we can democracyize our country again. >> tara dowdel, thank you. that is "all in" for this evening. the rachel maddow show the starts right now. thanks to you at home for joining us this hour. on the fourth of july in 1995, a county commissioner in nigh county, nevada, which is here in southern nevada, nye county, a county commissioner in nye county decided to celebrate independence day by declaring that nye county, nevada, was independent of the united states of america. he got into a bulldozer and he drove that bulldozer over to some federally owned land in nye county, it was part of a national forest, and he used the bulldozer to bust through that closed road in that national forest. he claimed that all federal land was under his control, because the federal government had no authority in little nye county, nevada. >> nbc news in depth tonight.

more on the fight over the role in the federal west, it's an all-out brawl called the sage brush rebellion. on one side, the federal government. on the other, some land owners and some local governments and the battle is threatening to turn very ugly. nbc's roger o'neil tonight has the first part of our in-depth report. >> reporter: in the land of wide open spaces, there's a new land war. the federal government owns almost half the property in the west, and the fight is over who should control it. the first shot was fired in nevada, captured on home video, dick carver, a county supervisor, reopened a road in the national forest. two federal rangers said they were threatened. it was the fourth of july, and it became a declaration of independence for a new rebellion. this time, from the feds. >> on the one hand, it is sort of funny, right? this little county in nevada, this one county commissioner, bulldozing his way across the

national forest, saying, this land is mine. this is ours! the u.s. government doesn't exist here. on the one hand, it's funny, except for the fact that this was happening in the context of bombs that kept going off in federal government offices, all over that part of the country. now, that bulldozing was july 4th. it was independence day in 1995. in march of 1995, a u.s. forest service employee named guy pence had had a pipe bomb set off in his office at the u.s. forest service. five months later, another pipe bomb blew up in a van that was parked outside his house. his wife and his daughter were home at the time, but thankfully they were not injured. on january 6th, 1996, the following year, a bomb exploded just outside the u.s. forest service headquarters, in espanol, in new mexico, and that was the second time in less than a year that a forest service headquarters had been bombed. it also happened in march, 1995, in carson city, nevada. >> a bomb went office in a u.s. forest service office in carson

city, nevada, blowing out windows, but there was no major damage, no injuries. no claim of responsibility either. >> beyond those forest service bombings at around the same time, two bureau of land management offices were also bombed. that was also happening 1994, 1995, 1996. of course, if you think about it, in the middle of all of that was the anti-federal government bombing that took place 19 years ago this week, in april 1995, in oklahoma city. the bombing of the alfred p. murrah federal office building in oklahoma city. that building included regional offices for the atf, offices for the secret service and the dea and the social security administration. the oklahoma city bomber and his accomplice were both part of something called the sovereign citizen movement, which doesn't recognize the authority of the federal government. part of the reason that timothy mcveigh was found and arrested after the oklahoma bombing was that his car didn't have proper license plates.

that's one of the things that is a hallmark of the sovereign citizen movement. they refuse to register their cars under property authority. those guys from the oklahoma city bombing were also part of the armed militia movement at the time. county officials saying they didn't -- the militia movement, excuse me, saying that they only recognized county official, they did not recognize the authority of the united states of america. we also had county officials bulldozing their way down federal roads at the time. the ongoing bombings of federal offices that not only preceded oklahoma city, but kept happening after oklahoma city, you look back, what's remark able the politics of that time, and what is suddenly newly relevant in today's news, is that at the time, there were these relatively mainstream figure tons right, mainstream figures, members of congress, who basically said they went to washington, they went to congress to represent these radical splinter groups that said they didn't believe in the existence of the united states of america. >> to better understand the sage brush rebellion, you need to know who's on their side.

surprising answers tonight in part ii of in-depth from nbc's lisa myers. >> i'm helen chen wich. >> reporter: in many ways withes, representative helen chenowich is the representative of the sage brush rebellion. she wants states to take back control of land from the federal government and to weaken environmental regulations and protection of endangerened species. >> spotted owls are supposed to have 4,000 acres per nesting pairs of spotted owls. i mean, i don't even know how they find each other in 4,000 acres, but that's besides the point. >> reporter: if she stopped there, chenoweth would merely be a conservative with a western flair. what distinguishes her and some of her freshman colleagues is their firm believe that the federal government has crossed the line. that instead of protecting individuals, it routine lay tyrannizes them.

do you believe that federal employees on balance are agents of tyranny? >> no, i believe the nature of government can be tyrannical and has become tyrannical. >> reporter: critics accuse her of stirring up fear and pandering to extremists. >> she appeals the to the very far right in idaho and i think in this country. >> what really put chenoweth on the national map, for better or for worse, was her refusal to criticize the militia movement in the wake of the oklahoma bombing. she still refuses. >> my responsibility as a congressman is to represent every one equally. whether i feel entirely comfortable with them, whether they're my best friends or not. >> reporter: whether she's a pioneer for the west or a standard-bearer for extremists, chenoweth is comfortable in the forefront of what she calls a real rebellion against the federal government. lisa myers, nbc news, the capitol. >> helen chenoweth is long gone. she left congress in 2000, after confessing to an adulterous

affair she had had, even though she said bill clinton should resign over his adulterous affair. helen chenoweth then sadly died in a car accident in 2006. but the politics that made her famous are either back now or they never went away in the first place. only this time around, they don't just have a few random members of congress that nbc has to go out to the capitol and dig out of the far-right fringe of the republican party. this time, for those politics, they've got the prime-time stars of a big cable news network called the fox news channel, which has been very busy for several days now, more than a week now, trying to turn this particular guy into a household name. >> this is what we, the people, are asking this morning. dis -- disarm the park service. and lately, red rock park and

all other parks that the federal government claims to have jurisdiction over. >> yeah! >> woo! >> yeah! >> take your county bulldozers and tear down that -- entrance places. get the county equipment out there and tear those things down this morning. >> yes, sir! >> yeah! >> whoo! >> yeah! do your job, sheriff! >> do your job! >> do your job, sheriff! do your job, sheriff! that's what you were elected for! >> you disarm those park service people. we want those arms delivered right here under these flags in one hour! and media -- >> media -- are you here, media? i want you to go to every place

that they got a federal park service station, and you watch those county machines tear down those places today in the next hour. and if you report back to these people, we the people, in one hour, if they're not done, we'll decide what we're going to do from this point on. thank you! >> yeah! >> whoo! >> one hour, you have one hour to send the county machines out to tear down the entrance places at the federal land and disarm the federal agents. one hour! media, you document it! this is one of these guys in nevada who has not recognized the existence of the united states of america. and these guys have been around for a long time, right? in 1995, one nevada county official did go and bulldoze a federal road in a national forest in order to prove that the u.s. government didn't really exist in nevada.

but, now, these same guys are back and they're demanding that the local sheriff go do that again, within the hour! that the local sheriff go take county machines and disarm federal officials and arrest any federal officials, officials from the federal government, that have trespassed in nevada, which though these guys is not part of the united states. and if you are flashing back to the mid-'90s and looking at this stuff, it's not just because of the demanding the bulldozer, right? it's not just because of the bulldozer references, it may also be because when you heard that sheriff there being yelled at by that local rancher, that he needed to go bulldoze federal properties and he needed to go disarm federal agents, you see those guys standing in front of them, standing in front of the stage there, facing away from them, right, while he's making these claims. these sort of fake military guys standing in front of the stage, standing in front of the guy who does not recognize the existence of the united states, they are 1990s-style militia men. you can see in this photo from nbc news, the guy on the left there has what i presume to be unregulation facial hair.

the self-proclaimed rank of captain. he's wearing captain's bars on his fatigues there. i say it's self-proclaimed there, because his patch on his uniform is not from any u.s. military operation. it says, pretorian guard. which is the name the arizona state publish has given themselves. they say on their website, they are recruiting patriots statewide. they want you to know that china has upped its military spending recently. and they've posted a very sleepy-looking picture of antonin scalia and said underneath that picture, the news that there's internment camps coming back. the militia guys from arizona and from all over, you probably heard, they've descended on nevada, this past week, and over this past weekend, to turn a long-standing, but kind of boring dispute over grazing fees, between the federal government and one of these guys who doesn't believe in the federal government, these militia guys descended on that cite in nevada over the last few days to turn that sort of boring, bureaucratic conflict,

into something that is a little bit more like a war. >> reporter: on a bridge in bunkerville, holding high-powered scoped rifles, these men took cover, prepared to shoot, prepared to die. >> here to protect our freedom. had to happen some time. might as well happen now, right? >> reporter: this saturday, he took position with other gunmen, taking the high ground, as federal agents waited in the wash below. between them, men, women, and their children marched towards a fence. >> get ready. >> on the other side of the fence, bureau of land management agents, also armed, also took cover. >> this is reporting from the local cbs affiliate, klas from over the weekend. obviously, they are covering the drama here of this armed standoff, not very far outside the major city of las vegas, but they're also noting how freaking weird it is to have a political dispute resolved in this country, in the 21st century, based pretty much on which side brought more guns to the

political argument. watch. >> reporter: on the streets of las vegas, when gunmen point weapons at sworn peace officers, they're often shot and killed. but in bunkerville, these men held the bridge. the difference between these gunmen and gunmen in our urban streets comes down to a political cause. >> at some point, you have to draw a line in the sand, and, i guess, this is it, you know? >> reporter: we didn't get this man's name. our photographer was fearful of possible cross fire should shooting happened and kept moving. but this gunmen and others pledged to be back, because these anti-federalist protesters got their first victory. not by the ballot, not by rallies, but on a bridge with guns aimed at police. >> got their victory, not by the plat, not by rallies, but on a bridge with guns aimed at police. and as that report from klas notes, this domestic dispute in nevada really is basically over now, at least the dramatic part is over. the federal government stopped trying to enforce federal law

about grazing fees. stopped trying to enforce a court order that said they could enforce that federal law. and they backed off, because people showed up with guns. to stop them from enforcing that court order. and while that is a remarkable form of dispute resolution for this country in the 21st century, it's also true that the drama is also kind of over. the guy who says he does not believe in the united states is still refusing to pay the grazing fees that everybody else pays to let his cows eat grass on federal land. and the government says they'll continue to work to resolve the matter administratively and judicially. so the drama here is over. but the drama being over, of course, that is terrible news for the people who have basically been selling tickets to what they hoped was going to be a shooting war, involving anti-government zealots in the american southwest. i mean, the right has been hyping this as a fight almost to the point of hysteria. >> this could be how the shot heard round the world happens in this case or others that are happening.

if they ever fire on innocent, peaceful people, trying to take stolen cattle and act like the mercenaries they are, this could turn into 1776 very quickly. >> yeah, and we are -- we are totally disgusted with this type of government. we're -- i don't think we the people are going to stand it and i'm not going to stand it, and i'm going to stand for it, and i'm going to stand as long as it takes to do whatever it takes -- >> incredible. we'll get updates from you in the next few days to see what unfolds. >> that was the rancher that doesn't believe in the authority of the federal government of the united states, on the radio show of the conspiracy theory guy who's the king of the 9/11 truthers. he's also the one who says the boston bombings was perpetrated by the u.s. government, also the newtown school shooting was perpetrated by the u.s. government. he's also the one who says the u.s. government creates tornadoes and uses them as weather weapons. the koch brothers funded groups, americans for prosperity, the affiliates of americans for

prosperity in nevada and also in colorado online, they've been trying to popularize this fight, with this rancher in nevada. popularizing it to a national audience. #biggovernment, #topconservatives on twitter #bundybattleisheatingupinnevada. they say, if you want to see the case for national government, consider the siege happening in this dusty corner of nevada. remember when there was going to be a trucker blockade of washington, d.c., where hundreds, no, thousands, no, millions, no, billions of truckers were going to slowly circle the nation's capitol on the washington beltway and bring the federal government to its knees unless nancy pelosi was arrested and they had all these other demands. the guy who was the spokesman for that trucker's ride for the constitution this past fall, the guy who said if this trucker uprising didn't work, then there should be an armed uprising against the federal government. the guy who apparently received a little bit of attention from the secret service after saying and then reiterating that

hillary clinton should be shot because benghazi, that guy apparently still has and does a radio show, and on his radio show, he's also hosted the nevada rancher who's in this fight, who's appeared there as well. glen beck's website has been as breathless over the story as anybody else on the right. nevada rancher taking on the government in a battle that's reaching the breaking point. and, of course, there's the mother of them all, our friends at world net daily, you remember the world net daily guys, right? they're the, show us the real birth certificate people. the obama conspiracy world net superstore. world net daily recently blasted out their exclusive news, quote, news, that even though the story appeared to end this weekend, that that standoff in nevada, it appeared to end when the federal government gave in to all the militia guys pointing guns at them and the federal government walked away from the cattle grazing dispute, world net daily says that was just a ploy to lull everybody into submission, and actually, they had sources that said, according to their

sources, and what their sources were hearing from their sources from their sources from their sources, what they were able to, quote, report, was that the federal government was actually about to launch a midnight raid. quote, and there probably would be violence involved, says world net daily. world net daily's source is a guy from this militia movement, which says that only county sheriffs have real authority and the federal government doesn't exist. world net daily source says he's hearing that a federal raid is coming. he tells world net daily, quote, i don't think it would be possible to launch such a raid without violence. i don't think the bundy family would lie down and be taken. now, on the one hand, who cares, right? who cares what world net daily says. these are the people with all the birth certificate conspiracies saying about president obama, they're the ones that say that president obama the not only secretly foreign, he's secretly a muslim and he's secretly gay, and he's secretly gay married, mm-hmm. a few days ago, they published

an alert to america that what might have looked like a lunar eclipse was actually a blood moon divine warning to president obama that he should stop passing so many executive orders. yeah, seriously. but what is cockamamy and hilarious and sometimes even a little sad on the right, it becomes something else when a media institution called the fox news channel decides to promote the worst of this stuff. when they drag this stuff up out of the far right, rather pitiful fringe, and they turn it into a national conservative cause celebre. and that's what the fox news channel has done with this story in nevada. and this is the important thing, i think. it didn't end this weekend when the standoff ended in nevada. i mean, yeah, they pumped this up until this thing happened. fox news and all these other right-wing outlets were building up this nevada rancher who doesn't believe in the federal government. they were building him up all last week, they were hyping this confrontation, they were turning this guy into a huge hero. but when there was this big standoff this weekend and it

ended with lots of guns there, but without anybody getting shot, the fox news channel was palpably disappointed, and since then, they have gone into overdrive, essentially trying to get the armed standoff going again. >> the united states government versus the nevada rancher, cliven bundy, and bundy with the backing of a grassroots swell from freedom fighters and a slew of tv cameras successfully got the feds to back down. >> this is a fox news alert. the federal government has surrendered in the battle against nevada rancher, cliven bundy. but according to senator harry reid, this, in fact, is not the end. >> one of the prime-time hosts on the fox news channel last night, and i kid you not, he led his prime-time show on fox with the world net daily story about how they heard from guys who heard from guys from guys who heard from guys that there is going to be a midnight federal raid on that ranch and it's going to be a violent one! that was their lead story.

to be clear, the only place that story is coming from is world net daily. and the rancher, the i don't believe in the u.s. government rancher, came on as sean hannity's guest on his fox news program, and sean hannity asked this rancher about his claim on the world net daily website about the fact there's going to be a raid on his rancher, and the rancher answered by stating the fact that we had this recent blood moon that was made up by the federal government. i swear this happened. i am not making this up. >> welcome to hannity, and this is a fox news alert. the federal government may have surrendered in the battle against nevada rancher cliven bundy, but according to senator harry reid, this, in fact, is not the end. but, first, according to online reports, a former nevada sheriff claims that his sources inside the federal government say that the bureau of land management may be quietly planning to raid the bundy ranch. so given that warning, could there be another standoff brewing tonight?

back with us is the rancher himself, cliven bundy. we're also joined by his daughter and son. welcome back to the program. there have been a lot of reports about this. what do you make of the sheriff's comments, cliven? >> i had no -- i really know nothing about that, you know? i can say one thing, we had a beautiful moon last night. and i thought, you know, that thing might be fixed up there by the federal government, i'm not sure. but it was different, that's for sure. >> all right. >> what do you think about this conspiracy theory that somebody made up over world net daily? i don't know, but i liked that other conspiracy theory from world net daily, the one about the moon. okay! this is what's happening on fox news channel right now in prime-time, in case you haven't been watching. this actual story in nevada is dead. it's over. at least the threat of armed anti-government zealots having a shooting war with the federal government seems to have cooled down a little bit.

but the fox news channel, in all its glory, is doing everything they can to try to bring that threat back. and on the one hand, it's hilarious and pitiful. on the other hand, it is playing with fire. because what they're talking about here is not the distant past, it is a violent past in our country. and it would be one thing if fox news was trying to gin up armed conflict in ignorance of what this kind of conflict has resulted in in the past in our country, but they're not ignorant about it. >> it's people being killed like at waco, texas, and we don't want any of that to happen. >> for those that don't remember the branch davidian and the waco compound, i mean, that was out of control. or go back to ruby ridge or randy weaver or elian gonzalez, which both of us were covering at the time. this seems to be a moment where we really feed to stand back. >> hey, bob, a lot of memories coming back, waco and ruby ridge, right?

>> i see ruby ridge, waco coming right back, and it would be a tragedy. >> i mean, in all those instances, obviously, the government was wrong in waco. the government was wrong at ruby ridge, except the people in those situations were also pretty goofy. so what the government should do is just back off. >> i'll be honest, we saw what happened at waco and the branch davidians. i'm concerned. we have exclusive details on what some say may become the next ruby ridge or waco davidian compound issue. some say a potential waco or ruby ridge is about to unfold. >> try not to sound so excited when you say that. ruby ridge happened in 1992. white supremacists, white separatist guy who affiliated with the aryan nation, he sold sawed off shotguns to somebody who turned out to be an undercover atf agent. when he failed to appear in court, u.s. marshals serving the warrant for his arrest ended up in a shoot-out. they shot his teenage son, they shot his wife, a federal officer was also killed in the shoot-out. waco was the following year in texas, heavily armed compound of the branch davidian cult, was

the scene of a huge shoot-out and a huge fire, a huge conflagration in which 76 people died, six cult members and four federal agents were also killed in an earlier raid. we did a documentary on timothy mcveigh, the oklahoma city bomber a few years ago on msnbc and we turned up footage of timothy mcveigh on site at the waco siege, there was tim thig mcveigh, looking on. that deadly incident was part of his anti-government radicalization that led him two years after waco to do this in oklahoma city. anti-government extremism in this country, the militia movement, the bombing of federal targets, these fantasies about armed militia, rebellions against the federal government, this is not fiction in our country. this is not even the distant past. these guys are still around. this movement is still very much with us. but even as this latest standoff in nevada appears to have ended peacefully, what is unprecedented this time around

is to have something as big and as loud and as powerful as the fox news channel blowing hot air on the dying embers of that conflict, trying to rekindle it into another jibt fire. 

a lot of memories coming back, waco and ruby ridge, right? >> i see ruby ridge and waco coming right back and it would be a tragedy. >> i mean, in all those instances, obviously, the

government was wrong in waco. the government was wrong at ruby ridge, except the people in those situations were also pretty goofy. so what the government should do is just back off. >> i'll be honest, we saw what happened at waco and the branch davidians. i'm concerned. we have exclusive details on what some say may become the next ruby ridge or waco, davidian compound issue. some say a potential waco or ruby ridge is about to unfold. >> the fox news channel this week has been breathlessly, almost excitedly, trying to reignite an already tense situation in southern nevada. not only hyping the cause of the folks who mounted an armed standoff against federal law enforcement this weekend, but pitching the story over and over and over again as the second coming of the waco and ruby ridge tragedies from the 1990s. joining us now is jim cavanaugh, a retired special agent in charge for the atf. he was a key hostage negotiator during the 1993 standoff with the branch davidian compound in texas. thanks very much for being with us. >> thanks, rachel. >> i thought of you while

watching that fox coverage and realizing they were bringing it back to waco, and specifically to ruby ridge and waco again and again and again. to someone who was there, do you think at any level it's appropriate to compare what is happening right now to what you went through at waco? >> well, i think only in the minds of the radical right, you know, where they can see a violent conflict with government authority and government agents, and then they can turn into a cause celebre to strengthen their movement. you know, this movement is not new. we dealt with them in the '70s, you know, post civil rights era in the south. we dealt with them when they were the posse, we dealt with them when they bled over with the klan. but in the '90s, they became more galvanized right after the ruby ridge event. and that involved a man who failed to report for a court hearing on a gun charge, and the described.

and mistakes, certainly, on both sides, but, you know, failure to report in a nation of laws to address the charge, and that's what we had. but right after that, there was a seminole event, rachel, in estes park, colorado, where the radical right, the real deep movers in the radical right met and had a summit meeting. kind of like the mob had in appalachia, new york, in the '70s, and that became the radical paramilitia movement in the '90s. sto that was a seminole event in the radical movement in america. and of course, then we had waco, which everyone here is talking about, but, just a few facts to clear that up. you know, you had a charismatic cult leader who would take a family into the cult. from then on, he would sleep

with the man's wife, he would sleep with the 12-year-old and 14-year-old female children that the man might have brought in there. he would control their lives completely. he stockpiled machine guns and silencers and hand grenades and made all these things and he named the place ranch apocalypse. and he was destined for, you know, a huge apocalypse. and we found out after all this transpired at waco that before we even went on the initial raid that he had taken his mighty men, six or eight guys that were his, you know, bodyguard or pretorian guard that surrounded him, and they would practice going out, louding in cars around the compound, with all their rifles, and they were going to go to waco and slaughter everyone at mcdonalds. that was before we even went on the raid. so he was reaching, reaching for disaster. when i would talk to him on the phone, he would say, you know, jim, i'm 33 and i'm a carpenter. he wouldn't say he was jesus, but he would say things like this. it's a much different event. so to call that in on a rancher

who's, you know, obstructing the court order in nevada, it's not the same thing. only in the minds of radical extremists who want the confrontation. >> in terms of that -- you called that seminole event that meeting that happened in colorado, am i right, when i hear you saying, that was essentially after ruby ridge, it was sort of, they used that as a galvanizing event to try to bring together disparate strands of the right? >> yes, it was a very, very important event, because for all the years leading up to that, we would bust these conspiracies that were hatched really in the back rooms. i mean, we would have an informant in the clan, when they would plot a bombing. you know, it would be six or seven klansmen, maybe some nazis in there, they would plant a bombing and we would have someone in there wired, we would bust it up. the sedition trial in the late '80s was to try to take out the leadership of all these groups, the klan, the order, you know, they killed the jewish talk show host, alan berg in denver with a machine gun.

and atf and the fbi were always trying to knock those organizations down, so the estes park meeting was their change. and louis bean, the klan leader, tried to push this leaderless resistance. in other words, operate in small cells, by yourself or just you and one other. and in fact, that's what terry nichols and mcveigh did in oklahoma city. they operated as two. >> understanding how these different events serve both as rallying points and as nodes for new types of organizing on the radical right, i think, puts a really fine point on how dangerous it is to celebrate that maybe this is the next thing after ruby ridge and after waco, maybe this is the next organizing moment, to talk about it in those terms just strikes me as incredibly dangerous. jim cavanaugh, thank you for helping us understand this. appreciate it, sir. >> thank you, rachel. >> thank you. we'll be right back.

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on october 28th, 1886, president grover cleveland held a huge celebration in new york. a dedication to the statue of liberty, a gift from france, sitting in the new york harbor. the dedication took place on what is now known as liberty island. the celebrations included a water parade with approximately 300 vessels that passed in front of lady liberty. this engraving from the library of congress depicts the new york harbor and the statue of liberty that day. the fireworks you see didn't actually happen, even though they're in the engraving. they were postponed due to bad weather.

but bad weather or not, new york city did hold the very first ticker tape parade that day in lower manhattan. it was in honor of the new statue, the statue of liberty. and while there were reports of that horrible weather that day, thousands of people did still show up. in the 128 years since that first parade, there have been 203 more ticker tape parades up the canyon of heroes, up the stretch of broadway between battery park and city hall that's called the canyon of heroes. it's hosted parades for everyone from visiting heads of state to american olympic teams to new york pro sports teams who won championships to astronauts to war veterans, frequently to war veterans. and interestingly, as well, at the end of world war ii, in 1945, joirp vendered to the allied forces in may of 1945. japan didn't vender until august, though. still, there were ticker tape parades welcoming home war heroes that day, not only in

september and october and december, but also back in june, even while the war in the pacific was still being fought, they had one of those welcome home parades after germany surrendered, but before japan did. when the korean war ended in 1953, there were five different ticker tape parades in lower manhattan for the return of different troops coming home. 38 years later, there was another parade to make sure that korean war veterans knew they were not forgotten and that they got a proper welcome. it was not the same for vietnam war veterans. the ticker tape parades to welcome home veterans of vietnam, that was delayed for a long time. it was not until 1985, more than ten years after the last american personnel had returned home, that vietnam vets finally got the nation's official welcome home on lower broadway. that long-delayed parade welcoming home the vietnam vets, that was the biggest one ever. in 1991, when the veterans of america's first war in iraq, the gulf war, returned, new york

threw them a ticker tape parade on the canyon of heroes. december 2011, the second war in iraq ended. the last american troops left iraq in december 2011. that ended our nearly nine-year military presence in that country. and at the time, for that occasion, two new york city council members proposed that the city of new york host a parade to welcome home the troops from that war, to mark the end of the war in iraq. then new york city mayor michael bloomberg said his office reached out to the pentagon to discuss the potential, but the pentagon reportedly said no. the pentagon reportedly told mayor bloomberg's office that having a parade would put soldiers who were still fighting in afghanistan in harm's way. they said it wouldn't be appropriate to do that while other soldiers were still fighting. should be noted, though, that other cities around the country didn't wait for the pentagon. the city of st. louis, missouri, was the first one to hold a parade, to say welcome home to iraq vets, followed by houston and tucson and fayetteville and north carolina and melbourne, florida, and richmond, virginia,

and kansas city, and chicago, lots of cities. but not new york. not in the canyon of heroes. not in the place where america thinks of as the place that we make it official, where we really say, welcome home, as a nation. over this past weekend, senator charles schumer of new york decided to raise the issue again. he said, now, combat operations in afghanistan are coming to an end. and so maybe now, now is the time to start to plan, finally, a welcome home parade for the troops who served in iraq and in afghanistan. and now there is a new mayor of new york city, bill de blasio, and he says he supports the idea. so the now finally the time, 2 1/2 years after the end of the iraq war, will the american troops who fought in that war and in the afghanistan war as well, finally receive the same welcome home as the thousands of troops who have fought in all those wars before them? we may have an answer to that. hold on. [ male announcer ] not all toothbrushes are the same.

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even though there have been very divided views in america about iraq and even afghanistan, just about every. though there have been divided views in america about iraq and afghanistan, just about every american has treated the newest vets with the respect and acknowledgement they deserve. therefore, it is appropriate not to wait and we should give them one of the grandest honors to

bestow all of our veterans and that is this parade down the canyon of heroes. >> joining us for the interview senator charles schumer of new york. senator, thank you for being here. appreciate it. >> good evening. >> we have talked about the issue a long time. >> you are one of the prime people who pushed this to happen. it's great. >> it has been an interesting conundrum to me that we didn't do something to mark the end of the iraq war in this country. >> they did try. there were two councilmen from staten island who called for this. they needed the city's cooperation. mayor bloomberg, i don't begrudge him. called up dod. they said until combat its ended in iraq and afghanistan. they regarded as interrelated conflicts. many who served in iraq went to serve in afghanistan and vice versa. they shouldn't do it. now the president called for combat to end by the end of 2014. hagel seconded this. now is the time to get moving and prepare and do the great

parade that new york can do down the canyon of heroes. i talked to dod. and -- they, you know, they're, they're the bureaucracy of bureaucracies. jumping through 100 hoops. they have been very positive. >> there was this. new york its new york. no other city in the country its new york. and canyon of heroes is its own thing in terms of having a place where we have nationally recognition. but all of these other cities, sort of ignored what the defense department was saying. and, and, went ahead with. i wonder, how does that influence the decision making abut what to do here? >> well i think they did their own parade. they didn't have the cooperation of dod. if we have the cooperation, we can have the top military brass come. we can have fly-overs. all kind of military bans and everything else. it will be a grand, grandpa -- grand, grand, parade. to give the women and men the recognition they deserve nothing like a parade in the canyon of heroes with the full support of our nation's defense department

and all sxt tra things that that entails. >> the history that weighs heavily here for me at least looking back at previous parade in the canyon of he rose is, its the vietnam war. an uncomfortable conflict for the nation, in terms of the politicalish -- political issues, in vietnam that translated to difficulties for veterans coming home. there was no parade for more than ten years. >> that was wrong. if people disagreed with the policies i think there was as much disagreement with iraq as the with vietnam. you don't take it tout on the people the vietnam dates. they were drafted. they served. they served noble and well. why was it different? one of the nice thing as the but the iraq war. a lot of not nice things.

the soldiers have been treated well from the beginning. congress did unite to improve health benefits. a g.i. bill was re-enacted so. they can afford college. many of them, of course were, older. they were reservists, national guards people who left their families to go. who left their jobs to go. not just fresh out of high school or college. while many more were in vietnam. and so -- there was a different view. why was it different? vietnam. iraq. i think, i, cut my political eye teeth protesting the velt name war in college. there was just so much anger at the establishment in -- in -- in vietnam. that it boiled over unfortunately into the veterans as almost symbols of the establishment. in iraq, people thought the war was wrong. but there wasn't the same hostility to the whole way america was going. vietnam was sort of an awakening to a lot of people >> what about the issue of paying for a large

scale welcome home event? obviously going to take a lot of money. >> it will take some money. we'll figure that out. the mayor has been involved. we pay for parade for athletes. i think a great thing. i love the yankees and giants parades. >> yes. i know. i know. >> i'm a fan. >> there were no mets. no dodgers, no, jets when i was a kid. so, those were the teams. i stuck with them. but -- we can pay for this. and i have talked to mayor de blazio, he is fully on board. a lot of the veterans' organizations want to chip in in all kind of different ways. paying for it went be the hard part. getting it organized. we well have to figure out when we can do it. we will wait with dods wishes. until combat is declared over. it would be nice if that happened in, in september. you know, given these elections. maybe that can happen. because they will be quicker to sign an agreement. karzai was resisting an agreement. we can do it on veterans day. what a great thing that would

be. >> senator charles schumer. we covered the story for a long time. >> you have done a great job. >> the first progress we are able to report. >> thank you for your good work.

on a wednesday night, 364 days ago. a year ago tomorrow. this happened. in a town called west in the great state of texas. >> are you serious? >> i can't hear. i can't hear. let's get out of here. >> that absolutely terrifying explosion one year ago at a fertilizer plant in texas killed 15 people and just leveled a huge part of a well established american place. in the year since that plant and that town blew up, we have learned a lot about what happened there and why.

but what we have decided to do about what happened there will amaze you. and we have got that story for you on tomorrow night's show. i hope you will be here for that. first look is up next. good thursday morning everyone. right now on first look, frantic wait. hundreds much high school students still unaccounted for as the death toll rises and family members of the capsized ferry wait. vladimir putin may have the momentum in ukraine negotiations. diabetes stuld is. new information for those battling diabetes. plus, a robotic sub scans the ocean floor in search of flight 370. two fire trucks collide while responding to a house fire and ford goes retro with a 50th anniversary mustang. hello, thanks for joining us. i'm betty nguyen. a desperate search is under way fo