is it now just after midnight on the east coast that means it's 11:00 p.m. in ferguson, missouri. and as you have been seeing in our coverage things in the last hour took a dramatic turn and a turn for the tense. what started as a generally peaceful protest night tonight in ferguson, night nine of this crisis in ferguson, missouri, it turned on a dime an hour ago as police in full riot gear started to try to disperse the crowd. it is not clear if it was a

change in the crowd. it is possible it was a decision by police to ratchet it up and clear people away but it did happen quickly. protesters had been told all day they needed to keep moving to avoid arrest. it's a strange interpretation to the right to assemble. you are not allowed to assemble in a stationary way but you have to physically keep walking in an area in which you are allowed to protest, and if you stop moving then you will -- if you stop moving you will be arrested. what we're watching right now with that street sign and these projectiles from the police side this is all live right now in ferguson, missouri. we're not exactly clear on what these incendiaries are here and what is burning in the street. open fires in the street. open fires in the street are

something that we have not seen much of. chris, can you see what is happening? >> so we just see massive what looks like fireworks explode and now it looks like the tear gas is coming out. >> can you smell the tear gas? >> there are flash grenades and smoke rising up from the quick trip. and protesters hurling things. i can't tell what they are. they look like fireworks. they could be flash grenades. there is steam rising up. a very, very chaotic scene happening down here where the quick trip was. just 30 seconds ago a bunch of things popped off real quick and there's another firework in the air right now. that looks like a flash grenade as well. >> i can tell you before the smoke went up so thickly we saw

protester with a street sign. and it seems like whatever is on fire is rolling from two directions at once. i can't tell what the items are. >> loud explosions happening behind us. there is smoke now rising up into the sky just now we've -- we have now entered the -- what now seems the inevitable. now everyone is -- >> they're running. >> down canfield. >> and there's -- people are also lobbing -- i'm not sure what they're lobbing back. >> it looked like -- >> that was a tear gas canister back. we have the loud crowd noise is complete, complete chaos here as the crowd disperses in the midst of this smoke that is billowing up and rising up and i can start to feel a little bit on the eyes. i think that they have deployed

tear gas. people are booking away from it. >> let's take a look at this guy here. >> you are seeing people running from it and coughing and you can start to feel it in the air, frankly, as it comes towards us right now. we're going -- >> from your vantage point is it clear -- >> sorry. >> what do the police want the protesters to do? >> they want them to move. like i said every night they've been -- they've been creating lines in the sand and the confrontation happens around that line generally. tonight the line in the sand was you have to move. do you hear that? >> you to continue moving. you are unlawfully assembled. >> you are unlawfully assembled you have to keep moving. >> we have flash grenades and tear gas and people have now scattered. oh, yes, that is very familiar

smell of tear gas wafting through the air. >> chris, one of the things you were talking about earlier is the importance there are not private vehicles on this -- in this area. we're seeing cars that look like some private vehicles here. what's happening there? >> well, it's unclear. basically i think there were allowances made. you cannot block off the area to all vehicle traffic because there are people who live and work here and have to get in here. and so -- and so, yeah, you can feel that tear gas in the air. it's starting to waft towards us. you get that familiar sting in the eyes. that is not apparently tear gas, that is definitely tear gas. >> that's tear gas. >> i can tell you -- >> that is tear gas. >> i can tell you -- and man, does that frickin' sting. >> do you need to get out of the position you are in?

>> do we have a mask for me here? do we have a mask? try to get a mask and stay out here. >> this is live right now. this is craig melvin and chris hayes who are on the scene on west floissant. the protesters are broken up in smaller groups and just in the last couple minutes in the last five minutes, police tonight for the first time that we can tell seem to have deployed tear gas and craig and chris are both being affected by that. we're trying to figure out exactly what's happening in terms of arrests, exactly what's happening in terms of violence and threats of violence. you can see captain ron johnson who is the man in charge of policing. there and at this point we're trying to figure out what's

happening in terms of police tactics and strategy. you can see the s.w.a.t. gear and riot gear. you can see police aiming weapons of some kind in direction of police. the thing mounted on the top of the car is an lrad, these are sound cannons that the police have used to try to disperse people. they cause you pain and make you leave an area. that is a weapon of war that has been used a few times domestically in the u.s., it's been used a lot in ferguson, including tonight. >> joining us right now is aaron dellmor. what can you see from there? >> i have been standing guard at west florrisant. there is a calmer scene now than

an hour ago but it's police vehicles are coming down right now. we have seen two emergency vehicles now and now i've seen about eight. i'm looking towards chris' position. tear gas, i can feel in my nose. people are running with their shirt over their face. the police have gas masks on and are in a defensive position. >> when you are seeing emergency vehicles, is that police cruisers or tactical vehicles or ambulances? >> tactical vehicles. they are not ambulances or fire. they are tactical vehicles and the drivers have helmets and shields. the police have shields and batons, face masks and gas masks are on. >> erin is it clear to you from your position, is it clear to you what they want protesters to do and can protesters do what police are directing them to do? >> almost every protester has cleared out.

i cannot explain the difference between 8:00 p.m. local time and i'm feeling the tear gas now, rachel. it stings. but i can tell you that protesters have mostly cleared out. when the hostile environment began to turn, they were linking arms. the community wants the protesters to go home. it's an isolated number of people who are surging forward and the police are reacting. i have seen now a fourth arrest i'm looking at right now. >> you have witnessed four arrests? >> rachel, i have to count that number but i have seen three tonight. i have to get closer to this one. >> i'm going to give you a chance to get to fresh air if you can to take care of yourself. stay with us but stay safe. i want to bring in ryan riley for the huffington post.

he has been on msnbc a lot these last few days. he was arrested in the early days of covering this. where are you right now and what are you seeing? >> so i was moving up towards chris hayes position when i was hit by a waft of tear gas. i managed to move back a little bit. when i was down there, you could hear the police officers instructing the crowd that they would have to keep moving and they couldn't stay in one place which is what they had been told earlier in the evening tonight before this tense standoff came about. >> in terms of wanting protesters to keep moving, we -- i overheard in talking to chris, police giving that instruction again just moments ago. it's not clear to me that there's -- from our vantage point it doesn't seem like there

is room for protesters to keep moving in a place away from tear gas where anyone might hear them. >> right now, if you're a protester or a member of the media you are lock into this, you know, mile-long corridor right here. you have the riot police on the one side, the police line over there. some of the officers going to the other side and that's where the tear gas was deployed. you are essentially in this corridor right here. right now i'm walking back towards in the direction of the quick trip. and you essentially see people walking back and forth with no clear direction on where they are headed. another complication tonight that may be an issue later in the evening is a lot of the protesters were mingling in the press zone here which i would make it difficult if there were a situation or any danger from

inside of that press zone for the police to distinguish between press and the general public here. i can see that becoming an issue later in the evening. in previous nights when we have had this press zone set up there has been officers surrounding and making sure that the public doesn't come in to that zone. and only that credentialed reporters came in there. >> what you are looking at right now is live footage in ferguson, missouri. this is footage of a small fire. we don't know what's going on there. but we are seeing police officers move intact call formation with weapons drawn but also in s.w.a.t. gear and gas mask. ryan riley do please stay available to us and stay safe. i known you're in the tear gas zone right now. thanks, ryan, i appreciate it. >> right now what you're seeing -- this is important, i think, distinction between today

versus previous days and chris has been highlighting this over the course of the evening. in this area of protest they blocked people from having private cars there. it was a roadblocked pedestrian only zone and that made for a different character of the protest with cars not in the middle of it without the danger or opportunity for people to jump on and that's changed the -- just the physical geography of what the protest meant. over the course of this evening we are seeing some private vehicles. we are seeing a lot of people on the streets. people are getting hemmed in by this intense police action on the sides of this avenue as far as we can tell. we have multiple producers there. but in a way, it's almost like reporting on combat action and i don't mean to be drawing that analogy glibly. but in order to try to follow

what the police are doing and how the protesters are responding and what they should do to keep themselves safe, it's very hard to get a grip on exactly what's going on overall. you can see it point by point but it's hard to get a stance of exactly what police are trying to do here and when they think they will have succeeded. i want to bring in a national breaking news reporter for "usa today" where are you and what do you see now? >> i'm a block from the quick trip and people are hiding behind buildings and trying to get from the tear gas. as soon as i and other -- and protesters walk near near west florrisant your eyes begin to burn and tear up. so people are trying to duck in behind the buildings to breathe more clearly. >> are people still protesting

in any meaningful sense trying to leave? i think people are still pro testing in a meaningful way. for the people of this community. this is an important demonstration for them. i think as they try to take cover. and try to get their breath, they come become to the streets and continue protesting. i am watching somebody right now. wiping his face. he is, he is trying to breathe belter. he is still walking in the direction of west florissant. >> when you say this is an important demonstration is that because of the national guard being called out. because of the end of the curfew. what about tonight is important? >> tonight as much as it -- i think tonight for a lot of people. the fact that there is a autopsy report released showing michael was shot at least six times and the national guard that was brought in. i think that people were very upset about that. i think also people, also i thinning people are upset about this, that initial, that protests. people still say the officer ha not been arrested.

he's not been charged. most people don't know what he looks like. they don't really know a lot of information about him. people are still upset about the initial death of michael brown as well. >> in terms of people being upset about the national guard. how are people articulating that to you. you hear upset. dissatisfaction with the decision, why is senate. >> a woman i interviewed. this is like being in jail in your own neighborhood. like the national guard would be martial law. tracked in her neighborhood. when she could go to the grocery store. when sunny could go to school, to work. they see the national guard. ratcheting up of military style. i think a lot of people here are upset they're going to have soldiers patrolling neighborhood. >> whb they announced the national guard deployment, the guard wouldn't be on the streets they would be specifically deployed around the police operation command center you. wouldn't see them take part in the kind of front line policing

we are showing now on our screen and you have been reporting on all night. is that your experience? are you able to tell if any body you are looking at is national guard or seem look these are police officers and troopers who you are seeing? >> from my vantage point, i saw all police officers, in terms of regular, saint louis county, police officers, tactical operations. feet away from the armored truck. i haven't seen any one who looked like they were from the national guard. i don't know if they're among the crowd. in other way. looks like police officers from the local community. i'm told the only people from the national guard here are at command center as you mentioned. >> national breaking news reporter, for "usa today." thank you so, so much for taking this time to explain what is going on. please stay on the line to the extent that you can. >> okay, thank you. >> thank you. joining us now, once again. msnbc reporter, erin delmar. you were call the in tear gas, last speaking to you.

what is happening now? >> rachel. showing you a picture of the street. what i can tell you, the street is empty. between canfield and ferguson avenue here on west florissant. the street is empty. people gathered on either side. media/protesters. they're isolated. majority of the people i was watching here last couple hours circle around. chant. they're gone. >> is it your sense they have gun to protest some where else on west florissant. where there are other people or people dispersed? >> residents made a chain. linking arms. walked the vocal protesters backward away from the police defensive position on ferguson avenue. walked them backward up the street. now that is the direction where chris hayes is. where the tear gas is going off. looking down the street. i see police vehicles. i do not see people. >> okay. erin, let me ask you, in terms of what you have seen this evening. one of the concerns particularly that politicians have

articulated and that the national press has articulated is concerns about journalists being -- not allowed to do their work. journalists being targeted. we did see an arrest of a photo-journalist today. there were msnbc reports, journalists who had fallen back, who tried to come ply. who had fall in down, trying to comply with police orders. had guns pointed when they're on the ground. are you seeing any effort by police to distinguish between media and protesters when they're giving orders or when they're moving people around. i haven't seen an effort to distinguish. what i can tell you, i am standing near the journalists, who had it point at them. i have seen them with their hand up, chanting with the protesters you. should know that. there are more vehicles moving down the road now. there is an overwhelming number of cameras here. majority of residents and protesters have fallen back. >> erin, in terms of the sound canyon, was that a significant way the police tried to,

disperse crowd. l-rad, sound cannon devices. >> not on ferguson. i was walking into something that sounded a lot like that. a stronger sense of tear gas. toward canfield road. very few people here. there are police. in riot gear. the tear gas is getting thick. from here, hearing explosions. i see people crouched down low, rachel. this is a hotter spot than where the police are lined up. on ferguson avenue. >> when you are saying you are hearing explosions. the sound. kind of sound we have been hearing, tear gas canisters fired. >> rachel. they're tear gas canisters. as i walk closer. they're definitely tear gas canisters. i'm getting as close as i can for you. a very limited number of people here. on the other side of the road. police set up ablockade. they're pulling up all the way

down the road on west ferguson. getting a closer look now. at what police seem to be, honing in on here. there is a small fire. trash fire in the middle of the road on canfield drive. upward from the intersection on west, west florissant. very small fire. >> erin, so we understand you in context. do you have a light on you? are you going to be attracting attention to yourself? >> i am uploading with my phone. a conscious decision. the camera burns out a different scene the i have chose in to upload via my cell phone. >> we have seen police targeting media who have light on saying the light are tactical disadvantage for the police. media lights have to come down. because the police can't function with those in their faces. >> i would agree you. i haven't heard that. i can understand it. but the residents have been pushing media back. urging media to fall back. the media is encouraging the

violence here, the residents. >> residents think there are things happening in the streets that wouldn't be happening if the media were not there? erin, still got you? let's go right now to, actually, let's bring into the conversation someone with a different perspective. anthony gray. an attorney who is one of the attorneys who represents the family of michael brown. we have spoken with him several times over the last few days. mr. gray, a very difficult night on the streets in ferguson. >> absolutely. absolutely. if it looks a little bit chaotic. you hear the siren going off. you see the bright lights, shine on the crowd i know it has to be disturbing to the neighbors. and to the community. i don't know what the answer is. i understand this is an

experiment in saint louis. we don't necessarily know how to deal with this type of situation we have never had it before. at least in my lifetime. i just don't know how to react to this. i am watching just about everything i can on television. >> when you, you described it as an experiment. when we spoke a few hours you described it as being a living laboratory now in terms of trying something it never tried before. do you mean that both in terms of what the police are frying to do in the way they're reacting to the protesters but also what the protesters are frying to do pushing so hard to be out there in the streets despite all the risk and chaos? >> yes, rachel. you hit it on the money. it is a two-way laboratory experience i have never seen again. and i have been living -- i'm 50 years old. i am half a decade. i have just never seen protesting like this.

the people who are out protesting think they have, a fundamental right to do that. bags it on maybe a tv show or something like that. clearly they don't have experience. look at the age of the people. i don't like to use the word protest all the time. kind of supporting whatever cause they think they're tout -- out there to support. there is push back. they feel in their mind they have the right to be there. the police feel like they have a right to direct how they should be there the a little bit of a showdown too. >> when you got to the basics here. this is obviously about your, your clients. their son. being killed by police. this is a community that rose up in anger about alleged excessive use of force by police. excessive use of force by a mostly white police force against a mostly black population in this town. now we are seeing it -- extrapolated into this whole other, type of confrontation. do you think that police could

be handling this better the i will not insult you by asking that. i will ask instead. can you imagine the police handling this well from here on out? this ending constructively. can you imagine a positive end from this point forward. >> because i am just an optimist ic person. i will say yes the i view the world from the perspective, the glass is half full. i will say yes based on who i am. i don't really know. let me make this observation. i think the whole situation would be different. because ron johnson has a presence. he has a heart. and everybody felt, his approach in the beginning. i think of all the officers that were standing behind him. carried the same type of emotional attachment that he felt. then i think you would probably be witnessing a different sa theiry. that's just my guess. i see him being out there all bay himself.

in terms of the connection that he talked about. and you see him out there hugging and shaking hand in the early parts of this. but you didn't see -- entourages doing that. you saw one gift. so the people behind him, you know i am not so sure they carry the same kind of feelings to the street that the commander of those guys carry to the street. in case you are just joining us. what you are seeing is live footage from ferguson, missouri. 12. 30. a.m. on the east coast. 11:27 local time in ferguson. speaking with anthony gray, an attorney for michael brown's family. michael brown, the young man killed by police officer in ferguson last saturday. mr. gray, one last sort of big picture question for you. one of the things you have done as an attorney for the family is that you have been sort of an emissary from them. being a public face willing to come on shows to have a public

conversation you. convey the family's wish that people continue to protest but do so in a way that is constructive, nonviolent and dignified. why is it that the family does want people to continue to protest. to, to, to continue to got out there. >> well, because they know as well as -- i know and perhaps you know too. because you are so intelligent. that by acting in a violent way, looting and rioting, that completely distraction away from what occurred on that saturday afternoon. this become the story and not michael brown jr. and all of these what i consider positive potential. national discourse, policies and the like. we are kind of losing the momentum that could have, you know potentially been made in that direction. because you are losing, losing people with this in my opinion.

losing people who may want to support mike brown jr. they see this activity. and they associate it with him. as the officer who was the one that triggered all of this. he is not getting that backlash. but michael brown jr. will suffer in my opinion as a result of what we are witnessing tonight. i think that is very, very unfortunate for this family. anthony gray. attorney for michael brown's family. thank you for being with us. >> thank you. always appreciate you. >> thank you. want to say one of the things you have seen in the last few second here. a live shot from ferguson, missouri. cloudiness you are seeing here. all of these, reporters, producers on the scene are telling us, that is tear gas that is clouding your vision there. one of the things which you've have seen, which may be an unfamiliar sight. people in bright yellow t-shirts. seen amnesty on them. seen a few in the last few minutes.

picked up on multiple cameras on the scene. i believe this is the first time that the group has ever deployed civil liberties observers to an event in the united states. amnesty international. human rights watch, other groups like this are regulars -- are regularly deployed, observers, human rights observers around the globe when they know that human rights are threat and think that having observers there may help, may help avoid some of the worst abuses or at least bring attention to them when they happen. i don't know when amnesty international deployed observers in the u.s. they have today. what we will see sometimes in the yellow shirts. also, tell you that in terms of the police presence. i think it is being, a misapprehension right now that because the national guard was called out today. because so much police presence on the street tonight looks like a military force.

i think there has been a misconception this must be the national guard on the streets of ferguson we are seeing. we have no indication that the officers who e we have been seeing on camera are national guard. to the can traer what we were advised, national guard troops would be held back specifically at the police operation center to avoid that being targeted essentially by protesters to keep that place open. that looks like a national guard vehicle. looks look a national guardman there. providing command center security is not the same as them being on the front lines confronting protesters as, as members of the united states armed forces. i want to bring in msnbc.com national reporter doing incredible work on the ground for days now. in ferguson. trumane. thank you for joining us, where are you. what can you see? >> i'm at the corner of west florissant and ferguson.

into the far from the police officers. the peace is hanging by a thread here. a few minutes ago, a car came down the street. immediately all the officers start yelling. automatic rifles. the people who are trying to walk in the street. they're being told to get back. get back. now we are a little further down from the, from the quick trip market where we heard loud bangs about, 10, 15 minutes ago. several of them. for my understanding there could be gas deployed down that way. you know, even further back. i know a gentleman. again, he got out. seemed to be bleeding from his hand. there were reports that he was shot. so again, they're trying to, hanging on by a thread here. and we can't see further down the road by the -- the quick trip market. we are done here closer to the line of police officers and where the media had been kind of cordoned off. not clear what is happening at the far end of the road. >> i will tell you. one observation, question for you.

the observation, i have been watching footage from a lot of sources over the last few days. i have not previously seen an officer holding his handgun. the way i believe we saw an officer on camera. live shots they're showing right now. police officers drawing their pistols not something, even though we are becoming immune to officers, holding long guns and occasionally training them at groups of protesters. in terms of your location and where the media are, are you saying that, there is a place where police and protesters are confronting one another but the media can't get close enough to see it? >> precisely. for a while there early on. closer to where we are. a group of protesters had locked arms and crossed the street. and that was the beginning of kind of the confrontation. but for the last hour or so. they all moved over. on to the sidewalk. so we can't see further down. everyone is on the sidewalk.

that's where we heard several loud bangs. see the smoke down the street. again. about, 35, 40 minutes age a bunch of armored vehicles. and down the street and in the opposite direction. and, from my vantage point. what's going on now. are you finding police at a high level operational level or front line cops you are encountering on the ground. are they treating cameras as a threat? >> first of all, it's, maybe some gas, wafting down here. everyone is backing up. eyes starting to burn a little bit. not a direct explosion. starting to burn a little bit. where we are, right on the

corner. and so, there are cameras, bunches, dozens of journalists on the corner. moment you step into the street. they tell you to get back. it's gas, wafting this way. not sure. yeah. >> trumane, i will give you a chance to get to some fresh air, do what you need to stay safe, keep a line open to us. >> the exposure to gas becomes an issue in terms of them beg -- being able to move on. live shots right here. hard to know what the purpose of some of the vehicles and how the police are essentially stratified as a -- as a force. whether or not the -- the police themselves as they're gearing up right now. who is telling them to gear up? does that mean they're about to start something? are they reacting to something

that is happening with the protesters? again we have luxury of watching this without being gassed while we are doing this, we have multiple cameras on the site. even from here it is hard to tell what is going on. what options protesters have. if they want to continue to protest but also to stay safe. i want to bring back into the conversation, host of all in, chris hayes. had to clear out of his position earlier because of tear gas are. you some where safe or with fresher air? >> yeah, yeah, in a fallback position away from the tear gas. just after we got off air, we were kind of, recollecting. figuring if we could, kind of find a way to go back. go back, go back out there. and to see what is going on. and as we were going to do that, there was a huge round of tear gas that came pushing through. and, and, you know. you, you, tear gas, it is, it is

effective at crowd dispersal. that's the way it is designed. that's why they use it the way they do. >> chris, when you are seeing police use tear gas in that way. to disperse people, is it clear to you when you have seen them use it and launch it tonight that they're launching it in places where it makes sense they're trying to disperse people or seem more random? >> rachel, figuring out the rhythm of the exchanges, it, it, just sort of becomes it possible to track. in the midst talking about a bunch of people and police. this particular round of tear gas came as the standoff was happening at the quick trip. people are unlawfully, you know, they're there unlawfully. and basically the seek witness

of events was, it looked like flash grenade. loud popping noises that could have. looked to be headed back toward the police. could have been bottle rockets with fireworks coming from some people in the crowd. and then the big -- like, like explosion of tear gas. i am now venturing back on to west florissant. the air has basically cleared. it's, it's, it's, more or less traversable. there's, there's, there's a huge line of, of, police out here. oh, actually, what about, 40, 30, 40. there is two big tactical vehicles. a van. a clutch of media. aside from that it is basically quiet. there is a big police presence up at the other end. by the mcdonald's. that's where the media staging area.

few cable news trucks. lights you crane see. we were positioned ourselves in between the two check points. so, you know, in between the sort of two of side of confrontation. and i got to say -- the trajectory of the evening went like this. you have this kind of strange, surreal, trauma engineered by police at the dusk hour. it was happening, while i was on the air live at 7:00 local time. people were told that they -- that they could be on west florissant. closed to most vehicle traffic. unless they were residents. they were marching in a circle. marching in a sishlg. people at one point. marching past, past with roses. and i was prepared to go on the air at 10:00 p.m. local time. to basically say, "okay, we have had, we have had basically, we

have had a -- a sort of peaceful night here." just as we were going on air. confrontation at the line by mcdonald's. what precipitated it. i did not hear any reports of anything emanating from, from, from protesters. all i know is there, there was a loon of riot, cops in riot gear. there was a confrontation. you heard the vehicle pull up. and the change in mood. i cannot emphasize the change in mood. you have people walking, and the vibe was -- it's calm. peaceful. obviously, it was angry. people are focused. and this wave of people running back. just this unleashing. in fury. people, just picking up and chucking rock at me. as a kind of like, frustration. and that was what, that is what

changed it. that initial, you know -- that initial standoff with the cops. just the dynamic. whatever elements. the protesters. whatever elements. the police. want to escalate. are getting, getting their wish. and i got to say. i wasn't. wasn't up there. to see that standoff. and i'm looking forward to seeing a lot of my colleagues. see what their reporting indicates. it felt like the first move off to escalate came from the police at that position. i don't know. again. ichl's saying that. without knowing fully what precipitated them standing in line. before that happened. the mood changed 180 degrees. an absolute charge of panic, rage, you know, chaos, kind of frenetic energy. adrenaline. feel it surge through everyone. feel it rushing back. then a standoff at the opposite end. at the quick trip.

the quick trip, where a standoff happened. a bunch of folks came. and -- and that was where the standoff happened over, over, you know, standing outside the quick trip. people being told. they, they could not stand. and then -- that sort of sequence of events. sounded like flash grenade. rockets. fireworks or something, throwing back, possibly tear gas canister picked up. tossed at the police. then the tear gas. everyone dispersing. running once again. here we are in this sort of. video game like -- you know, post apocalyptic scene of this empty suburban street. at night. with the police chopper overhead. and a clear night. and a few stars in the sky. twinkling. and a, a market. and liquor store. mcdonald's arches in the back ground. nothing on the street except the smell and taste of tear gas. it feels like every night is

headed toward the ending. there is no way for any one to break out of the cycle. in the pit of my stomach. it does not feel this is headed into a direction until something about this dynamic alters fundamentally. right now a bunch of things have been tried. there have been full militarization s.w.a.t. team. full pull back. what we have seen the last few nights. going become to the first kind of policing approach. it feels like we'll end up at this point in the evening. >> chris, obviously there is no simple truth to tell about complex stories. but it feels from the perspective of -- of -- protesters who, have been speaking publicly and media who are stationed among the protesters, that the change it happens on a dime like that, the police make a decision to change tactic that changes the mood

that inspires different be have ever from the crowd than they might previously have been exhibiting. looking at the lens through the other direction is it clear to you that there are distinct elements among the protesters. that there are people who are -- spoiling for a fight. there are people distinguishable from them who are not spoiling from a fight. are the police having interactions with nonpeaceful protesters that aren't being, that we aren't seeing because it is not characteristic behavior. that's causing the police to act the way they are. >> yes, there is some element of truth to that. definitely. there are people who are looking, to set it off. here. i couldn't tell you. i have been down here, five, six days. i couldn't tell you if it is 20, 100. seven people. it's just --

it's -- yeah. there's -- for frz. >> if you are not credentialed media you need to leave immediately? >> yeah, a bunch of gentlemen in full military regalia outside our station. see if they will try to chase us out of here. >> you are credentialed media. >> we'll show them our credentials. i'll put them on the phone. on with rachel maddow. >> that will definitely do it. >> that's part of it. there is no question. you know. it feels like everybody is in this weird game now. who started it. the fact of the matter is one side is the body of state and the law. and, and, and people that -- that you know. are making policy or, decisions, or decisions in the moment. it's hard to take a step back. and they will tell you there have been no injuries.

they will tell you you, know, today. today, after the national guard was called in. i fired up the old google machine. reading abut national guard responses to riots and ranking. there were many fatalities in the clashes. if-up are grading on the curve. the police have done a good job. they will tell you that. and again. if i've put myself in the shoes of one of the people on the street. as a police officer it is a very difficult job. it just is. i mean, you are trying to make the decision in the moment. and they're, they have got a lot of adrenaline in their system. they're scared. i think in a lot of cases. from, you know, there's, control -- control, an amazing, book by a guy, peter moscow, in baltimore, called, "popping the hood." professor, criminal study at john j. college.

how essential control its to a police officer. constantly. and managing a situation is bull work against the terror of some horrible unexpected act. this is the situation in which you have a lot of police from all different municipalities. very small, delwood, jenning, small police departments. you know, st. louis county. all in a situation that constantly, allude to them on the periphery of control. and that's -- you know, i think it freaks them out frankly. >> the shot that we have got right now is, a very close up shot of, of a deep loon of police officers, with long guns. drawn. they apeer to be less than lethal. advancing. police have their helmets. don't have the shield down.

not wearing gas masks. protesters are standing, essentially standing their grun as the police move toward them. the police seem intent on moving them out. we'll keep that camera shot up as long as we can. chris, i want to bring in aaron delmar. got information about somebody who was shot tonight. is that right, erin? >> police have told us there is a gunshot victim on the other side of the drive. before that they told us that shots are being fired from an unknown direction. for about 20 minutes. urging us to leave. say for our safety. i am the last person here. there is no one here. police further up, ferguson avenue. not credentialed media, disperse immediately. a building, police have broken into the building. i met with the photographer. beginning to burn the building. people beginning to burn the

building. >> what is. >> fire. >> what's in the building, what does that building house? >> nothing, rachel. the building was looted days ago. boarded up windows. there is nothing. >> can you tell who the people are who set it on fire? >> no they came up from canfield drive. did not come up west florissant. that is a residential neighborhood. >> any emergency response in terms of fire response vehicles, firetruck or anything responding to the fire? >> no. >> no. >> erin. i will keep an open line to the control room there. try to feed that information back in terms of, what we can report to authorities there. if they needed to get fire response there. just want to listen to hear what we can hear from police. again, these are live shots right now from ferguson.

with the "washington post," there for days in ferguson, arrested not that long ago. few days ago. later released. wesley you, are nearby to some shots? >> on the corner of canfield and west florissant. and multiple canisters of tear gas. aerosol. hard to breathe. i'm right here. >> are you seeing a fire burning where you are or is that out? >> i go back around the corner. the police are here. talking to a few, few of the residents who have their hand up. yes, i watched at the fire was set. watch it starting to burn. >> in terms of the, the residents and protesters and police right there, what is happening right now in terms of who've else is a round you and what the dynamic is? >> at this point. a handful. two dozen residents. many who live. they can't go home. and so, west florissant.

east/west. canfield. residents now, people who are stuck because of police fired the tear gas in. they were treated back in the residential streets. now they're trying, can we please go home. they need to walk past the police, to get to their cars, where they were. police shot the tear gas in. people set fires. and the police out. so you basically have the remnants, what has been the battlefield. better term. with residents remaining that if can go home. >> is there any effort by police, that you can see, to individualate, protesters who want to go home. >> no, nobody is being allowed through at all. no one is being loud through.

>> keep an open line with us, wesley. this continues to unfold. i want to bring in expert opinion. jim cavanaugh, i believe on the line. expertise in this matter, as a law enforcement official. jim, you have been watching a lot of this unfold. when you are seeing these police tactics like the ones on the screen right now. like that line of police officers with long guns that we just saw a moment ago. pointing the long guns at protesters at a short-range. what do you understand about the tactics and what police are trying to accomplish? >> rachel. you described it accurately. a little while ago. you talked about the one line. the moving riot officers there. they had shot guns designated for bean bag round. painted pink. yellow, orange. basically a shotgun. fires a canvas bag full of like beans. it is like getting hit with a baseball. and the shot you see there. i believe that fell through the shot.

the chief of the st. louis metropolitan police. they have their commanders out there as well. but, yes, you are seeing tactical officers make movements on the side. looks like they may be responding to some reports of, you know, a fire or -- or gunshot. or something. that is the s.w.a.t. tactical officers the riot equipped officers are more. seem to be on the central line. pushing the crowd back. we have seen a few arrests tonight. one man had an injured hand on the roll back a while ago. he walked to the front line of the police. >> that was an interesting moment. he was short of safely delivered through the police line. and what appeared to be an ambulance. or official vehicle. a stand down moment when everybody recognized this man need. this man isn't a threat. he need help. >> i do think. >> go ahead.

>> i want to build on one thing chris said. i think it is important. i group in newark. i remember the riots. the images in your mind. we saw armored personnel carriers down the street. there was 36 killed in los angeles. those riots were unbelievable, unbelievably violent. at least one grade like chris said of the police here has to be -- after nine days. those riots generally lasted five, six days. after nine days of this we haven't lust a life. only life lost is michael brown. and that, that's started this whole thing. so, there is some tactics to criticize. i think the first night they were very heavy early on with the protesters. i didn't think they handled that with s.w.a.t. was good.

they rolled it back. commander johnson. there is still. we need to look at arrests, charges, who has been arrested. we haven't seen officers, wielding billy sticks. shooting people. there is restraint here. you see the militarization. >> i think your perspective on that is valuable. we got a lot of on the street perspective. we know what it feels like to face off against the police. thinking tactically from the police perspective. avoid injury and unnecessary arrest. this is dramatic stuff. again this is live in ferguson. does it sound right to you. when you hear people on the ground. media, protester, say, listen, this protest was peaceful and going to end peacefully tonight. until the police made a tactical change. and the police tactical change is what turned this into a hostile moment.

>> i think this happened during this nine days. but i think also we have heard it. when it wasn't true. we hear it a night or two ago. commander johnson came up. captain johnson, the state patrol. he gave a whole litany of the reasons why -- they moved officers and deployed gas. there was gunshot. molotov cocktail. an attack on the mcdonald's. he ran it down. six, eight reasons. so if those reasons are there. the officers only have certain things they can do. one of the things they can do is deploy gas. and round. these things you see. because it makes it very uncomfortable there. and the l-rad, flashing lights and all those things are designed for crowd disper sal without serious injury.

i mean it does, does burn your face. burns your eyes. makes you want to leave. the noise is disconcerting. makes you want to leave. supposed to make you want to leave without injuring you. >> msnbc, former special agent involved. thank you. thank you, very, very helpful to get your perspective on this. what we are seeing, very kinetic confrontation. kinetic activity. including some incendiary projectiles. in a lot of cases what i think we are seeing, stand corrected by people on the ground. from two directions police are launching these things. on some occasions, protesters, at whom they're being launched are picking them up and throwing them back in direction of police. ryan riley reporter for the huffton post. spoke with ryan not that long ago he was caught up in tear gas the where are you snow what do you see now?

>> right now we are in the area. they're shutting it down. we won't be able to figure out what is actually happening down here honestly. not any media witnesses whatever takes place next. the claim is a public safety issue. a report of shots fired. who knows what they cam from. or what that -- we in here. a claim, a claim, gunshot victim. they are still actively moving members of the media back out of this press zone right now. and telling them -- to retreat. you know, way up the road. it's probably some where that you pretty much have to drive to. near the command center. where there is really not an -- an ability to witness what is taking place here on the ground.

>> when you say they're moving you back. how are, how is the police clearing the media area? what are they doing in order to make you leave? >> i mean -- a lean of them are progressing through the mark right now. saying, let's go. let's go. moving every one back. it's something. the media are hanging around as long as they can. until the cops crack down a lit built more here. but,y know i will see a line. seven, eight, around the officers who are sort of moving. through the city right now. you have crews collapsing. their trucks. broadcast trucks from down here. so might get a little time to move out. the claim is for public safety. obviously going to have some consequences for us not being able to, witness what is happening here. >> absolutely. that is invaluable to have the report. ryan riley. good luck. ryan riley, huffington post. >> i will say one thing that seemed like a sidebar issue with

the protest zone in ferguson was there is a no-fly zone. that nobody other than law enforcement allowed to fly any sort of helicopter below 3,000 feet over this scene. that seemed look kind of an oddity in the way they were enforcing the security in this zone. but it has practical consequences when, when reporters on the ground, are unable, either because of tear gas or because of police forcing them out, to get close to. perspective is news helicopters. they have not been allowed to fly over the scene. first amendment is having a tough night. live coverage of the situation continues right now with a special live edition of the last word with lawrence o'donnell. >> thanks rachel. we are continuing our live coverage of the events.

>> i have no idea. i have been here for a good part of a couple of hours now. there has been an initial stand off between officers and protesters. everything had been going fine and peacefully for hours. a group decided to link arms and stand the width of the street. after about 20 minutes, a community leaders and activists talked everyone down and prevented it from expanding but then in the distance, further down to where the quick trip market, there was the sound of banging and the sound of smoke filling the air. police vehicles including the armored vehicles were racing down the street.