>> ari, our man in texas. where are the cowboy boots? >> not yet. i didn't bring any back. >> thank you, ari. chris hayes is, as you know, up next. "hardball" starts right now. tonight, two title fights, christie versus obama. and hillary clinton versus elizabeth warren. let's play "hardball." ♪ ♪ good evening, i'm chris matthews in washington. p.t. barnum, the guy who created the greatest show on earth, knew how to fill the tent. if you want a crowd, start a fight. he put his money where his mouth was. he had his men start brawling on street corners, when the crowd gathered, they'd hand out flyers that the circus was coming to town. meet chris christie, who knows how to start a fight, telling the president he doesn't know how to conduct his business. itching to get into the center ripping, he's declared war on

president obama. and the white house's don't panic approach to the handling the ebola crisis. the president meanwhile is taking his deliberate approach of logic, listening to the experts and all the doctors at the cdc and nih. christie is selling something different. he wants to put up a wall around west africa, and after two cases of ebola transmitted in the u.s., he wants to quarantine every single health worker coming back from there. what he have here is not a failure to communicate, but a street corner brawl. since christie ordered the quarantine, he's ratcheted up the macho. look how he barks at the press? >> no, i don't, i have no reason to talk to you. >> can you explain the quarantine, how that will work? >> you're in your home and you're quarantined. [ laughter and applause ]

>> i know at times -- i know at times -- i heard your question. i know at times that you all would like to make things a heck of a lot more complicated than they are. >> let me just none this. >> -- but the right side of public opinion? >> no, i'm going to be on the right side of both, ultimately, matt. >> do you have any regrets at the way you handled the ebola situation in your state? >> no. >> today president obama addressed the country from the white house lawn. here he is. >> we got to make sure that those workers who are willing and able to dedicated to go over there in a really tough job, that they're applauded, thanked and supported. that should be our priority. when we see a problem and we see a challenge, then we fix it. we don't just react based on our fears. we react based on facts and judgment.

>> chairman of the rnc back before it was dedicated to black voter suppression. and the washington bureau chief with mother jones. both political analysts. >> that was the best introduction ever. >> it came from here. anyway, mike, i see an interesting thing. chris christie knows how to get in the senate ring. he knows he can bromance the president, whatever he does with obama, it creates a media situation. he's up with the big boys. he's running, saying to us, to hell with you guys. >> i think you're right. he's definitely on the big stage, engaging on the subject. and why? it's because he's listening to folks closer to the ground in the communities who are concerned about this. >> about ebola? >> about ebola, yes. but not so much about ebola, but

about the way the government has walked into this thing. where they've left open a lot of questions. people walked away little bit more concerned about whether or not the cdc is drilling all the way down to local hospitals. whether or not the president has a plan, and this idea of sending health workers there without a plan to deal with their return [ all speak at once ] >> but there's a difference between what obama is saying and what chris christie is responsible for as the governor of his state. that's where he's walking -- >> tell the world now watching what the president said. you have to take your temperature, it's a particular plan -- >> it's a plan based on science, not on fear. no, no, no, no, you had a chance to talk. right now there are seven americans who have contracted ebola. none thankfully are dead and almost all on their way to recovery. only two americans have contracted it here by being in touch with the liberian fellow who died from this. so right now, there's not any scientific basis for what chris christie says. maybe there's an emotional

basis, or fear-based basis, but if that's the way we're going to set policy, playing on people's fears, not on rational policy. >> you think this isn't a football, a political football? >> this is from the same crew who said we wouldn't have any cases of ebola in the united states. >> he said it would be unlikely. >> that's close enough for football. >> anyway, christie criticized dr. anthony fauci at the national institute of health. he said fauci criticized christie's quarantine order. let's watch him go after dr. fauci? >> i think dr. fauci is responding unfortunately as are many people from the cdc, in a real hyperbolic way, because they've been wrong before. and now they're incrementally taking steps towards the policy that we put in effect in new

jersey, and six other states have put in effect and the joint chiefs of staff have put in effect. we're all wrong and they're right. we're trying to be careful here. this is common sense. and the members of the american public believe it's common sense. we're not moving an inch. our policy will not change. >> it did change. he first said that kaci hickox was ill when she wasn't. he then said it would be a 21-day quarantine. and after three days he let her go. why? because he doesn't care about people in maine. he backed off because of pressure. he's not being consistent. but one thing he's being consistent in is the brash way which he hasn't been able to pull off since bridgegate where that arrogance, his version of charm, doesn't serve him well. >> is he back to -- [ all speak at once ] >> yeah, i think it's a little bit back to that. but at the end of the day, i can appreciate where christie's

coming from. >> i want to say something. i'm sorry, michael, finish your thought. >> having served in office i can appreciate where he's coming from. he's got a lot more to be concerned about than -- [ all speak at once ] >> today christie went after nurse kaci hickox who was quarantined in a tent for three days and is threatening to sue him. here's the governor. >> looks like you're going to have to defend this in court. >> whatever. get in line. get sued lots of time in court. get in line. i'm happy to take it on. it's all kinds of malarkey about this. she was inside the hospital, in a controlled area, with access to her cell phone, access to the internet and take-out food from the best restaurants. she was doing just fine. >> the best restaurants in newark. >> that's pretty good. >> what is he thinking about when she talks about her access to the take-out restaurants in newark? >> that means he's connected with real people who are sitting around their table saying she had access to the best restaurants in newark. >> there's the credit card.

>> you put your life on the line and you go to west africa to deal with these people, the most important thing we can do -- >> to contain the disease. >> contain it there. and what you get when you come back and brash treatment like that, and the best take-out in newark. >> i appreciate your sensitivity. but what is the plan to deal with folks when they come back? >> there say plan. >> what is it? >> there's a cdc plan. >> why did they have to take action on their own? >> you've never heard of a government doing something for politics? >> that includes democrats and republican governors -- [ all speak at once ] >> -- picked a fight with doctors at the cdc. this reminds me of groucho marx, fight any man in the house for a dollar. >> we want stricter things than what they have been willing to impose. and now they're incrementally moving towards our position. what's the difference between telling someone who's been a high-risk health care worker

that they can't go into public places, public transportation, and we want them to work from them. what's the difference between that and quarantine? it's because they don't want to admit that they were wrong. i'm sorry about that. >> let me suggest something. politics is about getting on the galloping horse when you get your chance. he sees this as a chance to be tough with the president because that's the only way he's going to win the nomination. >> i don't agree with all of that. i think he's looking at from the perspective of a governor. it's not just about conservatives with their hair up about this. americans have legitimate concerns about this. >> he's mouthing off with everybody. >> and since when has that been a partisan thing with christie? when he mouths off, he mouthing off, reflecting how people feel about stuff. >> but he's wrong. >> he's not wrong. >> he said she was ill, put her in a tent, didn't consult with any policy experts, other than his own expertise?

>> let's take a look at rush -- [ all speak at once ] rush limbaugh doesn't like what he's doing. he's found inside this macho behavior of the governor of new jersey, some sort of caving, as he sees it, to president obama. here's the under water walrus himself, rush-bo. >> we need to quarantine chris christie is what needs to happen here. second election in a row, one week prior to the election, the governor of new jersey ends up arm in arm, hand in hand, in bed with, i don't know how to characterize it, but responding to obama's demands. already cuomo and christie have been forced to cave before obama's onslaught. so it's really clear that obama can act, and he can act fast when it's something that really matters to him.

such as making sure that people who might have ebola aren't cooped up for 21 days. this is unbelievable to me. >> i think what he's mad at is that christie said the nurse had to be there for 21 days. after she showed no signs of the disease -- >> he lead her go to quarantine in maine. one thing that the white house has said, wrong or right, they don't have a lot of control over governors who take these policies. [ all speak at once ] >> you're just making my point, david. the fact that the way christie handled this, when she came back, he had to deal with, verify whether she was symptom attic, once she was asymptomatic, you can go. >> but what about the 21-day quarantine? >> it's not like you're going to sit there for 21 days and no one's going to check on you. >> can we get away from the clinical and back to the political? here's my point.

your party is so run by his hard right, rush baugh being the high priest. he's saying this guy isn't tough enough. [ all speak at once ] >> i don't really think that chris christie is really concerned with what rush limbaugh thinks about him. he's an elected official by the people of his state and he's doing what he thinks a responsible official should do. period. >> is he your candidate? >> i don't have a candidate yet. but he's a good guy and i loved working for him and helping him get elected. >> thank you, david. he's not your candidate. >> no. >> you supported obama, right? >> we're getting to snapping here. thank you both. i'm right about your party. ever since you left, it's been black voter suppression. coming up, another hard right tonight, this one for the heart and soul of the democratic party. what was hillary clinton arguing when she said corporations don't create jobs? i think she had a strong point

there. she is poaching on elizabeth warren territory. the top two democrats in the country going a bit to war here over ideology. this is "hardball," the place for politics. nineteen years ag, "wow, how is there no way to tell the good from the bad?" so we gave people the power of the review. and now angie's list is revolutionizing local service again. you can easily buy and schedule services from top-rated providers. conveniently stay up to date on progress. and effortlessly turn your photos into finished projects with our snapfix app. visit angieslist.com today. ♪ thlook what i got.p.

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we got a big one for you. now back to "hardball." is hillary clinton contending for the democratic left? the ground elizabeth warren has been stomping so hard. here she was stumping for alison lundergan grimes earlier this month. >> our democracy is supposed to work for everyone, not just the privileged few. but more and more you know this, you feel it, you live it. the scales are weighted against working families. >> well, last week, she praised senator al franken for pushing for tough regulation of big banks. friday campaigning for martha coakley up in boston, pushed for raising the minimum wage. no surprise there, but it was the comment she made about jobs that created attention. listen. >> don't let anybody tell you that, um, you know, it's corporations and businesses that create jobs. you know, that old theory,

trickle-down economics, that has been tried, that has failed. it has failed rather spectacularly. you know, one of the things my husband says when people say, what did you bring to washington? he said, i bought arithmetic. >> according to politico, later said the secretary of state meant to talk about tax breaks for corporations in that sentence. a sentiment she's long held. that was the quote from the staffer afterwards. yesterday, mrs. clinton herself sought to clarify the previous comment. she said she shorthanded the point, but meant to say she was against tax breaks for big corporations. that outsourced their jobs or profits overseas. she seems to be embracing elizabeth warren. will it work? the founder of the progressive change campaign committee, is a

columnist for "the washington post". >> i don't want to dilly dally over nuance and everything. it seems to me secretary clinton was taking a tough shot at corporations there, saying they don't deserve tax breaks, where the president is pushing for lower corporate rates if he can plug the loopholes to pay for it. there's a difference between those two. i think hillary clinton is moving closer to your candidate, elizabeth warren. i'm wondering why is she doing it now, ahead of the campaign? >> chris, there's a rising economic populace in america that elizabeth warren has been the personification of. hillary clinton is logging that. before an election, you want to say popular things. elizabeth warren is the most popular and sought-after campaigner for democrats across the country for a reason. that's because her positions are popular and hillary clinton is smart to embrace them. >> my question, that's a good

argument, but what about hillary clinton's goal here? if elizabeth warren doesn't run against her, she walks into the challenge. but can she get a strong mandate out of the election and not squeak in with a divided government? that's what i do. is it smart to go to the democratic left if you're trying to grab the center for the election? is that smart? >> it's not just smart. it would be brilliant if that was her strategy. we'll find out. we've done the polling. red states, purple states, blue states. >> are you surprised that raising benefits wouldn't be popular? that's not a tricky question. that's like saying, do you want to lower taxes? of course you want benefits to go up. they're never enough. >> there are some democrats around the country that are adopting the simpson bowls plan to cut social security and they are down in the polls -- >> that's obvious. that's why simpson bowles was tough to do. let me ask you, i think it's

going to be a battle for the democratic left here. i think hillary clinton, i wouldn't go that direction. i would go to the center. but when you watch the statement he's made lately that she's contending for the votes on the hard left? >> i think what's clear is, if you listen to her on the not quite yet campaign trail, is that she's very aware of the left of the party, not of the threat from elizabeth warren, because i don't think elizabeth warren will run for president, but of the popularity with warren. but it's true at the same time, that this is not a flip flop. if you look at her speeches from 2007, she was talking about issues of income inequality -- >> what about corporations, the language that corporations don't create jobs. >> that was a dumb thing to say. it was badly said. >> why did she say it? >> i think you get a little bit

carried away when you're up there talking and you don't say things in the best way. i think she didn't say it in the best way. she's definitely not elizabeth warren. we've seen this a million times before, chris. when you're running, as she is not quite yet. but when you're running, you're going to put your thumb on the rhetorical scale in one direction and you're going to attack back -- >> let's take a look at elizabeth warren. she was asked today about what she means when she says the political system is rigged. let's listen to senator warren. >> the government works for those who can afford to hire armies of lobbyists and make big campaign contributions. it doesn't work so much for real families. what we have to do, we have to have real people take our government back and make it work for us. >> we know the political world.

parties are identified with the people, with their strongest hostilities, animosities. republicans hate labor unions. where they exist, they hate big government, they hate taxes. democrats don't like big corporations, the power of wall street, the koch brothers, it's smart politics to work that side of the street, to go after those people, right? >> holding big corporations and wall street accountable is more politics. as you're pointing out, not just in a primary, but it's a smart general election strategy. frankly, we could have rand paul or huckabee in the general election and if the party isn't embracing warren's position, fighting for the little guy against the big guy, we could lose. >> tell me how that works. i'm fascinated by that. how does the right-wing snake the democrats as the party of the people? >> i mean, basically by co-opting our message. the reason warren gets record crowds, people want someone to fight for the little guy. some republicans are pretty good

at faking that game. while warren is the real deal. that's why i think hillary clinton might be recognizing this is a smart general election strategy to adopt warren's message. braley in iowa and begich in alaska are winning because they're campaigning warren's message. >> do you see secretary clinton as a political leader of the left? >> in this case, she's a follower of the left. >> the republican national chairman priebus, you know what we think of him. he said hillary's language said she's not ready for primetime. this is priebus, the leader of the black suppression movement. >> she's trying too hard and she's not really good at this stuff. i think that she is bordering on becoming, you know, sort of a caricature of something on the

outside looking in. if you look at what she's trying to emulate. she's trying to be elizabeth warren. i don't know if she was a little off script on that particular moment, but it clearly wasn't natural, and it was certainly awkward. >> that's in slow-mo. it was the thought, i guess. but he's attacking her brain? or her strategy? reince priebus isn't ready for day time, what do you think? >> so there's this critique from the right that hillary clinton has gone way left and is attacking corporations and hates business. and there's a critique from the left side that she's just pretending to be on the left. >> they're both right. >> you are both so smart. let me ask you a question about life. i believe in this. and i think adam believes what he says.

if you are who you are, you are who you are. if people can tell. mitt romney tried to prove he was a crazy right-wing barn burner, whatever the hell, just a business guy who likes making money and knows how to do it. he didn't want to say that. hillary clinton has to be a practical politician, she listens to people, she's friends with people like john mccain. she's not some crazy lefty. >> she's not a crazy lefty. but i think that the flip flopper label is going to turn out to be easier to apply to mitt romney, than to hillary clinton. she's not flip follow-upping -- flip flopping here? >> i think she's shown an ability to evolve smartly on some positions and hopefully he's evolving on the economic -- >> you put the shift in there. we've all evolved on gay marriage, most of us anyway.

great to have you on, with a great point of view. by the way, i just did a tweet thing for like an hour with people. almost half of them were pushing elizabeth warren. so it's real out there. i'm sure you're good to hear that. thank you both. coming up, john stewart takes on chris christie. david and goliath. and david letterman has the remedy for bush fatigue. that's next in the side show. this is "hardball," a place for politics.

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♪ >> ha! back to "hardball." time for the side show. governor chris christie is taking heat for the harsh treatment of nurse kaci hickox after he issued a mandatory quarantine for those returning from west africa. here was john stewart's take on

that last night. >> why does christie have to be such a [ bleep ] about everything? [ cheers and applause ] >> you know, he can't just quarantine. all right, you did the quarantine, but he can't just quarantine someone, he's like, you're a doctor without borders, not anymore, get in the [ bleep ] room! you self-sacrificing angel of mercy piece of [ bleep ]. i got your altruism right here! [ laughter ] >> anyway, a week to go before mid terms, mcconnell isn't taking any chances in his fight. last week he loaned his campaigned nearly 2 million bucks of his own money which is usually a very good sign of a nastily close race. he's put that money to a positive campaign ad, i didn't know there was such a thing, trying to show off his lighter side. >> a lot of people try to tell me how to do my commercials. >> we see you between two

trucks. >> that sounds dangerous. ♪ >> hey, mitch, what about using a talking baby? >> that's been done before. >> you and blood hounds. >> that's not going to work. >> maybe this isn't such a bad idea. i'm mitch mcconnell and i approve this message. >> you saw that. that shot you saw of the senator straddling two trucks say parity of the volvo ad starring jean-claude van damme which was popular last year. and the blood hounds are a throwback to an ad from 1984 that showed a pack of blood hounds chasing his then opponent. i guess he thinks it will bring him the same luck from 30 years ago. will it be enough to put him over the top? we'll find that out a week from tonight. jeb bush is moving closer to a run in 2016.

but the prospect of a third bush, some say too many. >> can we tolerate another bush being the president of the united states? i saw this response. take a look. >> are you up nights worried another member of the bush family will be voted into the white house? ask your doctor if you might night busherin, the first drug designed specifically to help the symptoms of bush fatigue syndrome, which can lead to depression, severe headaches and loss of hope. living with the possibility of another bush for president is hard, busherin can help. >> we'll get to our roundtable tonight. you're watching "hardball," the place for politics.

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>> welcome back to "hardball." and the "hardball" roundtable tonight, topics chris christie wants to make sure everyone knows there's no one more macho on ebola than he is, even if scientists say his prescriptions go overboard. plus, the battle of ideas for the democratic primary. the question, should hillary clinton run? get to the left without going to

the left herself? and this headline is create. every tv show right now is about hillary clinton. political shows are dominating television. reviewers and viewers alike compare the leading women in all these shows to hillary clinton. joining me now is tim daly, who stars in one of those programs, where he plays the husband of the secretary of state. also the author of "art of discovery." and also a columnist from the "chicago tribune," author of "culture warrior" and he owns a pulitzer prize. if you have one flaunt it. >> i'll trade you for a tv show. >> let me start with chris christie, i think he's mr. macho. he's fighting with the press, the president, going after anthony fauci who has been a public servant for a thousand

years. he's attacking everybody. i think it's a political football. your thoughts? >> well, first, this is his brand. a feisty chris christie. but secondly, he is thinking about running for president and the party, now the base, hates government, hates authority -- >> hates obama. >> of course, doesn't trust the cdc, et cetera. and after what happened with hurricane sandy where he was seen in public actual cooperating with obama, that will never do. so he has to wipe out that memory and replace it with one of doing battle with government. this is a new gesture on his part. new jersey can handle its own affairs. we don't need washington telling us what to do. he's got to quietly let this woman out of the quarantine that he's got her in, she after all, is not ill, as far as anybody knows. but he just kind of overshot it -- >> i think that she said she had

access to the best take-out in newark. i did some tweeting the other day and i discovered, which i should have long ago, that the excitement in the democratic party is on the hard left, people who are exciting about elizabeth warren. the clintons can't break their ties with wall street. they have been fund raising there for years. my question, there's a lot of interest in elizabeth warren and hillary is now trying to compete with it? >> i think what's interesting in hollywood land, the campaign never seemed to stop. people have been campaigning there since the last three years. so it's -- >> hillary's still campaigning? >> everybody's still campaigning. there's not a week that goes by that there's not some major fund-raiser in hollywood. since, i don't know, 2012. i mean, it just keeps on rolling. the world series is going on. madison bumgarner, great name,

ace pitcher -- >> .29 e.r.a. >> it's incredible, right? it's like saying he throws his first pitch. 98 mile an hour fastball on the outside of the plate. and everybody's going, is he going to throw that same pitch to every batter for the rest of the game? the answer is no. so of course hillary is playing a little bit to the left. she'll throw the slider, the curveball, the change-up, whatever pitch she can to whatever batter. because her goal is to get everybody out and win the game. i don't think it's a surprise -- >> she's drawing the batter's attention to the left, but she's going to throw a fastball down the middle later. or a change-up. >> that's not a bad analogy. [ laughter ] >> so in other words, i can throw a lot of stuff? >> yeah. >> look at this guy. new kid on the block. because hillary, she may be a lot smarter than critics who say she fumbled the words. maybe like eisenhower, she said exactly what she wanted to say.

>> for one thing, to carry the analogy on a little bit, that she's throwing the same curveball that she threw back in 2008 when she was trying to please the base of her party, while at the same time, playing to the middle. that kind of backfired on her because barack obama was already building a new base at the time. >> but if she's going to win, you know, if the republicans start hitting that curveball, she's going to throw a different -- >> i go back to religion. say what you believe, because in the end, if you fail, you can always say, i failed saying what i believe. >> there you go. >> if you fail saying what you don't believe, you got nothing. i don't want why she was a hawk going to the iraq war. i think it had to do with her own instincts. her husband was president. and also with the contributors, the land developers are all hawks. maybe there was part of that. maybe she thought it was a smart move. like in "the godfather." >> she also -- remember dukakis. she doesn't want to be out-done

on the dove side. and it turned out that the war was getting unpopular at the same time that she was -- >> last question to the experts here, since you're really good at this. is hillary smart to go to the center as fast as she can, or smart to go to the left, appeal to the left, get them behind her, and then move back to the center? >> look, i'm not smart enough to know what she should do or shouldn't do. i think she's going to have to adjust. should she win, she's going to be adjusting her game plan the whole way along, depending on polls and how her opponent is doing, and how the other people are doing. >> she's a politician. >> she's in the game. she wants to win and hopefully as you said, she believes in what she's saying along the way. >> it's 50 shades of politics. >> you guys are so cynical. i thought hollywood was filled with idealists, you got to say what you believe and trumpet it. >> that's what we're doing. >> you're great, by the way, i love this, you're a guy,

supportive of your wife, but i take on that drunken marine about a week ago. i think it's an ideal version of a leader. visionary, have very good values. two, they're very gutsy. and the key ingredient we need today, they know how to fix problems. that's why i love tea leoni as the secretary of state. she fixes things. i got an answer here, it's magical. >> one of the reasons people are so enamored of political shows is that on these fictional political lives, people actually get something done. >> there's an ending. >> and even if it's machiavellian, something happens. whereas in the real world, we're just stuck. >> sunday night i'm watching the ideal hillary for an hour, which i love. and then i get "the good wife." that comes on with the marriage that was wrecked. still in love with this other guy. i'm not saying this is hillary, but it's all complicated. every tv show is about and has

always been about -- hillary clinton. "madam secretary" which stars our guest as the husband. let's watch that part. >> what happened to my ethics being so sexy to you? >> they are. this is a one-off. it's just a crazy situation that trumps that. >> the very nature of ethics, they can't be trumped. >> please don't make me argue that. >> so your work is more important than mine? >> of course not. >> so you're willing to risk my entire career. >> but a man is going to be killed. >> who is going to be killed? >> josh broke up with me. >> what a noodle. >> he's a dufus anyway. >> your dad and i have something really important to talk about. >> more important than my shattered existence? >> no. okay, look, i'll be there in a minute. >> can we talk about the guy getting killed? >> back to bed! >> now comes the more

complicated version in "the good wife." we get a look at the complexities of a political marriage. let's watch. >> if you don't show up to endorse me, if you go out to some governor's conference instead, your favorables will plummet through the floor. on the day that you want to be talking about pensions, every question will be about the state of your marriage. yes, i may need you, peter, but you sure as well need me too. >> that is raw stuff. that's politics. >> i love that. >> i don't know if that's the clinton family, but that looks like the real thing to me. what do you think? >> i have been a political lunk for so long. this is my fantasy baseball. [ laughter ] >> it's finao washington. washington's the most interesting city in the world. >> i love how "the good wife" takes place in chicago. >> and it's filmed in new york. >> at least it's not vancouver, right? but we are bringing sexy back to politics. >> got to talk about this book.

when we come back, we'll talk about the art, of why people like my son went into this business you're in and we'll be right back with the roundtable. this is "hardball," the place tics.

pope francis is making headlines again. he says evolution and "the big bang theory" are consistent with the idea of a creator. but that god should not be viewed as a magician with a magic wand. his remarks bridge the gap between scientific evidence and religious faith. he recent encouraged the church to be more hospitable to

divorced couples and gay people. we'll be right back.

>> back with our panel now. robin, you've got a new book, "the art of discovery," it's filled with actors and great testimony who share their personal story of why they're inspired to build a career in the arts. anyway, thank you. >> thank you. >> i was thinking of mr. hans opus. >> this is our opus. >> this is a beautiful book.

take this book, show it off. >> i did ask him to wear it around his neck. >> how did you decide to take the road less traveled? my kids did it. most people coming out of school, they had to go to law school. bankers in my day, they take something pretty predictable successful. they don't take something risky, like acting. >> in my case, it may be congenital, with both of my parents actors. my son, sam is an actor, my niece, catherine brown is an actress. so it's in my family. it took me a while to get there. i was not impressed by actors when i was a child. >> were you wrong or right? >> i was right. >> i had an overactive imagination and i want today be a lot of things. a fireman, a policeman, an astronaut, and i realized in order to do one of those things

correctly, you have to devote to it totally. >> who were your heroes? >> my heroes were not actors. they were people like john glen and willie mays. those are the people that i aspired to be. and i got to play jim lovell in a series. >> i wrote a story in the book about being backstage with my father. that was very special to me. i was in the whole illusion that you're pulling off. >> when you watch ronald reagan, when you watch president obama, who i've supported most of the time, do they act? are they acting? >> well, i always thought -- this is -- i'm going to reveal myself here everyone though craig of coalition is a non-profit, i always thought ronald reagan was a terrible actor.

>> when he was president, was he acting president? >> sort of: i just never liked the kbie. i just felt he was writing a speech that was written for him. >> can you tell the "w" speeches were written by dick cheney? >> okay, you're going to get me in a lot of trouble now. no, i could not tell. >> congressman ben jensay. he was the actor in "dukes of has saturday kwlgts. someone asked him, do you miss it? and he said i'm acting up here every day. >> anyway, thank you for being here. >> it was made with renaissance hotels and jeff vespa and it's a labor of love and the arts and go buy it on amson. >> that's a sign. i never thought i'd have to say that again.

when we return, let me finish with my thoughts about the battle of ideas. and it is that between hillary clinton and elizabeth warren. this is a hot one on the left. you're watching "hardball" the place for politics.

let me finish tonight with this battle of ideas. i should begin by confessing where i stand myself. i usually find myself with the candidate who's furtest left. where does this put me in the

war of ideology between clinton and warren? i'll get to that, just not tonight. i'm ready to state my cases on the politics of 2016. i believe the best candidates are the people who are true to themselves. i believe the worst are the ones who betray themselves. i believe the best candidates who don't say things or pretend to be things in the run-up to the primaries that they have to deny when facing the general election in november. people like to blame ralph nader for taking ag way those 90,000 votes. i think the greater impact was when he pulled gore over in the middle of the campaign, in the center and to thoo easy-going appeal of george w. bush. i believe secretary clinton's greatest appeal is as a professional. who knows how to get with the other side and get something done. this ability to meet in the middle and get things done is the sweet spot in american politics today.

if you haven't noticed, there hant been a lot of that out there lately. that's "hardball" for now. thanks for being with us. "all in" with chris hayes starts right now. >> tonight on "all in," the first catastraphoe in nasa's attempt at commercial flight. >> america, at the end, is not defined by fear. >> presidential pushback obama e on the treatment of ebola health care victims. >> whatever. get in line. i've been sued lots of times before. get in line. >> plus, the shake up of midterm elections. could alaska mess up the ballot next week? >> the pope funds his nose at