tv NOW With Alex Wagner MSNBC November 11, 2014 1:00pm-2:01pm PST
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if held a press conference to prepare for that moment saying, racial tensions should not be under mined by fall out by any decision. >> none of these efforts will yield lasting change if they are under mind by lawlessness and disorder. the world is watching. >> the governor said state and local police will work in a unified command and that violence will not be tolerated with a decision anticipated in mid to late november, activists with the don't-shoot coalition urged police to allow free expression and allow safe zone to protest and also got notice from bob mc-- requesting that b share the date of the announcement and work with the community to create safety zones within areas of likely protests. when the announcement is made,
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there's no amount of law force that will keep people from going to the streets. should compel chiefs of police to comply with sensible and proper rules of engagement that will allow them to concentrate first on people that are engage in negative behavior. >> joining me now national reporter and professor of law at georgetown university and former professor of law paul butler, every time law enforcement tries to mitigate a situation it feels they are alex as baiting it. what is your read. >> when you had snipers on vehicles and police officers exas baiting tensions, the tone a few minutes ago seemed he was speaking to home owners, not the protesters. he said you have the right to
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make your voices heard, i will undoubtedly protect residents and their property. it seems there will be a foregone conclusion that there will be no indictment so law enforcement is preparing for the worse. >> one can only assume reading the reemptive remarks from missouri law officials that they will not indict officer wilson. >> there's two reasons to be concerned about that, alex, one is how do they know. this is supposed to be a secret process but it seems somebody keeps leaking and all those leaks seem to favor officer wilson. so it looks like it is not an investigation by the grand jury that is in good faith. and the other thing is, they always seem so concerned about the protesters and they never seem concerned enough about what's being protested. so defeuring the initial protese saw them bring out all that military gear.
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but there was disrespect for michael brown's very body and into attention to officer wilson until the protesters demanded it. there seems to be so much sympathy for the police and so little for michael brown. >> how much would leaking the sort of, the news from inside the grand jury hearing to the police, how much would that tip off, compromise the grand jury hearing. could you say legally speaking those results have to be thrown out, that grand jury conclusion is not viable. >> well, you cox could. and there's no rule that a grand jury only gets one bite at the apple. if there's concern about the integrity of the process there could always be another grand jury investigation. is it likely, no, because the prosecutor runs the show in the grand jury and there's a lot of reasons to be concerned about this prosecutor in this case.
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he's never brought a case against a police officer for shooting an unarmed black man. not like this is the only time that has happened. >> you were on the ground in ferguson and know the dynamics between members of the community and shop owners. it was reported by wall street journal that one of the folk that's supplies materials for constructions said we have been doing board ups for probably the past month. the phone has been ringing off the hook. when you were last in ferguson what was the climate like? it seems in a period where nothing was supposed to be happening, the tension has raised considerably. >> certainly the tension did not dispate. you had organizers coming down to help build a foundation for those who want to continue building on the organizations on the ground. don't get it wrong fire second, people are still very angry
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because a young unarmed man was shot in the streets and there are very few answers. we don't know much about this except for what has been leaked and reported in the media. so at ledged narrative that wilson feared for his life. so the complications how he ends up shot dead 35 feet away, there's questions. so the shop owner may have a legitimate concern. people did break into stores and set things on fire but never with mass 500 or 600 people you turning on the police and on businesses. you never had that. >> professor butler in terms of the free expression that has been an issue of contention in ferguson. we knew there was a no-fly zone established over ferguson in large part to keep the news choppers out, to not let the americans see what was happening on the ground.
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national protesters are saying freedom of expression must be preserved in this environment. how much do you believe that becomes a point of litigation in the wake of whatever verdict is handed zblodown. >> well, it already has. a few weeks ago a federal judge said the rules the police were using to regulate were unconstitutional. they had a ridiculous five-second rule so if a protester stood still for five seconds they were subject to arrest. >> zbliright. >> and so we can think of the civil rights concern but the ferguson police don't respect their 1st or 14th amendment of the united states constitution. >> that's a really great point the fact ha multiple amendments may be being violated in ferguson. this is not just about one thing
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but this is about many things pertaining to civil liberties and freedom and racial bias. you compared this to katrina, there's an inhernt fear about black people expressing themselves. that fear is what governor touched on, in many ways probably make worse. >> there were moments in katrina where you had thousands of people who were evacuated from their own homes. they had guns pointed at them. national guard saying put your weapon down. here again thousands of protesters, vast majority of people. i have seen a plastic bottle hit a truck and they are saying it is no longer a peaceful gathering and they are firing off tear gas and bullets. what happens to the american rights at these moments.
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>> let me ask this question in closing, if no charges are filed against officer wilson, we know there are civil cases, do you think this case continues in other forms or is the grand jury's verdict the final word we have on justice for michael brown? >> i think we are seeing in ferguson not so much a moment but a movement. so this case is about a lot more than the indictment of one police officer. it's about the pattern and practices of the entire ferguson police department. they could do a lot more good for the sit zecitizens that woue out of this if there is an indictment. we're talking about a national movement. about police brutality and why police are using weapons of mass destruction and using them against american citizens.
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>> there's a number of troubling developments in the justice system. thank you both for your thoughts. >> thank you. >> great to be here. after the break, a kill in the air between president obama and president putin and will take more than a overcoat to warm this one up. plus weighing in on what america is doing wrong with its veterans. and later, new york city just did something really insane on purpose. all that ahead on now. americans drink 48 billion bottles of water every year. that's enough plastic bottles to stretch around the earth 230 times. each brita filter can replace 300 of those. clean. clear. brita water. nothing is better. i'm 55 years old and i have diabetic nerve pain. the pain was terrible. my feet hurt so bad. it felt like hot pins and needles
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today. parts of the mid-west with more than a foot of snow coming down as fast as a foot an hour. going as far south as dallas. >> yeah we are looking at this bitter blast of cold weather that will unfortunately stick around through much of next week. this cold air will linger. look at denver yesterday, 64, that was the high in the morning. by afternoon temperatures had fallen into the neons. teens. denver is getting struck with the snow and cold, temperatures below minus five in many spots. they're looking at record lows set tonight that will break records in the 1800s it is really harsh in denver. the cold is settling in the south and looking for it to push into the east. not done yet this cold spreading.
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wednesday's forecast ten degrees. the cold will push off thursday and friday with temperatures falling into the 40s, not quite as cold as it is through the rest of the country. certainly everybody is going to be in on this bitter blast. back to you. >> thanks. coming up, 25 years after the fall of the berl in wall, the east and the west are once again deeply divided. more on that coming up next. rocket science. high tech components for aircraft and fighter jets. we're just their bankers, right? but financing from ge capital also comes with expertise from across ge. in this case, our top lean process engineers. so they showed us who does what, when, and where. then we hit them with the important question: why? why put the tools over there?
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focused on isis many argue russia is a significantly greater threat to global security. . . >> new reports of russians tanks crossing the border and heavy shelling in eastern ukraine are causing alarm in european capitols. >> we see force thats that are capable of nuclear that are being moved -- whether they are or not we don't know but they do have the kind of equipment there to support that mission. >> russians's actions are destabilizing a sovereign state, ripping up the international rule book. >> they acknowledged also the
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diplomatic reality. >> we continue to be deeply troubled by russia's activity, including heavy weapons that are in complete violation of the spirit of the agreement. at the same time we have had difference wz them on ukraine. we are working to pursue an iran agreement and in a range of areas where we can make progress together. >> others worry that need is exactly what putin is counting on. the abrupt flairing to help on iran . >> diamond joining me by phone. thanks for joining me. let me ask you about the situation on the ground getting
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considerably more volatile what can you tell us? >> there's definitely a lot of shelling over the last few daze both ingoing and outgoing from what i've seen personally and heard. it's coming from near the airport where the ukrainians incredibly still have a position within the city limits. they have a sliver of territory that connects them here in the city where they have a base. the other thing that's happening is that there's a lot of very heavy military hard ware coming in from the east, from the direction of russia. i've seen personally tanks, houses, grod multiple rocket launchers brought into the city over the last few days. the question is what is all this equipment being brought here for sand it about to be used.
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>> what are uniforms, are some of the soldiers wear russians military uniforms. how trans parent are these movements? >> well, i think, you know, the more time goes on, the less russia becomes concerned with trying to hide its presence here. i think there's still a convenient ear of this being purely separatist movement, a local separatist movement from the russians government. but you see some of the convoys actually flying with russians flags and they have started to jd hand out uniforms to the fighters who aren't from russia that look very much like russians uniforms making it difficult to tell the difference between the two. but even going through check points you will get people admitting they are from russians but you can't whether they are regular army or volunteers but
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they will quite happily tell you they are from st. peterson. >> thanks so much for your time and the update. stay safe. joining me a columnist from the washington post and former u.s. ambassador to russia. first let me ask you this, have we in the united states been focussing on the wrong conflict? we've allocated a lot of time and resources to isis and the middle east, but in the middle east but in the meantime are we ignoring something serious going on in russia or the ukraine. >> i don't hi you can say the u.s. is ignoring it but it is ironic for europeans for criticizing the u.s. that's distracted when it is the u.s. that has been pushing europe since this crisis began last spring to take it seriously.
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the administration adopted policy from ukraine to try to get a negotiated solution to deescalate tensions. the u.s. thought it would achieve that with the so-called minsk agreement between putin and ukraine. that is what is unrattling. the russians thought were serious about deescalating and that is important information about the moving of weapons. >> given the reality on the ground what our correspondent just mentioned and what we're hearing in the corns of the diplomatic world should the u.s. not have ruled out military action over ukraine. >> oh, i think, i mean, whether to trumpet it or not is a different matter but there's never been serious discussion about a military involvement in
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ukraine and that i think is right. but i do think there's been some what of a you know as david said, a hope that this minsk accord would work but it was always for russia to kind of consolidate its gains in eastern ukraine and then they had these mock elections and it sounds like they are bringing more material into that region. they are consolidated their position while we have not responded to it so i think at this moment it requires response from the west, united states and our allies both to put in place new sanctions, that's always been the strategy, to put new sanctions in place, that hasn't happened and second to shore up the ukrainian government. >> in terms of the crown jewel for obama administration a nuclear deal with iran is what
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we are in hot pursuit of, i wonder if you think, it is hard to use phrases of is it worth it, but given the dynamics in the middle east do you think the play with russia over iran is the right one. >> i think for president obama administration trying to get this nuclear agreement with iran is job one. it is true they are subordinating some other issues to try to achieve that. we will know in two weeks whether they will get there. i just visited with a russians ambassador and he went out of his way to talk about how much russia wants with the united states to achieve a deal on the iran-nuclear issue and everything we hear is that the russians have been fairly solid as a member of that coalition. if the administration could get that deal it's going to be an achievement that i think will reshape other regional realities.
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the russians in this moment, are going for everything they can. that is typical opportunityism. >> let me ask you in terms of sanctions, china and russia has announced possibility of a mammoth energy deal, they seem to have been brought closer as the west hassioned russians. we have to continually talk about the run off, the residual effects of sanctions, is it a good thing to have a trilateral relation with china and russia often acting in concert and china and the u.s. acting outside of that. >> well i look at the economic interest china has with the united states, they far exceed their economic relationship with russia. second what has been done recently between russia and china is russia is supplying
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energy to china, that's not against our interest but in our interest. the more energy in the global system, the better. i think it creates problems for russia in terms of dependency because they don't produce or other export things except for things they bring out of the ground, they are fully aware. with respect to bigger international issues, i'm impressed by how well we've done. and how well we've managed to compartment allies our interest. you see the russians and chinese cooperating. not because they are doing favors to the united states but because we have managed to condense everybody that is in all our interest to get this deal done. i don't see it competitive. i think the united states is in a pretty strong position with
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respect to russia. >> in terms of u.s. many relations, every move is scrutinized. president putin is casting his eyes, obama's sighs, the body language is parsed and analyzed. would you say that relations with the russians, where are they in the spectrum of warm to down right icy? >> oh, i think you have to go way back, deep into the cold war to remember and see a time that is compared to this moment. i think the challenge that russia presents to europe and to the international system is real and it will be sustained to get back to, you know, what's the greatest threat, i think we have to manage all threats at all times. you don't get to pick and choose. but this is the turning point. this is the end of the post cold war order.
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and this body language, i think, reflects that. it's a difficult time. we need to talk. i've been with the president in other moments of body gates we used to call it. we always need to talk and they have talked on the side lines but i do think it reflects a period we haven't seen a long, long time. >> coining the phrase officially on the air "body gate" thank you for your time. just ahead we will discuss the moral debt america owes its soldiers and why it is way behind. next on "now." ♪don't stop now come on mony♪ ♪come on yeah ♪i say yeah ♪yeah ♪yeah ♪yeah ♪yeah ♪yeah ♪yeah ♪'cause you make me feel like a pony♪ ♪so good ♪like your pony ♪so good ♪ride the pony the sentra, with bose audio and nissanconnect technology.
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his own life without going mad. if you can bring yourself to face, not shadows, but real death, described and recognizable by bullet or saber, arrow or lance, then you need never be afraid again. >> that was vice president joe biden during today's veteran ceremony at arlington ceremony. the parades and ceremonies do little to address the difficult transition from war to peace for american veterans. up to 29% of troops will suffer post traumatic stress disorder. if today more likely to kill him or herself than to be kill in combat. >> from 2007-08, our guest spent
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time in afghanistan creating a film in 2011. in younger's latest film," the last patrol" he reunited members for a 300 mile journey for an exploration for life after war. >> i met brandon in many afgh afghanistan with other american soldiers. he was a team leader. incredibly focused. and then he comes home to the united states and he's a mess. drank way too much. very self-destructive. but when we started doing "the last patrol" all of a sudden i would see the old brenden that i remembers from afghanistan. >> joining me now the director
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from the movie, sebastian younger thanks for joining me. >> my pleasure. >> so why the 300-mile journey. what did you expect to accomplish? >> i wanted to walk along rail road lines, basically to be vagrants we walked from d.c. to philly and headed for pittsburgh. we were sleeping under bridges, bei bathing in rivers. wung of the points of it was to have a long conversation about war, why we missed it, why it is so hard to unhook from war. there was two other shouoldiers with tim. we also wanted to encounter the country. /you drive you don't encounter the country. a rail road line went straight through the middle of
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everything, through ghettos and farms and we encountered americans, rich and poor americans, everybody and asked this question, how is american doing. what do you like best about this country. we've been at war for over a decade. i and i feel it is time to do assessment. like you do in war zones, you ask people how are you doing in the villages. someone needs to do that in this country. >> two points, the story telling aspect, to that, you wrote in a washington post piece earlier this year about how other cultures deal with warriors who come home and you wrote, after stone age combat warriors were welcome home by the entire community and
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. >> the act of explaining what happened. we don't do that with our veterans. we don't let them tell the stories of war. feels like you feel it is an important piece. >> here's the thing. if you have been trauma advertistraumatized in a group, healing also has to be collective. but they come home, they are out of their unit, getting individual therapy sessions, living by themselves or with their family, taking their medici medicine, that aspect of telling your story doesn't happen in a shrink's office but in your community. and i think every city hall in the country should be open to veterans to speak and supporting the troops means showing up and listening. some of those people will be angry that they did what they did during war. some will be very proud.
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some will be grieving because they lost friends. you will get it all. some will some won't sound patriotic. whatever. it is the whole package. if the citizens and veterans can hear these stories without centsoring, it would force the public to own the wars morally. >> right. if in is a glaring absence it is american responsibility for the war that's we have sent these men and women over to. you meet this point that is often seen incumbent on the soldiers to bear the burden of the war and in fact is our decision as a country and we haven't shouldered it. >> yeah, the people fighting these wars were four or five years old on 9/11. it is not their war. it is our war. we paid for it. we decided on it. i'm not saying it was a bad decision. i think some wars needed to be fought and after 9/11 going to afghanistan was imperative but it was our decision.
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not the 19 years old. and they come back from war and have the feeling that civilian population thinks the war was theirs, it belongs to the soldie soldiers. >> in the same way we don't ask oil rig workers to bear the burden of degradation. >> exactly we just got some guy out there drilling for oil, global warming isn't their fault if anything it is our fault. >> these are huge things to be reminded o reminded of. it is unfortunate we picked only one day a year to look at it. thank you so much for your documentary, it is called "the last patrol" currently airing on hbo. >> thank you. coming up california is bringing justice to its criminal system. saving quarter billion in the process. with universities across the state. for better access to talent,
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>> 25 grams, that is how much marijuana you can carry around new york city without getting arrested because yesterday city officials announced police will take a new approach to the state's marijuana laws, instead of arresting people caught with small amounts of pot, owe fenff will be ticketed. in black and hispanic communities, 86% of these marijuana arrests have taken
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place in new york city alone. the big green announcement comes one week after a pretty big election for drug policy reform. alaska, oregon and washington all voted to legalize marijuana and in california ballots approved a measure to reclassify to misdemeanor. thousands have submitted petitions to have their sentences reduced. last wednesday after prop 47 passed, defend ants were released from custody. felonies yesterday, misdemeanor today. this is the law now. this law is expected to downgrade the number of felonies by 40,000 and save up to $250 million annually. joining me now professor at
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columbia university and at the roosevelt institute and director toen for campaign to end mass incarceration. let's start with the war on drug. we have a chart sky rocketing prison population. you see a huge up tick. 71 nixon declares war on drug and in 80 what happened in the prison population. seems like catastrophic policy. >> it has devastated black communities over the last 30 years, particularly for young black men who end up with a criminal record and cannot find work or rent an apartment. it is devastating for those men and their family. there is no question this has been a policy failure of massive proportions. >> epic proportions. >> epic proportions.
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>> there's been some debate as to whether police and prosecutors will abide by this given the fact it was a ballot measure how much water does that argument hold and what challenges lie ahead for prop 47. >> prop 47 passed with 58% electorate and passed by 55% in conservative counties in california. i would hope that the law enforcements in the state are listening. >> doreen, to the new york city question, i did not think i would see bill holding up a ziploc bag full of weed. >> he said it was oregano. >> that's what they always say. what do you think of this policy. it is not legalization, it is decriminalizing. there's still a way to get
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arrested, if you don't pay the fine. >> first, it's a first good start. but we need comprehensive policy reform. because here's one of the issues. okay, so we know what the disparities are when people get arrested for marijuana, 86% black and brown but we know whites use marijuana at the same rate if not higher now we're going to the summons process, which is great, a step forward, but we're not collecting data on racial and ethnic back ground of those being issued summons to evaluate if it is woshi working one, we need to collect the data and two, the issue of stop and frisk. being forced to show if there's weed in their pocket is blatantly unconstitutional and we need reform on that. >> when you talk about good drug policy, i didn't realize one of the reasons we had mandatory
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minimum sentences, governor brown thought the parole boards whereby as and would be better to have a fair standard. that was bad policy but in its intention was not a particularly bad one. do you think we are learning lessons? do you think is good? i mean are we better at crafting drug policy now than 20 years ago? >> i think we will always have to pay attention to the data and observe the impacts of the laws we're passing. you never know what the outcomes are going to be, from very well-intention legislation. but we have clearly learned a lot of lessons and seen racial disparityises evolve. that means a lot moving forward. >> are we finally at a point where first of all the idea
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democrats and republicans can agree on anything, that is what some say is on the verge of extinction, that this could be a big meaningful area beyond corporate tax reform and the keystone pipeline, an agreement on how we treat those in the criminal justice system and how lives are rue ruined by unnecessary arrests. are we seeing eye to eye on this. >> we're almost there. it's a huge step forward. many democrats bear some of the responsibilities. i'm happy to see there's some convergence that these policies have been so destructive especially in communities of color also in white communities too. so there is some bipartisan that is promising but we need to push both parties to do comprehensive drug policy reform not just
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these one off policies here and there. >> allison what do you think of the prospects for bipartisan at the national level. >> i think it is very exciting. progressives and conservatives come to this issue because it speaks to programs different value within each party but they are both looking for answers recognizing the devastation that these bad policies have had on everyone's communities, regardless of your political stripe. so there's a huge opportunity for everyone to get a win. i hope people step up and see this. >> there are people who will look and remember new york city's drug policies of yore and it is cold comfort because to be clear, many young men of color in particular have had their lives ruined carrying far less oregano than bill branton did today. a lot of communities have been
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devastated by terrible incarceration policies. >> that's what i mean by kpr comprehensive reform. this is a great first start. we need to figure out how we heal all those young people who have been devastated by what happened in the last 40 years in terms of criminal justice policy. we need more reforp, healing, drug treatment programs, a package of reforms to deal with this drug problem. >> in terms of legalizing marijuana it is moving so quickly through the statements, this movement to legalize it. i wonder how much you think any complications will have echo effects on criminal justice reform. >> absolutely. we need to be thoughtful in this blindingly fast evolution about the kind of laws we're drafting to ensure our intention on our communities is actually realized
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that in fact we do see those communities that are suffering the most benefit from these reforms and that it is not just simply shifting power and marijuana revenues from one bucket that serves white people to another bucket that srves white people. we have to get explicit about this. >> thank you both for your time and thoughts. coming up the mormon church just made a stunning admission about its past. next. i lost my sight in afghanistan, but it doesn't hold me back. i go through periods where it's hard to sleep at night, and stay awake during the day. non-24 is a circadian rhythm disorder that affects up to 70% of people who are totally blind. talk to your doctor about your symptoms and learn more by calling 844-844-2424. or visit my24info.com.
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church explained this. according to the church, smith probably did not have sexual relations with all of his wives because some were quote "sealed to him" only for the next life. unofficial accounts of his polygamy available on line. he was indicted in the year 1844. the disclosures stand in stark contrast for the image of smith that has been portrayed for years, that of a devoted husband in his first wife emma.
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>> you can say that again. that's all for "now." i'll see you here tomorrow at 4:00 eastern. "the ed show" is up next. good evening americans and welcome to "the ed show" live from new york. how do we say thanks to the veterans? we'll do it tonight. let's get to work. ♪ ♪ >> impeachment would be a consideration. >> will the republicans try to impeach president ob? >> the one tool they have are articles of impeachment. let's get going on that. >> we have no plans to impeach the president. >> you don't bring a lawsuit to a gun fight. >> impeachment. >> i predict it will be one of the first things they talk about and that i
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