we can't close our eyes to this desperate need overseas. we can't just close our borders. there are many ways to help, and you can reach out to those aid groups on the screen. to find out what you can do. it's a human tragedy, so it's our business. thanks for watching. i'm al sharpton. have a great weekend. "hardball" starts right now. it's friday night in america, and this is "hardball." ♪ ♪ good evening, i'm chris matthews in washington. a high school freshman opens fire in a school cafeteria, shooting a table full of his friends, then himself. a self-radicalized muslim convert attacks four rookie

policemen in new york with a hatch hatchet. an american doctor back from west africa becomes this country's fourth person diagnosed here with ebola. it's friday night, october 24th, a week before the elections. we're going to our friday night roundtable to try to put it all together, if we can and how it's coming together in the minds and psyches of our fellow citizens, if that's even possible. we start with the latest news from marysville, washington. a reporter from the seattle times out there joins us now by phone. jennifer, thank you. you know, we're trying to get a fix on who did the shooting today. can you tell us about the young person who did it? >> reporter: yes, we've been told his name is jaylen fryberg. he's about 14 years old, from the tribes reservation up in marysville. from what we understand from our sources, he went into the cafeteria, around 10:45 this morning and opened fire. he shot and killed a young girl,

a girl who we're reporting, rejected him for a date. >> what about the other four people that were rounded? are they in critical care, or situations now? how are they doing in terms of life support? >> reporter: we have two children still at providence medical center in dire condition. two others have been transported to seattle to a trauma center. one of them shares the same last name as mr. fryberg, and we've heard is a relation, but we're not certain how. >> i'm looking at these rather rough tweets that came out of mr. fryberg, the young boy. it looked like there was a lot going on in this young guy's life. is it too early to figure out what motivated this pulling a gun on people he knew well, including the girl he was after, it seems. this is an amazing eruption of passion and anger and violence. yet we have scant information about what might have caused it. >> we're not sure. mr. fryberg, it seems, had

everything going for him. he was elected to the homecoming court last week. he was a star football player. very popular young man, well known in the community. his parents, very, very well known. his mother was on the school board. his parents were members of the tribe, very well known family. the fryberg family is very well known in marysville. what led him to do this? we understand a girl rejected him for a date. if you look on his twitter feed, there was a lot of anger in the last few days. >> is she the one that was killed? >> yes, there is a girl who was 14 who was killed. >> let me ask you about the ethnic factor. what about the racial aspects of this story? do we know anything yet? >> reporter: i don't think we know anything about the racial aspect. mr. fryberg is a native american. this community is a school of 2,000. there's many students who come from the reservation that go to school there. there's many, many students who don't live on the reservation who go there. mr. fryberg, from what we

understand was a well known, popular kid, and we're not sure, other than maybe just simply a girl who rejected him, was the reason for this. >> that happens all the time, but this kind of violence is rarely the reaction. anyway, thanks so much. we'll know more in the days ahead. jennifer, thank you for that spot reporting. >> thank you. joining me now, psychology jeff gardere and security expert anthony roman. jeff, what does this tell you when you see a case like this? >> well, certainly a lot of rage going on. and even though this young man is known to have been very popular, a lot of that may have been a facade for maybe a very unstable personality. but one thing it does tell us, and i know you know this, it begins to break the mold of what we used to see of school shooters, being isolated, being perhaps bullied. we don't know whether that has something to do with it, but basically people who are disaffected with severe mental illness, and this seems to be breaking all of those profiles,

unless there's a lot we don't know and i'm sure there's a lot we don't know as to what may have been brewing in this young man's mind and in his life with this young lady. >> from what we know of suicide, and this was basically a part of it, a suicidal attempt here, because we've seen evidence he may have been saying goodbye to people and all that, but i'm trying to figure out here, i've always been told that suicide doesn't come from a depressed reality, as much as it comes from a shocking change in your circumstances. could the young girl's rejection at the age of a freshman in high school be sufficient a motive to kill her and others and yourself? >> i think it might add to the drama that someone with an unstable personality is going through. because, again, you're absolutely right. if everything is happening in a very calm, smooth way for this individual, and all of a sudden that's ruptured by perhaps a young woman who scorns him, or something in his life isn't following what he's used to

having, as far as an orderly progression, or some sort of a progress in his life, then that can cause him to go over the edge, especially if this is someone, again, with a fragile personality, that we just didn't know was that ill. >> we all grew up with richard corey about the guy who had everything going for him, then goes and shoots himself. do you think the subject and the object are very different? we don't know what a person's feeling based on being freshman class prince or whatever he was. and playing on the football team. which normally would be the signs of happiness and success and a good social life. but we don't know, do we, what he was thinking, feeling, living? jeff? >> oh, well, yes. absolutely. i believe this was an individual who very much had a facade. and perhaps being this, you know, being in the student

court, being the prince, named to the fumble team and so on, has a lot to do with covering up a lot of feelings and using that in many ways to keep a structure in a life that may be falling apart. and so when the seams begin to show, when the public begins to see that maybe all of this is a mirage, then that person may feel suicidal, may feel that self-doubt. the self-esteem is crushed and it may push them over the edge. the other thing is, we just don't know whether he had mental health issues. was he on any psychiatric meds, or antidepressants. there's a lot we don't know. as those pieces come together, we'll begin to build the real profile of this individual. >> dr. jeff gardere, thank you for joining us. let's go to anthony roman. give me a sense now.

it seems like schools don't have metal detectors and i'm told you can't have one without somebody standing there, dealing with a kid who comes in with a gun and has to take it off them, tell them to go away, or what. is there any way to keep guns out of school cafeterias, to be blunt? >> there isn't a 100% method of protecting any facility or preventing guns from entering the facility. what you do is create layers of deterrents. you make it more difficult for the individuals. but more importantly than the physical security in this particular circumstance, is understanding the young man who was suffering these problems. clearly, based on some information we've developed on our way to the studio, it appears that the young man was suffering emotionally and that he had expressed that to many of his friends and colleagues. and it should have been self-evident that he was having some serious problems at that

time. if the schools would invest not only in upgrading security to a more professional level, one layer of deterrent, and then another layer of deterrent is the mental health issue, in which schools should reinvest in social workers, in peer group leadership programs, in physicians, psychiatrists and psychologists who can help these children during times of stress. they don't have to wait until there's stress. they can run in counter groups and discussion groups in which the kids deal with everyday problems, so they diffuse and learn to manage their problems as time goes on. and as they progress during their formative years. >> we never had any of this stuff growing up. we never had counsellors and shrinks hanging around the campus. you went to school, you got your

grades, you played sports, or in the band like i did and you went home. which schools have the money to have the groups you're talking about, the professionals, the psychologists, the social psychologists, the psychiatry that you're describing as necessary to prevent this incident? how many schools have that kind of money? >> they don't have the money. as a matter of fact, all of the programs are being cut down. >> i know. >> i've had experience in the school systems in which children that i know need help in the formative years, in elementary school. and without help, some of these children would suffer some very serious problems in the future. it becomes self-evident in the elementary schools. so i think, at this juncture, we have to examine how high a cost is too high? how many bodies in schools are too many before we -- >> i am telling you, there's not a person watching right now,

that wasn't heart-sick over a romance starting around 12. you've been through it, i've been through it, the girl doesn't like you, the one you like, the boy doesn't like you, the one you like, this is life. it's called growing up. how do you separate the normal romantic rejections, the unrequited love, we call it. how do you separate that from a felony, a mass shooting that's about to occur? >> well, that is not always guaranteed that one can be able to do that. but it's training the children who are not having that kind of training in the normal family environment, to deal with the emotions and to deal with them properly, so they can mature in a proper way. in addition to that, coupling in school security, as you say. do you need, you know, metal detectors as you walk into every school? that's very ob trucive and we don't really want to see those in the school. but if we have security guards

and there are security guards in high schools -- in most high schools today. if we offer them additional training in how to spot kids with problems. these security guards often know the children on a different level than the teachers do and can often spot the kids that are having trouble. and can act as a big brother or big sister in circumstances like this, and pre-empt some of the problems themselves. so perhaps we can use some of the resources we have in place today, with a little bit of an investment, and a little bit more training for those security guards. >> thanks so much for coming on this friday night. anthony roman, what a night this has been. when we come back, the other big stories, none of them good. ebola in new york city. we'll find out how the virus geths spread. and the new rules put in effect today after this happened. also, president obama meets the texas nurse, nina pham, who's been declared ebola-free. that is good news. and this is "hardball." hey tony, dad- go wide!

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we're coming back with new information on the fight against ebola in this country, the usa. and the latest on the doctor in new york, who contracted the deadly disease when he was over working and helping people in west africa. "hardball," back after this. growth is gratifying. goal is to grow. gotta get greater growth. i just talked to ups. they got expert advise, special discounts, new technologies. like smart pick ups. they'll only show up when you print a label and it's automatic. we save time and money. time? money? time and money. awesome. awesome! awesome! awesome! awesome! (all) awesome! i love logistics.

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and often even more. it's reliable. just like kung pao fish. thank you, ping. reliably fast internet starts at $89.95 a month. comcast business. built for business. >> this illness and this whole experience has been very stressful and challenging for me and for my family. although i no longer have ebola, i know that it may be a while before i have my strength back. so with gratitude and respect for everyone concerned, i asked for my privacy and for my family's privacy to be respected as i return to texas and try to get back to a normal life and reunite with my dog bentley. >> tonight that was nurse nina pham who contracted ebola after caring for ebola patient thomas eric duncan, left the national

institutes of health in bethesda, and went to the oval office and met with president obama. meanwhile, in new york, a doctor diagnosed with ebola in bellevue hospital in new york city. mayor bill de blasio rode the subway this morning, encouraging new yorkers to not be afraid. late today, a mandatory two-minute-day quaranti21 day quarantine for passengers arriving from west africa. >> we believe it's appropriate to increase the current screening procedures for people coming from affected countries. from the current cdc screening procedures. we believe it is in the state of new york and state of new jersey's legal rights to control access to their borders. we will establish an interview and screening process to determine an individual's risk

level, by considering the geographic area of origin, and the level of exposure to the virus. depending on the risk level, a person could require mandatory, 21-day quarantine, or at a government regulated facility. >> joining me now, dr. nina radcliffe. thank you for joining us. i guess the questions that people have now, they have real questions about the authority of anyone to tell us how you can get it and how you can't. is it absolutely iron-clad we know how you get ebola? >> yes, it is. what we know is by science, is that it can only be contracted by bodily fluids. fec feces, vomit, blood, and saliva. >> what about somebody sneeding next to you on the subway. was he able to transmit it by sneezing? >> two things. first of all, his viral counts were probably very low. and he probably was not having

the symptoms of coughing and sneezing. it's not an airborne disease. yes, although it possible to transmit it by saliva, at this time, it is unlikely. >> so what do you do if you're on a plane or subway who is sneezing? assume they have the cold or flu? >> we know it's a minimal risk of getting ebola because you're on the subway, you're touching this person's bowling ball, or if you're going to the grocery store. it's a very minimal risk at this time. >> why all the coverage tonight of the movement by new yorkers going around on the route this fellow took, over to brooklyn to bowl, he took three different subway lines, all listed in this morning's washington post. why so much information on the tick tock here if he couldn't have transmitted it during that time? are we being overzealous? >> we need to understand while people don't have symptoms, they're not contagious. this person posed a minimal risk

of committing other people. he was not vomiting. he was not having diarrhea. he did not have a high viral count. we need to remember that and focus on the science, and not the fear of this. this is not an airborne disease. >> thank you very much. people wanted to hear that. let's bring in our roundtable tonight. it's friday night, we'll have the roundtable. jonathan allen, washington bureau chief for bloomberg. emily, a reporter at the national journal. and also politics editor at usa today. start with jonathan here and this question of ebola. we now have a czar. his name is ron klain. most of us know him. you can call him an operative, if you want to be dismissive. he's a lot more than that. a public servant, comes in when he's needed. tried to win the recount in florida, lost it to a strong opponent, jim baker. but he's reliable. is he going to be a leader or a flag, someone that speaks the language that someone else wants him to speak? >> probably a little bit of

both. he's highly regarded inside the white house. he's been mentioned as a possible white house chief of staff in the past and this may be a stepping stone to that for him. but i also think he's somebody who's a lot better at articulating what the administration wants out there as a message, than some of the people that have been delivering it so far, including dr. frieden at the cdc whose had some difficulty doing that. >> will he have the ability to change the way the government does things, or make a better case afor the way they're alreay doing it? will he be a fixer? >> the role is both. if he sees things to fix, he'll have the power to do it, but also to articulate a little better. this white house is terrible with messaging. >> one of the problems is organization. i've criticized -- okay, i'm traditional. there's two ways to run a white house. the kennedy method, calling up

anybody to find out what's going on. then the reagan method, a strong chief of staff who cracks the whip, and everybody knows their job and who their boss is. which works here? i'm waiting to clarify which way obama does things. is there a chain of command? a president reaching out and checking with people? >> it's something that as we've watched this ebola crisis unfold, it's been clear that's not really present. you've seen there's been questions about what's going on where, about who knows what at what time? obviously in dallas, we saw some of those issues coming to light. so now the idea that you do have somebody who's going to be a point person, who is going to be the person who theoretically all this is going to go through, should really help kind of keep that response more -- >> does he have the bureaucratic clout to be the boss? how many people working on your side to get something done, it

seems like he's dependent on susan rice. does he have his own team, or is he just a fixture attached to all that team work? >> when obama appoints you to run this thing and he wants him to run this thing. we've all done this in your newsroom. one editor to do the ebola coverage, so it's not coming out of everywhere. obama is really the prime minister spokesperson for the moment on ebola. he's taken the lead, he's doing the talking. >> who's in charge of making sure there's no more screw-ups? the president has been accused again today of always being the witness to something that just went wrong, rather than the chief of government. >> ron klain is the guy. >> he will be the boss? >> get it ordered, get it in line and get everybody on the phone together to make sure we're not making the same mistakes. >> remember the white house chief of staff, dennis mcdonagh, a foreign policy guy, national

security guy. he's not steeped in how the domestic agencies work together. poddestin may be that guy, but he's leaving. you bring in klain, has a lot of experience in government, somebody you're trying to possibly move into that chief of staff job. >> do you think obama is ready to change and become a real chief executive, not just a good speech giver, but actually accept the job of running the u.s. government? is he ready to take that job on every day, 24/7, i'm the guy running this place? >> i think he needs to be. we've seen really in the last year, there have been a whole host, as republicans point out, a whole host of issues on which he hasn't been doing that. so if he wants to make his presidency something to talk about, something to look up to, he needs to do that in his last two years. >> do presidents do that? do they run the cdc? are they the ones --

>> they run the government of the united states and everybody wants to them. there's only one person we goat to vote on, him. if we don't like the government, we don't like him. who's running the health care system for the president right now? anybody know the name of this person? because when he had the rollout problem, we kept saying, it's the coo, the cmm of the hhs and i don't see that person too often. you would think there would be somebody he appointed, the day he got the bill passed, i want this person talking to me, so when the rollout comes, we know it's going to work. >> and with something like ebola too, there's just not having good information, not having streamlined information. it leads people to panic. that's something that i think clearly the white house by bringing in ron klain, recognized is happening. when you have an issue that people are talking about, worried about, you have to have that kind of response. >> you think the american people believe in this country, when

the government talks about ebola? do you think they buy the fact that it's hard to catch? >> not really. >> not at all. >> why don't they trust him? why don't they trust the government? >> there's been a sufficient stream of things over the past couple years, they're incompetent or lying in a lot of positions. whether it's the nsa leaks, or health care.gov that crashed. you assume the government's doing it, and they're doing it wrong. and there's an industry fueling the message that it's all a conspiracy. it's not just mistakes, they're bad people and it's all obama's fault. so between the fact that the government is operating poorly and that people are paying a lot of money to message that it's all obama's fault, it's easier to believe they're incompetent. >> isn't the scary thing not whether it's incompetence or lying, but both? that there's some great combination here. >> this isn't about right-wing and left-wing and the usual fights we have around here. it's about getting something

done right. anyway, thank you. we'll be back with more of you guys. i like your open minds. roundtable is coming back. from ebola to the school shootings and the terror presence, what effect are these having on the voting electorate, these cross winds? i can't believe it's going to help the incumbents, this is "hardball," a place for politics. this is "titanfall," the first multi-player game built and run on microsoft azure. empowering gamers around the world to interact in ways they never thought possible. this cloud turns data into excitement. this is the microsoft cloud.

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americans. ebola is also in new york. the canadian parliament has been besieged by an extremist, and isis continues its reign of terror across the middle east. we're 11 days from the elections. we're back with the roundtable. paul, how do you vote today if you're one of the mysterious 4 to 12% undecided? >> i don't know. you've just depressed me. i want to go out and have a beer. >> that means 12% haven't made up their mind. what will they do with all of this in their head? >> the most important question we look at, is the country on the right track, or the wrong track? clearly at this moment -- >> who would say right track? >> nobody would say right track. >> there's always someone. >> looks good to me. >> it's like the guy who liked clinton more after monica. remember that? >> that's a real problem for anybody with a d next to their name. it has to be a problem.

president is polling 30% approval, how do you get 50% of the people to vote for you. >> if you're republican, do you like the way things are going? scott walker, in wisconsin, likes the way it's going. >> it's very good for republicans running for senate and house right now. people are afraid right now. and it doesn't look like the president's leading in the direction they want him to. the big statistic is economics and it's the stagnant waging. it's not necessarily people think the economy is going terribly, but it's not going well for them. democrats don't have the ability to say, look what we've done for you, or here's the hope you can have -- >> isn't the market back up today? >> market is up, but talk about people's paychecks. same since before the recession. >> this isn't just psycho babble. according to a poll just out, there number of people who think

things are out of control is 64%. it's an amazing thing. >> that's something where people would have given obama the benefit of the doubt on one thing, or on two things. but when you have foreign policy crises going on, you have terrorism, you have, as you pointed out, things happening here in the united states, all of that contributes to a place in which voters don't feel safe. they feel like they don't know what's coming next. and that is not the environment you want to be in if you are president obama, or one of his allies right now. >> let me focus on you for a second now. suppose you're president of the united states and you go to bed at night, you have to have in your consciousness, what happened in canada, what happened in new york city, the cops who got attacked with a hatchet, the ebola is here, and the school psychology of kids with dating and high school going horribly lethal, you have to put that in your head and say, what am i doing to lead

this country? and there's a war going on in isis, all the allies, the enemies you have to deal with, everything from health care toic maing obamacare work. how does one person run that world? like obama? especially a college professor, a law professor, really. how does he do this? >> i don't have any insight into how somebody could handle all of those things at once. i think that's the problem. people think that he can't. people think -- >> who can? what human being is capable of that? >> i don't know. >> i think this is going to be the argument that's hard for a lot of 2016 candidates, whether you're talking about rand paul, possibly ted cruz, elizabeth warren who is opening the doors -- >> none of them are executives. >> no, some are first-term senators. some are saying give me a shot, i think the american public will say, we just tried this and those folks are not good at administering. >> but it also speaks to, you

have to be insane to want the job. >> or you vet the other people who might get it? they look at that and say, i can do that. >> hillary clinton if she runs, she'll bring the 3:00 phone call back and say -- [ all speak at once ] >> i know one thing we have. the job description of every new president is the failure of the previous one. george w. was considered not too bright, made big mistakes, pushed around by cheney. we wanted a president who was smarter, academic, read books. thought that was a good way to go. but we didn't ask other things. up next, joni ernst, the republican running for the senate in iowa is pushing second amendment remedy, personhood, and said states is -- she's a radical candidate disguised as a hog castrator. you're watching "hardball," a place for politics. in a race,

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here's what's happening. authorities say remains have been identified as those of hannah graham. the remains were found less than ten miles from where the 18-year-old was last seen in mid september. a suspect is in custody following an intense manhunt in california. authorities say a gunman shot a deputy, then fled. the same suspect allegedly shot two other people. we've learned a second officer has died. back to "hardball." ♪ ♪ >> back to "hardball." back to the roundtable. let's talk politics tonight.

a barn burner in iowa where republicans have pulled a rabbit out of the hat in joni ernst. she's managed to outrun a litany of comments she made before that border on lunacy. they dug up video of her saying remarkable things about the second amendment. she wants to arrest public officials for implementing the affordable care act. she's pushed for laws banning abortions. and the list goes on. by the way, this is iowa, a state that president obama carried twice. right now, ernst is up by two points against democrat bruce braley. the margin of error there is 3. back with our panel. who wants to take this on? i think ernst can win. but i'm not sure the voters appreciate who she is. >> i think some of those ideas are not as fringey as we think.

the idea of carrying my gun, because i don't trust the government because they might try to take my gun. >> how would you use the gun? >> people are afraid, they don't think anybody's in charge. it makes sense to carry a gun. >> how would you use the gun? >> you'd shoot them. that's not as fringey an idea. there are people in america who think that's not unreasonable. >> so if you don't like the tax law, if you don't like obamacare, you pull your gun? >> how far do you take it? that's the question. >> pulling your gun because you don't like obamacare, that's crazy. but she's a much better candidate, when she said things that are on the fringe -- >> has she been sculpted by smart consultants? >> yes, absolutely. they figured out how to get her talking in a way that's approachable. that hog castration ad you were talking about before, got her on the map, helped her get through the primary and now what you're

seeing from her is very positive, standing in a pig pen in the last ad i saw, basically saying, i can clean up washington like i can -- >> how does she get past the second amendment remedy things, where you say you're going to use your gun if you don't like the feds. it killed sharon engel in nevada. >> joni ernst has been a far stronger candidate. she's somebody who has this profile of, she'd be the first female elected senator from iowa. she's a combat veteran. she's a mom, she's got all these things that she really has. a year ago we were talking about republicans have nobody to run in iowa. now we're saying, okay, they have someone with a legitimate image and profile that slehe's created in a state that serves her well. >> what do you do if you're a voter? may be okay in certain parts of eastern idaho.

what do you do if you see the woman? she's attractive, you like the way she speaks. then you read the articles about what she's said in the past? do you project the nice parts that you see in the ads? or do you say if she's talking like that when nobody's watching, she may vote like that when whshe gets to the senate. >> people want to go and vote for somebody that reminds them of themselves, that makes them feel comfortable. and braley, i honestly, you're right, he's not as radical, dramatic. he's also not particularly inspiring. he doesn't make people go, i can't wait to vote for braley. i think she has the advantage that people can walk into the polling booth and say, i like that woman. maybe she's kooky, but i like that woman. >> chuck todd got a hold of her and talked about her fringe past. let's listen. >> very early when you were running for senate, personhood

came up, abortion, you talked about impeachment. you walked them all back. what should voters now take away from that? you took some of those positions and then you say, maybe i didn't mean to take that, i'm not there, it's a statement of principle. what should voters take away from that? >> a lot of those issues weren't issues that were pushed by me. they were questioned that were asked by media. >> in this case, it was conservative groups getting you to sign on. >> well, and didn't necessarily sign on to pledges that dealt with those issues. >> that was reagan talking there. he could do the same thing. he could say that's the way they got asked the question. he was untouchable. >> she sounded like a united states senator, pointing to the media. she's going to be the prototype. she wins. you're figure to see joni ernst clones run by senate republicans for years and years. >> this is why they don't want

mainstream or liberal moderators at their dwabez. they've accused them of bringing up questions about the origins of the earth and those kinds of things. >> that answer was not most politically savvy. >> pretty good, though. >> she could have said, i misspoke, or she could have said i still believe some of that stuff. but she doesn't say any of that. >> there you go. the roundtable is sticking with us. look who's back in the headlines this week. monica lewinsky, i think she has a good case on this one. today "the washington post" revealed now details about the harsh treatment she got when she was ambushed by federal prosecutors, threats of prison time of 26 years if she didn't talk. this is "hardball," a place for politics.

>> i'm going to be hosting a live twitter chat on monday at 1:00 p.m. eastern. tweet me your questions about the mid terms and all the close races using the hash tag msnbc vote. again, 1:00 p.m. eastern on monday. we'll be right back. mormal snap jebby rolban jebby deetle flosh. [laughter] eh. now's the time to get in the loop. just look for our fall tv picks with xfinity on demand. quickly find the season's hottest shows, with a handpicked collection all in one place. only from xfinity.

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monicas lewinsky said she was treated roughly by the f.b.i. one day? a suburban mall. it was recently obtained by the washington post. it backs up lewinsky's claims of mistreatment. >> well, back now with john,

emily and paul. i was not a big believer in the early claim this week from ms. lewinsky that she was a victim of blah, blah, blah society and whatnot. but ken star's troopers, when they grabbed her, they set her up by having linda tripp say we're having lunch. say if you're trying to get a lawyer, your witness will not be valuable enough to get you out of prison. keep you out of prison. really rough treatment. >> every criminal prosecution is coercion. they were coercing this woman to testify. it was meant to be an unpleasant experience. they clearly went over the line. they said if you go to your lawyer, you ool lose your immunity. >> the whoite house counsel was her lawyer in about 10 seconds had she been able to make a phone call. >> remember '98? you guys all know what happened.

'98, the public thought clin to did something wrong. but in a weird way, they make clinton look innocent, while he wasn't innocent. they flipped it. this may help hillary clinton when she runs for president. >> certainly points in that direction, particularly, as you say, as the clintons are back very perpetually in the public eye these days. it's something, since then, we have seen his public approval ratings slowly climb back up. he's one of the most popular, in-dand politicians in the country. something like this can only add to that. to show that there were further overreaches and things that were done wrong on the opposition side. >> you have a feature on this show, side show. and monica lewinsky is a sad

side show. the only way she can get along in society is by this scandal that's old enough to drive by now. it's probably like 16 years old. it's sad what happened to her. she's clearly taken advantage of by the president of the united states. >> is she taking advantage of it, too? >> of course, yes. people say intern and you think 16-year-old. i think she was 22 or 24 something like that. >> i had two jobs on capitol hill that day. i think i was working 20 hours a day. >> she shouldn't keep subjecting herself to the public. >> this is the right point, exactly. we're going to hear a lot more about this. >> is this good for the clintons? >> i honestly think it is. the clintons are able to say we're done with this. we've moved passed it. and it becomes more of a side show. the first time she appears, it becomes a big news story for us.

>> she should have a cup of coffee with monica and get passed this. >> what are you crazy? >> no, i'm normal. moving on, get it behind us. any i want, jonathan allen, thank you. emily shultise, when we return, let me finish with jonie ernst mainstreaming as a hard core republican. even if you're treating your crohn's disease or ulcerative colitis, an occasional flare may be a sign of damaging inflammation. and if you ignore the signs, the more debilitating your symptoms could become. learn more about the role damaging inflammation may be playing in your symptoms with the expert advice tool at crohnsandcolitis.com. and then speak with your gastroenterologist. with the expert advice tool at crohnsandcolitis.com. wouldn't it be great if hiring plumbers, carpenters shopping online is as easy as it gets.

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let me finish tonight with this. there are few more things frightening in this world than a masquerade. i give you the case of jonie earnst. she proclaimd herself able to blind us to her more forbidding aspects. like the bank robber who wears the nixon mask that becomes the only thing memorable to the eyewitness. jonie ernst was able to present herself to iowa voters as simply the hog kas traitors. who could think about anything else to say about her? who had anything to ask about her after that introduction. well, we should have asked. more to the point we should have remembered. ernst is the one who said two years ago u she would use her gun against the u.s. government if it did something that

infringed on her rights. she's out is there on tape now using her second amendment rights to open fire on a government official doing something that she doesn't like. they have the right to arrest federal officials who atempatteo carry out the law. iowa need not worry what the united states congress decides. if the state doesn't like a law passed by congress, it merely has to arrest any government official tasked to carry it out. nullification is what it's called. they can simply ignore, reject, defie what the national government decides. if they elect ernst, that's their el call. if they elect her while ignoring their deepest political believes, they are failing to stick up for their state, for their coup tri. think of the cold-blooded scam

that's being perpetrated here. this masquerading of the guys who are more than merely quirk kill. that's "hardball." >> tonight, we are "all in." a school shooting outside of seattle leaves at least two day including the gunmen, with three others in critical condition. tonight, we'll go live to seattle for the very latest. plus. >> we're fully prepared to handle ebola. >> how the biggest city in america spent months to prepare for this moment. the first confirmed case of ebola in new york city. we are live at bellevue hospital. "all in" starts right now. >> good evening from new york. i'm chris hayes and i'm standing here outside bellevue hospital where chris spencer is