that's "the ed show." i'm ed schultz, "politics nation" with reverend al sharpton starts now. good evening, rev. >> good evening, ed. thanks for tuning in. we are watching attorney general eric holder's message as he arrived today in ferguson, missouri. the attorney general is reportedly meeting with the parents of michael brown later this afternoon. but since the shooting of michael brown, the attorney general has been committed to finding out what happened. briefing the president. vowing to work tirelessly on a federal investigation. holding conference calls to update civil rights leaders. informing the president that he personally wanted to go to ferguson. and today, the first african-american attorney general who made civil rights a priority for this administration did just that. he met with students and

community leaders and talked with federal investigators. working on the ground. and a restaurant just four miles away from where michael brown was shot, he told ferguson restaurants, he is keeping a close eye on their time. >> i need to be here, you know. i was a little disturbed to see certain people questioning why i was here. why would i be any place other than right here right now to talk to the people in this area who are deserving of our attention and we want to help as best we can. we also want to listen. that the main part of this trip. listen to the main issues that you all are dealing with. are there ways in which we can help. >> just moments later, captain ron johnson, man charged with keeping the peace in ferguson, stopped by. >> my man. >> how you doing, sir.

>> the attorney general of the united states telling captain johnson he's making a difference. but this isn't about photo ops. the attorney general's pushing a very real, very aggressive investigation in ferguson. right now, about 40 fbi agents and federal prosecutors are working in ferguson. they conducted more than 200 interviews about the shooting. and conducted an independent autopsy. this attorney general isn't waiting around for the results of the local investigation. he is doing what he can to get justice for a family that's grieving. and today in ferguson, he plans to let them know it in person. joining me now from ferguson, msnbc.com's trimane lee, st. louis alderman and frank, jr who

represents a friend of michael brown and a witness in the shooting. thanks for being here. a pleasure. trimane, you've been covering the attorney general, what was it like on the ground? what was it like for this visit? >> people want to be heard. they feel like now that attorney general is here, they are not only being heard, but they are getting assurances that the investigation running parallel with the state investigation will be clear and transparent and that the federal government is here. the department of justice is watching. >> now you know, alderman french said, and captain johnson, both were asked today about the impact of the attorney general's visit. i want to play you the answer. >> i think it'll be a great impact. i think it will show that people of ferguson, people of st. louis, people of our nation, this their voices are heard. that the highest office in this

land is listening to their voices. and taking a look into the incident that happened. >> do you agree with that, mr. bosley? >> oh, i agree. i think one of the things we are thankful for, is that attorney general is here because there is a lot of misinformation, insination and innuendo swirling around this case and it will take the federal government to come in here and sort this stuff out. >> what about you, alderman french, what is your view? >> i also think it's a good thing for him to be here. the folks here have lost so much faith in their local prosecutor and local police department, that it really is going to take the federal government to step in and restore the faith. >> the attorney general arrived in ferguson to date but he is following the incident very closely. it's been reported that he wanted officers identity released earlier. he was opposed to releasing surveillance video of michael brown.

allegedly stealing from a convenience store. and he told his deputies quote, tell them to remove the damn tanks in ferguson last week. how big is the sense that the attorney general's invested in what happens there? let me he ask you that, trimane. >> oh, i think it is clear that he is invested. but one thing he did do and he has done in the past, he related his own experience as a black man. not just as highest prosecutor in the land but as a black man about being stopped and stereotyped. for him and the people, he understands the -- what's being said. when you see a take rolling up in a city street and see a crowd of black folk being gassed and police officers with dogs. he understands their experiences. so i think that goes a long way. >> now let me go back to you alderman french. you have been out there with the protesters. and there's been a lot of concern about the local prosecutors, local authorities. how important is the attorney

general coming in, given the concerns in the community. i'm not talking about those of us observing or coming in from the outside. but in the community, what does it mean to them that have expressed this concern about how local authorities might handle this investigation. >> yeah, you know, there is almost no faith here in this local community that there is going to be a fair investigation and fair result from the county prosecutor. so having the attorney general come here personally is a strong statement that the federal government is looking to make sure the justice is served in this case. whatever that may be. but also, we are still calling on the governor to reconsider and the point of special prosecutor. because even comments made as soon as within the last 24 hours, it really endangered people's faith that county prosecutor can actually try this case fairly. >> now, let me go to you a minute, again, mr. bosley. according to a published reports

in the "new york times," your client, darian johnson, who was with michael brown when he was killed, was interviewed by the fbi and u.s. attorney for four hours. does that mean to you that this is a serious federal investigation or serious inquiry by the federal government? >> oh, absolutely, reverend, al. here is the other thing, it wasn't really four, it was closer to three. they took him over the accounts over and over again. they asked him the questions one way. then came back and asked them to him another way. he still was consistent in terms of what it is that they saw. and so, as of a week ago, my client is a federal witness and people are now saying he recanted his story. he has not changed. he hasn't made any comments since last wednesday. it shows there is a lot of misinformation being spewed

about. >> help me with that misinformation, attorney bosley. >> okay. >> your client is saying what? what has he said happened that night? just repeat quickly for our viewers. >> okay. real briefly. they are walking in the middle of the street. an officer is coming from the opposite direction. he slows. they stop. he tells them to get the f on the sidewalk. my client says, well, we're a short distance from home. we're going to keep on walking. and big mike -- mike brown says nothing at that point. they keep walking. the officer throws his car in reverse. catches up with them rapidly. then said something to the effect, what did you say? and attempted to get aught of the car. he is so close on them, he can't open the car door. so he and mike have conversation, real words. he reaches out and grabs mike by the throat. mike is a big guy. he is moving away from the officer then the officer latches on to his shirt.

he pulls him closer to the car. at that time, mike is continuing to try to get away from him. the officer pulls out his weapon and said, i'll shoot you. and before he could get the next i'll shoot -- pow, he's shot. and he lets him go and he runs. that three cars are already stacked up behind the police officer's car because he is blocking the street. dorian get behind the car and the first car, big mike, mike brown, as he runs by, he says keep running bro. so dorian pays attention to that, but the officer is right behind. as mike passes by, the officer passes the car, dorian is able to get a full view of what is going on. he says there are more -- there are shots fired and he is thinking that one hit mike in the back. the autopsy says that it was one that hit him in the arm that could have come from the back. mike then puts his hands up, turns around and officer closes the gap and continues to shoot

him and he falls on his face. and that's the story. >> alderman french, there or two other witnesses that tell very similar stories, two other eyewitnesss, very similar stories. the only one i've heard that contradicts this is a lady who called into a radio show that says what she says. she was not there. she says is the policeman's story. is there anything you heard or saw from the autopsy reports released by the family's private pathologist or federal autopsy, to the degree you know, that is inconsistent story we've been told by dorian johnson and two other eyewitnesss. >> i think the autopsy report is more evidence that shows that an indictment should come and that this thing should go to trial. that what community wants. they want this thing to move on. they are waiting for the wheels of justice to spin faster. when the county prosecutor comes out today and says that his process won't be done until october, that worries me. we're trying to keep the peace here. and it is a fragile peace.

i don't know if we can keep it until october. >> trymaine, what is the mood now on the streets where we saw ten days of violence? >> i tell you what, i think people are quite frankly tired. night after night of being gassed. night after night of facing police rubber bullets, police are worn down. last night we saw a strategy by the police department. rather tan throwing tear gas, they circle had crowd, went in and aggressively physically removed people. maced people. last week there is still a very tin uous balance. things change at night. so we will wait until tonight to determine how cool people's heads are. >> one thing that's amazing to me, and i've been involved in civil rights and cases like this all my life, i have never seen what we saw today. an attorney general actually on

the ground and in a city that has been torn around a legal case, to really let the people know that they have a hands-on inquiry. freeman bosley, you've been a mayor, you've been a lawyer. this is unprecedented. i can't remember a sitting attorney general coming into a scene like this. >> that's right. and reverend al, that's what is so refreshing about this. and this is what you get when you get an african-american president. this is what you get when you get an african-american u.s. attorney. these are the things that these people are concerned about. as you know, in the past, nobody was really interested in that. that's why this thing is mushroomed into such a big problem because people have said it over and over again, what happened to mike brown, just really underscores what allowed to go on here in this community for so long. we've got cases where a man was tazed 13 times by the police officer, antonio johnson, with his hands cuffed behind his

back. they killed him. he kid to the next day. another situation with a man in columbus square, shot 27 times by police. nobody paid attention to those stories. it has taken mike brown's situation and the national media to pull the cover off of what is going on here in st. louis. that's why people are so excited and so glad to have you. >> all right, trymaine lee. freeman bosley, and antonio french, let me thank all of you for your time tonight. >> and thank you. >> coming up, protesters outside the grand jury began looking at this case today. and started to gather evidence. but the prosecutor in charge is raising all kind of questions from the community on whether this can be a fair investigation. plus, new details emerge on where the investigation is going and who is talking. and out of the chaos comes

stories of inspiration. yes, inspiration. how ferguson teachers and residents are coming together for the community. stay with us.

the grand jury convenes today amid controversy surrounding the prosecutor. that's next.

ing? r. breaking news, attorney general eric holder is meeting in ferguson.

grand jury testimony began today in the michael brown case. the proceedings of that testimony are secret but there's a fire storm of controversy surrounding the prosecutor whose presenting evidence to that jury. protesters gathered around the courthouse today demanding st. louis county prosecutor robin mccullough recuse himself from the case. questioning whether he can remain impartial in the case. today mccullough said his investigation would be full and fair, and gave us a hint at how long the grand jury hearings might continue. >> the aspirational team is mid october to have everything completed. we aren't going to rush anything in or rush anything through but as things are completed, they will be presented to the grand jury. but i understand the public want to know what's going on and needs to know. so there will be no decision by

anybody made at end of today or next week or any time soon but we want to get the process started. >> no decision any time soon. so how might this all play out and what can happen to convince the community that investigation will be fair and impartial? thanks to both of you for being here tonight. >> thank you for having us. >> thachk you, reverend al. >> reverend bines. let me go to you now. what do you think of the grand jury convening for next two months. >> it sounds good, we want to get things started, but we want it get things done right. the best way for things to be done right is for prosecutor bob mcculloch to recuse himself.

we want things right and transparent. we don't want any bias whatsoever in the process. we want justice. and this isn't political. this is just about being correct. >> you know, areba, last night, the governor addressed those calls to remove robert mcculloch from the case in a statement saying quote, i'm not asking st. louis county prosecutor bob mcculloch to recuse himself from this case. there is a process by which a prosecutor can recuse them self and a prosecutor be appointed. this morning prosecutor mcculloch fired back. listen to this. >> i'm not walking way from this. i've been entrusted with these responsibilities. but i understand declaring a state of emergency, governor

mixon has the authority to say, mcculloch is out of this case. we will proceed, as we lay out to people, until i'm told, if i'm told, by the governor, that i can't. and the most devastating thing that can happen is if a week from now, a month from now, he decides he has taken me off this case. you know, everyone is starting over. so stand up, you know, man up. stand up and say, i am not removing mcculloch or i am removing mcculloch. the family deserves no less than this. man up. stand up, governor. sounds like he is throwing the gauntlet down to the governor who has the legal authority to remove him. not that he has it recuse himself. areba? >> you know, reverend al. i think this political posturing is embarrassing and it goes to the frustration that ferguson community is feeling. if the governor wants to remove mcculloch he has the legal

authority to do so. rather than take little snippets at him or dig at him through the press, he needs do that if that's what he believes is the right thing to do. the st. louis community, fefrgson community, believes that mcculloch is incapable of being unbias in this case. they site a case where two african-american men were shot by two white police officers in a vehicle. those officers were not indicted or prosecuted. there is a long list of cases that i think has caused the ferguson commune it to have no faith in mcculloch. the governor knows that and i agree with mcculloch that the governor needs to man up, step up, and take some decisive action. >> committee woman bines, let's go through what a grand jury involves in missouri. jurors will consider whether there's probable cause a crime was committed. the votes of 9 of 12 jurors are

required for an excitement and the proceedings are kept secret. how likely is that that there will be an indictment in a given this grand jury in your opinion? >> well, you know, i don't -- i don't know. we need to start the process. there are so many unknowns going on with this case right now. so many things being, you know, leaked out to the press. that you know, should not be. but we need to start the process. because from where the community is standing, there's an unarmed young man that was shot six times, twice in the head. the idea that there may or may not be an excitement is crazy. it sounds like there should be an indictment because this stop from walking in the middle of the street should never ended like this. never from a trained officer. >> areba, let me get your legal expertise here. the new republic reported today that grand jury might not

deliver the justice that protesters are calling for. they wrote, while -- and i'm quoting them, while grand juries have a lot of power in theory, in reality, few use it. instead most just follow the lead of prosecutors. not only do the prosecutors get to decide what charges to seek, they also end up choosing what evidence to bring forward and how to present it. now, areba, the prosecutors in there by himself. no attorney representing any opposing view. he decides what evidence is put in front of the grand jury or not. he decides the charges. and he doesn't need an indictment to make an arrest. he can do that tonight on probable cause. >> absolutely, reverend al. somably ef that this prosecutor punted this to the grand jury to take the pressure off of himself. very few cases are decided at the grand jury level. most cases involve a criminal complaint being filed and an open preliminary hearing being

held. a hearing where a judge is presiding. that's open to the public. where the evidence and witnesses presented are all open. there's absolute disclosure. where as in contrast, grand jury proceedings, as you've said, are done in secret. and they really are about what the prosecutor wants to happen. if the prosecutors goes in there with the strong case, he can pretty much guarantee an indictment. to the contrary, if the case is presented in an alternative way, there may not be an indictment. but in any event the prosecutor gets to stand there and say, hey, look, i gave it to the grand jury and they didn't come back with an indictment. taking the pressure off of him. again, another point of contention. another reason that community is so uncomfortable and so frustrated with mcculloch staying on this case. >> all right, thank you both for your time this evening. >> thank you. >> thank you. coming up, inside the investigation. new details emerging from witnesses. but first, out of chaos.

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liberty mutual insurance. in the midst of unrest and certainty in ferguson comes remarkable and inspiring stories of generosity. keith griffin is a ferguson native who decided that he needed to get involved. so he made his mission to pass out pizzas and care packages to people on the street. the washington post spent the day with him. >> feed the community every night. y'all want it eat? eat up. >> you want cheese? >> tomorrow, i buy tomorrow too. i appreciate it, though. help out with the cause, though. keep the people off the streets. >> i'm not the leader. i'm just a guy that trying to spark the mind and idea of that leader to come out and fix it.

you know, me doing this part. just pretty much anything that the people need that they can't get their hands on. stuff at the drugstore that's no longer open. >> keep up that great work, keith. in another part of town ferguson teachers are involved. school has been postponed several times. teachers were out on the street helping clean up trash. >> we're out here to clean up the community. to show how we build up the community, not take it down. so all of our teachers thought it would be wonderful to kick off the day with cleaning up the community. >> other teachers were holding make-shift classes at ferguson public library, encouraging parents to drop off their kids for the day. >> parents dropped off more than 40 kids today for activity like science and art projects. these teachers hope it's a little bit of normalcy during these chaotic times. >> at left to be here, doing

these sort of fun quasi educational activities, and socially it is a good thing for kids who have been bummed out to be here with friends they know and they are meeting new people too. so it's been a good thing for everybody involved. >> over 40 kids showed up. this is what i call a teachable moment in ferguson. local residents giving the world a lesson on inspiration. way to go. . and startup ny companies will be investing hundreds of millions of dollars in jobs and infrastructure. thanks to startup ny, businesses can operate tax free for 10 years. no property tax. no business tax. and no sales tax. which means more growth for your business, and more jobs. it's not just business as usual. see how new york can help your business grow, at startup.ny.gov wouldn't it be great if hiring plumbers, shopping online is as easy as it gets. carpenters and even piano tuners were just as simple?

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stopp st stoppedi movement issinged ands armed in the air. >> the police continued to shoot until he went down. >> he put his arms up to let them know he was compliant and he was unarmed. >> a similar account from three witnesses. but today the times has details on what officer wilson is saying. quote, according to his account to the ferguson police, officer wilson said that mr. brown lowered his arms and moved toward him. law enforcement officials said that the times goes on to report, this is a quote, some witnesses say that mr. brown moved toward mr. wilson possibly in a threatening answer when the officer shot him dead. but others say that mr. brown was not moving. and may have even had his hands up when he was killed. these conflicting accounts will be at the heart of this

investigation. of why michael brown was shot to death. for more on the investigation, let's bring in former u.s. attorney kendel coffee and john burriss. thank you both for being here. >> thank you. >> john burriss, different accounts. but the only eyewitnesss said michael brown gave up and had his arms raised. >> in every case you will have conflicting witnesses and testimony. particularly you have to look to see what is their motive and where they are at the time they made the observations. three people say he had his hands up. other people said something totally different. at the end of the day, the question is, how far away was the police officer from mr. brown when he shot and i think also more importantly, what happened before. i think what happened at that car plays a huge role in assessing the overall fact pattern. but at the same time, if mr.

brown turned around, had his hands up, even if he was bent over slightly, that's an basis to shoot him if you are some distance away. the question is whether or not the officer perceived and had reasonableness to perceive what mr. brown was doing. i think on balance, the defendant has got to overcome these three witnesses, assuming the three witnesses did not have an axe to grind in that part of any kind of biasness. you have to deal with the question of who are the other witnesses. i hope it didn't come down to a black witness saying this and white witness saying something else because that's not going to advance the situation for a jury to understand. >> kendel? >> i think that first of all, we can expect that police community is going to continue to rally behind officer darren wilson and they are mighty smart and mighty good at what they do. and that includes working the press and getting their message out through the media. so we are hearing that message. we haven't seen witnesses that actually say it on camera. we don't know what they are say

together fbi. but at this point, we can assume that there is going to be an active effort of on only police rallying behind the cause of this officer but also police department and police officials trying to get his message out through the court of public opinion. fortunately we've got an attorney general who sent 40 fbi agents. when the fbi interviews you, they know how to ask questions. and if you lie to the fbi, it is a federal crime. i think whatever we are hearing, of what the public opinion is right now, the fbi are getting some interviews and information that's going to be a reliable basis as to what the eyewitnesss have to say. there will be conflicts. but tle are going to do what they can to match up the most reliable accounts with the forensic evidence. and that's why one of the first things the attorney general did was decide let's get our own autopsy here. >> now, john, let me ask you something. will the fbi be looking at how the police are handling this?

and give me the law here. if michael brown was dressed in a t-shirt, short pants and plip flo flip-flops, the officer knew he wasn't armed, is it enough to say that lunged at him and that is a threaten to kill him? >> i don't think so. especially if they were some distance away. making a movement, falling down or not, that's not a basis with which to shoot someone, speperi. and if they have their hands up, and the officer is in safety in his car. so if they evaluate the district attorney's conduct here and if the district attorney doesn't indict then the u.s. attorney is in a position to take that evidence themselves and file a federal civil rights criminal violation which is basically the same evidence but fourth

amendment violation that you can utilize to prosecute. >> kendall, you worked as u.s. attorney. the fbi, federal government, are they looking at how the police are conducting themselves? >> they certainly are. and they come in with an independence which is very, very important here. the local prosecutor, local police part of a very close knit family, that's going to rally behind and support each other. the feds come in largely from outside the community, can be much more objective. and they are going to examine a lot of things but one of them they will look at closely, is whether there's any evidence of obstruction. lie together fbi is a crime. and if in the efforts to create a story to support this officer, there is some kind of fabrication occurring, that's going to get a lot of attention too. sometimes not what you did, it's what you fed that gets you in

jail. what knowledge, if any, did the officer have of the alleged strong arm robbery that occurred before the shooting p thap could be part of the defense for the officer if he actually knew. but did he know? and who's going to join him in perhaps saying that they told him about it, told him to look for the suspects. that's an item to watch out for, reverend, as this case unfolds. >> kendall, even if he knew, and even if he heard it on the radio, there was not a report of an armed robbery. won't he need -- according to the federal law, a police officer can use deadly force if the officer has quote probable cause to believe that suspect poses a threat or serious physical harm to the officer or to others. if he had knowledge that he shoplifted some cigar webs there was no claim of a gun or any violence that took life or threatened life. would that be enough to justify every bullet he shot at michael brown? >> reverend, you're exactly

right. you can't shoot and kill a shoplifter. no matter what they say or how fast they run. >> but what they may do is try to morph this into a story that he heard it was some kind of violent crime, a quote strong-arm robbery. and look, he is going to definitely work the self-defense angle. but there is a separate angle if the officer reasonably believed this was a suspect who committed a violent crime. that's the second thing we will watch. >> the other point i would be careful about here is, was there a conflict or fight and tussle at the car. because if the officer says he got hit upside of his head and he was reaching for his gun, that will then have provocation for him to use deadly force at car. once the boy runs away, the question is, is he now a fleeing felon, having commit a felony by hitting a an officer. or is it a misdemeanor. even so, once he stops and turns around, regardless of what

happened at the car, you cannot shoot the person, the person put their hand up. >> kendall coffey and burriss, thank you. >> thank you. >> a new report emerges on the dysfunctional court system in ferguson. and attorney general eric hold are's visit to ferguson. stay with us.

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the the situation in ferguson and asking, how did we get here. michael brown's killing engages more questions about policing in ferguson and around the country. there is a pattern of unequal treatment that's been brewing for a long time. a group of local public defenders just put out a report revealing how dysfunctional the court system is in ferguson. and how the criminal justice system violate the fundamental rights of the poor. it highlights how the courts impose heavy financial burdens on the poor, that poor defendants are quote ordered it pay fines that are frequently triple their monthly income. as a result, defendants are incarcerated for their poverty. jailed for being poor. but it's not just jail time. it's traffic stops. court appearances. and searches this appear to

disproportionately target poor black residents. quote, municipal courts of police departments inflict a kind of lower level harassment. this tracks with annual reports on blacks in ferguson being targeted by police. 63% of ferguson's population is black. and yet they account for 86% of police stops. 92% of police searches. and nearly 93% of arrests. it is the kind of unfair and unjust treatment that so many in the community say is fuelling th the anger on the streets of ferguson. joining me now is one of the authors of that report. thomas harvey, executive director and co-founder of art city defenders. his group represents low income residents of st. louis county in municipal court proceedings. thank you for being here tonight, thomas. >> thank you very much for having me, reverend sharpton.

>> what prompted to you write this report? >> we're a nonprofit that been around since 2009. we primarily represent the homeless in the city of st. louis. and what we do is we work with social service agencies to remove the legal barriers that our client have, that prevent them from getting access to services they need to get off the streets and into the housing or jobs and treatment they need to get on with their lives. and when we began this work in 2009, we kept seeing these municipal ordinance violations and warrants for arrest as a problem from preventing folks from getting off the streets. >> go ahead. >> no, go ahead. >> no, go ahead. >> our clients told stories about being locked up and being pro filed and stories about their children not able to get into court. and this there were things, as brand new lawyers at a new nonprofit, frankly, we didn't believe that. so we conducted a court-watching

experiment, a court-watching program. we went out to about 60 municipal courts. there are 90 in our region. what we saw supported what they were saying. >> and let me get this right. what you were hearing was surprising, even shocking, to you. so you went out to see if in fact what was being said is true. because you couldn't believe this. >> that's right. that's exactly right. we were surprised what the they were saying. >> one thing is not being able to afford child care. 73% koufrts unconstitutionally close their door to nondefendants. so defendants who can't afford child care could be denied entry into the court or their forced to leave their kids in the parking lot. one defendant who left his kid with the friend was charged then with child endangerment.

you can't win either way with this. >> it is a catch 22. and that was not a client of ours but one of the stories with heard from folks in the court. and it was shocking to us. owe he are we went out and observed courts. bell ridge, ferguson and floorson and we have been working to finalize it over the summer and when this happens, we published the findings. >> and see, this is some of the simmering anger that we are hearing in the community. your report also shows how municipal courts can target poor people for failing it pay afine. they can be arrested an pay fines or court might not be held on a daily basis or it could be held once, once now per month. which means a person could spend three weeks in jail just waiting to see a judge. i mean, somebody with money would never have to endure

something like this, thomas? >> that is true. the way this court works is, if you had the money to make the bond, you would be out of the jail immediately. if you don't have the money to make the bond, the bond is frequently the unpaid fines and court costs that are associated with your plea. i want to be clear, our report does not say that people are targeted. our report says that our client tell us they feel they are targeted. they feel they are pro filed. and they feel in addition that they are being exploited financially. and that it is not just because of the color of their skin they are being pulled over. it is in order to generate revenue for the municipality. i can't tell what is in the mind of the police officer or judge. i know. of the judges and prosecutors and i would tell you they are good people. one of the things i'm very concerned about is a systemic racism or structural inequality that produces this. it doesn't matter -- sometimes it doesn't matter who is in those positions p. that system has been in place a

long time. it existed before some of the individual actors, it will exist after them. it is important to note that it is a structural issue. and we're hopeful that our report will give some context to some of the things going on that are create smfgt tensions in the reasoningon that we're seeing here. we don't pretend like traffic tickets are the reason folks are on the street and upset. >> no. we are not -- >> never experienced -- if michael brown never encountered that officer tsh-sorry. >> we are not justifying the voi lens. we are saying the underlying anger is a result of some of the systemic problems, you say, and that's why i say we need change in policies, not just people. thomas harvey, thank you for your time tonight. >> thank you very much, reverend sharpton. >> coming up, the parents of james foley. the american journalist behead bid a terrorist group, remembers their son. next. when you run a business, you can't settle for slow.

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today attorney general eric holdinger made his way around ferguson meeting with ferguson residents and vowing to carry out a thorough investigation. moments ago he arrived at eagleton federal courthouse meeting with local officials. and less than one mile away from that meet sgt old st. louis courthouse where the scott case was first heard. the case stated that african-americans free our slaves, could not be american citizens and therefore american property. today near na courthouse the country's first african-american attorney general was fighting for justice. there is some critical of it. but if you really believe in america, you want it improve it. i was raised by a strict disciplinarian mother. i asked her when i became an adult, why she was so hard on me. she said, because i loved you. i loved you enough to see what you could be if i kept forcing

and prodding for you to reach and be better than you thought you could. those of us that stand up, those of us that prod america. those of us that march and do what we do peacefully do it because we rae really believe in america. we love america. we want it to be all it can be. thanks for watching. i'm al sharpton. "hardball" starts right now. >> hard in the desert. let's play "hardball." good evening. i'm chris matthews in washington. we are headed to ferguson tonight but i'm compelled with start with the president's powerful reaction to the beheading of american james foley by the islamist group torturing and killing the way through syria and iraq. >> let's be clear about isil. they have rampaged acro