decades. political efforts to deal with a problem usually begin by acknowledging that there's a problem in the first place. and yes, we're talking to you, republicans in congress. and all of you hoping to get back there. that's all for now "now." ezra klein is next. good evening, i'm ready to go. let's get to work. ♪ american fast food king is poised to -- >> it is rare to see one without a tax angle. >> that mentality is something we want to avoid. ♪ have it your way >> burger king still will be run out of miami. >> they are not going to move overseas to get a tax break. >> the political fall outplayed a role. >> holy grail of tax avoidance

speech. >> good to have you with us tonight. thanks for watching, we're a country that wants everything to work. we're a people that can correct things when we want to to make things work. this story tonight is a classic example of how our tax system must be adjusted. can we use that word? we need to make adjustments. we start tonight with big financial news that could cost you some money. now, if you're in business and someone comes to you and says treasury will have to come up with $20 billion over the next ten years to meet all of its obligations, you're going to be thinking, whoa, we better raise the rent here. somebody has to pay. now, keep that in mind in the context of story that earlier today burger king announced its

planning to buy canadian fast food chain -- had a few whoppers as you can tell and they are good too. the deal is going to be $11 billion. it is the largest fast food chain in candcanada. it would create the third largest fast food chain. this is going to be a big deal in the fast food industry. the canadian dpost, what they have to do is approve this merger, they protect workers and want to know what's in it for them, for their country. burger king, you want to do this deal? what's in it for canadians? that's how they view it. burger king is obligated to make the case that this deal will be beneficial to the canadians. now the mega burger deal is being backed by warren buffett,

throwing $3 billion into the merger. he thinks it's going to be a profit center. when good old warren talks, a lot of people listen. originally both companies said the new global head quarters would be in canada. leaving the country. this news instantly sparked outrage in the united states. burger king would have joined the growing list of u.s. companies moving overseas to do what? avoid paying taxes. this is where the adjustment has to come into. sharon brown is worked up about it, and i heard bernie sanders talk about and sherrod brown is calling for a boycott. burger king always said have it your way. my way is to support two ohio company that's haven't abandoned their country or customers. >> burger king is setting the table to make a bunch of money in our country and yet avoid

paying taxes. well, it looks like public pressure and that kind of talk got to burger king because the company released a statement today saying, wait a minute. we're not moving, we're just growing. our headquarters will remain in miami. the decision to create a new global quick service restaurant leader with tim horton's is not tax driven. it's about global growth for both brands. burger king will continue to pay the federal state and local taxes and whopper, the whopper isn't going anywhere. that's good to know. for them to come out and say it's not tax driven, got a pretty good communications director in that outfit. that's a hard sell. it caused confusion on wall street. cnbc speculated only separational headquarters would stay in florida? >> part of this deal is to move the actual headquarters to

ontario from miami, which is where burger king is head quartered. i believe they are making it clear operational headquarters will stay in miami. >> who's calling the shots, who's not calling the shots? who's paying money to the treasury. only time will tell whether burger king will move headquarters to another country. if burger king skips out of paying u.s. taxes, the backlash will be severe. earlier this month, wahl greenz pharmacy got rid of plans to move their headquarters overseas and president obama is not too happy about all of this. this growing number of u.s. companies dodging taxes. a few weeks ago president obama called out the corporate tax evaders. >> it's not fair. it's not right. the lost revenue to treasury means it's got to be made up somewhere and that typically will be a bunch of hard working

americans who either pay through higher taxes themselves or through reduced services. it's something that would really bother the average american, the idea that somebody renounces their citizenship but continues to entirely benefit from operating in the united states of america, just to avoid paying a whole bunch of taxes. >> well, that's a long way of saying, we need to make some adjustments in our tax code. let me emphatically state. i have nothing against the whopper and burger king is not breaking the law. they are doing what we are allowing them to do. the corporations are doing what we're allowing them to do. this is more of an ethical story and loyalty story to country and workers than it is to anything else. the president is exactly right, someone will have to pick up the tab for these unpatriotic companies. pick up the tab, in other words

if the country is going to be running and we have those obligations, smik homebody has pay. if they are allowed to go overseas and we'll be shorted $20 billion, it's estimated that if nothing is done, tax inversion will cost this country the treasury $20 billion over the next decade. you're in business, can you come up with that money? somebody has to pay. what does this lead to? income inequality. it's going to be a greater burden on the wage earners, corporations claim their taxes are too high. although the government accountability office says the united states corporations really when you throw them all together pay 12.6%. that's the effective tax rate when you do all of the loopholes that are set up for them. one in four corporations in this country pay zero tax. you think that's fair? back in 1952 and we're going back a half century and more,

the corporate tax in this country accounted for about a third of the total revenue that came into the treasury. that number today, it's less than 10%. so this is the adjustment i'm talking about. you want medicare and medicaid and social security and be able to fund education and do infrastructure? where's the money coming from? we have set up a system for us to turn poor. we've set up a system without any adjustments lawmakers aren't touching this to be a third world country. keep in mind the fast food industry is a low wage industry. many employees qualify for government assistance. corporate profits, how's wall street? pretty good as of late, wages have flat lined over the years. we're having a hell over the conversation over that whopper, aren't we? this is another example how we get income inequality in this

country. the adjustment that has to be made is that our lawmakers who are idealogically driven and don't want to do anything for workers and families in which country who refuse to go back to washington and compromise and be able to pencil out and most of them have never run a business and pencil out exactly okay, where's the money coming from, the republican answer is, let's just cut the hell out of everything and let's have no government. let's just get rid of it. it's easy. that will be our way forward. that's not right. this isn't right. burger king is not wrong. they are playing within the rules. they are making i think an unethical and unpatriotic decision if it unfolds this way. we've allowed them to do it. the corporations have cash whipped big time the campaigns to keep the right people in office so they set up the tax system so we allow them to do this. and voter turnout is going to be

down in the mid terms? give me a break. we ought to be outraged as a country that this possibility is even on the table for a corporation. now reverse this for a moment. what if this opportunity was on the table for you? you make 60,000, $70,000 a year and tax guy says, hey, i can cut your obligation in half. human nature is you probably jump at that. there has to be an adjustment. we have to get real and have a serious conversation about our tax code. it ain't at 25%. it's not at 35% for corporations. it's down below 15. just look at mitt romney's tax return. get your cell phones out. tonight's question, if burger king moves its headquarters to canada, will you ever eat another whopper? text a for yes and b for no. you can leave a comment on our

blog. we'll bring you the results later on in the show. for me let's me bring in james hoffa, good to have you with us tonight. >> good to be here. >> does this set the table for average americans to feel the pinch if something isn't done? your thoughts. >> the money has to come from somewhere. we have to run this country. when you see somebody like burger king trying to pull this stunt where they move -- they might burn their passport, that's what they are doing. this is unpatriotic. this is wrong. this is like not paying taxes. general electric pays no taxes. this is a new wrinkle and now you move out of the country and you don't pay american taxes anymore. this is ridiculous. it can be solved so simply by congress. now, the democrats are against the president this and where are republicans? they are americans, they should be as angry as you and i are to say this is wrong. this money has to be made up and going to come out of the skins

much average american, the guy working two and three jobs. this is the wrong thing and we have to stop it. hopefully the pressure we put on them right now -- you made a good point, the operational headquarters. what does that mean? does it mean they have another head quarter which is the corporate headquarters? they are playing word games. i hope this is dead because i think millions of americans like you said, we're not buying any more whoppers. >> you mean you would advocate a boycott of burger king if this continues? >> absolutely. this makes me angry. i'm going to get wrappers and mail them to the ceo and say this is it. i didn't eat these, something like that. this is something that shows outrage and one of the things we're saying is, we've got elections coming up in november. everybody says the country is going the wrong way. where's the outrage about something like this? that says i pay my taxes. who are they not to pay their taxes? who is general electric or

boeing not to pay their taxes? wall greenz got the message and they stopped. a company that made pills in ireland and moved to ireland to pay lower taxes. this is a loophole that has to be stop. the biggest problem is income inequality, the top ceos are making 330 times a person makes at their company. it's going through the roof right now. they are making the money and everybody knows people out there that work at burger king and mcdonald's and working two jobs, 20 hours a week. and they still can't make it. that's the outrage that we should have right now. and it's time for corporations to stop this nonsense and for congress to close this loophole and say enough aenough. >> well, it's very clear the way burger king responded today and back pedaled somewhat and found the verbiage you alluded to,

meaning corporate headquarters and operational headquarters, that kind of underscores they are a little touchy about this. shouldn't this be a signal to lawmakers that people do want change. they do want fairness put into the tax code that's going to help the wage earners. and so you have written a lot about income inequality. is this the framework that takes us down that road? >> this is part of this huge discussion of what's going on in the country about right now everything you read is that wages have stagnated and we've recovered from the recession. but yet people are working more and more, getting two and three jobs but no one is moving up. the only way you can get a raise today maybe the states are basically slowly moving up to minimum wage. the president moved up to minimum wage on federal workers in some parts and that's the only way people people can get a raise. that's ridiculous. so much money being made in this country right now they should be

proud to give raises to keep good people working. >> james hoffa, good to have you with us. appreciate your time. let me bring in e.j. dionne. if i go to burger king, am i eating an immoral hamburger or unethical hamburger? i don't think it's fair but which we become so politically exhausted that we don't get outraged about anything anymore, people have thrown up their hands, we can change this and congress isn't going to do anything. what do you make of all of this? >> that's a real danger now. but i think this burger king story could end up being a good news story. what you're seeing here is genuine outrage by consumers who have real power here over burger king. i mean, it's average americans and all kinds of americans who eat whoppers and all of the other stuff they serve at burger king. and burger king looked out there

at these protests and said, wait a minute, this could be a problem. and i have a soft spot for warren buffett and hated the idea he was involved in a deal that was primarily about tax inversions and it looks like it's not. let's hope this is going down the road that they suggested later today, that this is about merging two successful companies to make a more successful company and not tax inversions. one other point, you hit it exactly right in your intro when you said this is an ethical story and loyalty story. how do corporations make money? yeah, they make money by producing a good profit but it's like that old elizabeth warren speech, people drive on roads to get to burger king. a lot of burger king employees qualify for government benefits and people have money in their pockets because they are here in the united states of america. i think this corporate inversions issue affects not just liberals, i think a lot of

conservatives say this is an issue of patriotism. if you make money in the u.s., you ought to share in the burden of financing the government that provides services to americans. >> how do you write that into a law? i mean, it's very simple, i think, you can't park money offshore and do business in the shores and make money off our people. i think that's pretty easy. one profound thing that is different between tim hortons and burger king, tim hortons employees have guaranteed health care. in america, we just have access to it. they don't have to buy it. correct? no doubt. >> that's a very big deal. canada has had a single payer system for a long time. it is not something that workers in canada have to worry about. and that has to be where we're going. obamacare is a step in the right direction. it's a substantial step especially for lower income

americans but hurts the corporate bottom line. we've said for years that there's more health care money in american car than there is steel. and so we've got to think about how we get farther than we are now providing health care in the canadians have shown us a good example on that. >> the global economy, the genie is out of the bottle but there has to be a sense of fairness where you money your money and who has to pay into the system and we have set and allowed this system to be set up for things like this to happen. that's where the adjustment has to come in. it's an election issue. e.j. dionne. remember to answer tonight's question, like us on facebook at wegoted. we have the podcast for you there too. congressmen are skipping out of town and washington, d.c. and

town hall meetings and why they are afraid to face the folks back home? a new study sheds light on how dangerous the keystone xl pipeline really is. stay with us. rear right back. wondering what that is? that, my friends, is everything. and with the quicksilver card from capital one, you earn unlimited 1.5% cash back on everything you purchase. not just "everything at the hardware store." not "everything, until you hit your cash back limit." quicksilver can earn you unlimited 1.5% cash back

on everything you could possibly imagine. say it with me -- everything. one more time, everything! and with that in mind... what's in your wallet?

and with that in mind... if energy could come from anything?. or if power could go anywhere? or if light could seek out the dark? what would happen if that happens? anything.

for over 19 million people. [ alex ] transamerica helped provide a lifetime of retirement income. so i can focus on what matters most. [ female announcer ] everyone has a moment when tomorrow becomes real. transamerica. what's happening, time for trenders, where you can join the ed team, facebook.com/edshow and you can get my podcast, every day, wegoted.com and ring offire radio.com. i did a podcast today about burger king with senator bernie sanders. the social media nation has decided on the top trenders voted on by you. >> no money down.

>> the number three trender, not a cheap suit. >> boehner's lawsuit is nothing but a big dog and pony show. >> he breaks about his willingness to change it unilaterally. >> president obama has issued the least amount of executive orders in recent history. >> it seems to me like an enormous waste of effort. >> it's egregious, preposterous. >> $350,000 price tag on the lawsuit. >> this is wasting more taxpayer dollars. >> i'll take your case but i'm going to have to ask for $1,000 retainer. >> it's in my view our responsibility to stands up for this institution in which we serve. >> he's willing to take your money and sue the president. >> the number two trender, game on. >> madden football season in america is a competitive time. >> you're the best. >> video games, this is a big event. >> fans sack stores for the

latest madden game. >> comes out every year, always huge changes in madden. >> madden nfl ranked among the top video games in america, bringing in $4 billion for electronic arts. >> new roster lineups and new animations. >> this is where legends are made. >> and today's top trender, skipping town. >> town halls are becoming increasingly rare. >> have a great vacation. >> you too, bob. >> they stopped being what we think of town halls and became political shout fests with cameras. >> means town hall theatrics like this. >> i'm not a lobbyist with all kinds of money, stuff it in your pocket. >> pick what you guys did. >> hear our voice! >> are a thing of the past. >> become gotcha moments for political opponents. >> how can the truth be a gotcha

moment? joining us tonight bob shrum, great to have you with us. it is very clear what's going on here. you have congress who's rated in the toilet and citizens united. they aren't worried about the bank accounts because they have corporate money rolling in like they've never seen before. why talk to the public? what's happening here? >> first i think you're absolutely right about that. the districts now are gerrymandered in a way they weren't in 2010. in 2010, republicans for example had to go out and try to harness all of tea party folks to take back the congress. secondly, these town meetings are dangerous, especially for republicans because the tea party types will say something and force candidates to say something to get candidates in trouble. for example, they are opposed to certain forms of birth control. they are put in a position where they are either going to offends the base or hurt themselves in a general election. third, i think when you look at the dynamics of these meetings,

if ordinary people show up and ask real questions, a lot of members of congress, especially republicans don't have answers. what are they going to do about burger king and tax inversion? they don't want to do anything. where is their jobs plan? they don't have one. >> what are they going to do if they repeal obamacare and protecting lifetime limits on insurance and denial because of preexisting conditions or replace coverage for millions of people? they can't answer those questions. >> it's still jobs and the economy when you talk to lawmakers what they are hearing from constituents and what type of feedback they are getting. bottom line here, citizens united has really set the table for these lawmakers to not have the pressure to go out and win over the hearts and minds of these people. it's better to suppress the vote and take the corporate money and the adelson money and koch brother money and everything else. >> that's reinforced by the way the district lines are drawn and

nothing will be done about that at least until 2020. a lot are sitting in safe districts with tons of money and don't need the town hall meetings. senators in a position where they could actually lose because they are voted on statewide don't want to subject themselves to the kind of questioning that's going to get them to make the kind of mistake that richard murdoch made in indiana in 2012. people want to duck this stuff. there's one other factor here that i think we ought to recognize and that is that once again social media can profoundly reshape the political dialogue. today a town hall meeting can be a twitter feed. a candidate without the extra noise and all of the attention conduct a kind of interactive conversation with constituents online and without renting a hall. i think we'll see fewer and fewer town halls. it's regrettable. i understand why a lot of democrats don't want to do this. they don't want to go and be yelled at by crazy people who show up. i think it's regrettable we lost

the conversation or capacity for a kind of civil conversation where someone says we have a recovery and it's a wall street recovery and unemployment rate is down. people a lot of middle class people are still hurting and wages haven't gone up. what would you do about that? those are the kinds of things that ought to be happening in august and they are not. >> do you think they have become gotcha moments? >> i think there are a lot of gotcha moments. i think unintentionally so because you have folks show up from the republican base who think they are going to help their candidate who ask the candidate a question that puts the candidate in a very tough position. that's especially true for statewide senate candidates. secondly, you have people who come who have no interest in the kind of serious conversation we're talking about. they want to get up and say, don't you know the president wasn't born in the united states or don't you know the president was advised by muslim brotherhood. all of this crazy stuff out there in the atmosphere and that tends to come into those town

meetings and infects them. maybe four, eight, 12 years from now after the republicans have locht a couple more presidential elections because of the kind of campaigns they run and positions they take, maybe we'll get back to a space where the differences between the two parties are not so great that it becomes very difficult to have a really decent conversation. >> if i could far legal whparal we're talking about now and what we led with last night when a dreamer went up to fall ryan and asked a question and the answer was read my book. i'm not going to answer anything. in fact, why don't you read my book. he doesn't have an answer for them and that is the operational procedure now for a lot of elected officials. i ain't going to mess with the public, i need enough votes to stay in there. bob shrum, appreciate your time tonight. still ahead, new information keystone xl pipeline could be

more dangerous to the environment than was first reported. a new study out there. rapid response panel joins me with the facts. our friends across the street attempted to find mfeminism. we're right back. thank ythank you for defendiyour sacrifice. and thank you for your bravery. thank you colonel. thank you daddy. military families are uniquely thankful for many things,

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welcome back, only time for one question tonight. here we go, question comes from dave, should unions claim to be people just like corporations do? no. i don't think so. unions are about representation and fairness on issues. not about personal faults. corporations, no, they are not people and neither are unions. stick around, rapid response panel is next. >> i'm hampton peerson, stronger

than economic date that, dow is up 29 and s&p up 2 to close above the 2,000 mark for the first time. nasdaq adds 13 points. durable goods orders surged past expectations rising 23% last month. a 7.5% gain was expected. the latest read on consumer confidence came in ahead of target however report on june home prices was weaker than estimates. that's it for cnbc, first in business worldwide. you, my friend are a master of diversification. who would have thought three cheese lasagna would go with chocolate cake and ceviche? the same guy who thought that small caps and bond funds would go with a merging markets. it's a masterpiece. thanks. clearly you are type e. you made it phil. welcome home. now what's our strategy with the fondue? diversifying your portfolio? e*trade gives you the tools and resources to get it right. are you type e*?

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infrastructure that will transport safely the cleanest barrel of oil produced in north america contrary to popular belief. >> hold the phone on that one. the truth is building the keystone lx is dangerous. there's a new study out there that says it is true, it is very dangerous. two researchers at the stock holme institute founded by the sweeti swedish government analyzed and the study says that the keystone xl pipeline could produce four times more global warming pollution than the state department's report said earlier this year. findings publged in the nature climate change journal factored in the financial impact would have on the global market. now, we have invited the authors of this study to come on this program but they declined saying they don't want to be mes taken for advocacy group.

the study clearly supports what we've been saying building keystone xl pipeline would add to the growing dwency on oil and radically contribute to our growing carbon footprint, jane cleb from league of conversation voters, great to have both of you with us tonight. jane, you first, how critical is this information coming from an impartial source? >> it's absolutely critical. the state department report was written by industry consultants and so we -- in the environmental side has our fact sheets as well. that's when you have scientists coming into the middle saying there's gray area here. we refuse to accept the premise that this pipeline will not increase carbon pollution. we know it will. and now we have an independent scientist group telling us the same thing all along, ed.

>> is this a factor for congressional candidates? is this a truly a hot button issue in the middle of the country? >> that's a really good question and glad to see you calling attention to this important study. they vastly underestimated the pollution and how did he have tas tating the pipeline would be. they tried to go after clean energy champions in the 2012 election cycle throwing millions of dollars, all kinds of negative and really disjust untrue ads and clean energy champions, not one clean energy champion lost their race or did not get re-elected because they oppose the pipeline. we believe the politics of climate change have shifted and actually as we've seen a midst the extreme weather across the country, whether the droughts or

devastating tragic fires or algae bloom in ohio, it is absolutely necessary to address climate change to reduce carbon pollution as the obama administration is starting to do in a major way. >> jane, has there been any more information out there for the pipeline, say in the last six months? have there been any studies out there other than the state department and oil industry throwing in their two cents on all of this? i don't mean to pick on senator landrieu, but for her to make the statement it's the cleanest barrel of oil, i don't know how she says that with a straight face. we have asked her office in the past to give us the source --

you have the industry written state report that they used that has misinformation all throughout it. then you have essentially front groups, americans for prosperity putting out fact sheets that folks use in their talking points. they are absolutely based in only the industry's perspective and that's we need more and more pipe lines to become energy secure. they will never have enough pipelines ed and that is the major problem. if we let this cut through the sand hills there will be another pipeline right behind it. they will never have enough pipeline. it's critical to say no to this pipeline and move towards clean energy. >> i go home to the midwest and turn on radio and listen to talk shows and all they talk about is moving oil. they are talking about pipe lines and talking about too much oil on the trains, you know, what are we are going to do? farmers in the midwest are upset because they can't get their product on the trains. this is how much oil this country is pumping out right

now. and this is what the lawmakers are hearing back home. i guess we better build this pipeline. what about that scenario? >> it's time to stop the fear mongering. this is clearly about padding profits of a foreign oil company rather than doing what's best for the american people. i think the elections this fall will present the american public with the real opportunity. are they going to support champions of clean energy who want to address climate change, a great congressman from michigan who has taken on koch brothers and gotten disgusting dirty mountain moved from the detroit river or someone who denied the existence of climate change, their opponent. we have a real opportunity. we're kind of at a cross roads when it comes to energy future, not about whether the dirtiest oil on the planet -- >> what's the latest in nebraska

what's coming up? >> our side will be defending our position. we won in the lower court. the court case is not about is tar sands good or bad, the court case is all about did governor hinman essentially abuse his powers in being able to essentially avoid the public service commission, which is the entity that should have been approving the pipeline route all along, as well as a republican, ed, gave em nant domain powers to a foreign corporation before they had a federal permit. i hope everybody tunes in. you'll be able to watch it at boldnebras boldnebraska.org. >> thanks so much. we appreciate your time. coming up, the tire industry in america is under attack. tariffs have been lifted and chinese are dumping chief tires on america and it's affecting american workers. hey. i'm ted and this is rudy.

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and in pretenders tonight, the fox news mystique, the five, the panelists tour apart beyonce's performance at the video music awards. they say they are presentation of feminism isn't cutting it. >> during the performance last night, she had the word feminism on a big screen and was rapping. this is after she had all of these women swinging around stripper poles and guy rating and the message was we don't teach our little girls they can be sexual and achieve the same things as men. in what universe is she living? that's half of the problem. >> also auditioning for a future husband to be honest with you. >> this is just a different kind of jail. >> fox news loves how to define how women can present herself, right? they wouldn't even let women on

their own network wear pants. >> guess who just walked in if you're watching and had the podcast, gretchen carlson dressed casual. >> nobody will recognize me,cas i have on pants. >> whoa, pants. >> pants were not allowed on "fox & friends". >> what happened with that? >> you always liked to be shirtless and sometimes you suggested it for me. >> yeah. >> feminism is about women defining themselves without bowing to cultural expectations. fox news is about defining a woman by her outfit. if the five thinks feminism means following their lead, they can keep on pretending. machines will be sprayed to be made. and making something stronger...

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if we can't offer faster speeds - or save you money - we'll give you $150. comcast business. built for business. finally tonight, this is the story for the folks who take a shower after work. more americans are planning to travel this labor day weekend than many the past six years. estimates say over 29 million americans will be traveling by car. labor day is supposed to be a celebration of the american worker and their contributions to this country. this weekend when the rubber hits the road, take a moment to think about the american tire manufacturers because as a result of unfair trade practices, those american workers aretime.

the numbers don't lie, folks. chinese tire imports are decimating another united states industry. the steel workers petitioned the international trade commission to investigate and take up the issue but the process takes time, costs jobs, lots of money. so as you prepare to head out this labor day weekend, if you

need a new set of tires, some people in congress understand what this is about. buy american. joining me tonight scott paul, president of the alieps for american manufacturing. scott, good to have you with us tonight. is this a clear example of how tariffs impact the market? it doesn't take away the free market. but it protects american workers and everybody gets a fair shake. how does this break out? what does the story tell us. >> good to be with you. that's exactly right. tariffs help level the playing field. nothing more, nothing less. we know on a level playing field that u.s. manufacturers and workers, particularly in the tire industry can be competitive in our domestic market. we know people familiar with a lot of the american brands. however, when tire dealers are stocking shelves with tires from china that are sometimes priced below the cost of the raw materials and the labor that goes into it, you add on

government subsidies from the chinese government in the form of oh currency manipulation, energy subsidies, lax environmental enforcement and the result is a lot of chinese tires, as you indicated, downward pressure on wages for workers and potentially layoffs. >> sweat shops are putting tires together and dumping them in america. so the tariff expired. why? why were the tariffs allowed to expire in september of 2012 just before the election? >> it's one of the weaknesses in our trade laws, ed. if you imagine our trade laws as a security blanket, in this case that blanket is thread-bare and it only allowed tariffs for three years and they were set to expire. under the trade laws and this is crazy and the only system in the world that operates this way. we have to show again that

chinese tires were surging into the market. that there was harm caused to the industry and to the workers all over again to get tariffs put back in. it doesn't make any sense. these trade laws could be more effective if we could apply them proactively because we know when the surges are coming. that's what really gives workers, companies a chance to get back on their feet to compete for market share and to create the good middle class jobs. i tell you, i have been to a lot of tire factory towns. these tend to be small manufacturing towns in rural areas. once you lose the manufacturing job, if you get another job at all you will be lucky. it's certainly going to be paying lower pages. if that has an effect on your family, on the community, eventually on the entire country. we hope the administration will do the right thing. we'll look at the case and put the tariffs back in place. it calls out the needs for better trade enforcement so we can regrow the middle class and

jobs. >> it's like we don't get the competition. we set the table for the competition to take our jobs apart. for instance, the numbers. 2011, 24 billion tires. less than 24 months later, 50 million tires. china knew when the tariff would go off and were ready to respond. we're like molasses when it comes to moving stuff like this. we are going to see a wave of probably layoffs in an industry because we have a lousy trade agreement. >> that's exactly right. let's put it this way. every other country that i know of operates in the real world. they are looking out for their own industry, their own worker. some do it through legitimate means. some like the government of china do it through subs disand dumping. we operate on a mythical philosophy that it was in a textbook in the 17th century. we need to get in the real world. >> scott paul, good to have you with us.

president alliance for american manufacturing. keep up the fight. that's "the ed show." "politics nation" with reverend al sharpton starts now. good evening. >> good evening, ed. thanks to you for tuning in. tonight's lead, new audio that may have been recorded when the gunshots that killed michael brown occurred. nbc news has obtained audio from a man who says he was recording a message to a friend near the site of michael brown's shooting. he says he ended up recording the fatal gunshots. nbc news has not authenticated the audio, but the lawyer for the man who recorded it says she has shared the recording with the fbi. remember, the words spoken on this tape aren't important. but the sounds of the apparent gunfire in the background are.