there's not one way to do something. no details too small. american express open forum. this is what membership is. this is what membership does. the wild things. let's play "hardball." good evening, i'm chris matthews in washington. let me start with this, the right, the far right, the far out right. the wild things were out there as far as the eye can see. mitch mcconnell waving a rifle. lindsey graham blaming things on benghazi. both pandering so far to the right, they are about to land on their butts. meanwhile, at a meeting called the uninvited were those judged

too far right even for the cpac convention. cruz says immigrants have cabs as big as cantaloupes and the president is one of them. meet the truly far out right. folks like frank who believe anti-tax pitchman grover in order quis is an undercover agent of the muslim brotherhood. the president may be secretly backing terrorists or the panelist who says john boehner is covering up benghazi. boehner is. with establishment figures like mitch mcconnell and lindsey graham trying to join the crazy. ted cruz calling people like bob dole and john mccain names to get to the hard right frontier to lead the country where he

plans to put his flag. dana millbanks and jonathan. this was something. this week went really far right. >> it's always a bit of a circus at cpac and everybody is under pressure to provide the red meat. this went further. this is the time ted cruz is not just speaking to cpac, but the furser right group called the uninvited. people too far right to be invited there. you have them not inviting the speaker of the house. not eligible there. republican candidates snubbing cpac. >> is this the republican party of 2014? people working here, i have been talking to people, you can argue this is the republican party. it's no longer the fringe of the fringes. >> paul ryan was saying he was saying it's not necessarily a civil war within the republican

party. he's right. there's not an establishment versus the tea party. >> it's a jam boar ree. >> it is. the establishment has been taken over by the tea party. >> you agree we'll be this crazy right. is it really the republican party that represents the nation of republicans which is about having elections pretty much half the country sometimes. >> remember, you have senators lindsay gram, john mccain, john cornyn, people who have been in congress, in the senate before 2010 when the tea party came in. they are now saying and doing things we would think are unimaginable ten years ago. that's because the tea party has come in and has yanked the party to the right. made them fearful since bob bennett lost his senate seat. >> they are not stupid.

lindsey graham is as smart as ever. >> because they have seen one too many of their colleagues go down. >> to make your point, this week in texas, john cornyn, who had no real opponents had 41% of the primary voters vote against him. it's scary. >> it is scary. that's why i agree with dana. i think we are all here in agreement. the republican party, it's not that the republican party co-opted the tea party, the tea party movement -- it is the future now. >> they must think of the future, a terrible phrase. cpac wasn't ted cruz's only stop. a group further to the right set up their own shadow conference dubbed, the uninvited. steve king, the cantaloupe guy of iowa. he says immigrants have cabs as

big as cantaloupe. they are carrying 150 pounds full of marijuana. gomer of texas, mo brooks of alabama who said this on the topic of undocuments immigrants. i will do anything short of shooting them. that's kind. franks referred to president obama as an enemy of humanity and jim bridenstine refused to attend a town hall when they said president obama should be executed. the far right is now the far out. then this group of full mooners. here is more color from the conference. a non-profit called empact schooled attendees about the threat of a terrorist attack by way of an electromagnetic post. they articulated the view that

antitax activists and a board member grover nordquist is with the muslim brotherhood. the wife of supreme court justin clarence thomas said president obama may be providing material support for terrorism. at least one panelist at cpac suggested john boehner was part ott benghazi cover up. this reminds me, you know, you know, the john bird society. they accused the eisenhower brothers, of being comi's. when you call boehner part of this, people like grover nordquist, you are a full

mooner. >> they left out the obvious, president obama is controlling us with our water. >> what is the latest on that? >> maybe using our cell phones too much. what's going on here, as you were saying, the establishment is co-opted by the tea party. what were the guys doing. you have to stay one step ahead. that's what's causing this saying cpac isn't conservative enough. we have to go in another direction. >> what is the dynamic? you take sides a little bit. what is the thing with the dynamic out there? they are not going toward winning a presidential election. they are going toward winning something. cruz wants to get to the farthest right rail. he believes the race that is coming, that's the best post to be in. why is that whole crowd going right? >> i missed it by what's happening.

i can't quite tell you what their number one goal is because it certainly isn't winning the white house, that's for sure. the reason we're talking about how we went from cpac, the far right, you couldn't get further right than that to this uninvited conference is there's no one in the republican party now who can tell the full mooners, tell the crazies what you are saying is wrong, what you are saying is facttually incorrect, what you are saying is disrespectful and un-american, what you are saying is bad for the party. there's no one within the republican party who can say that. that's how you have this. >> i will be contentious on this. do you mean to tell me the republican party chair of say, ohio, a middle of the road state or pennsylvania or virginia, even now middle of the road, the republican party chairs, men and women of those states are happy with this zoo they are watching on television, they think it's

good advertising? >> i don't think so. they are not worried about 2014. it's going to be a good year for republicans. this is about presidential primary politics. cpac has a presidential ballot. they always do. 26 people on it. how do you differentiate yourself? you have to be one step urter -- >> does the furthest right candidate win at cpac? >> this is a ron paul/rand paul thing. >> cruz could win this thing? >> he could win many a presidential primaries. >> anyway, cruz told conservatives if they don't stand for principle, they will lose. he made his point by attacking the last three unsuccessful nominees by mocking and referring to them as president romney, president mccain and president dole. today, no surprise here.

mccain is firing back. >> he can say what he wants to about me and he can say anything he wants to about mitt, mitt is capable of taking it. when he throws bob dole in there, i wonder if he thinks bob dole stood for principle on that hill top in italy when he was gravely wounded and left part of his body there fighting for our country. bob dole is such a man of honor, sbeg rety and principle. i hope ted cruz will apologize to bob dole. that is crossed a line that, to me, is -- leaves the realm of politics and discourse that we should have in america. >> of course ted cruz crossed that line a long time ago followed by bob dole who told

nbc news that cruz, senator cruz should check my voting record before making comments. my record is that of a traditional republican conservati conservative. >> that's the problem. by the way, bob dole was shot, you know, fighting in the toughest part of the war in the western part of the war up there in italy, in the end of it, near the end. he's going back to pick up a guy that was wounded. that's how he got shot. the idea of taking him down, he's old, he's not in great shape. this can't be beaten. i have never seen a guy take a cheaper shot. >> this is the disrespectful thing. >> who does he respect? >> ted cruz, clearly. he listens to himself. he will do what's best for ted cruz. senator dole isn't the first republican senator cruz went after. during chuck hagel's confirmation hearing, he questioned the secretary's

americanist. >> why doesn't cruz go after castro? i can agree with that. beat them. go land on the beach tomorrow, i don't care. leave our guys alone. he attacks so many americans. he is bad news. he is bad news. thank you. have a nice weekend. i hope mr. cruz does not have a nice weekend. coming up, things go better when you attack, poke, that's the idea behind the billionaire koch brothers. they got one, two for the price of one. not enough whites for republicans to win the white house, how is that for math and not enough minority voters for the democrats to win back the congress. why this could be the new normal. vladimir putin moves a major challenge to president obama. last night, david letterman and jon stewart had fun at his

expense. the subject of the new play, "camp david" opener here on march 21st. this is "hardball," the place for politics. by posting them to. oh, i like that one. it's so quick! it's just like my car insurance. i saved 15% in just 15 minutes. i saved more than that in half the time. i unfriend you. that's not how it works. that's not how any of this works. [ male announcer ] 15 minutes for a quote isn't how it works anymore. with esurance, 7 1/2 minutes could save you on car insurance. welcome to the modern world. esurance. backed by allstate. click or call.

the government reform committee apologized to elijah cummings. he phoned him at home and apologized for his conduct after the chairman cut off his microphone as he tried to speak at the end of a hearing wednesday on the irs affair. house democrats called on the house to sanction him for his conduct, a measure that failed as republicans failed to back him. we'll be right back. means advanced technology. we learned that technology allows us to be craft oriented. no one's losing their job. there's no beer robot that has suddenly chased them out.

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welcome back to "hardball." well, democrats find themselves facing an uphill battle to hold on to the u.s. senate in this year's midterm elections. there are as many as 13 democratic seats in play, in

other words vulnerable versus just two republican seat that are vulnerable. if republicans pick up a net of six out of all that, it's game over for democrats, because they only have a five-seat advantage now. well, democrats have one mission right now, take down the far right's money men. we're talking about the billionaire koch brothers, of course, who have made it their mission to create pure tea party chaos for democrats on the ballot by bankrolling an onslaught of attack ads. over the past ten days, harry reid, of course the senate's top democrat has waged an unrelenting assault on charles and david koch personally. here is how it started late last month. >> this is the truth. what is going on with these two brothers who made billions of dollars last year in an attempt to buy our democracy is dishonest, deceptive, false, and unfair. just because you have huge amounts of money, you should not be able to run these false, misleading ads by the hundreds of millions of dollars. >> well, early this week, reid doubled down.

>> what is unamerican is when shadowy billionaires pour unlimited money into our democracy to rig the system to benefit themselves and the wealthiest 1%. senate republicans, madam president, are addicted to koch. >> addicted to koch. and yesterday he told reporters he would not let up, saying, quote, i've been told by lots of people don't pick a fight. they're wealthy. they're very vengeful. but without sounding too melodramatic, if not me, who? that's harry reid speaking. i am after the koch brothers. they are two people who are trying to buy america. they have the money to do it. rick tyler, a republican strategist and steve mcmahon is a democratic strategist. is anybody making money off of these guys? they spend billions of dollars. are the consultants or ad copywriters making money? they're paying the checks to somebody. tv stations, i guess. >> sure, they spend a lot of money to get people elected. but harry reid doesn't like -- well, the unions also gave him

money. >> let's get to the point here. why is harry reid going after the koch brothers? why is he making it personal and admitting it's personal. he doesn't like these guys. >> well, he doesn't like them. but he also wants to make it much more difficult for them as business people to be successful in business if they continue down this road. so he wants them to be shunned at cocktail parties. he wants their business associates to question their motives and what they're doing. he wants to make their lives difficult in their communities. and i think he -- >> here is what i know about the koch brothers. they don't like being talked about. they like spending lots of money. they like to be able to dive-bomb into a campaign. jump into somewhere like north carolina, splurge a ton of money when they find a vulnerable democrat and then come out anonymously. but the democrats i think would be stupid to let them be anonymous. your thoughts. aren't the democrats smart to jump the guys and say these are the boogiemen. they're the bad guys. >> i think he and elijah cummings went to the same faux outraged acting school. >> that was real.

>> this is about changing the subject because harry reid doesn't want to talk about people who have lost their health care. women who lost their health care. he is talking about a stagnant economy. >> presumably, rick -- >> sure, whatever. >> say benghazi. >> why do you want me to say benghazi? >> because it's on the list. >> is it a game? >> it is a game. it's called change the subject from the koch brothers. should a couple of brothers who have made a lot of money in oil and gas decide who wins the senate race in north carolina for united states senate? >> of course not. everybody is free to give as much money as they want. >> but nobody has the kind of money they have to throw around. who else can write a check for a couple of million. >> it's okay for c-5s is that what you're saying? from 1989, c-5s put in over half of expenditures. >> unions have memberships. there is some democracy there. >> it's okay for the unions when they agree with harry reid. >> okay. the goose and the gander kind of

thing here. george soros. don't the democrats have some money men who just go around spending money where they want? >> yeah that. >> so how is it wrong for these guy as? >> that's why so many democrats and some republicans like john mccain think we need campaign finance reform. because nobody should be able to slip into a state under the cover of darkness, spend several hundred million, not in just one state, but several, and pick the united states senate that is going to work for their business. that's not the way democracy is supposed to work. and frankly, i'm surprised that the stations are so anxious to take this money. they used to have standards and they used to make people prove things. one of the things that is true about these koch brother ads is many of them have turned out to be drownright false. they continue to run them. so they have a first amendment right to do this. but they're not above the law with respect to slander and other things. >> let's take a look at this. i want to get to the interest of these groups. sorrows is the man on the left. maybe generalized left. but what do the koch brothers' economic interests? i get the feeling they should write off all these expenses.

i think every dollar they spend on the republican party is good for their business. tax write-offs, oil and gas industry, the whole deal. this is economic investment for these guys, isn't it? >> i don't think so. >> they're not doing it for ideological reasons, are they? >> i don't know them individually. i think they're actually patriotic. i think they actually believe in america. i think they actually believe in free enterprise. i think they believe in freedom. those are the things that harry reid doesn't seem to believe in. that's why he is upset. >> i think harry reid is a guy who pulled them up by his bootstraps and he believes in this country implicitly. anyway, here is harry reid taking on the koch brothers. according to "the new york times," by the way, since september, americans for prosperity, a group financed in part by the billionaire koch brothers has spent an estimated $20 million on television advertising, since september. look at this. groups backed by the koch brothers are airing ads literally thousands of times against vulnerable democrat incumbents. look at these numbers. they pay for over 3,000 ad spots attacking senator kay hagan, a democrat in north carolina who

is a senator there. they financed more than one thousand against mary landrieu in louisiana. nearly 700 against senator mark begich. this saturation campaign adding, do you think that's good for democracy? over and over again blasting people. >> the only thing that is different is citizens united where now corporations can run ads. most of them are mom and pop shops. >> do you think this is a good? it's a good call? >> i think you should allow candidates to raise all the money they want individually because it's their name on the ballot and put them on it. they're limited. >> but you don't like the outside. >> that would be better than what we have now. it's funny because it's sort of what you see depends on where you sit. i can remember back this 2012 when mitt romney's little mysterious funders were taking newt gingrich to task and taking him out of the primaries there was a lot of outrage from rick and some of the folks in the newt gingrich camp. and it sort of depends on where you sit. these guys come in, they come under cover of darkness and they do what they do because they

want to pick a senate that is going to be more reflective of their business interests. >> what i don't like is the tag line, you're getting at it here. if it says at the end of the ad paid for by the meshes for prosperity, nobody knows what that means. it sounds sort of vaguely good. who doesn't like prosperity. it doesn't say paid for by a couple of guys who made billions of dollars in the oil industry that would be useful information, that tag line. on the other point, to your side do, you think democratic working people, middle class democrats give a rat's butt whether some rich guy is paying for ads? does it work as a negative attack line to say that there is koch brothers? >> no. here is the thing. it works as a fundraising line. you remember back in day when i worked for ted kennedy. ted kennedy was used repeatedly to raise money for republican causes. so symbols do work in politics. but this symbol isn't well enough known to enough people to have an impact broadly. but they're well enough known in their communities so that when harry reid is talking about them, they're getting asked about it at cocktail parties and business meetings and board meetings.

that's really what this is about. he wants to make it socially unacceptable for them to do this. they're in business, and half of their customers are democrats, and they know it. and they don't want to be as controversial as they're becoming. they don't want the spotlight. >> i don't think they want the controversy but i don't think it hurts them in their little social set. >> i don't think it does either. they don't want the publicity. they like to do this, they think they're doing the right thing. i think they're doing the right thing. they're allowed to do it. it's legal. i think we should go further. i don't think citizens united went far enough. but that's the law. >> we encourage people on this show to get out and vote. the regular person, man and woman. get out there and vote. your vote matters. it's harder to make that argument when you know that these kind of characters, they're americans, i agree. they're legal, are spending billions of dollars to turn the elections in another direction. it doesn't strike me as very democratic. it's not democratic. it's something else. it may be legal. that doesn't make it democratic. thank you for making a good argument for a terrible cause. coming up, the more vladimir

putin acts like a dictator, the more the late-night comics pepper him with jokes. the sideshow is coming up neck. this is "hardball," the place for politics. if you wear a denture, touch it with your tongue. if your denture moves, it can irritate your gums. try fixodent plus gum care. it helps stop denture movement and prevents gum irritation. fixodent. and forget it. and prevents gum irritation. coach calls her a team player. she's kind of special. she makes the whole team better. he's the kind of player that puts the puck, horsehide,

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is the number one doctor recommended frequent heartburn medicine for 8 straight years. one pill each morning. 24 hours. zero heartburn. all of the sudden vladimir putin invades the ukraine. nobody knows what is going on. so we put together an informative segment for you tonight called understanding the ukraine crisis. take a look at this. >> the current crisis can be traced back to -- >> there is nothing to understand. here is all you need to know. mind your own business. ptoo. >> time for the sideshow. that was of course david letterman's not so subtle commentary about vladimir putin's control of the media. it's not so far from the truth, actually. yesterday putin blocked two

ukrainian tv channels from being broadcasting into the russian-occupied crimean peninsula. as the old proverb goes, truth is the first casualty of war. putin of course sees it differently. he held a press conference yesterday to show off how open he is being with the media and to explain his side of what is going on. and surprise, surprise, putin blames america. quote, this is putin, they sit across there, across the pond as if in a lab, running all kinds of experiments ton rats. why would they do it? no one can explain it. well, here was jon stewart's reaction to that putin press conference on "the daily show" just last night. >> this is what i'd like to suggest. let's have a conversation rather than an interview. >> you know what? i did not see that coming. a conversation, a rap session. i never saw putin as the cool dad. well, let's get to the conversation. >> i would ask you to begin by stating all your questions. i will jot them down and try to answer them.

fine. let us stop here for now. i will begin. don't interrupt me. >> i forgot it was an interesting fact. in russia, the word for conversation is the same word as the word for shut the [ bleep ] up. >> well, "the post" and anna applebaum may have summed up that well. putin's press conference reveals that we may have reached the weird moment when the dictator believes his own propaganda. up next tonight, the real reason why democrats are set to hold the white house for a while, and why republicans can hold on to congress for a long time. that's ahead. we're going to try to explain future history tonight. you're watching "hardball," the place for politics. [ female announcer ] think all pads are the same? don't.

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i'm veronica de la cruz. still, no sign of a malaysian airlines boeing 777 bound for beijing. it disappeared yesterday two hours after taking off with 239 people on board, including three americans. the airline says there was no distressing on whether conditions were clear. the airline ceo says passengers and crew are being notified. we'll keep you updated on this story. first, we'll get back to the program. welcome back to "hardball." well, if the early predictions

hold true, republicans could control both houses of congress by next year, and hillary clinton could be the odds-on favorite to win the presidency in 2016. and as the nation's demographics change, it's possible that the start of a long-term trend is there. democrats in the white house, republicans in the u.s. congress, especially the house. here is why. the democrats coalition minorities, young people and single women are highly concentrated in a minority of congressional districts, around big cities, mostly in urban areas. the republican party appeals primarily to rural, blue collar white voters. journalist ron brownstein writes in the national journal that the big takeaway from the 2012 election was the limits of the modern republican electoral coalition. it appears that the limits will be the modern democratic coalition. each side of the dilemma fits neatly into a bookend. republicans can't attract enough minorities to capture the white house and democrats can't get

enough votes to carry congress because they can't win enough to carry can cds. eugene robinson with "the washington post" and michelle bernard is founder of the center for women, politics and policy. thank you, both. during the break, i was stunned by this new number that charlie cook came out with, which is for the first time a president was reelected with a popular vote, pretty good popular vote, 52%, but didn't win a popular vote in most of the -- he has done well in berkeley, los angeles, san francisco, chicago, atlanta, miami. but out in the rural areas and out in the suburbs, the vote is more split apart and thrown around, dispersed. and he doesn't do that well. >> right. he is winning tons and tons of votes in the cities. >> 92% in charlie rangel's district. 92%. >> exactly. mitt romney didn't win any district by 92%. >> it's big cities. philadelphia, for example, is about 50-50 ethnically. but 85% of the city went for obama. so big cities are also the

stronghold of white liberals and groups that tend to vote democrat. >> absolutely. and to an extent, suburbs, right, because suburbs can tend to vote like cities more than like rural areas. but this is a real thing. you know, the question is, though, it is affected by the way you draw the districts. and so, you know, i'm a little suspicious when you talk about the long-term -- >> they won in 2010 big, the republicans. >> oh, yeah. >> before they got their redistrict, they won the right through the state legislature. they did. guys like meehan and fitzpatrick won in' 10. >> all won in 2010. they won with white males, culturally conservative who i believe don't necessarily like seeing a black president in the white house. it is black and white, maybe not 100%, but it's an issue there is absolutely no denying it. >> let's look at the senate. >> exacerbates. >> let's look at the senate, because the senate was drawn by the states.

it's the nature of the states. but the senate, our founding fathers ruled that the smaller states with less people in them who tend to be white states today, they didn't plan that part, rural states had the same two senators at new york. >> that was the idea. >> you called me on that. but they do. >> like wyoming and montana coming up this time. and alaska. alaska has very few people living in it. montana, south dakota. these states are going to dominate the senate. and they're all republican. >> this is a problem. democrats, if they're going to play in the senate, if they're going to keep this very slim majority they have, they have to find a way to play in these states. and it's not easy, because their voters don't live in these states. so they're going to have to find -- appeal to other voters. >> there was a time that idaho had frank church and south dakota had george mcgovern, utah had frank moss. my first boss. they're all over out there. >> yeah. >> moderate to liberal democratic senators in those rural rocky mountain states.

what is wrong? what has changed? >> the whole country has changed. but what i would like to say is how about focusing on like positive change, battleground texas, this move, for example, to turn texas into a blue state. it's not going to happen in 2014, but it could happen in 2016. what if democrats get smart in all of these rural states that we're talking about, instead of throwing in the towel and saying we can't compete -- >> what can they do besides wait for the demographic time bomb? >> the demographic time bomb has already happened. we're seeing the browning of america in every single state in this country. what we're not seeing is people being smart and going out and reaching out to people that have traditionally democratic values that don't see any reason to show up at the ballot box. >> get minorities and young people to vote in midterms. >> that's exactly what i'm saying. that's the point. >> that's got to be democratic strategy in this election. >> the ones who don't register, because they don't think they have any reason to register. >> do you think there is a connection between having a health care plan but not figuring out to roll it out?

figuring out how to win the presidency, but not keep it. so the conservative political action committee, that's cpac hosted a panel discussion on the gop's outreach to minority. but most revealing was the attendance for the discussion, which sums up the struggles republicans are facing with their national electoral coalition. take a look at this photograph that room is empty. it was tweeted out by a fellow name john hudak is a fellow at brookings who was attending pretty much all alone that cpac event. tweeted big problem for gop. most important cpac 2014 panel. topic, minority outreach. view, largely empty room. so, i guess they didn't have the welcome mat out. they charged people to come to this damn thing. that's not exactly -- a certain crowd that shows up. the yaffers all show up there. aren't many black yaffers. maybe there are. >> here is my advice to the people who do these panels and want to do african american outreach.

take a page out of karl rove's book. in 2005, president bush, i was there, president bush had a meeting with 20 african american leaders at the white house. most of them were ministers. most of them were overwhelmingly democrats. and he sat down and listened and said what are your issues? and we saw it translate into policy. most of the room was very much anti-gay marriage. most of the room wanted to see the country do something with regard to hiv/aids in africa. we saw it translate into policy. it's not large -- >> is that what has left to the fight against aids? >> and he listened. an that's his greatest legacy. and the black vote went from 9% to 11% between 2000 and 2004. it takes being smart, not throwing out yahoo or somebody, absolutely. >> fighting aids in africa. >> i've written in several columns that that was his greatest achievement. and it was a huge achievement.

>> and the people know it. >> and he listened. it's not -- you don't have to peddle. you just have to listen and be smart, and maybe not turn back the tide of voting rights. >> rove got this, george w. bush got this. the current crop of republicans does not get it. >> yeah. >> mitt romney didn't get it. >> isn't it funny how the more recent republicans are beginning to look like moderates? every old picture of you looks better. that's what i noticed. this question of the white house. let's go back to our premise, and then michelle, jump on this. does it look like now that hillary or any -- hillary looks like the probable nominee has a better shot at the white house come 2016 now than any republican, and yet there doesn't seem to be an horizon out there you can see where the democrats take back the house. >> you know, i don't see the horizon. i do think that democrats really ought to concentrate on doing better in the state houses because it certainly won't hurt if they're able to draw some congressional -- >> their next shot is 2022. >> exactly.

that will be their next shot. but it's tough. i mean, it's tough. i never say never, because stuff happens in politics. >> holding on to the white house, the democrats have a good chance to hold it? >> i think hillary clinton is the next president of the united states if she wants it. >> okay. >> house, a different story. >> i like your clarity. have a nice weekend. michelle bernard, i mean it. up next, you may remember him as john boy from "the waltons." one of the most popular shows in the '70s. richard thomas is in washington. he is taking us behind the scenes of some of the most dramatic examples of presidential diplomacy. this is "hardball," the place for politics. ♪ ♪ [ girl ] my mom,

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the scene in the white house last night was almost unbelievable. menachem begin of israel and anwar el sadat of egypt in a bear hug that worked out in 13 days at camp david. it will be the first time in history that an arab nation has agreed to a peace treaty with israel. >> the first time an arab nation made peace with israel. the signing of the camp david accords was a landmark achievement of presidential diplomacy back in 1978. the triumphant conclusion of an intensive closed door negotiation led by jimmy carter between two unlikely partners, the leaders of egypt and israel. there they are. but that's just what the public got to see, the public part, the hugging. the truth was the summit was more fraught with tension, discord, and actual animus than the press could ever have known at the time. it all played out in the tranquil wooded hills of its

namesake, camp david, the 120-acre presidential retreat north of washington. now pulitzer prize winning journalist turned playwright has written camp david based on the events that unfolded in the days leading up to that great agreement. you can see a real life work of political theater here. the play, which is 36 years in the make iing is as much about drama as anything written for the stage. debuts march 21st in washington at the great arena stage. with us to talk about it, the camp david," richard thomas who plays president carter. he's a 55-year-old veteran of performing arts, of course, acting in "the waltons" all those years. what did you learn in all this? i went to the reading, tough jewish guy. really tough who has lived through the holocaust, knows all the things about the world that hates the jewish people. totally sensitive to giving up the land. and anwar sadat who seems like a nice guy but just as tough. >> just as tough. it is drama.

it absolutely is drama. you see the signing and embracing as you say in the headlines. larry wright has done the most extraordinary job of taking you into those 13 days of intense back and forth and each man so passionate in his beliefs and desire to defend his own people and carter desperately trying to feel the idealist in him, knowing that piece is achievable and the alchemy between the three men that they managed to do something, i'd like to see something like that happen now. >> yeah, what struck me is, because going through the reading, the israeli -- the jewish side -- here he is this older guy speaking for the history of the 20th century and horror of the holocaust and speaking from that. should we trust you people? >> yes. >> why should we trust you? >> exactly so. two implacable enemies. one thing that comes up in play, it's as hard to let go of an enemy sometimes as it is to let

go of a friend. there's so much investment in the conflict. >> how many anwar sadats are there on this planet? how many eser weismans? how many great people? >> sadat's commitment to carter from the very beginning of the play, i'm here to make peace. i will make peace. i've gone to jerusalem, spoken to knesset. i want this to happen. he drove a tough bargain, too, because he wanted to do the right thing but he was constantly having to dig in. >> he remembered this -- the yam kapur war. invaded israel in '73. >> all these things are in the play, but what makes it exciting, what larry's done, it's a play about people. about -- of very principled, very strong men who were also flawed human beings. >> anyway, tempers flared in the early days in the meetings.

in fact, the entire peace summit was nearly derailed on the very first day. let's take a look at a scene from a rehearsal of "camp david." it was carefully researched, constructed by the language previously used. >> what promises can you make that will protect us? you're the most impeccable enemy the jewish people have had since the nazis. >> always the nazis. >> that's right. as you should know. >> i admire him because he fought the british as i fought them. >> in your terrorist career. >> who is the real terrorist here? you have the blood of hundreds of innocent people on your hands. >> well, that was -- that guy reminds me of omar sharif. he's egyptian, right? >> yeah. we got a great cast. ron rifken is playing, holly is playing roseland. this wonderful egyptian actor

who's a big star in egypt -- >> he didn't have to fake thing a the accent. >> he brought egypt with him. it's very exciting. >> is this going to inspire us? i saw brian cranston in "all the way" about lbj that talks about negotiations and leading this country and how you have to do it. is this going to teach us how to negotiate a deal with the middle east peace with john kerry pushing it over there? >> both that play and our play are about getting things done, about people who know -- >> grown-ups. >> -- how to get things done. the idea you couldn't have two more entrenched opponents than in this story. but they did it. they made it work. >> would it have happened if it were on television? >> i think -- >> happened in secret? >> carter was very clear, i want to be isolated away from the world, surrounded by nature and just the three of us talking in the room. >> richard thomas, you're the perfect guy for jimmy. >> i love it. >> i'm going to say something after this about jimmy carter.

he ought to get credit for this. richard thomas. "camp david" debuts march 21st. mark that down. march 21st. this month, the arena stage here in washington. it's a great platform. we'll be right back after this. this...is jane. her long day on set starts with shoulder pain... ...and a choice take 6 tylenol in a day which is 2 aleve for... ...all day relief. hmm. [bell ring] "roll sound!" "action!" from crest 3d white, new brilliance toothpaste and boost. after brushing, our exclusive boost polishes your smile and whitens with 3x the stain lifting ingredient for a smile that dazzles. new crest 3d white brilliance.

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that's my phone. hey. [ female announcer ] the x1 entertainment operating system, only from xfinity. tv and internet together like never before. let me finish tonight, and the week, with this. the right wing has decided to couple president obama with president carter. i think it's time people stopped them. made them pay for the cheap shots. here's a little comparison. president carter forced a peace treaty between israel and its

greatest strategic threat at the time. he got egypt to sit down and agree to recognize the existence of the state of israel. the first arab state to do so, and certainly at the time the most important they could have done it. compare this to what the most recent republican president achieved in the middle east. he took us to war in iraq, dug us into the sand of that country, a burial job that will take us years to liberate ourselves from. he took a buffer to iran. killed it as a buffer. making it a shiite ally or even client to be in years to come. great work, mr. president. anyway, thanks to the president, many on the right fell loyally and stupidly into war, we have a more dangerous situation in the middle east. thanks to president carter, the man they jeer, israel still has the treaty partner with egypt, a real country with a real history and real recognition of israel which it honors all these years since 1978. we will see how president obama does in the history books. we know how w. has done. we should remind ourselves occasionally what jimmy carter

did. something no other president has done before or since, made peace between israel and its chief regional rival and not only that, but getting that rival to recognize its right to exist. and that's "hardball" for now. thanks for being with us. "all in with chris hayes" starts right now. nightmare and mystery. a boeing 777 airliner missing somewhere between malaysia and beijing. hundreds on board. we'll have the lathe es in a live report. new signals from russia. the u.s. over ukraine. details in minutes. one more blast of winter. another snowstorm could hit the midwest and east coast. when and where. the gop war. the new guard takes on the old guard. hear what both sides are saying now.