a healthy 26-year-old journalist has wriftten an article entitled why i am choosing to pay $300 to stay uninsured. let's see if howard dean and ezra klein can talk him into complying with the individual mandate of the affordable care act and buying health insurance. >> a new deadline. >> the administration sort of stretching its deadline. >> the last day to soon of under the affordable care act. >> now it will judge on a case by case basis. >> they're saying they're worried about any kind of changes.

>> the real deadline, coming in the next few weeks. >> january 1. >> now come january 1, people will have obamacare. >> how significant is that deadline? >> republicans would keep the focus. >> obamacare is their ticket. >> on any and all problems with at fordable care act. >> you can't fix this mess. >> there is no way to fix this. >> forever and ev& ever. >> it is put up and shut up time for our party. >> there is a huge civil war happening in the republican party. >> expect us to do better. >> a new twist in a bridge controversy involving chris christie. >> they may say it is a way of getting things done. >> i've don't really care. >> republicans would rather keep the focus on the affordable care act. >> democrats will start newt year with a renewed focus on health care. >> there are so many unknowns. >> definitely will be a political issue in 2014. >> it is very important for the obama administration. >> 2014 scan be a breakthrough

year for america. the center for medicare and medicaid services say a record 2 million people visited the health care.gov website monday, december 23rd. and the obama administration is giving people who had difficulty enrolling on the federal exchange monday or tuesday another chance to get coverage starting january 1st. despite your best efforts. you might have run into delays caused by heavy traffic to health care.gov's maintenance periods or issues. with our systems that prevented you from finishing the process on time. if this happened to you -- don't worry. we still may be able to help you get covered as soon as january 1. tell our customer service representative that you, that you have been trying to enroll. and explain why you couldn't finish by the deadline. they can tell you what you can do to finish your enrollment and still get covered for 2014. joining me now, former vermont

governor, howard dean. and former head of the democratic national committee. also, ezra klein. columnist at "washington post," nbc analyst. and carl gibson, contributing editor to reader supported news. his latest article entitled -- why i'm choosing to pay $300 to stay uninsured. let's go straight to carl gibson's article. carl, have to tell you when i saw this yesterday, i read this, i said we got to get carl on the show to talk about this. a website send out a lot of e-mails with stories. invaluable stuff. helpful to the show. wanted to get the plug in, carl about your operation. this is what you wrote that struck me. it is something that i have been expecting to see at some point. you wrote through healthcare.gov, i found as a single 26-year-old male living in dane county, wisconsin who expects to make $30,000 next year. the most affordable health

insurance package for me comes with the deductible anywhere from $2,000 to $5,000. that's roughly 15% of my income. that comes out of -- pocket before my health insurance even kicks in. this affordable care would cost me about $150 a month. why the hell would any young person in this ten wuous econom want to pay $1,800 on premiums on top of a $2,000 to $5,000 deductible for health care costs that may or may not even occur. howard dean, i think carl might need fatherly advice on this one. do you want to answer that question for him? >> first, let me say unlike most of the stuff that gets written about health care, krilt sizing the bill, this is a really article. everybody ought to read it. i don't agreen with carl. because, i think in the long run, it's quite possible that

nothing of the sort will happen. but if you are wrong, god forbid you are one of the few young people that gets something really expensive, you are in bankruptcy. that's going to affect your credit rating, have all kind of problems with it. so it was a well-reasoned article. really well-written article. and raises a really good point. i have to say i think a pin the i dista grethe -- a point that i disagreen with. listen to advice from howard dean and ezra klein. what's your answer to that question carl poses. the affordability of this. the affordable care act provided insurance that carl does not believe he can afford. >> look, this is something real in the bill. i wrote the individual mandate is the best deal in the bill. the point is on any given day, for particularly for a young person, but for an elder person, it is a good deal to not be paying any money to health insurer or government health

insurer probably going to get up, be healthy, go to bed, and healthy. the question is on the days you are not. carl is picking up on a pin the that he doesn't make in the article. under at fothe act, you can do something, decide not to buy health insurance. when you get sick, wait a couple months. having paid the mandate you can get insurance currently which an insurer would never give you because you would have gotten sick. you can game the system in certain ways more effectively, post-obamascare than you could before. the thing will cost you, be a free rider, a jerkish thing to do. you can do it. it is a mistake to say i am young. that's my relationship to health care. one day you will be old. to say you are healthy. one day you are going to be sick. if every young person and every healthy person gamesment system. when they are old and sick there

will be most sim teystem afford to take care of them. >> carl, what is your response to all this advice? >> sure, well, i'm glad to be on the show. thanks to governor dean and ezra klein for coming on as well. i think, governor dean's home statement of vermont makes a great example of what a great health care system could look like. governor dean, you would know that in 2011, your state legislature, passed a single payer health care bill, but because of the affordable care act and the individual mandate and the exchanges, people now have to buy private health insurance which for people in lower, middle-class income bracket, people look me have a hard time aaffording. can barely pay my bills and save $100, and let alone pay $180 in premium. something scud be done at the federal left. congressman greatson, congresswoman, porter co-sponsored it. for a small fee, roughly equitable to the premium costize

would pay under the private health insurance you could buy into medicare and medicare could be expanded for everybody. everybody is paying into the system. it is self sustaining. >> actually. in fairness, we did something very much like that in vermont. we actually did something much better than a single payer in vermont. in the sense everybody under 18 in our state has the health insurance through medicare and medicaid. essentially what we did what you are suggesting and more. there should have been a public option. a single payer. we don't. we have to live what we have. until it can get better. but you are payer is coming in vermont. and single payer for kids, since 1992 when i was governor. >> let me offer a bit of a contrary point here. if you don't mind. which is i agree that -- that compared to what we got, because legislation is always compromised and always less than we hope it to be, a single payer system designed in a lab would

be a much bept erbetter system. one thing in the op-ed, carl, struck me a lot. one thing you criticize the system for doing. young people are paying too much, in order to subsidize as you immrip heply older sicker p. one of the interesting things people miss in the single payer conversation that happens much more in a single payer system than in this kind of one. the higher deductible and age rating, a young person can pay a third of an older person. that allows you to subsidize older folks less. in a true single payer system, the ones we typically talk about everybody is paying the same into the system. you are having more subsidy from young to old. which is true in most employ year based systems too. you see this on the right all the time too, they're furious you would have any young people subsidizing an old person. they get employer based health care. all young people are subsidizing old folks and much more. a lot of problems i think single payer would solve.

young people and healthy people end up paying more for something they don't need as often. as older people and sicker people. that's not one of them. that's, core to any insurance, national insurance system or nonnational insurance system we can conceive of. >> carl, it becomes very clear in your piece that you prefer, you would prefer a single payer system. certainly, as i would. many others would. your problem in this market, at $30 t you c $30,000, you cannot afford $1,800 in premiums. and then that is just if you never get sick and never use the health care system at all. if you use the health care system at all. your costs will go way above a couple thousand a year. that affordability issue that is so clearly focused in here. there is something very odd about the individual mandate as it aplays to you. you have a choice to pay $1,800

in health insurance premiums, know knows what in health costs. $1,800 if you dent do that. your penalty for not doing that. paying $1,800. penalty is $300. what i don't get about that. its the reason parking meters work. is that a parking meter costs 50 cents. if you don't pay the 50 cents on the parking meter you might get a parking ticket for $60. here, we are saying to you, you are -- your penalty for not doing the thing we want you to spend money on is something way less than the amount we are asking you to spend money on. >> yeah, that is the main issue here. why a lot of people in my age range don't feel like they're being related to on the issue and left out of the conversation. a lot of people struggling from, a student loan debt bubble, swollen by a trillion dollars.

education and health care are made to be profitable by a few group of people at the expense of everyone else. if we saw health care as a mu man right. everybody has a right to. health care shouldn't be for people who have fat wallets. and you make something that is affordable, and accessible to young people. something like a medicare buyin, or expanding medicaid to cover people who fall into, you know my situation, i unfortunately live in scott walker's wisconsin. that didn't happen. but here in kentucky, you know governor steve bashir expanded medicaid, great system, with kynect. overall in kentucky when not called obamacare, called kynect, it is well received by people. we're moving in the right direction. if we get to ape cy system, pay maul monthly fee to pay into medicare. i would totally participate. and feel like i was part of the con sler sa

conversation. ratherrelegated to a block of people getting the short end of the stick. >> rational economic man. the question what would rational economic man do presented with the menu of dollar choices. the choice carl ends up making is one, that many, many in his income category and health category are going to make. >> the problem here. ezra pointed out. he can be a free rider for now. and what happens in this country and the private sector. you can sign up one month out of the year. if you've don't sign up. you can't get insurance later on unless you signed up in that month. that's where the risk is. ezra is right, there is not that much risk to doing this right now. the other thing is, first of all, i think that, that -- young

people ought to have a tax subsidy. $1,800, $2,000 deductible. that's too much for somebody making $30,000 a year. the price range got screwed up. we awe know, the flaws, the bill written in senate finance committee. and insurance companies. lieberman held them up. got rid of the public option at the last minute. all this kind of stuff. again, i say we are where we are. we got to make this thing work. do our best to make it work. hopefully it will change as we go on. 20 years ago. i did this stuffen our state when i was governor. we waited 20 years. now talking about a single payer. >> howard dean. ezra thank you for joining us

tonight. >> coming up why it is not so hard to imagine chris christie might actually be involved in that bridge scandal, possible bridge scandal. and later, edward snowden claims mission accomplished, and, he wishes you a myrrhy christmas on british tell vision. [ male announcer ] here's a question for you: the energy in one gallon of gas is also enough to keep your smartphone running for how long? 30 days? 300 days? 3,000 days? the answer is... 3,000 days. because of gasoline's high energy density, your car doesn't have to carry as much fuel compared to other energy sources. take the energy quiz. energy lives here.

>> a russian official responded to a question about the u.s. delegation to the olympics specifically about the game athletes that are part of the delegation selected by president obama. russian olympic committee chief refused to directly comment on the anti-gay propaganda legislation and gays and lesbian athletes attending the olympic games. he did say this.

>> up next, the latest on chris christie's possible george washington bridge scandal. [ male announcer ] this is george. the day building a play set begins with a surprise twinge of back pain... and a choice. take up to 4 advil in a day or 2 aleve for all day relief. [ male announcer ] that's handy. ♪

>> let's start with this. i sat here, stood here respectfully listened to you. if what you want to do is put on a show and giggle every time i talk. then i have no interest in answering your question. you want to hear the answer or no? do you want -- do you want to hear the answer or don't you?

>> didn't i stay on topic? are you stupid. >> after you graduated, you conduct yourself in the courtroom, your rear end is going to get thrown in jail, it yolt. >> are you a bully? >> no, no i am not a bully. but what i am is a fighter. >> as chris christie continues to face questions about the mysterious lane closures on the george washington bridge, ordered by two of his appointees who later had to resign, "the new york times" reports that petty revenge tactics may be familiar to the christie administration. the times details a list of both democrats and republicans who have faced consequences after disagreeing with the governor. a former governor who was stripped of police security at public events, a rutgers professor who lost state financing for cherished programs, a state senator whose candidate for a judgeship suddenly stalled. another senator who was disinvited from an event with the governor in his own district, and in all most every case, mr. christie waved off any

suggestion he mad meted out retribution, but to many the incidents have left that impression. it has the been just as powerful in scaring off others who might dare to cross him. joining me now, hunter walker, who has been covering this story for talking points memo. hunter -- this bridge closure controversy possible scandal, is, has always seemed -- unlikely in and of itself to become a major national story about chris christie in terms of affecting his presidential campaign. but it does feed into this overall image that is -- only, now, i think being formed for, what will be -- chris christie as a presidential candidate. and it does seem -- to contain similar elements to the other stories that are well documented. >> you know what is interesting -- he always sort of revelled in having this reputation as kind of a tough --

guy who didn't take anything from his opponents. you know, a lot of the clips you played before, his people had actually posted them on to youtube. but now with this scandal and the stories that came out in the times it really seems like -- people are taking it different kind of look at that behavior. and, you know it's not cute anymore. >> i just want to go over for our audience, the two resignations, involved in the bridge cantaloupe sulosure. those are real facts. two people came under scrutiny for this, in this story. they resigned. take us through what forced them to resign. >> the two people that resigned are christie's appointees at the agency that oversees the george washington bridge. both of them are people directly involved in the decision to shut the lanes that led to days of gridlock in fort lee, the town where the bridge is based. and, you know, basically, there have been hearings called by the legislature. looking into the matter.

the guys claimed the closures were the result of the traffic study. no one has provided any evidence that any study occurred. so, you know, that lack of an explay nation for why they made this town -- go through four days of, you know, complete gridlock, has really bothered people. and, you know, interestingly, one of the guys claim heed was going to resign end of the month. christie actually came out in a press conference on, mid december, and, you know, said he is gone already. so, it was obvious that heads had to roll wlehen nay had no answers for the investigators. >> what do we know about how the resignations occurred. its there public information about christie's involvement in the resignations. >> not so much yet. but the amount of public information abut every aspect of this is only going to grow. because they are getting attacked on all fronts. the port authority, couldn't ducting an internal investigation. senator jay rockefeller, pushing for federal review. the legislature looking into

this. through assemblies transportation committee. and journalists looking into this. you have "the new york times" digging up the old stories of christie's alleged retribution, you have the bergen record, pulling up a story that in 2010, fort lee reached out to one of the crist yef hristie al litlie resigned. that showed he was aware of it. promised to help. three years later when the mayor of the town had a disagreement with christie, he aech shu's she lanes. >> hunter walker, thank you for joining us tonight. >> thank you for having me. >> coming up. edward snowden says his mission is accomplished. and heap delivered a christmas greeting on british tell vision. plus presents the cold truth. [ sniffles, coughs ] shhhh! shhhh. [ coughs ] i have a cold with this annoying runny nose. [ sniffles ] i better take something. [ male announcer ] truth is, dayquil cold and flu doesn't treat all that. it doesn't? [ male announcer ] nope. [ sniffles ] alka-seltzer plus fights your worst cold symptoms

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>> in the spotlight. an edward snowden christmas on british television. >> hi, merry christmas. i'm honored to have a chance to speak with you and your family this year. recently, we learned that our governments working in concert have created a system of worldwide mass surveillance. watching everything we do. great britain's george orwell warned us of the danger of this kind of information. the types of collection in the book, microphones and video cameras, tv's that watch us are nothing compared to what we have available today. we have sensors in our pockets that track us everywhere we go.

think about what this means for the privacy of the average person. a child born today will grow up with no conception of privacy at all. they'll never know of what it means to have a private moment to themselves an unrecorded unanalyzed thought. that's a problem because privacy matters. privacy is what allows us to determine who we are and who we want to be. the conversation today will determine the trust we can place both in technology that surround us and the government that regulates it. together. we can find a better balance, end mass surveillance, and remind the government if if the wants to know how we feel, asking is always cheaper than spying. for everyone out there listening, thank you and merry

christmas. >> joining the discussion, joy reid, msnbc analyst, steve clemens, and washington editor at large for "the atlantic" magazine. here we have another edward snowden statement. he says things. every time he speaks. he will say things that are absurdly wildly overblown. he says the government is -- his words watching everything we do. that is impossible. no one is watching everything we do. that capacity doesn't exist. he then says, think what this means for the privacy of the average person. for the privacy of the average person that means nothing. nsa, these operations aren't interested in the average person. he says kids growing up today will never know of what it means

to have a private moment to themselves. unrecorded, unanalyzed thought. this is so completely impossible. these, these, his rhetorical descriptions of scenarios. the manpower, computer power dupz n does not exist on earth to analyze everyone's thoughts. whether they are written or, or, electronically conveyed or not. joy, you know, snowden lovers object to taking his words literally. when he says these things and believes you should cheer him on. i find it odd when he speaks he says provably untrue things like this. >> lawrence, that gets to what has been problematic to me about the snowden saga. first came out with revelation that were not new if you read "the new york times" and have done for many years. so, in 2005. came out with a blockbuster

report. they were bleeding surveillance into the domestic space. when that happened. i was doing radio. listeners want the government off to keep us safe. the democratic response, was to pass a law. codifying that into law. by the time edward snowden gach this information to greenwald at "the washington post." this was not new. if you read vanity fair, these are ten-year-old programs. this was going on. now, attached to it. he added just -- made up, horror story ideas that were, came from edward snowden's own mind. that the government could in theory watch everything you do. he came up with the fanciful scenarios that are not themselves journal its m or revelations. they're edward snowden's nightmare scenario for what he

thinks could be done with the information. one last thing. say this is worth at 1984. you never read 1984. there were no televisions from the government in our homes watching us, they haven't outlawed sex, any body seen wrecking ball, or outlawed speaking against the government, it is absurd because it is in his own mind. >> steve clemens, i do find it odd that someone with his technical expertise has such rhetorical wildness to talk about the government watching everything we do. and those are his words. and that's just provably untrue. i want to get past that. the other thing, snowden said to "the washington post." it is mission accomplished. he has done what heap wa wanted dupe provoking this debate. he is right he has provoked the most important debate of the year. i think that is right on target.

the president of the united states has said this was a debate the nation had. i think while his words may not work for you. they're powerfully sa du lly se. i heard talk about if j. edgar hoover had been alive and had capacity that edward snowden has profiled and shown the world that the nsa has the, that no one would be safe. that was senator saying that. ron widen has said things along the same lines. not packed with the hyperbole. but i think it is a mistake to discount snowden that he has awakened in many people. the concern about the balance. and connected community. connected nation. and, that, the side that they have in fact, forefitted a tremendous degree of privacy.

when, randall stevenson of at & t and, maraissa mayer met president obama they were underscoring how their customers were making big differences sharing information with those firms, and the government just getting access off to everything about them. i want to make this distinction. i think the work he has done is very important. and it, there is no question about that. the debate that has been -- been provoked by it is very important. those are all separate issues. it is important. undeniably important.

he doesn't need to say that the government is watching everything we do. there is enough outrage out there, about what we, what we have already seen that we know the government is actually capable of doing. yet, joy, he continues to overstate it. his rhetoric is out of control compared to information revealed. >> that's the issue that they have had with him. when those -- when the stories came out in '06. this was a huge, alarming story. the fact that these things are going on. albeit with warrants. one thing that is true. young people. my youngest, child, 14, will not grow up knowing an unguarded unwatched moment. that is true. every company you dupe business

with. every site. google. good old facebook. these companies are making incredible intrusions people don't know about into their privacy every single day. what's snnew? they're sharing them with the government. people need new be concerned about the company's access as well. >> joy reid, steven clemens, thank you for joining us to night. >> thank you. off awe thank you, lawrence. >> coming of. my very favorite last word segment of the year. ♪

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>> i was inspired my mr. o'donnell's effort to raise money for kids in malawi. and 2012, i was watching him, inspired by him since 2010. god spoke to my heart. going to buy a desk in memory of my mother and father. he spoke to me and said you can dupe more than that. >> and she did so much more than that. she helped create what became my personal favorite story of the year. here on "the last word" and we will show you that story coming up.

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energy lives here. >> in tonight'sy write space we will have a review of my favorite story of the year here on "the last word." >> i was a little boy when i first heard about birmingham, alabama. and nothing i heard was good. police were using fire hoses to attack civil rights protestors. later that same year, the 16th street baptist church was bombed killing four little girls. when i was invited to birmingham

last weekend the first place i went was the birmingham civil rights institute which has extraordinary exhibitions telling the story of that time. i saw the shoes denise mcnair was wearing when killed in the bombing. i walked across the street from the institute and saw where the bomb was placed at the 16th street baptist church. three of the girls funerals were held at the 6th avenue baptist church. the church that invited me to attend their services on sunday morning. dr. martin luther king spoke many times from the sixth avenue baptist church pulpit during the bad times in birmingham. but sunday morning, i was invited to speak there because the cub scouts at the 6th avenue baptist church wanted to present me with a check for the kind fund. kids in need of desks is a partnership with unicef to

provide jopz how to workers in malawi, building desks we delivered to african schools that have no desks. the cub scouts at the 6th avenue baptist church wanted to do something big for the kind fund. they worked all year at it and found new ways of raising money every month. when the congregation and i arrived at church sunday morning, we had no idea what these 14 boys, ages 6 to 11 had been able to achieve. but when we saw what the cub scouts at the sixth avenue baptist church had accomplished in their year of work on behalf of kids their age, halfway around the world, sure felt like a miracle to us. ♪ ♪

♪ i love you jesus ♪ hallelujah >> good morning. you know, i -- i flew down here from my hometown of boston yesterday. and i thought just to feel at home i am going to bring the weather with me. so, you are welcome for that. and i do so feel -- at home here this morning because we share so many beliefs and we share so many values. and m bambitions and hopes. the one thing that we share is we all believe in miracles.

>> nobody likes when they sit on the floor. but the kids in africa wouldn't like to sit on the floor. crumpled up work, messy. everybody knows if you sitting down on the, crisscross apple sauce on the floor, then you are, your paperwork going to be messy. >> i said -- we believe in miracles. some people have to believe in miracles because they don't think they have ever seen miracles. this is the first time in the city of birmingham. city of birmingham is a miracle. what's happened in this city during my lifetime is a miracle, that some people in this room made that happen. the life of nelson mandela is a miracle. we saw that happen. i'll tell you another personal miraclen my life. to be standing here, to be

invited into a congregation as a guest to speak here -- that puts my name some where on that long list of distinguished guests who have spoken to this congregation and that is the only list that i will ever share with the reverend dr. martin luther king jr. and that is as great an honor as i could hatve ever dreamed of ad i never did dream of it. let me tell you about a miracle that i am hoping for. the miracle that occurred in the educational context. and i know that -- that in a classroom, if you could put ape desk there -- if you could maybe, just improve that student's line of sight to the blackboard, if you could just finally have that student making eye contact with the teacher all

day -- we don't know what miracle could happen. we don't know -- if that student who was drifting away suddenly becomes a good student. we don't know if that student doesn't become a great student. if that student doesn't become a nurse. a doctor. or the next nelson mandela. because there has to be a next nelson mandela coming from some where in some place in some one of those classrooms. >> we had bake sales. spaghetti sales. and car washes and every month we did a different project. the boys were there every step of the way. and she talked to us, asked us if we wanted to do that. and we took a vote. everybody said, yes we wanted to. it really touched us that they needed desks in africa.

on behalf of 6th avenue baptist church, pack 3145, we would look to present this check to the k.i.n.d. fund for $18,067.75. [ cheers and applause ] [ applause ] >> that act of kindness, that act of goodness, to take these children off the floor for that seven hours that they're in those classrooms, to give them that feeling of a real educational setting, to give them -- that little stage on which to perform that's good enough for me. that's good enough. they don't need to become doctors and nurses. they don't need to become great

students. it's good enough for me to make their day better. that's good enough for me. but right here, in this room, in this city of miracles, we can talk about miracles. and we can think about the miracle of $18,000 which is the single largest contribution the k.i.n.d. fund has ever received from any group anywhere in the three years we have been doing this! that's the biggest one! [ applause ] that check is a miracle! ♪ ♪ >> when they see your desks that

you paid for, when they see those arrive at their school it will be the first desks they have ever seen in their lives. that is the miracle that you will deliver into their lives, the day that truck arrives. and they will greet it -- as a miracle. i can tell you right now what they're going to do. they do it every time. the truck pulls into the school. they come streaming out of their classrooms and they are singing, they are filled with song, just the way we are filled with song here this morning. because they are joyful. and they are thankful. and you -- have delivered a miracle into their lives. thank you very, very, very much. >> every time i tune into lawrence o'donnell's show and see those kids in the desks, i will be able to say to my boys, a job well done. and i am proud of them. and i am extremely proud of my church congregation.

♪ ♪ [ male announcer ] this is george.

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>> keith mathis is the leader of the heroic group of cub scouts. he told us why he wanted his cub scouts to get involved with kids in need of desks. >> i knew it was something that our boys -- needed to be a part of. something outside the city. something outside the state.

making a difference in -- in children, or boys and girls. that look like them. that, that are the same age as them. so -- i knew that this was something that, that -- that -- that -- that was very good for them. it would be something that they would remember the rest of their lives. >> and the arrival of desks in african schools where the students have never seen desks is something that those kids will remember for the rest of their lives. [ male announcer ] here's a question for you: where does the united states get most of its energy? is it africa? the middle east? canada? or the u.s.? the answer is... the u.s. ♪ most of america's energy comes from right here at home. take the energy quiz.

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statements like that from pope francis led "time" magazine and the advocate to name the pope its person of the year. pope francis' comments led to this answer during the taping of the last word annual holiday party and awards show. >> jonathan, last category who is the biggest winner of the year? >> lawrence, the catholic church. because the pope francis i, the first from latin america, first jesuit is speaking in a way that has brought millions of people who were turned off or tuned out of the church brought them back to the church. he is the biggest winner of 2013.

>> you choreographed that move yourself? >> damn skippy. [ cheers and applause ] [ laughter ] >> cheers!