the next step. calling for the fwomgovernor tol a special prosecutor. thank you both. >> thank you very much. >> all right. it's calm and peaceful here. as sun is setting missouri. that does it for "all in. "we'll be back in a few hours. "the rachel maddow show the" starts now. thanks to you at home for jonning us this hour. there's a lot of news in the world. news out of iraq. tonight actually some very scary news and sad news out of iraq tonight. in texas, republican governor rick perry got his mugshot taken today. after he was indicted on two felony counts on friday. hello, governor. there are two u.s. senate primaries in two states tonight. in alaska and in wyoming. there are senate primaries. there's a lot going on in the news, but once again tonight, the biggest story in the country remains ferguson, missouri. this is a live shot of downtown

ferguson right now. it's twilight, basically. the sun just setting. it has been a volatile situation in ferguson for the last ten days since the shooting of michael brown by a ferguson police officer last saturday. tonight, i have to say, although it is peaceful on the streets right now, tonight is a particularly uncertain evening in terms of how the evening is going to unfold because in part, in part that uncertainty is because today, just after noontime locally, only about four miles from the spot where michael brown was killed last weekend, two police officers, again today, killed a young african-american man in the st. louis area. this time it happened in st. louis city. north st. louis. two officers who reportedly fired shots at the young man in this case, they were from the st. louis municipal police t department, so city police. it's not the same police force involved in the michael brown shooting or in the police response to the michael brown protests in ferguson. but in this incident today,

again, took place about four miles from where michael brown was killed, the young man that was killed today was said to have been 23 years old. he has not been formally identified by the police. police said that he was armed when police killed him. they said he was armed with a knife and, in fact, brandishing a knife and that's why these two police officers shot him and killed him in the street. the shooting reportedly happened at 12:20 p.m. local time. that would be 1:20 east coast time. less than 90 minutes after the shooting happened, the chief of the st. louis city police was on the scene of that shooting to give a statement about what had happened. the police chief basically there immediately after the shooting, and just as immediately, he was surrounded by local residents who were demanding answers about there being yet another shooting of yet another black man basically in the same area. and those residents also expressed their anger about it. >> thank you, everybody. this afternoon, at about 12:20, officers dispatched to this

location for a call of a disturbance. a gentleman entered a convenience store nearby, walked out carrying two energy drinks. when he was asked to stop, he walked out and the store owners let him walk out. a few minutes later, he came back into the storefront, took what was described as a package of muffins, pastries. the store owner walked out with him, asked, could you please pay for those before you leave? the suspect tossed them into the street then continued walking. they contacted police for the disturbance, and officers were dispatched. the suspect who right now is described as a 23-year-old african-american, was acting erratically walking back and forth up and down the street. as officers arrived, the suspect turned toward the officers and started to walk toward them, clutching his waistband. he then pulled out a knife and what we described as an overhand fwrip and told the officer, shoot me now, kill me now. when the suspect displayed his knife, they drew their weapons. the officers are giving the suspect verbal commands, stop, drop the knife, stop, drop the

knife. suspect moved toward the passenger, the police officer that was in the passenger seat of the vehicle at which time he came within three to four feet of the officers. the officers fired and the suspect is deceased. >> do you have tasers? >> some officers are amprmed wi tasers. >> did you not tell your men to exercise utmost caution? are you concerned this is going to enflame things anymore? >> that's a great question. officer safety is the number one issue. if you're the family of a police officer and somebody approaches you within three feet within a knife, i think you have the right to defend yourself and protect yourself. so i think it certainly is reasonable that an officer has an expectation to go home at the end of the night. i think we can all understand what's going on in ferguson but every police officer out here has the right to defend themselves and the community as quickly as possible. that's what we're trying to do. >> we're already starting to hear people yelling. are you guys concerned about

this? >> concerned isn't the right word. it's important people understand what happened. we're going to get that message out through many source as we can. >> did multiple officers fire? >> both officers fired their weapons. >> what is their disposition now? >> right now we have an investigation that goes on. the officers will not be on the street. they'll be on administrative duty until we can determine the facts if they are different than i have described, but i've talked to several people that witnessed this today here on the scene. >> heard the phrase "suicide by cop." was this that? >> certainly one of the witnesses described it as a suicide by cop. i didn't describe it that way, but i have heard that used, yes. >> as the st. louis city police chief speaking today after yet another young african-american man was killed by police in the st. louis area today. in this shooting today, again, it was two officers from the st. louis city police department, and the young man who they killed was said by police to be armed with a knife in this snen incident. police also said they recovered a knife at the scene.

now, local residents told reporters today that the young man who was killed was well known in the community, but, again, he has no been formally identified. after the police chief spoke today, which sort of ended up being as much to local residents as it was to the press, local st. louis alderman antonio french who you'll recognize here in the foreground, he spoke to the same crowd that the police chief had just spoken to, and the crowd did seem to be at least somewhat agitated and upset about the chief's announcement about the killing. antonio french basically tried to talk the crowd down. this was a remarkable scene. watch this. >> but the last thing we need is violence in our neighborhood. hey, listen. that's not going to be on the police to make sure no violence in our neighborhood. that's going to be on us. >> that's right. >> no silliness over here. all right? >> understand this, we know our rights. >> you know your rights. i know your rights, brother, too. i'm going to make sure this man's rights were exercised,

too, and we're going to find out what happened. we're going to be patient in our neighborhood. you got people that got your back over here. you ain't alone like they are in ferguson, you hear me? all right. >> you've got people who've got your back over here. you aren't alone like they are in ferguson. we're going to speak with alderman antonio french actually in just a moment live. that reference, this is not ferguson, you're not alone here, like they are in ferguson, you've got people who have your back over here. it seems like that was literally a reference to local politics and whether or not local communities feel represented in their local government or whether they feel disenfranchised and disconnected from their local government and local power structures. because these two killings of young black men by police in the st. louis area, they may have only been four miles and ten days apart, but one of them, the one that happened today, happened in the city of st. louis. which is geographically very close, but politically very far away from ferguson, missouri.

ferguson, missouri, which had a 6% black voter turnout in its last municipal election. in ferguson, today, the scenes on the streets have been peaceful. even in north st. louis where this new police shooting happened today. the scenes have been peaceful as well. even though there have been demonstrators gathered near the site of the shooting most of the day today. peaceful, at times loud, but not at all rowdy or violent. last night, it was in the 10:00 p.m. hour locally in missouri when what had been a very peaceful day all day long of protests in ferguson took a violent turn last night into what ended up being a long and very scary night of tear gas and police show of force and fires and two gunshot victims. at this 2:30 a.m. press conference, early this morning, the police announced they had made 31 arrests overnight. by this morning, kstk, local nbc affiliate in st. louis was reporting actually the total number of arrestees by their count was 78.

almost all of them, 75 of the 78 arrests were for failure to disperse. after all the people arrested last night by ksdk's count, 2 /3 were locals from the st. louis area or at least from missouri. the others were far flung from places as far away as california and new york. this morning, missouri highway patrol captain ron johnson was interviewed by msnbc's craig melvin and expressed exasperation ten days into this campaign and protest. first, he said, the media has not been helpful in some cases. he did said in some cases the m is not helping and in fact making the situation worse on the ground. he also cautioned that the justice that people are hoping for and looking for in the michael brown case is likely to be a long time in coming. he worried out loud to craig melvin today that ferguson, as people wait for justice, that

ferguson just cannot take many more days and nights like this. >> one of the things you said last night is that you thought that, perhaps, the media, that journalists, had exacerbated the problem. what did you mean by that? >> we had a number of journalists, not all -- i want to say that now. the gejournalists have been on r side many repoin reporting. i'm grateful to the media for what they've done. we have a lot of media that have not done a great job. last night when crowds were walking and small groups, and they got large, and they were just walking, and then when a certain element, that almost that got out here with mask on who wanted to agitate and build up the crowd was stopped in front of the media. the media would swarm around them, give them a platform and glamorize their activity. the crowd would stop. then before we know it, the crowd is 100. now it's 2 00.

now it's 300. now those criminals began to start throwing things out of the crowd that were standing within the media. >> i've asked a number of folks and said, what's it going to take to stop this? they said some sort of punishment for the officer. >> as we know, and i heard just like everyone else from the court system and the courts and the p.a.'s office, that is going to be -- that's not going to happen tomorrow. so that's not going to happen tomorrow. that -- it may be weeks, it may be months. we have to bring calm to our community. our kids cannot stay in their bed for months and not go to school. our officers can't come out here for months and put their lives in dangers. peaceful protesters can't come out here for months and put their lives in danger. these homeowners can not be uncomfortable sleeping in mare homes wondering if a stray bullet is going to come in their home. we have to let our legal system work itself out, and that's what makes our country great. and we'll have to see what the

outcome is. we've got to -- we've had our voice, and we've got to bring calm to this situation. we're going to do that. >> missouri highway patrol captain ron johnson speaking exclusively with msnbc's craig melvin early today in ferguson today. the ferguson florissant school district announced that school would be put off yet again. the first day of school further delayed. kids were supposed to have started school in ferguson florissant last thursday. they're now not going to start until next week at the earliest, monday at the earliest. local teachers, the local library, they're saying they're frustrating. they're doing what they can to offer stuff for kids to do in the meantime since the school board decided kids can't actually two go to school there yet. they decided to make constructive use of that time. everybody from school principals to the custodians who work at those schools put on orange vests and picked up trash bags today and walked down west

florissant avenue in ferguson picking up bottles and trash and litter and trying to be constructive after those heavy, heavy protests overnight. once again today, the city of ferguson, its mayor and city council, they asked again for peaceful protesters to please stop protesting at nightfall, to only protest during the day. this time, though, they also released a list of commitments that the city would try to make to address residents' concerns. they described commitments to increase the number of african-american applicants to the law enforcement academy and to neighboring police forces. they tried to get -- they said they would try to get dash cameras and uniform-mounted cameras for local police officers. the city said they'd engage with young people more, they'd rebuild and enhance the west florissant business district. this list of commitles they're making, this is not the first time the city of ferguson has asked protesters to stop protesting at night. but it is the first time as far as i can tell that they have coupled that request with the list of things that they are willing to do as a city to try

to address people's concerns. people did march today already in nearby clayton, missouri, in clayton, missouri, they marched to the office of the county prosecutor's office to ask him to recuse himself from the michael brown case. protesters and local residents and local public officials have repeatedly expressed worries this particular county prosecutor in st. louis county cannot be trusted to fairly prosecute a case like this. so far that prosecutor has resisted calls to step down. he says tomorrow a grand jury will start looking into whether or not charges will be brought in the michael brown shooting. we're also learning tonight from the local prosecutor's office that the officer implicated in the shooting of mike brown, officer named by the police department as one who pulled the trigger in the mike brown shooting, that officer has already been interviewed by investigators. and that officer will be offered the opportunity to testify to the county grand jury. local legal experts also tell nbc news tonight that the governor of missouri, jay nixon,

does clearly have the power to appoint a special prosecutor to oversee this case. to essentially force out the county prosecutor and put a special prosecutor in instead. protesters tonight and local officials in ferguson -- local officials who represent the ferguson area are already tonight demanding that the governor do exactly that. because they say they do not trust the local county prosecutor to handle this case fairly. well, tomorrow attorney general eric holder is due to arrive in ferguson. he'll be meeting with the local u.s. attorney, that's the federal prosecutor, as well as justice department prosecutors who are already on the scene in ferguson along with dozens of fbi agents who are taking part in the independent federal investigation of this matter. but as the sun goes down tonight, again, in ferguson, it has been a peaceful day. it's been a day that has been peaceful, also there's been a lot of peaceful and constructive and community-building work, like cleaning up and doing art classes with kids.

right? it's also been a day of peaceful, nonviolent protests. like that protest, that big protest today at the prosecutor's office demanding that he step down. but as the sun goes down on night ten, there are worries about what tonight's going to bring. new uncertainties, particularly after that further shooting today. alderman antonio french, the one who was counseling after this new shooting today there will be no further silliness in the neighborhoods, no further violence, because the latest shooting happened in st. louis proper, that's a place where rez dens could feel like somebody had their backs in local government. alderman antonio french has also spent the last 48 hours or so arguing online and highlighting online what he says are essentially out of towners. an narcist tourists. people trying to take advantage of the situation in ferguson by infiltrating what would otherwise be peaceful protests and essentially trying to provoke police and trying to provoke violence, trying to make the situation worse, not better,

even though they are not from this local region. alderman french has been arguing that these elements are present after dark and the protests at ferguson, he's been highlighting efforts by local residents to confront what he says are outside elements. he, himself, has been arguing against them and that's extended to his own altercations with at least some of the folks who he says are come in from out of town to keep the fires burning ever hotter night after night. joining us now, antonio french, alderman for the city of st. louis. he's been in the thick of things in ferguson since the shooting ten days ago. alderman french, thanks very much for being with us. i appreciate your being here tonight. >> thanks for having me. >> first, let me just ask you about what's happening right now, what happened today in ferguson, and in north st. louis after the announcement that there had been another officer-involved fatal shooting? >> yeah, so it's a tense night. you know, we're very hopeful that we'll keep the peace tonight. we did have an officer-involved shooting in north st. louis near

my own ward. the alderman there, chris carter, gave me a call and let me know something happened. we went over there, and it was early in the scene. crowd started to form. some people trying to see what happened, and that crowd quickly grew and it became a tense moment. but i was out there, chris carter was out there. the chief of police was out there. the chief did a great swrjob, i thought, at updating the media as to what happened right on site, then walked over and updated the public directly. there were some folks angry, but i think people appreciate it that he was there. and afterwards, as you said, i did speak and let people know this is not ferguson. and that in st. louis city, people do have representation and we will not treat our folks like the enemy. we're going to get a quick investigation to determine what happened. but we shouldn't have any violence in our neighborhoods because that doesn't solve anything. >> can i ask you to e will labon that point, when you're drawing that contrast between ferguson and north st. louis, obviously these places are close to each

other, geographically a few miles apart. what is it you see as the material difference in terms of whether or not people have a stake in their local government, and they're represented locally by folks like you and their local police department? >> yeah, i think the situation we find ourselves in today is a direct result of how the ferguson police department handled the situation from day one. even while the body lay on the ground, they took an adversarial approach to both the community that came to see what happened, and even the family, and the mother of mike brown. and i think that set the tone. and then later even that evening on the first night when they showed up in large numbers with attack dogs at the memorial service, that angered people, and then the next day we saw what amounted to a militarization of the situation and an escalation to the point where they went to war with their citizens and you still have some young men who every night when they try to shut this thing down treat it as a warlike

environment and fight back. and so that is not the case in st. louis city. folks felt like they didn't have voice or representation in ferguson. they do have voice and representation in st. louis city. i represent that area. chris carter represents that area. alderman flowers, in fact, was a witness to the crime, witness to what happened afterwards with the officers. and so we have representation here that will make sure that justice is served. wherever the evidence takes us, whether the shooting was justified or turns out it was not justified. but we need to be patient here in st. louis city because you do have a government that is going to be communicating every step of the way. >> antonio french, alderman for the city of st. louis, and who's been doing triple time as essentially a citizen journalist here letting the world know about the ground-view perspective. thank you for all you've done thus far to keep us informed. thanks for being with us tonight. >> thank you. >> all right. much more from ferguson ahead. you're looking at live pictures right now from downtown ferguson, missouri. it's about 20 minutes past 8:00

right now local time. about 20 minutes past 9:00 on the east coast. as the altderman said, it's a tense night, it's been a tense night every night for the last tip nights but also because of this new announcement of another officer-involved shooting just a couple miles away from where mike brown was killed saturday. stay with us. more live reports from ferguson, and much more other news. stay with us. straight ahead. two medium cappuccinos! let's show 'em what a breakfast with whole grain fiber can do. [ barista ] i have two cappuccinos, a medium macchiato,

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these are live images here from ferguson, missouri, where the sun has set, and clearly people have rejected the latest plea from ferguson city officials to please not be out on the street and not be out protesting after nightfall. they clearly are out for night ten in that city. we'll be right back. ♪

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avo: get a $1,000 turbocharged reward card on new 2014 turbo models or lease a 2014 passat s for $189 a month after a $1,000 bonus. again, these are further live images right now in the streets of ferguson, missouri. it's now the tenth day of protests there which have made hat that town a focus for the entire country. in just a moment, we're going to speak with an attorney for the family of michael brown, 18-year-old man who was shot and killed by ferguson police a week ago saturday, that killing that started this whole crisis. and while this story over the last ten days has evolved to become a national or even an international story, today, egypt called for american restraint against protesters. even though this has become a massive story involving now thousands of people, the story, of course, starts just with the body of that young man, and with his family losing him. after mr. brown was shot, the first thing that happened immediately after the shooting that upset people so much locally was the fact that his

body was left in the street for hours by police. this video was shot in the immediate aftermath of the shooting by a young woman who lived nearby. and the voice that you'll hear in the foreground here is her narrating her own video explaining what she's looking at right after michael brown was shot. >> god bless his soul. police shot his boy outside my apartment. they killed him. >> police later explained that they left michael brown's body laying in the street for so long that it was there in the street in the middle of the day for hours because they wanted to protect the scene of the shooting. because they said they had to, quote, practice our due diligence, with that shooting scene. but he laid in the street for

hours. after he was killed. it has been ten days since then, and still his family has not had the opportunity to lay him to rest. first, it was the county medical examiner doing its official autopsy. the only information that they've released from that autopsy officially was that mr. brown was shot multiple times. they would not even say how many times. there was also a leak to the "washington post" from two sources who said they were familiar with that county autopsy. a leak in which those sources allege that michael brown had marijuana in his system when he was killed. as if that information was more important to release to the public than the number of times he was shot. because of the family's distrust of local authorities, they also arranged for a second autopsy to be done after that first one. so after that first officer was done by the county, then a second one was done by experts brought in by the family. those experts t s did put a num on it. they did say mr. brown had been shot six times. they released that information publicly. then this weekend, attorney

general eric holder announced there would be yet another autopsy, a third one. the federal medical examiner reportedly completing that work yesterday and attorney general eric holder reportedly was briefed on the results of that federal autopsy today. one day ahead of the attorney general visiting ferguson. that is planned for tomorrow. the death of 18-year-old michael brown has become a flashpoint for the nation. again, these are live shots from ferguson right now. at core, this is also very simply the death of a young man, and his body remains, and his family still has the personal work ahead of laying him to rest and burying him. today, the family announced that michael brown's funeral will be held on monday. they know that this will be an important event not just for their family, but for their community and to a certain extent, for the nation. the funeral on monday is going to be open to the public. they're now having to seek out a venue large enough to accommodate the expected turnout of people wanting to pay their

respects. nobody knows what the consequences will be of the funeral of michael brown. nobody knows what the consequences will be, the chain of events his death in ferguson has set in motion. the family finally having a answer to bury him is a reminder for all this means to all these people, there is nobody who it can possibly matter to more than it matters to his family. joining us now is anthony fwgra an attorney for michael brown's family. mr. gray, thank you for being with us tonight. >> thank you for having me, rachel. it's my pleasure. >> mr. brown's family has been set for monday. it will be a service that the public is allowed to attend. can you share any -- share with us any of the plans for the public service? any of the family's thoughts into what they want to happen at that event? >> well, we know what they want to happen is that they want to have a dignified home going for their child, michael brown jr. as far as the itinerary, who's going to speak and those things,

that information has not been finalized. i'm not privy to it, so i don't feel comfortable disclosing that. they definitely want to have a dignified service for their child. >> today, i have to ask you about the potential prosecution in this case, the county prosecuting attorney has been refusing calls from the community to recuse himself to allow special prosecutor to take on the case. the prosecutor's office did say today that the officer involved in the shooting has met with investigators. he'll be offered the opportunity to speak with the grand jury. so far, though, the governor's ability to replace that county prosecutor with a special prosecutor, the governor has rejected those calls. those calls seem to be getting louder from the community. what are your thoughts on that and the family's thoughts on that at this point? >> well, the family's thoughts are from the very beginning when they saw how this information was being played out within minutes after the shooting, they began to lose their faith and confidence in the local county officials. i don't think that has ever

changed, in fact, i think some of the events in the aftermath of that has worsened that feeling. and so i believe that they will support an independent or special prosecutor in this case. they actually are joining the voices of those that are asking for a special prosecutor, and i think they will be satisfied if that move is made. >> has the family been kept in the loop and communicated with adequately and in a compassionate way as this investigation has gone forward? we know the grand jury meeting tomorrow will be considering evidence in this case. again, we know that the officer has spoken with investigators. we know that there's this political negotiating going on, or at least political calls going on around who is going to be the prosecutor in this case. does the family feel like they have been adequately informed and kept apprised of what's happening all along? >> no, they haven't. no. they do not feel that way because that's not the case. in fact, there has been no effort, to my knowledge, for any of the individuals from the

prosecutor's office, from the police department, other than captain ron johnson reaching out to the family pretty much breaking ranks and embracing -- >> unfortunately i have to jump in here because we have lost the audio from anthony gray, attorney of the family of michael brown. mr. gray, if you can still hear me, i'm sorry we lost your audio. it dropped out completely there. we'll try to get you back. thank you very much for being with us tonight, sir. i have to say, on the left side of your screen there, what you are seeing is police vehicles out on the streets in ferguson, missouri, right now. it's about 8:30 local time. i can't say whether or not these are equivalent numbers or if this is an equivalent mood to what we are seeing this time last night. it's been a big day of developments in this case, including another officer-involved shooting a few miles away from the site of the shooting of michael brown. we'll be keeping an eye on these

live shots, and we've got further news ahead. stay with us. ups is a global company, but most of our employees live in the same communities that we serve. people here know that our operations have an impact locally. we're using more natural gas vehicles than ever before. the trucks are reliable, that's good for business. but they also reduce emissions, and that's good for everyone. it makes me feel very good about the future of our company. ♪

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phone. the tons of visual material from that city streets has been shaping the country's understanding of what is happening in this news story in a very, very direct way, but there is one way in which the events in ferguson are not being covered. because they can't. because the police say they can't. and that is also changing way that people are able to understand the evens there, and that story is next. stay with us. so i get invited to quite a few family gatherings. heck, i saved judith here a fortune with discounts like safe driver, multi-car, paperless. you make a mighty fine missus, m'lady. i'm not saying mark's thrifty. let's just say, i saved him $519,

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when we learned today there'd been another officer-involved shooting not in ferguson but four miles away over the line into nearby north st. louis, there's one thing about how we learned about that that was just visually 180 degrees different than what we have been seeing in ferguson. this is where that shooting happened. and this is a scene of where it happened right after it happened. and it is a view of that scene from overhead, shot by a news helicopter, and the shot got wider and you could see exactly in what context what kind of neighborhood this happened in, how big the response was relative to the neighborhood. how many vehicles were on scene, how many people were on scene. whether people were still arriving there after the shooting or whether they were leaving from there.

an aerial view like this helps you get your head around what can otherwise be a confusing or hard to quantity thing that you are looking at, right? it helps you know what you're looking at. helps you understand its scale. we have not had the benefit of that kind of perspective in ferguson. literally, we have not had that kind of overhead visual perspective on ferguson since the protests there got intense and turned into a national story. early in this crisis, the st. louis county police department got a flight ban put in place for ferguson. they asked the faa to put a no-fly zone into effect over downtown ferguson after they said that a police helicopter got shot at during an early protest. the request to the missouri governor, that flight ban over ferguson was renewed yesterday in order to, quote, provide a safe environment for law enforcement activities. so, law enforcement can fly helicopters over ferguson to monitor protests and to help with policing, but the media cannot fly helicopters over

ferguson in order to monitor policing and film the protests. and this is not to question law enforcement's stated need for a flight ban. over the course of the last ten night, almost every night police have said there were reports of shots fired. police have said over and over again that gunfire has been part of this experience, especially late at night in this town. tonight, missouri highway patrol captain ron johnson said that police received calls of shooters on top of buildings in downtown ferguson. last night, at what appeared to be some of the most difficult clashes so far, police repo reportedly arrested 78 people and in the course of the night confiscated two handguns and at least one molotov cocktail which they showed off to reporters at about 2:30 in the morning as a way of trying to convince reporters that police directions to the media really were about keeping reporters safe and not just about suppressing the reporting of the news. police say that they have been shot at. they say that their helicopters have been shot at. they say that is why it would be unsafe for media helicopters to

be up there. that is their stated reason why news organizations can't fly over the scene to report from that helpful wide-view perspective. it's not a crazy argument, but that said, the no-fly-zone decision which was just renewed yesterday has been really con quench l for the country in terms of trying to understand what's going on there, especially where the police response is intrinsically part of the story. i mean, look at this. when you see these images on the ground, the situation obviously looks very chaotic. it is chaotic. this is from overnight images from last night in ferguson. one stretch of a major street, just one stretch. we watched these images as they were coming in live just after midnight here in new york. and from what we could see, and from what reporters on the ground described to us from their individual vantage points, it appeared that people were running from a police response. they were being pushed by that police response up the street toward another line of police that was pushing them back into

the opposite direction. from the best we could tell with cameras and eyes at ground level, it appeared that these protesters were caught or at least they may have been caught between police lines and basically an impossible position. and it was hard to know for sure, but that's a really important part of the story. that we honestly cannot witness from the perspectives that we are allowed and we thereby cannot communicate to you at home trying to be an educated news consumer about this story. we cannot communicate an important part of what police are doing on the streets of this town. we can see what's directly in frob front of our ground level vantage points but it's impossible to tell how scenes like this related to, say, the streets nearby. that kind of perspective is why news organizations use helicopters in the first place. out after view from high up. in a circumstance like this, it's hard to get beyond the running moment-to-moment experiential level. frankly, that is not enough to accurately and objectively

report on the rationality and reasonableness and effectiveness of police tactics and protesters' tactics. it's hard to tell what's happening when you can only see it from five feet off the ground. and part of the reason we cannot tell what's happening from a better vantage point, the media just literally cannot show it. physically, the media is not being allowed to show what we need to be able to show in order to characterize this in a way that is objective and makes the most sense. joining us now is patricia bynes, democratic committeewoman of ferguson township in the city of fuergusoferguson. thanks very much for being with ussen t en tsen to . >> thank you for having me, rachel. >> tell us from your perspective where you think the community is and the police are tonight in terms of the trajectory of these protests. how long they're going to two on, what the demands are, what the protests are likely to be like from here on out? >> well, let's see, we have some good news coming up with the attorney general coming into

town tomorrow. and also i know that we're looking -- bob mccolloch, the prosecutor is moving forward with a grand jury. people are seeing some movement which is the main thing people have been wanting to see out here is the fact that they want this case taken seriously. so i think that that has helped quell some anger about what's going on. they want to make sure that there is justice for him and his family and this community. so i don't know how long this is going to take. i don't know how long people are going to protest because this also is just not about mike brown. this is about police brutality. this is about racism. this is about racial profiling. and this is about a community that's trying to find its voice. so that doesn't have a specific timeframe, but i'm thinking as things move forward in the investigation, and in pursuing this case, people will probably start changing some of their strategies in protesting and maybe start having more meetings

rp , town halls. i know there are lots of things scheduled. that's where i think very soon we'll start seeing this transition. >> very interesting point. to that point, the mayor and city council in ferguson today put out a statement, once again, asking people not to protest after dark. obviously that instruction is not being heeded by people out on the street. we can see there tonight. they also listed a series of commitments that the city was considering in terms of trying to address people's concerns, everything from trying to get a more diverse police force, to trying to get dash cams and uniform games on the police trying to engage more with young people in the city. >> right. >> i saw that happen today and in print it seemed like something -- haven't heard a single person reference it all day, nor does anybody seem to be treating it as an important development in the story. is the city government just not being treated -- not being seen as relevant to this case now? >> well, because of the regio l regionalism in st. louis county, ferguson is just a small

municipality overall in the st. louis region. so, yes, they should be commended for working on things, but this is just not a ferguson issue, and people -- we see ideas. we want to see execution as well. we should be having the dialogue. we should be throwing out ideas. this is not just limited to ferguson. this is a regional issue, and it's going to take regional leaders to come forward and not just have more good ideas, but start moving things forward in this area. >> patricia bynes, democratic committeewoman in the city of ferguson. thank you very much for getting out there and talking with us. i appreciate your time. thank you. again, on the left side of your screen, these are live shots from downtown ferguson. see a large police presence right now. at this point we're not look at officers in s.w.a.t.-type gear but have seen tactical-style vehicles out there. there's plenty of people out on the street tonight. this is night ten of protests in ferguson. there was another officer-involved shooting in nearby north st. louis today. we'll keep you apprised. stay right here. since the day you met.

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as you can see in these live images, protesters are on the move tonight in downtown ferguson, missouri. these are live images. in this crowd, we have seen some protesters wearing gas masks tonight. there is another large police presence in downtown ferguson right now. we'll be right back. a card that gave you that "i'm 16 and just got my first car" feeling. presenting the buypower card from capital one. redeem earnings toward part or even all of a new chevrolet, buick, gmc or cadillac - with no limits. so every time you use it, you're not just shopping for goods. you're shopping for something great. learn more at buypowercard.com

in november 2012, on thanksgiving day in 2012, an american photo journalist working in the middle east went missing. james foley covered war zones across the middle east for the news website global post. but in 2012, while covering the raging civil war in syria, he was kidnapped. at the time, there were other instances of syrian rebels operating in the region abducting foreign journalists for ransom money. but when he was kidnapped, it was radio silence from his captors. a fuel year after his abduction, his father said we haven't been contacted by anybody asking for anything. the foley family created a website asking for help finding their son, appealing for any information. but this american photojournalist, james foley, had been missing for more than

600 days when today his image appeared on a video connected to the terrorist group isis. the video is far too graphic to show here. nobody needs to see it for any reason. but it includes what appears to be the beheading of james foley and describes his murder for payback of recent military operations in iraq. tonight, the white house put out a statement saying they were still working to confirm the authenticity of the tape but says -- >> the videotaped execution of a western hostage is a tactic. it is a tactic that's been used a number of times over the last decade. it is intended to have a specific desired terroristic effect. in 2002, a "wall street journal" reporter named daniel pearl was

kidnapped in pakistan and executed by his captors on camera. two years later in 2004, an american businessman from philadelphia named nicholas bird was captured in the war in iraq. he was later executed on camera with the threat that more abductions would follow. this is a tactic. it is murder and propaganda. in the video that was released today, the men who killed james foley showed and named the next hostage they say they intend to execute. another american, a journalist who had been reporting in the middle east for "time" magazine. this is a tactic, but also the grim reality for the family of james foley and the concerned family of the other journalist who had been threatened. just a short time ago, foley's parents released a statement saying --

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or if power could go anywhere? or if light could seek out the dark? what would happen if that happens? anything. we do have late breaking news tonight regarding the police shooting of michael brown ten days ago in ferguson, missouri. many protesters and residents and local leaders said they believe the st. louis prosecutor should recuse himself because they don't trust him to hand it will case fairly. well, tonight on the eve of the county grand jury starting to consider evidence in this case, the governor of missouri has put out a statement saying he will not ask the county prosecutor to

recuse himself. the statement effectively says if the county prosecutor ought to be recused from the case, he should do it himself. the governor's statement says -- >> again, that statement tonight from governor jay nixon from missouri, indicating that he will not ask the county prosecutor to step down and be replaced be a special prosecutor. we'll be keeping an eye on the situation in ferguson throughout the night tonight. keep it here on msnbc. now time for "the last word with lawrence o'donnell." >> rachel, the future of that prosecution has become the big issue of the night. as rachel just described, this is now the big issue of the night in ferguson. it has become the credibility of the distri