house party because obama care complaints don't stop. doing a little rap only seemed fair. >> i'm krystal ball, did you miss me yesterday? is the obama care website fixed yet? >> i'm tour'e, speaking of stats, numbers don't lie, your mom and dad are the coolest ever, at least they think they are. >> all in the genes, kpatability gene and the science of love. >> get your hash tags ready, this is going to be a winning wednesday. ♪ there may not be a party feel but hhs kathleen sebelius is in a white house meeting talking to senior advisers about you guessed it, the onhline obaa care exchanges as the best and

brightest rebuild the massive site, that was the administration aegs description, they insist the president didn't know about the problems nlg after the rollout. >> do you know when he first knew there was a problem? >> well, i think it became clear fairly early on. the first couple of days -- >> not before that though, not before october 1st? there was no concern at that point in the white house or hhs? >> i think we talked about having testing going forward and if we had an ideal situation and could have built a product in a five-year period of time we probably would have taken five years. we didn't have five years and americans who rely on health coverage didn't have five years for us to wait. >> down the street on capitol hill, republicans of course are trying to cash in on these glitches. >> there's problems with the website, but i would argue the problems go much further than that. how about the report over the last couple of days of the

hundreds of thousands of americans who are finding out that they are going to lose their coverage because the plans they had today don't qualify under obama care? >> so we start the hour at the white house with nbc's peter alexander. peter, why is the white house still struggling here, it seems, to get their arms around all of these website criticisms? >> reporter: first of all, let me compliment the rhythm and rhyme you're used to. i appreciate that. >> whoa. >> reporter: we'll save that for another time. it's clear the white house is trying to wrap its arm around the extent taking place right now. some describe is more like the oil spill, the bp oil spill than this is like iraq or katrina, unclear exactly where the end of the line may be in some situation right here. the white house with the meeting taking place right now, hhs secretary kathleen sebelius

hosting those health insurance executives right now. one of the big problems for them, of course, they fear they stand to have to bear a lot of brunt to this to get a lot of the blame. on the back side of this website problem, a lot of information that's being transmitted to them is garbled and it's a big mess, not a lot they can do it at least one health care provider, there's a 50% error rate at this time right now. they are trying to be more transparent, jay carney in his briefing just announced beginning in the days ahead there will be regular briefings held by the health and human services department to update reporters on the status of the rollout, the implementation of the aca. officials here and cabinet members will spread out across the country in the coming weeks and hit ten cities in particular to try to impress upon people their ability to sign up by phone and by meeting in person at some of these health centers for this.

the hope being these places where they are high level of uninsured they can turn this thing in their favor. >> thank you very much. >> for more on the politics, we'll bring in matt miller. crocodile tears on obama care. thanks for being here. >> good to be with you. >> we've been covering the story here on our show, on one hand there's serious problems here that have been exposed, not all together unusual when you're doing something that is this new and this massive, comparisons have been made to medicare part d and other programs that had whatever you want to call it, glitches at the beginning and still flourish. talk to us about the political piece of this. in your column you point out where there are certain things that might be good to do, some delays might make sense the president is operating in cynical political environment with people who aren't doing oversight. you have a republican party that we know just wants to use this only as politics, never as

policy. >> well, that's right. look, there's no excuse for the computer problems and website problems, but the big picture is states like california, kentucky are showing it can be done. the problem will get fixed at some point and what interests me, when you see the republicans saying, how dare you make it hard for working poor people to get health coverage that we want to subsidize in the first place? how dare you screw something up that we don't think should exist? it's a bunch of phony posturing. in a sane world, which we don't live in, you would have people of good will trying to say, how do we figure out how to fix the terrible launch of the website for people to get access, but it's all politics. what's also strange is that all of the arguments republicans make are internally contradictory because they are berating -- if you listen to their words, you would think

they are upset people are being denied this protection when they oppose if sfwl you would think republicans have a real opportunity and opening here to show they care about the millions of americans that need affordable health insurance and now getting jiped because of the administration and to your point they are saying, how dare the administration screw this up. this is something we never wanted to begin with. i would say they are feeling vulnerable because they don't have any of their own ideas to bring to the table. just this morning, conservative comme commentator bill crystal said maybe there's something in the works. >> the big republican reform plan in january, it will be much better for the country. >> do you think it will be an alternative to obama care? >> it's the full conservative reform alternative to obama care. >> if that ends up coming true, how would that change this conversation?

>> it would change it a lot. here's why i'm dubious that will happen. first, what people have to realize, obama care was the republican alternative, it was romney care. obama sensibly adopted a more market friendly approach, something the heritage foundation and other democratic groups worked on for years as a way that might be able to achieve bipartisan con sen us. the gop once obama decided to embrace this plan decided we have to be against anything he's for. the fundamental problem, if you want to insure the 50 million uninsured you have to spend money on the subsidies and the gop never wanted to spends money on poor working americans. i'm very skeptical anything the republicans put out will cover more than 2 or 3 million of the 50 million, which is the most they've done before. always to watch for details. >> matt, let's go ahead and stipulate the they are utterly disingenuous as they are on any

range of issues. but you have to say their high poj this sis is that big government programs don't work. we've given them a ton of ammunition, it checks off all the boxes. it's a big program, took a long time and cost a lot of money and it has been an utter and completely incompetently executed failure thus far. we're saying it will work some time in the future but we don't know when that is. in that respect, don't they have a point. i'm surprised to not see more outrage on the left from people like myself who have been add vo indicating for this law, saying, wait until you see what this law can do for you. now we basically shot ourselves in the foot. >> you know, as my 16-year-old daughter would say, chill, people. >> you know, matt -- i hear you there -- >> the site has been open for two weeks. two years from now. >> matt, it has failed on every

level. it immediately crashed as soon as it was opened. it is sending insurers the wrong data. even the people who signed up are not convinced they are going to get what they asked to get. we have no insight into how long this is going to take. americans first experience with this law, with this law that's been controversial, it seems to me this is pretty mission critical and more than just a glitch. >> all of those are fair points and i still would say, give it time. i mean, medicare part d, smaller thing, had issues when it rolled out and became enormously popular and to be fair didn't have democrats trying to wage a national campaign against its rollout, even though they were a.m. bif lent about the way it was designed. >> it was also done under george w. bush, someone who had contempt for the federal government. i would have thought the obama administration and democrats in general who believe that the federal government can work, could have done a more competent job than this? >> you're right. who can disagree with this?

it's a terrible launch to the program, it doesn't mean it's the last word. they have to figure it out. but when you got a program going to offer millions of people, who have had the risk of bankruptcy if someone in their family gets seriously ill. the policy goals will end up insuring popular support. >> young people don't stick around -- >> hold on, young people would not be signing up who are healthy right now, they wouldn't be signing up right away anyway, even if the website was working perfectly -- >> to make one point, to krystal's point and maybe this is something you can speak to, i think what she's getting at. they could have rolled this out slower, if give it time is the answer -- >> they had three years. >> you could have roll d it out for alaska and alabama first and then gone to other states. give it time could be a policy approach. >> matt, i think the bigger idea

here is that we're not really talking about obama care, it is to obama and anything he has to say. if he wanted to make the military bigger they would be against that. whatever he's got, they are against. it's personal. we're hearing some noise about maybe something crazy was said to the president in a recent meeting, some people saying it didn't happen. but we have video of it. can we roll that? ♪ >> that's obviously the wrong video but that's clearly how republicans feel nowa days, they've been rooting for obama care to fail ever since he was elected and it's kind of disgusting. >> it's also the case -- if you look at the recent focus groups of the tea party, there's a racial angle to this also they feel obama care is really part of some socialist plot to make minorities dependent when the truth is, the biggest percentage

of the uninsured are white. you've got to be asking what does a black man in the oval office have to do to give affordable coverage to 25 million poor white workers? it's crazy. >> standing up for the white people and black people. thanks for being here. up next, broken, that could refer to the political fight over obama care or the capitol dome, set to undergo two years of renovation to fix 1,000 cracks. the time is running out. some say to fix the glitches. we're going to look at what's at stake here as "the cycle" rolls on for wednesday, october 23rd. in this corner, the reigning lasagna dish, the big cheese. and in this corner, the best generation of dawn power, platinum! [ bell dings ] here we go! [ female announcer ] dawn platinum power clean's micro-scrubbing enzymes give you the power of an overnight soak in 3 minutes, and 3 times more everyday grease cleaning ingredients. for all your dishes. so if you like dawn,

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another week means it is time for another terrifying article about obama care. megan's latest headlines include seven solutions that won't save obama care. is is it in death spiral? and four things we think we know about obama care. megan, this week, time to panic? no but it's time to prepare to panic. it sounds like the earliest anyone is suggesting fixes is sometime mid november when it has to work. if it doesn't we should panic. if this piece doesn't work, doesn't it threaten most if not all of the affordable care act. >> it doesn't affect the medicaid expansion, that can happen separately but we were expecting to funnel people through these websites to

medicaid and that connection doesn't seem to be working. but in terms of buying insurance and private market for more than 138 above the poverty line does threaten the whole program. we need to establish a sound, financially affordable set of insurance premiums and the way we do that by having a good mix of young and healthy and old and sick people. what we have right now is what for insurers is the worst case scenario, it is not impossible to sign up, it very, very difficult. and that means the old and sick people are probably going to keep trying but the young and healthy people trying to get into this system to keep the premiums affordable may not show up if we can't get it fixed soon. >> your article on this, on the one hand you dive in on the policy, on other hand you sound sometimes like the republicans in congress that are either overgeneralizing or rooting for it to fail. i'll let you respond.

if the piece doesn't work, most of the patient protection and affordable care act doesn't work. beyond the provision you just mentioned there's regulations on preexisting conditions and regulations that help deal with gender disparty and help young people get on their parents insurance. you know this. square that a little bit with your written claim that this could sink the whole thing? >> well, what i said it could sink the individual market part of this, which is about half of the expansion that we initially expected. absolutely, it's not going to take away the ability to stay on your parents's insurance until you're 26 but that's not something we needed a big health care reform for. that was a small provision we could have done separately. we could also have done medicaid expansion and not touched the insurance market. but the intent was to do a massive overhaul how the market functions so people who have preexisting conditions and so forth would finds it easy to buy policies. this is absolutely vital to making the preexisting work.

that goes back to the young healthy people. if you have a guaranteed issue and community rating, which is another word for preexisting condition bans, what you also need is a way to get young healthy people into the market. that's what massachusetts did with the mandate. if you don't have that, what you tend to see, what we saw in massachusetts before they did romney care, what we saw in new york state for a long time and what we have seen in other states like washington and kentucky that have those kinds of systems is that premiums start going up and up because what happens is that the old and sick people are really excited. the young and healthy problem who maybe go to the doctor once every three or four years, maybe they buy it, maybe they don't. you have a sicker pool and premiums go up and more young people say, this is not really financially worth it for me. >> the big concern is you're laying out with the website problems is that the folks most incentivized who have preexisting conditions are going to be the ones who stick it out through the website or call in or send in the application and

that the younger folks won't apply. i wanted to ask you, what is wrong with the solution proposed by senator jean sha heene, that we extend the open enrollment period one month, two months so those young people have a chance more to enroll once it is working properly. >> let's look at the plan it was supposed to solve. the reason we have the open enrollment people so people won't stay out of the market and buy insurance when they get sick. yes, you could have a car wreck, but if you get cancer or so forth, it might make financial sense to buy it after you get sick. the other issue with the mandate under the law says you have to have insurance for more than nine months out of the year in order to escape the mandate penalty and open enrollment is fine for mem who managed to get

insurance and when it comes around to 2015 when they have to -- or end of 2014 when they have to enroll for 2015, do they go back and decide to buy it again or say i'm going to pay the mandate penalty, not be in this insurance pool. then you end with the death spiral that people are worried about. >> i understand that media and politics are both about saying something is amazing or horrible. i want to put the ball game into a tiny bit of context. 40% of the uninsured shall california, texas, new york and florida. what happens in those states will define most of what happens here. but ultimately i go back to one of the most profound things that ari ever said on television, he said, i don't know and people never on television say i don't know. but it was an unnoble question. and we're in the first inning of this ball game and we can't possibly draw any conclusion.

no ball game has been won in the first inning. if we say i don't know what's going to happen, that would be profound or accurate, if we say we're going into a death spiral -- the issue is we don't know. >> we're not there yet, it's not about saying it's been three weeks and we should shut the whole thing down. we need to set deadlines for what we're going to do and set them in advance. the tem tags and before he was a journalist i used to design and build networks for banks, the temptation is to keep slipping things and see if they don't get better. the problem is if we don't have young healthy people and made it really difficult and frankly with the back end problems with the insurers are having, if people think they have signed up and they haven't, then you end up with a huge mess in say, february, that's extremely hard to fix. total chaos in the markets. what we want to do, here are the goal posts that we need to hit. if we don't hit them, we need to

have a plan for how do we delay this, what do we delay? how do we make sure we don't undermine the insurance market that we're expecting to provide insurance to millions of newly insured people? >> megan mccardell, thanks for spending time with us. >> thank you. yesterday we reported on the president's promotion of a phone number to call for obama care and offered up a little salute to the pitches an 800 from sham-wow to the great ron poe peel, but we said the late ron popeil. the great ron is still with us, we regret the error. here's a video reminder of the man who made the 800 number famous. >> please call the toll free number you see on your screen right now. >> reporter: >> wait, there's more. let me show you this. >> put up the window, you set it -- >> and forget it! huh...fifteen minutes could save you fifteen percent or more on car insurance.

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life with crohn's disease ois a daily game of "what if's". what if my abdominal pain and cramps come back? what if the plane gets delayed? what if i can't hide my symptoms? what if? but what if the most important question is the one you're not asking? what if the underlying cause of your symptoms is damaging inflammation? for help getting the answers you need, talk to your doctor and visit crohnsandcolitisinfo.com to get your complimentary q&a book, with information from experts on your condition.

the arraignment of a 14-year-old student charged with murdering his teacher. chism was ordered to be held without bail. authorities say the teen killed 24-year-old colleen ritzer who's body was found near the suburban school where she taught math. they found blood in the school bathroom. schools are closed as police investigate. >> horrible. the future king of england made his first public appearance in three months today. arriving for his christening with mom kate and dad will. the guest list was small by royal standards, 23 people, including the queen and prince charles, prince george has seven god parents. they are family and some nonroyal friends, imagine that. >> super cute but not -- the nasty act that got him blocked from employment, director of

nuclear nonproliferation for national security council jofi joseph was fired. personal insults and into leaks over the year. he said it was a privilege to serve in the administration, but not according to your tweets sir. john mayer described it to me as russian roulette for your reputation. ari knows. the potential perils of social media and the overall quirkiness are not dissuading baby boomers from diving in. folks over 50 spend an average of five hours a day online. and that's not all spent trying to access obama care. they have the same social media drama like teenagers like you do. 60% of those active online had a

negative experience and 20% said it was bad enough to end a friendship. gallup said people age 50 to 64 now support marijuana legislation, majority of americans for first time ever. i loo i do not like the image of boomers smoking while using social media. we talk about the open-mindedness of millenials and how that will drive us in the other direction, remember the open free loving '60s, that will drive us in a progressive direction as we go forward as well. when we talk about marijuana decriminalization, it's not because i want people to get high, you know how easy it is for people acquire marijuana and get high, it's incredibly easy. >> always accuses -- >> i want people to know

criminalized and have their life changed for nonviolent health personal privacy health choices. >> i'm glad you clarified. i'm not surprised at all that the boomer generation is as tech savvy as this study shows. my parents are a perfect example. it starts with wanting to follow your kids on twitter or facebook, to follow who they are friends with, what they were talking about and then find they are more interested in seeing where their friends are they haven't seen or talked to in 25 years. another part that's interesting, they might be tech savvy but trust worthy, they end up giving their information to friends they haven't talked to in 25 years. to bring this back to marijuana, not only are they more in tune with the younger generation, but also talking about the generation born in the 50s and 60s -- likely to have tried pot at least one point in -- >> they inhaled. >> i think that's something they don't see as a heinous crime.

it reminds me of gay marriage. in time the older generation will die off and people will see gay marriage and legalization of marijuana not going to be an issue. >> there's a feedback loop there as well. i was thinking too about the fact these are the original pot heads, we think of our parents as like, they could never have done anything wrong. but they were young once too. so i think there's that element to this. i also think there's a feedback loop between the generaler generation and older generation. i remember when president o obama was elected, one of the theme was younger people convincing parents and grandparents to vote for the president. the generations are not isolated here. there's a feedback loop. my own parents i see becoming more tech savvy all the time. i was shocked when i called them two weeks ago and their phone number wasn't working, that they've had since i was 9 years old. >> cut the cord. >> gave up the land line, only have cell phones now. i was a little freaked out.

they are moving in that direction too. >> you mentioned the feedback loop, a whole richer impofrished way too community. sometimes a status feels minimal or superficial. if you're not talking to your grandparents on the phone every week, which most people don't nowadays, that's some way if they are hooked in might be easier to be in touch. you think about this on this show. i love being part of a tv show where there's a millenial and boomer. >> all genx -- you're so predictable. get it right. >> our facebook fans -- >> it's important that you're in a newscast to fact check as a factual item you are a baby boomer. >> i'm a gen xor that's why i wrote a whole book about it. >> i'm kidding.

>> here's a sample of what folks had to say, bob moore, i'm for the total legal zalgsization. i don't understand why it is taking so as long as, it should have happened years ago. up next, in the wake of stop and frisk, a massive product that could change fleecing in america.

when judge ruled against the new york police department finding the stop and frisk policy unconstitutional, civil rights advocates cheered the decision as a victory for social justice. the ruling is on appeal. it may have officers thinking twice. before simply stopping someone

for walking while -- a lack of hard data on the role of race in policing around the country. it's more difficult to measure the role that individual discrimination can play in producing. our next guest spearheading a project to create a data base that tracks not just who's getting stopped but police department policy and officer's attitudes and key difference. the goal is not to go after the police but work with them. 30 plus departments have signed up to be a part of the project. welcome to the show, professor of social psychology at ucla. what is this project? >> a year and a half ago, we centered with the department of justice to host a big convening, what we do is work with police departments. they came in and said what we need, you tell us how to get the data and you analyze the data

and we'll have a database, my jaw dropped. i said okay, i think we can do that. we spent the last little bit getting the money to make that happen and last friday we talked to some chiefs and many said we're very excited about this. for first time we're not going to just be guessing what's going on. we can measure it which means we can manage it. >> we were so excited to have you on the program. you've written about evidence based social justice. part of what we might see is cracking the code of something that many people talk about as racist outcomes without racists. explain how you can measure implicit bias or other ways people come to the conclusions they make while policing? >> well, it used to be the case everybody thought that racism happens because bad people have bad things inside them and just externalize it. it turns out that's frequently not the case. what you can do, you can do the same thing to make sure that

stops, use of force and everything else is equitiable. most importantly there are police chiefs part of a new movement to to do that on equity. >> part of the program involves an actual psychological survey of officers themselves, correct? >> absolutely right. departmentwide we take measures of implicit bias, biases you don't know you have and explicit measures and psychological profiles to see if departments vary and districts vary and whether or not it makes a difference for their behavior on the street. >> i want you to respond to how your data base you're going to create will respond to another data base that's been created. a lot of people don't realize, when you are stopped questioned and frisked, whether or not to be found guilty or innocent of anything, they fill out in new york called a 250, here's your name, whatever information you give to them. that goes into a database.

so then when they are investigating crimes in the area, they'll go back to you and ask you. this sort of seems to train police to look at all of the folks who get tagged in this way in this area as involved in some indirect way in the criminal activity, you know about it because some other cop tagged you. how does that database being created deal with your data? >> there's a difference between a data base that a police department will connect for itself and how good or bad is the problem nationally? for crime data, victimization data, departments have to give that information to the fbi, but there's absolutely no found requirements for police stops or use of force. as a result, we don't know where we stand on any of this. this will be the first time that nationally we'll have a good picture of that. >> there's so many times that people realize that thing you're talking about, racism without racists, so many people trying to explain this. all of these messages that we

get and people can think they are behaving in a totally -- race-freeway but it's impossible and people say i'm color blind. it's impossible in america to be color blind and not deal with the messages you get about who we're supposed to look at as criminals. >> one of things i like to tell folks, i'm color blind, they say it like it's a good thing. would you say you're gender blind. if i call you a woman that's not necessarily an insult, you like injure gender, i like my race. >> it's part of who we are. >> one more piece from the other direction here, sometimes from sort of the pc crowd, but it's a real thing. using these studies to look at psych log cological factors bec they are worried about appearing racist. >> when you go through officer safety training and watched -- you're told you have to control

the situation in order for everybody to go home safe. if you think you can take me, one of us is going home hurt. i have my moral authority and physical authority. i should use my moral authority when i can. you're going to call me a racist, what kind of moral authority do i have? none. if anything gets a little bit out of control, i have only one authority, my physical authority. >> if you don't have legitimacy within the community as a law officer you're going to get backlash not people wanting to follow the law. >> my own fear that you're going to call me out on my legitimacy can sometimes ironically raise the level -- >> that's interesting, and very well put. congratulations on the launch and we'll keep our eye on it. >> thanks for being here. up next, a very different kind of science, could who you love be determined by what's inside? much more cycle ahead. m has afi, atrial fibrillation --

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have already enrolled in the only medicare supplement insurance plans endorsed by aarp. don't wait. call now. ♪ don't disguise bad odors in your trash. neutralize them and freshen. with glad odorshield with febreze. remember when republicans won big spending cuts in 2011? >> republicans can take credit for forcing the largest budget cut in history. >> republicans felt that was a good deal. >> slashing spending was a policy win for conservatives. fast forward to this month and the new deal to reopen the federal government, those cuts were extended again, another conservative policy victory, but

the press and political class has been scoring it for a victory for democrats. republicans backed down and ted cruz exposed himself as a guy who talks trash and doesn't know how to fight and public opposition to the gop hit the heightest point in 20 years. if you think about the impact on job and school lunches and police officers, this wasn't a policy victory for democrats. let's look at three reasons why this victorious economic policy is wrong. number one, the sequester cuts in the deal dangerously threaten our jobs in national security. that's not my opinion. it's what speaker boehner said this year. the sequester threatens u.s. national security and thousands of jobs. there's nothing wrong with cutting spending, he wrote, but the sequester is an ugly and dangerous way to do it. boehner was right. the cuts were never designed as a good thing. they were crafted as a punishment to force congress into the grand bargain that never happened. since the cuts kicked in automatically, we're living in a per verse world where the

speaker and president are extending cuts. forget clothes, the emperor has no budget. the republican impulse to s surrender to unemployment instead of fighting for jobs. if they stopped the cuts, 800,000 jobs would be created by next, according to congress's own nonpartisan budget experts and bloomberg business week, devoted to the economy, not politics, explains this in the new cover story that the tea party won a hole low policy victory because heavy spending cuts have been keeping the unemployment rate high. with the worst jobs crisis since 91930s, we don't need any more republicans in the unemployment surrender caucus. now finally, there's the deficit. congress's economic policy is based on a perception that the deficit is huge, conservatives say it's so big we must reduce it before priorities like jobs or education. there's a fair debate over how

much the government should spend on programs at home, that legit. but it's not fair to say the deficit is out of control or expanding. if someone tells you that, they are lying. when the recession hit in 2009 the deficit was 10% of the economy. at the current fiscal year, just over 3%. next year it's projected to drop all the way down to about 2%. you won't know that though if you listened to the tea party or to many of the self-appointed budget centrists in d.c. a lot of people listen to them. when bloomberg news asked americans about the deficit this year, 62% of people wrongly said it was getting bigger. only 6% knew it was getting smaller under president obama. so, there are a lot more people talking about the deficit than there are people who know what it is. unfortunately, many of them are in congress. stay with us. we'll be right back with more "cycle." yo, yo, yo. aflac.

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we blame our genes for a lot of our problems, they take the fall for our eyebrows, elbows, knees, height and weight, and some of us, also like to blame them for our personal shortcomings. but our next guest says a specific type of gene in particular determine far more than our physical appearance. they're successful for or began transplants, production, how our brains are wired and maybe how romantically compatible we are with one another. we're joined from the professor of immunology at the university of manchester and the author of "the compatibility gene".

and professor, i want to start with sort of the core of your argument here about what the compatibility genes are and how they may play a role in who we love and are attracted to in our personal lives. >> okay, great, thanks for having me. the compatibility genes are -- they're fascinating because they're the genes that vary the most from one person to the next. so, you know, we each have similar set of genes. but these particular genes are the genes that vary the most from one person to next. we all have similar genes vary like eye color, hair color, skin color but these vary the most. they're fascinating from that point of view. and they were discovered for that reason, because they control -- they influence the success of transplants. so they already had a medical importance. but then there has been a sort of 60-year adventure trying to work out what these genes really

do. and that's been done by thousands of scientists right across the globe, in europe, the u.s., australia. and we've gotten to this point now where we know first and foremost they're important in the immune system and have a great deal of understanding how that works. these same genes are important in other areas, which does seem to include things like sexual attraction between people. >> yeah, professor, there is a really interesting chapter in your book called sex and smelly t-shirts, where they asked women to smell used men's t-shirts and rate them on sexuality. and this relates to your compatibility gene theory. so much of sexuality is about your mood and your eyes and how a person is and how they affect your life. so how do those two things rectify each other? >> right. so that's really important. so that is -- there were these really fascinating, but still quite controversial experiments done. where men were -- women were asked to smell t-shirts worn by

men. they had worn for a couple of days. and they would rank these t-shirts as to how sexually nice they felt the smell was. and they -- one experiment showed that women tended to prefer the smell of t-shirts worn by men that had different versions of these genes. but it's very controversial and let me take a moment to explain. one of the reasons it's difficult to be sure about these results is if women rank the smell of t-shirts on a score from zero to ten, say five, if men had different version of these genes compared to four out of ten, then that can be statistically proven they prefer the smell of t-shirts they give it five out of ten rather than four out of ten. the controversy is how big an effect that has. in anybody's actually behavior. which is exactly what you're getting at. so you're right that relationships between people are very, very complicated. and there's some fundamental biology in these genes playing a role. but there's many complicated

factors that govern the less of a relationship between two people. these genes have -- better evidence is in these genes playing a role in sexual attraction between animals and that's why there is some weight to the fundamental biology behind using these genes for attraction. >> we're going to get to the point where it's -- before we get any further in this relationship, i'm going have to check out your genes. but it's not just about love. i mean, talk to us more about how these genes affect all different parts of the body, pregnancy to as you said, the immune system. >> that's right. so these genes are undoubtedly crucial in the immune system. and we know a great deal about that, how that works. so you know -- so we -- each of us might get a flu infection and i might take four days to recovery, you might take three days to recover. and one of the reasons for that difference would be differences in these genes. >> hmmm. all right. thank you, professor.

actually, professor, one more question for you. why do we have these compatibility genes? what is the evolutionary basis? >> so it might be that these genes first came about so that -- for example, you could differentiate family members from nonfamily members or something like that. but then there were these genes might have been co opted to be used in the immune system. first, how our body fights disease. and we have slightly different versions of these genes, giving us slightly different abilities in fight offering different diseases. and the reason they're so different between different people is that maximizes our chance of fighting off disease. so the big differences between individual people, not hair color, skin color or eye color, it's these immune system genes. and so a fundamental part of our uniqueness, each person's uniqueness, is our special ability to fight off disease in one particular way. and then that maximizes our

chances as an individual and as a species to keep fighting off all kinds of diseases. >> very fascinating stuff. thank you so much, professor. dan davis from all the way across the pond. that does it for us here at "the cycle." now on to martin bashir. i'll be joining you in a moment, martin. >> get here now, crystal. while democrats call for a fix, republicans are just as happy to spread fear. we've got the whole threat of obama care, employers scared to death of the hundreds of thousands of americans finding out they're going to lose their coverage. >> before it literally kills women, kills children, kills senior citizens. >> the american people are now fearful, downright scared, adding to the fear infusion and the fear of americans growing in their fear. >> let's love people. let's care about people. >> we want to fix it and go forward. our focus could be used to fix

it. fix the technology. the ability to fix it. >> did you ever talk about resigning? >> what i talked about is doing the job to get this fully implemented and to get the website working right. >> we fought the fight. we didn't win. we live to fight another day. ♪ good afternoon. we begin with republicans' uncontrolled impulse to scratch at any aspect of the obama administration that may respond to political exploitation. today's version, healthcare.gov. and now that the shutdown debacle is done, let the fear mongering and conspiracy theories over the affordable care act commence. >> we've got the whole threat of obama care continuing to hang over our economy like a wet blanket. >> the rollout of obama care is nothing short of