emanuel will appear on "the tonight show" with jimmy fallon this evening. he is making good on his promise after fallon came in march and jumped into lake michigan for the polar bear plunge. he had his suit on. there he is. that's going to do it for this edition of "way too early." "morning joe" from d.c. starts right now. ♪ obviously we should be happy for the family. they've gotten their loved one back. that's important. the methodology in what we used was troublement. negotiating with terrorists. >> it is cause for celebration when a soldier is brought home. >> first of all, we're happy an american was returned to his family. this was not right. >> yes, it is a victory and a defeat. the whole situation has us pumping our fists with joy while

shaking it in anger. it is a celebration that is also very troubling. like a pizza party for hitler's birthday. was it fun? yes. do i regret it? of course. >> good morning, everyone. a live look at new york city. it is tuesday, june 3rd. welcome to "morning joe." we're live in washington this morning. with us on set here at the d.c. bureau, columnist and associate editor of "the washington post" and political analyst jew gene robinson. msnbc political analyst and former chair of the republican national committee michael steele with us. columnist for bloomberg view, al hunt. and jeffrey goldberg joining us this morning. both of you thanks for being with us. we have a lot to get to. there's some political news to report. elizabeth warren emerging amid questions about 2016. i find that fascinating. we'll get to that in just a moment. but first, so many questions about the bowe bergdahl story.

a lot of people, a lot of people on both sides of the aisle asking why did the white house do it. sergeant bowe bergdahl could be back with his family by the end of the week. that is the good news, of course. but the questions surrounding his release will extend far beyond that. the young soldier was captured by the taliban back in june of 2009. multiple reports say that bergdahl sent an e-mail to his parents just days before he went missing writing in part this. i am sorry for everything here. these people need help. yet what they get is the most conceited country in the world telling them they are nothing and that they are stupid. i am ashamed to be an american. and the title of u.s. soldier is just a lie of fools. the horror that is america is disgusting. his father reportedly responded, quote, obey your conscience. three days later his son apparently walked off his base without his weapon. in the months that followed, at

least six american troops were killed in the mission to find their fellow soldier. some of the family members of the fallen are speaking out with others from the platoon. the parents of darren andrews asked this. quote, where is the mhonor in ay of this? it devalues their lives. >> he willfully left. he had premeditated, planned out, and left. he deserted not only the army but he also left myself and my platoon and my company to clean up his mess. >> i have frustration that potentially he could still be alive in bergdahl had not left his post. we lost somebody that we love very much and we'll never see him again. >> bergdahl's former roommate said, quote, more than a handful of soldiers got purple hearts looking for him. national security adviser susan rice has a different take about bergdahl's service. >> this is a very special

situation. sergeant bergdahl wasn't simply a hostage. he was an american prisoner of war. captured on the battlefield. he served the united states with honor and distinction and we'll have the opportunity eventually to learn what has transpired. >> and here's where it gets extremely controversial. in exchange for bergdahl, the u.s. released these five senior taliban members from guantanamo bay. they were seen celebrating in qatar where they will be required to live for at least a year. just four days before bowe bergdahl's release, his father bob reportedly sent out and then deleted a tweet reading, quote, i am still working to free all guantanamo prisoners. god will repay for the death of every afghan child, ameen. supporters of the administration including hillary clinton are defending the exchange as one of the hard choices in government. hard choices is the title of her

forthcoming book. but members of congress complained they were not noti notified of the swap beforehand and there are deep questions whether these militants will pose a new threat for america. let's go around the table. al, i'll let you start. first of all, is it fair to ask the question why did the white house do it? why did they do it? five for one? five dangerous prisoners for one? five guantanamo bay prisoners were deemed the worst of the worst, for one soldier who has a questionable background? i'm sorry. it's wonderful that he's coming home. it's wonderful for his family. but does not this create more problems? >> it's certainly fair to ask. i think everything about this story is complicated. we don't know everything there is to know about this soldier. is he as clear a deserter as some say or what susan rice portrayed? certainly the swap is controversial. i'm not as upset as others by the swapping deal. the israelis swapped for 1,027.

ronald reagan tried to do it. doesn't say it's right. but this war is winding down. i'm less bothered by that. >> there's a difference between the israeli and the american swap here. which is that the israeli soldier who got out, there was no question hanging over his head about whether he was a deserter or traitor or walked off. >> these questions are not news. >> focused on this bergdahl case until it got out. >> the white house would know there were questions that were and letters that were going back and forth. >> hold it. let's back up for a second. >> okay. help me out here. >> i think the policy has to be these are our people. leave no man or woman on the battlefield. >> but do we give up five gitmo prisoners, do we threaten america's national security some would ask? >> then either we bring them home to a ticker tape parade or

court-martial. but we bring them home. >> or both. >> right. okay. so if it weren't five gitmo prisoners, well, you know look at the history of prisoner exchanges. we talked about the israeli example. you know, that's a legitimate question. >> there's a difference. >> you could argue that it's a good deal as thee deals go. >> it's a good deal? okay. >> the complication here is that's all great and the president can stand in front of the country and say leave no man or woman behind. but is it contra vengs of u.s. law. the law requires two things. one, you notify the congress of your efforts, number one. and number two, you do not negotiate with terrorists. so if this is found to fly in the face of that fact, that further complicates and to mika's question, what did the administration -- what were they thinking in terms of how this would play out in the face of the fact you're going to have

this political -- now you're going to create something that has more political fire to it than anything else because you're acting -- >> that's a bogus issue though. >> the law is a bogus issue? are you kidding me? >> if this guy were a great hero, you would say make that deal. >> al, but wait a minute -- >> you're getting hung up -- >> now you have to go back and ask the question why did congress put this in place in the first place. and if that's the case and i would agree with you. i'm taking bergdahl's position out of the equation whether he's a traitor or hero. that's not the focal point. the focal point for what will be coming down the pipe for congress will be the actions that led to possibly breaking u.s. laws. >> let's not make believe we don't negotiate with terrorists. we're negotiating with iran right now which is the formal sponsor of terrorists. the best thing i've seen on this

is the general in the navy who said when a sailor falls off a ship, it doesn't matter if they jumped or pushed, fell, you turn the ship around and get them. that's the principle that the administration went with. >> al, al, al, this is what people are perceiving this right now. let's talk optics. it's not like s.e.a.l. team 6 had an incredible mission and brought home a hero. okay? they're bringing home an american citizen which is great. but i'm talking about optics. we have them exchanged for five prisoners and letters being exchanged between bowe bergdahl and his family and his father engaged in a way i think makes people highly uncomfortable. i'm just wondering is it possible this wasn't thought out before? or is there so much we can't know as it pertains to these things? is it possible these five

prisoners can be completely kept out of harm's -- kept out of terrorism? i don't see it as possible. i see them working in any way they can to get back at america. >> the optics aren't good. to state the obvious. what we don't know, however, is what the considerations were. i think the point that jeffrey and admiral kirby make, you just do that. whether he's a good guy or a bad guy for a whole bunch of pristine -- i'm sorry. i'm sorry. the rational taliban -- >> are they going to be taken out at some point? how do we know? seriously -- [ overlapping speakers ] >> look. in terms of the optics, though, i think the white house must have asked the question what's

the alternative? >> that's a terrible question. but those -- >> he was sitting in a taliban prison. i mean, he was always ten minutes from something horrible. >> why wasn't this done three years ago? >> i know. >> and so to mika's earlier question about the questions to be asked, i think that's where you're seeing a lot of folks in congress raise some concerns about what exactly went on here which just goes back to the notification process. you can avoid a lot of this crazy talk early in this release effort if the congress had been brought along. susan rice says the congress was a part of this conversation. but the chairman of the foreign affairs committee said i don't know anything about that. i'm the chairman. i wasn't advised on this. >> mike rogers -- had breakfast with him yesterday, and he said he didn't know about it.

let me just say this. i usually am for a congressional involvement in foreign policy. there ought to be real oversight. i think this is sort of a dumb law that you have to get approval from congress to release certain people. that's different than an oversight. and i think clearly i think almost -- i haven't read the history of legislation, michael, clearly the intent was if you cut a quick deal, you cut a quick deal. >> probably was. the law's going to be something to be looked at. but that doesn't change the facts of the ground right now in terms of how we got here. i think that's how a lot of the investigation that's going to ensue will sort of center itself. >> to one of your questions, why now, there's an obvious difference in afghanistan now. we're in the end game in afghanistan. we were not three years ago. >> this is exactly the point. >> and now we know when we're leaving and how we're leaving. >> we're trying to close off, we're trying to cauterize some wounds here. first of all, the taliban

managed to get five people out of guantanamo switch a goal. and getting this guy out before american troops are gone from afghanistan is an important goal. >> we're never going to know what the circumstances are around these five are. >> we can take a guess. >> yeah. actually, we probably could. i'd like to believe that there are a few options in terms of closing gitmo. this is a president who wanted to. okay? who is not for the guantanamo bacon sent. and thinks that it tears away at the fabric of what we stand for. maybe this is -- and the hopeful part of me believes this is at least the beginning of trying to figure out what to do with these people. >> karsai is complaining about it. just having to release 65 bad guys himself. >> we're coming back to this, because it's fascinating, first of all, and important. i want to go down the line. yea or nay. where are you on raising the

minimum wage? raise it? >> i'm for raising it. >> raising it. >> raise it. >> you're going to like this out of seattle although some don't. the city council unanimously passed legislation to make the minimum wage $15 an hour. that is the highest in all of the united states. fast food workers, other activists immediately cheered the decision. there are people saying they can go to school now. they can do things with their lives now. they can move forward. the legislation goes into effect next april. but the increase will be phased in over several years. businesses with more than 50 employees will get three years to come ply while small businesses will get up to seven years. i think it's a great idea, but it will be interesting to see the ramifications. those against raising the minimum wage say the world will come to an end. but there are some that would be for this. >> mika, doesn't this happen

over time? this is not something that's going to happen in the next year. >> at least it's happening. >> no, this is true. but i think the process is like over three to seven years. >> well, that's fair to small businesses. >> time to bake it into their equations of how they manage their money and plan for the future. >> but that will make a significant difference in the lives of people who work like hell to get nowhere. and they need to -- well, listen. i think it's a crime, actually. i think it's criminal how low people are paid for hard work. >> in seven years they'll be making 27 grand a year. you're not exactly going to retire with that. >> no. >> but maybe you can afford, you know, a small apartment -- >> to eat. >> maybe you can afford to eat. >> and not eat the fast food you're serving. >> maybe not that. >> i think there's someone who might look at this as we do.

that would be senator elizabeth warren who's giving the populist wing of the democratic party reason to hope by not outright rejecting speculation of a future presidential bid. during a discussion, "the huffington post" ryan grim quoted a passage in her book where she says this. she is fiercely determined to do everything ki to help us once again be the america that creates opportunities for anyone who works hard and plays by the rules. grim then suggested there was something warren could do alluding to a run for higher office. here's how she responded. >> we're talking about economics. we're talking about power. but we're also talking about values. this is a moment in time for our country and i believe for our world. a moment in time when we decide who we are as a people and what

kind of a future we are going to build. here in america we the people have to decide what the rules are. so i get how hard this is. this is about concentrated money and power on one side. but it's about our values, our voices, and our votes on our side. i believe we can fight back and win. >> does anyone think she was saying more than what she was saying? i do. >> absolutely not. >> oh, come on. >> i am going to -- oh, mika. i'm going to disappoint all of us. we want a race, we want a contest. go lizzy, go. the democratic sister hood is so invested in hillary clinton that no woman is going to run against hillary clinton including elizabeth warren. is it unimportant? no. >> would she be formidable? >> yes. >> did you think barack obama

would run when hillary clinton ran last time? >> absolutely did not. >> thank you for your honesty. >> not that i think hillary can't be beaten. i doubt she can. but i think she has a certain hold that didn't exist eight years ago. and elizabeth warren -- >> hold on the media and people? >> on the democratic party. she'll drive hillary to the left. >> i appreciate her comment about the concentrated comment on power. she'll try to access that power and money and access if she decides to run. i don't think she will. i agree with you on that front. the democratic sisterhood, i like that term, is really heavily invested in hillary clinton. i've watched clay mccaskill this last weekend just stumble over herself to make up -- >> she's still fixing that problem. >> i don't see it. >> would she be formidable? >> sure, she'd be formidable.

>> what? you sound so castigating. >> i'm not at all. no, no, no. >> she would be formidable. >> she would be absolutely formidable. she would be formidable. >> that's better, gene. >> if hillary clinton runs, i don't think she does. if hillary clinton does not run, i think she's in there in a new york minute. >> yeah. and would she be formidable? >> absolutely. >> he can't wait for the elizabeth warren -- >> you heard a snippet from the stump speech. >> i'm sorry. but i think if someone is -- a senator is presented with poll numbers and saying you have a plausible shot. i don't see a tlot of people saying i'm not going to try it because of the sisterhood. >> what's hillary's message? it's to fend off attacks about benghazi. it's to fend off -- >> that's not fair. >> what's her message in ten seconds? [ overlapping speakers ]

>> what's her message? >> her message is to -- >> i want to know what it is. >> to turn to al hunt and ask for the message. >> she hasn't given a message yet. >> she doesn't need to give you a message yet. she's not running yet. >> i think there are a number of democratic activists that they don't care about benghazi. they don't like a return to what they consider wall street democratic -- >> that would be a big change. >> i know. but that's where i think they will try to pressure hillary clinton to move to the left. >> thank you. let me tell you something. i've got to go to break, but elizabeth warren right now has a message. that you can encapsulate in a minute or less with fervor about defending the middle class and the american consumer. and she has the background to back it up and even the family experience if you read her book. have you read her book, jeffrey? hillary clinton, you get jeffrey's answer. and i like her.

i want to see it happen. i think she's brilliant. >> you want to see a clinton -- >> i want to see her in the race. i want everybody to have options. still ahead on "morning joe," actor morgan freeman explores some of the world's biggest scientific questions. and west virginia senator joe manchin joins out of coal country. he pushes back on the new epa regulations. that's up at 8:00. in our next hour, he says ransom is the number one way al qaeda raises money and now we're setting a price on u.s. soldiers abroad. we'll speak to congressman mike rogers in the next hour. up next, apple released software updates. were any of them game changers? that's ahead. but first a game changer himself, bill kairns with a check on the forecast. >> that may have been nice to me. >> i didn't mean it. >> i didn't think so. d.c. and new york city, we have showers and thunderstorms late this afternoon. humidity is up a little bit. we are going to watch those showers and storms again not

until late in the day. most of the morning is dry. right now we have a line of showers from buffalo to pittsburgh all the way through west virginia. not too big of a deal. as we go through the afternoon, it's going to be summerlike. very warm, very humid. mid-80s for the mid-atlantic state. those chance of showers and storms. that's nothing compared to the danger we have this evening. unfortunately a severe weather outbreak, possibly a few strong tornadoes and a lot of damaging winds will roll from the central plains tonight into areas of iowa and illinois. the area of red is of greatest concern. the concentration of storms will be the worst there. that's where the worst damage will occur. it's smack in the middle of areas like omaha, des moines area, and north of st. joseph, missouri. again the timing of this will be late this afternoon through this evening. and actually even through the overnight hours. this time tomorrow morning we'll probably have a strong cluster of storms somewhere near chicago to indianapolis to st. louis. and then we'll do it again tomorrow afternoon. areas of louisville, lexington,

columbus, ohio. so two-day severe weather outbreak with the possibility of tornadoes. it's the first time we've done this in about three weeks. hopefully we'll make it through this one without too much damage and injuries or deaths. air conditioners are being turned on as i speak. you're watching "morning joe." ♪

all right. we've got -- bye. thanks. we've got live pictures from poland right now where president obama is speaking just now. he's getting his ear piece in. he's taking questions alongside that country's president. we expect obama will be asked about the release of sergeant bowe bergdahl in exchange for five taliban detainees. so we're going to bring you the developments as they happen. i'm just going to take a look here, if you can bear with me, and see if we're just doing opening statements at this point. yep. all right. let me monitor this.

we will bring it back. i'll have my eye on this happening right next to the camera i'm talking into. the minute they start dealing with that question, we'll jump in. and if anything else happens as well, we'll jump in. right now they're doing opening statements. let's look now at the morning papers though. we'll start with "usa today." syria's president bashar assad is expected to win a sham selection. in fact, the only people voting are in areas controlled by the government. the vote comes more than three years after the bloody civil war began. "the arizona times." scott thistler has changed his name to cesar chavez and if running for congress in arizona's heavily hispanic district. this is strange. is it just me? >> no. it's wierd. >> that's weird. >> i'm just making sure i'm not crazy here.

after losing a bid for congress and then a city council seat in arizona thistler thought it was time to maic a change. chavez is not taking questions from the media because he's been flooded with them saying quote there's not enough cesar chavez to go around. did we get that off the onion? i want us to check that. it's real, tower says. i'm going to trust my producers. the philadelphia enquirer, a new study shows the americans are learning more from stephen colbert than broadcast news. look at his face. according to the study, the colbert report caught more about than other news source. i believe that. the san francisco chronicle,

apple unveiled a major software update yesterday. the company will launch a new operating system for both its max and iphones this fall. also new ways for the computers to sync with iphones and ipads as well as allowing multiple devices to share files. we'll see. "the washington post." a new study out of the university of chicago finds hurricanes with female names -- this is just strange -- are often more deadlier than storms with male names. researchers analyzed more than 60 years of data from 94 hurricanes that have hit the u.s. between 1950 and 2012. they're findings? hurricanes with a feminine name -- god, this is weird -- killed on average 42 people compared with masculine storms. i'm just going to take a moment here. >> let that sink in. >> joining us now with the politico playbook, politico's

editor in chief john harris. i mean, i don't want to crack a joke when we're talking about fatalities, but what a strange study. right? there's a lot of things we could be doing with our time. >> they didn't name them after men until a few years ago. >> weird. >> 94 hurricanes, right? that's all you got and you're going to -- i don't think we could really -- this is -- there's a margin of error of like infinity. >> we have so many other things to talk about. i'll try not to move faster on this. should we be reading into, john, marco rubio's appearance in iowa? >> i think so. i'm reading into it. >> i'm reading into it. but i'm wanting joni ernst. >> for the past year burned on immigration by wading into that and conservatives didn't like that. rubio had a rule i'm staying out

of the intramural battles. he's now making an exception. one battle he is getting into is in iowa. kind of a key state historically. and he's backing very aggressively, spent a couple hundred thousand bucks on expendtures for joni ernest who is -- she's trying to appeal to the sort of tea party wing. she's got sarah palin support but also establishment support to back her. that's a formula that rubio is trying to replicate, perhaps, in iowa in a couple of years. but certainly broadly that's his national profile. >> what do you guys think overall looking at -- we were talking about elizabeth warren. now let's look on the right. >> it's wide open. i think it's going to be -- >> is he formidable? >> i don't think there's anyone -- >> right here. look at me in the eye. is he formidable? >> i don't think anyone has established themselves as

formidable. he started off kind of catching up with -- >> seems too young. >> i don't know if youth has so much to do with it as i think it's going to be the maturing of the political process and how they deal with issues like immigration, minimum wage, and so forth. those are real discussions. and the individual able to bring those in together is going to be the one who i think has the greatest chance to go up against whomever the democrats put up. elizabeth warren or hillary clinton. >> that's hard to do. >> whether immigration kills him in iowa and with the right wing of the republican party. >> the question is what is the immigration focus of the gop right now? >> what is it? >> that's just it. he tried defining that. >> let's not forget iowa was where mitt romney turned from a pro-immigration reform to an immigration basher because he got so much flack at town hall meetings. will rubio do the same?

>> we don't know what the immigration issue is going to be a year from now. certainly john boehner if he gets his way who is desperately trying to take this off the table. i think given how toxic it's been for the past year for rubio, that would certainly be the possibility. if it stays like that. >> john harris, thank you very much. good to see you. still ahead, here's a piece of advice everyone can use this summer. avoid sunbathing directly next to an airport. oh, my god. stunning video coming up next in news you can't use. but first, dan marino is the next name to join a lawsuit against a league that made him millions. we'll explain next in "morning joe" sports. ♪ when la quinta.com sends sales rep steve hatfield the ready for you alert, the second his room is ready. you know what he brings? any questions?

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♪ hey, everybody. welcome back. time for sports. dan marino is part of the latest group of players to file a concussion-related lawsuit against the nfl. it does not talk about injuries suffered by marino or the 14 other plaintiffs. but they join others who have alleged the nfl misled players about the long-term ekts of concussions. the league agreed to a $765

million settlement last august, but it was rejected by a federal judge in january who said she didn't think that that was enough money. want to get you up to speed on baseball news. philadelphia and the mets leading the phillies 1-0 in the second. ryan howard launches one deep to center. and this one -- look. it's heading out. but new york outfielder matt dindecker gets up there to rob that. nice catch. mets win 11-2. that isn't the only victory for the mets in history. on april 30th they broke a record in the clubhouse by eating 103 philly cheese steaks in one day. the mets get a new championship title, but it may have hurt them on the field in the long run after setting that record the team went on to lose eight of their next nine games. and we go overseas for you for some pacific league ball in japan. you might recognize the pitcher

here. ta d tadano. look at this pitch. fools the ump even because it was called a ball. batter doesn't know what to do. pair of marathon-related stories you'll want to see this morning. first we take you to south africa's comrades marathon. look there the spectators scrambling out of harm's way as the out of control car slams on a barricade on the course. pretty scary moments right there. then this uplifting moment where 91-year-old harriett thompson ran her way into the record books at the san diego marathon. she finished this race shattering the u.s. record for the fastest marathon run in the 90-94 age group. a role model for all of us. coming up next, "the new york times" mark leibovich is going to join the table to explain how to succeed in washington without really trying. can that happen? succeeding in washington without trying?

don't go away. we'll be back with more "morning joe" after this. hi, mika. ♪ a woman who loves to share her passions. grandma! mary has atrial fibrillation, an irregular heartbeat not caused by a heart valve problem.

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find out why more than two million members count on angie's list. angie's list -- reviews you can trust. ♪ all right. live look at washington. look how beautiful it is outside. everyone has to go running today. okay? mark? here with us now chief -- you know what he did? >> i ran here actually. >> part of "the new york times" mark leibovich. his latest piece for this magazine just out this morning explains how to succeed in washington without really trying. but we have to go to -- where are we going? poland. president obama is taking questions there with the president of poland. and he's being asked right now about the release of sergeant bowe bergdahl in exchange for five taliban detainees. i want to hear this question.

so let's take a listen. >> -- or do you want more from the united states? >> the united states has always had a pretty sacred rule. and that is we don't leave our men or women in uniform behind. and that dates back to the earliest days of our revolution. we have consulted with congress for quite some time about the possibility that we might need to execute a prisoner exchange in order to recover sergeant bergdahl. we saw an opportunity. we were concerned about sergeant bergdahl's health. we had the cooperation of the

qataris to execute an exchange and we seized that opportunity. and the process was truncated because we wanted to not miss that window. with respect to the circumstances of sergeantbu bergdahl's capture by the taliban, we have not been interrogating bergdahl. he's recovering from five years of captivity. we the taliban. he's having to undergo a whole battery of tests and he is going to have to undergo a significant transition back into life. he has not even met with his family yet. which indicates, i think, the degree to which we take this transition process seriously. something we learned from the vietnam era. but let me just make a very

simple point here. and that is regardless of the circumstances, whatever those circumstances may turn out to be, we still get an american soldier back. period. we don't condition that. that's what every mom and dad who sees a son or daughter overseas should expect from not just their commander in chief, but the united states of america. in terms of potential threats, the release of the taliban who were being held in guantanamo was conditioned on the qataris keeping eyes on them and creating a structure in which we can monitor their activities. we will be keeping eyes on them.

is there the possibility of some of them trying to return to activities that are detrimental to us? absolutely. that's been true of all the prisoners released from guantanamo. there's a recidivism rate that takes place. i wouldn't be doing it if i thought it was contrary to american national security. and we have confidence that we will be in a position to go after them. if in fact they are engaging in activities that threaten our defenses. but this is what happens at the end of wars. that was true for george washington. that was true for abraham lincoln. that was true for fdr. that's been true of every president. [ inaudible question ] >> that's not something that

we're discussing at this point. we're making sure the transition he's undergoing after five years of captivity is successful. >> all right. president obama right now in warsaw. he's doing a joint appearance with the president of poland. but of course there are many questions surrounding the release of bowe bergdahl. i want to get a sense from the panel. you know the questions hanging over this. did the president answer to any of those? he said this is how wars end. is it? >> he did show caution. which was the opposite of some of the initial hysteria out of the last 24 hours. he doesn't have a lot of information. he probably does, but we don't. he, i think, was being very

deliberate and i don't think that's surprising. >> al? >> i agree with mark. get the guy out. if you have a chance to get a guy out, you get a guy out. michael's raised issues before about the law and i think those are genuine inquiries. but i think the idea you shouldn't have gotten him out because he might have been a bad guy is nonsense. >> i agree with that. i think the only questions hanging here are the optics of his story. and that will be litigated in the public, the press, on the air. and maybe even more. but it's the exchange for the five gitmo detainees. and then the questions swirling around bowe bergdahl that makes

this difficult for people to understand. i see big questions on the left and right. they don't seem to be partisan questions. >> they're not partisan questions. i think they're legitimate questions to be asked. i go back to my earlier point. i think if the administration had done a better job of stair stepping key members of congress into the conversation to give them the heads up when you have a committee chairman like mike rogers and others saying we had no idea what was going on. we didn't learn about it until we saw it in the newspaper or heard about it on tv. that is not how this is going to work out for the administration. they create a lot more drama around decisions they make than they need to sometimes. and all it is is a matter of communication. that can be litigated longer term. given the new realities of how

we communicate to taliban and others around the country. this isn't a government with tanks and soldiers that you can readily identify. all of that has to be taken into consideration. >> suspect there were two stories to be told. we didn't know that it was happening now. that this thing was happening now versus did they in fact have discussions with the white house over time about the possibility of some exchange. they didn't know when it was going to happen. they didn't know it was five for one or whatever. but i suspect there are two sides to that story. >> i find myself going to a place we agreed we shouldn't go, but it's not just the letters being exchanged between bergdahl and his father and his father's tweet. it's the -- it takes a lot for a

soldier to speak out and show anger for anything the government has done. i think soldiers are the most committed people that you'll ever meet in this earth. and they seem sorry. they seem pissed. they seem really angry at this young man who left the grounds and put himself in harm's way and they lost comrades. i can't imagine the backlash might not be worse than we're looking at right now. >> it's a war situation. you sort of mix that with the fog of politics and the fog of the initial media frenzy. i don't think -- look. it's an emotional situation. i just don't think all of the facts are known. >> the facts are tough to get. help me out here. i don't want to be this person. i don't want to say he shouldn't come home. i don't want to say we shouldn't have done that. >> don't say that.

>> okay -- >> i don't think anyone's saying that. >> that's the alternative. you bring him home or you don't. i think we bring our people home. i think that's what we do. >> what the country has to reconcile -- >> then we deal with whatever the circumstances might have been. >> exactly. it is legitimate to say we should have brought him home. that was right. now let's find out if he should somehow be sanctioned, punished. >> that's the part i think the administration has messed up on. they did not game that out. how do we have that conversation in the face of facts on the ground with respect to appreciation. that part of it was not well thought out, at least not articulated in the early hours of this revelation. now it's taking on a life of its own. you have the concern that mika's shown resonating with a lot of americans right now. it is not right or left. it's not conservative or liberal. it's americans concerned about

the policy when it comes to freeing and negotiating. >> mike rogers is coming in top of the hour. we're going to talk about this. mark, i was -- before we jumped to poland to hear what the president had to say, you were telling us how to succeed in washington without even trying nap is your article. >> timely, right? >> actually, i feel like a part of this article right now but in some ways we all do that. then again, you talk about and it's actually pretty funny the way it's written here. we seem to be in the midst of several national conversations. but the only way to have your conversation rise above the others is to have the face of that conversation. your very own pussy riot, "duck dynasty," or cliven bundy. >> or bergdahl now. >> what is it? >> we are in a golden age of cause celebres essentially. . it's down to 30 seconds or something. which does not preclude -- >> our attention span isn't

good, is it? >> seriously. but no. i mean, what happens in these cases. obviously this is a different situation is that people hang around. and they try far too many acts than they are entitled to. and you have the noise machine. i did a survey of the blizzard of cause celebres. >> this is going to be a follow-up. i don't know if we just blasted through news you can't use. but still ahead on -- we did. okay. >> you can use that. >> we'll figure it out. wuk use this. still ahead on "morning joe," president obama betting his second term on environmental policy capping carbon emissions. but is that a gam to believe make right now? senator joe manchin joins us to weigh in on that debate. and more on the big story of the day. p.o.w. or deserter? justification for bergdahl's freedom from the taliban remains

in question. but does it all depend on how bergdahl was captured? congressman mike rogers joins us next on "morning joe." honestly, the off-season isn't really off for me. i've got a lot to do. that's why i got my surface. it's great for watching game film and drawing up plays. it's got onenote, so i can stay on top of my to-do list, which has been absolutely absurd since the big game. with skype, it's just really easy to stay in touch with the kids i work with. alright, russell you are good to go!

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intelligence committee, republican representative from michigan, representative mike rogers. and you are asking a lot of questions this morning and so are we. let's get, first of all, the very latest on the big story of the morning. president obama spoke just moments ago about the release of bowe bergdahl. speaking in poland, saying his administration has consulted with congress for some time about a possible exchange for members of the taliban. the white house says it had to act quickly to save bergdahl's life. today much of the focus surrounds how the young soldier was captured by the taliban in the first place in june of 2009. multiple reports say that bergdahl sent an e-mail to his parents just days before he went missing writing in part, quote, this. i'm sorry for everything here. these people need help yet what they get is the most conceited country in the world telling them they are nothing and they are stupid. i'm ashamed to be an american.

the horror that is america is disgusting. his father reportedly responded, quote, obey your conscience. three days later his son apparently walked off his base without his weapon. in the months that followed, at least six american troops were killed in the mission surrounding the effort to find the fellow soldier. family members of the fallen are speaking out. the parents of darren andrews asking this. where's the honor in any of this? hon horrible soldiers risked their lives for someone who was a deserter. >> he willfully left. he planned out and left. he deserted not only the army but he left myself and my platoon and my company to clean up his mess. >> i have frustration that potentially he could still be alive in bergdahl had not left his post. we lost somebody that we love very much.

and we'll never see him again. >> bergdahl's former roommate said, quote, more than a handful of soldiers got purple hearts looking for him. but susan rice has a different take about bergdahl's service. >> this is a special situation. sergeant bergdahl wasn't simply a hostage. he was an american prisoner of war captured on the battlefield. he served the united states with honor and distinction and we'll have the opportunity eventually to learn what has transpired. >> the taliban members exchanged for bergdahl were seen celebrating in qatar where they are served to live for a year. just four days before bowe bergda bergdahl's release, his father bob reportedly sent out and then deleted a tweet reading, quote, i am still working to free all guantanamo prisoners. god will repay for the death of

every afghan child, ameen. supporters of the obama administration including hillary clinton are defending the exchange as one of the hard choices in government. "hard choices" is the title of her upcoming book. there are deep questions about whether these militants will pose a new threat to america. mike rogers, i'll serve with you. the president spoke about this in poland. he spoke about this over the past few days and there is the argument you bring every man home. as this is winding down. dp we do the right thing in terms of bringing bowe bergdahl home? >> bringing sergeant bergdahl home is one thing. >> did we do the right thing. >> not in this case. the methodology is important here. it's interesting. i almost wish the administration would just introduce themselves

to the national security committees who do this work every day. that would be a good start. let me tell you why. back in 2011 the administration did come as according to the law and had a discussion with a bi-party meeting with both the house and senate. and in a bipartisan way, people said this is not a great idea. that was the last time we heard from the administration. >> a question for you. then to the table. if it were you, given what you know now, would you have brought him home? >> not under these circumstances. he was a prisoner of war with the haqqani network. not under these circumstances. >> you would have left him there? >> under these -- i would have continued to pursue his release not under these circumstances. i wouldn't have given the taliban five -- which four are likely to return to the

battlefield -- when we have soldiers on the field for another 12 months. that means those individuals are likely to re-engage against u.s. soldiers the last 12 months the president said they're going to be there. >> okay. who wants in? jeremy, take it? >> mr. chairman, i wonder given the way this has unfolded, you have members of congress lining up predictably on both sides of the aisle with democrats saying they believe the president was justified in doing what he did in bringing sergeant bergdahl home. you have republicans saying this is everything they always feared about president obama's foreign policy, that it's feckless and in the worst case he is too soft on people who wish to do america harm. but isn't this really just an example of both republicans and democrats not being fully honest with one another about criticizing the president's foreign policy? >> no, i completely disagree. as a matter of fact, my ranking member has also made a statement he doesn't agree with this. i've had other democrats tell me they don't agree with this. remember.

the bipartisan group that met on this in 2011 in a bipartisan way and i was in the meeting said this is a terrible idea. now, at that time they were trying to release prisoners as a good will gesture to try to start peace talks with the taliban. universal in that room was this is not a great idea. leon panetta, democrat, said bad idea at the time. i think this is a bipartisan opposition. this to me was about the policy of what happened. diplomats are very concerned. hearing from two groups that are worried about this decision, diplomats and their family. they think there's a price put on their head. and same with soldiers standing in the field and their family think there's -- that's not a partisan issue. >> going back to 2011. so you have the president's team meeting with the intelligence leadership about the idea of doing something like this. take us through the process currently. were you or any of the leaders

informed ten days ago in any way that this effort was being undertaken by the administration? >> the last we heard and it was members of congress who would be in the chain for notification was the proof of life video that was delivered last december. and here's what's concerning to me. we started a review yesterday to figure out what happened here. was there a violation, was there not? in disagreeing with the decision and having a violation are two different things. now we need to determine have they violated the law in this case? and their republic rhetoric does not match on the ground. we were informed it wasn't acute. they had no information it was acute. i don't know why you'd say that. we had to work within a few days of notice. we understand this happened weeks ago, this started. so everything they're saying, i don't know if they understand that.

but there are really very clear fact trails here. and those fact trails will come out in the course of time. that's why i wish they'd come up and talk to us versus trying to have conversations through the press. >> when exactly did you find out about this? >> our -- we were notified, i think the event happened 10:30 on saturday morning. we got the call probably late that afternoon on a saturday. >> after it happened. >> yeah. >> there was nothing beforehand at all. >> no. nothing. >> okay. so what do you think given -- what can we know? what can we even imagine that we might know about how these five detainees are being handled or these now free detainees that might make us feel better about the questions that are hanging over this. here's the other problem. this is why you want the administration asks doesn't have to follow the law.

members of congress are stomping their feet saying that's not what's happening here. there are legal requirements. there's a lot of expertise around these tables who have been through a lot of these discussions in private. and up to that point, as a matter of fact, i had been in every conversation on those -- that notion that we might swap prisoners or engage in a swap. without that continual dialogue, we would know that there was a problem in qatar before. we sent somebody who didn't live up to their obligation. >> i'm asking exactly how you think these detainees might be handled in a way that might give us some comfort. hold that thought for a second. because the president's in warsaw and he was asked about the issue of notification. whether or not he should have consulted congress and how that came to pass. and here's the president's response. >> we have consulted with congress for quite some time

about the possibility we might need to execute a prisoner exchange in order to recover sergeant bergdahl. we saw an opportunity. we were concerned about sergeant bergdahl's health. we had the cooperation of the qataris and we seized that opportunity. >> mike rogers, you're chair of the house intelligence committee. did that happen? >> you know, i guess you'd have to look at his words. i don't know what he means. in 2011 they did present a plan that included a prisoner transfer that was pushback. we haven't heard anything since on any details of any -- >> nothing since 2011. >> nothing. other than this proof of life video that came up and briefed us on the proof of life video. >> did they brief you in context of the initial thing they came to you about which would be to

make an exchange? >> no, they did not. we keep very detailed records on this. i don't know why they're going down this path. there's a broader question about is this the right decision to take four criminals one of which is wanted by the united nations for war crimes and put them back out on the battlefield. here's the problem. 12 months they get to go back. and number two, if they want to have discussions with taliban officials in qatar. they can do it. >> is there any question in your mind that these five will not in some way, shape, or form get back into the world of terrorism? >> i believe that three of the five four sure. likely four. and i think there's one possibility that that might not happen. >> jeremy wants to jump in. >> that's a good place to get to my question which is my understanding of how this would have worked is there would have

been an intelligence assessment given just how dangerous these detainees were perceived to be. so the president would have had to review what the intelligence community had collected on these individuals and make a determination whether or not they would still pose a threat once released. has the white house shared any of that information about just how dangerous they view these individuals to be with you and if you, what have you cleaned from that? >> well, the last assessment was done last year. and that assessment hadn't changed since the first assessment back in 2011 which was not eligible for release on all five. so the determination was made that none of these five should be we leased back in 2011. they updated that to some degree. more acuity into last year. so december time frame. in their minds they believed nothing had changed.

>> okay. al? >> elaborate a bit on why you think this is different than the israeli decision three years ago to actually exchange one prisoner for 1,027. many of whom were terrorists. >> i disagreed with that decision even publicly back then. this the difference. we want to see both sides have uniforms and play by the rules of law. that doesn't happen here. the haqqani network is a terrorist organization. they're the ones that had possession of bergdahl. so you negotiated with a terrorist organization which by the way hostilities have not stopped or ceased and will continue long after even 2016. that's my concern. and yao put on the battlefield at a time -- imagine this. this is all now working together against i think this policy decision. we announce that in 2016 we're

leaving. we've seen through intelligence reports that the enemy is going to react to that, and they have, about changing their tactics to get ready for a withdrawal. and now you've taken five very credible, now have this higher kind of structure in that part of the world and put them out back on the battlefield within 12 months. by the way, they get to talk to the taliban while they're in qatar. that's a problem to me. >> there are a couple of different -- first of all, there's disagreement probably between me and you on gitmo. i'm with the president. i think it should be closed. he can't close it because of all the questions you and i both know exist. and i feel there's something connected here. because something has to be done. at some point that initiative has to be wound down. you may disagree. having said that, you know the president's thinking that way. and i wonder if it's connected. but the moral question here and it's interesting, i'll put it to the next panel as well. my dad's coming in.

if all these stories surrounding bowe bergdahl turn out to be true, if he is a deserter, if all those e-mails and the stories from his comrades are true, should this have still been done? >> well, i would have disagreed with it even have he been captured on the battlefield. >> are these arguments an issue? it's hard. nobody wants to answer this. >> it is hard. because you are talking about an american soldier. i think that there is a way in which you can bring him home and the adjudicate what he did. >> we fwheed to put that story into context. >> i think you bring him home and then adjudicate his action on the battlefield. >> i'm going to let the department of defense go through their review and release that information. the questions being raised today were the same questions being

raised in 2011. ki tell you that. >> but is it part of the decision making process? >> again, there are other ways to get a prisoner out. and just because it happened under these circumstances at this time, doesn't it mean in another month you could have done it another way? >> that's really easy for us to say, congressman. >> and i understand that. however, it's not just about one soldier. that's why hard choices, they are hard choices. but you have thousands of soldiers in the battle space today. and diplomat who is now believe that they put their price on their head for this exchange. why? because they're still fighting. remember. these are the guys that have shot little girls who were trying to go to school. they just poisoned something like 300 to 500 little girls for going to school. that's the taliban. those are the people we're negotiating with. that's troubling. when we leave, the very women we've asked to come out and

participate in society are now at the hands of people who believe that women are like cattle. and they're kilg little girls for learning to read. so some notion that this is a noble exchange across the bridge with two law-abiding parties is wrong. and so when you negotiate with terrorists -- they don't read the same messages of any of us at this table. hard choices? yes. i argue was that one soldier's exchange worth the risk of what we put all on the soldiers. that's a problem. >> congressman mark rogers. thank you. more questions keep coming. still ahead, it's being called one of the nastiest races in the country. senator thad cochran is fighting for his political life. but first, president obama's reassuring our european allies over the violence in ukraine this morning. but is it enough? dr. brzezinski, david ignatius, and chuck todd who is traveling

with the president in poland joins us next. we'll be right back. ♪ who's going to do it? who's going to make it happen? discover a new energy source. turn ocean waves into power. design cars that capture their emissions. build bridges that fix themselves. get more clean water to everyone. who's going to take the leap? who's going to write the code? who's going to do it? engineers. that's who. that's what i want to do. be an engineer. ♪ energy lives here. ♪

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♪ this is from sky news in london, i believe. a reporter named john craig was covering the elections for parliament last week, and he treated us to a rare international edition of excellence in reporting. >> scheduled for immediately after the european election, but now have -- oh [ bleep ]. >> we do apologize for that. >> we do too. >> welcome back to "morning joe." here with us now in washington, d.c. former national security adviser for president carter and author of "strategic vision: america and the crisis of global

party" dr. sbigniew brzezinski, hi dad. and also david ignatius with the new book "the director." and from poland, chief white house correspondent and host of "the daily rundown" chuck todd. the president just took questions on bergdahl. we're going to reintroduce that in just a moment. but first a quick update on ukraine and the violence there i want to start on the set. bauss we have book party-like extravaganzas going on. yesterday it was politics and crows with my mother for her book "lure of the forest." joe and i did a talk with her on stage. and my father was in the audience. for once he was in the audience. but he got up with the mic and said some beautiful things. it was lovely. but the party didn't end there. because in the evening,

everybody around this table. was at david ignatius' book party. you had laugh lines for me. >> i had laugh lines all prepared for you and joe. i'm going to save them for another event. >> i'm ready now. >> one involved when joe decides he's really going to run for president, you're going to be looking for a new host. you know, al and i and your father would like to apply for the job. >> that's pretty good. all right. we'll stop there. because joe's not running for president. it's not happening. chuck todd, bring us the latest on the situation on the president in terms of the president as it pertains to ukraine and the message he wants to send there at the meetings takes place there? >> the big news here was announcing this billion-dollar defense fund for europe. it's all of course a response to russia and a response to what

happened in ukraine. this is something he did in his last visit to europe a couple months ago. he lectured the europeans a bit on defense spending. he said the u.s. pays more than his fair share. he praised poland who is one of the few countries in europe that's part of nato that pays its fair share into nato. but he said the downturn is something that has to stop. if if it doesn't step up as well. so while the announcement of the billion dollars, something they wanted to see. when the president got here the show of military force he and the president pull in, toured some f-16 fighter jets. i mean all about a symbolic way,

a show of resilience against putin. this whole trip was planned in the last two months in response when the president decided to cancel the g-8 meeting. and when there was an empty spot on the schedule, the thought was do poland. all the central and eastern leaders including the president elect in ukraine are coming to meet with the president. >> we also are following these military exercises that the russians are involved in. and how much impact is america having on russia's aggression towards ukraine? >> it's more than exercises. to use a word more closely that proximates what's happening.

if unhundreds of people are earlier in crimea, it's much more than an exercise. maybe not a full scale aggression, but it's certain lya way to show the emerging ukraine and democracy. >> david would you agree with that? >> yes. i think the russians are continuing to keep the pressure on. that said, a month ago i think a lot of people would have wondered if we could have got to the elections that elected a new president. poroshenko with whom the united states and russia both appeared to work. one thing that's become clear to me, i don't know if you'd agree with this. he's a person that likes stirring the pot in a deniable way. you might be surprised at this point if he sent the troops across the border.

i think they keep stirring the pot but not blow it up. >> well, if he can do it on the cheap, he prefers that. because he knows an outright invasion would create additional problems. but if this effort destabilize ukraine gets out of hand, he may have no choice if everything explodes. so we have a stake in convincing him this is not a good game. one way is to -- with some defensive arms that they can use more effectively. because they're literally disarmed right now. they have a practically non-existent army trying to put down a well organized deliberately armed insurrection in a part of the country that has a potential of becoming bigger. >> what i wanted to ask is do

you expect that obama and putin will meet during these d-day events later this week. and will it matter? is there any reason for any sort of expectation it will produce anything? >> well, my guess would be that there will be some sort of informal meeting. much as there was when the president went to sochi. there was a meeting some months ago. my sense is that the white house still thinks that some kind of transactional relationship with putin is possible down the road. you can say that's fanciful given everything that's happened, but i think they still feel they need to do business with iran, syria, a lot of places. >> my guess is dad, you think that's fanciful. >> advocating a compromised solution with the russians. we can talk to them about it.

or in the case of the meetings in the west, even if the president doesn't meet putin, hollande or merkel can put forth. mainly ukraine moving towards the european union but not a member of nato. and a separate arrangement free trade agreement with russia. but not a member of the union. i think that kind of formula could satisfy both. but to have it we have to convince putin that promoting violence is not the way to obtain what he wants which is the whole piece, all of ukraine. >> is there any chance that putin would make a gesture on iran on that issue or on the syria issue as a way of kind of reigniting this transactional relationship while still pressuring ukraine to get what he wants? >> i would guess, gene, that he feels he's already made the

concessionary move on allowing it to happen and pulling back from the border. reducing some of the number of troops. that he doesn't have another give he feels he has to offer. >> i want to move carefully to sergeant bowe bergdahl, the release of this prisoner. i have a moral question for the great minds on this set. i want to go to chuck todd first though. the president addressed this when making comments with the president of poland and he talked about bringing every last man home. that that's the way it's done. he talked about the questions of bergdahl's health and the other situation surrounding the opportunity they had at this moment. did the president say anything else to address the serious questions hanging over this exchange? >> well, he did address two things. but before i get to it, i wanted to bring up a putin point. the president was asked about meeting putin. he said he imagined he would likely run into him at normandy. so i think i'm with david on this one. it's very likely the two of them

are going to have some sort of thing. but going to the bergdahl questions, there were two, i think two defensive statements that the president made on various critiques. one had to do with informing congress. and he said congress had been informed for some time that the idea of a prisoner exchange was on the table when it came to bergdahl. and then he said the situation presented itself and so then they truncated the informing process there. so sort of creating some basis of understanding the critique he's been getting about whether he could have informed them sooner. saying number one, you knew for some time. for months that the idea of this prisoner exchange was on the table. and then when they went, he

acted before -- acknowledging they acted before telling congress. the second had to do with the idea these five detainees that were used in this prisoner exchange, he was asked if they go into the battlefield, he said the u.s. has a way of keeping an eye on them and immediately the u.s. would figure a way to capture them again if they turn their fight back against america. it was a pledge he made there. i tell you. i thought he most interesting part that he said is what you did in the intro which is this idea, hey, regardless of the situation that bergdahl may have left versus being captured or whatever the situation is, he said it doesn't matter. we don't leave a man behind. >> but can you put that -- i guess i'll bring it to my dad and david and al and gene. is that the issue, dad? should he have been brought home given what we know? do you ask that question? or do you just plow forward and bring them home?

>> well, i think there has to be a qualification to that question. at any price, bring them home? at any price? suppose they had asked for ten. would we have paid it? and why do we send the five? they seem to be senior commanders. we have some indication perhaps in talking to them individually, i imagine we have talked to them individually in their cells. that some of them may be changing their minds. maybe would be a force for more recommendation after we leave. i don't know. these are the questions that we have to ask. but certainly on the face of it seems to me like a very one-sided deal. >> david? >> well, it does seem one sided. although less so than the exchanges the israelis have made. the israelis are tough on terrorism. sometimes even just for the remains of a soldier. so there's this precedent for this. i think it's useful to ask the

reverse question. suppose he hadn't been released and it's a year from now and american troops are getting ready to come home and you have this american sitting there in ever more frequent propaganda videos from the taliban. the pressure on the president to act in a much -- >> that's a great point. >> -- would be enormous. think about the pressure. >> was there pressure right now? i can't say that i was aware of the fact that this was even going on. i didn't see evidence of ongoing pressure. the issue really is is it more the quid pro quo allowing for different standards of humanity and decency between us and the taliban. i think the intention was well meant. whether the price paid has answers to questions that haven't yet been posed regarding there should be more said. >> all right. dr. brzezinski, david ignatius, thank you so much.

chuck todd, we'll be watching "the daily rundown" today on msnbc. coming up, the big name that just joined the lawsuit on the nfl over head injuries and how that star will impact the growing issue. that story is next on "morning joe." ♪ wondering what that is? that, my friends, is everything. and with the quicksilver card from capital one, you earn unlimited 1.5% cash back on everything you purchase. not just "everything at the hardware store." not "everything, until you hit your cash back limit." quicksilver can earn you unlimited 1.5% cash back on everything you could possibne. say it with me -- everything. one more time, everything! and with that in mind... what's in your wallet?

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welcome back to "morning joe," everybody. hall of fame quarterback dan marino is part of a group of players filed a suit against the nfl. the suit does not tell any medical problems suffered by him or the other 14 plaintiffs. the group joins the others who alleged the nfl misled players about the long-term effects of concussions. $765 million settlement last august. however, it was rejected by a federal judge in january who said she didn't think that it was enough money. all right, everybody. coming up next, voters are headed to the polls in eight states today. but everyone is watching the race in mississippi to see if thad cochran can survive the tea party challenge. kasie hunt joins us with a report. "morning joe" back after this. ♪ [ male announcer ] whether it takes 200,000 parts,

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♪ knock the walls down, mississippians. knock the walls down. >> today is about mississippi's tomorrow. >> today is super tuesday, and the marquee race is mississippi's republican senate primary. let's bring in nbc political news reporter kasie hunt live from jackson, mississippi. kasie? >> reporter: morning, mika. we were here a couple months ago, and it's really clear being on the ground that the texture of this race has shifted pretty dramatically in chris mcdaniel's favor. he was on the campaign trail yesterday. we were with him at a chick-fil-a in tupelo, mississippi. listen to what he said. >> you know what's funny about this? when i first announced back in october, they said impossible.

and then two months later they said, improbable. and you know what they're saying today? unstoppable. ladies and gentlemen, i believe barack obama is the worst president this country has ever had. with that being said, can any of you name a single fight that thad cochran has led against barack obama? >> his campaign has tied you to a nursing home break in. do you think that's politically motivated and do you think those charges might be dropped after this election? >> who knows. what matters in this race are the issues. something just something else he wants to talk about. senator cochran has been a liberal vote for a long time. that needs to be our focus for the remainder of the campaign. >> reporter: this race has been broiled by a scandal in the final days. the cochran campaign has tried to link mcdaniel to this nursing home break in. it's not clear that mcdaniel himself was directly tied to it.

cochran steered away from it, though, at his last come pain rally in jackson yesterday, if you want to take a listen. >> i have always tried to do what is best for our state. i want to keep working and fighting for mississippi. president obama has taken us down some wrong paths, but starting tomorrow we can get america back on the right path. >> reporter: you know, mika, i will say that the sense i've gotten being here now is that there is a real possibility that senator cochran could lose this race. people on both sides acknowledged that there's really just no way to tell. and if turnout's really low, chris mcdaniel could end up pulling this out. >> that's really -- michael steele has a question for you. that's incredible though. >> it's amazing. kasie, you've got former governor hailey standing behind

cochran. you've got santorum and palin behind mcdaniel. do you see this race as establishment versus tea party or is this is a situation where thad cochran was flat footed going into this campaign and it's caught up to him scandal notwithstanding? >> reporter: i think you've sort of nailed it with that. the barbour family rose up around cochran. it wasn't clear or not whether he was going to retire. senator mcdaniel jumped the gun a little bit when he got in. and at this point, it's evolved into this big test for whether or not these outside groups -- and i talked to barbour yesterday. he described this as a bunch of outside gun slingers looking for another scalp. >> wow. gene robinson, i've been following this, we all have, and i've got nothing for or against thad cochran and i've got nothing in terms of evidence that this chris mcdaniel had

anything to do with this nursing home scandal. but the way he has answered questions about it or not answered them, he has not successfully unlinked himself from it. at times it seems like he's out and out lying yet it does not seem to be impacting what seems to be almost this, like, snowball that's building in his direction as it rolls down the hill. >> you're right. i don't understand the dynamic either. >> i don't get it. >> i frankly, in a state like mississippi, i would have expected a more outpouring of sympathy for cochran. >> oh, my gosh. >> and more of a rallying around him just on the -- >> on the basis of what happened. >> -- the horrible invasion of privacy. michael, you know the party better than i do. you speak republican. >> i speak republican, right. >> the guy doesn't -- i have to say this carefully. he looks like it's out and out lying. >> well, you know -- >> that's not very careful. >> you got to be careful with that. >> i'm sorry.

>> but that notwithstanding, again, i think it speaks a lot more to how the cochran campaign assumed a lot about this race. and mcdaniel as i think is symptomic of a lot of tea party candidates, they're going to come at it from a different angle stronger. >> joining us now from mississippi, the chairman of the mississippi republican party. and the paper there has a cartoon that shows you as sort of the diplomat between all the bitterness that's happening there in mississippi. and it's bad. it's bad. jeremy peters has a question for you, joe. >> hi. good morning. >> good morning. >> if you look at what's happening in mississippi right now, it is ground zero for tea party efforts. if you talk to leaders of the movement privately, they will say we need this race. we need a win desperately in order to remain viable this year. so as a result, i think you've seen a lot of influence in the

race that you ordinarily wouldn't have seen. a lot of outright distortions of candidates' records. and i wondered looking back now how you can say the influence of these groups has been constructive on the political process there. >> well, i don't think it has been constructive. i mean, it's -- you know, the race in mississippi on the ground is a little bit different than i think the national narrative is. if you hear some of the hyperbole coming out of some of the national groups, you'd think this is -- well, they say it's ground zero for the heart and soul of the republican party in 2014 and 2016. i don't think people in mississippi view it that way. i mean, and the race doesn't line up like that anyway. you've got people that would be classified as establishment helping chris mcdaniel and you've got people classified as tea party helping thad cochran. most notably the governor, the first tea party governor, is helping senator cochran along with most of our other elected

officials. in mississippi people have kind of a simple choice. whether cochran deserves another term or whether it's time for a change. and if so, whether mcdaniel is that person. i don't believe that normal average voters have time to keep up with who's establishment this time and who's not. they have paid attention to the issues. >> joe, gene robinson here. is that the real issue in this race whether or not you throw the bums out? whether or not it's time for a new -- for a new senator from mississippi, a fresh face? >> well, it's interesting. some of the national groups that have been in here have had this kind of odd attack against senator cochran. almost that he's done too much for mississippi. in some way. that obvious plays a little tricky down here. chris mcdaniel has run a very good campaign. obviously he's had millions of dollars that he's brought in from tv ads. the cochran campaign has as

well. i think it's closer than people would have expected. but as you can imagine, the republican party's focus is on tomorrow. is on avoiding a situation like kentucky where i think i saw a poll after that primary where 40% of supporters said they wouldn't vote for mcconnell and 25% said they would vote for the democrat. >> wow. this is an incredible vote. still ahead, joe manchin joins the conversation. but first we've got some great courtroom video out of florida. you won't want to miss what happens when this judge loses it. we'll be right back. ♪ we asked people a question,

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out back and i'll just beat your [ bleep ]. >> let's go. >> you want to fight me? do you? >> that is judge john murphy from florida getting a standing ovation as he comes back into the courtroom after that. according to reports, deputies had to break up the fight. no charges will be filed, but public defender's office is looking at reporting the incident or saying the incident will be reported to the florida bar and i say there's a tv show waiting for that judge or something. >> judge judy is unstoppable, i don't know. >> she's not going anywhere. okay. well, we are. still ahead on "morning joe," new questions about sergeant bowe bergdahl's past and a strange tweet sent recently by his father that are raising questions about the taliban trade. seattle is leading the nation in the minimum wage and

reforming it to the delight of activists and fast food workers. we've got all the details at the top of the hour. and you won't believe who's america's most trusted news source. who do you think it is? that's in our morning papers. and then morgan freeman takes a break from hollywood to pursue some scientific endeavors. we'll be right back. all that and more when "morning joe" returns. oh my god! look. you need to see this. show 'em the curve. ♪ do you know what this means? the greater the curvature, the bigger the difference. [sci-fi tractor beam sound] ...sucked me right in...

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obviously we should be happy for the family. they have gotten their loved one back, that's very, very important. the methodology and what we used is very troublesome, negotiating with terrorists. >> it is cause for celebration when an american is returned home. >> first of all, we are all happy that an american has been returned to his family. this was not the right thing. >> yes, it is a victory and a defeat. the whole situation has us pumping our fists with joy like shaking it in anger. it is a celebration that is also very troubling, like a pizza party for hitler's birthday. was it fun? yes. do i regret it? of course. >> it's 8:00 a.m. on the east coast, 5:00 a.m. on the west coast as you take a live look at the white house. welcome back to "morning joe." time to get going with the day. top of the hour. with us on set we have eugene

robinson, michael steele, al hunt and jeffrey goldberg. so many questions about the bowe bergdahl story. a lot of people, a lot of people on both sides of the aisle asking why did the white house do it. sergeant bowe bergdahl could be back with his family by the end of the week. that is the good news, of course. but the questions surrounding his release will extend far beyond that. much of the focus surrounds how the young soldier was captured by the taliban in the first place back in june of 2009. multiple reports say bergdahl sent an e-mail to his parents just days before he went missing writing in part this. i am sorry for everything here. these people need help, yet what they get is the most con ceited country in the world telling that they are nothing and they are stupid. i am ashamed to be an american and the title of u.s. soldier is just a lie of fools. the horror that is america is disgusting. his father responded, obey your

conscience. three days later his son apparently walked off his base without his weapon. in the months that followed, at least six american troops were killed in the mission to find their fellow soldier. some of the family members of the fallen are speaking out, along with others from bergdahl's platoon. the parents of lieutenant darren andrews asked this. where is the honor in any of this? honorable soldiers risked their lives for someone who was a deserter, a traitor. it devalues their lives. >> he willfully left. he had premeditated, planned out and left. he deserted not only the army but he also left myself and my platoon and my company to clean up his mess. >> i have frustration that potentially he could still be alive if bergdahl had not left his post. we lost somebody that we love very much and we'll never see him again. >> bergdahl's former roommate said, quote, more than a handful of soldiers got purple hearts looking for him.

but national security adviser susan rice has a different take about bergdahl's service. >> this is a very special situation. sergeant bergdahl wasn't simply a hostage, he was an american prisoner of war, captured on the battlefield. he served the united states with honor and distinction and we'll have the opportunity eventually to learn what has transpired. >> and here's where it gets extremely controversial. in exchange for bergdahl, the u.s. released these five senior taliban members from guantanamo bay, as we've been discussing. they were seen celebrating in qatar where they will be required to live for at least a year. just four days before bowe bergdahl's release, his father, bob, reportedly sent out and then deleted a tweet reading, quote, i am still working to free all guantanamo prisoners. god will repay for the death of every afghan child, ameen. supporters of the obama administration, including hillary clinton, are defending

the exchange as one of the hard choices in government. hard choices is the title of her forth coming book. members of congress say they were not notified of the swap beforehand and there are deep questions about whether these militants will pose a renewed threat to america. al, i'll let you start. first of all, is it fair to ask the question why did the white house do it? why did they do it? five for one, five dangerous prisoners for one? five guantanamo bay prisoners who are deemed the worst of the worst for one soldier who has a questionable background? i'm sorry, it's wonderful that he's coming home. it's wondersful for his family. but does not this create more problems? >> it's certainly fair to ask that question, as you just did, mika. i think everything about this story is complicated. we don't know everything there is to know about this soldier. is he as clear a deserter as some say or is he what susan rice portrayed. certainly the swap is controversial.

i'm not as upset as some other people are by the idea of swapping. the israelis swapped -- >> there is a precedent. >> for 1,027. ronald reagan tried to do it. it doesn't say it's right, but this war is winding down. i'm less bothered by that whether i am by whether the administration was totally forthright. >> there's a difference between the israeli and the american swap, which is that the israeli soldier who got out, there was no question hanging over his head about whether he was a deserter, whether he was a traitor, whether he had walked out. >> these questions are not news. >> but we weren't focused on this bergdahl case. >> the white house would know that there were questions and letters that were going back and forth. >> hold it. let's back up for a second. >> okay. >> i think the policy has to be these are our people, leave no man or woman on the battlefield. >> but do we give up five gitmo prisoners? do we give up five dangerous -- do we threaten america's

national security some would ask on the right. >> either we bring them home to a ticker tape parade or a court-martial, whatever, or bring them home. >> or both. >> okay. and so is it worth five gitmo prisoners? look at the history of prisoner exchanges. we talked about the israeli example. you know, that's a legitimate question. >> but there's a difference, though. >> you could argue that it's a good deal as these deals go. >> it's a good deal? okay. >> the complication here is that that's all great and the president can stand in front of the country and say leave no man or woman behind. but is it contravention of u.s. law? the law requires two things. one, you notify the congress of your efforts, number one. and number two, you do not negotiate with terrorists. so if this is found to fly in the face of that fact, that further complicates, and to mika's question, what did the

administration -- what were they thinking in terms of how this would play out in face of the fact that you're going to have this political -- now you're going to create something that has more political fire to it than anything else because you're acting, again, contra to the laws. >> that's a bogus issue, though. >> the law is a bogus issue? are you kidding me? >> if guy were a hero, you would say we're going to make that deal. >> you're missing the point. now you have to go back and ask the question, why did congress put this in place in the first place? and if that's the case, i'm taking bergdahl's position out of the equation, whether he's a traitor or a hero. that's not the focal point. the focal point for what will be coming down the pike for congress will be the actions that led to possibly breaking u.s. law and maybe that's what needs to be changed. >> let's not make believe that we don't negotiate with terrorists directly or indirectly.

we're negotiating with iran right now. i think the best single quote i've seen on this is from admiral john kirby, the spokesman for the pentagon. he was in the navy and he said when a man falls or a sailor falls off a ship, it doesn't matter if they jumped, were pushed, fell, you turn the ship around and you get them. and that's the principle that the administration is operating on. >> al, al, al, this is what people -- people are perceiving this right now so let's talk optics because the white house must have thought about that. it's not like s.e.a.l. team six had this incredible rescue mission and brought home a hero, okay. whoever -- they're bringing home an american citizen, which is as important as well, but i'm talking about optics. we have them exchange for five prisoners and we have letters that are being exchanged between bowe bergdahl and his family and his father engaged in a way that i think makes people highly uncomfortable. i'm just wondering is it possible this wasn't thought out before or is there so much that

we can't know about classified information as it pertains to these things? is it possible these five prisoners can be completely kept out of harm's -- kept out of terrorism? because i don't see it as possible. >> well, the optics -- >> i see them working in any way they can to get back at america. >> the optics aren't good, to state the obvious. what we don't know, however, is what the considerations were. i think the point that jeffrey and admiral kirby make, you get people out, you just do that. and you're not going to be able to trade one of our guys, whether he's a good guy or a bad guy for a whole bunch of pristine, wonderful, marvelous -- >> the great taliban guys. >> you wolf better about it. >> the rational taliban. >> how do we know -- so seriously -- >> this is the drone president. >> we have these people all these years -- >> don't put it past him. >> that's what i'm wondering. >> swallow this pill before you go.

>> in terms of the optics, though, i think the white house must have asked the question, well, what's the alternative? the alternative, let him rot? was that a better alternative? >> that's a terrible question, but those -- >> look, he was about to die. he was sitting in a taliban prison. he's always ten minutes from something horrible. >> why wasn't this done three years ago? >> i know. >> why wasn't it done five years ago? why wasn't it done at the time he was taken? so there are a lot of -- to mika's earlier question about the questions to be asked, i think that's where you're seeing a lot of folks in congress raise some concerns about what exactly went on here, which goes back to the notification process. you can avoid a lot of this crazy talk early in this release effort if the congress had been brought along. susan rice says the congress was a part of this conversation, but the chairman of the foreign affairs committee says i don't know anything about that. i'm the chairman, i wasn't

advised on this. >> mike rogers -- i had breakfast with mike rogers yesterday and he said he didn't know about it. so let me just say this. i usually am for a congressional involvement in foreign policy. there ought to be real oversight. i think this is sort of a dumb law that you have to get approval from congress to release certain people. that's different than an oversight. and i think clearly, i haven't read the history of legislation, michael, clearly the idea was if you can cut a quick deal, you cut a quick deal. >> probably was, i agree the law is something to be looked at. but that doesn't change the facts on the ground right now in terms of how we got here and i think that's where a lot of the investigation that's going to ensue will sort of center itself. >> to one of your questions, why now. there's an obvious difference in afghanistan now. we're in the end game in afghanistan now. we were not three years ago. we were in the surge and now we know when we're leaving and how we're leaving. >> there was a strong impulse in the white house, we're trying to

close off and cauterize some wounds here. the president managed to get five guys out of guantanamo, which is a goal. and getting this guy out before american troops are gone from afghanistan is an important goal obviously. >> we're never going to know exactly what the circumstances around these five are. i would like to believe -- >> we could take a guess. >> yeah. actually we probably could. i'd like to believe that there are few options in terms of closing gitmo, and this is a president who wanted to, okay, who is not for the guantanamo bay concept and thinks that it tears away at the fabric of what we stand for. maybe this is -- and the hopeful part of me thinks this is at least the beginning of trying to figure out what to do with these people. jeffrey, everybody, just yea or nay, where are you on raising the minimum wage? >> i'm for raising it. >> al? >> raising it. >> raise it. >> raise it. >> you're going to like this out of seattle, although some don't. workers are celebrating a

historic decision in seattle. the city council unanimously passed legislation to make the minimum wage $15 an hour. that is the highest in all of the united states. fast food workers, other activists immediately cheered the decision. there are people saying they can go to school now. they can do things with their lives now. they can move forward. the legislation goes into effect next april, but the increase will be phased in over several years. businesses with more than five employees will get three years to comply while smaller businesses will get up to seven years. i think it's a great idea. it will be very interesting to see the economic ramifications, because those who are against raising the minimum wage say like the world will come to an end. but there are others that would be for this and are for the -- >> or an earthquake. >> mika, doesn't this happen over time? this is not something that's going to happen next year. >> at least it's happening. >> no, no, that's true. >> my god, they can't agree on this in washington. >> that's true. but i think this process is over

a three to seven-year period. >> well, that's fair to small businesses because that's a huge hit. >> that gives the business time to bake it into their equations of how they manage their money and plan for the future. >> but that will make a significant difference in the lives of people who work like hell to get nowhere. listen, i think it's a crime actually. i think it's criminal how low people are paid for hard work. >> after seven years they're going to be making $27,000 a year. you're not exactly going to retire to the -- >> maybe you can afford a small apartment -- >> to eat. >> or maybe you can afford to eat. >> and not eat the fast food you're serving. all right. i think there's someone who might look at this as we do, and that would be senator elizabeth warren. elizabeth warren who's giving the populist wing of the democratic party reason to hope by not outright rejecting speculation of a future

presidential bid. during a discussion with french economist thomas pikety, the huffington post ryan grim quoted a passage from warren's new book in which she says, quote, this. fiercely, she is fiercely determined to do everything i can to help us once again be the america that creates opportunities for anyone who works hard and plays by the rules. grim then suggested there was something warren could do, alluding to a run for higher office. and here is how she spoend. -- responded. >> we're talking about economics, we're talking about power, but we're also talking about values. this is a moment in time for our country and i believe for our world, a moment in time when we decide who we are as a people and what kind of a future we are going to build. here in america, we the people get to decide what the rules are. so i get how hard this is.

this is about concentrated money and power on one side, but it's about our values, our voices and our votes on our side. i believe we can fight back. i believe we can win. i believe it. >> does anyone think that she was saying more than what she was saying? i do. >> absolutely not. >> oh, come on. >> oh, mika, i'm going to disappoint all of us. we want a race, we want a contest, go, lizzie, go. the democratic sisterhood is so invested in hillary clinton that no woman is going to run against hillary clinton, including elizabeth warren. is it unimportant? no, it's not unimportant. >> would she be formidable? >> she would be formidable. >> did you think barack obama was going to run? >> absolutely i did not. >> thank you for your honesty. thank you for sharing. >> it's not that i think that hillary can't be beaten. i doubt she can, but it's that i

think she has a certain hold that didn't exist eight years ago. >> hold on the media and on people? >> and on the democratic party. she'll drive -- she'll drive hillary to the left. still ahead, his state draws more than 95% of its power from coal, making the president's new emission standards an issue that hits very close to home. senator joe manchin joins us in just a bit. and then actor morgan freeman takes us through the worm hole. what we'll get in the new season of his science channel series. and up next, is stephen colbert the most effective man in news? the numbers seem to say yes to that. first, here is bill karins, the most effective man in weather with the forecast. >> that was too easy, mika. good morning, everyone, let's talk about this forecast today. this afternoon showers and storms rolling through the mid-atlantic and the northeast. also severe weather threat in the plains. first with a line of showers just moving through the pittsburgh area, western virginia, western new york, this is all going slide to the east

as we go throughout the day sparking additional showers and storms. it's going to be very warm, a little more humid in this region. so airport delays are possible, especially this afternoon, from new york city to hartford, philly, baltimore, washington, d.c. again, it's not going to rain out your day, just a short period of rain this afternoon. now for the troublesome stuff. already some showers and storms popping up in nebraska and areas of south dakota. this is the problem spot for the evening. we could even see a few strong tornados. after the tornado threat, even as we go through the night, almost until this time tomorrow morning, a large complex of storms is going to roll through iowa, northern missouri into illinois with a damaging wind threat. we could get wind gusts 80, 90 miles per hour so it's going to be a dangerous night right through the central plains. and then tomorrow afternoon we watch that threat moving into indianapolis, louisville, all areas of ohio and eventually into west virginia. so this is going to be the first real big severe weather outbreak later on tonight that we've had in the last three weeks.

we'll get some tornados and even a few strong ones. hopefully they'll stay over farmers' fields and not hit any homes or definitely any cities or towns. los angeles, the weather on the west coast, very quiet, cloudy morning. you should get some sunshine this afternoon. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. it starts with little things. tiny changes in the brain.

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let's look now at the morning papers, though. we'll start with "usa today." syria's president is expected to

win what western officials are calling a sham election. in fact the only people who are voting are in areas controlled by the government. the vote comes nor than three years after the country's bloody civil war began. the "arizona times" republican scott bissler has changed his name to cesar chavez after the labor movement and civil rights icon and is running for congress in arizona's heavily hispanic seventh district as a democrat. this is a strange story. is it just me? >> that's really weird. >> it's weird. >> weird, weird, weird. okay. i'm just making sure i'm not crazy here. >> no gender change. >> no. >> just a name change. >> name change so far 'after losing a 2012 bid for congress and city council seat last year, he decided it was time to make a change. chavez is not taking requests from the media because he has been flooded with calls and e-mails saying, quote, there is just simply not enough cesar

chavez to go around. did we get that off the onion? i just want to know. i want us to check that. it's real from our parade of papers. i'm going to trust my producers. the philadelphia inquirer," a new study shows americans are learning more from stephen colbert than actual broadcast news. look at his face. according to the university of pennsylvania study, the colbert report taught more viewers about campaign finance than other news sources. the study focused on the satirical coverage of super pacs during the 2012 election. ienl that. apple unveiled a major software update at its developers conference yesterday. the company will launch a new operating system for both its macs and iphones this fall. it also introduced new ways for its computers to sync with iphones and ipads as well as allowing multiple devices to share files. we'll see. "the washington post," a new

study out of the university of chicago finds that hurricanes with female names -- this is just strange -- are often more deadlier than storms with male names. researchers analyzed more than 60 years of data from 94 hurricanes that have hit the u.s. between 1950 and 2012. their findings, hurricanes with a feminine name -- god, this is weird -- killed on average 42 people compared with masculine storms which killed about 15. i'm just going to take a moment here. >> let that sink in. joining us now with the politico playbook, a male, politico's editor in chief, john harris. i don't want to crack a joke when we're talking about obviously fatalities, but what a strange study. right? there's a lot of things we could be doing with our time. >> they didn't name them after men until a few years ago. >> cesar chavez, female

hurricanes. >> that's 94 hurricanes, right? that's all you've got and you're going to -- i don't think we can really -- there's a margin of error of like infiniti. >> we have so many other things to talk about so i'll try to move faster on this. should we be reading into, john, marco rubio's appearance in iowa? >> i think so. >> on the trail? >> i'm reading into it. our reporter is reading a lot into it. look, for the past year ever since he got burned on immigration by wading into that and conservatives didn't like it, marco rubio has had a rule. i'm staying out of the intramural battles within the republican party. he's now making an exception. one battle that he is getting into is in iowa, kind of a key state historically. he's backing very aggressively, spent a couple of hundred thousand bucks in independent expenditures for joni ernst, who is a candidate he likes and is a

candidate he thinks is of his mold. she's 43, he's 43. she's trying to appeal to sort of the tea party wing. she's got sarah palin's support but establishment republicans have backed her and that's a formula that obviously rubio is trying to replicate perhaps in iowa in a couple of years, but certainly broadly that's his national profile. >> what do you guys think just overall? we were talking about elizabeth warren earlier, so now let's look on the right. >> it's wide open. i think it's going to be -- >> is he for midable? >> i don't think there's anyone -- >> right here looking me in the eye. >> i don't think anyone has established themselves as formidable yet. i think he started off kind of catching up with some of the positions. >> he seems too young. >> i don't know if youth has so much to do with it as i think it's going to be the maturing of the political process and how they deal with issues like immigration, minimum wage, you know, and so forth within the party. i mean those are real

discussions. and the individuals able to bring those together is going to be the one that i think has the greatest chance of whoever the democrats put up, either elizabeth worn or hillary clinton in 2016. >> my question is whether immigration kills him in iowa -- >> the question is what is the immigration focus of the gop right now. >> what is it? >> that's just it. >> let's not forget iowa was where mitt romney turned from a pro-immigration reform to an immigration basher because he got so much flak at town hall meetings. will rubio do the same and can he do the same? >> we don't know what the immigration issue is going to be a year from now or 18 months from now. certainly john boehner if he gets his way, desperately trying to take this off the table. i think given how toxic it's been for the past year for rubio, that would certainly be the possibility if it stays like that. >> john harris, thank you. up next, the criticism of

president obama's new energy proposals have been quite strong and that's just from the democrats. senator joe manchin joins us with his take next on "morning joe." the lowest price book any flight or hotel

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what we are seeing here is yet another example of an overreaching, overzealous, beyond the legal limit actions of this epa that has truly run amuck. >> what really bothers me more than anything is that the president and his administration through these policies is basically picking winners and losers in this country. unfortunately, west virginia is on the losing end. >> a democrat and a republican both from west virginia coming together to speak out against the epa's new plans to cut carbon emissions from power plants by 30%. joining us now on set to weigh in, democratic senator from west virginia, joe manchin. a lot to talk to you about this morning. we'll start right there. overreaching, overzealous, beyond the legal limit? >> which shows you that bipartisan agreement works. they both agree. >> that's true. i guess there's something we can

be happy about, they agree on something. >> what we're saying, i've been saying all along, i held my tongue until i've seen the rules come out. but you know, this administration should be dealing with the facts and how do we fix things. all we're asking for is give us the technology. $8 billion has been laying there in research for clean coal technology research and not a penny has been spent. i have a bill that says basically you have to invest those $2 billion in finding the new technology. you're going to be using it, you're going to need coal for the next 30 years, why not work with us versus against us. >> jeremy? >> senator, i wonder if the appropriate analogy here is the tobacco states from 20 years ago, where you have this life blood of the state economy being a product that is ultimately harmful to people. would you concede that things just have to change with regard to coal pollution? >> first of all, they have changed. we've cleaned up the environment more in the last two decades in the history of the world. eight billion tons of coal is being burned today. the united states only burns one

billion. what happens to the other seven billion. if you think the ocean currents and wind currents start and stop at north america, then we've got some ocean front property in west virginia for you. >> oh, boy. >> that's what we're dealing with. >> you might some day soon. >> i knew gene would come -- >> thank you, gene robinson. >> the bottom line is this. china is 4.5 billion tons and increasing. india is 2 billion tons. europe -- the european union is 1 billion. if we were serious about global climate and the changes that need to be made for all of us human beings, first of all, 7 billion people have an impact and we all have a responsibility. i con cure with that. i agree. the other thing is i'm not a denier and i had would ask this administration are you deniers. denying that you can energize this country without using fossil. if the case is you want to seriously clean up the environment, then why don't you have your trading policies with the countries that are using the most fossil right now start using the clean coal technology

that's available and help us develop the new clean coal technology that can clean up the atmosphere. they're going to use this energy, eugene. they are going to use what they have, the other countries. >> they're going to use it until they make a political decision, as the president has made a political decision, to go in a different direction, even if there's some economic costs. and i tell you, i actually believe that in china at some point they're going to make that decision just because of the political pressure they're getting from the growing, burgeoning middle class in the urban areas who can't breathe. they cannot breathe. >> it's not co2 that's killing people in china. it's particulates. >> it is particulates, right. >> and we've cleaned the particulates up in america. if we said we're cutting our trading back unless you start cleaning up things you can do with scrubbers, low nox boilers, things of that sort. >> senator, can i get you on bowe bergdahl a little bit, the big story of the day.

i know that you -- let me try one slice of this and that's the gitmo angle, which the president did go into office saying he would close it and he did not. is there anything in this decision that shows you that there is some sort of potential -- some beginning to figuring out the dilemma which you and i agree exists at guantanamo bay? >> the extraordinary cost, the unbelievable cost per prisoner at gitmo is just unacceptable. with that being said, i'm going to go down there and see it myself with some other senators. i want to see firsthand before i make my final decision, but i'm leaning towards -- we've got to get out of there. there's other places we can put and make sure we can secure. i know that we can do it and we've been able to do that. with that being said, these five horrific people that have been released to go back into their own environment to continue what they have continued before, i don't think their ways will change. that's concerning to me. i don't know enough, and i'm going to defer until we have a

classified meeting with the administration to explain to us, did you know, did anyone interview this bergdahl's superiors, the unit that he served in? the people that are speaking out now, did we not know about that before? did anyone do any recon on this before we made a decision? did we know that we lost lives? >> do you think those facts matter? >> they make a big difference. >> really? >> should make a big difference. >> i don't know. >> people in west virginia would want to know if a person walked off -- >> senator, can i ask maybe a slightly different question. do you think that this deal for bergdahl is part of a larger deal that the president is aware of that's trying to reconcile between the taliban and afghanistan as we draw down our presence there, that this is maybe some effort to sort of get some reconciliation in place?

>> first of all, i was encouraged when the president first said many years ago we're getting out of afghanistan. i would have gotten out quicker than this. i definitely won't keep 10,000 or wouldn't keep 10,000 for another year. that's me speaking. i don't think that if money or military might would change that part of the world, we'd have changed it by now. >> aren't there ramifications, though, to leaving him there if you're drawing down? >> oh, no, no, if that's the situation -- that could be. that's why i am waiting until i get a secured briefing that we can ask the questions you're asking me and we'll get those answers. >> i want to hear back. >> i want to hear myself. common sense and energy, common sense and energy is we will do it, work with us not against us. they're working against us and putting hardships that's unreasonable and unacceptable. >> i usually cut people off when they do stuff like that, but who doesn't love joe manchin, right? any more? any more? senator joe manchin, thank you so much. coming up, apple announced several software upgrades yesterday but it wasn't enough

to please every apple fan. brian sullivan will explain why he's disappointed with yesterday's conference. he should have listened to me a long time ago. and then his voice is one of the well-known voices in all of hollywood but in his new project, morgan freeman has a little bit of a different sound. >> in unusual situations -- >> you don't always get what you expect. but sometimes unusual situations lead to new insights. to find the truth about gravity, physicists are studying it in a place where they're expected to act very strangely. >> no, no! i don't like that. he joins us in just a bit. we should do that here. i'd like to see joe do that. keep it right here on "morning joe."

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welcome back. jeremy peters, you have taken orders, right? you've just been given orders on your next assignment. good luck with that. i can't wait to read it. business before the bell now, brian sullivan, brian, why didn't you just listen to me? >> about what? i always listen to you. >> apple. no, you didn't. >> what did i not listen to you on? >> batteries run out, all these chargers cost all this extra money. it's such a -- it's just a game and you started playing it more yesterday with apple's new products. >> listen, i would totally agree with you because when they came out with that new adapter, that smaller one, i said people are going to be angry because now you have to buy 62 different $40 chargers to make sure you've got chargers everywhere. >> because your battery keeps running down. >> it's true. it's very expensive. don't lose them. i left about ten around the

world, i think. listen, the announcements yesterday mostly aimed at developers, right. the kind of stuff for the applications develop ersz, the coders. they were very happy with what they heard. a lot of the stuff apple announced yesterday was the back-end stuff about software development. however, there was conversations about the so-called internet of things or internet of everything, which is tying everything in the brzezinski residence to the phone and apple ecosystem. door locks, lighting, heating system. pretty soon everything will be accessible by your phone. you're on a trip, you want to lower the heat. you want to turn off or turn on the lights, you'll be able to do that stuff with your phone. here's my lesson, don't lose your phone because then you'll be stranded outside in the cold. >> okay. that's a good point. you got me. you got me. i just like a light switch that you turn off. >> very simple. >> that is not tracking your privacy data, he just turned on the light, he just turned off the light. >> that's right, because you

can't follow everything i'm doing. i'm telling you, all this stuff adds up to something that's not good. somebody prove otherwise. cnbc's brian sullivan, thank you so much. up next, boy, we're not normal. this is the latest, latest product. we'll be right back. no, we actually say what we think which is we don't want it. here's the question. is poverty genetic? and what are the chances of a zombie apocalypse? those are just two of the questions asked in the new season of "through the worm hole." the host of that show, morgan freeman with his morgan freeman voice joins us next. no balloons here, freak me out. keep it right here on "morning joe." en i was pregnant... i got more advice than i knew what to do with. what i needed was information i could trust on how to take care of me and my baby. luckily, unitedhealthcare has a simple program that helps moms stay on track with their doctors and get the right care and guidance-before and after the baby is born.

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my experience shows that being born poor is not necessarily a life sentence. but for billions of people around the world, poverty passes from generation to generation without end. we inherit property, or the lack of it, from our parents. we also inherit our parents' dna. and for as long as we've known about genetics, scientists have been wondering if there is a connection between our money and our genes. >> it's a fascinating question. that is a clip from "through the worm hole." here with us now is the executive producer and host of

that series on the science channel, oscar-winning actor morgan freeman. morgan, it's great to have you here. this is exciting as we venture with new questions on the fifth year of the series. >> yeah. >> so you started out of the gate. it debuts tomorrow on the science channel. but the question that you're asking, is poverty genetic. as you get meta about this and get the world view, certainly here in america we think that no matter what that we are in this country, we can get out of it. >> used to think that. i'm not so sure anymore. >> i think there's still opportunity exists but maybe in smaller factions. what did you learn on the world stage about that question? >> well, there are areas of the world where if you're born into poverty, that's pretty much where you're going to die. that does not necessarily mean that it's genetic, however, i don't think. all of the research says that it's primarily a very of environment.

>> so it can be more nurture than our genetic nature. >> yeah. >> so when we look at the questions that you guys are pushing, what's been the most fascinating thing for you as you've been host and also an executive producer when you take a scientific look at things, trying to presenting the data to a rational audience to get them to understand a little better about the questions that you're trying to answer? >> this one will blow your mind. is the ocean aware of itself as a life form? now let's just suppose, you and i, that it is, that it does think of itself, that it is concerned with its own well-being. what does it think of us? what will happen down the road if we keep doing what we're doing? >> i don't know, but i'm so

distracted by your melodic tones, i can't think. >> thomas, what are you doing? >> i'm listening to your voice and you have this incredible voice and you're asking these questions. so do you think that that's also a part of the series, that you draw people in with the way that you're talking about these questions and getting people to think about boundaries and things that we've never thought about before? i've never thought about that before, thinking of the ocean as one moving body. >> at least five times in the past the ocean has pretty much cleared out life on its own. so if it has done it before, it can do it again. and scientists don't really know why it happened, they just know that it did happen. if it happened five times in the past, it can happen five more times in the future. i think it depends on how we proceed.

>> is it hard for you to believe, as we swift gears just real quickly before i have to let you go, one of the best movies of all time that you starred in "shawshank redemption," 20 years, the anniversary coming up this fall. do you ever get impressed about the type of ripple effect that movie has had on generations, men, women all say "shawshank redemption" one of the best movies of all time? >> i guess i really am impressed. but you can't be too impressed. there was more than me in it. there was quite a few people in it doing really great work. so that we all shared in the fact that it's thought of as one of the best movies of all time. it's kind of prideful, yeah. >> you have one of the greatest careers, such a brilliant actor and so great to have you here. lovely to meet you. fell in love with you on "the electric company" and have been paying attention ever since. you can catch morgan freeman on "through the wormhole" on the

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with our 2 week simple start plan. so jumpstart your summer and join for free. try meetings, do it online or both. hurry, offer ends june 7th. weight watchers. because it works. time now to talk about what we learned today. i learned that the situation with bowe bergdahl, the more you

talk about it, the more questions you have. it is one of the more fascinating and possibly disturbing decisions and events that i've seen in a long time in news. michael steele? >> what i learned is what joe manchin put on the table, that there's more to this epa decision that should be uncovered and discovered about cost and the effect that this policy is going to have. >> jeremy. >> i learned that you cannot apply the lessons of the tea party nationally to what's happening in mississippi and that we should be prepared for maybe a little bit of a surprise tonight. >> gene? >> shock, horror, people in appalachia where they mine coal don't really like -- >> no, they don't. we'll end on that note. if it's way too early, it's time for "morning joe." now it's time for "the daily rundown." chuck is abroad with the president, you'll hear from him too. have a good day. crazy eights. a major mess in mississippi and eyebrow-raising rumble in iowa and a likely