good evening, americans and welcome to the ed show live from new york. let's get to work. five years after the spill. cat island's disappearing act. >> cat island was ground zero to the the oil spill. so this is all that's left. >> this is it. >> this is it. if we don't rebuilding these islands, we'll lose it again. >> and later, what drone exports will mean in the fight against terror. >> the state department is putting out an announcement about the much wider exprt of armed drones. >> i called on the international community to come together and rad eradicate this extremism. this isn't a challenge alone. it's a challenge for the world. >> plus, how rahm's failing

grade on public education is impacting the chicago mayor's race. >> i said when i ran for office we were going to tell people the truth, do the tough things. >> it's been a year and a half since the mayor closed 50 chicago public schools. >> he's the one came to town loaded with millions of bucks and said i want to be emperor of chicago. >> i will absorb the political consequence so our children have a better future. good to have you with us tonight, folks. thanks fch wag. we start with our week long gulf series. the gulf today, five years after the spill. in our first three stories, we have taken you across the gulf to hear from people directly affected by the spill. i spoke with business owners who say the disaster drove their livelihood right into the ground. >> they started pulling their boats out. guests stopped eating seafood because of the worries of the oil contaminating the the seafood. we couldn't get seafood out of our local suppliers in louisiana

and alabama. because it was contaminated. that drove up the cost of the product. if we could even find it. >> the seafood in the gulf still requires continuous testing. government studies show the seafood is sea. one of the largest shrimp distributors in the country showed uz his latest catch. >> his whole shell fell off right here. this should be shell going all the way to the bottom. that's a cancer right here you got. that's a cancer right there. >> yeah. and you can tell by the chorolor of the shell. >> the shell is gone. yeah. you feel it right here. it that shell up. >> the facts on how the spill impacted human health are still emerging. bp directed us to government studies showing no direct correlation between health concerns and the chemical spill. we spoke with an environmental consultant who disagreed.

he shared his personal story. >> i started having problems with breathing and a weird rash that breaks out from time to time. and i went to the doctor. the doctor -- i won't say what he said, but basically he didn't know what it was. came up with some letters for it. >> a lot of folks had that? >> i contributed it to old age. and then talking to people that worked out there. they're all complaining about the same thing. when we went to get treated for it it doesn't help. they treat it like it's asthma. but the medications they gave you for asthma were not working on it. it didn't relieve it a little bit. and tonight we exam cat island. people in the gulf felt this was ground zero for the oil spill. it was a crucial breeding ground for the louisiana state bird. after all the devastation, there's now a big community effort to restore cat island.

>> the nation and the world didn't understand how bad this oil spill was. >> the images were iconic. louisiana state bird covered in oil. a symbol of a gulf disaster. p.j.hahn was there to document it it. >> we would get out there before the workers would get out there. once they started to see the poor birds covered in oil, gasping for air and the pictures came back, we said yeah we're going to get help. >> authorities did not want the media to see that, did they? >> they absolutely didn't want us to see that. and as an amateur photographer so to speak, i was out there photographing, taking photographs, and i had a lot of the media with me. and we happened to catch some birds trapped in the oil, covered in oil. >> so if that story had gotten

out. there may have been more of an intensity to save cat island sf. >> i believe more intensity to get more equipment down here because we were being told there's a lot of equipment. the problem is they would leave land, load up their boats and by the time they got on the water, it was 11:00 this in the morning. and they only work until 4:00 or 5:00 in the afternoon. by the time they got dark they were coming back off. the people locally hired, those guys work until middle of the night. they wore lamps on their head to go out and collect the oil. >> off the coast of louisiana, barrier islands provide a sanctuary for wildlife. >> little groups of islands, anywhere between four to six acres in size. and it was pelican and various other types of birds. even endangered species using those islands to nest. they used the islands because they are far away from any type of predators. now they had seven to

eight-foot mangrove trees. you couldn't get on the island. you could onl drive around them. and it was covered in bird. >> cat island was a barrier island off the coast of louisiana that saw the most damage from the oil spill. >> cat island was ground zero to this the oil spill. and there's a series of barrier islands along the louisiana coast. what happened was the oil came along the west side of the mississippi river. it came through the bayou pass. it came in there and those limit islands were there to greet them. >> not that there's a good time for the oil spill, but it was worse because the birds were festing. so you had pelicans and shore birds and other birds using the islands to nest and unfortunately the oil was coming in so thick that as it covered the mangrove it would kill the mangrove trees and the other vegetation on the islands.

>> when the room system dies, the land starts to fall apart. >> sure and then the erosion takes place. >> the constant wave action eroding from different storms or a natural wind and wave action that hits the islands start tos to break them apart. >> can you believe what you're looking at? >> it's gulf renching. >> this is all that is left of cat island. >> this is it. >> right off these islands when you get in shallow water and the prop runs aground, it kicks up the ground and this is what comes to the surface. you can actually smell the oil. it's literally amazing. our prop went through there tw two engines. it kicked off the surface and there's your oil. birds are still on these islands coming in here and feeding. so you can imagine the contamination that takes place.

as the island slowly disappears so might the migratory birds that made the island their greeding ground. >> we lost our pelican back in the '60s. louisiana only has six bird islands left. they're all disappearing. u.s. child life and fisheries did studies on the birds and discovered what happens is when these birds are born on the islands, they imprint to those islands. they'll come back every year year after year to the same islands. >> they're going to move where they have to move. it's just that we're running out of places for them to go to. >> if we don't start rebuilding the islands and a small habitat for them we're going to lose the pelican again. >> there's a massive effort to restore this to bring it back to its position. >> so your goal is to rebuild cat island? >> absolutely. >> which will take how much? >> $6 billion. we've been able to raise $3

million. we have a great cooperation. our new parish president decided to step up the pace and help as well by using the funding that the parish has. so we have money we put together from donations. i know we can bring it back. we've got to bring it back. t the birds are depending on this thing. it's going to be a beautiful bird sanctuary once it's completed. >> and they're getting support from unlikely sources. shell oil put up a million dollars to help us rebuild the island. they're not all bad. it's actually at one time belonged to a apache oil. and approached them to donate and they did. >> what has bp done to restore it? >> nothing. >> no. not a dime. not a dime for cat island. it's a shape we have to pay for something that we had no responsibility for committing this. >> we invited bp to speak with us on the program all week. they've declined the invitation.

that invitation remains open. joining us live tonight, our guide to cat island p.j. from pelican host consulting. thanks for your hospitality and your guidance through all of this and showing us where cat island was. if we had not caught the the tide right, correct me if i'm wrong, we would have gone right over it. >> we would have lost it and thank you and thanks to the show for having me on. thanks for bringing this to light to the nation and showing people the devastation that happens and what these people and wildlife has to go through. five years later it's still going on. it's still not right. it's a shame. cat island that you just highlighted in your show was just the most beautiful place. you see the most beautiful birds. over 57% of all migratory birds pass right through that area. it's one of the most beautiful areas you could find.

and it's gone. oo generations of birds lost. >> and right where we kicked up the bottom is at cat island. and that ail came up to the top. something came to the top. i want our audience to know, that is whaktly where we are we were when it kicked up the bottom. now i want to do this. bp told us in a statement when asked about cat island. they say cat island was rapidly eroding before the deep water horizon accident in 2010. primarily due to erosion from hurricanes katrina and rita. what is your response to that? >> it's a shape. bp has attorney a page out of the book of hitler to say, you keep saying things over and over to the public and the people will think it's the truth. and the sad thing is it's totally false. that island was in perfect condition. we had eight-footmangrove trees. you saw the pictures.

i photographed that island two years in the making it was gone. are you telling me that island can disappear that quickly? we saw the pictures of the oil over the roots covering the mangrove trees that would kill those. once those tries deeed, that's it. they're gone. there's no more island because as the root system dies so does the island. so for b.p. to continuously put up their propaganda. take the ads off tv one day of what they spend nationwide to tell everybody how good they are and promote themselves as saving the gulf and use the money to restore things like cat island. one day's worth of commercials could have put this island back. five years later we're still having the conversation about who will build cat island. they were directly responsible. >> if you were taking the bull by the importants ho elect the resources nobody would be happening with cat i lant.

the local folks have the real desire to do this. i sensed how much love there was down there. what is it like right now? if you go out there -- i understand you were out there today. what did you find? >> unfortunately the birds -- especially the the pelicans are trying to land on some place not there. these were birds probably born there two or three generations ago trying to return and wandering around, swimming around the island now, trying to find a place to nest. what's happening is with the loss of the island they will not go off and breed somewhere else. that's it. u.s. wildlife and fisheries has clear reports showing, once they come back to the island if it's not there, they don't go off and breed somewhere else. generation after generation of birds we're losing. and it's not only the pelican. a lot of birds nested there. some of them rare and endangered

birds we were able to photograph that used that island to nest. >> and do you have something to show us that you picked up today? >> i do. i was out there this morning. i love how b.p. is saying everything is going. there's so much oil still out there. >> what are we looking at now? >> what you see right now is a screen shot of a marsh grass. i brought a scientist out there that is doing research on bugs in the marsh. and wlil we were out there, of course, there's a lot of dead marsh with the oil that's caked on underneath it. but she's doing research on bugs in the marsh. it's a very interesting research that she's doing because they're pretty much a canary in the coal mine showing that at all levels, the bugs are dying. some live only on the ground. and some only move from the top tip. >> so this will document irreversible damage.

right? >> this is is -- this is -- i don't know if you can see this or not. >> yes we can see it. >> basically what you can see is this marsh grass. >> yeah. lift it up a little bit. obviously, this would be very tall. this is the oil clinging onto it. i'll leave it here in the studio. if b.p. is watching and want to send somebody to pick it up i'll give them a gps coordinate of where to find more of this. this is the kind of stuff you find out there. this is the type of stuff the birds and wildlife are feeding on. underneath there's a lot of small crabs and crustaceans. the marine life and wildlife are eating. and it gets put back in the eco system. >> we're going to replay our monday story tomorrow. but then coming up on monday we're going to have an extensive report on restitution. there has been -- describe the restitution, if you can, to lead us to where we're going for monday's coverage.

>> well, what happened is -- under the clean water act, there's several -- going to be several buckets of money coming to the coast. so far we haven't seen any directly to the parish. we're hoping to cobble the money we raised for cat island which is over $3 million. and then we're also looking at trying to get some moneys from the first wave of restore funds and be able to use that to put the island back. >> and bp for the record no money yet towards cat island. >> no money at all. and i literally have called every number i could for bp. i've spoken with them trying to recognize this island and spend a little bit of money on it. it would go a long way to restoring a gorgeous island and bird sanctuary. >> in their statement to us. they said they blamed a winter

freeze for killing vej tax. >> i can't say enough. if you repeat a lie long enough people will think it's the truth. that has been b.p.'s m.o. from day one. lie about how much oil came out. lie about what they were putting in the ground as far as resources to pick up the oil. they lost every appeal so far in court. you know they're going to do everything they cannot to have to spend a dime to correct. i would like to point out 11 lives were lost in that explosion. r i mean if that doesn't show pure negligence and the price of oil -- the barrel per oil, rises once you identify negligence this is is pure negligence on the part of this company. we have a lot of good companies, a lot of good oil companies that work and thrive in the gulf and a lot of people depend on. b.p. was a bad player. that's plain and simple. >> p.j. great to have you with

us tonight. i appreciate your help and helping ugs produce these segments. the full segment can be found at msnbc.com. get your cell phones out. i want to know what you think. tonight's question from our reporting, are you surprised with the condition of the gulf. text "a" for yes. text "b" for no. you can go to many i blog and leave a comment. we'll bring you the results of the poll later on in the the show. up next many chicagoans call him mayor 1%. as rahm emanuel gears up for re-election, next week. i'm talking to his top challenger when we come back. stay with us. everyday? because it helps me skip the bad stuff. i'm good. that's what i like to call, the meta effect. 4-in-1 multi-health metamucil is clinically proven to help you feel less hungry between meals. experience the meta effect with our multi-health wellness line. i take prilosec otc each morning for my frequent heartburn. because it gives me... zero heartburn! prilosec otc. the number 1 doctor-recommended frequent heartburn medicine for 9 straight years.

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welcome back to the ed show. the chicago mayoral race is less than one week away and rahm emanuel is pulling out all stops to get his re-election bid in stone. he has flooded the local air waves with tv ads. today president obama travelled to chicago to designate a national monument and rub elbows with his former chief of staff. >> i have confidence as a voezer and residence of chicago the will continue to do a great job. i'm glad he's my mayor. i'm glad he will be the mayor in another four years. rahm emanuel could use the boost. chicago tribune poll shows rahm emanuel sitting at 45%. his top challenger and my next guest comes in with a 20% rating of support.

15% of voters are still undecided. he needs to avoid the runoff election with the second place finisher. garcia wants to go one-on-one with what they call mayor 1% in chicago. obviously, those are not emanuel supporters. garcia has the backing of a number of labor and progressive groups who are tired of what they call his corp. rad friendly leadership. bars ya has pitched himself as a mayor for all of us. his most enthusiastic supporter from the chicago teachers union. he angered voters with his decision to close 50 public schools. most in nirnt neighborhoods on the south and west side of chicago. some feel he was picking and choosing neighborhoods. which alienated minority voters. now sits at 42% with black residents who make up a third of the city's population.

the 25% of undecided black voters will play a key role in deciding if rahm e man kbrul avoids a runoff or wins the race. this race comes down to turnout. we did reach out to mayor rahm emanuel to injit him to join us on this program. unfortunately he had a scheduling conflict. the invitation stands. you're certainly welcome to come on the the ed show before the election or any other time. joining me now is mr. garcia. good to have you with us tonight. if you had to describe rahm emanuel's time as mayor of chicago. how would you do it? >> well during the time he's been mayor he's catereded to a select few in the city who have benefitted from his tenure. he's catered to the rich and powerful in chicago. receiving huge amounts of campaign contributions from hollywood, from hedge fund managers. from the wealthy in chicago and

the tribune showed two weeks ago a series that most of his contributors expect returns in the form of contracts, appointments to important boards and commission tax increment, financing subsidies. just a host of benefits that 60% of his donors the article pointed out, benefit directly from giving him money. while the neighborhoods in chicago have suffered. as you pointed out, from the massive school closings in chicago, making us a leader in that regard and also becoming one of the most violent cities in the country with over 10,000 shootings over the past four years. so those tr the issues before the voters right now. >> how is the black vote going to go. how much of an effect will be felt in this election based on what the mayor did with closing a 50 schools. >> i think the school closures were a turning point for african-american voters in the

city. the african-american community suffered a disproportionate impact in terms of the number of schools that were closed. you know the neighborhoods where the schools were closed and devastated by the school closings, a sign of life a sign of positive energy. >> what would be different if you were mayor? >> i would not have embarked on such a course. i would have listened to the points of parents and students and other stake holders in the communities that said if you close these buildings, these institutions, our communities will truly be in terrible straits in terms of any hope for the future. it's a sign of the investment that occurred under this administration. >> is president obama's visit today a flat out endorsement. you heard the sound bite. is that going to help the mayor in chicago? >> i don't think so. i think it's too little and too late. i think the president came in to the mayor trying to save himself

from going to a returnunoff. he has demonstrated callousness. and the neighborhoods think he's not a neighborhood guy. he doesn't spend his time there. when they did an investigation on the the use of his time he always makes time to meet with the rich and powerful. >> he's not been everybody's mayor. mayor. >> and the downtown district that is doing great happens to comprise 1% of the total land mass of the city of chicago. >> chuy garcia thanks for joining us tonight. the election is next tuesday. >> going to a runoff. >> you think it will be a runoff? >> yes i do. >> we'll follow the story. appreciate your time tonight. later the obama administration is drastically arming our drone policy. what it mean for national security ahead. stay with us.

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the entry level will be bumped up to $9 an hour. that's $2 more than the federal minimum wage. still far below the $15 minimum wage protesters have been working towards. the company did respond it comes on the heels of insurance company aetna's major announce. they would bump their pay raise to $16 an hour. they plan to launch an enhanced medical benefits program, which will lower out of pocket expenses for employees. to the state of wisconsin. members of this menominee tribe continued their march to mad son. they hoped to talk about a proposed hard rock hotel and

casino they want. this is something advocates say will bring money to the state, the impoverished tribe, jobs to help the unemployed and tax dollars to the state. governor walker is against the casino and refused to meet with the tribe members after their five-day march to madison. and the state of texas, despite the ban on same-sex marriage allowed a gay couple to marry today. the license was granted for medical reasons to sarah goodfriend and suzanne bryant after goodfriend was diagnosed with ovarian cancer. this is not a sweeping change to state legislation as the grant only applies to one couple. texas' statewide ban on gay marriage was declared unconstitutional in federal court last year. the judge stayed the ruling to allow the state to appeal. and tonight in our ask ed segment, our question comes from larry. what could democrats be doing before 2016 arrives?

how about getting a candidate? get somebody do declare. i'm starting to think nobody is going to declare. except hillary. stick around. rapid response panel is next. ment. stocking end the day mixed. the dow sheds 44 points. s&p is off by two. the nasdaq is up by 18. most of the dow's decline is due to the decline in walmart shares, which finished down more than 3%. the company's latest earnings beat estimates that revenue fell short. and the number of americans filing for first-time jobless claims fell by 21,000 in the latest week. economists were expecting a smaller decline. that's it from cnbc, first in business worldwide. trol freak... i like to think of myself as more of a control... enthusiast. mmm, a perfect 177-degrees. and that's why this road warrior rents from national.

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welcome back to the ed show. the obama administration has announced a major shift in the country's armed drone policy. this week the state department said it would permit in export of armed drones for the first time. the administration is moving quickly on this. carefully selecteded allied countries could have armed drones by 2016. the united nations, china and israel are the only three countries that currently manufacture armed drones. turkey and italy have reported been seeking to buy armed drones for the united states for some time. both countries are concerned with the spread of isis. the obama administration laid down a strict set of rules for done sales. drones cannot be used for unlawful surveillance. no country could use drones against their domestic population. and any use much take place in internationally sanctioned

military military operations. each sale would be individually reviewed and the united states would monitor compliance. drone technology has greatly advanced in recent b years. the latest drone can carry as much ammunitions as an f-16 fighter. the obama administration says the policy shift is to ensure armed drones are used responsibly and legally around the world, which of course has been questioned by many how the united states used drones. you cannot deny their effectiveness. joining me tonight in the rapid response panel, stewart russell, who is a professor of computer science at u.c. berkeley and expert on robotics. also with us molly o'toole. great to have you both with us. did people in your line of work know this poll shift was on the horizon? was there much conversation about it?

it just came out and didn't seem like anybody knew this would happen. >> as for the media announcement, it comes as a surprise to some. i can't believe the "washington post" got the job on it. not by long. this conversation around the sale of drones has been going on from two perspectives. from the business community, a lot of production of armed drones from this technology goes on in the united states. they're complaining they don't have access to the market because of the regulations and then politically with the ramp up in the fight against islamic state. to get more involved. there have been requests previously denied for both armed and unarmed drone technology. for example, jordan earlier, who is a crucial ally in the fight against islamic state had maze a request for unarmed predator drones for surveillance and that was denied. i think the announcement came as a surprise.

>> professor russell. you wrote in a recent post that several nations are working towards the development of lethal autonomous weapons systems that can assess information, choose targets and open fire without human intervention. this is pretty scary stuff. how advanced is this technology? and how risky is it for us to let other countries have it? >> so the technology is very far along. the pieces are all in place. if you want something to run by itself. for example, if you were worried about enemies jamming your communications with your drones and you needed the drone flying by itself choosing its own targets, i think you could pretty much put something together right now and have it out there within a few months. would it be the highest quality system. would it sometimes make mistakes? that's to be seen. but certainly, within less than five years you can have very

high quality systems out there doing the job done by drones right now. the risk would be this is not the first step. the technology that we have right now with drones a human being operating the vision feed is coming back to the home base and the human is making the decisions. so right now we can replace that function with autonomy. the arms race that would ensue would be very rapid. once you have the drones operating, then they're operating at a much higher speed in terms of reaction times. so the only way you can defend against them is by having autonomous attack drones that would engage those drones. then you get into an arms race. and the end point would be machines of incredible accuracy against humans. and i said in other interviews. on the battlefield the life span of a human being may be ten

seconds. >> if we didn't export this technology, would other countries get it anyway? >> so there are two parts to the question. the export of drones that are operated by humans i think, that's happening already. there are more than 60 countries have who drone programs. buying unarmed drone technology or developing their own. the creation of systems capable of operating independently is more difficult. and i think right now only the u.s. could produce high quality systems. so at the moment the united nations is working very hard on a treaty that would actually ban the deployment of weapons that can choose their own targets and engage, in other words, kill them. >> holly, how would the united states monitor come compliance? that's like me selling you a car and telling you you can't drive on maine street. when someone -- again, we can

just imagine a country will feel pressured in some way and maybe go off and use the drone because they may view it in their own best interest yet it p may violate. how would will the united states enforce that and what about compliance? right. we're not exactly sure how this is going to play out as of yet. as you noted regarding the state department's announcement, they included details of how stringent the application process would be and that the bar would be pret thety high and i think they used the phrase pre presumption of denial. as the professor suggested, there's a concern about the proliferation of this technology. part of the motivation behind the announcement, which many analysts have stated is they recognize there's an inevitably to the spread of the technology the proliferation of the

technology. and so it's the way the u.s. can preempt that and try to regulate and control it as best they can while acknowledging that inevitably. >> and professor, is there a sense this may be a business deal? we want to sell more than the israelis and chinese on this. or is this more about security and the president fighting about allies and fighting isis and making sure everybody has the tools to get it done. here you are. >> you may say it's a con fluns of con fluence of factors. noun of us would be shocked. but i'm reminded of my kids. you foe, i accidentally got them nerf guns for christmas and they promised never to use them in the house. you can tell what happened. >> we can use our imagination. and what if they fall in the wrong hands.

and also molly, appreciate your time tonight. thanks so much. coming up, jeb bush is gearing up for a presidential run, but right wing talkers are trashing this guy on the air waves. talk radio consultant holland cook with a few details when we come back. this meeting is about. yes, a raise. i'm letting you go. i knew that. you see, this is my amerivest managed... balances. no. portfolio. and if doesn't perform well for two consecutive gold. quarters. quarters...yup. then amerivest gives me back their advisory... stocks. fees. fees. fees for those quarters. yeah. so, i'm confident i'm in good hands. for all the confidence you need. td ameritrade. you got this. ♪ there's confidence.

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>> that's coming up tomorrow on "the ed show" at 5:00 eastern. i'll join joe scarborough tomorrow morning on "morning joe" tojoe" to talk about the series. five years after the spill, the battle continues in the courtroom. >> personally i just think that bp is taking as much time as they can, retaining as much capital as they can. it slows the system. they're using this to do it. there's also an appeals process that they have they can appeal anything from a business claim over $25,000. currently they're appealing about three fourths of those notices that come out. >> that's coming up monday. up next jeb bush steps into the conservative gauntlet. cook weighing in. stay with us. sometimes breathing air can be difficult. if you have copd, ask your doctor about once-daily anoro ellipta. it helps people with copd breathe better for a full 24hours.

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don't be old fashioned. xfinity customers add xfinity home for $29.95 a month for 12 months. plus for a limited time, get a free security camera call 1800 xfinity or visit comcast.com/xfinityhome. welcome back to "the ed show." the former governor is still surrounding himself with the same guys his dad and brother were showing the overlap between jeb bush's advisers and past bush administrations the latest cnn poll of national republican voters shows that mike huckabee

he has the lead in 17%. ben carsing takes 9% of this poll. conservatee talkers on the radio, around the country have been painting bush as an entitled and republican in name only form. >> if i had to bet right now, he would be the nominee, and if i had to bed right now, he would lose. i don't have that to happen. >> if you compare that are positions on the key important issues, they are two peas in the same pod. who does jeb bush take after? his family or potential opponent? holland cook joins us here in the studio. good to see you. great to have you with us.

>> ditto. >> he's his own man. why would he go down that road and even address that. >> he's going to have to. the talent he rounded up basically are family names. i'm not surprised by the huckabee number because he is plays better to the base who has two problems because huckabee of all the 12016 wannabes is the best speaker. >> he's the guy with the media savvy. >> carson is the worst, huckabee is the best. >> what's wrong -- >> twofold -- does he have a problem with talk radio? and frankly does it matter? talk room turnout is low, tends mob the more zealous voters tends to be the base. general election is every four years, we're going to pick a

president. it's more representative. talk radio doesn't have quite the track record in the presidential years that it has, as we just saw, in the off years, so if he does have a talk radio problem, does it matter? you've seen the ratings in the big markets, the big national talkers are in ratings trouble. so we'll see. i do think he has a problem with them. glenn beck is doing that drastic voice that he does. warning you about jeb. you've heard what laura ingraham says, rush limbaugh and sean hannity are very favorable to ted cruz who owns the tea party lane. shawn is intrigued with rand paul. if those two can win, place or show in iowa new hampshire and south carolina they are going to be pace cars that make this a long race for jeb. >> media matters is pointing out how many times limb bay ah mentioned scott walker's name,

almost as if he's already picked his guy in the race because of hi attack on unions and he is conservatively principled that he thinks he's the guy. can limbaugh help walker? >> we'll see, but walker will be the start governor guy. frankly, although i don't think that's his intention, walker may be running for vp. >> does talk radio have the influence it had ten years ago? let's go back to 2004 and the reelection. george w. bush. a lot of people are still wondering how did that happen? the righties were pounding john kerry. they had never seen anything like that before or heard anything like that before. i mean would that have an effect this time around? or is talk radio lost some of its influence? >> back then was before twitter, before facebook. people are having conversations

with or without talk radio, and you have seen is how they have to turn on a dime when the twitter-verse turns against them. you've seen still they will quickly walk back and apologize if limbaugh pounces on them but i think attention has now spread out. people having the conversation are more in control, and that the gatekeeper on talk radio might be less influential because of social media. >> i think the gatekeepers are well aware that the republican party doesn't want to do too much. i think they have more of an influence on people in washington than they do on the actual voters across the country. >> if i were jeb, i wouldn't be going on the shows anyway. lay low for now, what do you have to gain by exposing yourself? sooner or later they're both going to have to show up. >> as far as hillary is concerned, i don't think it's going to be a coronation i think it will be a draft. $8 billion is going to be spent.

who can raise that kind of money? i would say the clintons are first out. >> the do youugh is the mother's milk of this process, it will take he stumbling to bring in joe biden, the plan b. "politics nation" starts right now. \s. >> good evening, ed. we're going to see you later on in this show. >> looking forward to it. >> but now it's time for us to get to work. tonight's lead -- birtherism by another name. today one of the ugliest right-wing smears of the obama presidency has crept back into the republican rhetoric. the suggestion that somehow the american president is not fully american. here's what former new york city mayor rudie giuliani said at a