[ male announcer ] celebrate every win with nicoderm cq, the unique patch with time release smartcontrol technology that helps prevent the urge to smoke all day long. help prevent your cravings with nicoderm cq. thanks for disrupting your afternoon. i'm karen finney. in this hour, a grieving father called out a politician and the nra with new questions on the signs that might have been missed and the disturbing rants of a shooter raised the voices of, yes, all women. >> new details emerging about the deadly rampage near a california college. >> you don't think it will happen to your child until it does. >> roger had three semi-automatic handguns. they were all in his own name and they were purchased legally. >> the suspect had over 400 remaining rounds of ammunition. >> when will enough people say stop this madness! we don't have to live like this! >> questions are being asked

about whether authorities could have headed off this horrible tragedy. >> the family of the suspect says they warned police before the shooting. >> he did not meet the criteria for an involuntary mental health hold. >> law enforcement are being asked to be law enforcers and psychiatric social workers. >> we should say to ourselves not one more! victims families, law enforcement and a santa barbara community are continuing to pick up the pieces after friday night's tragic shooting rampage which left six dead and wounded 13, all by a tormented 22-year-old man who apparently also took his own life. we want to begin with the latest in the investigation and an update on the victims from nbc's jennifer borkland on the ground.

>> reporter: the sheriff came out and told thus morning that they plan on doing as thorough as investigation into this series of shootings as they would if they had a suspect to prosecute in court. they are looking at every shell casing, the angle of every bullet, every stab wound, because they say they owe that to the families of the victims and also to try to learn what went wrong here and how they can prevent this from ever happening again. they're also picking through that 137-page long manifesto that was left by the suspect. that video that was uploaded where he talks about what he is planning to do on friday night, that was uploading simultaneously as these attacks were unfolding. it was -- none of the very threatening information that we had about him that we have about him now was available as he started on his rampage. so that's one thing that deputies want to make clear. they had done a welfare check three weeks ago because someone

in his family was concerned about the videos that he was posting on youtube. the welfare check went well. he actually referred to that in the manifesto saying he was frightened that those police officers that came to his door, those sheriff's deputies, would find his guns and his plans would be thwarted. so he took the videos down that made it seem like he was angry. he didn't want to tip anybody off. he was able to convince then that it was a misunderstanding, everything was okay. >> very quickly, jennifer, how are the victims doing? some are in the hospital. how are they doing? >> reporter: what we've heard is that there are still two who are in serious condition and that would leave 11 more who are doing pretty well. but two still very serious condition this hour. >> jennifer bjordlund, thank you so much. our panel is here.

as we learn more about the suspect and victims there are more questions being raised about just how this could happen again. one of the victim's fatherings, richard martinez, summed it up like this. >> why did chris die? chris died because of craven irresponsible politicians and the nra. they talk about gun rights. what about chris' right to live? when will this instant stop? when will enough people say stop this madness! we don't have to live like this! too many have died! we should say to ourselves not one more! thank you. that's it. >> you know, jimmy, that video just breaks your heart. when i first saw him yesterday, it just -- but -- and the pain

and anguish if his voice. i appreciated the fact that he didn't just talk about the nra. but politicians. because i do think that is part of the equation that we don't talk about enough, that people have got to learn to stand up to the nra and have some courage. >> yes. they should. not many profiles in courage in congress these days, unfortunately. something interesting that's happened, the nra has taken its focus off of the u.s. congress. it's focused solely on the states. georgia just passed its latest law allowing people to walk into a bar where you can buy alcohol as much as you'd like and you can carry a gun. into a church, et cetera, et cetera. this is why it is imperative. i do not say this lightly. people are dead. but the bottom line is, if the republicans take the senate back in the fall, guess what's going to happen? the nra is going to shift its focus from the states where it's already passed these crazy laws and it is going to start asking the house and senate to do these kinds of things, a republican house, a republican senate. the good news is we'll have

barack obama to say no. that's the good news. >> right. the bad news is they'll be there. >> right. >> i want to take a look at what was found in the suspect's car. i think that's as shock being as anything, how this young man was able to legally akwar three handguns. he was willing -- had 400 rounds of unused ammunition. erica, it is astounding to me -- california is one of the states with the best, most restrictive laws, and yet this young man was able to purchase those three guns in an illegal manner, all of that ammunition and it didn't set up any red flags anywhere. >> absolutely. i know we are still doing our part to learn as much as we can about what happened in this case but i think what happens with these tragedies that my organization every town for gun safety is trying to do is talk about the larger problem of gun violence in our country. 86 americans are killed every day with gun violence and frankly these tragic events are what bring us to this table to talk about it but gun violence is a serious epidemic in our

country and we need to do more to make sure we are keeping guns out of dangerous hands. >> tara, this young man was able to purchase these weapons. we know california has these tough laws. yet one of the areas that the nra tends to block is the research to have a national database so that law enforcement would have the kind of resources -- i was sort of shocked when i thought about the fact that they've had three sort of interactions with this young man. the police were at his door having no idea that he had guns inside the house. if they had any idea, then they obviously would have gone and searched for them. >> that's a great point. one interesting thing about california is they do have a law that's very effective but it doesn't get the funding it deserves. that's primarily because of the budget woes in the state following the recession. many states had these problems. but one of the laws which should be a national law basically if you commit a crime after getting a registered gun, legally, if you then are legal caught -- you get a protective order, restraining order, they then go

back and get that gun from you. that's a law that we need to be pushing for but the problem is -- you are so right about this -- the nra has focused so much on the state level and not enough attention is being paid to what they're doing at the state level so obfuscate all of these different efforts to control or manage gun violence better in this country. >> to that point, i know a number of organizations are trying to change that. talk a little bit about that. >> we are making progress. most of the headlines have been about georgia but there have actually been a good number of laws passed in five states already in this legislative session to keep guns out of the hands of domestic abusers. it is a little bit different but for a long time it's been very easy for people who have been convicted of domestic violence crimes to keep their guns and we are making progress. you are absolutely right that the nra, the washington gun lobby is doing its dirty work in the states and every town for gun safety and the moms demand action are meeting them where

they are and effect these laws. >> we need to support you. people need to support you. >> i want to talk about the mental health aspect. one of the things, really important yesterday as part of the statement the lawyers talked about the fact the young man was on the ow tichl speautism spect. we aren't saying there is a connection between the two. >> our thoughts and prayers go out to the victims of this tragic violence. it is inaccurate to report there is any correlation between asperger's syndrome or any autism spectrum disorder and planned violence. even the implication is discriminatory against those are autism since the fact is that these people living with autism are far more likely to be victims of violence. these reports are harmful in that they take the focus away from the real needs of the 3 million people in this country with autism. elizabeth, we wanted to get that out of the way but we know that mental health issues did play a role in this. the parents obviously had reason for concern. this was a young man who as we understand was in therapy.

there were reasons to be concerned. >> right. there were reasons to be concerned but to be concerned -- but i don't think it is totally clear mental illness was a huge issue. what we know so far is misogyny was. we saw from the 140-page manifesto, there was clearly a profound hatred of women. people of mental illness are more likely to be victimized than to be perpetrators of violence. so it is important not to make this entire discussion about mental illness. clearly we have a public health problem in this country and it is deaths by gun violence. >> i don't think people with autism would consider themselves as having a mental health problem. yesterday we did have an opportunity to talk with a mental health expert. there are maniy behaviors that are typical of someone with mental health issues. this goes back to this idea of learning and research and what can we learn. just last week. a bill was blocked by republicans that would have given more money to the cdc to

actually do more research so that in the aftermath of things like that we can be doing things to understand. the nra are say, well, if people had guns, they'd be able to defend themselves. >> as long as the republicans control the house and that funding source, then if they take the senate. the other thing to keep in mind in this fall's elections. i'm going to keep doing this and i'm going to get in trouble with the right-wingers on this. reason they want the house and senate to be in gop lands is because what they're going to do between 2014 this fall and 2016 is literally try to scare the living hell out of the country in thinking that barack obama and hillary clinton are going to take their guns. that's the whole point here. it is some sort of jedi mind trick that the nra is pulling. >> it is part of the hysteria that they generate. >> votes have consequences in the fall. >> erica, last point to you. i know that you put out a report

this week looking at the gaps in our background check system and background checks is the one thing it seems like everybody can agree on that we continue to have trouble getting passed. talk about the findings of those reports. >> it is important that we are talking about this today but it is important to note that only 1% of people killed by homicides are killed in mass shootings. the largest mass shooting in american history was at virginia tech and that shooter got his gun -- and he would have been a prohibited purchaser but his mental health record was not in the system. what our organization has done is taen fbi data and told the states especially states that are doing a very poor job of it, when you don't submit your records into the mental health national criminal background check system you are leaving fatal gaps and every missile record is a tragedy waiting to happen. that wasn't the case with this young man but we know that there's more that we can do to keep guns out of dangerous hands and we need the states to step up and submit their records. >> that's such an important point. we have to leave it there. again, the nra will come out and say this one thing wouldn't have

changed what happened. that's why i think many of us say that's why we need a wide range of things to make sure we're doing so that we can athlete decrease the likelihood of these things happening. the panel is sticking with me. when we come back, #yesallwomen. a strong response to the face of hatred. stay with us. and later, what it really means to honor our troops. ♪ [ girl ] my mom, she makes underwater fans that are powered by the moon. ♪ she can print amazing things, right from her computer. [ whirring ] [ train whistle blows ] she makes trains that are friends with trees. ♪ my mom works at ge. ♪

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one of the most important conversations to be had in the aftermath of friday's shootings is the deconstructing of the deep hatred of women that was reflected in the shooter's manifesto. intensity and the viciousness of his comments and attitudes can't simply be dismissed as

disturbing. over the last 24 hours the #yesallwomen has taken off as women and men share their personal stories and speak out against misogyny in our culture. their messages say it far better than i could so i wanted to share a few with you. tess sharp tweets -- because i wore a fake wedding ring when i waitressed belonging to another man was the only way to get customers off my back. hanna berry -- because somehow people still use the word feminist as an insult as if asking for equal respect is a disgusting idea. >> from lindy -- because we still treat misogyny like it is built into male biology. >> and because girls grow up knowing it is safer to give a fake phone number than to turn a guy down. it is true. >> rather than seeing elliott rod ger as a victim of society, the media has depicted him as a

bloodthirsty madman, a mere glitch in the system and yet the facts show a different story. my panel is back with me and i'm going to start with you. talk about your piece, what you meant when you wrote that. >> i think we like to believe in the myth that school shootings just occur, they are an anomaly an these people are just glitches in the system, we write them off as crazy people, as madmen. when you look at the data, there is a lot of research out there that shows they're very similar. they have a lot in common. school shootings follow patterns. most shooters are male. >> you made six points. we have it here actually. >> great. >> nope, that's different.

men commit school shootings. most school shooters are white. most victims of school shootings are female. many school shooters target females who have rejected them in the past. most gunmen exhibit a large sense of entitlement. many school shootings could qualify as hate crimes against women and girls. >> right. what we saw online was a lot of people contesting that. that's why the hashtag was important for especially women to have a space to tell their stories. there's something about when it is a white male. we don't qualify it with anything. if it was a black man committing violence we'd say he's a thug, we would say that -- we talk about gang violence. if it was a muslim man we would be talking about a religious extremist. and there's something about white maleness that just is invisible, sort of irreproachable standard that we don't hold accountable. >> one of the things that struck me overnight is just how this exploded overnight and just the intensity of the comments that people were willing to share. again, it was both women and men which said -- made it very clear

there was something going on here beyond just this incident. >> i think it was his comments were so odious that men who have normally not accepted when women have complained about the treatment that we get just walking down the street. i could walk down the street or get on the subway on any given day and be harassed by a man, screamed at which has happened to me on multiple occasions. no one comes to my defense. and when i point it out, typically i'm complaining or whatever. but men i think seeing all these women come online and making these consistent arguments, and it was global. many of the women joining in were from all over this world. but the other issue though that i saw that was really disturbing, there was also this pushback. while there were a lot of men who were rational, reasonable men who may have not seen the gravity of this but now do, that was great. but at the same time there was all these men saying well i understand how he feels, and maybe you women will think twice before you treat a man this way. there was a lots of that

happening and that is the very behavior that you are highlighting. that's the problem. >> jimmy, that goes to something that we saw -- i'll read a little piece of the manifesto in a moment. but this sort of sense of entitlement. if i as a man grace you with my attention, you better respond the way i want you to respond. i know you're not like that. >> as the only dude at the table, i've never felt like such a massive minority. look. old bigots and old racists produce new bigots and new racists. let's just call did what it is. old misogynists create new misogynist bh misogynist. when daddy does it, that means it is okay for you to do it. let's just call it what it is. we are in a much better place today than 20 years ago, 40 years ago, 60 years ago in the madmen generation. we're not there, we're not even close. that kid is proof positive why we're not close. somebody said to him it's okay to think this way. i don't know if it was his father or his mother.

his classmates. i have no idea. nor does it matter because he's now dead. but somebody's got to wake up and realize that in our churches and in our schools and in our homes and in our businesses, it's not okay to treat women like chattel. because they're not. >> we also i think as part of this -- this is why this is such an important conversation to have -- need to think about what are the ways that young men and young women are receiving these messages. because some of it you get from your family but some of it you get from mass culture. social media. you are surrounded by it. i want to read just a piece of the manifesto. i tried not to talk about him that much because i don't want to give him too much attention but i think it makes the point. he said, "you girls have never been attracted to me. i don't know why you girls have never been attracted to me but i will punish you all for it. it is an injustice, a crime, because i don't know what you don't see in me. i'm the perfect guy and yet you throw yourselves at all these obnoxious men instead of me, the supreme gentleman. >> what's even more troubling is that even in light of this

event, the comments on youtube, the comments under his youtube video, they are terrible. i have been on twitter for nour years. i've never had so many sexist trolls tweet at me. there was even this pick-up artist company that sort of fit into this whole men's rights activist movement and they actually commented, if only you had come to us, if only more men came to us to know how to pick up women, this wouldn't have to happen, as if that kind of violence is valid, as if that kind of violence against women is justified. >> to that point, michael kimmel in "huffington post" wrote the following -- righteous retaliation is a deeply held, almost sacred tenet of masculinity. if you are's grieve eagreed, yo entitled to retribution. >> american women are 11 times more likely to be killed with a gun than any other women if any

other developed country. it is important that we know that the presence of a gun in a domestic violence situation increases the likelihood that that woman will be murdered by five times. 500%. >> something about this combination of the masculinity and guns, violence. >> i can just push back -- i don't think you're wroonng, but think this is an epidemic across the world. look at way muslim men treat muslim women. okay? not just in muslim countries. here. look at the way they treat women. this is all in the name of god, by the way. >> start with the most obvious, which is we shouldn't look at these things as isolated events and there are a number of factors that are similar that we can take a look at and say what are we doing to reinforce those messages? >> again, coming back to actually michael kimmel who has researched this very much, the

term egrieved entitlement is something found in a lot of school shooters. often white men don't just sort of kill the people who they think have wronged them, they want to take their own life and take the lives of others at the same time. it is not just about my life is over and this person who wronged me is over. i'm going to get back at everyone else. if i can't live, so can no one else. this is a white male thing. it doesn't work -- you don't see it across the board as much as we think we do. >> i am grateful to folks who are weighing in on yesallwomen. it is an incredible conversation that needs to be had. the online conversation does not stop when we have commercial breaks. tweet us @msnbcdisrupt and let us know what you think about yes all women. you can also catch us on facebook @facebook.com/msnbc disrupt. i'm m-a-r-y and i have copd.

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as hell in the most even-toned manner i think i've ever heard in my life. >> as president obama visits troops in afghanistan to honor memorial day, we continue to track the fallout of the scandal rocking the veterans administration. the president addressed the issue for the first time on wednesday as his deputy chief of staff traveled to phoenix to investigate claims of cooked books and long wait times at a va facility there. this as new allegations of fraud and abuse surfaced just this week. meanwhile, despite continued calls for his resignation, secretary eric shinseki met with the president and lawmakers to further discuss how to get to the bottom of these being a cases. as we pick apart the political and bureaucratic consequences of this scandal, it is important to not lose sight of the men and women this directly affects, the very soldiers who return home with a myriad of wounds both seen and unseen. as the president made clear this week, our country has a commitment to get to the bottom of the va scandal but we also have a broader mission of caring

for our military families. there are multiple costs that aren't be accounted for when we send young people off to war. physical, emotional and financial. that's part of the over yawl problem the system is experiencing. how does one truly calculate the cost of caring for a young veteran with injuries that last a lifetime? tara and jaiimmy are back with . raul reyes, jennifer hunt, an iraq and afghanistan war veteran. thanks to you all for joining me. i'll start with you jennifer. i would love to get your take on what's been happening with the va. one of the ideas that's been put out there is that the white house is going to allow veterans to temporarily seek care at private hospitals in order to sort of take the pressure off of the backlog. i wonder your thoughts on that idea. >> i think it is a great idea. it is something that has been used before for veterans. i myself accessed care through what's called a voucher system when i was pregnant and at that

time the va did not have the services for obstetrics and gynecology. they are mostly just for gynecological services women need. i was sent outside of the va for health care. i was able to access top-quality care that the va picked the bill up for. it is great to see that veterans are going to be able to access the same services. that being said, this shouldn't be a solution to the problem. there are obvious fixes that need to be made to make sure that veterans can access the va in a timely manner and i think we're going to be -- i would hope to see that those fixes are being made through a congressional legislation as well as changes in policy within the department of veterans affairs. >> one of the things about this though that strikes me is, the sort of top-down approach. i'm not sure that that's going to work. it seems to me that the problem is really out there -- >> it is in the field. >> -- in the field. there is actually something that was written today about that actually. sam foote, who was the

whistle-blower, sais say the differences between trained investigators from the department of justice whose job it is to ferret out waste, fraud and abuse lying to them could trigger criminal penalties. office workers who ask a few coll questions and clinic staff members who may be afraid to speak the truth. >> it is not surprising when you consider what a sprawling system it is. it is important to remember that when veterans can access the va in a timely manner they are generally satisfied with the care. their satisfaction rate is usually above that for private hospitals. problem is within the system. the not is not the system. as we go through this process of identifying the different hospitals where these irregularities occur, i'm a little troubled by already hearing some people like kevin mccarthy making a great edict on the whole system. seeming to suggest we should slim down the v system or parts

of it subcontracted out to private contractors. that's very troubling. >> that's always the dog whistle right there. one of the reasons i wanted to do this and really talk about the true cost of war is part of what strax me is we talk about how much it costs to send men and women to war but they never calculate or think about when those young men and women come back, and are in their 20s and will need care for many, many years, what does that cost? that's never factored in to or discuss. >> you're saying long-term thinking wasn't deployed when we invade iraq? >> i'm just putting it out there. >> we're still paying for the iraq war. we had eight years of this george bush presidency where we had a credit card with no spending limits. now the bill has arrived in your mailbox and it is called astart. people who cheered this war in the first place have a lot of nerve complaining and blaming some guy who showed up

afterwards that are will too many injured people to be cared for in a timely manner. this was a bloody war built on lies in the first place. >> there is a "washington post" piece. this young man, they said we'll go had head to toe and figure out what your injuries are. this chart actually shows how the va calculates monthly payments whether you lost a hand, that's $100. a lost hand and a foot is $700 to $900. it is hard to put it into, jimmy, numbers like that. but i do think as we are having this conversation about a bureaucracy, we can't forget that we're talking about making sure that people get care. >> well, they're humans. so yes. and they may be missing body parts but i'm pretty sure their hearts are still pumping and we forget that. there isn't just a human element to this. what raul just said is very interesting. i'm of the school of thought

that the va is just so broken as an entity that the only way to fix it per se is to give people health care now outside the system. john mccain has just proposed this. if i were barack obama i'd be like, hey, harry reid, bring john mccain's bill up, let's do it, boom. bipartisanship. are you fixing -- you're short-term fixing the problem. there has to be a bigger long-term sort of investigation, if you will, or they got to just figure out how to rebuild this house called the va. >> would you agree that whether it works properly it is a model -- >> absolutely, no doubt about it. but a seven-month waiting list. 1 of the 40 that died in arizona. seven months he was told to wait. he had blood in his urine. he was 71 years old. they came back to him. guess what? he died of stage 4 blared cancer. blood in your urine means you have bladder cancer. the va told him you're going to have to have patience. patience? no. no. . there's no patience when someone has blood in their ur requiine.

they're putting dollar signs on arms? the va called his family on december 6th and said we can see him now. they said he's dead. >> i want to weigh in because i think it is important we don't just look at this in binary terms. yes, clearly responsibility needs to be taken and anyone who do anything wrong needs to be prosecuted. pending investigation. don't be knee-jerk either. the va is known to be very good for preventive care. issue is acute care. that's where the funding comes in. this is what i find problematic is the republicans are very great at throwing a rock and hiding their hand as my grandmother used to say. all of these opportunities to fund the acute care programs -- the modernization effort of the veterans administration -- because as i mentioned earlier, you and i had this conversation offline, i come from a military

family. my grandfather had issues with the va and those clearly predated president obama wasn't even around then. so -- but what happened was when my uncle came back from the vietnam war he had had ptsd. he was diagnosed as a schizophrenic. the reason why the va and other entities now recognize ptsd is because money went in to doing that. i think that on the one hand, yes, people are waiting, get them private care. but at the same time, let's fix the system that works. >> we need funding. that is so critical. >> jennifer is the one of all of us who's had experience with this system. get the last word. to you. >> i would say -- i would echo what tara was saying that these problems predate the obama administration. >> sure. >> they predate the bush administration. there have been -- these issues have been exacerbated, of course, by the influx of afghan and iraq vets but also because under the leadership of secretary shinseki, he was doing the right thing in including presumptive conditions for vietnam veterans with agent

orange exposure. the problems we are seeing now in some of these va systems are a product of them being forward thinking and providing that care that is needed and providing the benefits and services that is needed. the va is changing. when i went in 2008 i did not feel it was a place for me as a younger veteran or as a female veteran. i now have an appointment i'm going on tuesday. i've started accessing va care. i have seen the changes in the hospitals. the culture is going from one of prove that you need care to we will provide you care until we figure out that you don't. and that's taking time. people keep saying it is a large bureaucracy. well, there's a lot of things that go in to providing care. it is going to take a little bit of time. and, yes, changes need to be made if veterans aren't accessing care in a timely manner. but burning down the system and getting veterans into the health care system lets congress and lets the american public off the

hook of providing veterans care for injuries that resulted from wars they went into. >> thank you so much for joining us. the summer's biggest blockbuster. a world where billionaires fight over the future of the heavens and the sun. the stage is set for an epic battle. hey there can i help you? (whispering) sorry. (whispering) hi, uh we need a new family plan. (whispering) how about 10 gigs of data to share and unlimited talk and text. (whispering) oh ten gigs sounds pretty good. (whispering) yeah really good (whispering) yeah and for a family of 4 it's a $160 a month. what! get outta here! (whispering) i'm sorry are we still doing the whisper thing? or? (whispering) o! sorry! yes yes! (whispering) we'll take it.

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america's commitment to the people of afghanistan will endure. once afghanistan has sworn in its new president, i'm hopeful we'll sign a bilateral security agreement that lets us move forward. and with that bilateral security agreement, assuming it is signed, we can plan for a limited military presence in afghanistan beyond 2014. because after all the sack firis we made, we want to preserve the gains that you have helped to win. like 60,000 bonus points when i spent $5,000 in the first 3 months after i opened my account. and i earn 5 times the rewards on internet, phone services and at office supply stores. with ink plus i can choose how to redeem my points. travel, gift cards even cash back. and my rewards points won't expire. so you can make owning business even more rewarding. ink from chase. so you can.

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i understand why obama thinks can he change the weather. because he thinks he's god. he thinks he is the smartest person in the country. he thinks he knows better in washington what we do in texas. he thinks he's the one through all of his executive orders that congress isn't even up to his level. so i'm not surprised he thinks he can also change the weather. >> memorial day marks the unofficial beginning of summer

around the hottest political fight we see this year could be the overheating of our planet. in just over a week, president obama is set to unveil new epa regulations which will limit agr greenhouse gas emissions from power plants. it was found that climate change is not a thing of the future but actually occurring here and now. house republicans even passed a measure that bars the department of defense from using funds to assess the national security implications of climate change. but in a world where billionaire donors go head-to-head to affect the outcome of elections, the battle lines on climate science are being drawn for the 2014 mid-terms. environmental activist rod stier promises to inject $100 million into this year's mid-term races. his goal is to push the issue of climate clang to the front lines of politics.

he'll no doubt be matched by others across the country who continue to double down on their science denial. some say the fight over these epa rules could "rival what we saw over health care." there a battle cry from some goppers about a democratic war on goal from florida governors rick scott and senator marco rubio to the koch brothers and the millions they are pumping into the science denial machine. we're seeing a lot of preliminary movement on the right as they gear up for this clash of the titans. our panel is back to discuss. tara, i -- this is not one that i actually thought of as like this is going to be this big battle. but then realizing that the president's going to put out these epa rules which you know is going to set the right off. they're already angry and particularly for red state dems, this is going to be a tough one. go it is. this is a difficult issue. i do think as democrats we have to be careful with how we frame an talk about climate change. climate change is a little heady, i think, when you talk

about it. it is also a little abstract. what people do understand is when i was growing up in new jersey if you got into the beach or ocean, you could literally be stuck by a syringe. what changed that was government regulations. people in that community understood the importance of pollution and addressing it. also there were areas all over this country where there's cancer clusters of where people live near certain plants, certain facilities and there are these high incidents of cancer. >> oh, i think people are just fear mongering. i want to make it very simple for people watching. we have a list of five places to see before they're actually gone. that maybe makes it as simple as possible. right? the great barrier reef. the poles with continued warming ice will no longer form in antarctica in 20 to 40 years. madagascar. if nothing is done its forests will be gone in 35 years. the dead sea could dry up in 50 years because it is actually not dead. venice italy could be totally flooded and uninhabitable in

2100. >> does florida make number six? >> yes, it is on the list. >> parts of manhattan i'm worried about. the name of the game is shil, baby, shil. it is nice there are billionaires who care about america and spend their money politically for unselfish reasons because they are patriots. patriots is one of the words the democratic party needs to start deploying more as is pollution, as is poison. at this point there are only two safe jobs yet. to be an oil/climate change denir and tattoo removal. they're stuck with this battle now and they can win it if they use the right tough language. >> they've got a big heavy hitter behind them -- the pope. the pope even is talking about this. he said if we destroy creation, creation will destroy us. that's a big dog to have in your

corner. >> he's a little big, yeah. >> this issue of the environment and the climate doesn't need to be -- it shouldn't and political issue. but it is. at the end of the day, obama could propose a three trillion tax cut, not paid for, and rename every airport in the country after ronald ray gand and the republicans would say no, that's not okay. it doesn't matter what barack obama does. it simply -- because they hate him. we have to just accept that, we're out of the closet the fact that republicans despise him. that's life. what can he do? push. push this stuff. if we don't push this stuff, then our grandchildren are screwed already screwed. >> our grandchildren are the heroes. they're writing science reports convincing their parents over the dinner table. >> that's right. >> young people actually get it. it is really older people that just don't get it. the polls sort of show that climate change, climate science is on the bottom of the list of

things that people care about. >> but the tricky thing here is that, i think part of the reason we see this shift on the gop side to this issue is because the whole argument against obamacare has been sort of collapsing now that people seem to like it and they're working out the kinks. they had to come up with something. but it is a tricky issue also because it is sort of shaping up as a cultural type of issue with people on the far right, tea party, that's the group that no matter -- the science is irrelevant. you could get to 100% of scientists saying that climate change is real and they will still -- they will not accept it. we have people like marco rubio, noted scientist, who just two years ago was telling people i'm not a scientist, man. now he's a scientist and he is making pronouncements and he has a following. >> let him try to get insurance on beach front property in florida. >> apparently rick scott is not that worried about his beach front property in florida, is he? all right, guys.

we have to leave it there. thanks so much. it was super fun to have you. my panel, tearatara, john, raul jimmy, thank you so much. i'll see you back here next weekend at 4:00 p.m. eastern. have a great memorial day and many thanks to our troops that serve. a house, under siege. homeowner calls in the big guns. say helto home defense max. with the one-touch continuous-spray wand. kills bugs inside... ...and prevents new ones for up to a year. guaranteed. nothing to see here people. ortho home defense max. get order. get ortho®. what are you going to do?oming. ♪ sure. makes sense. but what about this? if you're looking to buy a car, now is the time and truecar is the way. but don't wait. after the record colds of this past winter, inventory has piled up... and the deals this weekend are amazing.

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