suddenly so tight-lipped. and slippery slope. increasing evidence that we knew of the mudslide risk in washington state far before this week's deadly disaster. and there's a very gruesome reason the death toll hasn't grown higher today. all of that, plus cycling out of control. talk about a leap of faith. the youngest man to ever climb mount everest is taking it on again in a bird suit and live on tv. last night he joined jimmy fallon, and this afternoon he will experience the greatest adventure of his life. a seat in "the cycle." good afternoon. we begin with a historic day at the vatican. president obama became just the ninth american president to make an official visit there. it was his first ever meeting with pope francis that lasted nearly an hour. details of their discussions

were kept largely private. but we know the president also met with the pop's top aid to discuss religious freedom, immigration reform and ending human trafficking. when the two historic figures re-emerged from behind closed doors, the president presented the pope with a customed made chest containing the same items made in the white house garden. >> some seeds. these i think are carrots. each one has a different seed. >> the pope then presented the president with two medallions and a copy of the pope's book titled "the joy of the gospel,"

which calls for a renewed focus on the world's poor, mirroring the issue of income inequality, the president has been so focused on as of late. the president promised to pursue the pope's writings any time he needs a lift. always here to give us a lift at "the cycle," jake martin, now a "new york times" best-seller with his latest book "jesus: a pilgrimage." thank you for joining us, and again congratulations on the book. >> thank you. thanks. >> so what is your reaction to their meeting this morning? >> it was very hopeful. they seemed to enjoy each other's company. they were all smiles afterwards. interestingly after president obama said i'd like you to come to the united states, the pope said como no, why not? >> one of the issues abby was alluding to that has ruffled feathers on the right in america is the pope speaking about poverty and income inequality. rush limbaugh essentially called him a marxist, to which pope

francis responded, the marxist ideology is wrong, but i have met many marxists in my life who are good people, so i don't feel offended. which i just love. because he totally diffuses it. which says it doesn't bother me, you can call me whatever i want. i'm going to talk about the things i want to talk about. i think for the president, one of the things that the pope really does is he frames the issue of income inequality in a right versus wrong framework rather than left versus right. >> very well put. and it's a gospel message. he's talking about jesus's message. and it's not just a catholic message, it's a christian message. i think president obama has been using that i think rightly, to remind americans and not just catholics that income inequality is something that's against the gospel. so i think they're both doing their roles. >> and on that point, the president spoke about their discussion on that, we have that brand-new sound, so let's listen to that. >> the largest bulk of the time was discussing two central concerns of his. one is the issues of the poor,

the marginalized, those without opportunity and growing inequality. and those of us as politicians have the task of trying to come up with policies to address issues, but his holiness has the capacity to open people's eyes and make sure they're seeing that this is an issue. >> that idea opened people's eyes, that struck me because i'm not someone who believes that we should try to legislate or regulate from one religious text. and a lot of folks who believe in religion, believe in god feel that way. that it can inspire and motivate, but it doesn't answer exactly what kind of government we want. that idea that the president is speaking to, if you could elaborate on that, do you think this pope is opening eyes to this challenge, not only of poverty, which goes all the way

back to scripture, but of widening inequality, as krystal was mentioning, a specific policy dilemma of our time. >> yeah, because the pope is speaking in words and in deeds. he's not only speaking about catholic social teaching and the gospel, but he's also meeting people and going and actually touching the poor. he said we can't just sort of give them a handout, we have to kind of become their friends. so it's a new way of helping to open people's eyes. and frankly, however you open people's eyes to income inequality and the poor is fine by me. >> this way that he's humanizing the poor and humanizing folks who were incarcerated just confirms once again that he's a moral leader and anybody who's the pope is going to be a moral leader. but on marriage equality rights, still somewhat you might say traditional. we might say regressive. i think about the sensitivity to the needs of the poor and the needs of folks who are incarcerated and other folks, and yet can't quite find the way to sensitivity to folks who want

to create a family that is slightly different than we have seen historically. >> well, although i would say that you're right, this that probably is not going to change, i would say that this pope more than any other pope in his tone and in his stance to gays and lesbians by saying who am i to judge, and even using the word "gay" has been much warmer. i know so many gay and lesbian catholics who now feel welcome in the church. so to that i say something has changed. they sense this tone and warmth and gentleness that is bringing them back, so i'm all for that. >> pope john-paul ii was such a consequential figure of the 21st century. his spiritual inspiration that helped tear down the iron curtain in communism in europe. his message of peace i think was felt around the entire world, even of people of different faith. when they began to write pope francis's legacy, will he be written about in that same light? will he have the same impact? >> i'm not sure politically -- we'll have to see.

but i think spiritually in terms of his focus on mercy and love and compassion. he said in an interview that he thought the church was actually too focused on issues like abortion, contraception and same-sex marriage. he's trying to remind people that the church's positions are much broader. love, mercy, compassion. i think catholics around the world are responding to that. >> father james martin, it's always great to have you. i hope your mother's watching us. >> i think she is. up next, one step forward and two steps back in the search for flight 370. there are new clues and new setbacks to tell you about this afternoon and we will get into all of that as "the cycle" rolls on for thursday, march 27th. latte or au lait?

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the hunt for flight 370s ha become something today that has become more of a surface search. for the second time in this 20-day ordeal, terrible weather conditions have grounded all search flights. they won't get back in the air until friday night our time. just look at what they are up against. severe icing, high turbulence and often near zero visibility. but the six ships in the area are still trying to track down the debris field, fighting the massive waves. they are now working off two sets of satellite images that each show hundreds of pieces of possible flight wreckage floating about 1,600 miles off the australian coast. remember, not a single piece of debris has been recovered since this flight went down. tom costello is back with us. he's been our go-to guy on this story for the past three weeks. tom, what can you tell us today? >> this is really frustrating. here's what the thais now have

given the searchers. thailand's space agency or satellite agency spotted this. if you looked at it with the naked eye, you'd think they're really shooting into a night sky and we're seeing nothing but stars. but they believe that they've now identified these white dots, which should be as many as 300 different pieces of debris, and they are in an area that is condensed enough to make them believe it could be a debris field. where is this area? that's another thing that's interesting here. we are talking about 125 miles or so from where these images were taken by that french satellite. remember that that was on sunday. then it took a day or two to actually process. and again, white images here, and varied sizes. varying sizes of debris. the other interesting point here is what we're talking about on the latitude and the longitude. 90 east by 44 west. that is the area known as the roaring '40s.

why do they call it that? because of where we are in terms of the southern hemisphere, and we get a tremendous amount of activity, ocean activity, very teixeira le turbulent. these are the areas that we're talking about. 1,600 miles or so from perth, australia. and this cluster now. this is what was identified by the french satellite and the thinking is because these other items now identified by the thais are close enough, within 125 miles or so, we may be looking at a drift effect, and so maybe we're looking at the same debris field or has the debris field scattered, we just don't know. but that's what they're up against. you mentioned the weather. look at the satellite image. this is a static image. it's not moving. but we talked about the rolling 40s, right? that's this area in here. just tremendous volatile activity in the ocean. and the icing conditions with that storm today and the rain, and very, very difficult visibility. you know, when you're talking about these air crews trying to

get down to get a close look at where that debris might be, they're getting down to 300 feet. at 300 feet, imagine trying to identify anything in the ocean. you're still pretty high up, right? you're 300 feet above the ocean and you've got rolling waves, white caps, and you've got ten to 20, 30-foot waves and now you've got this whole system here, which is just a phenomenal amount of weather moving into this area. so they suspended the search today before the air crews even got out to the search zone. they turned them around. they may not even fly tomorrow, friday, because of the weather. they may get a window on saturday, and then sunday, they get more of this stuff. and this is what they're up against. because we're now on, as you mentioned, day 20. that means you've only got about ten days or so of the battery life on the underwater pingers. it's important they try to locate the pinging or hear the pinging, because once that battery is dead, the chances of finding debris in the ocean is really going to be very, very slim. the chances will be slim because

they don't have anything to listen for, and this whole thing becomes an even greater haystack, trying to find just the tiniest needle. guys, back the you. >> thanks, tom costello. thank you very much. matthew robinson was an aircraft accident investigator for the u.s. navy and marine corps. he now works with robsen forensic. you heard the breakdown from tom. when you look at these clusters of potential debris, and these searches have been frustrated with folks doing the work and folks around the world trying to understand it. what do you see as an investigator at this point with that debris? >> first and foremost, my main rule is to put no one else in harm's way, accept no unnecessary risk. so if the weather conditions preclude a safe search, then call it off, postpone it, and live to go out another day. now, if, in fact, this debris field is positively identified as the wreckage and the bebree from mh-370, thisdebris

from mh-370, this is indicative of a high energy impact. something not commensurate with a deliberate ditching at sea, but more of an unsurvivable crash at this point. it just merits further investigation. it's a worthwhile lead and it needs to be pursued. >> matt, you've worked with night vision glasses, you've worked in meteorology. there is a horrible lack of visibility. talk about what it's like for the people on those six ships who are attempting to locate debris in the dark in the situation where you have bad weather clouding the whole thing. >> one of the utmost challenges. the searches and salvages that i've been on in the gulf of mexico area, here they have very many more challenges. it's hard to spot this debris floating on the surface because it lays flat. you need to be almost on top of

it to really be able to positively identify it. add in bad sea state, winds, poor visibility, clouds, fog, rain. they're up against a heck of a lot of challenges here. >> matt, let's talk about the united states' role in this. the pentagon today updated the u.s. search efforts. take a listen. >> people are contributing to the degree that they can, for as long as they can. the p-3 will be returning to cadena air baas there in japan, and we will augment the search with a second p8 aircraft. there's no plans to send american warships to the search area. right now, we believe, and just importantly the malaysian government believes that the most important asset that we have that we can help them with are these long-range maritime patrol aircraft. >> so the pentagon has set aside $4 million for the search

through april. three americans were onboard. at what point does the u.s. military start scaling back? >> that decision is going to be left up to the president, the secretary of the navy, the secretary of defense and the chief of naval operations will obviously assist as needed. but with other operational necessities looming, they're going to need to pull away from that and divert those assets to other areas. so it just depends. >> and matthew, because of what we've learned about the turns that the plane took during the flight, and the potential turning off or at least failing of the transponders, there's been speculation that the plane was taken off course intentionally, which, of course, caused folks to look at the captain and the co-captain in terms of potential explanations for what went wrong on this. and we know the fbi is doing a forensic analysis of the hard drives of both pilots. that should be complete later today or tomorrow. but the youngest son of the captain of the plane did break

his family's silence to malaysian newspapers saying, "i've read everything online, but i've ignored all the speculation. i know my father better. we may not be as close as he travels so much, but i understand him." how much focus would you be putting on the pilot and co-pilot here? >> well, there's a lot of truth in those roads. to develop a theory without any substantial evidence is irresponsible. and you mentioned a good point there, and there's been a lot of speculation that the transponder and the acars were turned off. there's nothing to substantiate that. it just stopped transmitting. now, is it worthy of further investigation? sure. but there needs to be more in-depth investigation on that, and we'll see how it goes. i always like to examine the human factors aspect of these crashes, and if they correlate

to any material factors as well. there's usually a combination thereof. so both merit more investigation, but there isn't enough evidence at this point. >> even as the search continues, the nature of the information coming out has changed a little bit. the malaysian government is discontinuing those daily press briefings it was conducting. as a practical matter, when there's less coming out from the governments about the search, there is less official news. beyond that fact, should we read anything else into that change? >> don't read anything else into that change. the worst thing that one could do as an investigative body is to release misinformation. it degrades the integrity of the investigation and the whole body as a whole. so, if there's no news, then they need to substantiate anything that they're going to release. they just don't have anything at this point. >> good note of caution there. appreciate your time. matthew robinson, thank you very much. up next, we've got something big. it's march madness. something we've been talking

about a lot. but we also have unionizing in college athletics. josh bayer from "the new york times" joins us. if i can impart one lesson to a new business owner, it would be one thing i've learned is my philosophy is real simple american express open forum is an on-line community, that helps our members connect and share ideas to make smart business decisions. if you mess up, fess up. be your partners best partner. we built it for our members, but it's open for everyone. there's not one way to do something. no details too small. american express open forum. this is what membership is.

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"the cycle" leads off with the heartbreaking search in the aftermath of the deadly mudslide north of seattle. the conditions so bad that they still haven't been able to actually retrieve eight bodies spotted in the debris field. another 90 people are still missing. experts say there were red flags years before last weekend's disaster. meanwhile, ukraine is getting some help from the international monetary fund. the imf has floated them a $27 billion lifeline to help offset the cost of military action to save crimea. a $1 billion aid package passed through both chambers this afternoon. the crisis has triggered the deepest east-west conflict since the cold war and has further hurt the slumping ukraine economy.

an internal investigation has determined chris christie was not involved with the george washington lane closures, believed to be political retribution. it places the blame squarely on the head of the then port authority and top christie aid chris christie. this probe was conducted by a law firm hired by christie. the state is conducting its own investigation and we will pore through it all with the man for jersey politics, our "cycle" friend steve kornacki tomorrow on this show. march madness resumes tonight with half of the sweet 16 teams hitting the hardwood. three of the four number one seeds remain, despite number of huge upsets since the field was 64 teams just a week ago. tonight's match-ups include number ten stanford against this tournament's cinderella team dayton. and from the new cycle to the spin cycle, and a decision that could rock the foundation of college sports, northwestern football players have now the right to form a union. that was the decision announced wednesday by the national labor

relations board chicago district. regional direct peter orr cited a number of factors. players scholarships, which he called a contract for hire in return for compensation. the players have said their main concerns are better health care and limited practice hours. and that has had nothing to do with the millions of dollars the school rakes in from football. in a statement, northwestern said it was disappointed with the ruling and failed to appeal to the full nlrb in washington, a process that could take months. currently the decision only affects private institutions, so players at a private school like the university of miami can also look to unionize. while the university of florida, a state-run school, would have to fight its own battle. make no mistake, a lot of this is about money and the potential for organized players to bargain for pay. during the 2011 and 2012 season, the top ten grossing programs of which northwestern is not one

brought in a combined $750 million. joining us for the spin is friend of the show josh barro. josh, great having you here. >> thank you, good to be here. >> i think we've gotten to the point where the ncaa is making so much off of these athletes, that something has got to change here, right? any rational person looking at the situation, it's hard to say look at how much money is being taken from the athletic departments and really nothing is going to these athletes. that totally makes sense. but part of the decision, they said, was the number of hours that these football players put towards football. 50 to 60 hours a week, that their lives on scholarship are pretty much controlled by football. and that to me could lead to a slippery slope, because you could say any sport team, whether that's swimming, i'm sure krystal can attest to that as a college swimmer, or any sport, saying our lives are devoted to this. it's a lot of hours, a lot of work. josh, ultimately this is about the money. why not just say this is about

the money? because that's what schools are most concerned about, that these players will then ask to be paid. >> yeah. what the nlrb is saying is something that i think is fairly obvious, which is playing in a division i football or basketball program is a job. it produces something of tremendous economic value to the school and it's something that you have to work on like it's a full-time job, and in many cases, it's really inconsistent with being a full-time student carrying a full course load at one of these schools. we have the scandal at the same time at the university of north carolina about how they have these more or less fake classes. one student handed in a one-paragraph essay about rosa parks that was -- >> terrible. >> it was factually incorrect in addition to having very little in it. >> a-minus for that paper. >> it got an a-minus. >> that happened in my college, too. >> i'm sympathetic to the athlete who has a full-time job being a college athlete and is being asked to pretend being a student on top of that. so i think the outcome should be basically these students who are doing something that is so time consuming and producing a lot of economic value should be paid

for their labor. a lot of college athletics aren't fundamentally like this. they really are a recreational activity. they can be one that is very consuming for students, but they're not a quasi professional activity that has a tv contract and that is intended to lead toward a professional occupation. >> or making money for the school. >> aside from the money part, and i'm sure basketball will eventually follow if we get this trend of unionization which seems to be happening. but part of the thing that separates football from all other activities is the life-threatening nature of football. i'm not talking about that you could die at any moment, but you could. we've been talking all last year, the last two years about concussions in football. and just the impact of having concussions, knocking your head over and over and over. play after play. and a lot of that damage shows up after your career is over. they don't have health care after their career, after their college career is over. so you think about the impact of concussions. you think about that they are not really able to get an

education, if you're at a d-i show. you really don't have an opportunity to go to the nfl. what they should have is a chance to have a negotiator at the table when they are dealing with determining the details of their life. and that's what unionization would give them. >> yeah. and so, in a way, yes, it is about the money, particularly when you're talk about football players or basketball players. but i think for the players, at least what they've said that they're interested in, which is more control over their lives and better health care, it isn't actually about the money. it is about having that seat at the table. and what's laid out in the ruling in great detail is the level of control that the sport and the coach has over these players' lives. which was something that i -- obviously i wasn't a football player, but as a former varsity swimmer at clemson related to very much. i mean, even on the swim team -- >> look at that. >> it was detailed -- they controlled your lives to the point of where you lived, what you did. obviously the practices, the classes that you took, all of that, down to the detail of what

kind of binder you were going to keep your notes in. i am not kidding. and they would check your notebook to make sure it was in the proper compliant format. so i personally don't have a problem with the idea that even if it's not a revenue generating sport, that these athletes who are giving so much of their time and whose lives are so greatly controlled, that they are basically employees and deserve to have some sort of say in what's going on in their lives. >> yeah, when you say they should have a say, that's all this case, this ruling does, is say that the ncaa can no longer benefit from this exception that it had. so the ncaa will now rise to level of walmart, a place where you might be able to organize and you may or may not succeed in collectively organizing. and that is an important legal point here that i think is interesting and that i think is right, which is the burden of proof is on the employer that is seeking to say that its employees don't qualify as employees. and so if you run a small business and you say i'm going to hire you, you're going to

work say 50 hours a week, you'll get benefits for it of some kind, but i'm going to call you a research fellow and you shouldn't be counted as an employee and have those rights, you have to defend that in court. the points that i think are really interesting here is you've got these folks here who are being told now, now you have the chance to organize. whether they will and whether they all will and what happens at the school, does that mean the same thing for football as it does for badminton, maybe not. but it at least lets them in the door. >> the situation is worse than that. it's not just that the ncaa has its exception because it's treating these people as non-employees. it's basically like a cartel. like if walmart agreed that they were going to fix the wage they were going to pay their employees. in the ncaa's case at zero. and somehow the ncaa has done this convinced many people that not only does it not need to pay its employees, it would actually be morally wrong to pay its employees. so i think unionization is

likely to further these workers' interests. but if you didn't allow all the schools to get together and fix the wage at zero, they would have more market power. >> still dealing with that myth of the amateur college athlete, right? honorable and doing it for the love of the sport and not a professional yet. >> it doesn't mean that they shouldn't have some say in what's going in their lives. >> that's exactly the debate that's going to continue on. the ncaa is fighting this, so it will be very interesting to see where this goes from here. josh, thank you as always for joining us. up next, how is this for parenting advice? let your kids play with fire. bounce on filthy trampolines and build stuff with saws and hammers instead of lincoln logs. what america may be getting all wrong about raising the next generation, up next. [ male announcer ] it's simple physics...

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the land is an adventure playground where kids play in a world with kids that could hurt or scare them. would you let your kid play there? i would. many parents keep their kids so close that they never experience risk or fear. what's wrong with that? isn't protecting kids part of responsible parenting? let's ask hannah rose, her newest piece is now on the cover of the atlantic magazine. you have been doing extraordinary work the last few years, so congratulations on all of that. let's dig into what is wrong with overprotecting your kid.

>> i think when you become preoccupied with safety and you don't let them take risks or learn independence, they effectively never grow up. they never learn what to do when they feel bad or when they're faced with a dangerous situation. it's just a part of growing up that we're interfering with. >> part of what you say in the article is that when i was young, when a lot of people who are parents now were young, e n etan patz was taken away on the first day he was allowed to walk to school. as you report, child abductions are extraordinarily rare. they were then, they are now. but that became lodged in a lot of people's minds, and led to a lot of people saying i have to overprotect my kid. but according to your reporting, the wave of overprotection does not lead to fewer injuries or fewer deaths. >> exactly. i mean, each child abduction

just sticks in our minds. we just can't get it out of their heads so. in the '70s, '80s, '90s, we went through a period of stranger danger, like if i leave my kid in the street, someone's going to abduct them or steal them. and it's not any more common now than in 1970s. it's just infected our brains. we're being swept along on a tide of protect, protect, protect. rather than -- not letting kids free like we did in the '70s, but maybe just thinking of parenting as creating opportunities for your child to discover themselves and to explore and to do other things, rather than just be protected. >> and hannah, how much of the shift has to do with the fact that millennials are having fewer and fewer children? i come from a family of seven kids, and as i've said on the show before, i ran away a number of times. my mom didn't have the ability to watch where all of us were at all times of the day, so we had to be adventurous. we had to get into trouble. she couldn't protect us. and my husband is one of two, and a very different upbringing

where she was able to focus on their every move. how much of that is the fact that we're having fewer children? >> it's true, when you look at people who study childhood in the '70s and '80s, it was about packs. it wasn't just kids of one age. there would be kids of all ages roaming around and building forts and going to the woods and building tree houses. that's what i remember from my childhood. you play across ages. but now we kind of privatize childhood. it all happens in the house, or your parents will drive you to a soccer game rather than just going to the ball field and playing soccer, which is what people used to do. >> that's very much how i relate to my childhood. i grew up in a very rural area. i remember being in the woods, finding trails by myself at a very young age, riding my bike around the neighborhood, just myself at a very young age and playing with other kids unsupervised. but now that i'm raising my kids in the city, i can imagine creating risks for them in a rural environment that would be sort of appropriate risks. but i'm having trouble figuring out how to translate that into an urban environment, where the

stakes are high. if she steps on to the street and there's a car there, that's the end. >> traffic is the one real danger, but we exacerbate the traffic problem because nobody walks to school. in the '70s, 80% of third graders walked to school by themselves in. the cities, rural areas, you would just walk out the door and walk to school. now you condition even imagine a third grader walking to school by his or herself. we don't really examine why. >> is it as simple as giving them more space at the playground since you're not going to let them go out into the streets? >> it's funny, these adventure playgrounds were actually designed for urban kids. they're in london because regular urban playgrounds seemed to boring, they came around to give urban kids a cooler place to play and a sense of adventure

and a sense of being able to create and manipulate their own environment. >> what would you say to those parents who are listening who would say hey, crazy lady, i want to make sure that my kids get to 18 and i can drop them off at college. i don't want my kids getting hurt before then, with your attack on overprotectiveness. what would you say to them? >> how about this? you will give your child a better chance in life, more character, better able to take care of themselves and do great things if you let them grow up a little bit and get out of the way. >> that's good enough, i think. >> hannah rosen, very interesting. i am looking forward to your next essay. thank you so much for that. speaking of letting people go on adventures, this spring, a california daredevil will attempt his most death defying feat yet, jumping off of mount everest. is he crazy? or is he ultrasane? we're going to ask him when he swoops into "the cycle" studio

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when he gets there, he is going to jump off in front of a worldwide audience on live tv. no pressure or anything. he already holds the record for being the youngest to make it to everett's summit, and he holds the record for the fastest time, in nine hours. takes most people three or four days, if they even make it at all. now he's going to be the first to attempt a wing flight off the summit and you'll see it all live in a television event called "everest jump live" hosted by nbc's own willie geist. for now, he is safe on the ground, or at least as safe as he can be with us. we thank you so much for being with us. >> thanks for having me. >> my first question to you is very simple. are you normal? like, have you always been interested in sort of death defying odds and throwing yourself off of things, or is this something that developed for you? >> i think since i was a kid i was jumping off stuff.

ever since i was a little kid, i wanted to fly. living with this miracle of technology now that i'm able to have a suit that will allow me to fly. it's pretty cool. >> i mean, this really goes against all evolutionary programming. i am frightened by the idea of jumping out of a plane and i imagine a lot of people are. i imagine you're frightened before you jump out of a plane. how do you find the courage to do it? >> i'm actually -- it's strange, but i'm actually afraid of heights. it's about concentrating on the task at hand. i like that. >> but you're an adrenaline junkie, so you live for that.

you're going to go a little bit lower. what is the feeling? describe for them the feeling you get when you're in that wing suit just swooshing down. >> it's a lot like you would think it is. you are fully in control. flying just like you're superman. it's an amazing feeling. >> you look like superman, too. >> yeah, you can see it. i sbgot a special superman suit. for everest, i'll have one that you can see it's designed a little bit different than you would expect in a wing suit. it's actually called a tracking suit. it's a really high performance suit and it will go really, really fast. i expect to reach speeds over 150 miles an hour on this jump on everest. >> he wants to know how you feel in the air. i want to know how you feel before you -- right before you go. i mean, i would be filled with nothing but sheer terror. have you done things like this enough that you are sort of in control of your emotions, or do you still have that fear of

heights, that nervousness before you go? >> well, there's always a nervousness and you're kind of checking all your equipment, making sure everything is really the right -- and set up the right way. but once i step up to the cliff disappears. i think that's the best part of jumping is you forget about everything else and you're just focused on what you're doing. >> how do you outdo this? once you accomplish this, amazing adventure, is there something after? or are you going to say i'm done, this was my goal, i can't do this again? i've conquered my fear? >> well, i used to say that but now i've come up with all new ideas. i've got a great home and great team and family at discovery channel. for sure i'll continue to develop programs and maybe do more live stuff or series. we have a lot of cool ideas. but i'm going to come back and keep my feet on the ground a little bit. i've got a book coming out, a lecture tour, things that are a little more realistic. >> when you're in the air, it sort of slows down enough that you're able to see the world and

see your experience and -- i remember when i went skydiving you can't -- it's moving so fast that you can't really comprehend the world but if you do it a lot it slows down for you, right? >> it does slow down. you get a little jayed to it, know the equipment works, you trust your training and you know you're able to do things but it never really fully goes away. i mean jumping off a mountain it's exciting but it gets a little less scary and you're able to take the experience in a little better. >> i know the wing functions like a parachute, but if you get a hole, if something doesn't work out that one in a million chance, is there an emergency parachute? >> it is. it's not like the skydiving parachu parachute. it's a much larger, bigger parachute meant to come out fast and slow you down and allow you to find a good place to land. >> as we're watching this live, what is the part that you will be sort of thinking the most about and the most nervous about? i mean, what aspect of this is the trickiest so to speak? >> other than your life. >> well, you know, doing it is

one thing, but making a live tv show out of it is another thing. it definitely adds layers of complexity. >> i would just worry about doing it. >> that's thing. i'm going to be focused on the task at hand. i'm used to having cameras in my face all the time when i do this stuff anyway so it really won't make any difference having those guys there but it would be cool to share wit the world. >> can we have you back after you make this jump? >> absolutely. i'd love to. >> i want to go back, how did you get up that thing in nine hours? what were you, running? >> well, almost. the key is not stopping. most people stop and they camp out, they carry a bunch of equipment. i found that i didn't really like carrying all that stuff up there so i just changed the program, made my fitness even higher and made it where i could go all the way to the top and back down in one gun. >> any tips for someone trying to conquer a fear of highs or another fear? >> i think it's important to note that if a guy from louisiana like me can climb the

tallest mountains in the world from one of the flattest places in the world, i hope the show inspires people to do whatever it is they feel like doing. >> you've fired us up. thank you very much. >> thank you. >> we'll be watching the discovery special in may. up next, abby takes to the trenches to defend herself and to defend her prescription for the country. way to get your fiber. try phillips fiber good gummies. they're delicious, and a good source of fiber to help support regularity. wife: mmmm husband: these are good! marge: the tasty side of fiber. from phillips. humans -- we are beautifully imperfect creatures, living in an imperfect world. that's why liberty mutual insurance has your back, offering exclusive products like optional better car replacement, where, if your car is totaled, we give you the money to buy one a model year newer. call...

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two weeks i talked about the need for entitlement reform. there was a firestorm of reaction. an article in the "l.a. times" went as far as to say i want to lead my generation into poverty.

come on, man. this isn't about me. it's about the major problem. here's the deal, say whatever you want, but unless we're willing to address this, we're in financial quicksand. here are the numbers in the coming fiscal year. the government will lay out a $3.8 trillion, about 70% of that for mandatory spending programs, mainly social security, medicare, medicaid, and interest on the federal debt. this basic math. the congressional budget office predicts each year over the next 25 years our government programs will wind up costing more than we take in. and they also project our debt to gdp ratio will only continue to grow steadily over the next two decades, reaching places we haven't seen since world war ii. we are fighting to survive only this time financially. social security spend willing grow from about 5% to 6% as a percentage of gdp. it's even worse for health programs like medicare and

medicaid, which almost doubled from 4.6% to 8%. over the next 25 years these programs will grow from about 7% of the economy to more than 14%. so i ask -- how are we going to pay for that? but for some people even raising the question means you're automatically anti-social security or against the elderly. that rhetoric might work for campaigning or special interest groups but it doesn't do much for the people who count on these programs. the "l.a. times" article that took me on raised a worthwhile distinction, though, about raising the age of retirees. the change in life expectancies from age 65 is much lower. but the idea that basically doing nothing about the budget shortfalls and having deficits forever will somehow be okay is not right to my way of accounting. when i talk of reform it could include means testing or slowly increasing the retirement age

for people for decades from when they'll receive benefits. others might support raising the income cap on the payroll tax. liberals may like that more but it's also a budgetary reform. on medicare, i think the simpson/bowles plan is a great place to start, slowly raising the medicare eligibility age from 65 to 67 by the mid-2030s and expanding means tested medicare premiums. let's debate those options. and by the way i'm not the only one who thinks we need to debate this. >> we're going to have to reform entitlements to keep them solvent for future generations. >> you're okay with raising the medicare ability age? >> with proper carveouts for people with health challenges, absolutely. our goal should be to explore any option to fund and maintain entitlements while also being

proactive about our long-term debt realities. say what you want, our financial lives depend on that. okay. that does it for "the cycle." "now" with wag wag starts right now. the chris christie commission on chris christie's role in bridgegate is out and you will never guess what it found. it is thursday, march 27th. this is "now." >> we just heard the findings from the report. >> clears him and the scandal. >> chris christie had no knowledge before hand of this george washington bridge realignment. >> this is chris christie's lawyer essentially. >> he played no role whatsoever. this is somebody chosen by christie. >> hired by the governor himself. >> represents the governor's office. >> paid for with state funds. >> i