♪ these veterans are suffering under obama's watch. after he declared them a top priority and his team had been alerted to misconduct. do you know what that means? it means we finally have a real scandal. a real scandal! jimmy, drop 'em! whoo! whoo! whoo! >> good morning. it is friday, may 23rd. welcome to "morning joe." can you believe it's memorial day weekend already. with us on set, "morning joe" contributor john heilemann. that's interesting, isn't it? isn't that interesting, thomas? >> i once was lost. >> the alarm went off. >> and now i'm found. >> you look good. >> that's good. it's good you're here, john.

>> it was a crazy morning yesterday, kids. crazy morning. >> no. that's okay. we've got the host of "way too early" thomas roberts. and in washington white house correspondent for the associated press, julie pace. great to see you. hi, willie. hi, joe. okay. >> hey, there, mika. willie, how's the book tour going? your father and you the other day were unbelievable on "morning joe." it's just -- it's really inspiring. how's it going? >> thanks, joe. we're having fun. "good talk, dad" is the book we wrote together. i was just saying to mika it was like sitting around with family. think about getting to go out with your dad and talking about the best and funniest stories of your life. it's fun for people to talk about how much they love him. for me it's a great tribute to my dad. we're having a great time. >> your dad's like ali in his prime. you never get a good punch on him. you say a lot of nice things

about him. and he just sort of brushes 'em off and comes back with a funny jab. what a hilarious guy. >> bye, guys. >> where you going? >> i don't know. i'm in a bunker. >> he's walked away from us. >> looks like jon hamm. i thought it was him for a second. >> he is so "mad men." i am going to do news and he will come back to the camera. an investigation. a four men have been charged for their role in photographing thad cochran's wife. we've been talking about this for some time. but it's developing into quite a big story. his wife, by the way, cochran's wife is in hospice. who sneaks a camera into hospice? last week blogger clayton kelly

was arrested for photographing rose cochran and posting it on a video online. then yesterday three more mississippi men were accused of conspireing with kelly. the jackson clairon ledger reports john mary hosted a radio show with mcdaniel. another, is a chairman of the state tea party and has reportedly donated to mcdaniel's campaign. his attorney claims the arrest is politically motivated. mcdaniel has claimed total innocence and condemned the alleged breach of privacy. as we have said since day one the violation of the privacy of mrs. cochran is out of bounds for politics and is reprehensible. any individuals involved in this crime should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law. why would they do it though? in a recent radio interview mcdaniel denied his staff had

any link to the blogger or knowledge of activities. but he struggled to explain why he denied knowing about the incident hours after his campaign manager had called him about it. >> basically she said some things about miss cochran. i said stop right there. you know our campaign's position. >> she didn't tell you there was an arrest? >> let me finish, okay? i can explain this. i said mentally our position had been the same -- let's back up. please give me the courtesy and i can tell you. >> i can't imagine your campaign manager not telling you. >> i was asleep. she called me -- >> she called you and told you there was a problem. what did the say? >> i can tell you what she said. she said chris, we have an issue involving miss cochran. i said let me get up and take a shower. you can fully brief me when i get to hernando. that's where it went down. we did not get further in that

initial situation. >> you never called her back? >> no. we're busy. >> joe, i'm going to -- i don't feel this person is telling the truth. sorry. it's what i immediately think. >> no, not at all. you can tell they're lying. >> it's bad. >> i was just going to say isn't this what a governor does when they're in a scandal after being governor for eight or ten years? this guy hasn't even been elected and he's in the middle of this horrible scandal. you know, mika, i've got to say, this may be a really positive development. these arrests. because creeps have been going around with video cameras in politics now especially for the last five, six years and they'll follow wives and videotape them. follow them 24 hours a day. there are candidates that will be going with their family to breakfast on a saturday morning or a sunday morning and somebody

will sit in the next booth and let them see them holding video cameras. i think there has to be a zone of privacy. if we want the best and the brightest to run for public office in this country, this sort of garbage needs to stop. and when people violate a zone of privacy, there has -- somebody has to be held accountable. and a good place to start is the other campaign. this guy's obviously lying. >> not telling the truth. there's no way. sorry. i know we should wait, but it really -- how do you even look at that and not realize that guy is literally trying to dance around what is a horrific truth nap is he did at the very least know about it and didn't even want to admit that. but the most disturbing thing is actually what happened. someone sneaking into a hospice? we all know what hospice -- it's probably one of the most deeply

personal places that a family can be at. hospice. and to sneak a camera in there? >> it's unbelievable. john heilemann, isn't this, john heilemann, the national progression, the perverted progression to the type of campaigning a lot of these people and fringe groups have been doing for years? >> yes, i think it is. joe, you're right to say this is not a first of its kind. there have been some famous stories in the last four, five, six years where surreptitious recordings have been made sometimes to try to take down organizations. sometimes try to take down individuals. the thing you're referring to has a name in politics. it's trackers. most campaigns have them now. someone who is paid to stay as close as possible to the candidate and their families and catch as much on video as possible in the hopes of finding them in embarrassing situations.

this is a disgusting and grotesque, the far extreme of that. but once you start crossing these lines, you start to get into some ugly places. as mika says, the woman is in hospice. she apparently has dementia. there is no purpose to this, no conceivable purpose to try to record her other than to embarrass her to no other end than to make a personal attack of that kind. and, yeah, i think maybe you're right that this may be the place where we get this far across the line, it will pull people back a bit into a more acceptable zone. >> willie, what did john take yesterday that made him overshoot the runway so often? bring that in for a landing. what was that? >> i don't know. i don't know what it was. so there's been no direct connection yet to chris mcdaniel, but it was made clear by this reporting the newspaper in mississippi at the very least

he knows these guys that were arrested yesterday. he looked like he was on his heels in that radio interview yesterday. my question is what advantage was that going to give a campaign to have that photo released and posted online? >> that's what i -- yeah. don't get it. >> i don't know what it is. if it was, in fact, orchestrated, what did they think it was going to come out of it? >> it was ignorant. they were trying to suggest that thad cochran had abandoned his wife in hospice for all of these years while he was campaigning. it's perverted and stupid. but that's what extreme groups do. i think it's finally blown up in one of these candidate's faces. >> it definitely has. >> whether they had direct or indirect knowledge of what was going on, he certainly looks slippery at the end. >> very. lawmakers are turning up the heat on va officials over the scandal of waiting lists that have left as many as 40 veterans dead if not more.

three va officials failed to show up to explain why the agency hasn't yet turned over all the e-mails subpoenaed by a house committee giving rise to claims of stone walling. senator mark kirk is calling into question $16 million in bonuses paid out to va hospitals near chicago asking whether wait times there were manipulated to earn extra pay. and yesterday john boehner says he's closer to calling for the resignation of eric shinseki. >> the reports that continue to come are appalling. and these are men and women who served our country. and we've not just let them down, we've let them die. this is awful stuff. and somebody ought to be heldabilitiable for it. >> shinseki met with top democrat dick durbin yesterday to discuss the scandal. the president's deputy chief of

staff also visited the phoenix hospital. >> what i don't understand is if john boehner is saying that people were not only let down, but they died, why won't he call for shinseki's resignation? most republicans already don't understand why the house speaker isn't. he needs to do it today. i think it's shameful he hasn't. you have democratic candidates all over the country chasing their tails being silent on this scandal where people are dying. and a lot of democrats -- i don't know. this doesn't seem like it would be a partisan issue. why aren't they demanding shinseki's resignation? he's been up there six years. >> julie, i'm sure you've heard the questions coming to the white house. what's their take? >> i think in terms of people holding back and call for shinseki's resignation, i think pa rt of this has to do with the fact that we are talking about a four-star army general, someone who is a disabled veteran.

i think that gives him some measure of protection whether that should overshadow all of these problems the va has had over his tenure at the head of the agency i think is a question that some of these lawmakers are grappling with. you know, the white house says they are going to wait for these reviews to finish. there's a preliminary review that shinseki is overseeing. we're supposed to get that next week. there's a broader review that nabors is to turn in in june. the question is will the political pressure mount from those on the campaign trail. this is almost the new obamacare question. what is your position on shinseki? will the white house be tiebl give these democrats some cover over the next couple of weeks. >> julie, most of the democratic candidates aren't saying anything. >> there are a few. >> few are stepping out now. >> we've started to see really in the last day or two some

democrat. there are two democrats in congress, in georgia who are in tough races who called for shinseki's resignation. but very few. you can be sure that every democrat who's running in november is going to get this question probably over memorial day weekend. >> meanwhile, john, as julie points out the optics of what the resume of shinseki is, the headlines would be obama fires a vet to save the vets. right? and we also know how the obama administration responds to perceived scandals with either kathleen sebelius or susan rice, they get their backup and kind of decide not to react to public pressure. do you think that that's the wisest choice they can make at this point as they continue to vet what really went on, let the investigation roll out. >> i think the point you're making about the fact that the president wants to tend to want to stick with people has been -- he throws people under the bus

occasionally but not that often. i don't know if it's the wisest choice in this case though. i do think we -- again, we keep talking about crossing lines. the problems in the va have been going on for a long time. i think this is to the point where it's going to be hard for shinseki to survive. >> on the cover of usa today, bob dole gives an interview. he calls the situation a disaster. one of the most respected veterans in our country right now. he says he has mixed feelings about whether or not shinseki should resign. he says he respects him as a warrior, as a leader, but if this report lies out and you can lay things at his feet, he's got to go. i'll read one quote. you shouldn't keep a veteran waiting three months to see a doctor. the situation requires urgent response. i don't want to be critical of the president, said dole, but he waited 23 days before he responded. he should have done it sooner. >> some of these problems, by the way, have been here for years and been unacceptable. now that the sunlight is being

cast on it, everyone should double down until it's completely ratted out. and it's going to be an enormous endeavor. julie pace, your latest piece for the ap has some interesting nuggets on the white house's attempts to win over congress when it comes to foreign policy. administration officials are holding private meetings with lawmakers and sometimes over wine and crackers in an effort to soothe the critics. but so far it doesn't appear to be paying off. with bob corker calling one meeting, quote, the most bizarre i've attended. according to congressional aides, the white house refused to provides concrete details on the u.s. approach to afghanistan and the kidnapping situation in nigeria. julie, take us through this. >> so what's been happening over the past week is white house officials dennis mcdonough and susan rice have been meeting with house democrats, with

senate democrats, and a handful of senate republicans. the point of this is to try to soothe some lawmaker frustrations over foreign policy ahead of a big speech the president will make next week. the people we talked to on the hill including one senator who participated in the meeting and aides who were briefed by their bosses, these folks said they went to the meetings, they had specific questions. not only about the president's speech but the white house politics in particular. things like what will we do in afghanistan when the war ends this year. what is the pentagon doing to find the missing nigerian school girls. we were told there were no actual answers provided. as a general matter what these law machers were also looking for was more of a strategy. what is the white house's broader approach to foreign also at this time. there's been a lot of criticism of this. it seems they left with a general sense of

dissatisfaction. >> so julie, why is that? as a white house reporter, i'm sure you hear these complaints all the time. what is the cause for it for them not having answers to basic questions? >> i don't think it's that they don't have answers, it just seems as though they're not willing to give lawmakers answers. one of the specific complaints that we heard is that there were questions asked about what the pentagon was doing with the nigerian girls and the lawmakers were told broadly there was going to be more that was going to be done. what they weren't told was what was announced two days later which was that they were sending 80 military personnel to chad. that's a frustration lawmakers have. if something is happening, why can't you tell senators who work on these issues. >> mika, i think this underlies a bigger frustration that lawmakers, foreign policy analysts have when it comes to

foreign policy. there's not an over-arching idea that underlines the foreign policy. there's not a thread that connects syria with iran, with afghanistan, with the eu, with china. and because there's not, lawmakers are left scratching their heads and it leads to a lot of frustration. >> all right. we'll continue the conversation in must reads on this. coming up on "morning joe," down to the final four. the republican party narrows its list of potential cities for the 2016 convention. >> sorry, heilemann. no vegas. >> worst news i've heard in a long time. >> let's just say sheldon adelson will not be happy with the finalists. another billionaire nba owner is in hot water. mark cuban under fire for his own comments about the donlald sterling scandal. why he's apologizing to the family of trayvon martin. up next, the top stories in the politico playbook.

but first bill kairns with the check of the weekend forecast. you're not letting us down, are you? >> it's a mixed bag. let me show you. yesterday we had those crazy thunderstorms from just outside of albany, new york, who had a tornado on the ground for about 20 miles. to the hailstorms that went across the mid-atlantic yesterday. they were insane. and delaware had significant damage from wind storms too. it's all clear this morning. that mess is all gone from yesterday. we will see a chance of severe storms today. but further to the south, we're okay today. but in south carolina, bordering with north carolina including charlotte, myrtle beach, you have a chance to see strong storms today. as far as the airports go, charlotte airport probably one of the only ones for your travel and getaway. and right through the memorial day weekend, in the northeast, saturday morning won't be great. but by the time you get to sunday and especially memorial day monday, it really starts to get warm. we could be mid-80s along the

mid-atlantic. that's beach weather, folks. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. ♪ i'm on expert on softball. and tea parties. i'll have more awkward conversations than i'm equipped for, because i'm raising two girls on my own. i'll worry about the economy more than a few times before they're grown. but it's for them, so i've found a way. who matters most to you says the most about you. at massmutual we're owned by our policyowners, and they matter most to us. ready to plan for your future?

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♪ time now to take a look at the morning papers. on the front page of "the new york post," another reason our whole system about food and health is completely skewed. this is "the new york post." this poor beautiful little girl is told by the city of new york in a test they take for bmi at the schools that she's fat. and she read it. she wasn't supposed to read it. it doesn't make any sense. and some of the tests are so skewed, we have to actually look at a lot of different factors in order to be able to make that determination. it just shows what a huge, huge uphill battle we have in terms

of getting it right on our health. >> show that picture again. >> i just feel bad for the girl. >> but she's not fat by any definition. there's no definition. >> she's an athlete and her parents are furious. so we'll be constantly covering the issue of food. at some point i'll try to get it right as well and hit it on the right note with people to get the right information out there. it's hard. it becomes a very controversial conversation. here's a look at "the wall street journal." there are growing concerns about sunday's election in ukraine following an unprecedented assault by pro-russian mill tautan -- militants. dozens of soldiers were hurt in what is now the deadliest attack on the military since the unrest began. attacks occurred in several other villages with kiev accusing moscow of trying to

disrupt election preparations. joe? >> and this from "the arizona republic." a raging wildfire is near flagstaff, arizona. crews will be able to get that one under control. the wildfire has burned up to 8,000 acres. hundreds of firefighters are at the scene telling thousands of residents to be ready to evacuate. now, so far there have been no reports of injuries or damaged buildings. so that's a little bit of good news. >> from our parade of papers "the dallas morning news." president obama will nominate the mayor of san antonio to the next secretary of housing and urban development. julian castro is in his third term as mayor. the president is expected to make the announcement this afternoon. >> and this from "the usa today." time inc. says they will place adds on their covers of their

magazines. they hope it will generate additional ad sales. now, "time" and "si" are going to be the first large scale magazines to place ads on their covers. >> "the boston globe," director of the cia bob gates is the new president of the boy scouts of america. he will be the organization's first president to have held a position in national politics. and he's held several. this man's amazing. what a get for the boy scouts. gates earned the rank of eagle scout when he was a teenager. >> and this from "the new york times." very sad news, of course, for willie, for barnicle, for heilemann. las vegas out -- out! also cincinnati withdrawing from the race to host the republican national convention in 2016.

now, both cities named logistical concerns as part of the explanation behind their choice to revoke their bids. the news leads cleveland, dallas, denver, and kansas city in the running. >> all right. "the birmingham news." a man found a way to show his allegiance. >> i'm innocent. roll tide. >> i'm what? no. he did not. >> the man was taken into custody during a raid to round up people with outstanding warrants. we got to play this again. willie, you sent this to me. as dead spin said, the real star was the sheriff's deputy who after he said roll tide gave a knowing nod.

>> i'm innocent. roll tide. >> yep. yes, sir. >> what's great is he's got the handcuffs behind his back. it's like the roll tide perp walk. >> that's the best defense you could have. >> if you could keep that on file, i think that's going to be useful. yeah. >> i love that. >> are you saying so when i get arrested they can do a sort of side by side? >> that would be good. >> roll tide. >> there are several ways to use it. >> doesn't work as well on the upper east side when you get arrested. >> what do i say? what's columbia? >> go lions. go team. >> what's the parade this weekend? >> in parade magazine, a tribute to two beth friends and soldiers who were buried next to each other in arlington national cemetery after dying defending our country. everybody just stop for a second and read that article.

that'll do it. let's take a look at politico now, willie. >> joining us now the editor in chief there. former treasury secretary tim geithner has faced kr it schism over wall street bailouts including from jon stewart on the daily show. >> you have to make sure you're preventing people from running from the system, the system from collapsing. we don't do it for the banks or the bankers. we do it to protect them from their mistakes. >> now, here's where i guess the perceptions begin to shift. because i think that's a compelling case. that you're being told this economy is going to crater. and that even though the ar arsonists are on the plane with us, we have to land the plane. then it felt like you got the arsonists off the plane and got them a steak dinner and massage. >> that's part of the piece

called why tim geithner drives liberals nuts. the argument continues to be that no scalps were taken after, nobody went to jail, he didn't go after the huge bonuses that were handed out largely with government money. so what's the impact of this now? our political system? >> this is debuting at number four on "the new york times" list. but it's not just a backward look. our back page has a story making clear this is the forward-looking book. this is the central debate in 2016. two views. one, you kind of treat wall street like a math problem. it's hard and difficult, but you want to be as rational and efficient as possible for the larger economy. the other says this is a moral question. these people were wrong. they did effectively evil things for the economy. there's got to be a moral dimension to the response. that's what jon stewart was getting at with his steak dinner

crack. we'll hear this debate for two years in the democratic party. >> who does that impact? are we talking about hillary clinton here? and if so which side does she come down on? >> for the bulk of her career coming out of the clinton years, hillary clinton has been more on the geithner side of the argument. as she positions herself and looks at the democratic party where these forces that really want old testament style justice are gaining strength, it's going tobacco interesting to see her reposition herself. if she tries to straddle both, that will go back to 2008 when she tried to straddle the iraq war. we just don't know yet. >> that's why some people think someone could come in and give her a bit of trouble on the left flank if she does decide to run. >> only thing is we don't know how she's going to be in the campaign. we do know that a month ago she

went down and spoke to goldman sachs and was very defensive of that institution. what she said there was reported out that she basically -- she didn't quite say it was much to do about nothing, but she came to the defense of that massive bank that got one of the biggest bailouts. >> let's face it. the clintons live in new york. they are in the elite of the democratic party. so these people who are part of the financial system, this is their social world. this is their political world in many ways where they're getting a lot of their money from. i don't doubt that -- >> you and i understand that. you and i understand that, but people outside of manhattan are not going to understand that. right? in the democratic party? >> no, they won't. when she plays to that anger if she does and makes real kind of

chest thumping speeches elizabeth warren style, does it seem authentic or tinny? and is it connected to her policy views or just look like a political calculation? >> she gave a speech to try to attack the other way at the new america foundation where she said some are calling this a throwback to the gilded age. >> that's a real problem. >> john harris with a look inside the politico playbook. thanks so much. coming up the rangers and canadiens drop the gloves at the garden. a wild end to game three in the eastern conference finals. and later an incredible save by a good samaritan in china. a baby wanders out on a window ledge with the parents nowhere in sight. that straight ahead. "morning joe" is coming right back. ♪ vo: once upon a time there was a boy who traveled to a faraway place

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♪ all right. let's do some sports. looks like a series in the eastern conference finals with the stanley cup playoffs. montreal's brandon prust sets the tone with a cheap shot on derek stepan. stepan would return later in the period but the blue shirts would not let that hit go unanswered. they drop the gloves to settle the score. you don't see a lot of this this late in the playoffs.

there was some hockey played. briere sends it into the crease off a defender's skate into the back of the net. check this out again. off the rangers skate there. rangers don't go down though. they pull their goalie with less than a minute to go. kreider banks off the defender's skate. ties the game under a minute to play. and we are going to overtime. >> back along. they score! an overtime-winning goal and the canadiens are back in the series. >> canadiens win 3-2 in overtime. they had to have this game. now the rangers lead 2-1 in that best of seven series. game four is sunday night in new york. he may be the best known american soccer player of all time, but landon donovan will

not be on this year's world cup team in brazil. the 32-year-old has been the name and the face of the national team for the last decade. donovan did taic a break from soccer last year and missed three world cup qualifying matches. unclear exactly why he was left off the final 23-man roster. some say it's a soccer decision, others point to a rift with the team's head coach. let's do some baseball. while yasiel puig's head may not always be in the game, his talent is undeniable. >> he curveball hit deep right to center field. chasing back of the back is camp. he won't get there but puig will. makes an incredible diving catch. he slides in safely. >> that is just an incredible play by puig. take another look. may have saved a run, but the mets still won 5-3. yu darvish throwing pitches professional pitchers have never

seen before. torii hunter doesn't know how to react to this lob. watch him buckle, his head flail backward as the pitch passes him by. it was a ball. but he did strike out looking later in the at bat. straight ahead on "morning joe," eugene robinson says the republicans have a tea party problem. what does john boehner think about that? >> i'm not going to enter this distinction between the tea party and republicans. >> gene and ezra klein join us in just a minute. but first we'll work through mika's must-read opinion pages. we'll be right back with more "morning joe." ♪

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house. what a beautiful day on this friday before memorial day weekend. it's time now for the must-read opinion pages. i'm going to take this one from "the new york times" which writes in part this. a year ago it would have been unimaginable for the house to pass a bill to curtail the government's abusive surveillance practices. the documents leaked by edward snowden finally shocked lawmakers from both parties into action producing promises that they would stop the government from collecting telephone data of americans. unfortunately the bill passed be i the house on thursday falls far short of those promises. and does not live up to its title. the usa freedom act. because of the last-minute pressure from a recalcitrant obama administration, the bill contains loopholes that dilute the strong restrictions in an earlier version potentially allowing the spy agencies to continue much of their phone data collection.

still, the bill finally begins to reverse the trend of reducing civil liberties in the name of fighting terrorism as embodied in various versions of the patriot act. and if the senate fixes its flaws, it could start to rebuild confidence that washington could get it right. julie pace? >> you'll hear a lot of concerns from privacy ciedy advocates th even after this debate, what we're left with is legislation that quite frankly doesn't go very far. as that editorial points out, what it does do is keep other privacy rights from being eroded. but it doesn't necessarily have the sweeping effect that a lot of people had hopes for after the snowden disclosures. >> joe? go ahead, willie. >> i was just going to read one other one if we had time. this is the usa today opinion page. wes moore, our good friend veteran of the united states army and author. writing about memorial day and what's going on with the va.

far too many americans look at memorial day as a day off. to me and others it's the reality that even though some didn't make it back from war it didn't mean their fighting was over. >> there's no doubt about it. you know, this scandal that we're talking about right now is part of a much bigger problem that we've had for years. we've been talking about it for some time. military men and women have been made promises about health care for life. for generations they've been told you put on the uniform, you move your family across the globe. you risk your life in battle. you leave part of yourself on the battlefield. you suffer for this country. in return, we'll pay you a salary, we'll pay your retirement and we'll give you health care for life. that is a promise that has been

made by congress and the president. and that is a promise that successive presidents and congresses have broken. if anything good can come out of this scandal, it's my hope that finally a promise made to our vets will be a promise kept. if we can afford to fight ten-year wars, then we have to be able to afford to pay for 60, 70 years of health care. and if we don't want to do that, then we can't afford to fight wars. and that's what america's going to have to face. and it's disgusting that everybody waves the flag when they go off to war, but then when they come back everybody wants them to just slink away, go away, hide, and not hear about it. this didn't start in 2014. this has been going on for way too long. >> amen. amen a thousand times. i'd also say for politicians who

wear the flag lapel pin and they put u.s. servicemen and women in their political ads, it's time to step up and do things beyond symbolic gestures and take care of these guys. when the planes flew into the buildings, less than 1% of us put on gear and got on planes to deal with it. if you're go i think to war for us, we will take care of you for life. we need to start honoring that commitment. >> all right. we're back in a moment with news you cannot use. will ferrell and his celebrity twin chili pepper drummer chad smith are have a drum-off on the tonight show. we'll be right back. ♪

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♪ time for news you can't use. incredible video out of china. a baby was searching for his mother in a thunderstorm when he wandered on the ledge of the building. a passerby gets in position to make the catch. and he does. saving the little boy's life. prevents him from hitting the concrete floor below that ledge. that's just incredible. lucky little kid. >> you see the mom grab the baby and take him off. >> it's a good thing that guy

learned the little league lesson, use two hands. >> make the play. incredible. this is not to be confused with our favorite baby dropping video of all time. this is the ritual in india. the baby tossing. they believe it blesses the baby for a long life of happiness and health. pops right up. hand it back and bring up the next one. here we go. ready. boing. >> why do we have more respect for the chinese falling than we do this? we didn't fuzzy out the parts. >> fuzzy out the parts. >> it's a hash tag. >> how about billy corgan frontman for the smashing pumpkin known for his powerful melodies and guitar riffs and alternative lifestyle. especially when his band peaked back in the '90s. ♪

>> that's a great bands. corgan may be trying to appeal to a different audience these days. this is billy corgan on the cover of "paws chicago" magazine. he's a big fan of the organization. those are two of his adopted cats sammy and mr. thom. the softer side. >> wow. did you know about this will ferrell/red hot chili peppers doppelganger. >> i didn't realize how much they look alike until you see them together. >> chad smith is the drummer for the red hot chili peppers. meeting face to face on the tonight show for a drum-off. ♪ >> take that, funny man. >> looks like baby learned how to play the drums.

but can baby do this? ♪ >> come on. let's see what you got. what do you got? >> that was a cute. do you play for the lukewarm chili peppers? >> let's give a nice assist to quest love for playing the drums in the background for will ferrell. coming up at the top of the hour, why one democratic senator is getting an earful from a republican colleague for saying race may be playing a part in

the opposition to obamacare. and eugene robinson and ezra klein will join our conversation. much more "morning joe" when we come back. ♪ woman: everyone in the nicu -- all the nurses wanted to watch him when he was there 118 days. everything that you thought was important to you changes in light of having a child that needs you every moment.

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nature lover... people person. ♪ and you put up with it all... isbe ♪ welcome back to "morning joe." john heilemann and julie pace are still with us.

with us now from washington, editor in chief of vox.com and msnbc policy analyst ezra klein. and pulitzer winning columnist and msnbc columnist eugene robinson. let's start with the primary in mississippi. the primary itself is being overshadowed by a growing investigation. this is a horrific story. a total of four men who support tea party candidate chris mcdaniel have been charged with their alleged role for photographing thad cochran's wife who lives in hospice care. blogger clayton kelly was arrested last week for taking pictures of rose cochran and posting them online. it's a video actually. then yesterday three more mississippi men were accused of conspireing with kelly. the jackson clairon-ledger reports that john mary hosted

radio show with mcdaniel. and another has reportedly donated to mcdaniel's campaign, hosted a fund raiser, and helped campaign for him. but mayfield's attorney says the arrest is politically motivated. mcdaniel condemned the alleged breach of privacy. his campaign issued a statement reading this. as we have said since day one, the violation of the privacy of mrs. cochran is out of bounds for politics and is reprehensible. any individuals who were involved in this crime should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law. in a recent radio interview, mcdaniel denied his staff had any knowledge of his activities. but mcdaniel really struggled to explain why he denied knowing about the incident hours after his campaign manager had called him to tell him about it. >> basically she said some

things about ms. cochran and i said, whoa, stop right there. i said you know our campaign's position in regards to this. >> she didn't tell you there was an arrest? >> let me finish. i can explain this. i said mentally our position on this has always been the same. paul, we had been -- let's back up. i can tell you what's going on here. give me the courtesy and i can tell you. >> i can't imagine your campaign manager not telling you -- >> i was asleep. she called me -- >> she called you and told you there was a problem. >> she did. >> what did she say? >> i the tell you. she said, chris, we have a problem with ms. cochran. i said you fully brief whe when i get to hernando. that's where it went down. >> all the way to hernando when you got to the fair you never called her back? >> paul, no. we're busy. >> oh, god. it's hard to watch. >> it is hard to watch. >> clearly trying to figure out

how to lie. >> you know, mika, this guy looks like one of those sweaty defendants at the end of a perry mason episode where they finally break down and said, i did it, i did it. let's go to gene robinson. the only man old enough to remember watching those sweaty defendants along with me at the end of perry mason. i don't know that i have ever seen a politician look more red handed, caught, guilty than chris mcdaniel. his campaign is obviously over. his supporters are all over this. there are connections all over the place. >> what were they thinking? >> he appears to be lying and he's made a horrible situation worse. i just hope, gene, that other creeps that go around with video cameras invading people's privacy are put on notice by this case. >> yeah. this is really disgusting and appa appalling. and that video, you're right. it's like perry mason or for

those a bit younger with ab law and order episode or something like that. you know, he obviously was searching for a story to tell. and couldn't make up his mind how he was going to tell the story. but i think he's probably -- he had an uphill struggle against cochran. maybe a chance to knock him off. i think that's probably gone now. there's got to be a -- just a wave of sympathy for cochran and for his wife and for the whole situation. >> all right. onto this story now. a congressional hearing over the health care law took a dramatic turn when the issue of race was brought into the discussion. republican senator ron johnson of wisconsin pushed back against a statement by democrat jay rockefeller who chairs the commerce committee. here's the exchange. >> i think it's very important to take a long view at what's going on here. and i'll be able to dig up some

e-mails that make part of the affordable care act that doesn't look good especially from people who've made up their mind that they don't want it to work. because they don't like the president. maybe he's of the wrong color, something of that sort. i've seen a lot of that. and i know a lot of that to be true. it's not something you're meant to talk about in public, but it's something i'm talking about in public because that is very true. >> it was regrettable and i would say offensive seeings i'm the only one in the room here talking about opposition for you to play the race card. that you would say opposition to obamacare streams to inherent racism. very offensive. i didn't object to this because of the race of the president. i object to this because it's an assault on our freedom. please don't assume, don't make implications of what i'm thinking and what i would really support. you have no idea. >> i actually do. and, you know, god help you.

>> no, senator. god help you for implying i'm a racist because i oppose this health care law. >> i did not imply you were racist. >> let's play back the tape. >> we could do that, but we're not going to. you've lost your temper. i understand that. >> i was called a racist. i think most people would lose their temper, mr. chairman. >> you were not called a racist. >> he's the only republican in the room, and senator rockefeller suggested that millions and millions of americans who are opposed to the affordable care act or obamacare as the president likes it to be called have racist reasons for doing that. that's one of the stupidest most offensive things i've heard a sitting senator say. instead of apologizing because there was only one republican in there, rockefeller doubled down. the word of the morning, the

word of the year. and it's really deeply offensive. he owes ron johnson an apology. gene robinson, democrats have used the race card before. republicans have played the race card before. this is not something new. you expect more, though, from jay rockefeller who was around in 1993 when hillary clinton was savaged and bill clinton was savaged by trying to provide americans national health care. i mean, this is -- we've talked about this before. i mean, you had the number two republican in the house say that bill and hillary clinton were marxists and he said it on the house floor. he called them marxists on the house floor. they're white. you had jerry fallwell, one of the top conservative leaders in

america, accuse bill clinton of murder. you had others suggesting that bill clinton had murdered vince foster, had murdered ron brown. i just -- i am stunned by what ro rock feller said. >> if you rerun the tape is that some of the opposition to president obama and his signature legislation is because he's the wrong color. senator rockefeller believes that. and frankly if you were to see my e-mail and my snail mail and see some of the stuff i get, you would agree. now, does that mean that -- is that calling ron johnson is racist? it's not calling him a racist. that's making an observation about in general some of the

opposition and he did say some of the opposition. does johnson perhaps have a right to take offense because he was the only republican in the room? i think he probably does. because in that context i can understand why he would feel personally attacked. but i think that what senator rockefeller said, if you just take it word for word, is objectively true. >> you don't have to look at my snail mail. and you don't have to look at my e-mail to see invective and hatred spewed at me. just look at my twitter feed. i mean, we all confront that. but to suggest -- >> but it's not all -- it's not all -- i'm talking about crude racial caricatures and insults and sometimes some really vile stuff. and then sometimes some stuff that's not, that you wouldn't call vile but that clearly has a

racial tone. and if you step back and you look broadly at opposition to president obama and his programs, of course it's not all based on race. of course not everyone who opposes him is racist, but there is some of that out there. there is. >> gene, i mean, i can just take people that put #unite blue and make a sweeping condemnation about america's labor movement if i wanted to. but i don't. because i know that these people are on the fringes. they're freaks. they're hate mongers. there are a lot of people in america's union movements who are decent working people that would agree with us on a lot of issues. we could all pick and choose --

talking about people in the margins. and i just don't think that's constructive at all. when hillary clinton faced as much or more animosity. than barack obama. am i wrong here? >> certainly faced a lot of opposition. in fact, she didn't get hers through. and president obama got his through. so either he was more effective or it was a better time or you can weigh one opposition against the other. but it's hard to compare those two situations and then say but i don't think race has anything to do with opposition to president obama. i can't prove chapter and verse that it does, but i can tell you anecdotally that i've got some reasons to believe that it does

have something to do with it. not the whole thing, but it's there. >> let's bring ezra klein into this conversation. we want to get your take on the big picture, what we're talking about here. specifically what jumped out at me as i watched that exchange was rockefeller said he had e-mails that show opposition to obamacare is based on race. i wonder if he was talking about republicans in congress or just some of the hate e-mail that he's been getting. that's kind of stood out to me. >> that's hard to say. you know, i think one thing here is two things can be true is what eugene's getting at. it is true that some opposition of obama is structured by race. there is very, very powerful and ve -- where you use a set of questions to figure out. and in the obama years those questions structure your attitudes towards things like obamacare and even obama's dog. if you give people with racial

resentment a picture of the water poodle and tout it as kennedy's they have wildly different thoughts. race is playing a role in people's thoughts on this. and it is true that most people do not oppose obamacare because of race. the vast majority of people who don't like it don't like it because they don't trust the way it's implemented. as joe says you saw tremendous opposition from hillary and bill clinton when they -- that's why this stuff is very difficult to talk about. because you need to be able to talk about something that is real and hard and very, very offensive to people without painting everyone with the same brush. >> joe? >> you say anecdotally. you look at the numbers, ezra. barack obama got elected with 53% of the vote. twice. he won what would be considered these days a massive landslide

in a majority white country. and unless i'm wrong, this is the first majority white country that has ever elected a person of the color. i must say, i have been behind closed doors with thousands of conservatives through the years. i have never once heard one of them say in the deep south or in the northeast or in south boston, boy, i really hate obamacare because that black president -- i never -- i've never heard anybody come close to saying that. and i have spoken to some wildly right wing groups. i have never heard it once. now, is there racism out there? yes, there's racism out there. i just wonder what evidence jay rockefeller has that any of the political debate or discourse that we had from 2009 forward on the affordable care act had to do with people hating barack

obama because of his race, ezra. i'm not being difficult here. >> i hear you. and there is -- i think what you're responding to and you can tell me if i'm wrong, is the way rockefeller said it makes it sound like a substantial portion. i think you're taking this as republican opposition to obamacare is by race. i can't speak to his e-mails. what i can say is there is good political science evidence that race has structured a certain segment of the population's attitudes on this bill and this presidency in a way that you can't find that correlation under bush, under clinton, under presidents going backwards. that doesn't mean it's most americans. but it's not disproven by the fact that barack obama won a majority. race had can structure on the other side too. it's something obama said himself in an interview that some people dislike him because of his race and some people are more inclined to like him

because of his race. this study was done on attitudes specifically about obamacare. when you look at the racial resentment index, it helps predict. it's not the only thing, not the one thing. >> thomas? >> i was going to say we can compare and contrast this to what the clintons tried to do in the early 1990s. the is is when i first started reporting. people were pulling their hair out over this because an unelected first lady was trying to upgrade our country's social contract and trying to win social policy in this country. that had never been done before in this country to that extent. that's where the pushback came. bill clinton didn't have the political juice to be able to get that through. hillary clinton took that on as her own project and didn't get it through. mainly because people said this is an unelected first lady trying to amend the social contract. >> let me move on then to the midterms.

the way this started when you watch this conversation devolve between rockefeller and johnson, of course we're not getting anything done. because we're always looking for the reasons why we're fighting. the whole thing was discouraging. eugene robinson you write in the "washington post" the gop is still swallowing the tea. nothing in the primary so far suggests that the republican party is tempering its views or weakening its -- far right ideological purity. republican candidates simply cannot risk being called moderate. democrats can though. the republican party's move to the right opens up political space for incumbents and challengers trying to win in red states. candidates such as grimes and nunn can maintain some distance from washington. and in the process make

republicans play defense. julie pace, you know, the midterms have always been seen as a huge opportunity for republicans. might it be for some democrats in these swing states? >> well, possibly. i mean, georgia is a really interesting example. because you have demographics that are changing there. and what democrats were hoping for is that a more conservative candidate would come out of the gop primary than it looks like we're going to end up with. i do think the distinction between the tea party and mainstream republicans is an interesting one. you heard john boehner saying i don't see a difference between the tea party and mainstream republicans. he was saying that as a bit of strategy. i think there is some difference, but you do see leadership, mainstream republicans trying to actually maybe align themselves a little more closely as this discussion has taken place during these primaries. >> that makes sense. joe, jump in.

>> i know gene will be shocked and stunned and deeply saddened because i disagree with my buddy. if you look at the georgia primary, i think that's evidence that this party has learned from its stupidity over the past four years. we had in delaware, for instance, an opportunity to put mike castle and a guy so strong and powerful that i don't care what the bidens say, that's why beau biden didn't run for president. everybody says he was scared by castle would have won. and he would have beat anybody in delaware. instead we get a lady who says i am not a witch. you get the georgia primary, you had paul broun who said some really, really stupid demeaning things that hurt the republican brand. he got like 9%. you had phil gingrey who tried to redefine rape.

he got 8% or 9%. these guys would have won in 2010. you see in 2012 you got jack kingston, the chamber of commerce endorsement. and whoever ended up winning, i'm sorry, i'll have to learn his name because he might be senator. there. thank you so much. david perdue. the party has changed. and there is a difference between the republican party in '10 and in '14 has changed. i personally believe. whether gene does not. >> there's no doubt the history in these past races that you've been pointing to, past cycles you talked about, republicans have shot themselves in the foot se sequentially in many cases by having far right candidates win primaries in states where they had the more mainstream candidate of taking a seat away. and so far this year the republicans have not made that mistake. we've not seen -- there's not a seat right now that i can point

to where there's a tea party challenger who has gained the nomination of the party and has therefore weakened the party's chance to win the race. but it seems like they have avoided the worst possible traps they could have fallen into it and that they have fallen into in the last three successive cycles. >> you know, that's absolutely right, john. and joe, once again, we're not actually disagreeing. we're perhaps looking at different sides of the coin. in fact, yes, the root of the republican party has decided it is tired of throwing away elections on candidates who are unelectable. and so it's done a much better job of picking people who could actually win these elections. in the process of doing that, it has moved right. it has essentially adopted the

tea party's position with candidates who are much more electable. finally the republican who can walk out in front of an audience right now in these states that are up for grabs where the tea party is active and say, you know, i'm actually a moderate republican. i'm a rockefeller republican and i believe in and i look forward to working with the democrats. >> i agree, gene. you're not going to find somebody going around saying vote for me, i'm a rockefeller republican. it is still a conservative party. no doubt about it. maybe we've just cleaned up, gotten the food off our lapels and tried not to look so crazy. >> you probably weeded some out. but i do think, although, the narrative now is the tea party has waned a bit. the impact is there. over the last four years, the influence on the candidates even now who are more moderate, they've obviously taken on a lot of what the pea party brought to the party. i don't think we can totally

deemphasize what they've done to the republican party. >> the republican party has veered further to the right and the democratic party has veered to the left over the course of the last six to eight years. no question about that. >> ezra, really quickly let's bring you in. we've got to go to break. everybody is getting mad at me. i'm sorry. but if you look at some of the democratic senators a, you actually have senators that are much further left than senators that were democratic in 2006, 2008. is that a fair point for them to make? >> i'm not actually sure who they're referring to further to the left. you've not had great elections for democrats. i think if you look at go back to sochl the measures of polarization, i think john is talking about, you see a sharper veer to the right than you see among democrats. part of that -- not part of it

necessarily. but right now a lot of democratic choices are structured by the obama administration. vote alongside the obama administration. and the obama administration has not veered sharply to the left since 2008. so i think the interesting question there is what happens when democrats are in the minority again. >> all right. ezra, thank you very much. julie pace, thank you. we'll be checking out the top stories on skrrks vox.com, ezra. eugene robinson stay with us. still ahead, yet more allegations at a va hospital. $1 million in bonuses were still paid out to hospital execs? plus the deadliest day in ukraine. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. ♪ you, my friend are a master of diversification.

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♪ joining us now the undersecretary of state for

public policy rick stengel. good to see you. >> great to see you, willie. >> you're back from ukraine fairly recently. what's the situation on the ground there? >> they have an election coming up on sunday. this is not just any election. this is the kind of first election of the new old world. they're on the edge of democracy between russia and the west. you know, we're so supportive of the ukrainians being able to choose their own destiny and future. i was there in kiev. it was calm. people are resolute about voting, about choosing their own history. and that's something we really need to support. >> how much support is there from where you sit inside the state department about putin's next move? what else he's willing to do. if it began with crimea and he looks to eastern ukraine, are you worried about what he's planning to do next? and if so, can you prevent him from doing it?

>> we, keir concewe're concerne. again, i -- you know, in the leadup in the election, things have been pretty calm. you know, the ukrainians are resolute about voting. i think they will be in eastern ukraine as well. people are eeg tore get out there. what we've seen thus far from russia is that the election will go on and will be a free and fair election. >> i'm going to shift from ukraine to thailand which is on the front page of every newspaper in the world today. this is a country that has been remarkably prone to coups over the course of its history. first of all, what explains that? and secondly, what's the impact of the coup in thailand on american? i've always considered you one of the most brilliant people i met, so i assume you know

everything about everything. >> this is not -- this is an illegal coup. it's taking away the rights of the people to choose their own future like we're talking about in ukraine. why this happens, i can't say. i know the secretary has been -- is perturbed about it. there will be consequences about the relationship between the u.s. and thailand. >> should we care a lot about this? is this something the average american should care a lot about? >> you know, my view, john, is we should care about places where governments are oppressing their people, where they're preventing people from choosing their own leadership and form of government. i i think that's something americans should worry about. >> i want to ask you about boko haram. many people in the united states hadn't heard of them until about a month ago when this kidnapping took place. we know we sent in people to help on the ground.

how big a footprint does the u.s. have there right now? >> it's small. we're helping the nigerians who asked for our help in finding the girls. it's a despicable act, what they've done. it's a despicable group. again, are they directly threatening us? no. but we want to help the nigerians. it's something americans feel a lot of empathy toward and it's something we want to help them solve. >> so we have -- we'll go to benghazi now. we have people being subpoenaed, secretary kerry and others and this committee looking into what happened. i have a question i guess that's focused squarely on the state department. because a lot of people are saying that there's a fear that hillary clinton will be damaged by what comes out in this and they really want to try and -- that's fine now. but in the days after the benghazi disaster, was there an

attempt to protect her that got us in this situation in the first place? >> the way i look at this, there's been 13 hearings already -- >> but why? >> i'm just saying i don't know what else there is to know about this. we're complying with the requests. there's been 25,000 pages of documents that's been released. if there's anything else there, i don't know. >> to be fair, i think one of the things taking the other side, recently the controversial e-mail that was released. what duke of the substantive impact of that, it was a new piece of information. clearly it's inflamed republicans to a great degree. so secretary kerry has been subpoenaed to go in and testify. you guys have called that a political stunt. is he going to go and testify? >> my understanding is he's going to comply.

subpoenaing the secretary of state without inviting him first is not something that's exactly polite, but if you think that document was a bombshell, i really don't see it. so i just think so much is out there. what is so political about this is the state department in so many ways has complied with trying to bring greater security to protect american diplomats and americans working overseas. that's what we've done in response to benghazi. if people were investigating that saying what have you done to secure our embassieembassies would be great. this other thing is just a political stunt. >> how much better is the security now almost a year and a half, two years after the attack on the kaconsulate in benghazi? is this a priority for the state department? >> every day i'm in meetings for this. i think this has always been the

case but it's particularly the case post-benghazi. people err on the side of protection. >> it's always good to see you. thank you very much. coming up, nba owner mark cuban is under fire for his own comments about the donald sterling scandal. the remarks that led the billionaire to apologize to the parents of trayvon martin. stay with us. ♪ really... so our business can be on at&t's network for $175 dollars a month? yup. all five of you for $175. our clients need a lot of attention. there's unlimited talk and text. we're working deals all day. you get 10 gigabytes of data to share. what about expansion potential? add a line anytime for 15 bucks a month. low dues... great terms... let's close. introducing at&t mobile share value plans... ...with our best-ever pricing for business.

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frightening moments for some bus passengers in russia. a hot water pipeline burst under the bust which started to fill with boiling water. passengers screamed as the fled the vehicle. 13 people were hurt. some severely burned. >> wow. another professional basketball owner is facing criticism for his commentary on race. mark cuban, owner of the dallas mavericks, says he was trying to be honest about his own prejudice. but his honesty is drawing some backlash. >> i know i'm prejudice. i know i'm bigoted in a lot of different ways. i said this before. if i see a black kid in a hoodie at night on the other side of the street -- on the same side of the street, i'm probably going to walk to the other side of the street. if i see a white guy with a shaved head and lots of tattoos,

i'm going back to the other side of the street. right? if i see anybody that looks threatening, you know, chances are there's part of me that takes into account race and gender and age. you know, i'm prejudice. but other than safety issues, i try to always catch my percentages and recognize and be very self-aware that, you know, my stream of thought is never perfect. and i've got to be careful. >> he later tweeted an apology to the family of trayvon martin saying he should have used a different example and was not considering their family. he stands, though, by the substance of that interview. gene robinson, interested for your take on this. he says he was being honest about the way he feels and the way he says a lot of people feel. >> he shouldn't have gone straight for the hoodie and he apologized for that. there was a broadway musical a few years ago "avenue q." there was a song in there everyone's a little bit racist. which was, you know, kind of a

funny, witty number. i think mark cuban was perhaps doing a bit too much gazing and what he was talking about was, i think, just reactions to people who might look different or who you might think are different. that's a bit different, i think, from if you want to go all of that way back to the trayvon martin thing, stalking this person and then ending up killing him. because he's black and wearing a hoodie. i don't think mark cuban is saying that that's where he would go. so i think, you know, maybe he should kind of just take a nap. >> okay. still ahead on "morning joe," take a look. >> these veterans are suffering under obama's watch after he declared them a top priority and his team had been alerted to misconduct. do you know what that means?

it means we finally have a real scandal. a real scandal! jimmy, drop 'em! whoo! whoo! >> yes, we do. why didn't three va officials show up to a congressional hearing yesterday? their empty chairs giving credence to a growing investigation. senator joe donnelly is our next guest on "morning joe." ♪ anncr: right now, at the volkswagen memorial day event

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>> first of all, we have such an all encompassing progress with our vets as we look ahead towards this weekend. given the fact that many are coming home right now facing serious, just let's leave apart the physical issues, mental health issues and suicide. there is so much that needs to be built upon with our va. is there not? >> there's huge things we have to do. especially we're right at the very beginning of a wave that i think for the next ten years at least all our young men and women from iraq and afghanistan are all coming home now and we anticipate this is going to go like this in terms of required services from the va. because they're all coming home and these are not people who did one tour and came home. some of them have been three, four, five times. at the end of the day, they're almost more comfortable some of the vets when they were in afghanistan than being home in muncie, indiana. >> we're one of the few shows

that cover this extensively and talk a lot to vets and to people who are working on veterans issues trying to hire them back into the system, whatever else. willie, off whole bunch of initiatives you're involved with. but we talk about that sort of difficulty transferring back because the one place where they feel comfortable after five tours of duty is with their guys, is with their teams, is with their units, is doing their job. and those skills are incredibly important, valuable, and transferable with a lot of work. which scares me so much about this scandal is it's uncovering, quite frankly, years and years of trouble we've already faced with the veterans. >> one of the most important things we could do is a job. when i was in afghanistan a few years ago, not my most recent trip, but i was with the indiana national guard. we were near the pakistan border. a really difficult place.

and i said what's the most important thing i can do for you when i get home. i figured better guns or trucks. and they said, look, joe. this is one of the most difficult places around, but we've got this. we've figured this place out but i go home in a couple months and i don't have a job. and i've got kids waiting, a husband or wife waiting. if i go home and don't have a job, i don't know what i'm going to do. so one of the most important things everybody who's watching can do, if you have a small business, if you know of job openings is make sure we give our vets a shot. they're disciplined. they're hard working. they're focused. they're amazing. >> amen. we need to teach employers to see the high point of hiring a vet. we are just at the beginning of the something. we're going to see huge numbers of veterans coming home when the wars are finally over. we talk about something like the va, this is only the beginning of the problem. if the system is swamped right

now, what's it going to be like when the rest come home? if shinseki is fired at some point, maybe that's a good symbolic thing. the bureaucracy underneath him remains. how do you change it? >> just yesterday i was on the phone with our vas out in indiana. again, it is something that we've done on almost a religious basis because it's -- we have such a high veteran population in our state. and i just said, look -- and they've been really good about this. i said, if there's a problem, let us know. the worst thing you can do is to just kind of put it in the closet. we can work through problems together. but if we don't know, we can't fix them. for instance, just in the -- you know, i was elected to the senate two years ago or a year and a half ago. before that i was blessed to represent a congressional district in northwest indiana. in the six years i was there, we

basically tripled the health care services in the district from the va. and there's still a demand for even more. and so this is going to be something that really, really requires tons of time, effort, funds. and it is our moral obligation. they stood up for us to protect our nation. and now we have to stand up for them. >> amen. senator joe donnelly, thank you so, so much. >> thank you. still ahead wrk working with a political icon. 15 years after john f. kennedy jr.'s death. his former creative director at george magazine is reminiscing about their time together. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. ♪ i make a lot of purchases for my business. and i get a lot in return with ink plus from chase like 60,000 bonus points when i spent $5,000 in the first 3 months after i opened my account. and i earn 5 times the rewards on internet, phone services

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here with us, matt berman, the author of "j.f.k., jr., a memoir." why did you want to do a book now? >> well, enough time of passed on the situation. i'm in the same line of work.

i've been doing advertising and magazines for the last 15 years. i always go back to this creative time when we did these amazing projects. >> it's hard to believe it's coming up on the death of j.f.k., jr. and -- is that what you mean, having enough time to give deference to the loss? >> certainly nothing like this was on my mind. every job you take in social media and getting messages out there, i always think back to the magazine cover, that's what people saw, that's what people talked about, i felt it's also a good moment to talk about those times, like these big magazine times that are sadly not what

they were in the 90s. >> can you talk about that and the role that george played in trying to create something new. talk about what george was like as a magazine and some of the fun stories you remember from that time. >> i was hired to do the logo and the prototype of the magazines. i was kind of a young gun on staff and they put me in a room with j.f.k., jr. and his business partner and his right arm, rose marie. so we were sitting designing logo and prototypes to eventually sell to advertisers. when it came time to staff the magazine, j.f.k., jr. just

looked over and said, "i don't know, why don't we just go with matt." he had this idea with his business partner, and if you think about it, it was ahead of its time. this was way before colbert and jon stuart and i think it probably why he worked with a young art director, because there wasn't a lot of preconceived ways of doing something. that's why he would start with such a young staff. we were really sort of shooting from the hip and doing it. >> the book is fascinating. it's a look into this casual

relationship and kind and business-like at times and funny at other times. it's a great read. the book is "j.f.k., jr., george and me, a memoir." thanks for taking the time this morning. >> thanks, guys. ameriprise asked people a simple question: can you keep your lifestyle in retirement?

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5:00 a.m. on the west coast, as you take a live look at new york city. willie, thomas and heilemann are back with us. a total of four men who support tea party candidate chris mcdaniel have been charged for their alleged control in photographing thad cochran's wife. his wife, by the way, is in hospice. who sneaks a camera into who is pes? last week blog ger balle eger - accused, mark mayfield, is an

attorney and vice chairman of the state tea party. he has reportedly donated to mcdaniel's campaign, hosted a fund-raiser and helped campaign for him. but he claims his arrest is politically motivated. he has condemned his alleged breach of privacy. as we have said since day one, the violation of the privacy of mrs. cochran is out of bound for politics and is reprehensible. any individuals involved should be prosecuted to the fullest extense of the law. in had recent interview, he denied any belong to the blogger why he denied knowing about the engs dent hours after his campaign manager had called him about it. >> base clically she said some

things about miss cochran. >> but she didn't tell you there was an arrest? >> paul, let moo finish. i can explain this. i said mentally, our position on this has always been the same. let's just back um and i can tell you what's going on here. please give me the courtesy and i'll tell you. >> i can't imagine your campaign manager didn't tell you -- >> i was asleep. she called me -- >> what did she say? >> she said, chris, we have an issue regarding miss cochran. >> when you got to the craft fair, she neff called you, you never kamd her back? >> paul, no. we i don't feel this important

is you can tell they're lying. isn't this what a governor does after being in a scandal for like 8, 10 years? this guy hasn't even been elected and his in the middle of this horrible scandal. mika, i have to say this may be a real positive development because creeps have been going around with video cameras in politics now, especially for the last five, six years and follow mayors' wives in grocery stores and videotape them, just get in their face, follow them 24 hours a day. there are candidates that will be going with their family to breakfast on a saturday or sunday morning and somebody will sit in the next booth and let them see them holding video cameras. i think there has to be a zone of privacy. if we want the best and bright

toast reason f brightest to run for public office, there has to be a zone of privacy. somebody has to be held accountable. this guy is obviously lying, mika. >> not telling the truth. there's no way. sorry. i know we should wait but it really -- how do you even look at that and not realize that guy is literally trying to dance around what is a horrific truth and that is he did at the very least know about it and didn't even want to admit that. but someone sneaking into a pos pish? >> it probably one of the deepest personal places that a family can be at. and and to sneak a camera in there -- >> isn't it the natural

progression, converted progression that people in fringe groups in campaigning have been doing for years? >> yes. i think you're right to say this is not the first of its kind. there have been some famous stories in the last four, five, six years where surreptitious recordings have been made to try to take down organizations, to take down individuals. the thing we refer to in name are trackers, someone who is paid to city as close as possible to the candidates and individual find them -- the far extreme of that. but once you start crossing these lines, you start to get it and to some pretty ugly places. the woman is in hospice, she

apparently has dementia, that is no off attack of that kind opinion maybe this will be the place where we go back across the line and hopefully it will go to a more acceptable zahn. >> what's made clear which bithis reporting is that at the very least he knows these three guys who were arrested yesterday. so there a lot more questions to beansed. he certainly looked on his heels in that raidoff interview yesterday. my question is as a matter of political strategy, what advantage is that going to give a campaign to have that photo released? >> yeah, what is it? >> i don't know what it is. if it was orchestrated, what good do think they is gl going to come out of it if. >> it was ignorant.

they were trying to suggest that thad cochran had abandoned. >> rar he had direct or indirect knowledge of what was going on, he certainly looked slippery at the end. >> very. >> three vanchts officials failed to show up to explain why the agency hasn't yet turned offer all the e-mails subpoenaed by a house committee, giving rise to claims of stone walling. senator mark kerr is calling into question $16 million in bonuses paid to the v.a. near chicago asking whether wait times there were manipulated to earn extra pay. and house speaker john baner

said he's getting closer to call for the resignation of secretary shinseki. >> the reports are appalling. these are men and women who served our country and -- we've not justice let them down, we've let them die. this is awful stuff. >> the president's deputy chief of staff also visited the facility at the center of the investigation, the phoenix hospital. joe. >> meekia what i don't understand is is if john boehner is saying that people were not on let down but they died, why won't he call for shinseki's resignation? most republicans are. i don't understand -- you have democratic candidates all over the country chasing their tails,

being silent. i don't know. this doesn't seem like it would be a partisan issue. why aren't they demanding shinseki's resignation? he's been up there six years money. >> julie pace, i've sure you've heard the questions coming from the white house and the white house is hearing the questions. what's their take? >> i think in terms of people holding back and calling for shinseki's resignation, i think part it have has do with the fact that we are talking about a4 star general and that -- his tenure as head of the agency is the question that some of these lawmakers are rapling with. there's a policemenry review that shinseki is overseeing, we're supposed to get that next week, there's a broader view

that ron nabors is supposed to turn offer in june. this is a question that all of them are getting asked. this is almost the new obamacare question, what is your opinion on shinseki. will the democrats be able to give them some cover over the next couple of weeks. >> most of the -- >> we started to see in the last day or two some democrats -- there are two democrats in congress in georgia who are in tough race who is have called for shinseki's resignation. there was a democrat in new jersey yesterday who called for his resignation but very few. can you be sure that every democrat who is running in november is going to get this question probably over memorial day weekend. >> meanwhile, as julie points out, the optics of what the resumé and we know how the

administration responds to perceived -- they get their back up and decide not to react to public pressure. do you think that's the wisest point they can make as this point as they continue to vet what can roll out? >> the fact you're making that the president tends to want to stick with people. he throws peoplend the bus occasionally but not that often. i don't know if it the wisest choice in this case, though. again, we keep talking about crossing lines. the problem is the v.a. had been going on for a very, very long time but this is to the point where it's going to be very hard for shinseki to survive. >> on the cover of "usa today," bob dole gives an interview and calls the situation a "diss ann anner."

he said high he has mixed feelings on whether shin ski can sur rife. >> you shouldn't keep a veteran -- i don't want to be critical of the president but he waited 23 days before he responded. he should have done is sooner. >> now that the sunlight is being cast on it, everyone should double down until it's completely routed out and it going to be an enormous, enormous endeavor. >> julie pace, your latest piece for the a.p. has some interesting nuggets on the white house's attempts to win over congress with it comes to foreign policy. administration officials are holding private meetings sometimes o over wash and

republican "oup the white house refous to provide concrete details on afghanistan and nigeria. julie, take us through this. >> what's going happening in the past week is they have been meeting with senate democrats and a handful of republicans and the broader caucus. the point is to soothe lawmaker frustration over foreign policy ahead of a big speech the president is going to give at west point next week. but the people that we talked to on the hill, including one senator who participated in the meeting and then aides briefed by their bosses, they said they went to the meeting, had very specific questions just about

the foreign policy of formally ends this year. and we were told that there really were no actual answers provided. and as a general matter, what these lawmakers were also looking for was more of a strategy. what is the white house's approach to foreign policy at this time? we know there's been a lot of criticism with this. it seems like lawmakers laughed with a general sense of dissatisfacti dissatisfaction. >> julie, why is that? as a white house reporter, i'm sure you hear all these complaints. what is the cause for them not having answers to basic questions? >> i don't think it's that they don't have answers. it just seems as though they're not willing to give lawmakers answers. one of the specific complaints that we heard is that there were questions asked about what the

pentagon was doing with nigerian girls and they were told broadly there was going to be more that was going to be done but they weren't told what was announced two years later was that america was sending 80 military personnel to chad. if something is happening, why can't you at least tell senators who work on these esh use. >> i think this underlaws a. >> there's not an overarching idea that underlies the foreign policy, not a thread that connects syria with afghanistan, with eu and with china. because there's not, lawmakers are left scratching their heads and it leads to a lot of frustration. >> still ahead on "morning joe," pope francis is already breaking tradition and making headlines with his trip to the holy land this weekend.

and up next, thousands prepare to evacuate as wildfires in arizona burn out of control, bearing down on homes and businesses. we're going to update you on where the containment stands. but first, here's bill karins with the weather. bill. >> and a very busy week we've had. the fires, the flooding. now we go into member call day weekend. only a few big cities will have trouble with their travel today. later this afternoon, additional showers and storms, new york city and northward. also from denver to kansas city. as far as bad weather, severe storm goes, if we're going to get any large hail, damaging winds, we're watching you in south carolina. as far as airports go, if we're going to have any big airport delays, most likely charlotte with those thunderstorms late in the day. i'm not expecting a lot of travel trouble through the day. let me take you through your

member call day weekend. the green shows you where the best chance of rain is. in north texas and western oklahoma, you're going to get the iran. you don't want it but you definite definitely. >> as we hit memorial day, mid 80s in the atlantic region, so that's good. i think the memorial day weekend is shaping up for many of us to have a fantastic picnic or barbecue. more on "morning joe" when we come right back. all stations come ov ♪ in god's country, yeah ♪ this is for real this time. step seven point two one two.

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take to take another look at the "morning papers." another reason why our views on food and health are skewed. this is "the new york post." this poor beautiful little girl is told by the city of new york that the test they take for bmi at schools that she fat. and she wasn't supposed to read it. some of the tests are so skewed we have to look at a lot of different factors in order to make that determination. it just shows what a huge, huge, uplittle battle we have in terms

of getting it right. >> seriously why would you -- >> but she's the least -- she's not the least bit fat by no definition. >> and she's an athlete and her paerchts are furious. we'll be constantly covering the issue of food and at some point i'll try and get it right as well. it's hard. it becomes a very controversial conversation. here's a look at the wall street journal. there are growing concerns about sunday's election in ukraine, following an unprecedented assault by pro-russian militants. mass gunmen killed dozens in what is now the deadliest attack on the military since the unrest began. attacks owe with several other villages, with kiev accusing

moscow with trying to disrupt elections. joe. >> and in flag staff, arizona, crews remain optimistic they'll be able to get the wildfirend control. hundreds of firefighters are at the scene telling thousands of residents to be ready to evacuate. so far there have been no reports of injury or damaged buildings. >> from the "dallas news," julian castro delivered his speech and the president is expected to name him as housing chief this afternoon. >> "time" magazine and "sports

illustrated" prepare to separate from their parent company, time warner. now time and s.i. will be the first large scale magazines to place ads on their cover. >> the "boston globe." bob gates is the new president of the boy scouts of america. >> that's great. >> he will be the organization's first president to have held the position in national politics. he's held several on both sides of the aisle. this man's amazing. what a get for the boy scouts. gates earned the rank of eagle scout when he was a teen-ager. >> and this from the "new york times." that's great, isn't it? and this from the "new york times." they sad news for willie, for barnicle, for heilemann. las vegas out. oum! and withdrawing from cincinnati for the race in vimed to though

the news leaves cleveland a much better place, dallas in the running. >> and a man in alabama found a way to proclaim his innocence while be arrested this week. >> i'm innocent. >> [ inaudible ]. >> what? >> he did not. >> the man was taken into custody during a raid to wind up people with warrants for drug related charges. willie, you sent this to me. as dead spin said, the real star was the sheriff's deputy who after he said "roll tide" gave a knowing nod. >> what's going on at your

house? >> i'm innocent. >> roll tide. >> it's great that he got the handcuffs behind his back. it's like the roll tide perp walk. >> if you guys could keep that on file, i think it's going to be useful. we need that. >> are you saying so when i get arrested, they can do sort of a side by side? >> that would be good. >> roll tide. >> it doesn't work as good when you get arrested on the upper west side. >> what is -- >> go lions, go team. >> in parade magazine, a moving memorial day tribute to two best friends and soldiers who are buried next to each other in arlington national cemetery after dying defending our country. everybody just stop for a second and read that article. that will do it. let's take a look at politico now.

willie? >> joining us now for a look at the play book, the editor in chief there, john harris. >> good morning. >> happy memorial day. >> former treasury secretary tim geithner has faced a lot of criticism over wall street bailouts, including from jon stewart on "the daily show." >> you have to make sure you're preventing people from running from the system, the system from collapsing. >> you don't want the system to collapse. >> you don't do it for the bans or bankers. you do it to protect them from their mistakes. >>. >> here's where the perceptions start to shift. you're being told this economy is going to crater and even though the arsonists are on the plane with us, we have to land the plane. then it felt like you took the arsonist off the plane and get them a massage and steak dinner.

>> why tim geithner drives people nuts. the argument seems to be he didn't go after those getting huge bonuses with government money. so what's the snans. >> the book debuted on the "new york times" best seller list. this is a forward looking book because it is the central debate in 2016. two views. one is that you kind of treat wall street like a math problem. sure, it's hard and diftd but you want to be as rational and efficient as possible for the larger economy. the other says, no, this is a moral question. these people were wrong. they did effectively evil things for the economy. there's got to be a moral dimension for the response. we're going to hear this debate for the next two years within the democratic party.

>> and who does that impact? if you believe it extend noose 2016, are we talking about hill hl? if so, what side does it come down on? hillary clinton is more of a geithner problem, this is something to be managed, leave more ralt to the side. there are these forces that really want old testment style justice are gaining strength. if she tries to straddle both, that's a flashback to 2008 and how she tried to straddle the iraq war. which side is she on? we just don't know yet. >> what do you get when a hope, an e-mom and a rabbi travel to the holy land? it's not a joke. we'll break down the pope's

historic visit next. don't go away. we'll be right back. ♪ ♪ vo: once upon a time

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welcome back to "morning joe." pope francis is going to the middle east this weekend on his first visit to the holy land. talk about a game changer. even his first trip to the middle east as a pope is going to be game changer. to talk to us about it now from rome, father kevin o'brien from georgetown university. also with us from washington, host of "inside story" on al jazeera america. talk about the importance of going there with leaders of other faiths and how this is breaking tradition. >> yeah.

well, bonjourno from rome, joe. understand that this trip is primarily religious. he's going to meet with the patriarch who is the fifth among faithfuls among eastern christianity. that will be an important moment to bringing the christian churches together. surrounding that visit are all sorts of other political and religious encounters, particularly, as you said, some meetings as other popes have done with rabbis and leaders of islam and judaism in the city of jerusalem. >> we have a long day but ray suarez has a question for you. >> is there pending business, father? is this just a meeting between two important figures? or are there agenda item, pending business between the leaders of the and and the

western churches? what do they have to talk about? >> well, they have a lot to talk about. understand that it was 50 years ago that their predecessors lifted the ex-communications on each other. so for a thousand years the christian churches have been divided between the east and the west. so while it seems to us to be small steps, each of these meetings are very important to bringing the east and western churches together. the pope as part of the papal entourage is bringing along two friends from buenos aires, an e-mom and a rabbi. this pope has always been concerned about interreligious dialogue. >> the pope has infused new life and certainly no energy into catholicism and po catholics

around the world. talk about the interfaith bridge he's trying to represent and the fact that he's bringing along these two friends as part of his religious entourage into an area where some people don't him to visit. >> i think what pope francis's style is trying to find common ground among people of equal justice where people can find some common ground. i think what you're going to hear a lot about on this trip are two words, you'll hear about peace and poverty. this pope took the name of st. francis assisi, a pope known for his peace. also different on this trip you

will see at least three times by my accounting three times the pope has asked to meet with ordinary people who are poor and marginalized. both christians and nonchristians. in bethlehem, he has turned down an invitation to a fancy dinner with other priests and dignitaries and he just wants to have lunch with ordinary family in bethlehem. you're going to see -- >> father, it's ray suarez. you talk about this trip and many of the spots he'll be visiting are ones people will be visiting. when you go to the grand mosque and then go to the western wall really in distance just a couple of hundred yards away, don't you have to step very carefully because these are more than tourist spots.

they're highly fraught, highly disputed symbolic places. >> absolutely. he's meeting with every head of state and meeting with netanyahu, abbas and the palestinian authority. we're not naive. this trip, though religious primarily, it is deep lip political. his word that he loves to talk a lot about is encounter, that is meeting people where they're at. what you might see is some bringing together of people in ways that haven't been before. the pope tends to go off script from prepared remarks to speak to the party. and at the heart of this pope is one committed to poor and to piece. you're going to see that not only in his words but in his actions.

you're right, that visit to the mosque and western wall are going to be very significant. other popes have also made those visits. >> ray, it's john heilemann here. i'm curious to expand on that point a little bit. there's always a political dimension to a papal visit. some of them are not totally without controversy. we've soon some palestinians who are upset about the way the pope is going to be visiting a palestinian ref jugee camp. they say he's not spending enough time there. orthodox jews are upset because he's visiting a place that is called the last supper. talk about the potential for actual controversy and conflict and what the meaning and significance of that might be over the course of the next few days. >> well, it's interesting that the parties you mention, both

jewish and muslim leaders, have dismissed those people who have complained as fringe elements within their own ranks. interestingly, the israeli government has had to openly deny reports that the sen i call on my zion will not be transferred. they to defend the idea that israel is going to keep stewardship over this place. when a pope travels, it's complicated, it's diplomatic, but it's also got to be handled. >> all right. way suarez, thank i so much for being with us. we hope up come back soon. and father, we appreciate you

coming to us today from the vatican city. >> coming up, companies going out of their way to do business from russia. the friday edition of "morning joe" rolls on. ♪ ♪

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actually be wearing a shirt during himself interview, fly fishing -- >> he did. >> he kept it between the line, didn't he? >> he did. he said russia wasn't going for self-isolation, he said he was an optimist, they could repair relations but continued to blame the u.s. and the west for ins ci -- instigating the ukrainian situation. he even made fun of our on jeff cut mauormore a little bit. >> some american companies, some of them are sticking in russia and sort of, you know, not going anywhere. tell bus about that. >> the credit card companies interestingly enough. heard from visa and master card saying we will continue to

operate in russia. it's been tricky for the credit card companies. there was disruption in service. moscow had to put more of a security deposit in the central bank. they will work with russian authorities to try to come up with a whole new payment system for russia so they can stay in the country and continue to do business there. visa and mastercard continuing operations. hewlett packard, more job cuts. 11,000 to 16,000 more job cuts for h.p. >> not good news there. sara, have a great memorial day weekend. >> you, too. >> an incredible save by a good samaritan in china as a babb wanders out into a window and falls two stories. we'll show you the drop and the catch coming up next. life with crohn's disease or ulcerative colitis

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so this is the the must-see video of the day. everyone is talking about this. it's a wild one out of china. news reporters say a baby was searching for his mom in the middle of a thunderstorm when he

made his way out to the ledge. a passerby ses child, gets in position to save the kid. >> you know the child is in danger when you see them free falling two stories in mid air. >> i know. >> great catch, though! look at that! >> the man catches the boy, prevents him from hitting the concrete. there you see the mom carrying the child away. >> perfect two-hand basket chair. >> whatever they did, god bless him. earlier this week we looked at the final set of polling ahead of the primaries. we break down whether the surveys actually got it right. >> tuesday's primary elections didn't yield many surprises. as most polls predicted, mitch mcconnell successfully defend ts his place as the republican nominee in kentucky. he crushed his treat party challenger matt bevin by more than 25 points. a closer look at the numbers in

the blue grass states show democrats turned out more voters overall in the senate contest. >> as expected, alison lundergran grimes won her nomination and will mace mcconnell in what's expected to be a tough and expensive race. ffs a different story in georgia. most polls predicted david perdue would win the primary contest but it was congressman jack king staun who outperformed most of the polling. in oregon, monica wehby withstood vicious last-minute attacks to secure the nomination. however, the republican turnout was 6 points higher. ron widen secured more than 80,000 votes in his primary than

incumbent merkley did. and asa hutchinson and mike ross each scored roughly the same number of total votes in their respective primaries. all in all the results opened as many questions as they closed and no matter how you slice them, the results should serve as a cautionary tale to both parties that, the electorate is open minded and looking for solutions. back to you. >> john heilemann, it really is a volatile electorate. i would say no more than any state than arkansas, which of course most of us chakd up as a red state a long time ago. it's not looking like a red state. it's looking decidedly purple this year. >> much more like a purple state, much more like a state during the time of bill clinton's dominance. you could end up going democratic on both those races. it's going to be i think very tight there. >> this is going to end up being

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no regular blood monitoring; no known dietary restrictions. for information and savings options download the xarelto® patient center app, call 1-888-xarelto, or visit goxarelto.com honestly, the off-season isn't i've got a lot to do. that's why i got my surface. it's great for watching game film and drawing up plays. it's got onenote, so i can stay on top of my to-do list, which has been absolutely absurd since the big game. with skype, it's just really easy to stay in touch with the kids i work with. alright, russell you are good to go! alright, fellas. alright, russ. back to work! welcome back to "morning joe." it's time to talk about blah what we learned today.

thomas, what did you learn? >> i learned a lot today. we have to say thank to you emma goss, our intern. she has to leave today but we appreciate all the work she's done for us here. emma, thank you. >> joe, what did you learn? >> my biggest takeaway is that the las vegas option for the republican national convention, off the table. a good cause for all of us who want to kill ourselves, i would say. >> you must have known this news yesterday morning. that's why you were too broken hearted to show up on the show. >> that's correct. >> if it's way too early, "it's morning joe." stay with us. chuck todd is next on "the daily rundown." have a great memorial weekend. we'll see you on tuesday. secretary shinseki presses on as a sad scandal hangs overs v.a. this memorial day weekend. a high