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tv   Ronan Farrow Daily  MSNBC  February 24, 2015 10:00am-11:01am PST

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h potentially life threatening injuries at this point. the metrolink slammed into a truck on the tracks causing several cars to derail. witnesses say the driver of that truck then took off. >> he was running and just -- you can tell right away when a person did something. >> on the scene in oxnardis miguel almaguer. what do we know about what could have led to this collision? >> reporter: ntsb is on their way out to this investigation. we don't have a lot of details. i want to show you the scene right now, this is the aftermath of that collision. what we're told is the commuter rail train was going at 79 miles per hour. its cruising rate when it spotted a truck in the railroad crossing when it began to slow down but at some point it did slam and plow into that truck. there was a collision here a
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fiery explosion. police were immediately called on and found 51 people injured inside many of those passenger vehicles. they took 28 to the hospital where they are being treated for different surgeries, four remain in critical condition. police are still on scene here investigating what happened here. we know three of the four cars were equipped with the crash energy management system which is designed to take a shock from an impact like this that was just implemented here last year for metro link. that they say investigators here probably did save lives in this incident. investigate ares are still here trying to determine what happened. the driver of the vehicle that collided with this train has been taken into custody. he's also being treated at a hospital for nearby injuries cone nan -- ronan -- >> thanks miguel. we'll keep following that. in washington at the same time we're waiting on the start of the white house briefing expected any minute at this
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point. we could hear fresh reaction and questions about an apologize from veterans affairs secretary bob mcdonald and to hear from bob mcdonald himself who admitted to mistaking his military record in a recent interview. telling a homeless veteran he served in special forces. in a statement mcdonald said that was inaccurate and i apologize to anyone offended by my misstatement. joining me now jim miklaszewski. the administration says it accepts mcdonald's explanation and it seems to be a direct explicit apology. >> it happened there in los angeles a month ago when robert mcdonald was seeking out homeless veterans on the streets when he encountered one vet who said he was special forces and mcdonald responded inexplicable i was special forces when that was not true. so far as you said, the white house is willing to accept the statement that he made a misstay
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and misstatement and apologize for it and the white house is willing to move on. declaring a military record that you don't deserve or military service that you don't deserve is one of the absolute cardinal sins that anybody in this service can do and so it will be a long time before mcdonald's apologies you through. >> and of course he did go to ranger school, i understand some of the confusion may have come from there. at any rate we have a direct apology and we'll have to see how that military community responds. always a pleasure jim. >> you bet. >> later in the hour we're going back inside the va with an investigation focused on one medical center in wisconsin, where oep yats were handed out like candy and one family lost their former marine son and gained a determination to uncover the truth about that facility. that should be at the half hour. also in washington today, secretary of state john kerry
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told lawmakers some progress is being made in the nuclear talks ongoing with iran. speaking before a subcommittee he cautioned there's no immediate deal on horizon. >> the policy is iran will not get a nuclear weapon. and anybody running around right now jumping into say we don't like the deal or this or that doesn't know what the deal is. there is no deal yet. and i caution people to wait and see what these negotiations produce. >> and new documents leaked to al jazeera, suggest that when the israeli prime minister told the u.n. back in 2012 that iran was close to making nukes, he was actually contradicted by his own intelligence agency. he told the prime minister there was no evidence that iran was developing nuclear weapons at the time.
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ali, the u.s. and iran go back to the bargaining table next week. what is iran hoping to get out of the next round of talks? >> iran wants sanctions lifted immediately and want to keep their nuclear program intact all be it a peaceful one according to authorities in iran. in geneva they seem to have made progress managing to sharpen up tough issues as a senior u.s. official put it. much remains to be done. the iranian foreign minister told the local media here that the talks of the p5plus one spes especially with americans are going well but a long way before an disagreement can be reached. the deal they want to last ten years. the so-called breakout capacity question of how long any agreement would endure is a
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critical one dominated these negotiations. americans want a deal that will would last 15 years or more and iranians seven years or less. what we can gather from these negotiations, they want a deal to put a serious restrictions on iran's programs for a decade after which those restrictions would be loosened which raised a lot of questions elsewhere. another clear indication that these talks are taking shape beyond the political outline with the presidents of the u.s. energy secretary and head of iran's nuclear agency. two people qualified to delve deeply and sources close to these negotiations have told me they've been able to square more circles on these talks than they have been before. >> maybe early signs of progress there. thanks ali. >> congress is still at odds over israeli prime minister
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netanyahu's joint speech before congress next month. two democratic senators have invited the prime minister to a closed door meeting during the visit in march. dick durbin and dianne feinstein sent this invitation along with a letter that blasts him for accepting john boehner's office to address both chamers saying it threatens the to undermine the bipartisan approach towards israel which troubles us deeply. and president obama could veet to a bill authorizing the construction of the keystone pipe line as soon as today. it will be the first veto of legislation from this new republican controlled congress. the white house has repeatedly threatened to axe this bill if it lands on the president's desk. we've got a programming note on president obama, he will sit down tomorrow with jose diaz balart at 8:00 p.m. eastern
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time. closing arguments could begin as early as this afternoon in the american sniper murder trial. his attorneys argue he's not guilty by reason of insanity, sew showing signs of psychosis when he shot them. how do they try to build up insan stant defense? >> reporter: eddie ray routh's attorneys are trying to show he had a psychosis that prevented him from knowing right from wrong and that's key in this case. they believe the psychosis was so strong that eddie ray routh thought the world was being invaded by pigs and chris kyle and chad littlefield were hybrid pigs. that's why he says he had to kill them first. the problem with that according
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to the state is that eddie ray routh fled the scene like a guilty man who knew what he was doing was wrong. in fak fact one of the psychiatrists who interview eddie ray routh said to the jury on friday routh knew what he was doing was wrong and he did it anyway. the jury is still hearing evidence today. it could get the case later today, perhaps tomorrow. ronan. >> a sad case thanks charles. nbc's charles hadlock. coming up in a vicious new attack isis militants just abducted dozens of christians in syria. we'll talk to one of the biggest political risk consulting firms and what he's telling his clients, both governments and private industries on what the new isis moves mean for their operation. stay with us. it's just you and your honey. the setting is perfect. but then erectile dysfunction happens again. you know what? plenty of guys have this issue not just getting an erection
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welcome back we're following reports that before dawn today isis militants kidnapped 90 syrian christians in the northerneastern part of that country, this latest attack follows the islamic state's brutal beheadings of 21 egyptian christians in libya. richard engel is following from istanbul. what do we know about the kidnappings and what do we know about how these two attacks on christians fit with isis' agenda? >> reporter: ronan, we just spoke to a top kurdish official who operates in this area and he described what happened to him -- what happened in this attack. two days ago, not at dawn this morning, two days ago isis attacked a string of christian villages in syria's province
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that there was a running battle there was an initial attempt to defend the christian villages by christian defense forces local militias that had been set up to try to keep isis back. when isis advanced these christian militias melted away and weren't able to hold ground. isis moved in and started carrying out potentially atrocities, very unclear of exactly what happened in the village because the christian defense forces went away. but then the people the villagers were at isis' mercy and it is said that isis took away between 70 and 100 of the christians primarily women and children, their fate is unclear. then the kurdish fighters who we are speaking to now in an attempt to rescue the village and reverse this assault have moved in and are launching a counteroffensive of their own. several hundred, if not a few
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thousand people from the area have been trying to escape to find safer ground. it is an ongoing battle but according to this kurdish official and two human rights groups dozens at least of christians were taken away when isis moved into these villages which is not far from the city which is right on the turkish border, where many of the refugees fled. >> troubling and at least the second data point of these attacks on christians richard engel, thanks so much for that update. >> an expansion of isis brings new risks for everyone operating in the middle east from private industry to governments, assessing those risks has become big business. ian joins me now. we talked earlier this year about your group's ton ten geo political risks and number one was how isis and its expansion would add to the problems of politics in europe. how would you characterize that threat now? >> well we saw the "charlie
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hebdo" bombings of course and 9/11 moment for france. we've seen this lone wolf attack in denmark, the follow-up, of course is enormous anti-immigrant sentiment as well in europe. very divided societies. it's one of many things like russia ukraine and greek skittishexit issue that's making the market a big concern for everyone thinking about the global economy today. >> today the south korean spy chief says a teenager went missing last month in turkey is probably the first known south korean to join the islamic state. how are foreign fighters traveling from home to syria, which we've seen all over the world shaking up global security? >> it's shaking up security in the region and shaking up security in europe. you're right, we have one from south korea and i think two from japan, even united states you're talking about sort of in a
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couple of hundred. i mean the fact is in the united states we have a relatively decent size islamic population but well integrated in our society so therefore not as vulnerable to the kind of calls that you're seeing from isis that just recently have brought these three teenage girls from britain over to syria as well. europe, again and of course the middle east itself is the big concern. my biggest concern, 26% of lebanon's citizens today are refugees and the economic carrying cost is immense. they can't handle it and of course tracking who is being radicalized in that environment is something they can't deal with. that's a real vulnerability. >> and those kind of refugee camps and populations can be hot bids for the radicalization you're talking about. while we have you here i want to switch to number two, russia there's a new interview where vladimir putin says an all-out
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war between russia and ukraine will not happen. do you believe him? >> i don't generally make a practice of believing putin, but all-out war between russia and ukraine is probably unlikely. the fact is that russia is at war with ukraine right now. there are russian troops that are fighting in ukraine. some russian troops that are dying in ukraine. and over 6,000 dead so far in that conflict. the ukrainians have lost 20% of the territory and i suspect they'll lose more before this is all wrapped up. i mean you're splitting infin tifs when you talk about how much we want to believe putin on this issue right now. >> and ukraine peace talks are under way, we'll have to see how those progress obviously some progress we think from the foreign ministers who are there but also plenty of reason with the players in this particular dispute to doubt there will be a full resolution. we'll watch and i know you will too. ian bremer fascinating to hear from you. >> thanks ronan.
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>> disturbing allegations that doctor at a va medical center have been overmedicating patients with powerful narcotics. you won't want to miss this investigative report. stay with us.
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after multiple charges of misconduct at its hospital the va has a new secretary and new promises much reof reform. one of those promises is still emerging and the focus of investigations inside and outside the va medical personnel, including chief of staff have allegedly been overmedicating patients with powerful pain killing narcotic drugs. those allegations first came to national attention when the center for investigative reporting published an article online last month. for this installment inside the va, we worked with the center to bring you this story. the hospital some patients came to call candy land and young veteran who died while receiving treatment there. >> he was very outgoing.
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he was the type of kid and person that could make anybody laugh. >> i lost my closest friend so he was one guy that i talked to every day. >> marvin and linda lost their son, jason, a former marine last summer. he died here at the va medical center in tomah, wisconsin, where he had been a mental health patient. the cause of death, mixed drug toxismty powerful painkillers and tranquilizers that the va had prescribed for him. he first went for addiction to pain medication and anxiety several years ago. the va his parents say initially described him 11 different medications as treatment. >> 11 different meds? >> 11 different meds yeah. >> did that surprise you? >> yeah yeah it blew my mind to be honest. i was shocked by it i just
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didn't really understand how with all of these different meds in his system how anything could work. >> heather was jason's wife and naya his daughter. >> i slowly saw him decline. he would be worse than when he went in. >> why did you think that was? >> it was the medication. i could tell when medications were changed or increased because his behavior would change so drastically. >> his parents say he was in and out of the va a half dozen times and often asked for more prescriptions and took more pills than he was supposed to. >> and he couldn't control or handle taking them and he was so confused by the amounts. so basically the last four years i gave him his meds seven days a week every day. >> three years ago they say he overdosed on one of the medications supplied to him by the va. >> he end up taking most of the three-month supply in four days. >> they repeatedly asked the va
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to reduce the number and amount of medications and these va documents provided by jason's father list his prescriptions days before his death. 14 different medications. >> we didn't know but it was in the autopsy report. >> just last month, evidence his story may have been part of a larger part tern the independent center for investigative reporting dug into allegations from whistle blowers that the tomah va was handing out powerful drugs like candy. through a freedom of information act request, prescriptions of four common opiates had almost quadrupled since 2005. and prescriptions for just one of them oxycodone increased
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almost ten-fold. 2005 was the year dr. david hul han became the chief of staff. the current and former va staff members described the tomah va as a place where many veterans were overmedicated and zombie fied with painkillers and so much so it was called a drug candy land. dr. hulahan saw patients and prescribed patients. his name is on several of jason's bottles. jason's father says employees at the va privately warned him his son's many medications were a problem. >> i met with a lot of nurses and counselors and everybody and said your son is on too many meds. they set right out they couldn't say anything because they have no say in the matter. >> ryan worked at the va last year for only a few weeks but
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became one of the most public wistle blowers, a u.s. army veteran and graduate of the military academy at west point and been a va psychiatric patient with credits the va for successfully treating his depression and ptsd. >> my impression was overwhelmingly positive and the va literally saved my life. >> reporter: shortly after he took a job as administrative assistant in the mental health unit he says he saw a different side. he filed a formal complaint last fall charging among other things that some tomah employees were concerned about unethical practices involving dr. hool han. too afraid to come forward because they feared retaliation. >> as soon as i became known as the public whistle blower willing to come out publicly i started to get calls from not only current employees but employees who had left the va and left to go to other
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facilities with really serious allegations. i had heard from psychologists and psychiatrists, other professionals, clinical people. it was pretty serious stuff. it was patients being overprescribed narcotics, some people alleging patient deaths. retaliation. >> we talked directly from five current and former va employees, including several medical personnel who allege they have firsthand knowledge that dr. hool han and other staff under his direction were overprescribing powerful pain killing narcotics to patients. some of them allege that was a contributing factor in the deaths of patients. one current tomah patient, jason bishop contacted told us overmedicating has been a common occurrence there. >> you go in there and that's all you see, empty eyes. >> in the other patients. >> in the other patients, yep. >> why do you think that is? >> they are gone all doped up.
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>> all doped up. >> you can tell they are all doped up. >> according to his medical records, bishop himself received high doses of morphine and other drugs from dr. hool han. he says dr. hoola han has done some good things for patients but questions his motivations for prescribing drugs, getting supplies of powerful addictive drugs, he says has made some patient's problems worse. >> i mean literally they are breeding addicts, drug addicts, not just physical addiction, they are breeding drug addicts. >> ryan quit the va weeks after filing his complaint citing a culture of retaliation and intimidation that had become unbearable. but he continued to try to bring the allegations to the attention of government investigators and public officials in wisconsin and washington as well as the media. after contacting the center for investigative reporting, honle
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and the center discovered something many didn't know. the va inspector general investigated these allegations before beginning in 2011. 32 specific allegations from multiple tomah va employees and the inspector general had completed a report a year ago but did not release it until after the center for investigative reporting made its existence public. it stated that the inspector general did not substantiate allegations that narcotic drugs were predescribed inappropriately and did not substantiate the allegations, including retaliation and intimidation. we did not find any conclusive evidence. but it did determine that the total amounts prescribed to all patients were at considerable var yans compared to other facilities in the region and the report confirmed five pharmacy staff left the facility in recent years over concerns of dr. houlihan's prescriptions.
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they considered the matter closed. the center for investigative reporting article generated a firestorm in wisconsin and rippled through the v axtd and congress in washington, d.c. there are now many investigations. last month bob mcdonald noungsed that the va itself would create a comprehensive review of medication practices, including a review by a va accountability team in retaliation against whistle blowers and also investigating, the state of wisconsin, at least one congressional committee and u.s. drug enforcement administration or dea. >> building 404, this is where the tom ah va writes many drug prescriptions for veterans it's one place investigators inside and outside the va are looking for answers. under scrutiny, the tomah va
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management including dr. houlihan, he has been temporarily reassigned outside the medical center and not see patients or prescribe medication spending the investigations. his attorney says he will fully cooperate with any formal investigation and will be cleared of any alleged wrong doing. dr. houlihan's attorney said he would be happy to do an interview if the va approved. but a public affairs rep said they could approve no interviews, ryan is continuing to push for more attention, despite what he claims are attempts by the tomah va to hurt his reputation and undermine his credibility. >> all anybody wants out of any of this is a serious investigation because it comes down to being concerned about patients. >> without real changes, the employees told us veteran patients there will continue to be vulnerable to the risks of getting too many medications. jason bishop agrees. >> a lot of the people will want
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relief so bad, that they'll keep taking them. they'll give them -- they'll take whatever it is they give them. >> they hope the investigations leads to answers about what happened to their son, jason and to changes for other veterans. >> do you blame that va health care center for his death? >> i do i really do. i feel he didn't have a chance. >> not with all of those meds in his system and not by adding more meds. >> we trusted them and we expected them to know what to do because it was really hard for us. and it just seems like they kept giving him more and more. >> i wish they would have helped him when he was there instead of just keep giving him more and more and more and it's -- it's sad because i don't even have someone to be there for me now and yeah -- >> i'm so sorry for your loss. >> and in response to us yesterdays the va said it was
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actively reviewing all allegations of retal tri behavior and overmedication at the tomah va and looking thoroughly into the specifics of what happened leading up to the death of jason. the va responded aggressively to the inspector general's report on those allegations, making changes, quote, in response to the inspector general's recommendations. changes like allowing pharmacy staff to appeal prescription decisions by reporting to another senior manager, not the chief of staff. directing the doctor and the psychiatric nurse practitioner to move clinically depressed patients to another doctor based on their high prescribing of opiates and pain control physician to separate pain managements from psychiatric care. the va claims that it haents stop whistle blowers from demanding more accountable. one of them ryan honnell, will tell me what he thinks of the
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we're back with our investigation into the alleged overmedication of veterans at the va medical center. we invited the veteran's affairs representative to send a representative but they politely declined. joining me now, ryan honnell, you have been an important part of pulling back the curtain on some of these allegations. i want to get an update. what's happened in tomah since the first news broke from the center for investigative reporting? >> well, first of all, thanks ronan for covering this. it really highlights the importance of the bill of rights and particularly the first amendment because when government fails as a whole, which is base beingally what's happening in the va it is only
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the press to inform the public accurately about what's going on. like i said it's all about accountability. and you've got all of these fires throughout the va tomah or -- last june rob nabors a staffer at the white house, actually put out a report and on page two of that report, which i'm not going to read for time purposes actually spells out. you can google that online and find that but it's all about accountability and hasn't changed up to this point. it doesn't matter how many -- new va secretary can be put in the turnstyle but can't hold them accountable if they hide the report. it's only the president of the united states, president obama, that can nominate a new inspector general that doesn't hide reports like the one in
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tomah. he doesn't hide information from a secretary shinseki regarding other scandals. >> what kinds of reception have you gotten since you went public? have investigators contacted you? >> i met with a dea investigator, state investigator. i basically stopped working with the va because from day one -- one of the problems in the va and again, all on the inspector general, is that whether you complain as a patient or you complain as an employee problems get pushed down and don't go up. in my case i reported the facility director reported my service line manager, i reported david houlihan and for the first couple of months in the quote/unquote investigation, everything hot potato got handed down to them to investigate
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themselves. unless something changes, nothing is going to change. even until today i'm being retaliated against. i have a police report that was done five months after i left the facility talking about my instability and how i'm crazy. in a police report black and white, i've got mental health professionals calling me crazy and contracts with multiple people in the tomah facility accessing my medical records after i left and compound that with the fact that i never received care at the tomah va facility. >> in a facility you never received care in but against which you were bringing forward some of these accusations from other whistle blowers, people were accessing your private medical records and you feel they were using those against you to try to undermine your credibility? >> well you know i mean i don't have answers to that. it takes a serious impartial investigation. i mean the simple fact is i have a half dozen people in my
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medical records after i left. and the reason i never got care in tomah, we moved up here and i was an employee for eight weeks. i had planned on getting care in tomah, but i was still getting care in indiana where i moved from from a va doctor who has been treating me and literally saved my life. so for va employees within the tomah facility to black and white, black and white call me crazy, it shows you can't even leave the va without being retaliated against. the last thing i'll say about continuing retaliation, i've got a threat of a lawsuit from david houlihan and what does he put in here, he puts in here in response to a reporter he puts that -- he references my mental health problems. and so even until today, the chief psychiatrist in all of western wisconsin for the va
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the chief of staff, is accusing me of things related to my mental health status. >> it is true the va says that that kind of charge of retaliation is one of the things they are loorking into here. we'll have to see what that investigation concludes. ryan honl thanks so much. we'll keep watching this story and keep tabs on your situation as well. >> thank you very much ronan. >> the reporter who first uncovered this story and ignite a firestorm, the center for investigative reporting aaron glance. thank you so much for your work on this. it's a wrenching story for the facility in wisconsin, but explain to the audience what this means for the rest of the country and what this tells us about the va in general? >> i think the reason this story about a va in rural wisconsin is important to everyone in america because it goes to the heart of the problems that the agency has been having. secretary eric shinseki was forced to resign last year over
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allegations that books were being cooked and that many people throughout the agency charged with helping veterans recover from war were ignoring the very rules that they were supposed to be following. here we are, you know almost a year later with a new va secretary. the issue is different. it's painkillers, but the problem is the same. they are not able to follow their own rules. the va rules clearly state, you know when you have patients be very judicious in the use of these dangerous addictive narcotics and yet here we have a chief of staff of a hospital who is doling them out like candy and when people like ryan say there's a problem there, they are the ones that bear the brunt of retaliation. >> this is one of the early scandals that is still developing under that new leadership under the new secretary. tell us about how vigorous his
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response has been. has there been the response that the whistle blowers are calling for? >> he's been public since we released our story in january, the entire wisconsin congressional delegation democrats and republicans immediately called for investigations and change. secretary mcdonald responded. you mentioned the va is investigating itself the office of inspector general has a new investigation, dea is involved. but the real question is why didn't he do anything sooner? why did it take a public shaming in the media for him to calling for an investigation? i have e-mail correspondence from him with ryan honl before our story ran saying that he was on top of it other va workers i've talked to said they spoke directly with secretary mcdonald and then when the scandal came out in our story in january, he acted surprised and pledged to
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investigate. where was this action when people were complaining privately? why did it take the media to grab everyone's attention? >> one thing we have heard throughout reporting this series on the v.a. from veterans and whistleblowers is the seemingly reluctance to take action unless there is a spotlight. aaron glants thank you. >> we did reach out to the v.a. to join us for the story and they politely declined. and just ahead, domestic political news. the so-called man of chicago, can he avoid a run-off? rahm emanual of chicago in the hot seat. x mealtime. with great taste and 100% complete nutrition, it's the only one cats ask for by name. there's nothing more romantic than a spontaneous moment.
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some breaking news right now. administration officials telling nbc news the justice department is going to announce the decision this afternoon in the trayvon martin case whether or
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not they will pursue federal civil rights charges against george zimmerman. they are expected to say they will not pursue charges against zimmerman. he was found not guilty of charges. this thursday is three years since 17-year-old trayvon martin was shot and killed on his way home from a convenience store. that announcement expected today from the department of justice. we'll bring it to you live as any news comes out of that. and in chicago where it is colder than elsewhere around the country in this cold snap the mayoral election is getting hot. people are headed to the polls to see if rahm emanual will stick around. he needs over 50% of the vote to avoid a runoff but a final poll putting him only at 48%. his primary challenger cook county commissioner jesus, chewy, garsy, he polls at 26.5%.
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following this kevin tibbles. how has this changed since the last mayoral election which was an easy win? >> if you take in the margin of error, he could be over the top if he is 48%, he could be over the 51% line and with all elections, ronin, when it gets down to the nitty-gritty time to fish or cut bait people start talking about what if he doesn't get it. obviously rahm emanual is a high profile mayor coming in after richard dally, but when we talk about the issues here this is when people start to sort of scratch their head and say, well, who, exactly is supporting him in this election? obviously in the minority areas of chicago, which is where chewy garcia is doing well those are the same areas where the mayor
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closed some 50 schools. and another group of people are talking or discussing the fact the crime rates here and the murder case seems to be relatively high compared to other parts of the country. in spite of the fact that the murder race went down last year. so as we approach the final bell with regards to this election a lot of people are talking about, well, is the mayor going to be able to get over the finish line and avoid the runoff in april. at this point, who knows. what i can tell you is you did mention the cold weather. a record number of people voted early in this election. perhaps in order to stay out of the lines today because it is another cold wintery day here in chicago. >> and one thing we do know for sure. the chicago tribune reporting he raised about $15 million in this race so far so whatever the result he will come through it flush. thank you, kevin tibbles. >> that wraps up rf daily live from los angeles. thank you for joining. i always appreciate your time.
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hello, everyone. i'm joy reid and we begin with breaking news. the justice department has just announced the conclusion in the trayvon martin case. this afternoon they found insufficient evidence to pursue federal criminal civil rights charges against george zimmerman for the fatal shooting of trayvon martin. you may recall zimmerman was found not guilty on all charges in connection with trayvon martin's death. the usa todayam itch al sindor covers this. you covered this as i did in sanford all of the many months and i know this just happened but give me what you might expect the reaction will be? >> i think people will not be surprised. and i lot of the people i talked to after the jury trial said they didn't think this would meet the bar of the federal hate