welcome to a special holiday edition of "morning joe." today we want to look at one of the most divisive men in american history. richard nixon. >> while the watergate stain scandal remains on the white house, they debate richard nixon's positive legacy. pat buchanan and douglas brinkley brinkley join us. if pat buchanan had his way, you never would have been able to write that book because he said burn the damn tapes.

and from london we have historian john meacham who regularly burns tapes. i love this quote from the greatest comeback. the deputy assistant to richard nixon said starting in '66 there's a recurring refrain you would hear around the nixon office and through the years of the administration and continued into post-presidency, what does buchanan think? what does buchanan say? pat, you have a thousand memos that you sent to nixon and his responses that make up this book. extraordinary. tell everybody again the story of how you met nixon and how you got involved early in his comeback. >> i met nixon in 1954-'55.

the assistant pro looked at the rookie caddie and i went along 18 holes and 12 years later i'm in st. louis young editorial writer and he's coming over to speak and go to a cocktail party afterwards. i got invited to it. met him in the kitchen. i said if you're going to run in '68, i would like to get aboard early. two weeks later i was in his office in new york and i was hired december 1965 and there are only three people in the office. rose mary woods, pat buchanan and a lady named pat ryan answering the phones. patricia ryan nixon. mrs. nixon. that was his entire staff in there in new york. a couple guys traveled with us in '66. nixon went out into something like 35 states. 80 congressional districts. it was a phenomenal republican comeback. 47 house seats. and suddenly he was in the hunt

again. >> so how did this happen pat? we have to put this in proper perspective. nixon lost in '60. he ran for governor in '62. howard k. smith on an abc special, good job howard k. smith. the program was called obituary of richard nixon and they said his political career was over and three years later you believe he's going to win. >> the most brilliant thing and right thing he did, both right and wise was in 1964 when that tremendous convention when they are cursing nelson rockefeller, he's demanding extremism be denounced, nixon introduces goldwater and then he goes out and campaigns for goldwater harder than goldwater did himself and at the end goldwater says i know you didn't do it for yourself. did you it for me. if you have selfish motives, i'm

with you. that meant the martyr of our conservative movement and the leader of the conservative movement politically, i saw if we could weld his movement to nixon's center of the republican party there is no way nelson rockefeller or romney who had taken a hike could get the nomination. as soon as i got with richard nixon, i said first thing we have to do is we have to capture the conservative movement before reagan in california wins the governorship. >> take us inside the white house with the development of a really aggressive domestic policy. >> nixon was not a buchanan conservative. he wasn't anti-big government. he was a guy that grew up in the depression and admired woodrow wilson and he had no problems with new ideas and fresh ideas. in that statement by john mitchell. that was about segregation.

he was telling civil rights leaders and others watch what we do and not what we say. we were raising the devil with court decisions. if you take what nixon did, he came in with 10% of the southern states desegregated. when he was out, it was 70% of them. a bloody mess all through that process. nixon was pro-civil rights. he was anti-forced racial balance and that's what he did. it was a success. look what else he did. he ended the draft as he promised to do. he put in 18-year-old vote. he created the environmental protection agency. all of these things domestic policies were dramatic in foreign policies that can rival opening to china. all of the troops came home as he promised. pows came home. he saved israel. with russia greatest arms control agreement since the washington naval agreement. enormous achievements. if he quit after his first term

he would have been regarded among the top ten presidents near great. >> i agree with pat in the sense that first term was remarkable. in 1972 he killed george mcgovern. biggest landslide in our book december of '72, nixon is leaning back taking a moment to celebrate and someone write a book about 1972 because it's one of the best years in political history. we did so much. as pat suggested in many ways he was domestically a continuation of a new ideal liberal. he built a great society. family assistance clean air and water. created dea. he was believing in big government still. >> that's one of the things i worked on '72 or politics of it. this guy was dead in '65. by 1972 he's created this new political majority which succeeds the roosevelt coalition and dominates presidential politics all of the way up to

1992. 49-state victory for a guy who ten years earlier said good-bye and good luck. i'm done with politics. >> john dean is out with a new book "the nixon defense" based on his findings after listening to about 1,000 hours of watergate related tapes including listening to yourself. do you remember that moment when you were explaining that to him? >> very well. >> how did you see him responding? >> i used that metaphor. there was a confluence of events where he wanted me to write a bogus report. i thought it had to end. hoped he would have his fist come down on the desk and say we've got to stop this. he had answers for everything and wasn't really inclined to stop it. >> interesting perspective you have in the face of some of the key moments in history on standing up to the person you

work for and saying look we got to deal with this. a lot of people can't do that. a lot of people are critical of the present times right now. four years of listening to hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of hours. >> i set out to find out how someone as savvy as nixon could make mistakes he made that destroyed his presidency. i had to go through it from day one until they pulled the device out. >> you testified in 1973 before the senate committee and you talked about how you had said to nixon there's a cancer on the presidency and if you don't get rid of it it will kill the presidency. you found out over the course of this research that by the time you talked to him and said those things, he was fully aware of pretty much everything. >> that morning i wasn't quite sure how much he did know. i now know that he knew almost everything i had to tell him. and he was stringing me along and trying to see my reaction.

that night when he enters in his diary i found i was overemotional. i was frustrated. i can hear myself sighing. i'm just not able to persuade him. my early 30s at that time you only push so hard with leader of the free world. didn't work. >> you were getting nothing. >> nothing. >> let's play a portion of president nixon in 1973 talking to former u.s. ambassador to greece giving financial assistance to watergate defendants.

>> you say this conversation would later haunt president nixon. >> he clearly knew he was selling an ambassadorship at that point. he had been set up. they didn't want to change -- they wanted a new ambassador in greece. he had cash and that's what they

needed at that point in the coverup. nixon himself was lending a hand. >> huge fan of your first two books. extraordinary. conservatives are. pat buchanan bill crystal, a lot of people -- if you want to understand american conservatism, it's a great place to start. this book is controversial. a good friend of mine and good friend of this show there have been charges about plagiarism. the "times" talked about it. theres passages that look like they are lifted directly from some of the reagan books. what do you say? >> that's nonsense. what kind of plagiarist links source notes to the pages he's supposedly plagiarizing? >> we have a lot of the passages

that are the same. >> they're not the same. >> you say that -- >> put up the second passage. he thinks i got that from him. actually i got it from an african-american paper "the atlanta world" from 1976. the thing that i write is completely richer. the second passage that your producer showed me was the one in which reagan was shown on camera laughing at what was going on at the convention. >> reagan absolved into laughter, yeah. >> then in my book, i say he dissolved into laughter and he saw the screen dissolve into laughter and stopped laughing when he realized it looked back on tv. i thought i was friends with craig. people should read his book. anyone interested in ronald reagan should read his book because it's a good book.

he wants my book shredded. i want his read. the thing is he's also a public relations professional. his clients are people like ann coulter and the first thing they did was send out a letter to their roladex saying that he's trying to put a new spin on reagan and we can suggest tweets that you can use. it really strikes me that this is an ideological motivated thing. >> so we'll get craig on at some point. maybe get both of you guys on at some point. i would really love to talk about this book. not to stay negative. like i said i cannot be -- >> larry king tweeted it was controversial and that's why he was reading it. i'm okay with it. >> your first two books i mentioned were extraordinary books. any conservative that wants to understand where we are today need to read what you wrote

between the years of '64 and '66. i thought you took a more negative tone toward reagan in this book. is that a fair assessment? then say the treatment you gave reagan in the first two books. >> i kind of report what i see. >> what do you see? >> well one thing i see -- i write about this in the preface. it's very important to understand that opinions about reagan have always been divided. they've been divided since he was in high school. i tell a story about how there was a cartoon in his high school year book making fun of him. some guy says i'm drowning and reagan goes out and saves him and the guy says no don't save me. i'm trying to commit suicide. and reagan says you have to postpone this because i'm trying to win a medal. people saw him as a phony but others saw him as a hero they want to emulate. in the preface i quote a letter from a woman who wrote him in the white house.

you need to save the country like you saved people when you were a lifeguard. by the same token, i had a friend that grew up in california in the '60s and '70s and she could not bring herself to read the manuscript because she was so mad at ronald reagan. the bottom line is i'm trying to bring back the idea that ronald reagan is a controversial figure that's divided americans. >> nixon was too. it seems to me you were more sympathetic toward richard nixon and what tortured richard nixon more than you're sympathetic toward ronald reagan. >> people told me they came away from the book more sympathetic from reagan. i don't know. i didn't go in with that agenda. it seems like reagan books are divided in two. they are literally treated as put on earth to defeat the evil empire. you have read them. or they hate him. >> come on i'm in that group.

let's bring in doug brinkley right now. it's fascinating. ronald reagan is still, you know, people are still trying to get their arms around this man. you talk about like churchill would have said that he's still a mystery wrapped in a riddle wrapped in an enigma. i remember even nancy reagan saying there are parts of reagan that i didn't even know. >> absolutely. he's become a beloved figure. i'm here in washington. you have reagan national and all of the rest. his presidential library is the most visited. the big reason why everyone talks about reagan and he generates such interest is because we may be living in the age of ronald reagan still. fdr told america that the federal government is there to help you and was there to plant trees with the shelter belt in the depression and here to feed

the poor and do social security and the government won world war ii atomic bomb harry truman on continuing to create government. the pentagon. the joint chiefs of staff. the cia. dwight eisenhower interstate highway system. biggest public works project in world history. kennedy to the moon. all of this federal government even nixon creates epa and jimmy carter fema and then reagan. the revolution comes in '81. it's a rollback that reagan is talking about rolling back great society and some of the new deal programs and that's where we're at right now. >> still ahead this hour on "morning joe," keira knightly and pierce brosnan.

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>> done. what do you think? >> i think i'm angry. i'm mad at you because it's so good i hate you a little bit. what's it called? >> i don't know. >> i love it. i think it's incredible. it's about me right? not about your other boyfriend? >> i don't know if it's about you. it's your christmas present because i can't afford to buy one. happy christmas. >> thank you very much. i love you. >> i love you. >> that was a clip from "begin again." here with us now, golden globe award nominated actress kiera knightly. you sound good singing. >> i am singing. >> you're singing and adam levine is acting. i don't get it. i began that adam levine was so helpful to you when you said how

do you do the singing thing because he sold a gazzilion albums. >> he didn't help at all. he was right. it turned out all right. >> i hope you didn't give him any acting lessons. i said the same thing. i never done this before. you'll be fine. >> for you singing is new. >> it's new. it was an interesting one. it was sort of i didn't actually -- the songs weren't written until two days before we got in the studio. i didn't know what they wanted or what it would be and we kind of got into the studio and tried some stuff out. and i just kept going until people stopped wincing. i thought okay. >> you spent your life expressing yourself in one way and now in another way. how hard was it in front of the microphone with headphones on and everyone was staring at you and oh god, i can't do this old

trick that gets me through. i'm in a whole new area. >> you are getting am he to relive the entire thing. it's exactly like that. it's panic that sort of hits and then you always hear about music industry and you think there will be alcohol and it will be fine. the only thing i was offered was water and green tea which made me more caffeinated and worried about the whole thing. >> it's not 1976 anymore. so tell us the story about -- give us the basics of this story. explain to us the opening scene. >> it's a story of friendship. it's a story of the love of music and love of new york. i think it's really about people who suddenly find themselves having fallen down. they think they know where they're going and what life is and everything falls apart. >> so a washed up agent thinking

about killing himself and walks into a bar and here's -- >> he hears me sing. it saves him completely. >> you are singing a song about -- >> i'm singing a song about killing yourself because my character -- i think i'm giving too much away. >> they all die in the end but you want to see it because the journey is the fantastic part. you're singing this song. he immediately as a reason to live. >> he immediately suddenly goes -- he's playing a washed up guy who has been trying to do the business side and forgotten the creative side of what he does and he remembers that he likes what he likes doing and maybe there's something they can do creatively together and that gives him a reason to go on which is fair enough. >> talk more about the new york. we all love new york. how is this a love letter to new york? what's special about new york that plays in the film that makes new york the right place

to do it. >> new york has a very specific energy and it's one of the only 24-hour cities and a place where people famously come to reinvent themselves. it's very much a love letter. it was very important and we were out and about in new york shooting the city and being amongst that energy which also meant getting shouted at quite a bit by people to get off the sidewalk. >> james said you did guerrilla filming. how did you go about doing that? >> get in a really little van and drive around and you quickly jump out like in times square at 3:00 in the morning and you dance around a bit and hope you get enough before people start recognizing us and you had to get back in the van and get out of there. >> you're serious? >> i am serious. >> it's fascinating. you have big stars in it. you expect it to be slick and beautifully produced and yet it has the feel of downtown new york because you filmed it that way. it's brilliant.

>> more fun to do a film like that than a big production film? >> i like doing low budget where you have to hit the ground running and keep going. >> did you get to keep the van? >> i wish i got to keep the van but i can't really drive. >> so you have to answer a question for me. we often have tony scott on "the new york times" critic. fantastic critic. he says the great debate is whether one of my favorite movies that makes me weep every christmas, love actually is either the greatest movie or the absolute worst movie ever made. >> which makes it a great movie. >> i always thought everyone agreed it was the greatest movie ever made. i go out and ask people and it's about a 50-50 split. break the tie. is it not the greatest movie? >> break the tie because i'm not biassed here. it's obviously the greatest movie ever made. >> should it be on cable more than it is? >> absolutely.

>> it was incredible. >> i'm glad you like it. >> this one is going to be even better. >> it's the love of this decade. >> i have a wife. she loves that movie. >> you don't? >> i like the movie. >> it's something about that movie and as i told norah, you have mail. dog comes around the corner and what are you going to do. this is quite the program. what are you going to do. >> it's great. >> he's not afraid to say it. >> up next actress maggie gyllenhaal takes on her most challenging role to date. "morning joe" will be right back.

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>> they don't want you to choose a palestinian. they want an israeli. >> doesn't matter what anyone wants. >> we want you to choose a palestinian. >> i will choose whoever best protects the aims and ideals of this company. and nothing you or anyone else wants will affect that decision. >> you cannot choose an israeli. not after this. >> i'll choose exactly who i want. >> then you will have made a mistake. >> and if i do at least it will be mine. >> that was a scene from sundance tv's "the honorable

woman." you said this was so much better. seriously, eight-party mini series. bbc and sundance coming together. it couldn't be more timely. we have a report all summer long about what was going on over there. couldn't be more timely could it? >> when we made it in 2013 it was a relative calm time. you would agree you have to have your head in the stand not to know this was part of the world that was going to blow up again. i think that's part of hugo who wrote and directed it took it on as the subject of the piece. >> very complicated character. the beginning of the series really starts with a very graphic scene that really shapes your life. tell us about it.

>> well the character i play is the daughter of a zionist gun runner. he's killed in front of her in the very beginning of the piece. giving a tiny bit away. that's in the first few minutes. and i guess i think so much of this conflict is about what we inherited and about the history that comes along with it and so i think she is trying to subvert what her father was doing which was so much wrapped in violence and work toward reconciliation. >> she inherits a lot of money and then tries to -- >> what do you hope people will take away? you don't want to give away everything that happens. what is your biggest hope in what a viewer takes away from this? >> you know i have been watching it with my husband who hadn't seen it. we're up to episode five.

>> is he a tough critic? boy, you were good in three but four -- >> that has to be complicated having him watch you. >> he's the only person in the world who i really care what he thinks. he's an actor. but truly, truly down to the very nitty-gritty. i have been watching it and we're up to episode five and i thought -- when i saw it at first i watched it on my ipad. and i noticed that there are things that the characters say that aren't part of the discussion in this country, that aren't allowed to be said here. that if i said right now on your show i don't know. >> they would drag you off kicking and screaming. >> there would be a lot of intimidation. i think somehow -- i don't know how hugo did it. the show which does not take a position, which does not take a point of view and say this is

right and this is wrong but instead lays out elements of the conflict. it does it in a way that so far people can hear. >> a more honest conversation. >> how does playing a role like this shape your own personal outlook about a complex issue. were you at all concerned about taking on a role at such a controversial topic. everyone has opinions about it. >> yeah. i think i feel much more emotionally attached and connected to it than i did before when i started the show. i knew as much as anyone who has two little kids that tries to read the newspaper every day and does their best and now i'm obsessed with reading the news about what's happening over there. and it does break my heart in a way that it didn't before and also i think it's taught me something about -- it's truly taught me something about

compassion. i do think it's very difficult in this situation to have -- to be one sided or to believe this is what's right or this is what's absolutely wrong. i'm constantly kind of slightly shifting my feelings about it and my thoughts about it all the time. >> i want to leave on a final question for you. you are read in. as you proved highly intelligent and there's been a big debate about hacking issue of the icloud and certain celebrities unfortunately exposed, certain pictures that have been put out there for the public to consume. what's your take on that? and should people feel ashamed that they have been hacked and these things have been exposed or is it a true privacy violation? >> i started rehearsal for a play yesterday and before that was on vacation with my family and was reading news on my icon and didn't click on any of that.

i watched it on your show this morning. i think privacy -- listen privacy is incredibly important and that echos all over this country and this world and i think i would be so incredibly upset if that happened to me. i don't know anything about it to be totally honest. >> she's an honorable woman. >> coming up, the moving story of the bedford boys. >> how the boys made the ultimate d-day sacrifice. we'll be right back. [thinking] there i was. another holiday... ...stuck at the kids' table... ...again.

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we come by almost every day to deliver your mail

so if you have any packages you want to return you should just give them to us i mean, we're going to be there anyway why don't you just leave it for us to pick up? or you could always get in your car and take it back yourself yeah, us picking it up is probably your easiest option it's kind of a no brainer ok, well, good talk thousands of men made the ultimate sacrifice 70 years ago on d-day to help the allies on a path to victory. >> one small town in virginia was hard hit losing 19 boys by that day's end. mike barnicle has a story of the group that will forever be known as the bedford boys. >> all facing west toward the beach where they landed the channel they crossed and the land that they left to come and

help rid the world of the terror that was hitler. omaha beach. the american cemetery normandy. 172 acres. 9,386 headstones bleached white by sun, wind and time. >> normandy eastward with a tremendous roar of battle. >> 150,000 ally soldiers came ashore at 6:30 in the morning of 6 june 1944. the noise stunning. the carnage horrific. the bravery constant. omaha beach was a fortress. machine guns had clear and interlocking fields of fire from cement pillboxes. men dropped in the water caught in a buzz saw of bullets as soon as the gates opened.

some drown. others barely made it ashore. men like lawrence never forget. >> i got this about noon or a little later. i laid over on that shelf until 8:00 that night and watched it. i saw it all. they couldn't get out. >> brannon, 94 now, is from morristown tennessee. his days forever shaped by what happened here 70 years ago. >> the first battalion hit right down there. germans couldn't go -- they killed 800 of them right there. there were bodies floating 200 yards out in the water when i went out that night. they moved them out of the way for us to go back out. it was just hell. really. you know.

i actually saw over 2,000 people killed that i could see. i lived 1,000 years that day. >> at day's end more than 1,500 american soldiers have been killed. one of them was private ray stevens of bedford virginia. a town of 3,200 folks. private stevens and his twin brother, roy, were only 2 of 30 young men from bedford that hit the beach with the 29th. by dusk, 19 would be dead. two sets of brothers would parish in the campaign. one small town still carrying history's heartache. the monuments of history are all still here. american rangers scaled a 100-foot high cliff to capture a german gun placement. the hedge rows were thick,

dangerous and ever present. the villages still looking much the same as they did when the allies came calling. and the largest of the cemeteries. the one that sits on a bluff above the beach where world war ii in europe began to end. omaha beach. where those who died in europe serve as a daily reminder of the horror of war and the price of freedom and democracy. it is here no matter the season no matter how many years pass the sun still sets on sacred ground where heroes look west toward home toward america. >> and mike barnicle standing by. it's hard to imagine that town on that day and the days after that to lose so many of their own. >> mika you know 70 years

later it's incomprehensible to think of how parents could deal with such grief, in such a small environment, 3,200 people in that town. so many served and so many died. again, as we said earlier, this is who we are as a country. it certainly is who we were. the entire country went to world war ii. whether you went overseas or stayed in the united states working in an industry related to the war and nearly every industry was related to the war effort, we all served. it's very very different today. >> john meacham? >> the enormity of that loss. how did the word get back to bedford? how long did it take? the only thing president roosevelt said in public that day was to pray that prayer we heard a moment ago. as june unfolded, as summer unfolded how did the enormity of that loss sink in at home? >> well i think the scene in

"saving private ryan" the telegrams sent out from the war department it would be ten days to two weeks before the word got back to that small town about the casualties. in my own family oddly enough my uncle gerald who was killed at midway the battle of midway june 6, 1942 his mother my grandmother, they did not find out about his death until early in july right before the fourth of july and then it was only a telegram listing the fact that he was missing in action. there was another couple of weeks, well into july, before he was clearly declared dead by the war department. >> coming up he made james bond cool again but now pierce bronson is taking the helm of a new spy series. >> he joins us next. keep it here on "morning joe."

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>> that was a scene from "the november man." we sat down with the star of the film earlier this year pierce brosnan. >> couldn't we all be that cool to walk away with an explosion with no expression on our face? >> there's an "snl" skit about that? >> yeah. this was a blast of a picture to do on the streets of belgrade. they welcomed us into serbia and gave us the world. >> a real departure from the

"bond" franchise. looking at what you went through to shoot this you look fantastic. you're not a young man. how did you physically -- >> i'm not a young man! >> is was going so well. >> whoa whoa whoa. i got broad shoulders. i can take it. how did i do it? stamina. hard work. this is from a group of books from bill granger. this is book number seven. took five years in the making to put the picture together and raise the money, et cetera. i did it with my company and that's just my partner. and so it just seemed like timing was right to go back on the stage into the game of espionage. >> listen, young man -- >> thank you, pat. >> or not so young man. we irishmen always look good.

don't forget that. we age well. there's some depth to this guy. a lot of these movies come out and it's shoot them up and that sort of thing. you get the feeling that this guy has feelings and depth and there's a blanket there. there's a pathway there. >> that's a testament to bill granger's work in the series of books "the november man" and the character's name is peter and he has a complexity to him and depth and layers and he's a sassy operative in a cultured bad ass. >> cultured bad ass. that's what i want to be. >> obviously playing bond for years a big part of who you are. now you say, okay another espionage. do you go in a little bit more skeptical? it better be that good before i get into the spy game again. >> it better be different, right? >> you want to be an unexpected surprise. you hope to be an unexpected

surprise. you know after the bond moved away stage left out of my life and the curtain kind of dropped unexpectedly, there was a kind of void there and there was an itch to do something within the spy genre but it didn't feel right, the timing of it. and it was somewhat unfinished business just as i was getting the hang of it. i was gone it felt like. my partner and i wanted to really do something like this with these books. as i say, there's been enough time and distance between my time as bond and now. >> i had little girls. this had to be your scariest role because you were singing. i watched that 15 times. i was thinking to myself i bet this is scary stuff. >> it was terrifying. i think the three of us morning

we went into the studio to record those songs we were just deer in the headlights. >> we can't talk about movie roles without talking about the movie "mrs. doubtfire" especially with the passing of robin williams and great scenes you have in that movie with robin as mrs. doubtfire. you're trying to take miranda away. as we look at that a lot of that was ad-lib. i love your face at dinner when the teeth go in his wine glass. all of that seems so unexpected. >> cheers to health. >> oops. >> oh my god. sorry about that. just one moment.

>> this was a joyous movie for any actor to be part of. i was a huge robin williams fan. i absolutely adored him. no one made me laugh like robin williams. and the job for me came at the most wonderful time of my life. "mrs. doubtfire." the sequence of which you speak was outrageous because it my close-up in that sequence and there was no one there. kids weren't there. robin just ripped it up and was as rude and crude and as funny and it's very difficult to keep a straight face when you have someone that comic genius you stand back and follow his lead. >> stay with us. we'll be right back. these ally bank ira cds really do sound like a sure thing but i'm a bit skeptical of sure things. why's that? look what daddy's got...

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good morning. welcome to "morning joe." all this morning we are taking a look at some of our biggest interviews of the year. >> we're going to start with those individuals whose influence and power we feel both here at home and abroad and they all joined us the same exact week. >> joining us now on set, the secretary of state john kerry. great to have you onboard, sir. >> good to be here. >> good to have you back. >> let's start with the overarching question who is in coalition in the muslim world and beyond standing with us? >> we have more