r husband dead on the floor with a gun near him and the son had vanished. she reported to police that she feared her own son had committed this act. >> thank you. boehner looks lamer. mcdonnell goes to the slammer, and david duke defends steve scalise. have a nice day, republicans, and let's play "hardball." ♪ ♪ >> good evening, i'm chris matthews in washington. put this day, january 6, 2015 down as a bad day for republicans. a top governor who was on mitt romney's short list for vice president is sent to prison today. 25 members of congress, all republicans vote to dump john boehner from the speakership. a stunning rebuke for the history books.

and john lewis demands that boehner's number three man apologize for hanging out with the neo-nazi crowd. no, it was not a good day for the republican party. we have it all tonight wrapped up as one big whoopee cushion for a political party that keeps getting dragged back in by the tea party. a party that says it can govern, but has a top governor heading to the pen. i was reading your column today. i think you got it right. but let's talk about this republican party today. 25 people, this has never, ever happened -- 25 members of the republican party in the congress today voted against boehner to continue. they want him out. i've never heard of anything like this. >> it's the largest rebuke of a speaker from his own party, at least, in a century. but you have to remember, two

years ago, depending on how you count, 12, 16, who had a rebellion as well. i actually think they sort of shot their whole load here. the fringe of the republican party, there are 25 of those guys -- >> but didn't they shoot a line across his bow to say, look, you think you can escape the right-wing of this party and do reasonable things. we're sitting here, 25 people willing to vote against you. >> i think that was their intention. but they shot and they missed. now john boehner is going to say, great, you two dozen, i don't need you anymore. if you're not with me, i can get two dozen democrats here. this is why freedom works was saying this is our last best chance to assert our will here. >> are you that optimistic about boehner's ability to escape this crowd? 25 guys saying you're not our speaker. >> dana stole my line. there's not more exhilarating than being shot at and missed. this is a good day for republicans, not only did they take the house and mcconnell has been sworn in in the senate. john boehner he knows the guys

are going to vote no against him. they're going to vote no down the line on a lot of stuff. but john boehner has an opportunity to work with mitch mcconnell to get stuff done and they're going to do it. >> here's the headline tonight. the revolt was set into motion, thanks to republican louie gohmert. he led the charge by announcing he was running against boehner for the leadership post. others then joined the fight. gohmert was cheered on by the right-wing media, and some in the grassroots. but in case you need reminding, this is the man they were rallying behind in their revolt against boehner. this is louie gohmert. >> i had one guy that was particularly out of line, and i warned him three times and then we duct taped his head and we didn't hear from him until it was his turn to talk. >> that was when you were a judge? >> that was when i was a judge. >> this administration has so many muslim brotherhood that have influence that they just are making wrong decisions for america.

>> there's no assurance that if we did that we wouldn't end up with mugu dog pan or mugu cat pan, there's no way to assure that money will not be wasted when it's sent to foreign countries. >> the attorney general failed to answer my question -- [ all speak at once ] >> order, mr. chairman. >> -- aspersions on my asparagus. >> i don't know what you think about him. what do you think of gohmert? he's a republican member who led a revolt, got 25 votes against john boehner. sane people voted against boehner. he said if we give foreign aid to foreign countries, they'll be eating dog food? >> he only got four votes. >> let's get through these people. stephen king, a member of your caucus voted against him. what do you think of stephen king? is he completely insane? >> he's made a name for himself being anti-immigration.

he voted against boehner because he thinks boehner will do something on immigration. and i think boehner will do something on immigration -- >> he's the guy with the cantaloupe legs, right? >> yes. >> who are this other guy, representative yoho, what's his story? is he has good as his name? >> he used to do work with animals. he was a -- >> these are strange people in your party. you said this menagerie has been tamed that boehner doesn't care about these people. they were willing to dump him from the speakership. >> in many ways, what boehner has done is given them a free vote. he said there would be no retribution. when tip o'neil was speaker, if you voted against him, you were in big trouble. boehner said i'm not going to do it that way. >> you got a right-wing media that competes with you. catch this crowd. the right-wing championed the movement to dethrone boehner today. and made gohmert a hero for igniting the revolt.

>> is it time for new leadership in the house of representatives? to put it bluntly, i think it's time for a new speaker. if i were to ask anybody in a poll, any city, what is speaker boehner's agenda? they would not be able to answer that question. >> you got to hand it to gohmert. he has guts, right? the old saying, if you're going to shoot the king, you better kill the king, right? not to get too graphic. we don't want him to shoot anybody, but you know what i'm saying. you better actually take him out. >> there is no regular order. they write these mass of bills under boehner and shove them on the floor as if he's nancy pelosi. boehner doesn't want a fight within the republican party. he would rather kowtow to obama. >> can you imagine listening to that voice around the house? >> for hours a day. >> the leader of the activist group freedom works said

gohmert's mission to overthrow boehner also whipped the grassroots into a frenzy. in your piece, he's quoted as saying, from a grassroots perspective, this is probably the hottest issue we've mobilized on since obamacare. i think louie gohmert would make a great speaker. >> he would certainly make a great speaker from my point of view, but it would be endlessly entertaining. >> you could write a column every day about him. >> i was watching today and it was a circus. you had two dozen lunatics trying to take over the asylum, but the guys running the asylum were laughing at them. kevin mccarthy laughing when gohmert voted for himself and when these other guys are giving their nomination speeches. i think there was open ridicule from the establishment. >> i like boehner as a person. because he seems like a person, even though i disagree with him. a poll taken at the end of last year, a few weeks ago, shows that 60%, 3 of 5 republicans nationwide want a new speaker of the house.

only 25% said they'd re-elect boehner to the post. so the clown car, all the crazy people like yoho, speak for the majority of republicans in the country. more than boehner does. explain, lucy. why are the crazies in the republican party have the dominant thought? >> this poll was done by a big democrat. >> oh. >> blame the messenger. >> and look at the poll more deeply, they don't have an alternative and they didn't have an alternative. this is not a vote that goes to the country. it's a vote that goes with the colleagues. >> but why does the country prefer the nut cases? >> because the country hates congress and always hates congress. look at the approval ratings. boehner is being responsible and he's going to get stuff done. >> we should remember, two years from now, john boehner is not going to be interested in being the speaker and it's going to be passed on possibly to the david

duke set. so they don't have too long to wait until -- >> before we finish this, scalise, want to get to it later in the show. can he survive as a member of the republican leadership having hung out with david duke? >> he didn't hang out with david duke. i like to give the facts. scalise is a good guy. >> he's apologized for doing it. >> i know he apologized. i'd like too see what the facts are on this whole case. scalise will survive and i think he'll do a good job. >> just so you get yourself in this corner, if the facts are and they've been established, that he spoke to a group called the european whatever group, run and created by the co-founding -- was founded by david duke, you're saying if he did speak at that group, then what? >> listen -- >> no, you said the facts aren't there. >> i want to know what the facts are. >> if he spoke to the group that duke spoke at -- >> he's already apologized.

>> you're in a corner. >> you're saying he didn't do it. >> i don't think he did. >> but if he did -- >> he certainly doesn't have a clear memory. >> why did he apologize for doing it? >> because it's better to apologize now. >> for hanging out with nazis? you don't apologize for that if he didn't do it. >> he spoke to white supremacists, i think it says volumes that the republican party in the house is trying to run out john boehner and not steve scalise. >> listen, i think scalise is a good whip, he's a good man and a good congressman and i think he'll stick around. >> that's good for the democrats. they'll never forget this. this is on their happy list. dana milbank defending nobody. john defending steve scalise. coming up, bob mcdonnell, once a rising star in the republican party, was on the short list to be mitt romney's running mate not so long ago, is going to the federal pen for a couple years. mcdonnell was sentenced today to two years behind bars.

and later, more on the festering problem for republicans that's not going away. as long as steve scalise stays in leadership, i believe the party has a chronic illness. do they really want to send the message that it's okay to associate with neo-nazi groups? this is "hardball," the place for politics. boy: once upon a time, there was a nice house that lived with a family. one day, it started to rain. the house tried to keep out all the water, but water got inside and ruined everybody's everythings. the house thought she let the family down. they just didn't think it could happen. they told the house they would take better care of her... always.

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as i said in court, i am a fallen human being. i've made mistakes in my life. i always try to put the best interest of the people first as governor.

but i have failed at times and some of the judgments that i have made during the course of my governorship have hurt myself, my family, and my beloved people of virginia, and for that i am deeply, deeply sorry. >> well, welcome back to "hardball." that's former virginia governor bob mcdonnell, once a rising star in the republican party. sentenced today to two years in prison on corruption charges for taking bribes from a slick businessman with business interests before the state. to put it in perspective, what an epic fall from grace this is. consider these items from his resume. he was on the short list to be mitt romney's running mate two years ago. he was selected to give the republican response to president obama's first state of the union address. he was widely considered a future presidential contender himself. but a jury decided that the gifts he accepted from a businessman represented bribes. a new rolex wife a gift from his

wife, but purchased by williams. and mcdonnell behind the wheel of williams' ferrari sealed his fate. he reports to prison on february 9th. what do you make of this, rosalyn? because i look at this from a couple directions. one is, you know, with this all criminal behavior, he doesn't think he was a criminal, and yet he is. this is a big change in the way we look at what used to be considered the petty crap that goes on in politics, but now seen as felonious and worthy of serious prison time. >> yeah, i mean, the prosecutors argued in this case that there was a quid pro quo with the businessman and the jury heard six weeks of testimony and concluded that they agreed. the businessman gave a series of luxury gifts and $120,000 in low-interest, undocumented loans. and the jury found at least that mr. mcdonnell had used state government to sort of help him hawk his dietary supplement.

>> in the past, i think about all the people in politics who got breaks on interest rates, sweetheart deals on interest rates, and it was a bad day at work, but it doesn't put a person away for two years. what do you make of this? is it a message to politicians and their friends, be damn careful any time you take anything from anybody that you didn't earn? >> yeah, absolutely. the prosecutors today said they wanted to send the message and said that this verdict in september and the prison sentence today did send that message, that, look, if you've got a slick businessman who wants something from state government and he's around you, showering you with things, offering you bank loans that you could not get from a commercial institution, you know, he probably wants something. and if you take it, they're going to be watching. >> well said, good reporting rosalyn from "the washington post." joining me now, paul butler and criminal defense attorney brian weiss who represented texas

congressman tom delay who's money laundering charges were overturned. thank you for joining us. when i got my first job at the white house, a friend of mine said, have you met any new friends? and i think mr. weiss, that's what happens in politics. if you get a position of any significance, new people start hanging around that you've never met before and they want to give you stuff, they want to hang out with you, they want to be your friend. what's the message for politicians who have been lucky to get elected, like the new members of congress today? >> well, it's like our moms tell us, if you lay down with dogs, you wake up with fleas. be very careful of the people that you let hang around you. this is a federal prosecution. this was not a state prosecution of bogus proportion like delay. a jury agreed this was more than just business as usual. and it's funny because those of us who watch the cowboy game on sunday looked up in jerry jones' booth and saw chris christie.

well, you know, probably business as usual. probably a couple of good old boys, but i'm telling you -- >> is he allowed to take a free ride to a football game? is he allowed to sit in a booth and accept those favors from an owner of a team? is he allowed to? he must think he is. >> well, certainly he thinks so. and i think he is. because most states have an exception to what we call the preexisting friendship rule. if you and i are good friends prior to you achieving office or aspiring as some great governmental figure, then you and i can exchange gifts and i can go to your hospitality booth and the owner's booth at arlington stadium. but again, the best advice anybody could give anybody in this business is, watch who you spend quality time with. >> i want to talk about the notion of quid pro quo. most people think a crime is when you do something for somebody who did you a favor.

that's the crime. was there a quid pro quo here? did he actually do things, the governor? didn't strike me there were the kind of things, he lent his prestige to this guy. the intangibles. i never thought that would constitute a crime. but it seems the jury did. >> this was far from a slam dunk for the prosecution. the government had a creative theory, but they persuaded 12 peers of governor mcdonnell. so the message is, it's no longer busy as usual. you scratch my back, i scratch yours. that's how politics works. what attorney general holder has said is that he wants to use federal prosecutions to go after the big fish. under previous attorney generals, it's been low-level drug offenders who have gotten a lot of attention. he's saying public corruption is his public enemy number one. >> let's underline this. is this coming from eric holder? is he the spirit of this new

aggressive progression of people of civil abuse? >> i think that's absolutely right. i don't think that the judge in this case is necessarily on board. because if we consider that mcdonnell was looking at a minimum of eight years under the federal sentencing guidelines and he only gets two years, we have to ask whether that reflects the gravity of his criminal conduct. this is a man who never accepted responsibility. he lies under oath, according to the jury. he throws his wife under the bus and then gets his own kids throw their mom under the bus. the average joe who steals $175,000 gets a lot more than two years. we have to ask if this were a young black man, would this judge have given him the same benefit, still separate and unequal in criminal justice. >> let me talk about that. if you steal a car and the car is worth 50,000 bucks, that's grand theft auto. that means you go to jail for five or ten years, i don't know. >> absolutely. governor mcdonnell isn't even going to jail for as long as he was governor of the state, whose office he put up for sale.

>> i did like your defense of tom delay. i thought that smelled of a lot of stuff that goes on in texas. i wish there was a straight prosecution down there for once. it reminds me of pakistan. you lose an election, they prosecute you down there. it just seems like that. everybody's either hard right or hard left. and ticked off at the other side to the point they can't even think straight. so this case, however, it was almost like they took this pristine family, church-going family, that must have thought they were perfect people in many ways, i mean, i did like the fact the governor said today he's not a perfect guy, but he thought he was, i think. when he took that rolex watch, that's what grabbed me. why would a guy walk around with a single -- there he is flashing it, a symbol of corruption. he knew that johnny williams bought that watch, that his wife didn't, why would he want to walk around flashing the damn thing like he's a kept person? what's that about? >> the problem with being the governor of the virginia or the owner of the dallas cowboys,

sometimes you actually start to believe you can walk between -- >> you have got it out for governor christie. you've stuck it in twice now. go ahead. >> chris, i'm a huge chris christie fan. but look, there's two kinds of people in the criminal justice system and i've learned over the last three decades. there are people who we are afraid of, predators, and people who we're mad at. i think the governor falls into the latter category, mcdonnell, not christie. this is a situation where he had a 21st century version of a lady macbeth wife who wanted to live the good life and dragged him into this relationship with a chucklehead, the proverbial snake oil salesman. and this monumental fall from grace is the ultimate tragedy. politicians, whatever we may think of them, are human beings. whether you're governor mcdonnell or tom delay, these aren't people who we definitely do not need to warehouse.

>> we don't always do what we want, but be responsible for who we are. so true, no matter how you did it or why you did it, you did it. thank you both. coming up, u.s. congressman steve israel of new york and his very funny new novel from the sublime to the ridiculous. we're going right now to the place for politics, right here.

welcome back to "hardball." there's no shortage of books published by lawmakers in washington these days. it's almost a prerequisite for anyone with a political career, especially those seeking the presidency. but a book out today breaks the mold of what you'd expect. it's a novel. it's called the global war on morris. it's set in 2004, it's the fictionalized of morris feldstein, an unambitious pharmaceutical salesman from long island who is mistakenly identified as a terrorist during the bush administration's war on terrorist. including people like karl rove,

and the inimitable vice president dick cheney. it's a laugh-out-loud political satire about government surveillance, public paranoia and an overzealous white house using national security to score points. it's a work of fiction, but as every good satirist knows there's a grain of truth behind it. congressman, i'm overwhelmed. i grew up with real comedians, the guys that made you just laugh. not sort of chuckle like with bill cosby, but laugh your butt off like phil silvers. i know what funny is. this book is really, really, really, really funny. >> thank you. >> and i couldn't stop laughing at it. it was outrageous. you got this jewish guy from long island, you can't understand how everything could go wrong with his life and yet there's something real about it.

tell me this, why are you so good at this writing thing and you're supposed to be a politician? politicians can't write. what's going on here? >> when i was growing up, i wanted to serve in college, be a novelist and play outfield for the mets. i was horrific at baseball. i focused on the other two and it worked. >> this guy, a traveling salesman, spend their day driving around with sales quotas they can't meet, kids that don't respect them, often times a spouse that doesn't like them all that much, and yet somehow he falls under the surveillance of the -- what is it? the national security agency. and they go after this guy. here's an excerpt from your book. it's a description of vice president dick cheney, which i particularly like. let's go. there he was at the far end of the room, leaning on his desk, his arms spread and his wrists

locked, vice president richard cheney. the editorial cart don't do cheney justice. they didn't capture the permanent sneer, the upturned lip that made it look like he was always on the verge of spitting from the side of his face. the way he seemed to duck his chin beneath his collar like a turtle retreating into his shell. the thinning white hair above the skeptical eyes. he was all the more frightening in person. have you shared this with the vice president? >> i have not. and at any time i'm missing three days, check with him. i'm not sure he's busting down the door to buy this book. i would attend meetings with president bush and vice president cheney, leading up to the war where they were trying to convince us that saddam hussein had weapons of mass destruction. i would watch and observe what

was happening, and i began writing those description says as soon as i came out of those meetings and i'm taking readers behind the scenes in washington through the book. >> the great thing about the book, it sounds like it could actually happen. here's a middle class family, not the happiest people in the world, but the wife goes down to florida. they have a condo down there and she does this guy, who is a sleeper sell guy, an arab guy, who was waiting to become part of an attack on the united states, and she gives them the use of their condo, which ties all this together for the nsa. it's a gloriously funny book, up there with thomas wolf -- tom wolf. the book's called the global war on morris. congratulations, congressman. >> thank you, chris. glad you enjoyed it. up next, what should republicans do about steve scalise? he's their number three man in the house and he spoke to a

neo-nazi group. yes, he did. he's apologized for it. this is a chronic problem for the party, it ain't going away. you're watching "hardball," the place for politics. nearly half a million cars were stolen in 2012, but for every car stolen 34 people had their identities stolen. identity thieves can steal your money, damage your credit and wreak havoc on your life. why risk it when you can help protect yourself from identity theft with one call to lifelock, the leader in identity-theft protection? lifelock actively patrols your sensitive, personal information every second of every day, helping to guard your social security number, your bank accounts and credit, even the equity in your home -- your valuable personal assets. look. your bank may alert you to suspicious activity on your credit or debit card. but that still may leave you vulnerable to big losses if a thief opens new accounts in your name or decides to drain your savings, home equity, or retirement accounts. and your credit report may only tell you after your identity's been compromised. but lifelock is proactive protection

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welcome back. a chronic illness. that's what house republican steve scalise has become for his party. today politico reported he's been so damaged by this scandal, his political viability is in

question. they write, scalise's job as house majority whip remains safe, but he may be too toxic for some republican circles. senior figures doubt that the corporate chieftains and rich donors will give him money to keep campaign coffers filled. it would be civil for lawmakers to support the house republican agenda. today john lewis told the huffington post, i think somehow in some way he should come clean, say what he did, apologize to members of congress, to his colleagues on both the republican and democratic side of the aisle. scalise will take part in a press conference with the rest of the republican leadership tomorrow, his first time facing reporters since the scandal surfaced. i'm joined by msnbc political analyst joan walsh. and michael steele. and the huffington post sabrina siddiqui. i want to ask sabrina, has this

got legs, as we say in journalism? will we be talking about this until scalise leaves? >> absolutely. i think there's palpable concern in the republican caucus that this problem isn't going to go away, especially with the amount of focus on his background. you have reporters looking into it, democratic operatives looking into it. there's always potential they could dig up more. talking to some republicans today on capitol hill, they're concerned that there could be more information that comes out about his association with the white supremacist group as well as the fact that his job is, as you said, to raise money, and they don't think -- >> how do you go to donors, mr. chairman, asking them for money if this guy has neo-nazi connections, that he's worked with holocaust deniers? how do you do it? >> you go very carefully. [ laughter ] and you do a lot of -- a lot of

prep beforehand and there are a lot of advance phone calls to make sure the meeting will take place. yeah, this is going to be an issue, i think, and the leadership -- well, the rank and file members should be and are rightly concerned. the leadership doesn't seem to be. they seem to have closed the tents on this and said, we're going to roll with this as long as nothing else comes out. and that remains to be seen. i think it's going to be a very interesting problem for the leadership to have, and i think ultimately, chris, it knocks down the messaging. it takes -- >> sure. this isn't the minority group they were looking to reach out to, was it? and you mentioned something before we came on tonight, which is that he's taken the place of eric kanter who is jewish. and here's a guy identifying with the worst possibly anti-semitic crowd around. >> neo-nazis takes the place of the one jewish person in

republican leadership. which is weird and tragic. and it's stepping all over their message. should have been a better day. john boehner beat back a challenge. and i think the story is sticking around. i think the real problem, despite what he says, that he didn't know, how do you not know that david duke runs this organization? the chicago cubs triple a team, not known for their political expertise. they wouldn't stay at that hotel because they knew that the conference was going on there. and steve scalise, a local -- >> it was a bad day when david duke himself is out there defending you. last night duke told fox news that while he doesn't know if scalise spoke at his group's event, he knows he was at least scheduled to appear. he knew that, and the two also squared off about duke's racial and political beliefs. let's watch bill o'reilly go after david duke here. >> don't sit here and tell me you're not trying to promote the cause of white people, because you are. >> look, i am absolutely -- i love my people, my heritage. i want to preserve my heritage like every people does.

>> preserve your heritage? what does that mean? >> how about european heritage? the people that run the media, they're enflaming the african americans against european americans. but the truth s the real people, who are repressing and hurting all of us are the big bankers which are robbing us blind like the goldman sachs of the world. putting us in wars for israel -- >> the one thing you said, i want to get everybody on board with this, congressman scalise was scheduled -- >> he did not go to a white supremacist meeting if he went at all. >> but he was scheduled to speak to your group. >> there you have it. by the way, he believes he's a part of the superior race. why has he had so much plastic surgery? if he's one of the elite, what happened to this guy? >> this is the price the republican leaders pay for trying to elect a member into leadership to kind of serve as a bow to the hard right-wing of their caucus.

>> he was challenged by the hard right-wing, by the birthers -- >> he was challenging, but he was the conservative -- >> what do you think of yoho and that crowd? they think the president is an illegal immigrant because they can't stand the fact that he's an african american as president. so they're not that far -- not the republicans, the tea party types -- >> scalise has said he agrees with david duke on certain conservative issues and that the only thing that's wrong, the first thing that's wrong with david duke, he's unelectable. >> who said he said that he was david duke without the baggage? >> a reporter, a trustworthy reporter. >> it was said from the white house podium. >> it shouldn't originate with josh earnest. >> what do you think, sabrina? >> does he remain in leadership? i don't think so.

>> the white house did weigh in. they said yesterday they didn't mind taking a question about the scalise scandal and here was, as you mentioned, josh earnest speaking out on this issue. >> there's no arguing that who republicans decide to elevate into a leadership position says a lot about who -- what the conference's priorities and values are. and ultimately mr. scalise reportedly described himself as david duke without the baggage. so it will be up to republicans to decide what that says about their conference. >> that was josh earnest. referring to a report by stephanie grace who recently wrote, this is what i remember about the first time i met steve scalise nearly 20 years ago. he told me he was like david duke without the baggage. he's still got the baggage. up next, is the republican party finally ready to give up their fight against same-sex marriage, it's not clear. it might be at the edge here. this is "hardball," the place for politics.

president obama is getting out of washington to tout good news on the economy and preview his state of the union. his first stop, detroit, where he'll celebrate the auto industry's big comeback. on thursday it's on to phoenix to talk about how the housing market has improved. on friday, he'll be in knoxville tennessee to push new student initiatives.

we'll be right back.

we're back. a ban on same-sex marriage, a ban expired yesterday in the state of florida, making that state the 36th state in the country where gay marriage is now legal. that state's former republican governor jeb bush now a likely republican candidate in 2016, released a statement, saying, we live in a democracy. and regardless of our disagreement, we have to respect the rule of law. i hope we can also show respect for the good people on all sides of the gay and lesbian marriage issue, including couples making lifetime commitments to each other who are seeking greater legal protections and those of us who believe marriage is a

sacrament and want to safe guard religious liberty. this marks an evolution in bush's thinking. back in '94 he wrote in an opd, striking a different tone. he wrote, should sodomy be elevated to the same constitutional status as race and religion, my answer is no. as he carefully tries to thread the needle on an issue that a majority of american support, how will the rest of his party treat same-sex marriages? my question is, how do you bridge the gap between jeb who is now accommodating the facts that the courts have ruled we have a right to same-sex marriage, not the supremes, but the other courts, with a guy like mike huckabee whos he'll quit the party if they don't keep their fight up against same-sex? >> i guess jeb will hand him his walking papers. what jeb is saying, is the party

needs to be in a different space and in line and consistent with his position on immigration, where he talks about it from a human perspective, real people who are going through these very personal journeys. whether i agree or disagree with his position on gay marriage is irrelevant. what's important to note, he's framing the conversation in a different way. the question is whether or not the party's going to move into that conversation. whether there can be an open discussion -- because the party's always taken the view that, hey, let the states decide. so now the states are deciding -- >> the courts and the states. >> let the courts and the states decide. now that it's being done -- >> he points out they're doing it in a non-sexual way, which is fairly appropriate. if you're a republican you say, if they want legal protection for somebody

>> frying to get there. it's very different from what he said in '94. there's no talk of sodomy. and it is a lot like -- it's a lot like what he said about immigration. >> can he stay in muster? >> i think new hampshire will buy this. >> and south carolina. >> i think it's a come passionate conservative playbook. >> his brother is all for constitutional amendment. the whole thing. >> but i think it does pass muster in iowa. by the time we get to that discussion in iowa a year from now, i think yes, absolutely. >> where do they get people in your republican party are just going to mutiny and say enough of this crap. we were born gay, you know i'm gay fw. why do you give me this stuff. >> what a lot of gay republicans have done, they're marching very quietly behind the scenes. they don't need to be out in front, they don't need to wave the banners.

they've been going to various county ant e and state and party functions and establishing a presence in a voice. that's a very important way. >> here's where the voice hadn't e hasn't reached, the republican platform right now. >> that's the deal with the sodomy. >> believe me, it's the polygamy. >> you mean the thinking -- >> they believe if you go with gay marriage, the next thing is polygamy. >> it's the right of primary with a very similar position. he talked about civil unions, he talked about the need to treat a sensitive issue with respect and that the matter should be left up to the states and ultimately, he should survive the primary with embracing gay marriage.

and that's something we'll have to see how it plays in the general election. >> but the plat form will really not look any different, i predict. >> no, the platform won't look any different. that is a moral consensus that a lot of the party leadership and activists have kind of put in place there. that's a lot of individuals and state parties and others act up. >> i've been thinking if hi e hillary runs a great campaign rngs she's unbeatable. but if she runs a mediocre campaign like last time, she's beatble. if the republican party is dumb enough to plant their feet in opposition to same-sex marriage, they are going to lose the general election no matter how bad a campaign hillary clinton runs. they're going to lose to her. >> it's how others in the party deal with this issue. jeb is setting a standard. he's put a point out there. now, let's see how that's responded to by the party

officials who want to run. >> but to go back to romney's example, which is a good one, the way that romney got through with a very conservative base was that these right wing people fought each other. we're going to have that again. we're going to have huckabee and rand paul -- >> how can a libertarianism be against same-sex? >> that still doesn't change my political views, necessarily. as a conservative or a live ral. >> and i don't believe e believe in the blue plate special, either. >>. >> i have some objections to the normal fare. michael steele, sabrina sadicki.

>> stay around for the yutz. this is joe during the full cry during the swearings in today. he is in love with this moment. you're watching "hardball," the place for politics. [ male announcer ] take zzzquil and sleep like... the kids went to nana's house... for the whole weekend! [ snoring ] [ male announcer ] zzzquil, the non habit forming sleep aid that helps you sleep easily and wake refreshed. because sleep is a beautiful thing.

let me finish tonight on a lighter note. today, as we've been reporting, is opening day of the new congress. having worked up there for a number of years myself, what a happy occasion this is for senators and members of congress and especially their young children and grandchildren. it's really unlike anything else up there in capitol hill. it's as if the politicians took the day off and simply enjoyed the honor enjoying elected to serve. one can really get into this sort of thing is vice president joe biden. his ability to simply get goofy somehow seems to fit this occasion. opening day of congress, like no other. here the vip is pretending to speak for the grandson of senate majority leader, mitch mcconnell. >> have you talked to democrats? >> and here he is chating up a member of a totally different

generation. the grandmother of senator corey gardener of colorado. >> ready? how are you? my name is joe biden, vice president. how are you doing? well, well, i know. and i just swore in your grandson. [ laughter ] >> anyway, finally, here he is, bewailing the hard-earned experience of fatherhood to a teenage girl. >> yes, being a father of a teenage girl can be an exercise in front-line combat where you never know at any given minute whether is best friend or mortal enemy. anyway, it's back to where you really know who your enemies are. that's "hardball." "all in" with chris hayes starts

right now. >> tonight on "all in." >> i am not doing this. >> yes, you are. >> joe biden was bidening, senators were exchanging hog castration devices on the hill. welcome to your 114th congress. >> this house will continue to be led by a proud son of ohio. >> tonight, the republican mutiny that almost managed to topple john boehner. a republican david duke problem persists. plus, the new mini scandal over chris christie's upholding in