children. when children show up to school hungry, they can't learn. so we need to change our thinking around this. these are some of the things we're doing with food policy action, focusing on these kitchen table issues that affect everyo everyone. >> tom, thanks so much. that's "the ed show." "politicsnation" with reverend al sharpton starts right now. >> good evening, ed, and thanks to you for tuning in. i'm live tonight from los angeles. breaking news tonight from dallas. within hours, the first nurse diagnosed with ebola will leave dallas and arrive at a special biocontainment unit at an nih facility in bethesda, maryland. in the span of two days, texas presbyterian sending both infected nurses to facilities specifically equipped to handle ebola. they're just four such facilities in the united states.

the responses of the hospital in dallas and the cdc under the microscope today. 22 members of congress leaving the campaign trail to attend the first hearing on ebola, where they grilled officials. and this morning, startling allegations from a nurse at texas presbyterian who told the "today" show that they were unprepared for ebola. late today, president obama issues an executive order so he can deploy the u.s. national guard and reserves to liberia. joining me now from the hospital in dallas is nbc's craig melvin. craig, thanks for being here. >> thanks for having me, reverend al. >> let me ask you, what preparations are under way to get the nurse on the plane? >> nina pham will be boarding a

plane that's either just landed in dallas or is about to land any moment now. that information from the local affiliate. that will be the plane she takes to bethesda, maryland, to the national institutes of health. i can also tell you, we can expect a similar scene to what we saw yesterday, similar in the sense that we will see the folks who are with her, wearing the hazmat uniforms. she'll be in a similar get-up as well. but as you indicated, nina pham, the second nurse to be transported from dallas presbyterian over the past two days. >> now, this morning, the dallas county judge, clay jenkins, told you he only wanted one ebola patient treated at the hospital. then he had none. is this a lack of confidence? >> they say no. the hospital has said that's not

the case. they've said, in fact, that it's more of an issue of depletion of resources. i'm going to read part of that statement to you. this is again, from dallas presbyterian. with many of the medical professionals who would normally staff the intensive care unit sidelined for continuous monitoring, it is the best interest of the hospital, employees, nurses, physicians, and the community, to give the hospital an opportunity to prepare for whatever comes next. as we've been saying here, we've been given every indication that it is likely that we will see at least another ebola patient here. so what they're essentially doing, we're told, is trying to make some space at dallas presbyterian. they have three beds here that can house ebola patients, and right now, we have the indication that they don't have the resources. they don't have the staff. they don't have the nurses to adequately care for the ebola

patients, because so many of their staff is being monitored for ebola themselves. >> a nurse who worked inside told the "today" show they weren't prepared. what is the reaction on the ground today? >> we heard from that nurse this morning. we've heard from a number of nurses and unions over the past few days and they've echoed similar sentiments. they weren't properly prepared, they didn't even have conversations about ebola. they didn't have the proper gear. talked to a few folks on the ground, couple of nurses were talked to on their lunch break. there was one nurse who obviously wouldn't go on camera, but she was very angry at the hospital's response -- or lack thereof. and there was another nurse a few minutes later who said, this could have happened anywhere. i believe that our hospital has handled this well. we've done the best we could do. and i certainly hope, according to this nurse, she hopes this is

not something that tanets the hospital forever. one of the nurse downing street say they noticed fewer patients coming into the hospital here at dallas presbyterian. >> lot of hard questions and we're going to continue to ask them. nbc's craig melvin, thanks so much for those details. turning now to the first congressional hearing on ebola. officials from the cdc, the nih, texas presbyterian, and other agencies, were grilled for nearly three hours. republicans and democrats calling for answers about the botched handling of ebola patients in texas. but it was cdc director tom frieden who faced some of the sharpest and toughest questions. >> authorities thought it would be similar to the 1976 outbreaks, and quickly contained. that turned out to be wrong. >> people's lives are at stake

and the response so far has been unacceptable. >> i still don't feel like we have a good answer of why nurse one and nurse two contracted ebola. >> the first nurse that was infected, i believe you personally said that the protocols were breached originally. have you backed away from that? >> we're looking at what might have resulted -- >> you said the protocols breached. were the protocols breached with the first nurse that was infected? >> our review of the records suggests that in the first few days of -- >> if you didn't know for a fact, you shouldn't have said it. >> but tonight, so many questions remain unanswered. joining me now is congresswoman jan schakowsky who was in the hearing today and dr. nat lay aczar, a clinical department in the department of medicine. congresswoman, were you assist with the answers you got today?

>> i think it was a real wake-up call. the alarm bells rang. i think be ms were justifiablying more concise answers about why the nurses contracted ebola. but we did get answers, that the issue is now training and equipping, essentially, that we establish not only the protocols, but the ability now of our front line health care workers to be able to implement them. to have the knowledge, the training, and the right protective gear in order to prevent themselves from getting sick. >> congresswoman, let me ask you this. a lot of the back and forth at the hearing today focused around the idea of a travel ban. many republicans want a ban on flights in and out of west africa. many democrats disagree. listen. >> screening and self-reporting

in airports have been a demonstrated failure. >> if we have a travel ban, wouldn't we just force these people to hide their origin? >> even jamaica, as i read in the press earlier this week has issued a travel ban. >> is the white house considering a travel ban? >> i can't speak for the white house. >> do you know if they've ruled out a travel ban? >> i can't speak -- >> have you had conversations with them about it? >> we've discussed the issue of travel. >> where does that debate stand? is a travel ban necessary? >> well, we know that some airlines have already canceled or cut back on flights, and save the children and doctors without borders have said that has interfered with the relief effort, getting workers there, getting volunteers there that are going to be doing the job in west africa. the one thing we know we don't want to do is actually exacerbate the crisis there, because that's where it all starts from. so i think it's a question that

still needs to be asked. but is it going to make us safer? or could it actually make the problem worse? >> dr. aczar, what do you feel? is a travel ban necessary? >> i don't think that a travel ban is going to accomplish the goal of preventing infection from coming in to the united states. i really don't. my gut instinct from the very beginning on this is that we're going to be using and stretching a lot of resources in order to accomplish appropriate screenings. there's a lot of questions about what happens to people when they get screened, where do they go, what happens after that? and as we've seen already, we have thhypotheticals, but untile have it caught and appropriately managed, we can say it was effective or it wasn't. i want to reiterate again, the questioning, the breaching of the protocol, let's not forget

that health care workers are infected in spite of their best efforts to use appropriate protocol all the time. dr. kent brantly and nancy rib old, neath of thither of them k they got infected, and they were supposedly appropriately trained. let's take a step back from the blame game. we know the hospitals need to have more preparation and more training. it's unfortunate that we had to sacrifice the healths of our nurses, obviously, and we're hoping to prevent that from happening again but we may not be able to in spite of our best efforts. >> let me ask you this while we're talking. i want to go back to something i played for you and the congresswoman earlier. it was stated today by dr. frieden that we are not -- he does not feel there will be an outbreak, but he had one qualification to that. let me play what he said. >> there's zero doubt in my mind

that barring a mutation which changes it, which we don't think is likely, there will not be a large outbreak in the u.s. there will not be a large outbreak in the u.s. barring a mutation. >> we heard him say he did not expect an outbreak unless there were mutations. what does that mean and is it likely to happen? >> from the infectious disease world, i think that anticipating a mutation -- i mean, what would it need to be a mutation? we already don't have treatment for it. so it's not like we have an effective treatment that we can use. we know it's highly contagious, so making it more of a super bug, i think that sounds more like science fiction than reality. for him to make a comment that we are able to control infection here and not have an outbreak, is still appropriate wordage for the situation. that is, we are going to expect

and anticipate some scattered cases. that's to be expected. but an outbreak is very different from an index patient getting behind the ball and having infected a few others, very, very different from an epidemic. >> congresswoman, you were very passionate about the nurses today and what protection the nurses were having going forward, and what happened in the past. in fact, a dallas purse spoke out on the "today" show this morning. listen to what she said about protocol. >> i just flat-out asked several infectious disease nurses, i asked the cdc. why would i be pairing two pairs of gloves, three pairs of booties, a plastic suit covering my entire body and then leave my neck hanging out this much? >> that is your concern there, with the question she's raising, congresswoman? >> yes, i think that any exposed

skin can certainly make you vulnerable to the ebola virus. but i want to say one other thing about this. nancy pelosi today called for the appropriations committee to come back to congress and have a debate about adding more money to these agencies whose budgets have been cut -- the cdc and the national institutes of health. the director of the national institutes of health said his budget had not been cut, we would likely have an ebola vaccine today. so there's that issue as well. >> i'm going to have to leave it there, congresswoman jan schakowsky, dr. natalie aczar, thank you both for your time tonight. >> thank you. >> thank you. coming up, as we mentioned, we'll have much more on that dallas nurse breaking her silence on what was happening inside. >> knowing what i know, i would

try anything and everything to refuse to go there be treated. i would feel at risk by going there. if i don't actually have ebola, i may contract it there. >> and we are awaiting comments from president obama after meeting with his top advisers on ebola. we'll have those comments. and turning to politics, fan gate in florida. it's a political debate moment for the ages. why little fans sent rick scott into hiding? stay with us. you're never quite sure what is coming your way. but when you've got an entire company who knows that the most on-time flights are nothing if we can't get your things there too. it's no wonder more people choose delta than any other airline.

for the first time, we're learning exactly what was happening inside the texas hospital treating ebola patients. a nurse broke her silence on the protective gear she was given. >> i'll just be honest. i threw a fit. i just couldn't believe it. in the second week of an ebola

crisis at my hospital, the only gear they're offering us at that time, and up until that time, is gear that is allowing our necks to be uncovered. >> last night, we demonstrated in our home studio in new york that problem. >> here, i'm actually protecting any fluid, blood, diarrhea or vomit from getting into my face area. the concern is, the neck is exposed here. the current recommendations again are not to have anything specific on the neck. >> so how can this country's health care system improve and be ready to deal with the ebola challenge? that's next. you notice a few things. like the fact that you're pretty attached to these. ok, really attached. and that's alright. because we'll text you when your package is on the way. we're even expanding sunday package delivery. yes, sunday.

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>> you're looking at a live picture of the ambulance in dallas that will take a nurse to the airport, then to nih in maryland for treatment. for the first time, we're hearing what happened inside the dallas hospital. brianna aguirre told matt lauer, the medical staff was completely unprepared for ebola. >> never talked about ebola. and we probably should have. they gave us an optional seminar to go to, just informational, not hands-on. it wasn't even suggested that we go. it wasn't something that they said, you really should try to make it. it was i believe only offered

once, if not, twice. we were never told what to look for. i just don't think that any facility in this country is prepared for that at this time. >> she also said medical staff didn't have the proper protective gear. >> by the time that i partook in the ebola situation at my hospital, we were already wearing what i guess would be hazmat suits. they were tifex suits. they were dupont suits. and it was basically just like you would have in a snow suit or hoodie. it would zip up to about here. and from there, go into a hood up around my face. like this, around my whole face. and then on top of that was a mask in front of me that would go under my chin, to here. so from here to here was uncovered. i'll just be honest, i threw a

fit. i just couldn't believe it. and the second week of an ebola crisis at my hospital, the only gear they're offering us at that time and up until that time is gear that is allowing our necks to be uncovered. and i just flat-out asked several infectious disease nurses, i asked the cdc, why? why would i be wearing two pairs of gloves, three pairs of booties, a plastic suit covering my entire body, and then leave my neck hanging out this much so that something can potentially go close to my mouth or nose? >> then she was asked if she started showing signs of ebola, would she think twice before heading to her own hospital? >> i've played that situation out in my head, and knowing what i know, i would try anything and everything to refuse to go there to be treated.

i would feel at risk by going there. if i don't actually have ebola, i may contract it there, is how i actually feel. i would do anything to refuse to go there. >> that is a very telling statement. so how concerned should we be about this? >> joining me now is david quamen, one of the first people to report on ebola. he's traveled to africa 18 times over the last decade, researching the spread of the virus. his new book is called "ebola: the natural and human history of a deadly virus." thanks for being here tonight, david. >> it's good to be with you. >> the allegations are disturbing. should these nurses be concerned? >> yes, they should certainly be concerned. it seemed that the preparations in dallas were woefully inadequate in terms of supplies, the protective equipment, and the training in how to use them.

we have some very expert people at the cdc in the viral special pathogens branch and doctors without borders have great expertise. it takes training, as well as the right equipment. training in how to use the equipment and then close monitoring of the protocols to make sure that they are observed, as people put on and take off the equipment and deal with patients. that doesn't seem to have happened in dallas, and presbyterian hospital wasn't ready. whose fault that was, it's hard to say. >> david, i need a fact-check. people are very concerned. how concerned should we be? how concerned about travel and interaction? i mean, i flew out here today on a plane. how concerned should people be? >> people should be very concerned about what's going on in west africa? there's devastation. it could spread and we've heard from the african union today

they're concerned it could cause destruction across africa. people are entitled to be concerned about the arrival of a few patients in the u.s., or the transmission to one or two more patients. but frankly, we should be able to control that. we have the resources in this country to do barrier nursing and isolation care of these patients. i think it's a good thing that the two patients from dallas have been moved to atlanta and bethesda, where they will be cared for by people who were deeply trained in how to do this. so i think americans should be very concerned about stopping this epidemic in west africa, because nobody is safe around the rest of the world until it is stopped there. travel bans -- >> all right, let's talk about west africa for a minute. because i mentioned your trips there. what did you learn in your trips to west africa about ebola? what can you tell us about ebola?

>> my trips in connection with ebola have all been to central africa where the disease began in 1976. it's a disease that comes from the forest. it lives in some animal, that's called the reservoir host. we don't know which animal. people say it lives in bats. they're a suspect, but it hasn't been positively proven. people have contact with the animal, whatever it is, eating it, you know, hunting it for food or whatever, and the virus spills over into a person and then passes from one person to another. but reverend al, there have been almost 20 outbreaks of ebola in africa over the last 38 years, and they've all been controlled with the death of no more than 300 people, each one of them, total of 1,800 people. and this epidemic got out of control in west africa, because of a peculiar combination of unfortunate circumstances, including crippled governance and lack of health care resources, and the fact that the force in those areas is not very

far from the big capital cities and the international airports. >> is this a pandemic, or was this a pandemic in west africa? >> i think the accurate terminology in so far as that's important is epidemic. a pandemic is a disease event that spreads around the world, affecting significant numbers of cases in a broad geographical distribution of cities and countries. this is not a pandemic, and we certainly hope it won't become a pandemic, but it's no longer just an outbreak. in west africa, it is an epidemic. >> you said earlier today this is a dry run for the pandemic. what did you mean by that? >> this is not a one-time deal. this is not a solitary event. if we get ebola 2014 under control and stop it, we should be aware that next year, or the year after, or the year after that, there will be another

emerging virus, another scary new virus coming out of an animal somewhere in a remote place, getting into humans and then being passed from human to human. we know sars did this in 2003. we have been concerned about bird flu, the mers virus out of saudi arabia. scientists are aware there are more of these coming. >> you've written an article called "could ebola mutate to become more deadly." in it, you mentioned something you refer to as the nairobi table top scenario. explain that to us. >> that's right. this is in response to the u.s. closing its borders against west africans will solve the whole problem. maybe it's going to come to that. but even if we do that, it won't absolutely protect us, because of this scenario. say a man, a liberiian man gets on a plane in monrovia, feeling

fine, flies to kenya, to the nairobi airport. travel there is closed but it's due to open on october 24th. this man flies to the nairobi airport, starts to feel a headache, he coughs on a table top with spittle in the nairobi airport. five minutes later, an american businessman comes by and touches that table top, touches his eye and gets on a flight for singapore. in singapore, he does his busy for two days and feels fine. then flies to los angeles. he's coming in, an american businessman arriving tfrom singapo singapore, with no history of being to west africa, how are you going to stop that from coming? >> thank you very much for your time this evening. we're awaiting comments from president obama after meeting with his ebola response team. we'll bring you that as soon as

it happens. also, the ebola fear factor. when does america cross the line from common sense precautions to panic? also, the real reason that republicans are using ebola to attack the obama administration. stay with us. i'm only in my 60's... i've got a nice long life ahead. big plans. so when i found out medicare doesn't pay all my medical expenses, i got a medicare supplement insurance plan. [ male announcer ] if you're eligible for medicare, you may know it only covers about 80% of your part b medical expenses. the rest is up to you. call now and find out about an aarp medicare supplement insurance plan, insured by unitedhealthcare insurance company. like all standardized medicare supplement insurance plans,

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breaking news tonight on ebola. on the left you see the white house where president obama is meeting with his ebola response team. we expect comments from him shortly. on the right you see texas health presbyterian hospital in dallas. we expect an ambulance to take ebola patient nina pham to the airport for transport to the nih in maryland. more on that breaking news ahead. growth is gratifying. goal is to grow. gotta get greater growth. i just talked to ups. they got expert advise, special discounts, new technologies.

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with top members of his ebola response team. we expect to get comments from him shortly. we'll bring that to you just as soon as they come in. we turn now to the 2014 election. when political races heat up, we see lots of candidates struggle under the hot lights of debate stages. we've never seen something like last night's governor's debate in florida, however. >> you can see the two candidates who were invited to take part in this debate, right now are not stepping up on the stage. [ laughter ] ladies and gentlemen, we have an extremely peculiar situation right now. we have governor charlie crist -- [ cheers and applause ] >> there's democrat charlie crist, but no sign of republican

governor rick scott. and why? it all came down to this fan. charlie crist is famous in florida for bringing a fan to appearances, so he won't sweat. and governor scott didn't want it there. >> the rules of the debate that i was shown by the scott campaign say that there should be no fan. somehow, there is a fan there, and for that reason, ladies and gentlemen, i am being told that governor scott will not join us for this debate. >> now, the debate sponsor says the fan wasn't allowed. and governor scott's team says he didn't refuse to come out, but was waiting for the rules to be decided. but still, it didn't look good for scott. after a few long minutes, he

finally came out on the stage. but when he was asked about the incident today, governor scott didn't have a good answer. >> governor, what happened last night? >> charlie was throwing a fit. he said he wasn't going to show up. so we waited to see if he was going to show up. >> he might have thought governor crist wasn't going to show up, but he did. and didn't anyone from the governor's staff see this and realize how terrible it looked, that the governor wasn't out there? seems like governor scott could use a fan today, because he's sure taking some heat for that image. joining me now is dana millbank of "the washington post." dana, thanks for coming on tonight. i know the tv lights can be a little hot. regardless of what the rules say, doesn't it look like scott lost his cool? >> yeah, it looked like he got a little hot under the collar

there, reverend. and it is a little corny, i suppose -- >> wait a minute, dana, what do you have there on the desk? >> i have a fan out here now, because you ask the tough questions, reverend, and i don't want anybody to see me sweat. so i'm taking a page out of charlie crist's book. you know, anybody's who's studied political science knows about the kennedy-nixon debate, and nixon's perspiring, kennedy looks good and therefore kennedy wins the election. that's how political lore has it. so i can see you might have a dispute over the fan, but there's a time to cease and desist and get out there on the stage and air out your differences, regardless of what the air currents in the room actually are. >> well, you know, unlike scott, i'm going to stay on -- keep going back and forth with you. i've been in a lot of debates. i've never seen this.

fan gate was the front-page news today all across florida. "the miami herald" headlined it, fangate, then debate. tampa bay times said after fan delay, a sharp debate. and the "orlando sentinel" has it as crist, scottrade barbs after a fan flap nearly derails debate. are those the headlines they want to see? >> no, and it doesn't matter what happened in the rest of the debate after you have a silly episode like that. rick scott has battled fairly low popularity and charlie crist has had a reincarnation now that he's a democrat. all you need in the last couple weeks is a slip-up. whatever the reason was, did he not know crist was out there, particularly the way the moderators have it, it may be,

the governor looks peevish and silly. >> corey gardner, he got pushed last night for his support on measures which could ban abortions and some forms of birth control. watch this. >> it would seem that a charitable trerppingz would be that you have a difficult time admitting when you're wrong and a less charitable interpretation is that you're not telling us the truth. which is it? >> again, i do not support the personhood amendment. it's simply a statement that i support life. >> why does no one else think that? >> i have answers this question multiple times. >> people who agree with you on the issue of life think you're wrong about how you're describing the bill. >> the bill that you're talking about is simply a statement that i support life. >> what do you make of that exchange, dana? >> i make of that that corey gardner is not interested in

answering the question. he represented a conservative house district where he was taking a fairly extreme position on personhood, on abortion, on life. now he's running to be the senator in colorado, which is very much a purple state, and he's -- what he's trying to do is walk away from the position without saying he's walking away from the position. so you see a lot of these tea party characters who came in, in 2010, and around that time, trying to rise up through the ranks now, and they need to leave behind some of the rougher edges. corey gardner is not known for his eloquence and he did not handle that terribly well. he's doing well in the race there, that's not necessarily a full fangate that's going to derail him. >> dana, i'm going to have to leave it there. dana millbank and your fan, thank you for your time tonight. >> stay cool, reverend. and president obama is in the oval office meeting with top members of his ebola response team.

we expect to get comments from him shortly. we'll bring that to you just as soon as they come in. coming up, is the fear justified? are we seeing ebola hysteria, or is it fair to panic? "conversation nation" is next. ae bit skeptical. what they do actually is rocket science. but at ge capital we also bring expertise from across ge, like lean process engineers we asked who does what, when, where, and why that step first? ideas for improvement started pouring out. with a little help from us, they actually doubled their output speed. if you just need a loan, just call a bank. at ge capital, we're builders. and what we know... can help you grow.

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joining us tonight, msnbc's krystal ball, legal analyst, midwin charles, and msnbc contributor sam seared. thanks for being here. >> thanks for having us, rev. >> first topic, the ebola fear factor. now, obviously, it's a serious issue, but is america crossing the line from safety to hysteria? two students from nigeria were just rejected from a texas college because, quote, navarro college is not accepting international students from countries with confirmed ebola cases. one right-wing website published this photo of a traveler dressed in full hazmat suit, waiting to catch a flight in d.c. >> and check out what they're talking with over at fox news. >> 58% of americans say they think things in the world are going, quote, to hell in a hand

basket. that was the question. 58% said absolutely. >> krystal, has the concern krfd into hysteria? >> in certain corners, as evidenced by the ideas you just pulled up. the idea of not accepting students from countries that now have ebola. would that now include the united states by any chance in that list? one of the problems we've had frankly is the senate due to opposition from the nra hasn't been able to confirm a surgeon general. so we don't have one trusted voice to tell us what fact and fiction really is. we have had hysteria and concern over things which really aren't a risk or a threat. that doesn't mean we shouldn't take ebola seriously, but the much bigger problem is in west africa, where we should be focusing our resources and where we should have been from the start. >> or maybe should have been

focusing resources. >> that's right. >> there's a lot of value on the right to be promoting this narrative that the world is going to hell in a hand basket in the run-up to the election. i think we know who the administration is. we know who ostensibly is running the cdc. so i think there's a lot of value there and i think that's driving a lot of this too, frankly. i think there's a lot of people out there who have an agenda and i think there's also just a genuine sort of sense in some news quarters that this is going to sell a little bit if we drum up the hysteria, we'll get more viewers. >> the cdc has sent out conflicting information. when we had the first person come to this country with ebola, the message was, this is never going to happen here. no one else is ever going to get infected. not only have others been infected, but health care workers, people who are on the

front lines, been infected. and there seem to have been many lapses at the hospital in texas. so i think the cdc is caught between a rock and a hard place. they're supposed to put the facts out there, but also ratchet down the fears. we've been getting a mixed message. >> the reality is, too, that the car ride that we all took to get here -- >> we're watching the ambulance move bringing nina pham from the hospital, as they're headed to dallas love field to transport her to nih. go ahead, sam. >> i was just saying, probably the most -- the car ride over here was more likely to cause my death frankly than ebola is. and so, i think the problem largely is just that there's no

perspective. and to a certain extent, we're watching an ambulance transport this patient. on some level, that's more than i think it gives a message that it is something we should all be worried about. of course there's policy implications and what not, but at the end of the day, i think most of us are pretty safe. >> but let me go back to something that sam raised, kriftel, when he talked about the politics of it, blaming this administration and government. isn't it ironic that the circles to don't believe in big government now are saying big government should have been doing more? >> yes, it's very ironic that suddenly republicans are dying to have a czar to handle the ebola crisis, right? they want big government in terms of an ebola czar. they want big government to enforce a travel ban. they want big government to give more money now to the cdc and the nih, which, by the way, i

support. but suddenly when there's a crisis, libertarianism small government doesn't sound so good when you need a coordinated response across the country. >> of course. and i think you make an excellent point. everyone wants small government until it's convenient. i think that's part of the reason why you're seeing this call for a czar and for a sort of coordinated effort. it's like after any national disaster, people want all of a sudden a federal government that is responsive, that is accurate, and that is going to sort of do what they're supposed to do. >> i think also -- and again, we're watching nina pham, that is the ambulance taking nina pham, the first nurse diagnosed with ebola, she's being taken to love field in dallas to be transported to nih. we're watching this as we talk. i think that it goes, what you were saying midwin, i think really people don't want

government when they don't need it. so they want to cut programs and other things that they don't need. but when they feel there's a threat, government should have done something to protect me. >> that's right. and you have to ask yourself, how could government have done something to protect you if the budgets were cut for some of these agencies? so you can't have it both ways. >> that's right. >> this is a great example of how the free market is not going to solve, you know, every type of problem. it just has not been profitable enough for any corporation or company to develop an ebola vaccine or some type of treatment in the past at an accelerated rate because it hasn't been profitable enough. so that's why you need something like nih funding, for research and development, et cetera. this is one of those times where reality runs into libertarian ideology. and libertarian ideology loses. >> again, we're watching nina

pham as she's being transported to love field in dallas, headed to a special isolation unit at the nih. she'll be flown there from love field and head to maryland, again, to a special isolation unit at nih in maryland. krystal, on the point that sam was making, it's also been said on this show tonight, that had resources not been cut, we may have had the research that would have already led to some kind of vaccine for this. >> that has been -- public health officials have said that's a real possibility. if we had more funding, we could have had a vaccine. it's not just about ebola. it's about government and our priorities and our responsibilities overseas.

>> i'm going to have to leave it there. thank you all for your time tonight. >> thanks, ref. more on this breaking news ahead. so i can reach ally bank 24/7, but there are no branches? 24/7 it's just i'm a little reluctant to try new things. what's wrong with trying new things? feel that in your muscles? yeah... i do... try a new way to bank, where no branches equals great rates.

the ultimate arena for business. hour after hour of diving deep, touching base, and putting ducks in rows. the only problem with conference calls: eventually they have to end. unless you have the comcast business voiceedge mobile app. it lets you switch seamlessly from your desk phone to your mobile with no interruptions. i've never felt so alive. get the future of phone and the phones are free. comcast business. built for business. >> breaki in ing news right now. nurse nina pham is being moved to the dallas airport where she'll fly to an nih facility in maryland for treatment. earlier we saw hospital workers gathering outside the hospital to cheer her on and lend their

support. these are live pictures from love field where she'll board a plane for the trip to maryland. we're also awaiting comment from president obama after his ebola meeting. more on all of that ahead. [laughs] when we're having this much fun, why quit? and bounty has no quit in it either. watch how one sheet of bounty keeps working, while their two sheets, just quit. bounty, the no-quit picker-upper. come on!

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>>because i make the best chicken noodle soup because i make the best chicken noodle soup for every way you make chicken noodle soup, make it delicious with swanson® moments ago, these are hospital workers cheering on miss pham, nina pham being transported to love field in dallas, headed to maryland, to nih. and that's what it really is about, showing love and concern for those that now are fighting this ebola virus. that is what we should focus on. how do we solve it? how do we deal with it? this is not a time for panic, but it is a time for action. not a time for the blame game, but a time for sober reflection on what we could do.

this is not about our divisions. ebola is not going to check republicans or democrats, western africans or eastern europeans. we all must rise above our differences and our divisions and unite to contain this problem. thanks for watching. i'm al sharpton. "hardball" starts right now. ebola steals the election. it's not only topic a, it's topic a to z. let's play "hardball." ♪ ♪ good evening, i'm chris matthews in washington, which is now ground zero for the ebola fear. it's now official, ebola is now the number one focus in the nation's capital, as well as the rest of the country where now it's the most