disastrous health care rollout, president obama announced a fix that would allow people to continue their plans under the health care rollout for a year. if it was a policy solution to a political problem, it was also a mea culpa. >> there is no doubt people are frustrated. i would be, too. i was not informed correctly that the website would not be working the way it was supposed to. had i been informed, i wouldn't be going out saying this is great. we did fumble the ball on it. what i'm going to make sure we do is get it fixed. >> unfortunately the president is looking to recover the fumble. because if you like it, you still might not be able to keep it. it's even hard for me to get out. although the new proposal laos insurers to keep people on existing and substandard plans, it does not necessarily mean insurers or individual states will agree to it. president obama is meeting today with insurance ceos to discuss ways to work together in a

conversation that is guaranteed to be as contentious as it is awkward. already insurers are rejecting the white house plan as are the state insurance boards. in just three hours after the president's announcement, washington state announced it would not allow insurers to extend canceled and substandard plans. that doesn't mean the effort is over. this afternoon the house is expected to vote on a bill from house democrats that is based on the white house fix but adds a consumer protection provision which allows the state and government -- state commissioners and government to go after bad actor insurance companies. the lower chambers will also vote on the keep your health plan absent of 2013 put forward by michigan republican fred upton with a straight face. it would allow americans to keep existing health coverage through 2013 while allowing new consumers to purchase the same substandard plans. writing in the new public jonathan cohn explains exactly why the upton bill is a terrible

idea. primary goal of the aca is to change insurance company practices, they will no longer charge higher prices, deny benefits or coverage to people with pre-existing medical conditions. another goal is to eliminate the sale of insurance policies that lead people exposed to passive bills they could never afford. the upton bill would undercut both efforts. in short the upton bill is a not thinly disguised effort to repeal affordable care act. the white house sees things the same way and has threatened to veto the bill should it pass both chambers. either way debate indicated that the fight is far from over. >> if you want to go back to a system where insurance companies could turn people away because they are sick, by all means vote for this bill. >> it is important that we take this action today on hr 3350, because we have heard from the american people, from

coast-to-coast, that they do not want -- they do not want the president's health care law. >> the upton bill comes today disguised as a sheep in wolf's clothing. >> for millions of americans it's cancellation today, sticker shock tomorrow. >> this one on the floor today really takes the cake because it is essentially pull the plug on the affordable care act, that idea that it was helping consumers was sort of the trojan horse whose underbelly ips poisonous with -- in terms of the health and well-being of the american people. >> joining me host of msnbc's disrupt, our very own karen finney, political reporter for slate dave weigle, former senior adviser to president obama and director at the university of chicago institute of politics the inimitable david axelrod, editor of the grio joy reid.

joining me from washington is nbc's capitol hill correspondent luke russert. david, i've got to turn to you first and ask you -- >> i was hoping. >> i'm sorry you had to sit through marcia blackburn talking about coast-to-coast. >> at least she didn't talk about red solo cups. >> and champagne flutes. there is some question about how many democrats may vote for the terrible upton bill. i will heretofore only refer to it as the terrible upton bill. i feel like this is really a true sort of line in the sand for the obama presidency. the first time his own party has truly been, i won't say open revolt, but very much disillusioned about the white house, the president's promises. i wonder if you think this latest patch that was announced yesterday was enough to regain confidence in the party. >> it's enough in the short-term to stall votes for the upton bill, which is, in effect, voted

41 times -- 47 maybe. an infinite number. >> this is a repeal by another name. i think as that becomes clearer, people will back away. perhaps what the president did yesterday will speak to that. one of the challenges from the beginning, i was there from the beginning, there's lots of decisions and lots of paths you took that aren't necessarily the direct path to get where you want to go but you have to do it. what the president did yesterday was address a political challenge which was concern on the part of democrats about this controversy. so i think in the short-term it will help. in the long-term they need to get the website up and working. people need to see what's available out there. when that happens, i think they can move on. until then, it's a slog. >> luke, speaking of a slog: what's the latest from capitol hill? how many defectors on the democratic side of the aisle can

we expect on the upton bill? >> well, yesterday that number would have been higher. since they have introduced the bill house democratic leadership aids are called landrieu light, which is the bill you mentioned allow states to go after bad insurers, keep plans for a year and no new enrollment as opposed to mary landrieu's plans which would allow these people to be in those plans indefinitely. it will probably bring down the number. as high as 60, the latest aide i spoke to said probably around 30 or so. it will be left to members in tough districts to make the decision for themselves for their 2014 prospects. that's really where a lot of anger comes from from house democrats, procedural bill on the house floor, alex. they feel the president sold them out for the 2014 election. they obviously know he's not running again. he needs to go a step further. a lot of folks say this is the

time for outreach. does not communicate with congress, insular. people make fun having a barbecue, a tour of the oval office but means a lot to rank and file members, probably go a long way. they need to feel love. they need a hug from 1600 pa avenue. they feel sold out. >> it's weird. invite them for a ham sandwich and give them an administrative patch. the weirdness of all this everything it's really a correction for a receipt or cal error -- rhetorical error. the jury is out what effect it will have on aca, assuming it doesn't pass. >> first i would say members of

congress are children. they keep score. you didn't call me back. i didn't get invited to your dinner. i didn't get invited to your event. why didn't you ask me to co-sponsor the bill. a lot of that is the craziness we see going on is that petty. that being said, i want democrats to get back on offense on this. this is ridiculous. lets remember why we're here. we had a financial crisis where people went under. they lost their homes. why? most people because of their health bills. those people even had health insurance. the fact we've gotten so far away from that conversation, it's immoral to me. i'm speechless because it's so ridiculous we're talking about a website and talking about these little fixing. i get the politics, why democrats are frustrated but i think there's an opportunity to be more on offense and say we're trying to give people health care. you're trying to take it away. >> i think mcgovern is on point there. lets don't forget already

millions of people who didn't have health care, younger people, people with young children with pre-existing conditions. there are people hold have been thrown off their health care because of caps, lifetime caps who are seriously ill, who can't be thrown off. insurance companies can't spend vast sums of money on bonuses and administrative fees. if they do, they have to give money back. all of these things are already in place and this what the republican party wants to roll back. they apparently thought the old system -- >> taken away. >> i think, julie, dav joy, daf brought this it, it's around insurance instead of care. the crassness, lets continue to allow insurers to offer substandard plans that could bankrupt them, leave them with massive bills is morally bankrupt. >> if i worked for the

insurance, i would give my entire public relations department a 100% raise and double the fees to my lobbyists. what we're seeing in the bill from fred upton, republican from blue cross blue shield -- i'm sorry, michigan. you've now taken an entire debate about 40, 50 million people not having insurance and finding a way to get them covered. we have zeroed it down whether 1.5 people can continue to purchase high deductible insurance. freedom and democracy and everything else all rides whether blue cross blue shield, humana can continue to sell highly profitable known as single issue insurance with super high deductibles, super low cost and extreme limits on what can you do with it. that's what we're arkiguing abo. >> the policy itself and whether or not it has a tangible effect. if i'm an insurance company, i'm

not one but i do play one on television. the president is allowing us to sell crappy plans. we've done months of work. we're not going to give the option. if i'm state insurance commissioner, it's not worth the headache. >> some talk off the error, put out statements. it will take a long time to go back to regulators and approve the plans they scrapped. i don't think there's legal questions about them doing this. it's not even the uncertainty of that. they made cost adjustments and regulatory adjustments. i think what the white house is trying to do and what democrats are starting to do is what everyone is saying, shift the focus back to insurers. they lost focus. they worry they might lose focus for a very long time. every problem with health care five years ago you could blame on hmos. every problem with health care they solve this month, every cost issue blamed on the government. it happened in 2012, democrats

didn't lose when people's rates went up in 2012. that was the panic now. people who were losing what couldn't tell without patronizing them were bad plans but not for the company but the government. change that focus. not sure they can but that was the intent. >> insurance companies are getting away with murder. they are playing both sides. we also know insurance companies are not good actors when they were supposed to be telling people what options, one of the concerns what the president announced. i do not trust insurance companies to tell people their options because we know when they had the opportunity they didn't. >> one other quick question. what are the regulatory implications if somebody goes back to their plan they like and then they get dropped anyway. find out pre-existing condition, in the hospital. >> under law they need to be insured. >> do they still get protections of affordable care act after they opted to go to the old plan. >> david, thus far at the beginning of the health -- you can speak to this better than i

k at the beginning of the drafting of affirm ca, more tension among insurers. insurers had done wrong by american people. they had not been good, up front, selling bad policies. then the writing of the bill came to the fore. there's more cooperation. recently there's been more cooperation with the insurance companies because the federal government has been more reliant on them in all honesty to sign americans up. with this latest move, it would seem like the relationship has become more frayed between white house and insurers, basically left them with the ball. for better or for worse. i wonder what you think the implications of increased tension between insurance companies and white house may be. >> certainly going to make for an awkward conversation, that's for sure. look, the insurance companies still have at this point a great interest in seeing this work. so i think at the end of the day they are going to try and make

this work. one of the things it is absolutely true that people got panicked and were worried about, but one of the things that compounded the problem, they couldn't get on the website to see what their true alternatives were. i go back to the point they have to fix that. let me get to karen's point. i feel very strongly about this. you've heard me talk about this before. having a child with a chronic illness, having gone through all the fear of going bankrupt because of bills that insurance companies didn't pay and so on, it really, really irks me to see this treated as a football in a political battle between republicans and democrat. there are lives at stake here. marcia blackburn here said red solo cup or crystal stem. this isn't about beverages, it's about life and death, so lets treat it that way. >> luke, to go back to the actions on capitol hill, the house has its version -- house democrats and house republicans

have their own proposals. where does house democrat proposal come into play here and how much support is that expected to garner? >> it will get a lot of support from house democrats. it's basically what pelosi and the leadership is doing in order to try and get folks not to support the upton bill. this has now become an issue for 2014. that's where i think there's a lot of anger from house democrats, alex, this is going to be relitigated again today. you know house republicans will schedule these types of votes on the future. while nancy pelosi was able to hold her caucus together and done a masterful job of that, the more and more this rollout goes poorly, it's going to be harder to do and fracture the party. it gets them off the economic message they did so well on during the shutdown and debt limit. >> luke, as you pointed out on this show yesterday, portions change, the president had sky high ratings and republicans in a state of crisis. i don't think the war has been won by either side.

that's likely to continue. if the website actually gets fixed, we could see once again a reversal of fortune, could we not. >> house democrats want january 15th to come. that's when they have to be funded they expect gop to go down the same rabbit hole they did last month. however, alex, house democrats knew health care was going to be used against them in the 2014 midterms. what's happened over the last few weeks, it's given that argument a lot more ammunition than they ever thought it would. they thought they could use it to advantage, say these people are covered, a great thing, defending the idea of big government solving big problems is a lot harder for a lot of folks especially in the swing district. >> let me say, my friend, nine months, ten months, 11 months is a lot of time. nbc's luke russert, capitol hill. thanks for your time, my friend. >> thank you very much. be well. >> after the break a million and a half people could become eligible for health coverage under aca's medicaid expansion. that is just in the state of texas. we will discuss the good stuff

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another 396,000 have the ability to gain access to medicaid under the affordable care act. that's been less reported on but it shouldn't be. >> buried in the monumental underperformance of the health care law has been some monumentally underdiscussed good news. nearly 400,000 americans have successfully enrolled in expanded medicaid coverage under the affordable care act. that is 396,000 americans that now have access to lifesaving treatment who did not have it before. in addition to subsidies for

private insurance, the affordable act expands medicaid coverage up to 138% of the federal poverty line, which is about 16,000 for an individual this year. it's also leading to the woodwork effect. patients already eligible for med kate cade come out of the carpentry to enroll in the plan. 120,000 of the new enrollees were eligible for medicaid coverage but just didn't know it until the law went into effect. as with all things aca expansion does not come without hitches. in 2012 they allowed state to opt out even though it would help thousands with no cost. 25 gop states have refused the expansion. the choice, getting even worse. to pay for the medicaid expansion, the law cuts subsidies to hospitals who take on a large share of uninsured patients. if hospitals were getting more patients through expanded medicaid and private insurance,

they wouldn't need as much assistance from the federal government. now many states will get neither the new patients nor the federal subsidies. in georgia three rural hospitals have already closed this year. "the new york times" tells the story of donna atkins, a waitress in savannah, georgia, who was recently diagnosed with throat cancer. donna was advised to get a special image of her neck but it would have have cost $2300, more than she makes in a month. i didn't have the money to walk in the door of that office said atkins. atkins had surgery friday two years after her first symptoms. it is unclear whether miss atkins, whose in come is right around the poverty line will be left without medicaid or if she earns enough to qualify for subsidies to buy insurance on the federal exchange. in the meantime 15 more georgia hospitals may be shuttered leaving patients in need without recourse. joining me now democratic congressman from texas 20th district joaquin castro.

congressman, always a pleasure to have you on the show. toif talk about texas. rick perry is an ideologue. when you look at the human toll, 1.4 million people uninsured in texas alone. you're talking about medicaid denied to parents with children making $3,737 a year. they don't qualify for medicaid. in your opinion, as someone who knows the lone star state, what's it going to take to convince people like rick perry to opt into this, antagonism, persuasion, what is it? >> we've tried the whole range of it. the fact is his decision to reject medicaid money was unconscionable. one out of every four texans doesn't have health insurance, 38% of texas women, 38% of hispanics in texas don't have health care coverage. the business community was solidly in favor of expansion, social advocates for the poor

were in favor of it. i think quite frankly, alex, what it's going to take is a change of the politics, change of the governor, change of the party leadership in texas to really make a difference. >> what's amazing to me, and i think this gets often ignored, it's not as if there's an economic argument made around not expanding medicaid and talking about the burden on the states and so forth. at the end of the day emergency rooms still offer care to poor people who don't have insurance. i'll cite this staff. county hospital in your hometown in bexar county currently runs substantially reduced fees on individual health care rather than an insurance plan to cover them. that plan serves about 60,000 people at an annual cost of $54 million. county tax dollars pay for that. this is an economic argument, cost taxpayers less to in sure these people. is there any reasonable argument you can make at this point?

>> no. there's an old adage in politics, democrats and liberals make the decision from their heart and republicans and conservatives make them from their mind. here in both the heart and the mind, it's clear what should be done. medicaid should be expanded. still the governor is not yielding to reason. >> congressman, opens up to our folks in new york, david, we were talking about the human cost of this. >> yes. >> one of the reasons we felt strongly we needed to read the excerpt from "new york times" people who have cancer can't get treatment they require and are forced into poverty or they die because they are not given adequate health insurance and health care. do you think the anecdotal evidence will be enough to sway? >> i don't know about governor perry. i heard him on television recently say people in my state have access to the greatest health care in the world. in fact they do have some of the greatest health care in the world down there. it's just the people we're talking about don't have access

to it. i remember when my child was sick and i was sitting in the emergency room and i saw others in more strapped circumstances than me sitting there in utter panic thinking about how in the world they were going afford the health care they needed to keep their kids going. you're right. some of it is transferred to taxpayers, but they don't have access to a lot of the health care they need. we have to ask ourselves, is this the america we believe in. a lot of the people we're talking about, most of them are working people. so you work, you work and you work, and then you don't have basic health care. is that the country we believe in? governor perry says this is rugged individualism. i think it's heartlessness. >> joy, what is disturbing to me about the argument in and around the aca, it's increasingly become one republicans are framing takers versus makers. people trying to get the old sick people trying to take from us young, invincible moneymaking

business people. whoever the makers are in that metaphor. when in reality the aca is much more incumbent with social security. a point ron brownstein makes. i wonder if that narrative too far cemented in conservative circumstances at this point? >> it is. that's why they have partly been so successful at framing the debate as being all about the individual market buyers. those people by definition slightly more affluent than people through medicaid and why we completely ignore, the people you mentioned, actually getting an insurance card through medicaid expansion. literally it's seen as a file you're in the system, not a feature, people getting care through medicaid. just more welfare. that's the way it's talked about. what's the pivot point that will change this narrative. one will be big hospital systems looking at bankruptcy. in the state of florida, the governor of florida, no liberal, a guy whose previously claim to fame was his hospital system

defrauded the government for $1.8 billion. he was going to go ahead and take the medicaid expansion, not that i liked ideology, he's a tea partier but hospitals are treating people with no insurance card and facing bankruptcy as a result. they couldn't convince legislature that slipped him down and said, no, we're not taking this money. we're creating two americas, one confederacy and u.s. where literally if you're not rich you can't get treated unless you go to the er. another wholesome health care system. it doesn't make sense. >> here is one of the concerns. there are all of these effects you're talking about. i think that the republicans are intent on blaming the affordable care act for it. and this is really -- the big story is never before has there been something undertaken like this under this kind of sniper fire. that has made this so much more difficult. i'm concerned they are going to take what is the effect of their

o fwchlt stinenca and affordable care act, putting pressure on hospitals, more pressure on taxpayers. i think it's a real concern. >> congressman, the hospitals and their insurers know the truth. they know exactly why things are as bad as they are. i wonder in texas, how much weight does that business community have in terms of decision making in and around the state's health care. >> believe me, the texas hospital association and others in the medical industry pushed, and they pushed pretty hard in ways that i had not seen them push republicans in the 10 years i spent in the legislature. but texas is almost a special case because republican incumbents including governor perry feel like they have so much wiggle room in the november elections that they can ignore even some of their traditional allies. i think that's what you saw in his refusal to expand medicaid.

to joy and david's points, the language these folks are using is very disturbing. ted cruz in the press conference he had with rick perry when he talked about medicaid expansion compared people who need medicaid to drug users and compared giving these folks medicaid to giving them a hit of drugs. that is extremely disturbing for a united states senator to be talking in those terms. >> i think basically everything ted cruz does and said is extremely disturbing but i think that was fairly -- that was very fair of you. texas congressman joaquin castro, we look forward to a change-of- governors sooner rather than later. also former senior adviser to president obama david axelrod, thank you for being here. >> a new report about war crimes sheds a grim light on afghanistan. we will discuss the forgotten war just ahead.

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over the coming months, more of our troops will be coming home. our troop levels in afghanistan will be down to 34,000. by this time next year, the transition to afghan-led security won't be nearly complete. the longest war in american history will end. >> indeed impending departure of troops leading to casualties among afghan national security forces one of the many consequences of scheduled withdrawal in 2014.

it won't just be soldiers leaving the country, the u.s. effort brought with it plenty of foreign aid, which quadrupled afghanistan's gdp. $54 billion came into the country in the form of economic aid and military spending, industries prospered, construction, logistics and security. that aid has done little to address severe problems facing afghan economy. opium production soared to an all-time high leaving head of the u.n. office on drugs and crime that without interim support, without more meaningful assistance, this country may continue to evolve into a full-fledged narco state. that aid expected to decline as coalition forces depart. relation between hamid karzai and the u.s. are strained. after efforts to rebuild the country karzai said in a recent interview that those efforts

failed. >> the entire military exercise was one that caused afghanistan a lot of suffering. a lot of loss of life. no gains because the country is not secure. >> hit a new low when protests broke out in response to reports that a u.s. special ops rounded up and executed 10 afghan civilians and buried their bodies outside a u.s. base in kabul. the unsubstantiated reports are the basis of a piece called "the a-team" killing. matthew akins looking for answers. he joins us now. thank you for joining us. it's great to have you in the u.s. can you tell us what happened here according to your reporting and investigating? >> about a year ago u.s. special forces unit known as a-team showed up in this remote valley.

within a couple months locals started accusing them of murder, torture, disappearances of 10 men, extraordinary allegations that would amount to some of the worst war crimes committed by u.s. forces since 2001. eventually forced out because of these protests but the whole incident remained shrouded in mystery. u.s. military denied responsibility even as their bodies turned out buried outside the base. remote area dangerous taliban support, difficult access. we spent the last five months getting to the bottom of it. in this investigation we published rolling stone, the current issue we assembled a damming dossier suggest u.s. military forces were complicit in the gravest war crimes. >> the u.n. and red cross investigations found u.s. involvement, quote, credible and may have, as you said, amount to war crimes. you note these incidents don't occur in a vacuum. the idea human rights groups repeated by documented abuse of detainees in u.s. custody, this

happened not just in this one isolated incident but sort of throughout the history of the u.s. and afghanistan. >> in the context of things that began in 2001 at bagram airfield in custody, continued through abu ghraib, continued instances in afghanistan and iraq where prisoners have been abused, killed in custody, where u.s. forces have turned a blind eye or been willfully complicit in serious human rights by afghan or iraqi allies. there's been no accountability for these incidents. we've seen very few people go to jail or be held account able as numerous reports by u.n., congress, red cross pointed out. so this really fits into that larger pattern. >> karen, we've talked about the armed services before, war in the middle east, the fact nobody really talks about it. part of the problem here in terms of transparency, congratulations to matthew. we thank him for reporting and investigating and being embedded there, thereto not a huge

discussion of what's going on in the middle east in the media. i think in a way that allowed things to happen and we've gotten a free pass on things. we also have a strategy for a drawdown accepted by american public. we want our troops out. at the same time ramifications and implications for being there are profound for the afghan population. it's painful to listen to hamid karzai to speak about intervention. >> it's painful. i have somebody over there i love dearly. to think he's wasted years of his life and that's how karzai feels, it's terrible. >> the sacrifice of the american soldiers, then you have that day, which is underdiscussed, the civilian casualty, soldier casualties, sacrifice in blood and treasure and sacrifice on the ground. if there have been war crimes, an investigation of those or some sort of ground swell of

action around what exactly is going on in the middle east. it doesn't exist. >> there isn't much. we're in washington at least focusing on the next four. we're already talking about iran, strategy there. when we do talk, there has been a reawakening of discussions of drone usage and of actually the kind of completely invisible to most americans actions to take out targets with casualties we would hear about if done by soldiers. we're hearing a little more about the way the war on terror is operated. not as much about afghanistan as we spent -- not just expensive. that was supposed to be the answer to the reasons we were attacked on 9/11. >> we're a little complicit in the fact anybody -- when was the last time there was a protest about bringing troops home. i'm not saying complicit in what happened, horrible, we're complicit in that we don't make it an issue. we don't say to our government, bring our troops home now. we're done. >> or the civilian casualties

are on the drone strikes. >> if we don't do it, guess what, more of the same. >> the forgotten war. i think americans almost don't remember we're there. we so quickly pivoted over to iraq and sort of forgot about that core mission in afghanistan. it's dragging on and on. most americans wonder why we're there. >> we're complicit in what happened. these are the soldiers we sent out to fight our dirty war. these u.s. army special forces from the third special forces group of ft. bragg, the most heavily deployed unit in special forces. they have been out for 10 deployments, senior ones, the toll they suffered, things they have seen and done i've been told by soldiers in the special forces community, they have really seen the weight of this war -- >> they go and do it so we don't have to. how about that. >> also no wars without consequences. read a-team killing in the latest issue of rolling stones. thank you for joining us. federal reserve janet yellin

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austerity obsessed congress. >> some of the near term redu s reductions in spending detracted from the momentum of the economy. we are worried about a fragile recovery and a more supportive fiscal policy, one that at least had less drag that did no harm would make life easier. >> in other words, necessary for the fed to keep bumping billions of dollars into the economy because of the damage done due to a deficit obsessed party, not saying which one, which will at any cost. another apology crack smoking mayor of toronto robford faces off with the city council once again. we'll have the latest circus act for you coming up next. in the nation, sometimes bad things happen.

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the last thing olivia said [ bleep ] i never said that in my life to her. i would never do that i'm happily married. i have more than enough at home. >> mayor ford speaking as mayor ford does very plainly as he said in council yesterday, he f fed up. i don't think we can broadcast that on tv but we just broadcast it on tv. >> mayor ford, that was yesterday. they voted to wrest power from his uncontrolled first and hopefully only term mayor so far by overwhelming majorities the council voted to strip ford's power to appoint committee members and remove authority

during state of emergency. if this does not constitute state of emergency, i'm not sure what does. meanwhile a week after rob ford and his brother had their weekly radio show canceled, we've learned the brothers ford are launching a television show. said doug forward rob is like howard stern or rush limbaugh, you never know what he's going to say. indeed rob ford is like rush limbaugh in that he's also a dangerous loudmouth which admit add predilection for illegal or controlled substances. congratulations ford family and good luck canada. no one is from canada, so i feel like we can't approach with the same indignation. >> dave, how is he still there. >> you can't impeach the guy. there are no rules. in d.c. marian berry went through a serious situation. >> marion berry went through

crack smoking with a prostitute child play compared to the unending follies of rob ford. >> in canada the law is you not only have to be convicted of a crime, you have to be imprisoned, then they can impeach. i'm thinking how many american politicians are like we've got to change the rules. >> joy, this is what i meant. legislatively how is he still in office. in terms of shame, does this man have no sense of shame? >> i have to say the general sense of superior ority canada lorded over the united states is over. we may have some problems but our members of the house of representatives who are driving us crazy and throwing the government over the cliff, at least they are not admitting -- i say admitting. >> they have a better health care website, give them credit. >> compare, who would you rather be, i know the answer to this, president obama or rob ford. i think you would probably rather be still even now president obama. if you're rob ford, have you to

exist as rob ford in perpetuity on planet earth. >> with a reality show. >> more than barack obama enjoyed himself. he's a 40 something man who looks like he's lived several lifetimes on earth, most of it in seedy places. >> barack obama smokes tobacco. >> in congress. >> may or may not still have on the diapers. >> on that note, joy, high note, we'll leave it there. watch karen on disrupt 4:00 p.m. eastern right here on msnbc. that is all for now. i'll see you back monday at noon eastern. "andrea mitchell reports" is coming up next. nd. but it doesn't usually work that way with health care. with unitedhealthcare, i get information on quality rated doctors, treatment options and cost estimates, so we can make better health decisions. that's health in numbers. unitedhealthcare.

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we knew this was a plan he couldn't keep. now a promise he has broken. the white house in crisis mode as it struggles to save the embattled health care law. the house is min away from voting on the upton bill that will allow insurers to continue to sell plans that do not beat obama care standards. what can the president do to calm his caucus. we'll ask bob casey and joe crowley. the obama care mess given opposition rivals present and past. >> it's dishonest. what starts twisted stays twisted. live report from the philippines where hundreds waiting at the tacloban airport for safety.