like isil. >> estimates are up to 100 americans in the isis force. >> conservative estimates suggest 500 british jihadis. >> fighters could go over there and get radicalized and come back to the homeland. >> we're very concerned about the risk that those individuals pose. >> we have got to repel this movement. >> inaction also at a price. >> there will be air strikes syria. >> i don't know what will be accomplished by the air strikes. >> they cannot take territory or hold territory. >> what exactly are we getting ourselves into? >> under what conditions would we be prepared to work with the syrian government? >> i'm ezra klein in for alex wagner. there is breaking news this hour, a law enforcement official tells nbc news it appears to be true, that a second american was killed over the weekend in syria in the very same battle in which

douglas died while fighting four isis against four rebels of the syrian army just outside of aleppo as we're starting to learn more about mccain, later moved to minnesota where he attended high school and had in recent years lived in san diego. he left for turkey in the spring before crossing over to neighboring syria. exactly how he became so radicalized remains unclear. his best friend from high school was killed in 2009. he converted to islam ten years ago and would post religious thoughts on facebook, called himself the slave of allah. >> he met somalian guy that's converted him to be a muslim. i don't know about his life in san diego and what kind of people he ran across. i guarantee that this -- all of

this has something to do with friends that he may have made. whatever he was doing i want to believe he was probably a follower, you know, following around people clearly. >> but while the conventional stereo type in the west is that all isis fighters are religious fanatics that's not always true. two british men who traveled to syria, before they left bought copies of islam for dummys on amg zon right before they left. an extensive 2008 british report by mi15 on terrorists concluded that far from being religious zell ats, a large number of those involved in terrorism do not practice their faith regularly. many lack religious literalcy and could be regarded as religious novices. the same report noted that many westerners drawn to terrorism were in relationships or had

children and had educational achievement wildly and unsatisfied with their jobs. mccain was married and daughter approaching her first birthday. last known occupation was a caregiver to clients with special needs. today the white house addressed the threat posed by foreign fighters like douglas mccain. >> there are thousands of foreign fighters more than up to 50 countries. we're very concerned about the risk that those individuals pose to the 50 countries for which they traveled. these are individuals who have been radicalized and received military training and in some cases battle tested and demonstrated as mr. mccain did a will ingness to die for the cause. >> if there's any conclusion, it's that there is no single pathway to violent extremism, it isn't as easy as just poverty oranger. many western fighters like douglas mccain ar drawn by a

spirit or sense of belonging or higher purpose. as the new york times wrote about our thoroughly modern enemies, it is not only the will and lust for power but yearning for a transcending cause that liberal societies can be trouble satisfying. joining me now is mark landler. i want to ask what you know about reports coming in now there was a second american who died in that battle on the side of isis. >> well, ezra, we don't know a great deal more than what you reported. u.s. officials confirmed they think there is this second american. he did die in the same battle. we're trying to nail down more details about who he is. but i kind of think we're at the beginning of what going to be a series of disclosures if it is accurate and as many as 100 americans who signed up for isis

or some other spinoff. we'll probably get a sequence of these kinds of reports and probably it will fill out the extremely varied picture that you are describing earlier that will find that these people are from a whole range of different backgrounds and motivations are often unpredictable and may not seem connected to one another. >> what is the level of concern inside the white house and inside the national security community about americans like douglas mccain who probably have an american passport and in theory could get back here. is there a fear that this is a beginning of a problem in three or five or ten years is going to be on our choice? >> that's in fact one of the rationales you'll hear the white house why it's important to go after the groups hard and degrade them. what's interesting about the mcarthur case, isis kept him on battlefield and the other

american reported killed, that they chose to use these americans as fighters in a battle against other muslims on the battlefield in syria. when they could well have held them in reserve and sent them back to the united states, perhaps to carry out a terrorist attack here. one of the interesting implications of these reports is whether isis views its immediate mission as attacking the united states, launching attacks against americans or against the homeland or whether they are more interested in using all recruits they get, whether from the u.s. and uk and elsewhere for a battle in syria and iraq. and it appears at the moment for anyway, they may be more concerned about fighting the battle over there than taking battle to our shores. >> it seems that leaves tension in policy towards isis, you could argue this point two ways, one, that the right thing for america to do here is to launch

a much more aggressive effort to degrade isis such as they don't have focus and power and resources to project these fighters back towards america or argue that getting to a long fight against isis will turn their incentives towards trying to strike back at america. is there a consensus in the national security community about which of those is correct? >> i think people at the moment would probably lean towards trying to strike back hard and degrade them right away. target enough of their leaders that it deprives them of their ability to project this message and new social media the way they've been able to so far. i think one of the other things you're going to see as part of an effort to mobilize countries in the region around the effort is that the u.s. will work carefully with the turks, for example, to really try to shut down these porous borders between turkey and syria, where

the major channel of foreign fighters have been able to cross over and join isis. one of the major things the u.s. would like to do is clamp down on that. you obviously can't prevent americans who hold passports from traveling to places where they can integrate with groups like this. but if you make it harder to get into syria, that's one way to try to close the conduit for these people. >> mark landler, thank you very much for being here. >> thank you. >> joining me now, fellow at the new american foundation, heather har bert. when you read the background, you think of this kind of appeal as working for disaffected unattached drifting radicalized young men, you don't think about people with kids and jobs and people who live in san diego. what is this sort of research around this? what is your kinds of understanding about the working theories of what kind of western

residents are as you say siptible to jihad appears. >> isis appears to be an ability that goes beyond what we've seen from other groups and does tug successfully with those with family and community ties. whether externally they are unattached and don't have a family and strong ties or whether that detachment turns out to be internal, it's people who are looking for a sense of belonging, a sense of purpose and higher purpose as awful as that sounds that there's a strong aspect of morality to it from their point of view or justice, honor, dignity, much more so than poverty and discomfort. >> you were talking about sophistication a second ago. i want to ask about a particular dimension, the digital sophistication. a lot of the relationships here seem to get forged on social

media in the sort of horrible video of the killings seemed to be designed for lack of a better world viral, production values were high. it was a horrible thing to watch and strangely modern. and i'm curious how new that is. this always been -- in recent years active rid radical islam message boards but the real aggressive interaction on social media seems to be a little new. >> there's a tradition of recruitment videos and killing videos, but what isis has done is number one improve production values. which is clearly meant to appear to folks used to western production values. and number two, the recruitment videos are designed to address any concern that you ezra klein might have about leaving your home in san diego. there's almost a frequently asked questions model, which does suggest that there's a

deliberate attempt to touch on -- to get people who aren't loners and drifters. >> so i think that what this then leads to, we're thinking because we're in america, about the level of appeal to werners, but what about the level of appeal in the arab world. how successful has isis recruitment been there and what sort of caliber of recruit are they being able to pull in? >> there's a way that the west is a little bit of a side show, right. it's very -- in a way their success is most useful in their then ability to recruit arabs or other folks from muslim world. if you think about sort of their competing with other jihadi entities, there's no question people are leaving pakistan, people are leaving yemen and saying, this is where the action is. and that isis is very deliberately targeting its market to say, hey, we're the place that are actually making progress.

bin laden talked about a state. he never had a state. we had the state. we're the real caliph, which would be laughable if it wasn't having such horrible human consequences. it's a very modern, very modern operation with premodern ideas at its base. >> that's an incredibly such sink description. as president obama considers a wider offensive against isis, he's facing new pressure from congress on how to proceed. i'll talk with rachel maddow on the president's path forward when she joins me next on "now. " hey, i notice your car is not in the driveway. yeah. it's in the shop. it's going to cost me an arm and a leg. you shoulda taken it to midas. they tell you what stuff needs fixing, and what stuff can wait.

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. as the obama administration considers widening the u.s. mission against isis, debate is focusing on a few tough policy questions, what threat does isis actually pose to the united states? what will the air strikes against them achieve? how long will they and can they last? what's the chance that air strikes pull the u.s. into a deeper conflict? will the strikes be inside iraq or will they also go into syria? but the question behind these questions is where within our political system the issues will be resolved? namely, will president obama seek congressional authorization or make the call entirely on his own? under the war powers act the president has 60 days to seek formal authorization from

congress. this week members of congress are demanding president obama get congressional authorization for the use of force against isis but the white house has not committed to anything of the sort. yesterday josh earnest told reporters we have not speculated about what sort of authority would be required from congress if the president were to make a decision to authorize the use of military force in syria. adding that the current military action that has been ordered in iraq is vested in the powers of the commander in chief. joining me now is the host of "the rachel maddow show." >> good to see you. >> obama surprised both members of congress and own staff by seeking authorization, never came through about a year ago. i think this is kind of profound for the country and how this gets decided. it seems to me where it becomes

a precedent going forward and congress gets more involved again in decisions of war or gets tossed out as an ab who ration ration. >> he said we ought to respond with air strikes but recognize in our constitutional democracy congress is vested with the decision about whether or not we are add war and so i want congressional authorization. what happened at that point, senate foreign relations committee took a vote, voted 10-8 that those air strikes should be authorized. but then nothing else happened and instead everything changed course to an effort instead to try to get rid of syria's chemical weapons that was both international and successful as of this past week. congress was asked -- congress sort of made a gesture towards starting to answer then went

sile silent. now the president may be about to ask for renewed authority again to go strike in syria. it would be for a different purpose but the ball still and always is in congress's court on these things. honestly, i think the white house knows that. i think they are willing to push it take little bit but they know this is a congressional decision. >> i completely agree they think they do know that. but i think one of the odd kinds of pressure they get, congress doesn't want to make the call. they are vulnerable democrats angry at tim cain, another member of congress for trying to assert congress's power. the difference between that and how founding fathers thought this would work is tremendous but it does seem one of pressures here in the white house is a lot of members of congress telling them, we don't want to have to go yes or no on this, we want you to just do it. >> please let us keep complaining from the peanut gallery and don't let us be the

decision makers on this which the constitution says we ought to be. that hill piece quoting the unnamed democratic sources and wanting congress to do the right thing on this, it's one of the biggest outbreaks the democratic wus tud we've seen in a long time. i understand why nobody put their names on those quotes. at a practical level, i think it's also fair to say that i don't know how a vote on authorizing air strikes in syria would cut politically. i mean, i think the american public is largely anti-war, we're tired of wars we've been in and weary about being baited into a war. i think the public is violently disguflted by isis and tactic, i don't think anybody can say about a vote to authorize the air strikes or not and at the human level it's a disgusting calculation to be making when right now we have u.s. pilots in

danger overseer i can't and got 700 to 1,000 american service members with boots on the ground in iraq. to talk about political consequences now is unclear first of all and gross. >> i totally agree with that. part of where it gets very fuzzy, i think it is fairly clear most democrats would end upsiding with obama on this. republicans are in this weird position. all of the rhetoric, almost all of it, that more should have been done in iraq but it gets very vague when it time to say what that more should have been. to actually sign on to obama's policy sort of very much cuts both ways for them, it does commit to doing a little bit more but on the other hand it does yoek them to the president and say we back this and if it fails, it is partially on us. >> and that's part of why i'd be interested for somebody to call

the question there. the only sort of unifying principle on the republican side of the aisle, they are against anything obama does. other than that, particularly on foreign policy and even on traditional republican issues like the use of military force, it's a very fractured world and hard to say there's a right wing and left wing or conservative wing and moderate wing or libertarian wing and interventional wing. it's hard to say what republican policy is on stuff like this. i would love to see them start to figure it out in part because this is one of those things that out to transcend partisanship. i do think it sort of does. i don't think people's political party predicts in terms of man on the streets on whether or not we should do air strikes in syria. this is a higher purpose than partisanship. and why it's so angering to me to see congress try to weasel out of having to make a decision. >> on the operational side of

it, the actual technical, one of things that gets very hard here, you have to kind of figure something out that allows for air strikes but somehow cuts off the possibility of escalation. i'm curious how you think about it. you had a good segment last night about the ways in which things that begin with oh, there will be air strikes and that will be great because no americans will get hurt have a tendency into escalating into much more significant commitments. one of the things, how exactly can you write a resolution limiting that? >> i think you can try strategically to limit that, but when it comes to operational momentum and stuff that happens, it's very hard to say. if something happens like with scott o gradedy got shot down over bosnia and behind enemy lines hiding out for six days eating bugs, if we had a resolution that said we never put u.s. boots on the ground,

who that have precluded the rescue motion thission that lan the forest and got him? at some point it's magical thinking to say air strikes can be con strained to keep americans safe. pilots get shot down and stuff goes wrong. there isn't a way to think about air strikes -- i think in terms of being effective or in terms of being cautious that is honest unless you recognize it takes boots on the ground and a lot of support and a lot of preparing for bad event you'llties to mount an air strikes campaign. no such think as just air strikes, they are never easy and not magic. if for one thing we need ground intelligence for targeting and need people on the ground to capitalize on the gains achieved through bombing. it's never easy and never a small mission. >> one background factor,

congress is not in session to even debate this. do you think this ritzs to the point they should come back to deal with it? >> yes, absolutely. war and peace are fun to argue about in the abstract and can be ideologually enlightening and the way we think about different policies. when a country with a advanced air system that can shoot down planes a700 to 1,000 americans n the ground and we're debating about what to do, it's more important than the fifth week of vacation. for congress to throw metaphorical bombs at the president while they are unwilling to make their own constitutionally required decision what to do, i think it's offensive, anything worth

coming back to washington for, this is it. >> rachel maddow, great to have you. >> thanks, ezra. >> be sure to catch rachel tonight and every night at 9:00 p.m. eastern. coming up, new reports that russia is waging a major new offensive in ukraine. one that some call actually a stealth invasion. the details next. there's a reason it's called an "all you can eat" buffet... and not a "have just a little" buffet. because what we all really want is more. that's why verizon is giving you even more. now, for a limited time, get more data! 1 gb of bonus data every month with every new smartphone or upgrade. our best ever pricing with the more everything plan and 50% off all new smartphones. like the htc one m8 for windows or android. built to inspire envy. come get your more with verizon. [ male announcer ] that's why there's ocuvite to help replenish key eye nutrients. ocuvite has a unique formula not found in your multivitamin to help protect your eye health.

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up its military presence in crimea as max fisher writes at vox. let's be clear, russia is invading ukraine right now. this is how the state department described the situation today. >> these incursions direct a counter offensive is under way in liuhanskluhansk. >> why not say it is under way rather than likely. >> i decided to say likely. >> the new columns of russian tanks and armor in ukraine indicates a russian directed counter offensive may be under way, #escalation. the problem is confirming a russian invasion is for the u.s. government much more politically troublesome. but that doesn't mean it's not happening. just ahead, burger king wants it its way right away. matt ig lace yas discusses the

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to help reduce the risk of another one. if you've had a heart attack be sure to talk to your doctor before you begin an aspirin regimen. today the fast food giant announced it will buy the iconic and delicious chain tim hortons, sorry about that, for $11 billion. they have a shared market interest in breakfast if not for the fact the company will be head quartered in canada. burger king is planning to move headquarters north of the border allowing them to dodge american taxes and pay the lower canadian rate. the fast food chain was flooded

with boycott threats. one user wrote, i hate to go back to mcdonald's but will big time if you skip out on paying taxgs on this government for making it what you are today. the whopper just became un-american! the ante was upped against when sherrod brown weighed in. burger king's decision to abandon the united states means consumers should turn to wendy's old fashioned hamburgers or white castle sliders. my way is to support two companies who have not abandoned their country or customers. they wrote, we hear you, we're not moving, we're just growing and finding ways to serve you better. the decision is not tax driven, the whopper isn't going anywhere. burger king is not alone. tax inversion, which is

essentially when a bigger company merges with a smaller company and puts headquarters with a smaller company to pay taxes in that country has been on the rise for the past decade and exploded in 2014. it's getting increasingly high profile attention. >> we need to stop companies from renouncing their citizenship just to get out of paying their fair share of taxes. we can't wait for that. you shouldn't get to call yourself an american company only when you want a handout from american taxpayers. >> so will congress be taking up the president's proposals to crack down on tax inversions any time soon? no, that is part of the reason inversions are going up as my vox colleague mat iglesias notes, not only those crackdowns halted inversions but fear of crackdowns tends to halts inversions, companies are reluctant to push the envelope in ways that are likely to prompt regular tri backlash.

businesses know that a republican house will not touch obama's proposals to stop tax inversions, this is a good time for them to make their move. joining me now at vox.com matt iglesias. >> good to be here. >> in the burger king statement they assure people on facebook they are not moving and headquarters will become on paper in a different place. they are like -- that is like partially true, right, nothing will be picked up and moved? >> at least very little will be. that's sort of part of the hallmark of a tax inversion. companies sorts of do move from time to time for different kinds of reasons but what you have in a really classic inversion case is a company will say, we're a swiss company now but actually all of the executives still live in the united states and nothing has changed. that's part of what makes the moves seem shady. >> why are tax inversions exploding in 2014? >> the big reason they are exploding is that companies have seen that they can get away with

it, that we've had a few and it's become clear that congress is very gridlocked and nothing new is going to happen. more and more are happening. another factor is that the bond market is cheap to borrow money in so it's a good time to do mergers in general. you've seen it with pharmaceutical companies who have special attributes who make them really adept at dodging taxes if they can get head quarters in a jurisdiction. this is different from that actually and little bit of a separate case. >> one of the interesting i think maybe parts of the inversion question, there are two types. there is a situation where the change in headquarters is a side effect of the two companies merging. they merge for business reasons and have to make a decision on which side of the border they are going to live on. then there's another where the purchase of the smaller company itself is done in order to get the tax inversion, in order to make the move.

burger king says this is not going to change the tax rate very much. they say this is really about breaking into the breakfast market and can't get that great coffee without buying tim hortons. how credible is that? how credible is it that they want the sale and merger is a side effect? >> in this case it is credible, the tax rate that the merge company will pay is basically the same as the tax rate that the two companies would pay at separate entities. moving to canada is about avoiding a tax increase. if you swallowed tim hortons and turned it into a american company, they would suffer a tax loss. they are doing the inversion to avoid a tax penalty. any gains they make will have to come from actual coffee and doughnut efficiencies zbls people say, they are doing this, rob lowe was tweeting about how american tax policy forces this kind of thing to happen. they are doing this because america has very, very high tax

rates, even though most companies don't pay that high rate. one of the things you see here that makes a corporate tax reform discussion hard, you actually could lower the rate a lot. but what companies want, pay less taxes in total. they want loopholes like this one, don't want you to end corporate tax inversions, is that why congress is gridlocked on this. >> it's a big part of the issue, it's simple to device a system more logical and fairer and more economically efficient but some particular companies are going to have to pay more if you even it out or do a reform that costs money but you have to make that up. nobody wants to pay more in taxes, there's an interesting academic debate about reforming the system but the real sort of business and political argument is that everyone wants to pay less. you can't make everyone pay less. >> matt iglesias, thanks for being here. >> thank you. >> coming up, the u.n. issues a

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president obama side stepped congress on the issue of climate change before and by the looks of it he's thinking of doing it again. according to "the new york time times", he's working to compel nations to cut their planet's

fossil fuel emissions but without rad fiction from congress. it requires an approval of 2/3 of the senate. but according to the times, the president's climate negotiators are getting around that requirement by advising -- shame to urge countries to cut carbon emissions amid these reports today. the state department issued a stapt emphasizing that the disagreeme agreement has not been written and repremature to say. this comes as a draft of a major new report on carbon emissions, described as blunt and forceful. details of harm already done by higher seas and torrential rain

and other climate extremes. joining me now is chief science adviser for "years of living dangerously", joe rome. it's good to see you. >> thanks for having me. >> let me ask you if this is something that can be done. politically binding is not a term i'm familiar with. >> what would the bind be? >> nations are going to make public commitments. if they don't keep them, pressure will be brought to bear the way we bring pressure to bear on nations that are rekals trant and do things we don't even like militarily. >> do you think this would be a good deal? do you thinks it would change the trajectory we're on with global warming. >> we know what the u.s. is about to agree to. the president five years ago, before copenhagen said 20% reduction from 2005 levels by 2020. it looks like he can deliver on

that with the help of the epa and fuel efficiency standards and the like. the question is what will china put on the table and if it's substantive, you'll see other countries make substantive commitments. if it's not, you probably wont. >> what do we have to induce china to do more or more to the point, where is china on this. what kinds of pressures are they feeling? >> obviously, you have the carbon pollution and your other urban air pollution. their coal plants are making major cities unliveable. they are clearly going to clean up their coal plants and slowed the growth of coal and put in controls, but if you want to reduce carbon pollution, you have to replace coal with something cleaner, which might be renewables or nuclear or the like. so they have an incentive to take action and they are not -- quite mired in the denial in the

u.s. are. they know climate change is going to happen and hit them hard, drought and floods and things you talked about will get worse and worse. plus sea level, like united states they have a lot of val awable land and property near the coast and sea level rise will threaten that. >> at home, there is currently the ongoing effort to regulate carbon emissions coming from power plants for the epa but there's been video and tape and other comments have come out from mitch mcconnell recently saying that if he wins the senate back, one of their objectives will be to essentially use spending bills to end the epa's ability to regulate carbon and take out the money for it and force a shutdown over it. how serious of a threat do you think that is to the epa process? >> certainly one has to take mcconnell seriously. the analyses says he has a good chance of being the mext majority leader. the question is politically,

does the public want to see a shutdown because the epa -- in order to stop the epa from reducing pollution? i don't think the polls support that. so you know, the republicans have been doing politically unpopular things and they may try to pull this off. i don't think it's a winner and i think they would blink. they blinked, you know, last year on this and they saw it hurt them in the polls that they even got as close as they did. so i think one should be very concerned if mitch mcconnell were to become senate majority leader and it would cause problems for obama and the epa. but is he going to shot the government down over this? i guess i'm a bit skeptical. >> do you think president obama would blink over that issue? >> i think -- i think he is pretty resolved if you've been listening to his speeches and of course his counselor, john podesta has been very strong.

i think he's been getting the advice and of course reading the recent reports, including the national climate assessment from his own government that say we can't keep muddling. the situation is too dire. >> thanks for being here. >> thanks for having me. >> after the break, senator marco rubio has come a long way since his days fighting for bipartisan immigration reform or maybe the wrong way. the latest turn is next. so factn negatively impact good bacteria? even if you're healthy and active. phillips digestive health support is a duo-probiotic that helps supplement good bacteria found in two parts of your digestive tract. i'm doubly impressed! phillips' digestive health. a daily probiotic. virtually all your important legal matters in just minutes. now it's quicker and easier for you to start your business, protect your family, and launch your dreams. at legalzoom.com we put the law on your side.

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believe in america even more. >> that was florida senator marco rubio way back in the good old days of 2013, urging colleagues to support a bipartisan senate bill that he helped to write and negotiate. that bill went on to pass 68-32. this is how he talked about immigration yesterday. >> the state of florida and senator wants to deport us. senator rubio, you don't stand with latinos. >> you're doing harm to your own cause, you're harming your own cause. you don't have a right -- >> same day he further distanced himself from marco rubio as he said, i've learned in the last year because of such an incredible distrust of the federal government no matter who is is charge, the only way you deal with the issue of immigration reform is by first securing the border and insuring

illegal immigration is under control. the transformation is telling, in 2013 he made a huge gamble. he essentially bet that immigration reform would not only pass but would put his party back in the good graces of latino community and he could get the credit for that and those latino votes to the white house. that would be worth alienating some on the right. that did not work out. rubio and other republican elites underestimated the basis towards reform, the bill died in the republican controlled house. so now marco rubio finds himself at the losing end of a bad bet. the question is when will marco rubio learn to cut his own losses. i'll see you tomorrow at 4:00 p.m. eastern "the ed show" is up next. good evening, americans, welcome to "the ed show", i'm ready to go so let's get to

work. >> what are the odds you run for president? >> bernie sandsers for president campaign. >> senator bernie sanders of vermont. >> we have a middle class which is collapsing. >> billionaires are on the war path. it is ol garky. they want more, more, more. >> i think the american people are catching on. >> we are fighting for the souls america. >> 400 individuals in this country than the bottom 150 million americans. >> you're welcome. >> people do not appreciate how far right the republican party has gone. >> do you support a change -- >> you're not answering the question. >> do you support -- >> entitlements you have to tax. >> i asked you a question and you didn't give me an answer. >> calm down. >> do you support -- >> i want your positions on the