i feel extraordinary sympathy. >> it's chicken. we'll say salad. listen to this now. tgi friday's launched a summer promotion of endless appetizers. great thing to do because people in the country need to start putting on the weight. >> oh why. >> really got to -- you know? whole lot to chew on today. we will have much more on the immigration crisis and everybody's talking about and includes breaking news. the president just this hour asking for nearly $4 billion in emergency funds from congress. he's headed to texas for two days of fund raising and doesn't plan to viz -- border and causing a mess of criticism including governor rick perry that just accepted an invitation to meet with the president during that trip. we start with a piece of reporting fully baked for you. a story to put higher in the rundown. i got nothing. but really, big news for weed today. washington state is becoming the

second in the country to legalize recreational marijuana. just 24 stores will have a license to sell and they expect lines around the block. just like what we saw when colorado started selling pot seven months ago. what can washington learn from the ups and downs of that rollout? joining me from denver, mason tavert. our political panel today, huard fineman of huffington post and karen finney. a pleasure to have you all back on the show. mason, there's a difference of the states and washington with a cap of number of stores to sell and requires growers to be licensed and in colorado no cap, residents can grow small amounts without a license. what would you say to washington sellers based on what you have seen play out in colorado? >> well, essentially, the systems are very similar in that they're more or less treating marijuana like alcohol. and what we are likely to see are licensed cultivation facilities producing a product

that is then sold by marijuana retail stores much like we would see for liquor stores and likely to see big lines at the beginning. obviously historic situation. people have never been able to buy marijuana legally as an adult in a retail store but, you know, it's really not going to be much of a novelty in the very near future once things setting down and another legal product for adults. >> karen, each of the states is kind of a different blueprint for legalizing. which if either do you think will become an impetus for more states to follow suit? >> i think we will learn from both states, actually, because, i mean, i was looking at the image of the labeling of the different kinds and i think one of the things we're going to learn is not just about selling it but in terms of regulating it. right? in the same way that a different number of alcoholic drinks, beer versus wine versus hard alcohol, we're going to learn something about how people are impacted.

>> there are mellow varieties and mason, perhaps you can speak to this. do you think the regulatory regime needs to be nuanced to accommodate the kinds and ways and maybe some of us get paranoid? go ahead, mason. >> yeah, yeah. every state will address marijuana differently much like every state addresses alcohol differently and different types of products are treated differently. for example, marijuana infused edible products are going to be not just regulated in terms of the marijuana that's in them, but a kitchen producing them also needs to be regulated, follow the same types of health standards to see in any other commercial kitchen so ultimately we're going to see a wide variety of regulations aenl not all that new. this is something we have been doing with alcohol, other intoxicating substance and more harmful for a very long time. >> howard, mason is making the point this is not that different from other regulations tried and

true. as they navigate and turn it into a successful economic model, how will you see the objectors change the arguments? >> well, first of all, i think that the revenue side is a very -- going to become an increasingly important thing for states. as other states move toward full legalization. washington state is looking at -- they hope raising $190 million over 4 years. but they may have made a mistake in how they decided to tax it. which is i think the same way colorado does. correct me if i'm wrong which is based on price and not on the thc content. which would be equivalent to the alcohol content dealing with beer and wine and liquor. and the problem there is -- >> we're just putting up the stats on the economic side, just how much, $190 million projected for washington in 4 years. i'm sorry. go on. >> exactly. and so if they want to keep -- the states want it to be a

serious revenue source which state and federal governments have done with other kinds of things like tobacco and alcohol from the beginning of the country, they have to be shrewd about how to tax it and it's not based on price. it should be based on content of the intoxicant, if you will. and so, as it becomes more of a revenue source i think it's harder to argue against. more and more states are going to go for it. there are dangers in terms of edibles from what i understand. those are carefully regulated. and kpt just rely on maureen dowd my friend deciding how much to eat herself. >> poor maureen dowd. curling up in a corner. >> we have to give -- make sure that she can start slow. >> right. >> that's a serious concern. in colorado, based on what i know, there have been some serious incidents with it. >> let's talk about that. one of the big differences between these states is the sale of edibles, exactly that type. not allowed in washington as of now and you mentioned maureen

dowd's column about the very undertaking, a finer moments i thought. in a colorado hotel room and freaked. i strained to remember where i was or even what i was wearing. staring at the exposed brick wall. i became convinced i had died and no one was telling me. i feel you, maureen. should edibles be legal in these states, mason? >> yes. because if we keep that type of product illegal, it is just going to be available in the underground market which is exactly what we're trying to eliminate. we need to make sure that the products are packaged properly, labeled properly. we want to pro- vent accidental consumption of them. i mean, with maureen dowd, you know, it's great that she really brought this issue up because it is what we need to be talking about. this is how we should be talking about marijuana. but, you know, to put this in perspective, she acknowledged she took so much and didn't listen apparently to what she was told and follow the instructions on the labeling and

that's on par with, you know, her saying she wants to try a martini for the first time and then having six and getting violently ill and potentially passing out and dying. >> it's deceptive. the candy bars, no small. i get where she was coming from. >> it's a valid point. a great point. >> right. there's a danger there. >> there's actually an effort under way to limit servings in a unit, a serving and potentially very good idea. >> right. it seems clear to come up with smarter and smarter ways to regulate and amount in the product as you're saying, mason. karen, the overall arc seems to be more and more support for this. pew puts support at 54% nationally. oregon, alaska, d.c. efforts underway what to legalize. is this a matter of time, inevitable? >> i think it is. two factors to look at, there's a sort of economics of it that i think other states look at and

look towards that. and then also, we know that some of what's been happening with marijuana is connected to some of the justice system reforms that we have been seeing in terms of criminalizing the use of marijuana so -- and i also think that's sort of an attitudinal shift happening and having increasing number of states going through the experiences and will learn we know how much is a unit and how much to tax it and all of those things and probably going to be pretty, you know, common place not too long from now. >> mason, appreciate your join us. always great to have you here. we're coming back to you on another pressing issue. first, up next, this man that we're about to talk about, see his picture there, risked everything to save an imperilled people that the rest of the world was turning away. two ambassadors join us to talk about his legacy and turning to a surprise part of the world on today's immigration crisis. you don't want to miss this one. important legal matters in just minutes.

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do you remember the name raul wallenberg? congress is giving him the gold medal. he was a swedish diplomat in budapest in world war ii at a time when european jews were being rounded up, massacred, turned away everywhere they sought shelter. he took them into swedish diplomatic spaces, risked everything including his own life for them. according to some accounts he saved at least 20,000 jews, some say tens of thousands more. what's his legacy teach us about today's greatest challenges that congress faces aas ths they awa this man. joining us is mark bring zin ski

and as we reflect on the leg sane what he did for the jewish people, very quickly wanted your take on breaking developments happening right now in israel. today israeli immediating reporting two rockets intercepted over tel aviv. idf sending reservists to the border. ambassador, what role should the u.s. play in aleleviating the crisis? >> well, you know, ronan what we have seen in the middle east is not just an american problem. it's not just a problem isolated to the middle east. it is an international problem. and it's good that others join us in trying to address this challenge. which in certain ways go to the legacy of wallinberg. the importance of not being indifferent. a 32-year-old young swedish diplomat in nazi-occupied hungary on his own spearheaded the saving of tens of thousands through original, creative efforts, creating false

passports, jumping between trains to hand those passports to people scheduled for destruction. it is the kind of proactive engagement that's a lesson for us all. >> it's an astonishing story. ambassador, do you think that that proactive engagement that's so much a part of wallenberg's story should play right now in the israel-palestinian con plikt? >> i think that the wallenberg was an inspiration for all of us individually in our work. and i think this is something to follow up ore here shows that one man can make a difference. he showed compassion, determination. he showed moral courage. and also, the fact that you could live up to your ideals and protect them. and that's something i think to inspire us all in international diplomacy and possible for us to really engage in these kind of conflicts that you also see in

israel-palestine. >> does sweden plan any greater engagement? >> sweden is very engaged in israel, in palestine, as well. we are a great supporter of the palestinian authority and i think also i'd like to say that we are engaged also in forging an efficient policy on the part of the european union and part of 28 members. >> ambassador, a lot of mysteries surround raul wallenberg's death. he was a childhood history and how and when his life ended. russia said he died in prison in 1945 and people speculate otherwise. why is there that lingering mystery? >> that's in certain ways a responsib important responsibility to follow up on the fate of wallenberg. probably dying in lonely isolation. and i think understanding ultimately what happened to him

is part of the celebration of the hero. tomorrow the congressional gold medal, one of our nation's highest civilian honors, will be bestowed to raul wallenberg and accepted his by his still living half-sister who flew over to accept it in the rotunda and asking and answering that question on the fate of wallenberg is an important part of the story. it is also the case that when president obama was in stockholm on the historic visit to sweden last september he was asked by the still living half sister of raul wallenberg to follow up on the fate of wallenberg and i'm very pleased to say that at a very high level the white house did follow up in moscow. no response has been given yet and we're waiting for an answer but it's imperative for us to follow up on the fate of raul wallenberg because that's part of the legacy of the importance of not being indifferent. >> ambassador, the legacy also

applies specifically to the theme of not turning away the needy and that's something that sweden as a country confronts in a very acute way right now. more than 114,000 refugees from places like syria, iraq in sweden and not everyone's happy about it. we have seen demonstrations there. in light of the wallenberg legacy, does that surprise you? >> sweden is one of the countries in europe that receives the greatest number of refugees from different hot spots of the world. i think we are the country in europe of the greatest number of refugees coming out of syria, also during the iraq war. just a suburb of stockholm with more refugees than the entire united states. we have a generous policy ready to try to do our bit and a need for additional burden sharing in europe when koit it comes to

these issues and try to be as forthcoming as possible and very much contributing to society once they're integrated and part of society. they're -- we have received 100,000 people out of the bosnian wars and they're swedish citizens. having said that, of course, there's always a problem with the integration of refugees, people coming from other cultures. and unfortunately, sweden is not spared. we have seen anti-semitism in europe on the rise. there's been occasions of this in sweden, as well. we try to counteract it. my government is fiercely works against anti-semitism and trying to work for tolerance in society, trying to help with the education of our young population to understand what's going on in the world and i think that's particularly important. >> and ambassador, that powder keg of resentment and same time really wanting to bring people in and for the sake of our own

nation's competitiveness is what we feel in the united states with the border crisis. it's in america's history, too, just as it is in sweden. fdr didn't let immigrants enter the united states in the world war ii. president obama is navigating the pros and cons again. what can america learn from wallenberg's legacy as it confronts immigration specifically? >> i think that supporting the young raul wallenbergs of today is walking the walk in terms of 6 that legacy, ronan. what i mean is this. in stockholm, i have had the privilege of meeting young ukrainians who have been protesting for what's right. i have had the privilege of introducing to the presidential delegation that came to sweden last september the winner of the raul wallenberg award last year who organized young people against anti-semitism and

xenophobia in southern sweden. those are the raul wallenbergs of today and if we stand with them, they're stronger. and i think that's the mandate of the legacy of raul wallenberg. >> that is an incredibly important message for all of us to hear and i hope it weighs on present-day conversations about the great human rights challenges and i appreciate both of you coming on to talk about it. ambassadors. >> thank you. >> let's follow up on the question. we have been talking about immigration. karen, what more does the president need to do to stop this problem? >> well, i think the measures looking at in terms of the initial crisis at the border right now are right. but i do any we need more of a moral conversation. mine, just listening to that conversation, i mean, this is a humanitarian crisis seeing with the children now and also -- i mean, it's become, you know, it is a racist conversation that tends to happen talking about

immigration reform and what we have seen recently some of the images of the protests, you know, of buses filled with these children and people, you know, the angry protests, i think we need to remember humanity more in this conversation. >> right. if there's a lesson of wallenberg it is don't turn away the people persecuted and men and women and children in the border crisis being persecuted, fleeing violence. howard, is congress to blame here? is the gridlock reforming the system to acouple date the people coming in the problem? >> well, the problem is that immigration is a, as an issue, as a challenge to the united states is a moving target. it constantly needs to be revisited. you can't have one law that lasts forever and never been that way in the united states. it needs constant vigilance by congress. congress is unable to be vigilant of its own activities let alone the world right now. and it's a tragedy because as karen said there's a moral

dimension, a law enforcement dimension. none of which are being properly handled because congress is the only place for it debated and that is not happening and that, too, is something that raul wallenberg would be concerned about today. >> howard, i think you summed it up. it is a tragedy. karen, howard, really appreciate it. see you in a few. bringing you back all throughout today. later, little, underappreciated, overlooked for four bigger neighbors and, no, not talking about slovenia. something you have on hand. such a clever tease and i'm confused by it. the image reveals all and we'll explain all later in the show. stay with us. d. but one dark stormy evening... there were two things i could tell: she needed a good meal and a good family. so we gave her what our other cats love, purina cat chow complete. it's the best because it has something for all of our cats! and after a couple of weeks she was healthy, happy,

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♪ during the cadillac summer's best event, lease this all new 2014 cts for around $459 a month or purchase with 0% apr and make this the summer of style. we are back with breaking news on the immigration crisis unfolding on the border. take a look at this number. you are hearing a lot coming days. president obama just requested nearly $4 billion in emergency funds from congress. that is 4 billion with a lot of zeros. governor rick perry also just in the last hour finally accepted an invitation to meet with the president in texas for fund-raisers at the end of the week and there's talk about whether that would happen because perry is locking horns

with the president on the crisis and still no plan for the president to visit the border. the point of a lot of that friction while he's there. back with me, howard fineman and karen finney. appreciate your both sticking around for this. howard, governor perry initially said he wouldn't meet with the president on the tarmac. they're going to meet privately at the request of the white house. is this a meeting at the end of the day that the president needed to have for political optics sake? >> no question. i wonder how much of that $4 billion extra going to texas. i think he did, especially because the president is down there for fund-raisers. and he isn't going to the border. that commodation you mentioned optics. that's not good optics for the white house. don't forget that the amount they asked for here is much more than people initially expected. they were talking about 2 billion. this is 4 billion. i ahead the white house document on this.

st they start with enforcement and deterrence. i agree with what karen said earlier in the show about the need for moral vision on this but looking at it in narrow political terms, the president is trying to protect some democratic senate candidates in red states and tough elections by using a lot of money on enforcement and deterrence and processing those kids quickly. >> karen, what about the decision not to go to the border? people are inflamed about this. a texas congressman wrote i'm sure president bush thought the same thing, to look down at everything from up in the sky and then owned it after a long time and referring to that infamous flight over new orleans. is that a fair some pair son and why not just go? >> this is one where going to the word optics, i personally as a democrat am concerned about the optics. i don't know he necessarily needs to go to the border but come up with some way to show

the president sort of engaged in this issue. that could be, you know, he's done meetings with immigration advocates but the optics of going to texas to raise money and not going to the border, i found that to be a bit of a puzzling decision but i think meeting with governor perry and for the governor, governor to have it be a private meeting, great optics for him to say he gave it to the president but he doesn't have to deal with a photograph of him with the president. >> howard, this number, $4 billion, is that too big to get through congress and appetite for that? >> well, that's a really good question. i think that the president is kind of calling the republicans on this because a lot of the money will go for enforcement, for deterrence and for processing people who really you have to describe as refugees. and they deserve a hearing in court and that's according to the law by the way passed when

george w. bush was president that gives special treatment to unaccompanied kids of central america. that was designed to address the issue of sex trafficking but now it's turned around and become a major feature of our immigration law. the republicans all voted for it so they need to fund it. i think that would be the president's argument. he's got a shot at getting the money, calling their bluff saying it's a big problem. i'm not -- this is not a sweeping overhaul of all immigration law. leave that aside but do this now and anything to pass in the crazy congress this would seem to me to be the thing. >> you mentioned that sex trafficking protection thes law that passed with broad bipartisan support at the heart of the debate and we want you to stick around for looking at that. if congress doesn't have an appetite for this, karen, do you think that will finally spur the president to take executive action more decisively on this issue? >> i hope so. i mean, i am in the camp of people who are, you know, tired of, you know, him trying to give

boehner room to get something done. that's not going to happen so i think at this point certainly if congress will not take action on this, where it's as you pointed out narrowly defined, very clear what it is what they want to do and not acting on that, the president is more than justified in saying, you know, he should say, sue me? right? i'm trying to get something done. we're going to get something done. >> he has sue me as a joke and as a matter of fact. john boehner is going to sue him. >> yes, he is. >> stick around. we'll look at this much more and i'm glad howard raised the particular law because the president is saying the hands are tied because of that piece of republican-introduced legislation and we're actually going to hear from an advocate on the human trafficking side of the debate on just that. someone you might not expect to weigh in on the debate. lucy lui the actress with us up next. stick around. [ female announcer ] there's a gap out there.

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president obama has said that his administration has their hands tied dealing with this border crisis because of a law from the bush era. one ironically aimed at curbing child trafficking. that's the trafficking victims protection act of 2008. it gave sweeping new protections to kids entering the united states alone from countries other than mexico or canada. and it delayed the deportations while they received a fair hearing. that now is a problem. it's a political problem. and it's an actual problem as we try to expedite getting these individuals to somewhere sustainable not housing them in warehouses. it was designed, of course, to respond to a disturbing flood of human trafficking into the united states and passed with broad bipartisan support. it's happening right here in the midst and not just children from central america. today, in our call to action, an

advocate wades in against the fight of trafficking. lucy lui is a unicef ambassador for a decade and shining a spotlight on the horrors of trafficking. we recently sat down with her to talk about a new film based on a compelling new story. >> stop it! >> a lot of people don't know that something that happened in this movie is possible. it's a true story. i wish it didn't happen but it is something that happens every single day. i think that having people understand that there are women and children being, you know, taken hostage and auctioned off, this behavior is not -- we're not going to stand for that. there are young girls to range from the age of 5 years old and up and even 3-year-old children. they're not children at that point. a're just toddlers and infants raped and abused and a cultural backdrop to it, as well. having the idea if you're very

sick and if you have intercourse with a child or an infant that is a virgin somehow give you energy and vitality and help save your life. united states has a huge sex trafficking business and it's big money and money is business and business -- people don't care what it is. what commodity it is as long as it brings in money for them. you look at the united states. there's an awareness that happens outside of the united states. everything happens outside of the united states. but really, in the united states, it's very prevalent and it happens at truck stops, everywhere. so, i think once people sort of open their eyes to it they start to recognize what's happening in their own backyard. think they that social media is a springboard for a lot of people to draw attention to important issues that a lot of people in different countries can't access and now access it by seeing a sentence or looking at a video or having photograph of proof. a lot of women who get rescued or escape end up going back

because they don't know any other way and the mind is set in that direction and in that sort of a victimized state. so it's very difficult. and we have to find the resources to really be able to nurture these women back to a place of normalcy. and they're children, too. it's hard. children are so susceptible. i think that when you see something visually in a movie, it becomes that much more impactful. and you see a young girl being raped, it doesn't seem like that's a possibility. and when you see it, it almost forces you to take action. and even if you don't actually physically do something, your mind is changed. once you watch something, you are a part of it. you are therefore taking action just by watching something and being witness to it and then spreading the word. >> it is shocking to the conscious an it's right here under our noses in america and

that's what this legislation that the obama administration is complaining about was meant to address. it's there for a reason. so, as we for very valid reasons move to expedite the deportations, we have to keep the protections that the law supposed to accomplish in place. howard fineman and karen finney back with us to discuss that. is this law that the obama administration is citing for tying the hands requiring more time for fair hearings for young people to protect them against the exploitation, is that the issue here? is that the problem? >> well, it provides the administration with a reason, a compelling moral reason. perhaps the most compelling moral reason to think of in human affairs practically to ask for the money to properly administer the results of this law. there are many reasons why these kids are coming north. the poverty, escaping the drug cartels, family break-ups,

governments that don't work, economic disparities, you name it. but this is certainly one of them. and this is the one that the administration has to use by law to judge whether these kids can be sent back to the countries they came from and it takes money and time and staff to do this properly. republicans are going to say it's the president's fault because the dream act provisions that he put into place gave the wrong message. i don't think that's the major factor. i don't think that's the major factor. >> karen, as this flood of young immigrants increases calls to erode the kinds of protections that take time and make it harder to deport swiftly how do you maintain the protections necessary to address the epidemic of sex trafficking? >> the law is not the problem, right? and the law is underneath that law or the right ideas. right? the right morals, values. >> the administration, karen, saying the law is part of the

problem. >> they are but i think what they're -- what i see is an administrative problem. right? they need more resources to process the influx of people more quickly. the law wasn't designed to handle i think these kinds of numbers. right? so i think part of it is is put additional resources in place to deal with the current situation but again i don't think that means you -- i know the administration is saying that the law is the problem and again we need to make sure that we also look at the law and remember we put it in place for a reason. right? is reason still very much exists and deal short term with the problem that we have and let's not unravel something that was a good idea when we initially did it. >> all right. howard and karen, appreciate your sticking around for that. we have one more conversation for you up ahead because we have a couple of stories and we need you for. but first, this week's call to action is this very debate of how we balance the need to deport and act swiftly against an epidemic of trafficking right now. we are asking you to help urge

the senate to pass a bipartisan bill, the justice for victims of trafficking act. so that hopefully even as we move to deport we also keep in place those protections we have been talking about. sign our petition. head to ronanfarrowdaily@msnbc.com. up next, that conversation we are talking about. the panel is back to weigh in with a tech voice on a federal judge's supreme court smackdown with surprising, colorful online shorthand. facebook laying down the law on a teenage safari hunter and this little guy. it's a brave new world of digital challenges literally up ahead.

cadmium, mercury, lead. all on the periodic table. all inside these, too. now the last thing we want is for all that to mix with water. so recycle. you'll keep your planet clean, t-m-y-k. stfu. can't seem to find it in the black's law dictionary but it's

in the vocabulary of a judge. that's richard george coff and wrote this about the hobby lobby ruling. the court is now causing more harm, division, to our democracy than good by deciding hot button cases. as the kids say, it's time for the court to stfu. if you're not clear on the meaning, it is a link to urban dictionary. most judges went with the doctrine of letting the existing law stand and not upsetting things but shut the f-up makes the argument nicely, too. it's old problems with new forms in a brave new digital world and joining me is samantha murphy kelly. thank you for being here. the judge, he has a history of this controversy, samantha. in the government shutdown, for instance, he said tell congress to go to hell.

>> right. >> don't you have to praise the fact that social media allowed even the people you least expect in the judiciary to be honest? >> exactly. it is not really the type of language expect from a federal judge again, you know, now that social media's opened up a platform for celebrities, judges, anybody, it's one of those things where everyone needs to maybe take a step back and really think about what they're putting out there before they do. i think it's one of those things where he's gotten a little into trouble before and now we're seeing it again today. >> right. he also blogged some sexist stuff about how young women lawyers -- he's an older guy, talking about how young women dress in the courtroom. en this -- then he took it back and apologized. certainly the honesty is appreciated. >> and he included the urban dictionary link for anybody that didn't get it. >> that's savvy. here's another big social media story that's been popping online. it's been trending. facebook's getting a lot of heat for deleting some pretty controversial pictures.

they're from this big game hunter who's also a rather attractive teenage girl a cheerleader, in fact. not the person you'd expect, necessarily, in shots like this one you see here. that's triggering this huge debate. of course, animal rights activists are horrified. and then people pushing back, including, look, it's online, death threats, sexist comments are buying into a patriarchal view is about a woman engaging in these activities. how do you make sense of that? >> sure. so when this first started to bubble up, there was an online e petition that went viral. it got maybe 40,000 signatures. basically, the petition was asking facebook to step in and remove these pictures from the site. a lot of social networks don't take a stance one way or the other. they did end up deleting the pictures. a lot of people were saying, why would they step in? but in their policy, it says you can't post graphic images if it's related to animal cruelty.

>> they gave your site a statement. they said, we removed reported content that promotes poaching of engaged species, the sale of animals for organized fight. this is pretty cut and dry. there are a people who think it's a violation of free speech. >> sure. i think it is a little bit of a challenge because it is in its policy. in one case, they said that people can use graphic images if it's to convey maybe animals -- to prevent animal cruelty or to make it more of a statement as to prevent it. but in this case, it was kind of showing it as a prize or something that doesn't really coincide with the policy. >> they're pretty gross images. >> depending on where you fall, some people were very supportive of her too. she has a whole following of people saying, of course -- >> do you think it's a feminist statement? >> exactly, yeah. i think it really depends here. a lot of companies try not to take a stance, but in this case because it is graphic and in their poll circumstances they decided to pull it.

>> maybe my favorite is she actually then went on a news channel and said, well, what about thomas jefferson? here's a picture of him hunting. seemingly neglecting some of the more controversial parts of thomas jefferson's personal history like owning hundreds of slaves. he did some not great things in his time. so another big story out there, which is why i wanted to have you on the program, is you wrote a story that every person i've described it to has been fixated on about the pinky. the unsung hero of the digital family. explain why the pinky is changing in its significance. >> sure. so everybody talks about the thumb and the pointer when you're holding your phone and how important it is. but the pinky is so important in terms of balance and support. and basically, when you hold your phone up, the pinky acts as basically a shelf. you know, you can just pick it up regularly, but once you kind of navigate throughout the interface, it really falls to the bottom. >> it's essential. >> yes, it's basically very important to keep it stable.

>> so all of you at home, take a look at you're holding your phone. this isn't something you necessarily expect, but there it is. the shelf. you wrote, grab your smartphone and do a simple task like check your e-mail. like a trusty steed carrying the weight of your contacts, apps, and messages upon its tiny, boney surface, the pinky is most likely propping you have the device. let's go to the panel on this one. have both of you emerged from today, howard, karen, with a newfound respect for the pinky? karen? >> i've always loved the pinky because the pinky swears, the one that counts the most. >> howard is living out the pinky dream. the pinky swear, obviously essential. samantha, have you talked to evolutionary biologists about this? >> there's a reason why we do this instinctually. back to the ancient days when people were making tools out of rocks and different stones, they would hold it in one hand and use your other hand to kind of

do the creation of it. but as you were holding it in one hand, your pinky would typically fall towards the bottom and act as a way to prop it up. so, you know, it has to do with weight too. if you're holding a teacup, your pinky might go up because in that case it needs it to be more for balance and not necessarily wait. it's not just so you look dainty. >> you have really done a lot of thinking on this. >> i know. i spent a lot of time on the pinky. and it never gets any credit. it's working so hard for you. you never know. >> you've changed the conversation on this important political issue. howard fineman, are you going to now get self-conscious and stop using your pinky? >> no, but it makes me realize how much the whole world is now contained in these things. i mean, at "the huffington post," like every website, we're obsessed with making sure our contend, video, and everything is on the smartphone. the smartphone is our lives right now. so studying the hand that holds the smartphone is a very

inevitable and cool thing to do. congratulations. >> amen to that. this has been a pleasure. thank you for gamely sticking around for that. and thank you, all of you at home, for changing your opinion of the humble pinky. that wraps things up for today's "rf daily." thank you all for joining me. now it's time for "the reid report" with my colleague joy reid. do not miss it. it's one of our finest programs. stay with us. vo: this is the summer. the summer of this. the summer that summers from here on will be compared to. where memories will be forged into the sand. and then hung on a wall for years to come. get out there, with over 50,000 hotels at $150 dollars or less. expedia. find yours.

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>> heck just look at everything from up in the sky. >> the borderlands deserve a presidential visit. >> officials say help is not coming here quick enough. then, hobby lobby summer. how democrats plan to go all out to mobilize the women's vote to fight back on contraception. and nevada, assemblywoman lucy flores, who's gone from a gang affiliated high school dropout to being on track to become one of the most high-profile women politicianings in the country. she'll be here and we'll talk immigration, the border crisis, and her amazing story. we begin with the white house, which is once again in crisis mode, with president obama drawing plenty of criticism over a fundraising trip to texas that does not include a stop at the border. >> i'm sure that president bush thought the same thing, that he could just look at everything from up in the sky, and then he owned that for a long time. i