air strike killed the leader of a somali terrorist group affiliated with al qaeda. he once vowed to follow in the foot steps of bin laden and it looks like he did. that's what president obama was working on while some were just criticizing him. thanks for watching. i'm al sharpton. have a great weekend. "hardball" starts right now. the pressure builds. let's play "hardball." good evening. i'm chris matthews in washington. in a few minutes we're going to get to the latest on the mystery plane that crashed off of jamaica. we'll jump into hillary clinton's announcement today that she'll decide after new year's whether or not to run for president. news that could influence democrats and republicans hoping

to beat her in the 2016 contest. and now that secretary clinton set the shot clock, if you will, we'll ask now a male candidate should debate a woman candidate. are there rules? we'll give you the latest in the investigation surrounding new jersey governor chris christie. what will be the impact of yesterday's big guilty verdict on the former governor of virginia. we begin with president obama's challenge to europe and the countries of arabia to go to war with the islamic state. does this mean we won't act against the beheaders if they don't? or are we doing things, sending in special ops teams that the president doesn't want to go public with yet. in wales today the president said he was working on building a broad coalition and ruled out u.s. boots on the ground in syria. >> our goal is to act with urgency but also to make sure that we are doing it right. it's not going to happen overnight. we are steadily hoving th in ing this in the right direction. we are going to degrade and

ultimately defeat isil, the same way we have gone after al qaeda. we have been very systematic and methodical in going after the organizations that may threaten u.s. personnel and the homeland. and that deliberation allows us to do it right. but have no doubt we will continue and i will continue to do what's necessary to protect the american people. >> how i hate that word -- homeland. it is pure neocon talk. chuck todd is moderator of "meet the press" and political director for nbc news. you are interviewing the president for "meet the press." congratulations, you will be a bold moderator for that historic program. what can you tell us as a reporter that might be between the lines of what the president said today in wales? how does it work? if we wait for the saudis, the jordanians, they may never act.

is he going to act alone if he has to -- the president -- to go after isis? >> well, he already announced -- we though he has part one of the coalition. he has the western parties that agreed to go after isis or as the administration referred to him as isil. he talked about the next step. what's the next gathering of world leaders? it's at the general assembly of the united nations. i think that's where they believe they will get the arab thagss on board. when you hear this talk he ruled out bootings on the ground of the united states. but they are not ruling out the idea that you're going to need boots on the ground to deal with isis in syria. it's clear that the united states wants it to be saudi boots or jordanian boots. doesn't want it to be united states boots on the ground. so that's another couple of weeks of putting the coalition together. at its best, this looks like an

administration after a president seemeded a little bit nervous about how to go about this, how aggressive to get. they decided to go the bush '41 route. think jim baker in '90 where he built a large coalition to go after saddam. that's what they want. they hope to get one. i had a snarky e-mail from a viewer who said, you know, the united states gives a lot of military support to saudi arabia. are they ever going to use it? why is it the united states that has to use their own military even after the united states sends so much military to these chris and allies. it's a little snarky, but you understand. >> i'm with you. >> the president is channelling the same war fatigue that's in the united states saying we know this is a problem. we don't want to keep doing it by ourselves. >> would he have answered a direct question if one of the reporters got to him with a question that said do we or do

we not have special ops teams, contract workers now in syria going after isil? would he have answered that question negatively? >> i don't think he would have answered it. i think there is a lot of occupation going on. i think he would have focused the question more on iraq. there's been hesitancy about the syria aspect of the problem. when asked about it, he talks up the potential solution they feel they have put together in iraq with a new government, with the reinforced iraqi military that might be able to deal with the threat in a more direct way. it's the syria aspect of this that's seemed to knock him a little bit for not a loop but he's been cautious, reluctant the. it's clear his team made the decision. they have to go after isis in syria. it's not the united states. it's not going to be just western powers. they are going to do it and try to build the large coalition so that it is essentially sunni states perhaps that are going

and doing this on the front lines with the support and the assistance of the united states military. >> you're going to be on pitching mound against the president the this weekend. what's your best question? >> well, do i give it away now? do i say it here? i'll be honest. i think the first question is a simple question. are we at war? isis is at war with us. are we back on war footing? this is a president that wants us off war footing. now i feel he's trying to prepare the country for going back on war footing. maybe similar to with al qaeda, a different type of war footing. that's what it feels like. is that what he's trying to prepare the country for? i think it is a basic question a lot of americans have. >> do you think he feels the pull on him from the american people who want, to use a phrase, a captain kirk and not mr. spock? they want somebody controlling the ship, not somebody telling us which way it should be going. does he know the disconnect is

there? does he care? >> look, this is not who he is. the american people elected him because he was not a guy who saw everything in black and white. his rise was because he did see gray. now the criticism is he sees too much gray. there is too much nuance. i think you see it does feel like from an outsider perspective watching this that his entire national security team has been publically trying to push him into this position. he's there now. think about joe biden and his rhetoric, chuck hagel, john kerry. they seem to be this a more aggressive place about isis than the president himself. it's not as if the president doesn't -- they agree on going after him. he's just so weary of opening up the syrian can of worms. >> we should stop using or ma ge

don talk, homeland. don't say that. we know where we live. good luck, chuck. break a leg this this weekend. >> thank you. >> chuck will interview the president of the united states this weekend. it will be his debut -- chuck's, not the president's -- on "meet the press" this sunday. the president ruled out u.s. boots on the ground in syria saying the international community needs to do more to help moderate opposition forces in syria. let's watch the president now. >> we will not be placing u.s. ground troops to try to control the areas that are part of the conflict inside of syria. i don't think that's necessary for us to accomplish our goal. we are going to have to find effective partners on the ground to push back against isil. and the moderate coalition there is one that we can work with. we have experience working with many of them. they have been, to some degree,

outgunned and outmanned. that's why it is important for us to work with friends and allies to support them more effectively. >> joining me is brian katoulis from the american center for progress. how do you get others to do the fighting? >> there he's talking specifically about the syrian opposition against assad and the islamic state, isis. for the last couple of years we have been providing some form of support. so have the saw disand the qataris. it's going to different factions and isn't organized. i hope he's talking about getting boots on the ground, more organized and the network behind him. they know the sunni tribes which could be the anvil against which we hit the islamic state. doing it is easier said than done. saudi arabia doesn't like qatar. they don't coordinate. it's not 1991. it is 2014 and these countries are often at odds with one

another. the syrian opposition against assad and isis is in disarray because oil rich countries have squandered money and weapons themselves the last couple of years and haven't organized the effort. i hope the president is saying let's get it organized better. >> chuck talked about the president taking step one and getting europeans behind it. i would say that's an optimistic view. the president really only said he faced no pushback. >> it's important that some of the nato ally partners joined us. >> they're not fighting. >> no, they are not. let's talk about what kind of fight it is. we talk often in homeland. you were mentioning these comments. we use the word war like a traditional combat here, conventional military fight. it's not. the intelligence networks, the types of operations that we have seen in somalia earlier this week. that's the sort of fight. i think what they talked about at nato is the intelligence on

the networks that include 12,000 foreign fighters. it's a different -- we are not talking about fighting the state though it calls itself a state. >> those guys marching in the black uniforms with black flags. are they foreign fighters or syrians? >> i can't tell from the to. it's a mix. what we know is there are 12,000 from either the region, 3,000 coming. my point is we often talk about where we bomb. can we get intel, can we contain them? i hope that's what he'sing about in forming a coalition. >> wearing those uniforms they should be easy to spot. they dress like darth vader coming to town. >> in thes last week or so we have done aerial surveillance. we need good intelligence on the ground. it took two months. >> politically we have to stop the beheadings. we can't watch that every two weeks.

we'll have you back many times. coming up, hillary clinton start it is shot clock like in basketball. she'll make a decision about running for president in the first of the year. that's coming up in the new year. so the timetable is set for a democratic contest. there are new developments many the george washington bridge lane closure a year are afterward. they were closed a year ago. somebody yelled "shut up" to the police there. they weren't supposed to talk about what was going on. what's going on now? that's what we want to know. what does it hold for the future of christie? and the debate between u.s. senator kay haguen and republican challengerer thom tillis showed, i think, how a man shouldn't run against a woman candidate. here is tillis. >> that's reality, math, something kay needs to accept. the answer leads me to believe she hasn't been in north carolina much lately. kay's math doesn't add up. >> what a sarcastic being.

he's sniping at the united states senator calling her kay as if they are buds. 'cause this work? finally, let me finish with the decision by organizers of the st. patrick's day parade in new york to allow gay groups to join in. that's a great decision. this is "hardball," the place for politics. chael! looking good! trying to keep up with you! i told my producer karen that i take metamucil because it helps me feel fuller between meals. it's just one small change that can help lead to good things. now she's breaking up with the vending machine. nope. i call that the meta effect. [ female announcer ] 4-in-1 multi-health metamucil now clinically proven to help you feel less hungry between meals. and promotes heart health. experience the meta effect with our new multi-health wellness line and see how one small change can lead to good things. [ girl ] my mom, she makes underwater fans that are powered by the moon. ♪ she can print amazing things, right from her computer. [ whirring ]

[ train whistle blows ] she makes trains that are friends with trees. ♪ my mom works at ge. ♪ we are back. if you missed it there was a sad drama in the skies over eastern cuba, the caribbean and cuba. f-15 fighters trailed a plane with an unresponsive pilot until he crashed off the coast of jamaica. two people were on board the doomed flight. a real estate developer and his wife. a former ntsb investigator is with us now. what do you think happened with the plane? what do we know? >> one of the things that's a telltale sign of hypoxia is what the f-15 pilot saw. that's the ice built up or the frost built up on the windows of the airplane.

there was likely a depressurization problem and the pilot suck coming to the effects of hypoxia. >> thank you. we'll know more tomorrow morning. thank you so much. formerly of the ntsb. we'll be right back after this. driver 1 you ready? yeah! go! [sfx] roaring altima engine woah! ahhhha! we told people they were riding nissan's most advanced altima race car. we lied... about the race car part. altima, with 270 horsepower and active understeer control. how did you?...what! i don't even, i'm speechless. innovation that excites. we are a collection of smalls. a home saved. a hero homebound for a new opportunity. a kitchen that kick starts careers

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welcome back to "hardball." today hillary clinton speaking in mexico city of all places laid out a political timetable. here she is. >> so i do have a unique vantage point and set of experiences about what makes the united states operate well and what doesn't. and what a president can do and should be doing. so oh i am going to be making a decision around probably after the first of the year about whether i'm going to run again or not.

>> just like that, probably after the first of the year. a declaration like that puts a lot of political action into motion. not just for the democratic side, of course, but the republican side as well. hillary clinton just started, as they say in the nba, the shot clock for 2016. joining me now is perry bacon, msnbc senior political reporter and blumberg editor jean cummings. tell me what you think about this. i have been thinking about it a lot. your thoughts is this. >> i was surprised she was so explicit. i talked to democrats who were likely to work on the campaign. what i was told was two things. the reason you want to announce early in january is the first reason is the republicans will be attacking her anyway. like rand paul, ted cruz are going to be on the campaign trail by that time. you want to have an apparatus defending hillary clinton formally in a campaign. the second reason being democratic do fors already want to start rallying around her. you can't drag it out until

april or may. they will wonder if we have a candidate, who is the candidate. sthek anoups in january but not start going to iowa, new hampshire all the time until july or august or much later in the year. >> your thoughts, jean? i love all that. >> i think she had to do it for the party. the party needs to know she's in. if there's a notion she may not run, she can't wait until april or may. then leave somebody to start from scratch at that point. it's too late. i agree. she'll be attacked anyway. might as well prepare herself. there is in a modern campaign so much work that has to be done in building that broad base, the e-mail bases and building out the computer infrastructure. it's a lot harder to build a modern -- >> you need a war room are. >> right. >> one thing you're right about is when she was getting hit during the book tour she had people from the publishing house but they won't help her politically.

she didn't have thor war room with stefan -- george stephanopoulos and carville batting them down. there is always an outside thing that joe biden may figure his last hurrah. it seems when she announces this in january she will announce she'll run probably. we all think it probably. does biden athouns bf that or does this shut him off and he says, well, i can wait until january. if he waits he won't run. he won't announce after she announces. your thoughts about the interest aring scrabble over who's first. >> my understanding is biden is unlikely to run if hillary does, period. if she waits until april he could maybe rumble. by her talking about january, that closes the door. joe biden had trouble raising money in 2008 when he ran. if donors know hillary clinton will announce in january i'm not

sure who will say money will buy or join the staff in december if they know hillary will announce the week after and she'll be ahead by 70 points in the polls. >> who does she want to run against? my hunch is she wants sparring partners. hold a convention in new york and be crowned? that's too much, i think. what do you think she thinks? >> i think it would benefit her to have some kind of primary early in the book tour she stumbled on many questions. she was out of practice on gay marriage. on the rechbs to wealth. her language wasn't sharp. it wasn't ready for the campaign trail. to have a sparring partner would be good. preferably from her left so she looks for centrist. >> bernie sanders. >> that would do the trick. >> a real socialist. i'm not knocking him. he is one.

>> he doesn't have a super pack. he's not running. it's that simple. >> martin o'malley from maryland. >> he's trying to raise money. >> brian shh wietser? what are you hearing, perry? >> the names i have heard are oh oh o'malley, like gene said, bernie sanders and jim webb is making a lot of flirtations about running as well. the people i have talked to, their view is they want someone to run because they want to have debates, want to practice. they don't want someone who will attack on the 1990s or talk about monica lewinsky a lot or make it a personal campaign. they want an opponent to be above the fray and make it issues only as opposed to any kind of personal thing. >> where do you find opponents like that? the this is 2015. where do you find nice fellows like that? i don't want to say anything about the secretary. what kind of candidate is that? >> if you look at the line-up perry listed, jim webb is the

most interesting one. >> sure. >> he can do income inequality with a lot of authenticity. >> what do you make -- perry, you're in florida. i hear jeb is running. mitt is making noise running op-ed pieces. looks like the field will be crowded on the republican side. maybe 8 or 10 people. across the board including maybe even huckabee. i hear everybody wants to run. they must think it's worth it to run against hillary all of the sudden. >> i don't think it's worth it as far as hillary. the real story is how far marco rubio and chris christie have fallen. a year ago we thought those people would be strong candidates and clear the field in some ways. and do a really good job. now it feels like anybody can win. i think jeb is too establishment for the party. he hasn't ran in a long time. it will be a free for all and they will try to announce early. some republicans might be on the ground in iowa january third or so.

this is a full sprint. it's not clear. this is the wide nest a long time. there is not really any favorite i can see. if i were a republican i would go for it. paul ryan could run as well. >> a lot of people think they can run win the general or they wouldn't be running. >> he's right. anybody could win this. if hillary makes the call in january, that will turn everything on. that means chris christie has to make a call. they have to get in the game, start raising money and building a machine. >> do you think there will be distance between hillary clinton after she comes out of the convention and the republicans come out? will there be a widespread between her and the republican candidate. >> on what issue? >> the match-up. >> on the match-up. wide spread coming out of conventions? right now hillary is running

strong. anything can happen. >> perry, what do you think? close one? >> polls are showing right now that hillary was high for a while. now the republicans are back to normal. back to the normal view that hillary is a politician. the polls will be pretty much tied at the end of the convention times. >> i think so. the country is tieded. it comes back. >> yes. >> women will be concerned about the first woman president. there will be guys on the wrong side of the issue. a lot of guys will vote and not tell their wife how they are voting. it will be tight as a drum, i think. perry bacon, jean cummings, thank you. have a nice weekend. up next, dick cheney's knee jerk obama bashing gets him a knock down if his home state of wyoming. that's ahead. as we head to break california governor jerry brown leads the challenger by double digits. they met last night for the lone debate. >> if you had a choice between fighting for civil rights of

poor kids or the union bosses that funded your campaign you sided with the university union bosses. you should be ashamed. i will fight for the kids. >> that makes no sense at all. it's so false. i feel like it's a sales pitch from, i don't know whom. >> neel. >> yeah. you learned your job well working at goldman sacs and the rest of those who wrecked the economy. it's like the arsonists putting out the fire. transit fares! as in the 37 billion transit fares we help collect each year. no? oh, right. you're thinking of the 1.6 million daily customer care interactions xerox handles. or the 900 million health insurance claims we process. so, it's no surprise to you that companies depend on today's xerox for services that simplify how work gets done. which is...pretty much what we've always stood for. with xerox, you're ready for real business. which is...pretty much what we've always stood for.

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bio of the former vice president that was given to them by cheney's office. readers later found out the bio contained unusually subjective criticism of president obama in the text. quote, president obama began to dismantle the security policies that kept the nation safe. his policy decisions have led to a reversal of the gains america made on the war on terror in iraq and afghanistan. and a weakening of america across the globe. look, all we know is cheney will use any opportunity to stick it to the president. we also know you're not supposed to editorialize in your official bio. the wyoming bar heard from several lawyers who said they wouldn't attend because of the inappropriate material. the group later apologized. next up, the news that russian forces moved into ukraine was verified by satellite imagery last week. russia denied involvement.

the russian are troops are really just freelancing while on vacation. that's what they say. the claim flies in the face of the evidence but the russian embassy and united arab emirates thumbed their nose at nato with this photograph of toy trucks and tanks. the caption reads nato's latest evidence of russian armor inv e invading ukraine has been leaked. seems to be the most convincing ever. this juvenile attempt to mock nato is the latest in an ongoing twitter showdown with canada that began last month after canada's delegation posted a map showing russia's border with ukraine that didn't include crimea as a part of russia. geography is tough. here is a map for russian soldiers who keep getting lost and accidentally entering ukraine. we'll see. and health conscious first lady michelle obama participated

in many a new comedy sketch at funny or die, a fake trailer for snac snac snackpocalypse where healthy food was replaced by candy until the hero of the story comes. here's how it ends. ♪ >> don't you hate when trailers give away the whole movie? >> yeah. can we just watch "frozen" again? >> up next, new developments in the george washington bridge scandal. we'll grab a look at where the investigations stand now and what it means to governor christie. this is "hardball," the place for politics.

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francis rivera. here's what's happening. more than 100 american contractors on a charter flight left iran after being grounded for hours. the flight operated by fly dubai was ordered to land in band bandar abbas on its way from bag ram air base in afghanistan to dubai. since it took off late the flight plan didn't match the records. air controllers ordered the plane to land or fighter jets would intercept it. now back the "hardball." welcome back. vift details emerged about the lane closures on the george washington bridge which almost a

year ago today set off a legal and political domino effect in the christie administration. the bergen record says the police officers were told to shut up by high level officials after they raised alarms about the scheme they saw being undertaken. the record ares reporting is based on the string of police testimony provided to new jersey lawmakers investigating governor christie. it reports during the closures a police officer radioed that the closures were creating hazardous conditions on fort lee streets. shut up, a port authority police supervisor at the bridge allegedly replied. the officer was visited in person by two officials to reinforce the message to shut up. to date the new jersey lawmakers heard public testimony from six key witnesses including top aides to christie himself. the legislative committee is not the only investigator on his tale. the attorney in newark has a

grand jury devoted to the bridge br closures. the manhattan district attorney opened up his own investigation to several matters surrounding chris christie including a $1.8 billion transfer of funds that may have been to plug a hole in the state's infrastructure budget. the securities and exchange commission is said to be investigating whether or not the governor's office misled public bond holders in documents to raise money for infrastructure projects. christie has denied doing anything improper in all of the cases. steve kornacki and mr. wiznowski, give us a sense of what you see operating in your committee and also in the various criminal investigations surrounding the governor. >> these reports of the port authority police behaving badly are really troubling. when you have a traffic jam as monumental as you had at the george washington bridge, you

would naturally think police officers would run to aid motorists and try to clear up the problem. what happened here is you have an officer trying to do the right thing and being told by his superiors to shut up and not do anything about it. what's troubling is it appears the hierarchy in the port authority police had some level of understanding or complicity in the attempt to conceal what was happening. >> so it was all coordinated. somebody at the high level knew exactly what the mission was here. was to do what? how else -- >> that's the answer to the question. >> what did the police do. >> we need the opportunity to interview ms. kelly, mr. step yan, mr. wildstein. they have sought refuge in the fifth amendment to not incriminate themselves. but who gave bridget kelly the authority to close the lanes? what gave the police officers who now seem to have had some

level of involvement in this, what gave them the authority or belief that it was okay to shut down this whole thing to make sure there was no public comment? >> steve, you have been out in front on this from the beginning. we rely on you again tonight. what's the likely route for any investigation or possible prosecution -- the bridge, the skyway, the diversion of funds or what looks to be pressure on the mayor of hoboke n to approve a water front development by the governor. >> you are looking at three things. the expectation is when it comes to the closures, the bridge shutdown itself you talk about different principle players, kelly, wildstein, bill baroni. within the group of four people the expectation is at some point in the probably not too distant future there will be indictments whether it's all four, one of the four. indictments, plea deal. there will be a shake out from the bridge deal. when you talk about the reporting that's come out as a

result of the scrutiny that's going on with the land deals that the port authority was involved in you have questions about david sampson, chris christie's confident, chairman of the port authority, whether he'll get into legal trouble, something the federal prosecutors indict him on over the stuff that came to light. as you say the issue with the mayor of hoboken. allegations she lodged could involve david sampson as well. whether there is a shakeout, that's the tough es one to tell. the key factor is so much had to do with the decisions made in the u.s. attorney's office in this u.s. attorney's office is the complete 180 degree opposite of the office under chris christie. it is opaque, difficult to get a read on. you have seen a lot of false starts in terms of reporting. people who think they have a clue what's going on. it hasn't turned out that way. >> you know, i worked in politics for years. you always knew what the boss wanted done. he rarely told you how to do it, but you knew what the mission was. that's why you worked for the

person. >> right. >> how does bridget kelly stop bridge traffic across the hudson river, interstate commerce shut down. if that's not a mission set by the governor who did set the mission? that's my question. did this employee, this nonelected person come up with the idea we are going to shut down traffic between new york and new jersey? we are doing it for a month. >> it's not believable, chris. you know how the governor's office works. people aren't freelancing, trying to guess what the boss wants. they are following direction given by their superiors, they are given instructions and understand what they are supposed to do. we have been asked to believe bridget kelly woke up and decided it might impress somebody if she closed the lanes. david wildstein thought it might perhaps get him a promotion. the reality is i think a little different than that. the fact is that somebody gave bridget kelly a specific or an

implicit instruction that this would be a thing to do because somebody thought it would be helpful or accomplish something. what we don't know is what they were trying to accomplish. we know what the effect was to put fort lee into lockdown for four days. we'll continue to look at the facts and try to get the answers that the public deserves. >> let me go back to steve. outside the orbit here. it's all context. anybody in public office who wants to face a jury now must be crazy. it seems to me the juries aren't in the mood to assume laxness and, oh, that's just politics. i don't think that old attitude, i grew up in a big city, that's the way politicians behave, is acceptable anymore. if i were christie i would be worried about the jury. >> the justice department just took -- looked at the beginning like a risky shot at a former governor, bob mcdonnell. it was a risky case and they won. if the jury had not come back like they did, would it make the justice department more hesitant

to go into the matter of chris christie or did the win on the board, they are not looking at going 0 and 2. i agree. there might be a link even if just psychologically between what we saw yesterday in virginia and new jersey. the one thing i would say when we tack about chris christie is the key when you start talking about legally and chris christie is can it be proven in a court of law, proven even to the point of indictment that this guy knew ahead of time were was involved in covering this up. the only thing we have seen now that seems clear to me is that chris christie had opportunities to know. >> okay. >> will willful ignorance. >> never forget the judge's instructions. circumstantial evidence is good enough. thank you for coming on again. up next, perils for male candidates running against women candidates. exhibit a this week's debate in north carolina in the u.s. senate race where the republican challenger repeatedly sniped at

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i did not know what it was like to be a non-smoker. but i do now. ask your doctor if chantix is right for you. we're back. now that we are past labor day in the beginning of the campaign we are getting to know the men and women seeking political office. sometimes the more we watch, the more we avert our eyes. watch north carolina republican thom tillis debating kay hagan this wednesday night. watch hagan's response to him. >> that's reality. that's math. that's something that kay needs to accept. kay's answer leads me to believe she hasn't been in north carolina lately. kay's math just doesn't add up. here's something you should know a lot about being a senior appropriations chair, kay. you know, kay, if you read the budget. i just think again that senator h hagan really needs to understand and maybe spend more time in the states. >> i'm actually insulted by his

comments. i was a vice president at a bank. i wrote billion dollar state budgets in the state of north carolina. i understand math. even when i was a teenager i worked at my dad's tire store and didlayaway for people buying tires. i understand math. >> anyway, one north carolina reporter wrote, "tom tillis stopped just short of calling kay hagan little lady." anyway talking down to your female opponent may not be the best strategy. remember what happened when vice president george herbert walker bush attempted to explain something to his rival back in 1984. >> let me help you between the difference between iran, the embassy, and lebanon. iran, we were held by a foreign government. in lebanon, you had a wanton terrorist action where the government opposed it. >> let me just say, first of all, that i almost resent vice president bush, your patronizing attitude, that you have to teach

me about foreign policy. >> kasie hunt is msnbc political correspondent, jonathan capehart is an opinion writer. let me help you with your answer to this. i think he learned that from roger ailes because roger ailes got him to say, let me help you with that one, pierre. >> i will say, on the senator hagan and tom tillis, i mean, he couldn't address her that way on the senate floor if he were to actually get here. i mean, senator reid got in trouble for that for addressing any senator, male or female by their first name. it's disrespectful. >> use some psychobabble if we have to, we all use it here. was he using that to put her down, showing he was so unempressed with her personage that he'd dismiss her? i think it's odd. i call every senator senator unless they tell me not to. the only guy who ever told me not to was pat moynihan. the rest of them said, call me pat. they're always -- i think you give the person their title. after all, he's going for that title. >> in part of the clip you

showed, he addressed her at senator hagan. he did do that throughout the debate, sparingly, but the thing, the reference that he made, the very first reference to the senator in his opening remarks was, kay hay. that, to me, struck me, whoa, that's unbelievably -- >> is that her nickname? >> no, i think he maybe just made it up. but, to me, it struck me as disrespectful. and probably just set the tone. he just came off as rather highfalutin, smug, and probably trying to prove that, oh, i'm not impressed by you, i'm the speaker, you're just a senator who's lost touch with the constituents. >> he took a shot once or twice but kept taking the shot, it's only a 45-minute plane ride, i'm sure kay hagan has been down there an awful lot the last six years. the idea she's never been to north carolina like it's billions of miles away is ludicrous. >> well, it's such a fine line, too. as we've seen in the other clips you showed, this can really backfire pretty easily on a male

candidate who comes too close to that line, and remember, hillary clinton and -- >> here it is. thanks for queueing it up. kasie, here, heavy handed tactics can backfire as you said, kasie. back in 2000, republican congressman rick lazio crossed into hillary clinton's debate space pushing at her a sign to, as a campaign pledge. he wanted her to sign, like divorce papers. watch this. >> i'm not asking you to admire it. i'm asking you to sign it. >> i would be happy to when you give me the signed letters -- >> right here. right here. sign it right now. >> we'll shake on this, rick. >> i want your signature because i think everybody wants to see you signing something that you said you were for. >> he's leaning into her. lazio in a 2008 interview called it a mistake saying "even when your opponent is as tough as nails and no way they're going to be intimidated by a challenge or comment, the audience may not see it that way." jonathan? >> right, no, that's absolutely right. i think he probably thought he was doing the right thing.

i remember watching that debate at home in new york and the more i watched that particular clip, the more uncomfortable i got. i wasn't afraid that he was going to do something to hillary clinton. i wasn't afraid that hillary clinton couldn't hold her own. but the optics of it was really, really bad. >> people pick up on the type of -- >> what are the rules? miss hunt? >> they're always evolving, right? i think in the larger picture here, and you'll hear both democrats and republicans talk about this, this is the kind of thing that discourages women from running for office in first place. >> really? >> and one of the things they talk about as far as one of the main reasons why there aren't as many women members of congress as there might otherwise be is because they don't step up in the first place. they have trouble recruiting women to run. so you see these kinds of situations where, you know, they're having to stand there and respond to someone who is sort of trying to knock them down a peg. i mean, why would that be -- >> what's the reaction, if you were running the ad, working for senator hagan, would you run that guy's, tom tillis', speaker

tillis' performance in the ads? run ads and say, this is no way to treat a person who's a senator? when it's that behavior you're using against him? >> i don't think so. i mean, it's not like george herbert walker bush's treatment of geraldine ferraro. >> he said afterwards, i kicked her ass or something. it's unbelievable. i'm thatsorry, that's what he s >> he did. if i were kay hagan, i wouldn't use that in an ad. to answer your question, how should a male candidate treat a female opponent? look to vice president joe biden and his debate with sarah palin. that's how you do it. treat your opponent with respect. >> thank you, kasie hunt and jonathan capehart. we'll be right back after this.

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let me finish tonight with some good news on the irish front. every march, new york city has this great historic st. patri patrick's day parade. for years there's been a dispute between the parade committee, itself, and gay organizations wanting to participate. starting next st. patrick's day, the parade will begin to open to those organizations. the first group, nbc universal, lesbian, gay, transgender group at my company got the go ahead this week. cardinal timmy dolan who will be the grand marshal of the 2015 parade is said to be very supportive of the change. he said the parade should be a source of unity. i think this is great. st. patrick's day gets bigger and bigger each year, has become

a popular holiday in this country not just for irish and now can be celebrated fully in a country where people do at their best treat each of us as god's true children. and that's "hardball" for now. thanks for being with us. "all in with chris hayes" starts right now. tonight, we are "all in." abrupt landing. a chartered plane with as many as 100 americans on board grounded in iran. we'll have the latest details. you can't contain an organization that is running roughshod through that much territory. >> the president says the u.s. and its allies are preparing to take the fight to isis, while republican hawks take a victory lap. and tesla hits the jackpot. state of nevada offers the electric car company over $1 billion in tax breaks to build a battery factory. even if the factory succeeds, will state taxpayers lose? >> i think people in nevada should be very proud that that's