that i could call my own was so important... . ...you know it just makes you feel like a person again. every 8 minutes the american red cross responds to a home fire or other emergency. you can help. please donate now. ♪ hello. welcome to "taking the hill." i'm patrick murphy. we have a great show ahead. today the u.s. military is back in iraq with plans on expanding its mission for syria. only 1% of americans serve in uniform. is it time to end the all-volunteer military? i want to talk with an army general who's calling for major changes. the minority of americans who serve take on our full weight of

war and it's showing. every day 22 veterans commit suicide. we're going to take a look at the oscar-nominated documentary showing the people at the va. but first, major headlines in the middle east today. we start with the situation in yemen. thousands have taken to the streets in protest against rebels who have tightened control over the capital city. the u.s.-backed president of yemen resigned friday. the volatile situation in yemen has led to reports that it's having an effect on u.s. counterterrorism operations there, a claim that president barack obama is pushing back on. he spoke about it this morning in a joint press conference with india's prime minister. >> i saw some news reports that suggested somehow that counterterrorism activity had been suspended. that is not accurate.

we continue to go after high-value targets inside of yemen, and we will continue to maintain the pressure that's required to keep the american people safe. >> let's get to nbc's kristen welker, who's live at the white house. why are we seeing this type of defense from the president? >> well patrick, i think the president felt the need to come out strongly to refute some of the reports that we've seen in recent days that the u.s. counterterrorism strategy would be impacted by the unrest in yemen. the administration being very firm in this point that it is in fact not going to impact the counterterrorism strategy there. but certainly there are big questions. the president made two points today. he said the united states' two key priorities are first protecting u.s. personnel in the region. we know there have been a number of diplomats who have been evacuated in recent days. although, important to underskoerpunder underscore the point the embassy does remain open. he said u.s. counterterrorism

measures will continue in yemen. this is an area where we see aqap al qaeda in the arabian peninsula. the united states has said it is very important to stomp out that threat. it's worked hand in hand with president hadi in doing that. a little bit of background on this patrick, the united states started its counterterrorism measures back in 2002 but increased the communication and the coordination with yemen once president hadi did take control. that, of course includes drone strikes. now that president hadi has resigned, the big question is what happens? the houthi rebels who have taken control, are opposed to u.s. drone strikes. so it's hard to see there won't be some measure, some type of impact at least when you're thinking about coordination and intelligence. having said that the united states very firm that stomping out aqap is a broader part of attacking militants and going after extremists. so they're making the point right now that that's not going to be impacted.

the united states monitoring what's happening very closely right now in yemen as president obama continues with his travels in india. patrick? >> kristen, thank you so much for joining us today. japan today condemned the execution of a japanese captive held by isis militants, and it's demanding the remaining hostage be released. president obama this morning called japan's prime minister to offer his condolences. isis posted a picture of the japanese freelance journalist holding what appears to be a photograph of his fellow japanese hostage beheaded. a message with the photo said he would be next. nbc news chief foreign correspondent richard engel is monitoring the story from istanbul. what's behind the latest isis tactic? >> as you know from your own time in iraq, al qaeda in iraq was a formidable enemy, an organized group. the u.s. thought at one stage it had defeated or at least seriously weakened al qaeda in

iraq. but this latest demand from isis shows that al qaeda in iraq has just changed. it has moved to syria. it has transformed itself into isis. and the reason the latest video from isis makes it so clear is look at demand. isis apparently killed one of the two japanese hostages. in exchange for the other japanese hostage, isis is asking not for the $200 million anymore. it is asking for the release of a woman that most of the world had forgotten about. she's been held in a jor dane yan prison for nearly a decade. she was sent to do a suicide mission in 2005 by the leader of al qaeda in iraq. clearly that organization never forgot about her. still dreams about her freedom, still wants her to be released and is asking for her to be

released in exchange for the japanese hostage. no other organization would be interested in this woman. it is al qaeda in iraq that left iraq, moved into syria, found a new home in the chaos of the civil war in syria, and is still fighting. not necessarily fighting against just u.s. troops in iraq but fighting a global battle. >> nbc's richard engel, thanks so much for joining us today. joining me now to discuss all this and much more is democratic congressman seth walton, a member of the armed services committee and the budget committee and a former marine corps captain who served four tours in iraq. seth thanks so much for joining us here today on "taking the hill." >> great to be here. >> i want to start with isis. secretary kerry said this past week that u.s. air strikes have killed 50% of its leadership and all told about 6,000 foreign fighters. but a year after isis bursting on the scene, it's show nothing

signs of going away. is the u.s. strategy working from your perspective? >> i think we have to have a broader strategy. if you look back at what happened with this dramatic expansion of isis from syria into western and then northern iraq they didn't just defeat the iraqi army. the iraqi army put their weapons down and went home because they had lost faith in iraq's sectarian government under prime minister maliki. so what that tells us is that fundamentally, it's a political problem in many dimensions. at the end of the day, iraq has got to be able to defend its own borders and protect its own people. but to do that, the iraqi army has to have faith in its government. i'd like to see us putting a lot more effort into ensuring we have a table, trustworthy iraqi government that its own army can follow. >> yeah seth it's the battle for the 20 million sunnis. how about on a personal level? you and i both served in iraq. what's your reaction when you

see an enemy like isis driving u.s. vehicles and using our weapons and holding ground that we both lost friends fighting for? >> it's incredibly frustrating. it's incredibly frustrating. certainly one of the lessons we've learned from iraq is that you not only have to be very careful going into wars you also have to be very careful how we come out. and that's certainly a lesson that i hope will apply to afghanistan today. but as someone who fought in iraq and who worked with the iraqi army and who kept going back to try to put the country back together it's very sad to see it falling apart. the reality is that we actually had a pretty stable iraq after the surge. but we didn't follow through with the political support that was really needed. and you know, it shouldn't have been a surprise. ambassador crocker and general petraeus came back from the surge and basically said two things. first of all, the surge has been

incredibly successful militarily. but it has not made as much political progress as we need. so they called for a diplomatic surge. we built the largest u.s. embassy in the world in baghdad. but then we left it half full. >> yeah. and with a new prime minister there, hopefully things are going in the right track. i guess time will tell. >> you know, he's saying the right things but we need to see results. >> i would agree. now, there's a growing debate about the white house's refusal to discuss radical islam and terrorism. they won't even use the phrase. now we're seeing criticism from the left too. your colleague, another iraq war veteran, called it disturbing and frustrating. is there a problem with white house being too sensitive to address the real issue here? >> i think the issue is that we've -- look we've got to have a strategy. congresswoman gabbert, who serves with me on the house armed services committee and is really becoming a good friend and tremendous colleague on the

hill, she's right. we need to have a strategy to address radical extremists. but i do think that language matters. and our greatest allies in this fight will be moderates. so if we're saying things or using terms that offend or alienate moderates, then we're pushing away some of our most important allies in this fight. so she's absolutely right that we need a clear strategy. it's got to address this threat, these terrorists, these murderer murderers murderers. i think the white house could do a lot better job of articulating that strategy. statement, i think language matters. >> yeah. last question on isis here. article one, section eight, clause 11 of the u.s. constitution states only congress can declare war. sadly this president has asked the congress multiple times for a new authorization for use of military force against isis. now, congress broke for summer recess. they said we'll get it in the

fall. in the fall they said let's wait until after the elections. then they said it's late for the new year and a new congress. i know you've only been there for three weeks, but is a new aumf going to happen? are you going to vote on it in the congress in both houses do you think? >> i don't know if it's going to happen, but it absolutely should. this is a debate that congress needs to have. and it's important that we have voices in that debate who have been overseas who have been in iraq, like myself. we've got to be careful. we have got to be incredibly careful when we talk about putting young americans into harm's way. it's congress' responsibility. we ought to have a voice in this discussion. >> yeah, as you know we have almost 2,000 of our troops back in iraq right now. and we just learned recently that the u.s. is going to be training syrian rebels this spring. we have thousands of troops as i mentioned, on the ground in iraq. are you concerned -- we talked earlier about strategy. are you concerned ever about mission creep?

>> absolutely. i was a military adviser in iraq myself about ten years ago. i was an infantry platoon commander, but that was the mission of my platoon. when iraqi unit that we were assigned to advise and serve with started to get overrun by the militia, we went to their assistance, and that started the worst fighting of the iraq war until that time. so the point is that these are infantry troops who have just been given an advisory mission. and a military advisory mission can very quickly become ground combat. let's not forget the vietnam war started as a military advisory mission. >> yeah and i always remember the strategy we learned in vietnam. where you have a clear mission, you have overwhelming use to accomplish that mission and a clear exit strategy. let's focus now on afghanistan, seth. you know last year in 2014 let's look at what president obama said here at the state of the union.

>> tonight for the first time since 9/11 our combat mission in afghanistan is over. six years ago nearly 180,000 american troops served in iraq and afghanistan. today, fewer than 15,000 remain. and we salute the courage and sacrifice of every man and woman in this 9/11 generation who have served to keep us safe. we are humbled and grateful for your service. [ applause ] >> -- combat operations in afghanistan are over. when you still have 9,000 troops on the ground still going on missions providing support, when you have 3200 civilians killed last year in afghanistan, is the war really over for those thousands of americans and afghanis? >> no absolutely not. and i think a lot of america is forgetting that every day here

there are young americans in harm's way, fighting the fight at nights in afghanistan. and we've got to be very careful about how we pull out. the lesson of iraq as i said earlier, is that we not only have to be careful about getting into wars we have to be careful about how we come out. we're at that time in afghanistan, and we have got to take it very very seriously. i can't emphasize enough how serious it is for every young american on the front lines over there right now. >> yeah, well with two new leaders, obviously the prime minister in iraq and now the new president in afghanistan, let's hope that political solution really comes to fruition because there's a lot of men and women who have given the ultimate sacrifice and all of us who served there that really want to see that happen. >> absolutely. >> seth thank you so much. congressman, you're doing a great job. i know you're three weeks into that new gig. but we're all pulling for you. so thanks so much for joining us on "taking the hill." >> thanks very much for having me, patrick. after the break, the new

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as many as 30% of iraq and afghanistan veterans suffer from ptsd. but a new study finds that it goes back nearly as far as warfare itself. british researchers have found evidence of ptsd among the soldiers of the syrian dynasty in 1300 b.c. before christ. despite its long history, there's still far too much misunderstanding about what has become the signature wound of

the iraq and afghanistan wars. now a new book "the evil hours," a very personal memoir of how trauma faces us. joining me now is the author david morris a former marine corps officer. david, thanks so much for joining us. >> thanks for having me. good to be here. >> so let me just begin, can you explain to our audience what was your experience like with ptsd and dealing with that? >> well i survived an ied ambush in southern baghdad in 2007 october 10th. then came back to the united states. the transition was difficult for a number of reasons. i mean i think there are difficult -- it's very difficult to find opportunities to be understood. earlier we were talking about possibly bringing back the draft. when you only have 1% of the u.s. population actually serving the military, there are less opportunities to be understood. but specifically, some of the symptoms i suffered, you know i didn't really think -- i didn't know what i was going through until about 2009.

i was in a movie theater. there was a very realistic ied explosion depicted in the movie. i basically blacked out and woke up in the passageway in the hallway of the theater i was in. i had sort of completely lost it for about a minute and came back in and was able to watch the rest of the movie. but it was so similar to the -- movies now are so realistic. it was kind of similar in some ways to the ied ambush i had survived. my brain just switched off like an overloaded electrical grid. >> i know for me i went to see "american sniper" last sunday. i brought my wife with me because i was worried about the same sort of thing. >> oh yeah. >> how about, david, you know, the treatment within the va? it's the largest health care system in the country. are they unified on how we deal with these veterans coming back when we deal with ptsd? >> the va has rolled out a very broad-scale, massive program on what they call evidence supported treatment, specifically prolong exposure

therapy. and another one called cognitive processing therapy. they're both scientifically prove to be very effective. the problem is you're not getting personalized care. they're sort of one size fits all, scaleable, mass produced therapy. they're not therapies in the normal sense of you sit with a therapist and work through issues. specifically, prolonged exposure has a 28% rate of actually making ptsd symptoms worse. i think the va has some questions to answer about this specific therapy. i interviewed dozens and dozens of veterans is and rape survivors and other survivors of trauma. almost all of them said prolonged exposure therapy made their symptoms worse. yet we've spent tens of millions of dollars on this therapy. it made my symptoms worse. i couldn't leafve the house for a week. i've read the research. it has a 28% symptom exacerbation rate. the va, you know, there were no informed consent in my case. there's no official policy of informed consent. i'm even warning veterans that this therapy may make your symptoms worse.

so that's a personal concern. that's a part of the book that i looked at. i read the science, interviewed a number of researchers who developed the therapy and some researchers who have some countervailing opinions. the war against ptsd the va is fighting, it's very broad scale. they're doing a good job, but it's got to get a lot better. >> how about -- i want to take a quote from your book. it was very powerful when i read it. and i quote, trauma is the glimpse of truth that tells us a lie. the lie that love is impossible that peace is an illusion. therapy and medication can ease the pain but neither can suck the venom from our blood, make the survivor unsee the darkness and unknow the secret that lies beneath the surface. so therapy basically, you know, your argument at least when i take this is therapy and treatment just doesn't teach you how to deal with something it doesn't solve the problem. >> that's the interesting thing. people want to talk about it as if it's a brain event, a brain problem, the chemicals in your

brain change. it's a whole personal event. it changes you existentially, psychologically. you look at the social world differently. i voted for bush the first time when i went to iraq 2004 as a reporter. my political views changed radically. my relationship with i had country changed. the way i related to my social world changed. particularly the way i slept differently. i didn't sleep as well sleep as long. i had nightmares occasionally. that's why it's so difficult to treat. it changes every aspect of a person's -- you know their body, their psychology and relationship to the social world. the problem with a lot of therapies is they tend to focus on was aspect of it. if you're really looking at treating and managing ptsd, you have to think about treating all the aspects of a person but also just in terms of the idea of spiritual and personal change and becoming a different person in the wake of this overwhelming event. >> yeah. do you think war people are more susceptible to ptsd than others?

>> yeah. studies show -- and there are a host of what they call protective factors that make people less likely to end up with ptsd. a well-known example is the hanoi hilton cohort the most famous member of which is john mccain. they had a 3% lifetime ptsd rate. john mccain was in kapttive for 5 1/2 years. you would think that his cohort his group of people kwouf a very high likelihood of ptsd. very, very low, in fact. there were a number of specific reasons you can nail down. they were holder. they were higher ranking. most of them had been to college. they also is had some of the best training in the world. they had been through a year of flight training and all these tough training schools. they showed up with all of these pluses in their department. importantly, when they came back president nixon greeted them all as heros. they had a huge party for them thrown at white house. frank sinatra came. everything was internalized by the culture and people thought and meditated what they had been

through and incorporated that. >> that's why we all have a role to play. all of us have a role to play to welcome them home. separating the war from the warrior. we got to jump but i want to thank you so much for your service and for coming here on "taking the hill." >> thank you for having me on. this was great. >> thank you for the great book, too. when we come back, who's making good on their promise of hiring our nation's veterans. you're watching msnbc "taking the hill." don't settle for 4g lte coverage that's smaller or less reliable when only one network is america's largest and most reliable 4g lte network: verizon. with xlte, our 4g lte bandwidth has doubled in over 400 cities. and now, save without settling. get 2 lines with 10gb of data for just $110... or 4 lines for just $140. and get a $150 bill credit for each smartphone you switch. hurry! offers end january 31st. only on verizon. [meow mix jingle slowly and quietly plucks] right on cue.

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that's right. of the 2 million federal employees, 607,000 are veterans. so to the ceos and business owners out there hiring veterans, we salute you. for those who aren't follow their lead. unemployment rate for post-9/11 veterans is 7.2% which is higher than the overall unemployment rate of 5.6%. so let's get after it. there's tens of thousands of our nation's veterans who are counting on you. up next who's really fighting our nation's wars? does the all-volunteer model really work for the military today? and have your voice heard using #takingthehill. discover card. hey, i heard you guys can help me with frog protection? yeah, we help with fraud protection. we monitor every purchase every day and alert you if anything looks unusual. wow! you're really looking out for us. we are. and if there are unauthorized purchases on your discover card, you're never held responsible. just to be clear you are saying "frog protection" right? yeah, fraud protection. frog protection.

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welcome back to "taking the hill." i'm patrick murphy. you know less than 1% of americans are in the military

since post-9/11, iraq and afghanistan. they reap some benefits from serving their country, but they also carry the burden of that sacrifice. they and their families suffer the wounds both physical and emotional. so is the all-volunteer military working? should all americans be required to serve in some capacity? these are the questions my next guest asked in his new book "skin in the game: poor kids and patriots." joining me now is retired major general dennis leech, who spent 35 years in the u.s. army. general, thanks so much for being with us here this morning. >> thanks for inviting me patrick. >> so sir, you call in your book them poor kids and patriots who are really fighting america's wars. is that accurate? >> well i think it represents the predominant segment of our military. we have a history of the lower socioeconomic classes serving in our military and it's

continuing now. i think that the higher socioeconomic classes have historically not served in our military proportionately. >> has the all-volunteer model ever worked in your opinion, with the u.s. military? >> well i think that the all-volunteer force that went into place in 1973 was never really tested until 2001. and in 2001 when we entered these long wars in iraq and afghanistan, the military establishment, the pentagon realized that this was going to be a difficult recruiting environment. as a result of that, or in response to it changed the number of policies and practices to support the all-volunteer force in these long wars many of which have contributed or caused some of the problems that our veterans today and their families are facing. >> well, walk us through what some of those were. >> yeah you have the

long-standing deployment policy of two years in recovery for each year in combat. the fact of the matter is that we didn't have enough troops to fill the requirements. so that two for one became one for one, and in some cases even less than one to one. we also extended combat tours to 15 months. that two-to-one combat ratio really became in practice no horse is so dead that it can't be beaten one more time. another example is that we gave unprecedented enlistment bonuses to people coming into the military. in 2007 at the height of the recruiting crisis 70% of those who enlisted in the army received bonuses on average of $18,000. i don't begrudge any of these enlistees that money, but you did have to ask yourself if it's an an all-volunteer force, why do

we have to pay someone to volunteer? we also did a few other things like implemented stop loss which is nothing more than a back door draft that's technically legal but morally indefensible. we use contractors at an unprecedented level to do things that military uniform military had historically done. and we use the guard and reserve as it was never intended to be used in the all-volunteer force concept. so many of these things were done, and they led to serious consequences for military service members and their families. >> general, what i appreciate about your book is you do talk about the problems with all-volunteer military, but you also offer a solution. so go through the alternatives, what you call the fifth alternative that you write that is both fair and efficient. can you explain that for us please? >> there are a number of alternatives that are brought up

to the military today to all-volunteer force. and in my judgment if you take them and measure them against the fair efficient, and sustainable standard none of them come to the fore. i would point out before i answer your specific question that the important thing is we have a dialogue as a country to ask ourselves the question is the all-volunteer force working, and will it work in the future? but the alternative i suggest is that we would reduce the size of the active duty land forces and have a fair across-the-board draft of men and women, no deferments, no exemptions that would either go into the active component, those who are selected for conscription, would either go into the active component, go into the reserve components, or if you wanted to go to college, you can go ahead

and go to college, but you would be a member of rotc. if as a conscripted reservist or national guardsman, you're deployed for one year. that would be the end of your military obligation. and that alternative does four things. it closes the civil military gap, it reduces our tendency toward militarism it gives us efficient land forces to provide for national security and finally and perhaps most interestingly, could save the american taxpayer up to $75 billion a year. >> well let's talk about those economics. we're already seeing major budget cuts and troop reductions. can we afford this type of plan? >> well i don't think it's a matter of affording the plan. the question is being able to afford the all-volunteer force. the all-volunteer force concept is very expensive because of the nature of having an older force. and the other thing that comes

into play is that for example secretary panetta, before he left office as the secretary of defense, said that if we keep adding to the personnel costs that are unique to the all-volunteer force, personnel costs will consume the entire defense budget by the year 2039. this would leave no money for modernization, procurement, or any of the other elements of the defense budget that are critical to national defense. >> yeah. well, general, so much focus is always on the hardships involved in joining the military. but you and i have also received incredible rewards for our military service. how would the american average joe benefit from serving their country in uniform? >> well this is a historic issue. individuals would benefit from the experience of getting to know their fellow americans that

they might not otherwise know. but the other benefit of it comes from the fact that this is not only a national security issue, but it's also an issue that tugs at the social fabric of our democracy. this is the shared sacrifice that all of us have that currently we have 330 million americans who lay claim to rights and liberty and security that not one of those 330 is obligated to defend and protect. and we strengthen the social fabric of the country when all of us have skin in the game. >> yeah. well, general, thank you so much for joining us here on "taking the hill." we really appreciate your time and your service to our nation. >> patrick, thank you. up next my conversation with the director of an oscar-nominated documentary about the va's crisis hotline. what the first responders are hearing from those who call for help. this is "taking the hill" on msnbc.

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and stay ready for everything that is still to come. the numbers are staggering. every day 22 veterans commit suicide. though, only 1% of americans serve in the military, 20% of suicides are veterans. but there is help. the va's veterans crisis line is there every day, 24 hours a day, 365 days a year talking to veterans and their families. now an hbo documentary profiling the crisis line has been nominated for an academy award. joining me now -- >> veterans crisis line this is robert. >> he was planning to bleed out.

he's talking to them. he finally opened the door. but somebody hung up on me. >> no one can replace you. you need to take care of your kids kenneth. you're their father. >> we are like a fire house. this place is as serious as a heart attack. >> we got him. >> thank you so much for helping us. >> i'm not going to leave you. i'm not going to go anywhere. i'm going to stay right with you. >> joining me now is ellen kent director of "crisis hotline: veterans press one." thank you for joining us. >> thank you. >> i was excited to know you're a girls high graduate from northeast philadelphia. thanks for joining us here in new york. let me ask you first, what brought you to this project? >> i think we were reading the statistics, the really staggering suicide rate among veterans. we wanted to try to sort of bring some awareness to the extent of the problem, the causes of the problem, and also really importantly to try to destigmatize reaching out for

help. >> yeah and that's what i try to battle. we have a military ethic of we leave no one behind. we talk about unemployment, we talk about veteran suicides, but i also talk about the positive things on veterans as well. this documentary is so important. i watched it t and it just grabs you. you feel like you're at these call centers. why do you think many of them are calling? >> well i think that there's the anonymity that the hotline offers. i think it's really really difficult to talk about a lot of these issues. i think that a lot of the veterans come home and they feel that they can't. and so this gives them a sort of supported way to experience some of the things that they went through during war. i think that they're concerned that if they do reach out for help, that it'll create an obstacle in their ability to get work or to continue in some of the areas that they're interested in. so i think being able to call anonymously and share some of these fears and some of these concerns and some of what they're going through is very

helpful. >> yeah and you had veterans calling into this hotline, according to the documentary, from as far back as the lebanon war and vietnam and up until obviously iraq and afghanistan. and even some active duty members who were calling. >> right. >> so do you think, especially with the iraq/afghanistan war, ptsd as the signature injury of those wars do you think the psychological wounds run even deeper with these wars? >> well, you know, i think that what experts are seeing is that because of all the bomb blasts and the concussions, there's more traumatic brain injury. that's a suicide risk. and i think that there are a lot more close encounters with civilian victims, and that's very hard. then people come home, and they're told it's weak to try to deal with some of these issues. and then they also have to find jobs and they have to find meaning, a mission back in this country. so it's a lot. there's a lot going on. >> yeah. when you watch the documentary, there's some amazing people that work at that. veterans and civilians.

what do you think was -- drew those folks to work there? you heard it in the preview there. it was like a fire house. answering these calls, it's quiet stiermometimes, busy other times. what do you think drove those folks to be part of the solution? >> i think a lot of them had worked in mental health before. i think they wanted to reach out a hand to veterans. this was a way to do that. i think some of the responders are veterans themselves. and they want to feel that they're enabling their comrades to return to productive life. this is an opportunity to do it. and you can save someone's life if you can interrupt that impulse. you know five minutes on the phone can make the difference between life and death. >> yeah they talk -- when you watch it, it's these folks who are in upstate new york. it's the only call center in america to call these. and the one scene where it was lewis, who is a veteran, and the veteran called in and wanted to talk to another veteran.

can you tell the audience about that? is that okay? >> that happens a lot there. you know, i think that veterans are home and they're with a family member that they feel they can't -- that doesn't really understand them, that they can't fully talk to. so when they call the hotline, sometimes they want another veteran, and i think, you know, many of the veterans have had experience with some of their people in warrior transition units, people that they've been in battle with who have had a suicidal impulse or maybe taken their own life. so they really know how to talk. and they really understand the experience of war and the psychic costs. >> and i think the one point is it's okay to dahl. you know, it's anonymous. people can call and get the help they might need. what do you think needs to happen as a country? this is like the last line of defense. these people call -- one call was on christmas eve and the mom, you know -- one of the workers there was coaching a mom

saying, you know this is -- give me a christmas present to come home wrote a what do we need to do as a nation not to get to that point? >> right. well, i think, you know one of the reasons we're happy that the film is getting some attention now is because mental health services and suicide prevention services aren't the priority that they need to be in this country for veterans and for all americans. that's the first thing. and i think there needs to be a change in military culture that says that seeking help is smart. and not weak. >> yeah. >> and i think, you know, in general, we need to have a greater understanding. about what some of our fellow americans are going through and support them. >> yeah. thank you so much for doing this documentary, for being with us here today. the commonwealth of pennsylvania is proud you're one of their own and look forward to seeing you soon. >> thanks so much. >> all right. >> when we return my thoughts on "american sniper."

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now, my final thought last sunday my wife and i saw american sniper. it was a great movie. we just sat there speechless at the end. and i'll admit, i got choked up half a dozen times during it. i'm not a movie critic but it's probably the defining movie of the iraq and afghanistan wars. it shows in great detail the sacrifice of not just becoming a navy s.e.a.l. but the incredible suffering of family of four that comes with four overseas deployments. this is my opinion. i was absolutely stunned when i read michael moore's comments calling navy s.e.a.l. chris kyle a coward. i know mr. moore tried to walk it back saying he was referring to snipers and not mr. kyl specifically. you owe the family an apology. they did their part. the part that congress and two presidents have asked them to do.

i served in iraq and when i came home, i ran for congress with $322 in my bank account. i served two terms in congress and did my part to end a war. but just as importantly, to help pass legislation to help returning veterans like the post 9/11 g.i. bill. what troubles me the most are folks that conflate american sniper. the lesson learned in the vietnam war is separating the war from the warrior. this movie was based on the perspective of one navy s.e.a.l. one of america's best. and it's not from the perspective of an iraqi or the justification of the war itself. "american sniper" and bradley cooper showed us all what these back to back to back deployments do on the 1% of america that has been put through the wringer on

their behalf. on our forward operating base in baghdad, there was a sign that read the u.s. military's at war, the american people are at the mall. let's hope those folks who watch "american sniper" take away a resolve to become part of the solution. too many of our returning troops are falling through the cracks. today, 22 veterans on average will commit suicide. 7.2% of post 9/11 veterans are unemployed. their leaders like general h. on today who say that they all voluntary military is broken because america doesn't really have skin in the game. but you know who did? chris kyl and his family had skin in the game. 2.6 million americans did, as well. mr. moore, you did not. and it's time for you to apologize for calling one of our own a coward. thanks for joining us on "taking

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