police presence last and what impact is it having on the psych key of the community? and what about the investigation? where is the search for the truth going? analysis on the michael brown shooting straight ahead. hello, everyone. it's high noon here in the west and 9:00 a.m. out west. welcome to "weekends with alex witt." two days after the name of the officer who shot michael brown, we're getting the first look at that officer. nbc has confirmed that this is officer darren wilson receiving a condemnation from his police department earlier this year. the 28-year-old officer is a six-year veteran of the police department and grew up in the st. louis area. the photos were first published by yahoo! news on saturday. ferguson police have not responded to several requests about the photo.

police say that darren wilson stopped michael brown and his friend for walking in the middle of the police. according to the police, brown reached into the police car and shot the officer several times in the street. we have more breaking news. we've also learned that eric holder is ordering a federal autopsy of michael brown's body, this at the request of michael brown's body. this will be performed by a medical examiner as soon as possible. meantime, there is some calm now. for the most part, it was a peaceful protest but several people were ordered after the curfew took effect. police said they had to act to get protesters off the street. >> we have the right to assemble peacefully. it is our right. >> reporter: police fired smoke canisters and tear gas into the crowds to clear them.

today, the governor of missouri responded to criticism about his handling of the situation. >> it's been a horrific week and appropriate energy and angst. with a dual investigation going on, with the justice department and local prosecutor and especially after talking to general holder, appreciated them sending in 40 additional fbi agents to make sure that they are moving to get a thorough investigation, to get justice here. >> meantime, the national action network will hold a rally for justice today. the leader and msnbc host, the reverend al sharpton will lead the event t begins four hours from now. the family of michael brown will attend. he was shot last saturday afternoon by a police officer. nbc's ron allen is in ferguson for us. good day to you, ron. >> reporter: good day to you, alex. it was an incredible show of force. the plan was to move into the

area. a much softer approach. but they say they changed pans when they got reports of armed gunmen in the streets and a shooting victim in the area. the commanders gave the order to clear the streets. >> don't shoot. don't shoot. >> reporter: tension had been building towards a showdown through the hours counting down to the curfew. while many protesters obeyed the call to clear the streets, a defiant group dug in. scores of police armed with military-style weapons that have added to the anger and resentment. first came a warning. >> this is the police department. you are violating the state-imposed curfew. >> reporter: and then about ten minutes after midnight, the police moved forward opening fire with smoke canisters, multiple rounds, sending the crowd running for cover. police say their response was appropriate because they had more to deal with than a

protest. >> a shooting victim is in critical condition who may lose their life, we had a police car shot at tonight and, yes, i think that was the proper response. >> reporter: earlier in the day, missouri's government declared a state of emergency. >> we can for the allow the ilwill of the few to undermined the goodwill of the many. >> reporter: this is following a security tape showing michael brown allegedly stealing cigars from a store some ten minutes before officer darren wilson shot and killed the unarmed teenager about half a mile away last saturday. now this -- authorities have said that most of the protests here have been peaceful. they blame a small number of criminals for the violence. they seem determined to root them out. in less than an hour, police took back control of the heart of this besieged city, the

protesters fleeing into the night. a heavy rain cooling down the confrontation. the police considering their next step as they try to keep the peace. the violence was contained to a small area of ferguson several blocks long. the rest of the town was peaceful observing the curfew. officials have not said whether they will try to impose another midnight to 5:00 curfew again tonight. alex, back to you. >> ron allen, thank you. joining me now, todd johnson with the grio. let's talk about the incident at the barbecue restaurant. it has forced police to take the stronger action, right? tell us about that. >> how you doing, alex? captain johnson said in his press conference earlier this morning that that was the reason that the vehicles had to be brought in because they were trying to reach what they learned w learned was a shooting victim and it's unclear who shot this

young man and how it helped but around midnight, it seems like all of the timeline just meshed with after the curfew. so it was a little confusing for folks who were trying to figure out if the response was related to the curfew or related to the incident at the barbecue restaurant. there was a large group of protesters. some of them were armed and again we had that shooting victim. it was a bit confusing to learn what the police and highway patrol and the police were actually responding to. but eventually they cleared that up for us earlier this morning. >> so there were several incidents concurrently happening, it appears. what about the use of tear gas versus smoke canisters? there was some question about that. >> there were a lot of questions about that and there was confusion among the police that were gathered around speed yeah members into the tonight. we had conflicting reports saying initially the canisters did not contain tear gas and

then we had people approach the media area where the media were assembled saying, in fact, it was tear gas that was deployed. so there was a confusion on multiple levels for not knowing the protesters and some of the people in law enforcement, some folks telling us it was just smoke and then later in the night confirming that it was, in fact, tear gas. so they used both as they approached last night. >> okay. so the curfew gets implemented at midnight and goes until 5:00 a.m. in general, in advance of the curfew, did you talk to residents? did they welcome the idea of this, or not? >> reporter: many of the residents that i talked to did in fact welcome the idea of a curfew in the sense that we have this idea that peaceful protests, we described things as peaceful only if there aren't -- there is a destruction or if there isn't rioting or looting. but still throughout this week there have been, you know,

honking of horns into the night, 12:00, 1:00 a.m., 2:00 a.m. the curfew was welcomed as a method to bring order to a place in a community that really is experiencing chaos at this point. so it was welcomed. it was embraced to a degree but for the large group last night, mostly young folks seemingly not concerned with the curfew and not concerned with any state of emergency order from the governor. >> but i think it bears repeating, todd, that for the most part, the curfew worked. i mean, the incidents of violence and the police having to come in with the armored vehicles, that was a very small area. correct? >> reporter: it was, alex. and it is important for people to understand that throughout the day and throughout this week, really, the majority of the demonstrations, the people that are lining the avenue here in ferguson, holding up cards,

talking about justice for mike brown, letting their voice be heard are carrying that out peacefully and without incident. it's only in the night after midnight when seemingly a different crowd comes along. many residents not believing that all of the groups gathered are actually from this community so it takes on a different element after midnight and that's why i think authorities have kind of pinpointed midnight as their starting point for the curfew. so, yes, largely peaceful, largely expressive and very engaging and energetic, obviously, but, again, when incidents like last night happened that detracts and distracts away from everything that happened throughout the day, the headlines will only read that seven were arrested for breaking the curfew. >> todd, i'm curious about where you are right now and the reaction because we see very prominently behind you emergency vehicles only. that's got to be a little disturbing toress departments. this is midday on a sunday.

you see police tape. so where are you? >> reporter: we're about less than a mile from where the incident took place last night near the quick trip that was destroyed last sunday and we're in a shopping complex. we're in a parking lot near a shopping center near a target and there are police vehicles all over the place. so if you are shopping this morning, if you're coming to get something to eat, if you're purchasing food or clothes for your family or what have you, you will see police everywhere. and you will see the sign, like you mentioned behind me. so it's a bit drawing, again, for people that actually live here. members of the media descend on ferguson in moments like this, obviously of course, local media is all over this as well. but for the people who live here, trying to restore a sense of normalcy and thinking about moving on past this incident is growing harder and harder with each passing day, especially with signs, like you mentioned

behind me. >> trying to return to a sense of normalcy and yet trying to get some answers about what in the h ecell happened. todd johnson, thank you. so was the police response last night appropriate? let's go to retired atf agent in charge jim cavanaugh. i know you were with us last night. give us an assessment of what happened? >> a person was shot, a person in the crowd or more than one person seen with firearms, i think they had to change just walking up on it. and yet it was still restrained. i mean, you didn't see -- there's no actions of policemen beating anybody with night sticks or anything like that. there's some gas deployment which is a general crowd disperse sal tech netechnique b

the police. they made some arrests. >> may i ask you, though, how is it that the police are not clear if they were using smoke canisters or gas. is this indicative of a small town police department and they are overwhelmed by everything? shouldn't they know? >> well, i think what happens is, when you have a deployment like that and a line of officers and an on-scene commander, they may tell officers to deploy smoke here on this side and then the by the time it gets to the public information officer for the troopers, he tells the reporters that there's a delay or lag in the information. i don't think that they are hiding that they deployed cs smoke or plain smoke. they did it. it's on the camera. they are not going to hide that. it seems to have cleared out the street. section arrests.

one person is critically wounded by gunfire and no arrest has been made there. and also captain johnson said that they had a report of some people on the roof over looking the troopers and they were worried that they might have firearms as well. they had to take action. >> governor jay nixon was asked why a curfew was issued. let's listen to what he had to say. >> when we saw that second night late, you know, the clear actions of a few to loot, we knew we had to keep people's property safe in order to get justice here. the longer is to make sure that the dual investigations get to justice. >> do you think what happened last night, a curfew can be counterproductive? >> well , it can be. it was a pretty late curfew, midnight.

the night before last when the looting happened at the liquor store, i think they were pretty restrained. they only threw one canister of gas to prevent officers being pelted by bricks. they didn't try to do anything like rescue a fifth of beggin o there. but they need justice for all in ferguson. . investigative side of the house needs to support this safety and security side of the house. >> jim cavanaugh, thank you so much for staying up with us. appreciate it. the release of that store surveillance is drawing more criticism mainly from governor jay nixon. he has two reasons why he's against the release. we'll talk about it next. sundays are the warrior's day to unplug and recharge. what if this feeling could last all week? with centurylink as your trusted partner, it can. our visionary cloud infrastructure and global broadband network free you to focus on what matters. with custom communications solutions and dedicated support,

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that shows 18-year-old michael brown in an alleged strong-armed robbery. this is what the governor said today on "meet the press." >> we did not know that was going to be released. i don't think the attorney general knew that. we disagree for two reasons. one, in an attempt to disparage the character of this victim in the middle of a process like this is not right. it's just not right. and secondarily, it did put the community and quite frankly the region and the nation, you know, on alert again. >> an attorney for the brown family says they are beyond outraged over the release of this video. they say it's nothing more than an attempt to soil their son's reputation. i will be speaking to that attorney coming up later on this hour. joining me now is state representative sharon page who represents the city there in the missouri house. representative pace, thank you for being here. my first question to you is, i'm

sure you've heard from your constituents, what are they telling you about the protests and the police reaction? >> well, initially when it first started, there was some concerns about the use of -- overuse of protection, if they want to call it that, and the weapons that were being used and the tactics. i think they did pull back, which is a good thing. to some extent, they may have pulled back too much and the looting at that point began and there was some concerns about that. their concerns from the seniors about there's a curfew that's out there and there are certainly concerns about that peaceful protesters have been on the scene and i've been walking with them as well as other representatives of the district who includes gray and courtney cou curtis. there's concern that the parents have not been allowed to see their son. they haven't had a time for grieving and that's a big concern.

you know, they are asking for peace and to stop the violence as well. we need to certainly do that. this is something that is going on all over the nation. it's not anything that's in you but it happened here and this is family. the people in ferguson are not like this. these people come out after hours and that's a concern and that's why the curfew was initiated. >> ma'am, you mentioned the looting on friday night. in fact, a lot of people came out saturday to clean up and actually to help prevent looting any further. here's what folks are saying about that. >> the department that is out here violating this community, y'all know that ain't right. you know you ain't right. this isn't the way to do it. y'all could come out here and just don't do this. don't do this. >> it was peaceful. most of the people that came down, it was peaceful. i saw them looting and it represented me and i don't want my son to look at me like that. i have a son and that's not how

we should move. i understand them being mad but -- >> representative pace, do you think those sentiments reflect the majority of your constituents? >> i feel that the majority of constituents that are really concerned about trheir communit and how they are being portrayed. these people are coming from outside and using this as an opportunityist and using this as a time to stir up things and to be self-fulfilling for themselves. it's not something that we want to associate with the death of michael and we certainly would hope that that would stop and the parents are asking for that as well. >> in fact, you've said, quote, it's about the child that's been killed and we need to work together to get a resolution for that. so what kind of resolution do you want to see? >> well, initially i had asked and sent a letter, also, to the attorney general for him to get involved and my understanding

is -- and also the justice department and that has happened, the fchl bi. so we just need resolution. we need transparency. we need to know step by step and a certain timeline, if possible, we have asked the attorney general chris coster to hopefully give the public some information and a timeline as to what expect at different i intervals. at least we'll have something to look forward to see that we're on target. we need to stop politicizing the events of these rioters, the rioting and the looting is something that's taken away from this key issue, the situation with the information being released at the same time as the officer's name and where meek ke michael is allegedly stealing cigar has nothing to do with

this. i think that should have been a separate press release or whatever they needed to do that. but that does not give justification to kill this young man and i'm outraged at that and there should have been something done to prevent that from happening. >> sentiment shared by many. thank you for your time. my next guest wants washington to take action in the shooting of michael brown and he's one of them himself. so what does he want congress to do? that's next. [ female announcer ] we help make secure financial tomorrows a reality for over 19 million people.

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my motheit's delicious. toffee in the world. so now we've turned her toffee into a business. my goal was to take an idea and make it happen. i'm janet long and i formed my toffee company through legalzoom. i never really thought i would make money doing what i love. we created legalzoom to help people start their business and launch their dreams. go to legalzoom.com today and make your business dream a reality. at legalzoom.com we put the law on your side. the calm has returned to ferguson, missouri, after more protests overnight and joining me on the situation in ferguson as well as the situation in iraq, ben cardin, members of the foreign relations committee. thanks for being with me. >> always a pleasure. >> this has sparked so much debate about the militarization of police departments. we've seen these officers in

full combat gears, they have been perched on mine vehicles, the kind that you would see in the battle in iraq. sniper rifles aimed at unarmed civilians. sir, should something be done in washington to either end or limit the kind of force police departments can use? >> it's not that they have this equipment, it's how they use this equipment. and certainly in a community event like this, it's not helpful at all. so it is good law enforcement, is what we're talking about. first and foremost, the law enforcement community wants to see peace and that's what we're working for right now but to show this force was not helpful. >> but to address the killing of michael brown, i know you've called on congress to take up your bill which bans all racial

profiling. talk about that bill, what it says, and how it will help. >> well, first, in the michael brown incident, we need a transparent investigation as to what happened. but we know in ferguson as well as in all communities, we need a close working relationship between community and law enforcement. if a community believes that they are being targeted because of their race or religion or ethnic background, it certainly will not allow for that type of working relationship. my legislation would end racial profiling in america at all levels of law enforcement. that's where a community is targeted solely because of their race or religion or ethnic background where you don't have specific information about a crime but you're targeting a group because of their race or religion or ethnic background. my legislation would end that once and for all to help build better working relationships between communities and law enforcement. >> ir s. i understand your programs would educate law enforcement officials and the difference between suspect descriptions and racial

profiling. is that seen as controversial at all or do you think that is something that might have bipartisan support? >> i would hope that this would not be controversial and we do have bipartisan interests. i hope we have the type of support we need to get it done. we've had too many individual episodes in this country so we are hopeful that we'll be able to get this done and i would hope that it would not be controversial because racial profiling is wrong. it's unamerican and doesn't help in solving crimes. it's a waste of resources and it's time for it to end. >> let's turn now to the situation in iraq. the u.s. conducted 14 more air strikes in that country in addition now to the nine air strikes yesterday. the president has said many times that this mission is only to protect u.s. dip lomats. at the same time, they keep warning about isis and the severe threat to the west. so should the mission from the united states actually be to destroy isis? >> well, our military options are somewhat limited. we're not going to be able, from

a military operation, to be able to destroy isis. what we need to do is cut off their support and one of the reasons we've been working so hard on a government that represents all of the people of iraq, including the sunni population, we would then cut off some of the support that isis is receiving in iraq itself. what we need to do is a multiple strategy, obviously providing humanitarian assistance and making sure that we do the best we can to help people. that's important to protect u.s. personnel it's important. but iraqis must take care of their own military needs. the united states can't do that for them. >> senator, is it a fool'ser rand for the u.s. to keep pushing for unity? are separate sunni and kurd states the real solution? >> a unity government -- we're doing the right thing by pushing for a unity government. that's the only way people will be able to live in peace. most sunnis, shias and kurds

understand that there will be to be a give a take relationship. that's what the international community is pushing for and that's the only way we'll have peace in the region. >> senator ben cardin, thank you for your help, as always. help isss is on the way for brown family. and with the quicksilver card from capital one, you earn unlimited 1.5% cash back on everything you purchase. not just "everything at the hardware store." not "everything, until you hit your cash back limit." quicksilver can earn you unlimited 1.5% cash back on everything you could possibly imagine. say it with me -- everything. one more time, everything! and with that in mind... what's in your wallet?

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critical condition. and seven people were arrested for violating the curfew. meantime, thousands have been donated to the go fund me campaign set up by the brown's family attorney. the fund has raised more than $58,000, in fact. the department of justice has just announced it will conduct an additional autopsy of michael brown. this at the request of his family. kristen welker is traveling with the president there on his last day on martha's vineyard before heading back to the white house. what is the justice department saying about all of this? >> reporter: alec, let me read you a statement by michael fallon, a spokesman for the department of justice. "due to the extraordinary circumstances of this case and at the request of the brown family attorney, a federal

medical examiner will perform an autopsy and justice department officials still plan to take the state-performed autopsy into account in the course of their investigation." valley jarrett spoke with governor jay nixon yesterday. she has been in constant contact with state and local officials there in ferguson. she's also been in contact with civil rights leaders, including in the naac perfop. the last time we heard from president obama was on thursday when he called for a time of healing and a de-escalation. the white house has been quite concerned about what they have been witnessing in ferguson. as you mentioned at the top, alex, president obama heads home tonight. he will spend two days in d.c. he'll be meeting with his top officials and vice president. he will certainly, i am sure,

include in those discussions updates about the crisis in ferguson and then he'll head back here to martha's vineyard. we haven't heard from him about this since thursday. i don't anticipate we will over the next few days but he'll continue to get updates. alex? >> the president has spoken publicly about racially charged problems in the past. whenever he weighs in, he gets blow back from both sides. either he doesn't say enough about race or he says too much and he's politicized it. >> reporter: we know that he came out and spoke after trayvon martin. that was a situation that obviously was very divisive and had the country engaged and quite royaled. so we heard him come out and speak in the wake of that. i think the calculation was a little bit different this time, alex, because you had these images coming out of ferguson that were so troubling. so you had the president release a statement early in the week. the white house was hoping that, due to the president's statement

and all of the calls, including from mr. brown's family for peace in ferguson, that the situation there would de-escalate. but when the president saw and the white house saw that that wasn't happening, then the calculation was made for him to come out and make that statement that we heard on thursday. so i think his decision to come out and address the nation about this was about race, to some extent, but more broadly about calming the streets of ferguson, calling for an open and independent investigation and making sure that it was handled properly. alex? >> kristen welker from martha's vineyard, thank you for joining me. and now we'll go to the brown's family attorney. what do you hope to learn from the additional autopsy? >> well, first of all, thank you for having me. i think the attorney general's call for a federal examiner to come in is encouraging. it's an indication that steps

are being taken regarding this case. and that's all the family wanted to be assured of in the first place, is that a fair and impartial transparent investigation is conducted surrounding the events of the death of their child on that saturday afternoon. so it is very encouraging to hear attorney general holder make that announcement. >> sir, perhaps one of the most vexing thing over the last 48 hours has been this, the decision by the ferguson police department to release the video and name of the officer who shot michael brown on the same day. what do you think about that? what is your interpretation of that action? >> well, the interpretation from everyone that i've talked to feel that it was a calculated decision on the part of the chief to sully the reputation of this young man while he's already dead, it's an attempt to assassinate whatever legacy that he may have after his death and

that's how they view it. they view it as an inciteful move and those that felt that way acted out based on it. now, let me just point out that no one knew anything about the ferguson market before the release of this video. for the last several days, people had walked past this market with no problem. but once the video was dropped, then the very night that it's dropped, then you have this big issue over at that market. there's a direct link between the two. >> let's hear what governor nixon has to say about that. >> they are bringing in additional 40 fbi agents to make sure that they are moving to get a thorough investigation, to get justice here and i appreciate their response and that energy to make sure that they get this

right. >> what do you make of the 40 additional fbi agents getting in on this case? >> well, it's just like the independent federal examiner. it's just an indication that steps are being taken pursuant to this investigation that sends a significant fall of encouragement to this family. that's pretty much all i can make out of it. i don't know exactly what they are doing but the fact that they are here and their focus is on this case is encouraging. >> it has been an extraordinarily difficult week for this family and a terrible ordeal. do they have anything to say to the people of ferguson right now? >> right now, alex, they are speechless. they are still distraught. keep in mind, they have not buried their child yet. they have not made final arrangements to have him rest in peace. and before they can do all that, they have to now contend with yet another attack on a child

that is already dead so you can imagine how they are feeling that is compounded by the initial situations that never went away. >> thank you for your time, anthony gray. i know it's a busy week for you as well. >> thank you, alex. taking the fight to isis. something has to be done. that's next. honey, look i got one to land. uh-huh (announcer) there's good more... honey, look at all these smart rewards points verizon just gave me. ooh, you got a buddy. i'm like a statue. i just signed up and, boom, all these points. ...and there's not-so-good more. you're a big guy... huh. oh no. get the good more with verizon smart rewards and rack up points to use towards the things you really want. now get 50% off all new smartphones. a body at rest tends to stay at rest... while a body in motion tends to stay in motion. staying active can actually ease arthritis symptoms. but if you have arthritis, staying active can be difficult. prescription celebrex can help relieve arthritis pain

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taking the fight to isis, the pentagon has announced that the military conducted 14 strikes around the mosul dam overnight. kurdish ground forces have partially retaken the critical dam. why isis has proven to be such a powerful adversary. >> isil now is a terrorist organization with an army. that's what makes them so dangerous. tanks, heavy artillery, money.

the peshmerga were armed up a little bit and now they have support from the iraqi air force and u.s. air force and have made real progress around that dam. >> joining me now is steven clemons. thank you for joining me. >> sure thing. >> 23 air strikes in about as many hours and taking over the dam seems more like a strategic mission rather than a humanitarian mission. are we seeing mission creep? >> it can be. if you had a 65-foot wall of water coming down over iraq, millions could be killed. in a certain degree, it's such an important strategic asset that it can't be ignored. we have the peshmerga fighting, i think, as hard as they can with weapons systems that we're increasingly providing but you have to remember that that whole army that the iraq government

had in the north, divisions and brigades just folded and collapsed. and when they collapsed and ran, isis took overall of those weapons systems, largely which were american weapons systems. so to a concerned degree, the peshmerga are outgunned by our own systems that have fallen into the hands of isis. so it is a bit of a mission creep but the dam is vital. >> british prime minister cameron called for intervention in iraq and wrote "the creation of an extremist caliphate in the heart of iraq and extending into syria is not a problem miles away from home. it will only go stronger until it can target us on the streets of britain." steven, if the uk joins in with that sort of determination, is a

real war all but gauuaranteed? >> what david cameron doesn't understand and which i find troublesome, people are looking at somehow isis is the threat to be beaten. iffize were to come out and create a state that it calls it islamic c achl liphate, how is it going to withstand other regional stakeholders. so the question is, how are they complicit or in the in what isis is doing and where is the larger scale deal making to shut isis down in where are we -- how are we working with the saudis, the kwa qataris and kuwaitis? but the idea that david cameron would join us in kind of looking at the conflict as isis exclusively, misses the point that it's a manifestation of a

sunni shia conflict in a region that's going to have to take a higher order in deal making where this will happen over and over again. it won't just be one sinjar mountain or yazidi village that is being executed, it will continue to play out. >> all right. let's look at an nbc poll from june which found that 50% of americans say that the u.s. has responsibility at all to help iraq fight isis. then, on the flipside, you hear from people in the intelligence communities calling for a lot are more action. how do you see the president weighing this? >> i think the president is trying to remind americans that the growth and opportunities and jobs and economic prospects are more in asia than the middle east which are going to be involved in these kind of military convulsions. until an ee kwi lib bree yes,

ma'am gets this back to stability rather than chaos. and it turns military men and women where we're not going to be able to move the needle one way or the other. the president is holding military restraint. it's what hillary clinton has been criticizing him for. i understand why he's doing it and i think that's where he sees most americans today. when most americans on labor day said we don't want to go to war with syria, that probably holds with the larger population as well. indicted governor rick perry says he's not abusing power. he's fighting back and you're going to hear from him coming up. on contact... ...and goes to work in seconds. ♪ tum, tum tum tum tums! try great tasting tums chewy delights. yummy. [ doorbell rings ] stall them. [ imitates monkey ] stop stalling. cascade platinum fights cloudy residue

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visit comcast.com/wireless to learn more texas governor rick perry is speaking out about his indictment on two felony charges, abuse of power and coercion, after allegedly trying to force a district attorney to resign after she was arrested for drunk driving. she refused and prosecutors say

that governor perry vetoed $7.5 million from her office. in an interview this morning, he said even his political enemies are on his side. >> david axelrod said this was a very sketchy indictment. professor dercowitz, who is not exactly my cheerleader, said it is outrageous. across the board you're seeing people weigh in and reflecting that this is way outside of the norm. this is not the way that we settle differences, political differences in this country. >> joining me now is eleanor clift, editor of "the daily beast." he says it's partisanship. is there any merit to this case? >> well, they say grand juries can indict a ham sandwich and i think in this particular locale they've indicted a couple of republican ham sandwiches in the

past. i think former republican senator kay bailey hutchison dealt with this and there's a history of political partisanship. they've got a pretty good case against the governor for abuse of authority. he basically punished the people of this locale because he thought the behavior of this woman was out of bounds. and so can he do that as governor? i suppose he has line item veto, yes. but it seems excessive. i think they will battle it out in the courts. a governor indicted is just not a headline you want when you're planning to run for president. >> yeah. if he's found nod guilty, though, or if the case gets dismissed, the question is, regarding the 2016 ambition, is it game over or does it rally the troops? >> if it's dismissed or he wins,

it helps. there's a couple republican governors now. scott walker has ethical issues in a lawsuit. governor christie and there's one more. there's a group of them and they are all bright stars and they are all facing legal issues and i'm sure that they all feel that they are partisan witch hunts but there are serious issues at the heart of these cases and now we'll see how it plays out. but it's a speed bump for governor perry who is really, you know, doing well, sort of capitalizing on his leadership in the border crisis. >> a lot more to come on this issue. let's move forward and talk about ferguson. the protests there certainly captured the focus of the nation, shining a light on race in america. the president addressed it in his statement on thursday. you've covered different white houses over the years. what's been your take for how presidents deal with racially charged issues like this?

>> well, dwight eisenhower sent in the troops. jack kennedy made a famous phone call to martin luther king in jail. there have been -- you know, these are different eras. i think this president has shown a great deal of restraint in dealing with these issues. i know john lewis, the congressman was calling for him to send in the national guard to federalize the national guard and i think he's going to do the best he can to exert some influence from washington and you see the attorney general involved and the president -- even the fact that he just spoke out, i think it did have a calming effect. the people of ferguson understand that their grievances are being heard at the highest levels. so i think he's handled it appropriately so far and i think we can just hope that the wheels of justice, you know, begin to move and i think once we see the police officer held to account

and we begin to learn more about what happened, that that should ease some of the tensions. but i think the town of ferguson and many other towns in this country -- this is not -- ferguson is not the only place where you have a total imbalance of lack of diversity in a police department and you have a community that really feels like they are at odds with the people who are supposed to protect them. i think they are going to have to revisit that issue in plane places. >> absolutely. that's a point that's been reiterated many, many times. thank you so much. >> thank you, alex. a rally for justice will be held at 4:00 p.m. eastern. the parents of michael brown are expected to attend and we'll bring that to you live. in just a few minutes, thoughts about michael brown from the father of trayvon martin. what he says everyone needs to remember amid all of the protests. and startup ny companies will be investing hundreds of millions of dollars in jobs and infrastructure. thanks to startup ny, businesses can operate tax free for 10 years.

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michael brown. and a critical win for kurdish forces fighting isis. why there's new concern for the risk of the group and what it poses to the west. and outrageous texas governor rick perry sounds off on the grand jury indictment against him this week. hello, everyone. welcome to "weekends with alex witt." here's what is happening out there. two days after the ferguson police department released the name of the officer who shot and killed michael brown, we're getting our first look at that officer. nbc news has confirmed that this is officer darren wilson receiving a condemnation from his police department earlier this year. the six-year police officer is 28 years old and grew up in the st. louis area. the photos were first published by yahoo! news on saturday.

the ferguson police has not responded to comment about the photo. darren wilson stopped michael brown and his friend from stop walking in the middle of the street. brown, who was unarmed, allegedly reached into the car and grabbed for wilson's gun. attorney general eric holder has ordered an additional autopsy of brown's body. it will be performed by a federal medical examiner as soon as possible sf. also, criticism of govern jay nixon for the release of this surveillance video. >> we didn't know that the video was going to be released. we disagree for two reasons. one, an attempt to disparage the character of this victim in the middle of a process like this is just not right.

and secondarily, it did put the community and, quite frankly, the region and the nation on alert again. >> well, the scene in ferguson is much calmer right now as we give you a live look there but it was a very different situation about 12 hours ago. >> we have the right to assemble peacefully. that is our right. >> that was a group of 100 protester who is defied the midnight curfew despite warnings from police. authorities unleashed smoke canisters and tear gas into the street but they say it was not the curfew that prompted them to act. they say they were responding to reports of a break-in at a nearby restaurant. seven people were arrested for violating the curfew. police also encountered a man with a handgun in the street who got away. a police car was also shot at. authorities are investigating a shooting that left one man in critical condition into meantime, a major rally for michael brown is scheduled to begin in ferguson in about three hours from now.

the leader reverend al sharpton will lead that event. let's go to tremaine lee. what is the situation like? is it a quiet sunday afternoon? >> reporter: right now it is indeed a quiet sunday afternoon. for the past few days, the earlier part of the day was marked by a lot of quiet. some protesters will be gathering at what has background zero at the station and it's quiet, a far cry from what we've seen the last several nights, though. >> trymaine, are you hearing anything about the midnight curfew? >> reporter: haven't heard any details about whether it will be pushed back at all or adjusted. right now it's still firm. a lot of the people i've spoke with, the issue with the interaction with the police

before michael brown was killed was an issue and that that's part of the problem. now with the curfew enforcement, there is even more interaction that may exacerbate these tense situations. >> let's talk about the confrontations last night. what did you see? i know you were out there. what happened? >> reporter: so, about half an hour before the curfew, you know, folks were heading home. a lot of people said they didn't want to risk being arrested or put themselves in any danger. by the time midnight came around, from our vantage point at the far end of west florence avenue, you barely could see any protesters except for journalists and some police. but around 12:30 or a little around that time, you started to hear a dim and a chanting in the far distance and you looked about 200 yards away and you saw a whole group moving slowly forward. at that time, police started to assemble. you saw the armored vehicles and, you know, officers with assault rifles come in and the

crowd started coming in closer and closer. and then you saw the police fire off canisters of gas -- i'm sorry. smoke first and then followed that up with tear gas. again, rapid, one canister after another after another. and in all, seven people were arrested. one person was shot. apparently. i'm not sure who the shooter was but it was quite the chaotic scene, far different from when calm was restored to the city. >> listening to you, as you talk about -- you see this group of protesters a couple of hundred yards in the distance. is that where the red's barbecue restaurant was? is that who were gathering? >> reporter: you have red's barbecue on one corner and then you have the quick time gas station that was burned down and essentially is ground zero for where all of the protesters gather. so while the larger group would have been in that area, the

police say there was a handful of other people armed with guns who snuck into the restaurant, climbed on to the roof and were waiting for officers to enforce the curfew. police said they gathered some sort of intelligence. they haven't gone into detail about how they gathered that intelligence but that's what sparked the militarized action that we saw last night. >> what are residents saying about what happened last night? >> reporter: residents are, quite frankly, tired of it all. again, it exacerbates the entire situation. while some people have said, you know what, by the time 1:00 in the morning, 2:00 in the morning rolls around, most of your protesters who are about the calls of fighting police brutality and all of the things that they've spoken out about, they've long since gone home. they are concerned that there's a certain element that comes out later in the evening. but again, you're bringing the police out on the streets to enforce this curfew and the

police itself are kind of the seed for a lot of this confrontation. >> msnbc.com reporter trymaine lee, thank you. appreciate it. >> while so much focus is centered on the protests, there is a family that is very publicly grieving the loss of their son. they have called for justice and truth about who their son really was. a son who was worried that his life was not worth anything. tracy martin is joining us, the father of trayvon martin. well some, sir. i'd like to get your reaction to when you first heard about michael brown's death and then the protests that have followed. >> when i first heard about mr. brown's death, it certainly hit home with me and my family knowing that we are still dealing with our ordeal. i just -- my heart just went out

to mr. brown and i know exactly what they are going through. they are going to have a lot of restless nights. they are going through it right now. >> yeah. >> and the country -- the country stands behind them in their loss. >> michael brown's parents have seen their son's character questioned and tarnished, particularly with the alleged robbery surveillance video that even the governor says should not have been released. you, too, saw your son's character attacked. how is that for a parent during what has got to be the worst time of your life? >> it certainly has wear and tear on a parent, just seeing the assassination of your child's character and at the end of the day, you ask yourself as a parent -- in my case, in our case, i sat back and said, is my son on trial or is his killer on trial. and i'm seeing the same elements in this case. >> you know, tracy, we're hearing so many call for change

but exactly how happens is a bit more complicated issue. what do you think can be done to prevent the alienation that many black men feel as well as an tag nation by the police? >> you have to understand that we as an african-american community, our young kids get stereotyped a lot. we have to break the stigma. we have to come together as human beings and say that african-american lives matter just as much as any other ethnicity group life matters. so we -- it has to start -- it has to start -- in america, we have a real issue discussing race. no one wants to discuss those issues. we understand that racism is alive and well and we just have to be able to sit down at the dinner table at the end of the day and discuss these issues. >> so what would you say to michael brown's parents? what kind of advice would you give them? >> my advice is to just hold on

to god, keep your faith, keep your head up, don't let anyone assassinate the character -- your son's character. they have to stand up for their son. they have to stand up for justice. we're with them 110%. protests are going and protests are needed but peaceful protests. so i just want them to know that they have a lot of people behind them and we're here for them. >> and tracy, how are you and your family doing these days? >> we're doing well. sabrina is doing well, javaris is doing well. all of the kids are doing well. the family's doing good. you know, we are in the midst of helping families such as the brown family through the trayvon martin foundation. it's a work in progress but we got it off the ground and we're doing good things in the community. >> that is good news, indeed. tracy martin, thank you very much for your time.

>> thank you, alex. today the u.s. is ramping up its fight against isis in iraq. the u.s. military launched 14 air strikes against isis, positions around the critical mosul dam amid nine air strikes yesterday. joining me from erbil, iraq, is ian williams. good day to you. do we know yet how successful these air strikes were? >> reporter: they seem to have been reasonably successful, alex. the battle for the dam is clearly ongoing. this is the biggest dam in iraq. military officials here in erbil are saying that they have taken back control of part of the dam, perhaps half of it. but that the progress is being incurred because of bobby traps and roadside bombs being left behind by isis which took control of the dam ten days ago. the u.s. providing the critical

takeover. by my count, the heaviest that we've seen during this period of conflict. u.s. officials saying they took out 19 vehicles at the checkpoint and they were doing this in order to avoid critical infrastructure and, of course, it doesn't come much more critical than the mosul which provides electricity for a good part of northern iraq and the destruction and, of course, the fear is that that's precisely what isis might do, which is devastating for the environment. but if the iraqi forces, kurdish forces are able to take it back and, of course, the news is tentatively positive, it would have a significant development. >> i would love to continue the conversation but i think i'd be testing technical abilities. we'll talk to you later. why the city of ferguson is

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remember less than three hours away from a rally for justice in ferguson, missouri. michael brown's family will attend. well, the recent events have government officials rethinking a federal program which provides local agencies with military-style equipment, weapons and armored vehicles and technical gear. >> keep in mind, we've seen an increase in active scenario shooters in our graham mall schools, theaters where police have to respond in a capacity

that they have the equipment and the resources necessary to combat that threat. it's absolutely needed. >> that's one opinion but others argue that it's turning our local cops into combat troops. reporter bradley has been covering this for "the washington post." r ac radley is joining me. >> thank you for having me. >> so what is it about what is happening in ferguson right now that is most disturbing to you? >> i think it was the initial reaction. when the police respond to a protest expecting violence and confrontation, violence inevitably follows. this is true from the perspective for the police. when they show up with armored

vehicles and snipers, it shows that they are expecting the protesters to be violent and it all of the cops look alike, when all their faces are covered in the robocop gear. they are not people. they cease becoming people and names and faces. they become sort of a robotic symbol of everything the protesters are protesting against. so when you remove that human factor, when neither side sees them as human, you set the stage for confrontation and the job of a police force should be to de-escalate and to find conflict or to avoid conflict and when you have it, to try to find resolutions that use the least amount of force possible. >> you know, history would suggest what you're saying is absolutely correct and in your book you go through a couple of them. i'd like for you to talk about what happened in the late '60s,

jerry wilson was appointed police chief and then the wti protest in seattle where norm stanford was saying that he had done things completely differently. >> right. so in 1969, jerry wilson was appointed police chief in washington, d.c.. the nixon administration at the time was trying to ramp up the war on crime. wilson took a very different approach. he immediately saw that the police force did not represent the community, that it was much whiter in the community and that previous police use had gone further south to recruit for the police department. so what wilson did was try to recruit from within the city and tried to build a police force reflective of the city. in the first recruits it was 50% black. what you saw in d.c. was a community much more willing to work with the police and much more willing to give tips about crime because they became more trusting of the police and saw themselves reflected in the police force, which i think is really important.

interestingly, crime actually went down in d.c. during wilson's tenure while it went up in the rest of the country. he took a much more community-oriented stand poipoi and it worked. wilson was appointed in san diego for a long time and then appointed police chief in seattle. stanford did some great things in san diego. but during the protests in 1999, the wto protests, there were peaceful protesters blocking a street but they were doing so peacefully. stanford officers launched tear gas at them and they launched the tear gas behind them which caused the protesters to run towards the police which, as you might imagine, spurred some violence which then spread into riots all over the city. and, you know, stanford defended his position at the time. we had the wto riots that became the template that other cities responded to protests.

stanford says it was the worst decision of his career. >> with regard to ferguson, how much of it a difference did it make when the highway patrol took over? >> well, that first night when the highway patrol took over and you saw the head of the highway patrol, the head of the response in ferguson meeting with protesters and shaking their hands and hugging them and chatting with them and talking with them about their goals and what they were protesting, this is what -- this is leadership, right? this is what police leaders should be doing. there are police who do this. the police leaders in salt lake city, utah, when it was time to evict the occupy protesters, he sat down with them and said, look, city council told me not to do this. you can leave volume lun tearily or we can arrest you in front of the cameras so you can bring

your cause to the front. everything doesn't have to be force. everything doesn't have to be using as much force as you can. he saw his job was not to promote security or to protect the community. those are all very important but primary function was to facilitate the first amendment and to give these people an ability to express themselves. >> thank you for weighing in. appreciate the stories, too. >> my pleasure. a new call for increased action against isis. a u.s. ally says something has to be done. that's next. and startup ny companies will be investing hundreds of millions of dollars in jobs and infrastructure. thanks to startup ny, businesses can operate tax free for 10 years. no property tax. no business tax. and no sales tax. which means more growth for your business, and more jobs. it's not just business as usual. see how new york can help your business grow, at startup.ny.gov

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what's in your wallet? attorney general eric holder is ordering a federal autopsy of michael brown's body at the request of brown's family. this will be performed by a federal medical examiner as soon as possible. joining me with more on the investigation, kristen welker who is traveling with the president on his last day there in martha's vineyard.

what specifically is the justice department saying about this additional autopsy? >> reporter: well, i'll read you a little bit of the statement released earlier today. this is from the doj spokesperson brian fallon. "due to the extraordinary circumstan circumstances involved in this case and at the request of the brown family, attorney general holder has instructed justice department officials to arrange for an additional autopsy. this independent examination will take place as soon as possible." according to a senior official, briefed this morning by his vice adviser valerie jarrett and among others. some are calling for the president to be stronger on this issue. some civil rights leaders

encouraging him to speak out. again, we last heard from him on thursday when he called for calm in the streets. a ferguson white house officials say at this point, no plans for him to do that. he's monitoring the situation through these daily briefings that he's been getting. he's heading back to washington, d.c., alex, for two days of meeting with his top officials there. then he heads back here to martha's vineyard on tuesday night. >> good to know he's heading back. kristen, we have british prime minister who wrote an op-ed calling for the u.s. to go over isis. how much international support has president obama really called for in this u.s. mission? >> reporter: well, it could be a coalition of the willing if the uk does in fact move forward with military engagements. president obama has been in contact with a number of world leaders during this past week. and we've seen humanitarian aid

from britain, from france in terms of the military mission so far. so this would certainly be an escalation. i'll read you a little bit of what prime minister cameron said in the op-ed. "the creation of an extremist caliphate in the heart of iraq and extending into syria is not a problem miles away from home. it is our concern here and now." it certainly appears he's preparing his people for the possibility that they might engage militarily. meanwhile, what we're seeing on the part of the united states is a broadening of air strikes. nine today. as the u.s. tries to defend that dam in mosul. if you ask about mission creep, democrats push back saying that this is not mission creep. having said that, if you recall, president obama initially framed this around a humanitarian mission, trying to prevent a

genocide. certainly it's shifted away to that at some extent and it focusing on u.s. interests in the area. alex? >> kristen welker, thank you very much. ahead, rick perry's response to a grand jury indictment. today her doctor has her on a bayer aspirin regimen to help reduce the risk of another one. if you've had a heart attack be sure to talk to your doctor before you begin an aspirin regimen. [guy] i know what you're you're thinking beneful. [announcer]beneful has wholesome grains,real beef,even accents of

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travel, gift cards, even cash back. and my rewards points won't expire. so you can make owning a business even more rewarding. ink from chase. so you can. welcome back to "weekends with alex witt." michael brown's parents will participate in a rally that begins at 3:00 p.m. local time. the unarmed teenager was shot last saturday by an officer and it's led to nightly protests. governor nixon says this is caused by old wupds ounds in th community. meanwhile, george lewis said on "meet the press," the problems we're seeing here go way beyond ferguson. >> we have to get officers to respect the worth and dignity of every human being. it's a shame and disgrace in a

city that is almost 70% african-american to have only three african-american police officers. >> joining me now, opinion writer, goldie taylor and republican strategist joe watkins. glad to have you both with me. goldie, i'll start with you here. how much of what we're seeing in ferguson is all about racial disparity, as governor nixon says, are these, quote, old wounds? >> you know, i think that at the end of the day these are about the facts of the case and did this officer have probable cause to engage this young man? did he have the legal right and the right to continue shooting? that does happen in the context of the racial issues that continue to per va st. louis county. i went to high school in ferguson, the very high school that michael brown went to. i'm well aware of the tensions that occur and continue to occur decades over the decades but it's the context in which this kind of thing happened.

>> did you ever witness things, goldie, that you felt were unfair, that were just wrong or racially profiling in your time there? >> i think my parents advised us of how to conduct ourselves. we suspected that and knew that in our hearts as we grew but looking at the stats just the other day really bear out what my family certainly suspected to be true. >> ohjoe, i want to talk about e release of the surveillance video. do you think it's at all a coincidence that it was released on the same day that the officer's name was released who shot and killed michael brown? >> it's so unfortunate the way that this has unfolded. i think the police and authorities need to do a lot better in reaching out to the community. this doesn't have to be. and so much of this is based on just poor communication and just

ill communication. we really need to be talking to each other. they need to be talking to the community. they need not to be dealing with the community in the way that they are. there needs to be a more fair exchange of facts and they need certainly the authorities, including the governor, needs to be more forthcoming and doing a et better job. they need to be dealing with the community in such a way that the community feels that they've been embraced and helped. but obviously that's not the case right now. that's why we have the violence that we do. >> i'm curious to you both and i'll let you go, first answer, joe, do you think that the heavy-handed approach, the militarized use of force and the fact that you had police officers using their armed guns and long guns on their own citizens, did that exacerbate the situation? >> i think so. i think so. i think how you come to the sense is everything to do with

how they respond. if you provide a vehicle for people to talk and to understand what's going on, then they don't have any reason to respond in a violent way. people respond this way when they feel like they are not being heard. >> goldie? >> you know, i have to agree with jill. at the end of the day, it isn't always the color and makeup of a school board or city council or even a police force. it is their connection with the community that they serve and clearly there was no mechanism in place. there were no avenues open and ready and fluid enough to keep the kind of information flowing in the aftermath of this. certainly police authorities felt like or at least it seemed like they had no accountability to the people that they served. and so i think that that is the real reason for the spark and unrest that we've seen this week throughout ferguson and i think that's why the world is standing with the people of ferguson tonight. >> i want to switch topics here and talk about texas governor rick perry who was indictmented on two documents, one for abuses his power of authority.

how is he able to fight these charges? >> actually, the way it's unfolding is helping him. you have leading democrats who say they have questions about this, the way that this is being handled. and i think that eventually, ultimately governor perry will come out just fine from all of this. this clearly looks like it's a bit of a small, political witch hunt to get him and at the end of the day, i think rick perry ends up prevailing. >> do you share his optimism, goldie, that this may not affect his run for president in 2016? >> i think it absolutely does impact his ability to run for higher office and to stay out of jail. i think this indictment is on clear grounds that he was going to or attempt to remove the funding from an office that serves the people of texas and i think that's unfortunate that he

did that for his own sort of political needs. >> okay. goldie taylor, joe watkins, great to see you guys. >> thank you. what missouri governor nixon says about criticism ahead. to tooth decay and bad breath? [ exhales deeply ] [ male announcer ] well there is biotene. specially formulated with moisturizers and lubricants, biotene can provide soothing relief and it helps keep your mouth healthy, too. [ applause ] biotene -- for people who suffer from dry mouth.

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again, this breaking news. attorney general eric holder has asked for additional autopsy to be performed by a federal medical examiner on michael brown's body. we're told this new independent examination, which the brown family requested, will take place as soon as possible. meantime, the situation is much calmer right now in ferguson, missouri, after new confrontations last night. hundreds of peaceful protesters abided by the midnight curfew but a few refused to leave the area and they were met with tear gas and smoke canisters. police say they launched the smoke and gas because they were responding to an incident at a nearby restaurant. several people were arrested for

curfew violations. joining me now is retired atf agent in charge jim cavanaugh. do you think the curfew helped and do you think it should be extended? >> well, it seems like it helped and i noticed the governor said at the press conference that they will make a decision each day based on awareness on whether they will use more or less force. i think that's appropriate but we've seen a pretty uncoordinated command out there, dualing press conferences between the chief and highway patrol and no commander as the investigative phase. the attorney general's announcement of an autopsy is a positive step. you know, in the federal service we use the the arm services of pathology for our autopsies in atf, fcbi has used them. i think they go to them in bethesda because they clearly can do a good job on them.

that's not to say the attorney general won't do a great job as well because they have great medical examiners but in this case, with the distrust of local authorities, i think the attorney general made a good call on that. >> store owners are saying that police have refused to protect the shops that they saw being looted. if that's true, why would they allow it to happen? >> well, you make a judgment as the on-scene commander when you're dealing with property crimes on when you want to make a move. you know, liquor store being looted may not be the right time to move a police line forward and engage numerous looters where then to use physical force, to apprehend them. so i think that was the right decision. you know, i saw the tactical officers remain back. i thought the on-scene commanders made the right call. you don't have to go in there and rescue the fifth of gin. it was the right call now.

the store owner loses money and that's not good but nobody was injured. so if we can get the peace restored in the days ahead, if the investigative side will come in and support the governor and the highway patrol trying to maintain the peace and move the case involving the police shooting expeditiously, not a rush to judgment but if the facts are at the bar of justice, let's examine them and make a decision because what i see here are not facts that are gone, alec, or not available, but failure to make a decision and you can't make every last legal maneuver or whether or not you want to go to the grand jury or get a complaint or have a preliminary hearing which sometimes those discussions slow these cases down. and in this case, the city, the country needs, you know, not a rush to judgment but an expedited processing of justice. >> i want to ask you about the militarization of police forces. where do you come down on that? and is it as much about the equipment that's being used or the optics and how that

equipment is being used? >> well, i'm a negotiator and i spend many years in atf, you know, ramming negotiators and pushing negotiators and trying to always get the softer side of things done first. and it's an uphill battle in the police sometimes to get negotiating teams equipped and listened to and to have rank and to be really used and not as check the box negotiators. so it is an uphill fight because you can always get police to act but i call the police our disease collectively in the police we don't always have patience. and we need to have patience and restraint upfront. so the first night in ferguson, if you had seen the patients in restraint and it didn't work and then you had to move to a little harder stance, then i think it would have been received better by the public. but when you start hard and you really don't need to start that hard, all that gas launched at the protesters and the officers

with the tripod-mounded rifles, i mean, get bu binoculars. the image to the public is very disconcerting. i think we need to look at the image, mainly the tactics because i think tactics are even more important than the image. the image is important. get those officers in blue if you're in a suburban area or city. you may need olive drab in rural operations and certainly that's true or some cam mouflage. but let's try to start easy. if you're going to have these armored vehicles and s.w.a.t. teams, have a negotiating team equipped and ready so you can start easy. you don't always have to crash the door in. you can call and say, we're all out here, do you want to come out? >> i bet you were a great negotiator. thank you for joining me.

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the national action network will hold a rally for justice today in ferguson, missouri. it begins in a little more than two hours and the family of michael brown will attend. of course, a police officer shot and killed their unarmed 18-year-old last saturday afternoon. the events we have seen over the past week have sparked a national dialogue about race relations in this country. questions about that have risen with police ahharassment and th double standard many african-americans say they face. but what can be done about it? >> joining me is a pastor and jason johnson. pastor joe, what do you make of the events here in ferguson? >> what i make of the events in

ferguson is simple. what we see is not really what is known as ferguson. i spent my entire life in north county and the people of ferguson are good people and the events that have transpire bring to bear issues that have been deep rooted in st. louis but are not necessarily the results of the people of ferguson. so that's kind of my take on what i see happening. >> okay. jason, naacp president had this to say this morning about the investigation of michael brown's death. >> i believe it's critically important for a prosecutor to be appointed. i think it's critically important for the justice department to remain active and engaged because this county, this municipality both have a long history of very troubled relationships with the community. >> do you agree with him and if so, how do you begin to make a difference? >> there are multiple levels of investigations that need to happen in this city. we have seen police academy level incompetence on the part of the local police.

even last night you had one group of police officers, a state trooper saying we didn't use tear gas and another group said we used tear gas later. there needs to be multiple investigations, and this doesn't just start with the mayor who probably needs to be removed. it doesn't just start with the chief of police. it doesn't just go to the governor. it goes all the way to the president of the united states. barack obama needs to evaluate program 1033 and perhaps suggest that local police departments that have a history of racial profiling or police brutality can't get access to free military weapons anymore if they've shown themselves to be irresponsible with the equipment they already have. >> you think, jason, under no circumstances whatsoever? because we have heard the former new york city police commissioner bernard caric say there are situations when it's needed. i have talked to a former fbi agent in charge who says there are times you need these kind of s.w.a.t. cars and the high powered stuff because you may be facing something given how people have access to guns and the like. >> but none of those things are what's going on right now and

that's the problem. i think the president should only suspend those police departments or pass an executive order, suspend those police departments who have shown themselves to be irresponsible. you may need stun guns and tear gas and atfs and tanks if you're in st. louis proper, if you're in chicago, if you're in a major metropolitan area, but not in ferguson. clearly they've demonstrated when they had these toys they went way overboard overprotecting, being unnecessarily aggressive and it didn't help solve the problems on the ground. i don't think they have proven themselves to be responsible with their military grade equipment. >> pastor joe, what do you think needs to be in ferguson to help the community snooheal? >> the community needs to step up and begin helping each other out. we've attempted to begin service projects and empower the people of the surroundings communities to be a voice for good in the community, and so organizing things like cleaning up the

street, organizing things like bringing food to those in need. a grassroots movement is what's needed to better hold ourselves accountable as well as bring up moral and see things change. >> interesting. yeah, georgia representative john lewis says today it's ferguson, tomorrow it's elsewhere. what needs to change in this country for these types of events to stop happening. jason, what do you think? >> we need to have a full-scale evaluation of police procedures and police training in this country. what happened in ferguson -- the reason we actually know about this is because of social media. i mean to be perfectly honest, these kinds of abuses happen all the time. people are shot and we end up not finding out about it. there needs to be a discussion at the doj level. how are officers being trained? how can we evaluate that training and also national parties. the republican party and democratic party, i know this may not be as sexy, they need to encourage people to vote. they need to tell people that having a 12% -- >> make this -- >> -- turnout isn't good enough.

>> and make this an important conversation. gentlemen, thanks so much. that is a wrap of "weekends with alex witt." keep it here on msnbc for the latest news coming out of ferguson including a rally for justice for michael brown two hours from now. have a good one. [cat meows] ♪meow, meow, meow, meow... it's more than just a meal, it's meow mix mealtime. with great taste and 100% complete nutrition, it's the only one cats ask for by name. thereyou can do anything...ily. if you keep a good head on your shoulders. that's why we use head & shoulders shampoo and conditioners. it keeps us 100% flake free. so i just have gorgeous hair. head & shoulders. the world's #1 dandruff shampoo.

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