on could not play. he was just another guy out there. >> all right. terence moore, sports columnist, thank you for joining us tonight. it's an exciting time for high school players to know where they are going to go next year. congratulations to all of them who got that done. that's "the ed show." "politicsnation" with al sharpton starts right now. good evening, rev. >> good evening, ed and thanks to you for tuning in. i'm live tonight in chicago. tonight's lead if you thought republicans had a serious alternative over president obama's agenda think again. today, one of the top contenders former governor jeb bush went to detroit and gave what was supposed to be a major speech on the economy. but instead we heard the same old talking points attacking the safety net and slamming the president on ill interrogation.

>> he's gone beyond his constitutional powers. that creates greater doubts as well. president obama likes to say, you play by the rules. but for president obama, one of the rules is this. he reserves the right to change the rules. instead of a safety net to cushion our occasional falls, they have built a spider web that traps people in perpetual dependence. >> the safety net traps people's independence? that's to attract voters who were mr. 47% in 2012? and there was another problem for governor bush today. a deep irony in his decision to roll out an economic agenda by visiting detroit, a city whose economic engine the auto industry, he once said should have been left to go bankrupt. >> to report what the president did in bailing out general

motors, i don't. i think it's been way overplayed, the difference between a more traditional approach and a controlled bankruptcy. >> here's the bottom line. president obama has a record of lifting the country out of a deep recession. and now he's outlined a bold vision for how to fight inequality and move america forward. that's what republicans are up against. but from the 2016 field to the halls of congress the gop is clearly a party still searching for answers. joining me now is congresswoman donna edwards of maryland and jonathan capehart "the washington post". thank you both for being here. >> thank you. >> whether it's jeb bush or john boehner, do republicans have any real solutions for issues like inequality or immigration or health care? >> well the short answer is no. and listening to jeb bush today,

it's so sad to see him go to the bank bottom of the republican party with the same words but nothing with an action or agenda. and you can see that in the agenda right now. the president put up in his state of the union message, a message about hopefulness for people, dealing with things leak affordable child care and college tuition and creating jobs through infrastructure and republicans are still stuck to their same old tired, bankrupt agenda but does nothing for the middle income americans. >> jonathan capehart, he made a prediction about how the country would do under the gop leadership. listen to this. >> and for what it's worth i don't think the united states should settle for anything less than 4% growth a year. at that rate the middle class

can thrive again. >> 4% growth? now maybe he's forgotten about the other bush economies. under his dad's presidency, the economy grew at 2.1%. under his brother, it grew at 1.6%. is this a problem, jonathan for his candidacy, that all of his statements will be measured by his family's record? >> measured by his family's record because he's a son of a president, the brother of a president. but what he says will be judged by the other president's president, clinton and president obama who, you know come in between those two. look, it's really difficult and actually not quite smart, i don't think, for candidates to make predictions about where the economy will be and how much they can deliver and how quickly because it's a recipe for failure, especially if your prediction does not come true. and many times -- i mean how many times did we talk about and

did republicans slam the president for making predictions early in his first term about green shoes for the economy digging its way out of the recession? hammered time and time again. i don't think it's a smart idea to do that. i mean maybe they are thinking that if we put a number out there, then we're being bold and we're being dynamic and in our prediction that again, sets yourself up for failure. >> congresswoman, house republicans, as you know voted against -- again to repeal the affordable care act. but today we learned 9.9 million people have now enrolled in plans in 2015. beating expectations. house republicans have now created a working group to come up with an alternative to the affordable care act but they claim to be working on an alternative for years. listen. >> my guess is sometime this

fall you're going to see an alternative solution from the house republicans. >> after the first of the year we'll bring forth a bill that will be able to unite republicans around specific health care issues. >> they have introduced 126 ideas about how to fix obamacare and how to replace obamacare. >> we are working on this. we have a lot of different views. >> so the bottom line is they've got no alternative, yet they want to repeal this law anyway despite the fact it would deny millions of americans' health coverage. >> well, that's right. and actually for the first time on the 56th vote to repeal the affordable care act, the republicans also lost three republicans on that vote precisely because they don't have an alternative. i mean listen here's the reality, 9.9 million people who now have health care hundreds of thousands of young people who can stay on their parents' health care plan eliminating

the requirement that you can only get health care by not having a pre-existing condition. these are taking advantage of the affordable care act. the republicans don't have any ideas for health care. they don't have a replacement for health care. and the fact is they don't even have a replacement for the way that the president has grown this economy. 11 million jobs out of a deep recession, 58 straight months of job growth. the republicans really don't have any answers and democrats are saying you know what, we're putting concrete proposals on the table that are going to grow paychecks and improve the lot of the american middle class and republicans have -- you know what's that score? zero. >> jonathan how do the 2016 candidates handle the affordable care act? their campaign? i mean we talked a little about jeb bush. how does he and the other contenders handle the affordable

care act issue? >> well they are going to say that it needs to be repealed. some of them might even say it needs to be repealed and replaced. we'll have to listen to what that -- >> will they have to come up with a specific plan though? >> well the point i'm getting to rev, they are going to be forced to come up with a plan at the end of it is term in june renders invalid the subsidies of the health care exchanges, which would completely gut the affordable care act and suddenly you might have the situation where millions of americans, 9.9 million americans that congress was just talking about. and to repeal the affordable care act is without a replacement there and coming up with an alternative with the

supreme court and right now we're not even talking about an alternative. you saw how long it took to get the affordable care act passed. it was a year and a half. do you think congress is going to be able to do that in four months? not a chance. >> it's really going to be a scene if that were to happen if the supreme court rules that way. congresswoman donna edwards and jonathan capehart thank you for your time tonight. >> thanks, rev. straight ahead, shocking video of a plane crashing in taiwan. what happened and what clues will this video hold? plus, "american sniper" star bradley cooper speaks out about the controversy surrounding the war movie. and sports illustrated swim suit issue makes history. and this. ♪ let it go let it go ♪ ♪ i'm one with the wind and sky ♪ >> why some on the right-wing tv

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two disasters on opposite sides of the world. a shocking plane crash in taiwan caught on dash cam video. and a horrific train accident in new york state. what are investigators looking at right now? that's next. toenail fungus? don't hide it... tackle it with new fda-approved jublia! jublia is a prescription medicine proven

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now to that breaking news on the horrific plane crash in taiwan. at this moment investigators are combing through the wreckage for clues on what brought the plane down. the crash was caught on this dramatic dash cam video from a freeway. rescuers searched for survivors but had difficulty reaching parts of the plane that was still under water. 31 are confirmed dead. 15 have been taken to the hospital and 12 are still missing. just before the crash the pilots reported an engine

problem and called "mayday, mayday engine flame out." joining me is retired plane captain and katherine higgins. thank you both for being here. >> thank you. >> jim, it's rare that we can actually see the plane crash. what do you see here? >> well i see a lot. and a lot of this is going to have to be backed up with further investigation but if you just take a look back at the first part of this flight that we can see, the airplane was substantially level and looked to be flying very low, close to the buildings but fine and then it began to stall. a stall happens when you don't have enough air flow over the wings to give lift to the airplane and, of course if in fact there was a flame out on the left engine that would exacerbate. you would begin to see the plane roll roll into the dead engine.

the good engine giving the power and rolling the airplane because it has power on one side and not the other. so if you look at this in slow motion, look at the wing as it makes contact with the ground for the first time. it's not just slicing through it as it would if you had forward motion. it's almost falling into that wing. as a matter of fact, i think at this point the airplane was, in fact, falling. >> now, jim, i want to show the video in slow motion. do you think the pilot was intentionally moving the plane away from the freeway? >> i actually think, reverend that he was trying to maintain enough altitude to clear the buildings. that may have brought the stall on a little prematurely. because if he was that close on his air speed to maintaining flight to anything to create descent so we could get a little air speed, it would just exacerbate things. so he did clear the buildings

and, in my view that was a heroic act and then of course he lost it because he just couldn't fly without air speed and began to roll. >> kitty, how important is this video to the investigation? >> well it's extremely important. we always talk about the black boxes but obviously having visual images that you see will tell them a lot and i think your other guest has suggested a scenario that makes a lot of sense. when we finish the investigation, we will know whether, in fact that's what happened. also we have the voice records and his message to air traffic control. we'll know very quickly, i think, what exactly happened and why. >> jim you can see a taxi cab was clipped by the wing of the plane as it crashed. is it surprising more people weren't hurt? >> yes. this was a miraculous kind of a situation in terms of the number of people that survived this

crash. it could have been a whole lot worse. i think one of the things that may have helped us is the fact that it was going so slowly and, of course when it did make an impact, the major impact was in water. we used to call that an auto fire extinguisher. >> jim thank you for your time tonight. >> thank you, rev. now to breaking news on that horrific metro north train crash in new york. the ntsb board, it's been on the ground for nearly 24 hours and trying to find out how it struck an suv on the track. a fire through the first car, six people were killed and five in the train and the driver of the suv. moments ago the suv was moved off the tracks. kitty, one witness was in the car behind the suv when it was

hit and described what he saw. watch this. >> as we're waiting to cross the tracks, the gate comes down in front of me and comes down and hits the top of her car. she gets out of the car, she gets out, walks around the back looks at the arm that's on the back of the car, she looks at me i gesture to come back i backed up to indicate that there's plenty of room to back up. she turns, walks and gets back in the car, slight hesitation and then moves forward and at that instant the train hit. >> how will investigators use witnesses to figure out what happened kitty? >> well again, reverend al those reports are very very significant. i think there is probably also a camera on the front end of this train. and that will also tell us what happened. the fact that the gates came

down and she was caught there is very troubling. we have technology that is apparently supposed to go into effect i believe by the end of this year that would, in some instances, perhaps not in this instance, but stop a train if there is an interruption in the signal going to the train. we don't know that in this case yet but i would argue that we have technology that could have prevented this accident by automatically causing the train to brake because there was something on the track. >> these kinds of accidents are not that uncommon. "today's" show jeff rossen has that story. >> check out this dramatic video just outside of orlando last may that demolished a sports coupe. the car stalled just before the gates came down. the driver got out with seconds

to spare. just last month in houston, a mother, father and six children escaped injury with when this freight train struck their car at another crossing. the conductor sounded the horn several times but the two cars didn't move in time. and in glendale california an suv stuck on the tracks caused this commuter train to derail hitting trains on both sides of it. killing 11 people. >> kitty, your reaction? >> well my reaction is these are tragic accidents. the ntsb has tried to improve crossings by including more signals, including more cross-bars to prevent these kinds of accidents but we still see them. and the question is what are the next level of improvements that can be made so that when people get trapped and panic in a moment like this that there is technology. i firmly believe there is an

answer in technology that will cause the train to automatically brake so we don't have the scenario that we saw yesterday and in previous accidents. >> well let's hope and pray we can get that technology soon. kitty higgins, thank you for your time tonight. >> absolutely. good to be with you. still ahead, bradley cooper speaks out on the "american sniper" controversy. and paris hilton's brother in trouble for allegedly disrupting a flight yelling about the, quote, peasants on board. but first, why does fox news have a problem with frozen? we talked to some special experts about it. and you're going to want to hear what they have to say. that's next in tonight's "gotcha." ♪ at kraft we start with

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i almost felt like my brain was frozen after seeing this segment on the fox news show. >> it is being called the frozen effect. i'm not talking about the latest winter storm. are movies like the disney smash hit about the ice queen and her sister turning men into fools and villains? it looks like they depict men as evil and cold and bumblers. >> let me get this straight. are they really using their time to say the most popular animated movie of all time about the love bond between two sisters is anti-men? yes, yes, they were. >> he's crazy. >> i wouldn't go that far, olaf

but there is more. >> we don't have to build up women at the cost of tearing down men. >> strong male figures. >> mmm. strong male figures as heroes? what a great idea. i wonder why hollywood hasn't thought of that one? i guess except for superman oh and batman or spiderman and, of course there's iron man and then there's captain america. who can forget the hulk? these heroes are really zeros. but "politicsnation" has a world exclusive tonight. reaction from some of those very heroes. >> reporter: that's your reaction to this? >> i think it is the best that

anyone can have right now, you know, because we need to have a strong superhero, yes, we do. >> do you feel like you're being overlooked here? this report is saying there are not enough superheroes. what about you? >> i am the only one. >> reporter: do you feel like you're being overlooked? >> i am. i am here in times square and i'm overlooked. yes. >> reporter: and you look like a pretty strong superhero. >> the superheroes are all here. yes. me and batman. yes. the superheroes. >> so distraught he couldn't even talk to us. but we did manage to get exclusive reaction from one of the stars of "frozen."

that's right olaf i think the morning show could use some advice from one of your co-stars. ♪ let it go, let it go ♪ ♪ can't hold it back anymore ♪ >> so i can't conceal, i must reveal and let them know that we got you. romotion allowed me to start investing for my retirement. transamerica made it easy. [ female announcer ] everyone has a moment when tomorrow becomes real. transamerica. transform tomorrow. good job! still running in the morning? yeah. good job! getting your vegetables every day? when i can. [ bop ] [ male

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and bad for the barkley twins. your brain can send information to the rest of your body at 268 mph. three times the speed of a fastball. take care of your most important parts with centrum. multivitamins expertly designed with nutrients people don't get enough of from food alone. centrum. for the most important parts of you. it is time for the justice files. joining me tonight, former prosecutor and host of "justice files," faith. up first, the so-called mommy blogger who's accused of killing her young son by poisoning him with salt. leslie used her blog to post

about her son's sickness but prosecutors say she's the one who made 5-year-old garnet second by force feeding him salt through a sometomach tube over time. the sodium led to a swelling in his brain. in opening arguments on tuesday, the two sides gave two very different pictures of the defendant. >> lacy spears is a calculating child killer. >> lacy spears did exactly as we wanted and expected parents in her position to do. she comforted him. >> she pleaded not guilty to manslaughter and second-degree murder. the defense says there's no eyewitness and no motive. so what's the prosecution's case? >> well the prosecution's case is based on circumstantial evidence. no one actually saw her harm her son but circumstantial evidence reverend, can be very very

powerful. it's as if you went to bed at night and grass as far as you could see out your window and then you woke up and saw snow. you might not have actually seen snow but you can be convinced beyond a reasonable doubt that it snowed during the night. that's circumstantial evidence and the kind of evidence that they have in this case against this woman. and there appears to be a lot of very powerful circumstantial evidence that indicates that she, in fact may be guilty of this crime. >> investigators say that they found a search on the mother's computer for, quote, dangers of high sodium in a child. how strong is a search like that as evidence? >> well when your child ends up dying of sodium poisoning, it's very strong and very compelling. if i were the prosecutor i'd be arguing, that's not a coincidence. it reminds me of the case in georgia with the hot car dad who left his son in the car and found out that he searched his computer about how long it will

take to die in a hot car. and then she apparently called one of her friends and asked her friends to get rid of a bag that was used to put salt in the back to feed her son. she called that friend and asked him to get rid of the bag. not only do you have suspicious behavior before her son died suspicious behavior in the hospital taking him to the bathroom and then him getting sick. that's on video but also the cover-up afterwards is very compelling evidence against her. all right. our next topic, the alleged meltdown of paris hilton's 20-year-old brother. he's accused of going on a midair midair tirade in july even allegedly ranting that he would kill several flight attendants and the co-pilot. the affidavit says that he told the co-pilot "if you want to square up to me bro, then bring

it on and i will fight you." hilton also called the other passengers twice peasant saying quote, he would own anyone in this flight. they are peasants. witnesses say he used the "f" word 25 times and made children cry before the crew finally handcuffed him to his seat. he surrendered yesterday to face charges of interfering with flight crew members. he didn't enter a plea and was released on $100,000 bond. he intimidated crew members because he was defending himself, he says. what do you make of that argument? >> i think it's nonsense. i think his behavior was extremely outrageous and i'm glad that he was charged. listen, his defense attorney has said that he took some type of sleeping pill. there was something going on with him, some kind of mental breakdown. i hope that's the case. because if not, that's how he acts and he behaves in such an

irrational and irresponsible manner on a flight, he deserves to spend time in jail. you can't do that you can't threaten people and threaten the safety of everyone on a flight. that was a 10-hour flight and for four hours they had to put up with his belligerence. >> this could be a very scary proposition if you're on that flight. >> absolutely. i mean this is not a bus that you can pull over to the side and get a police officer. you're over the atlantic ocean. this is an intercontinental flight and it's very outrageous behaviors that he's being accused of. he's facing a maximum of 20 years in federal prison. so this is very very serious and i'm sure the defense is going to allege as indicated, he's taking a sleeping pill and these drugs had an effect that

caused this outrageous behavior but it was terrible i'm sure for the people on that plane. the defense attorney has a lot of work ahead of him to cut out a plea bargain to help his client avoid prison time. >> all right. ken and faith, thank you both for your time tonight. >> thanks rev. >> thank you. coming up behind the scenes on election night 2012. why president obama was irritated with mitt romney's concession call. plus the star of "american sniper" bradley cooper responds to the movie's criticism. and a first for "sports illustrated" swim suit edition. a plus-size model. it's all coming up in "conversation nation," next.

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time now for "conversation nation". joining us tonight, democratic strategist tara and jimmy williams and msnbc's abby huntsman. thank you all for being here tonight. >> thanks, rev. >> thank you. >> we start with president obama irritated with mitt romney's 2012 concession call. former senior obama adviser david axelrod writes in his new

book about how the president was not smiling during the call and, quote, slightly irritated when it was over. after he hung up the president said, "you really did a great job of getting out to vote in places like cleveland and milwaukee and, in other words, black people. that's what he thinks this was all about." former aide disputes this call saying it's a lie. what do you make of this? >> well if he did make those comments, which i think he did, given the other comments made about the president, it's not like this is in line with other things that have been said. if he did make those comments they were weak, they were classless, lacking in grace and passive aggressive. so the president should be upset. the bottom line is news flash here, black people only make up 13% of the united states population. so clearly his win was more about more people than just

black people. 70% plus of asian-americans voted for the president. 70% of hispanic-americans voted for the president. the majority of jewish people voted for the president. overwhelming numbers of young people voted for the president. this is a pattern of republicans seeking to diminish this president's accomplishments and, frankly, it's tiring and it's ugly. >> now, jimmy, this was according to david axelrod, the president's interpretation of what romney said. do you think romney was minimizing the president by only giving them one constituency, his base black vote or do you think he was trying to in some ways, excuse the fact that he had lost by a large margin? >> i think mitt romney was as ineloquent as he normally is. that's what i think happened. i think mitt romney said something that he thought was perfectly nice and what he ended up saying to most americans was

perfectly awful. that's why when you go into a room and you don't think there are cameras, you say things like the 47%. when you say things -- he didn't say this but newt gingrich did -- these kinds of things they are not mistakes. they just say them because that's what they believe. and when you believe things that's the opposite of what a majority of the american voters believe. by the way, don't forget barack obama beat mitt romney by 5 million votes. >> absolutely. >> i'm sure that those 5 million were not all african-american. here's the deal republican party, as tara just said if you'd like women to vote for you as a majority and gay people and latinos and black people you should probably acknowledge that they exist as gay people as latinos, as women and as black people as opposed to just americans because, in fact they are. >> abby you are the republican on the panel tonight. let me put you on the spot.

>> sure. >> do -- you hear that the romney spokesman said that it's a lie. what do you think? do you think romney said this? >> you also have to remember that this is a book and you want to sell books. this is the first of -- i mean not the first, rather but one of many books that have come out within the obama administration and with any book there's always another side to that story. i think to jimmy's point, there are a number of things that have been said from folks within the republican party. this though, i'm not really on the same page as the panelist because i think you have to think about the man who said it. mitt romney, who is a very awkward guy. and the one thing he wants more than anything in the world, is to be president of the united states. that call had to be very very difficult for him to make. so no matter what he said it was going to come out awkward. so i don't know if what he said really came across the way that people took it. so you know i don't want to believe it. i hope that's not what he meant, if that's the case. it's probably best that he didn't end up winning in the

end. but look i'd like to think there's another side to this story and maybe he was just being his normal awkward romney self. >> well it's a little like losing the best essay in school and saying to the winner you did a great job even though your mother helped you cheat. but anyway from the campaign field to another kind of battleground, the new bradley cooper movie "american sniper" has faced all kind of criticism with some saying it glorifies war. and now the movie's star is speaking out. >> the fact that it's inciting discussion that has nothing to do with vets and it's more about the iraq war or why or what we did not do to indict those who decided to go to the war, you know, every conversation that is in those terms, terry, is moving farther and farther away from what our soldiers go through and the fact that there's 22 people -- 22 vets commit suicide each day. >> he says instead of debating

the iraq war, the movies should make us talk about veterans. jimmy, because he have a point? >> he does. and this is something that you and i discussed on your show which is this issue. i don't plan to see the movie. i care more about what happens to you are oh veterans. we supply them to go to war and when they get back do nothing to help them except for waiting in the v.a. line. justice for vets we know that 700,000 of our veterans are under criminal justice supervision. we know that 1 in 6 out of every one of our post 9/11 vets is somehow, some way addicted to something, alcohol, prescription drugs, illegal drugs, et cetera. that's a problem. why? because the community is not there to support them. >> right. >> there's a great thing called justice for vets which is there to support them and give them an alternative and that's something that we should be talking about on a daily basis, honestly.

>> rev, i was waiting to hear what bradley cooper had to say because i knew he would say exactly what this nation had to hear and i have two brothers in the military and what he said is the 22 that commit suicide every day and as an actor you have to get inside the mind of the person that you're playing and so i'm sure he felt with him while he was playing this role. and he wanted all of us to realize the most important thing here are our veterans and taking care of them. that's more important than any of this stuff that we're talking about right now. >> everyone stay with me. when we come back, the "sports illustrated" swim suit issue makes history with its first plus-size model. ♪ ♪ ♪ good job! still running in the morning? yeah. getting your vegetables every day? when i can. [ bop ] [ male

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for $29.95 a month for 12 months. plus for a limited time, get a free security camera call 1800 xfinity or visit comcast.com/xfinityhome. we're back with our panel. for the first time ever, "sports illustrated" has their first plus-size model. tara is it about time we're seeing a plus-size woman in "sports illustrated"? >> absolutely. it's about darn time. she looks fantastic. she looks hot. are we still pretending that

everyone is a size 0. actually, the woman in the "sports illustrated" magazines don't look like that because they are air brushed. i think this is great. it's progress. we need more of it and let's keep it going. let's reward this. i might buy the imaginemagazine just to encourage this. >> i wonder if plus-size models like to be air brushed as well. i'm with tara. she's so beautiful. she looks so happy out there. the crazy thing about it being a plus-size model, the average size is between a 12 and 14 and that's about what she is. so it's really looking at a girl that's just leak you. i'm surprised it's taken this long for a magazine to put this on the cover. you want to see somebody that is beautiful just leak you want to feel beautiful. instead of calling her plus size we should just call her a beautiful woman. >> jimmy?

>> this is an ad. she is now actually a part of the women that are going to be in the layout. although, part of me thinks oh dear, here we are having this conversation. again, at least they are acknowledging the fact as my colleagues have just said that most women don't look like that. and thank goodness they are actually putting someone that looks normal on there. i think it's fantastic. >> and for the record a lot of men actually -- this magazine's obviously geared towards men. a lot of men like women -- >> yep, they do. >> who are curvier women. >> i was just going to say that. >> they prefer that. >> tara they don't want us. >> yes. >> i'm going to stay out of this. thank you for joining this conversation. >> thanks, rev. when we come back, "essence"

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finally tonight, i'm here in chicago where civil rights and policing are always topics of conversation and those topics are also front and center in this month's issue of "essence" magazine. for the first time in the magazine's 45-year history, there's no image on its front cover. just these words. "black lives matter." i had the honor of contributing an essay along with people like carmen john legend and new york city's first lady mccray. it's focusing debate on some of the biggest challenges facing the african-american community. and the crucial question where do we go from here? joining me now is "essence"

editor-in-chief, vanessa deluc achl. a. >> thank you for having me. >> "essence" has never done a cover like this before. why now? >> we felt that it was absolutely essential for us to chronicle and note and make a point that this is an unbelievable time in our history. that what we are witnessing is a new civil rights movement unfolding right before our very eyes. >> i wrote how long it can take to achieve lasting change. how can "essence" help keep people focused on these things? >> well one of the things is to continually, from now on introduce a civil rights watch. it will showcase people in the movement making great strides, bring attention to people you may not know about or have heard about, the young ladies that have organized the new york city

millions march that happened not too long ago, people on the ground in ferguson, people who are in the justice halls. >> one of the things that i think is great is that people are doing things different ways. some don't agree on tactics but the people are moving and that's a movement. >> that's what i love about this. and to our artists, you mentioned carmen and john legend, the song that they wrote that's featured in the movie "selma," glory, that's a new version of a civil rights anthem, right? >> we must march, we must stand up. >> and i think the key for me at this moment is that we -- and i'm so glad to hear about the civil rights watch, that we don't let the moment pass without being committed to real change. >> absolutely. that's why it was so important for us to hear not just from a few voices but a lot of

desperate voices. not everyone agreed on what is the path. >> yes. >> how we should move forward. that's okay. >> and we never were monolithic. i mean we had dr. king and malcolm x and thurgood marshall all at the same time. >> yes. yes. >> and there's nothing wrong with that as long as we are headed towards a better way for everybody, not just us but everybody. >> we felt that in this issue, technically, we wanted to make it clear that there are many ways to get to the success that we're seeking. >> and i think you did a great job. thank you for your time tonight. >> thank you for having me. >> that was my conversation with van necessary vanessa de luca last week. what are we going to win out of this? but something we've already won.

we're young activists and veteran activists and those in entertainment and athletes white and black and latino and asian, is that america has begun to have a conversation about change. the conversation in itself is a victory. now we must turn toward more substantive victories but just getting the conversation is how it began in the '60s and how it's beginning now. i'm glad "essence" put it on the cover. it's on the cover of american's minds. let's move forward even if we don't all agree on the tactics, we all agree we need to have this conversation. thanks for watching. i'm al sharpton. "hardball" starts right now. grandmother's know best. let's play "hardball." ♪