jihadi john had a face, and now he has a name. the united states' commitment and the president's commitment to ensuring that we find and hold accountable the terrorists who are responsible for the murders of american citizens has never been stronger. >> good afternoon. i'm abby huntsman. as we come on the air today, the man known around the world for carrying out the bloody beheadings of at least three americans is no longer anonymous. the man is mohammed emwazi. he was born in kuwait but grew up in an affluent london neighborhood. he graduated with a degree in computer programming. he told a london rights group he

had been unfairly treated, that he felt like a prisoner. >> and every single scenario mohammed is doing his best over that whole period to try and find some recourse to being able to live his life outside of the u.k. and away from harassment. but at every single turn the u.k. security agencies were there, blocking him, stopping him without ever bringing any kind of criminal case against him. >> emwazi then made his way into syria. jihadi john is always dressed the same all in black, only his eyes and the ridge of his nose are ever visible. you can always see that holster under his left arm. he was dubbed jihadi john last august when experts substantiatedsubstantiate ed -- started analyzing his british accent. we've now heard from him seven times since. take a listen to that accent. >> we are an islamic army and a state.

>> nbc news chief global correspondent bill neely is in london with the latest on what we know about this guy. >> good afternoon, abby. the man who up to know only had a nickname jihadi john now has a name mohammed emwazi. and it turns out he was not only known to american and british security services but was interviewed by british officials on at least two occasions in two countries over two years. so it turns out this man was in his mid-20, from a well-to-do kuwaiti family graduated from the university of westminster here in london with a degree in computer sciences. and in 2009 was well known enough to security services to be questioned after a visit so tanzania. they wanted to know had he planned to go to somalia and join the al shabaab terror organization? he was questioned by security officials again in 2010 after going to kuwait. he was fingerprinted, searched

questioned. and according to a british advocacy group, at that stage he felt he was being harassed by british officials. in fact they say he was not only radicalized in britain, but he was radicalized by britain because of the treatment by british security officials. so there are -- it's interesting that we know some of these details now, of course. in 2012 2013, he ended up in syria. but it does leave many questions open. for example, when did he first come on the radar of the security services and why? it was clearly while he was a university student. what did they suspect him of? did they track him? was he on a terror watch list or was he just a name on their database? and why did they not prevent him in 2012 or 2013 from going to syria? those were early years for people to go from this country and from other foreign countries into syria.

but why was he not stopped? so in one sense, it changes a lot because we now have a greater idea of the background of this man, and it turns out he is an intelligent man from a well-to-do family. to some degree he doesn't fit the template of those angry jihadis who would join isis. but in other respects, you know it doesn't change anything. he's still with isis. he's still the public face if you like of the organization. he's still killing people, and it appears he's still in syria, still hunted still the world's most wanted man. back to you. >> nbc's bill neely in london for us. thank you so much for that. capitol hill is a very busy place lately. let's bring in an important figure in all of this senator joe manchin. thank you so much for being with us. >> thanks for having me abby. >> so yesterday it was three men from brooklyn arrested for

planning to join isis. today it's come out the guy with the british accent was from london and has been in syria for almost four years. senator, we are dealing with our very own people here. how does this change the game for you? >> well also abby we've been told that there's terrorists -- some type of terrorist activity in all 50 states. so this is not some other people's problem. this is all of our problems. right here in the united states. that's why it's important to have a clean department of homeland security bill. not for any political reason. just saying all of us democrats and republicans, believe that securing our homeland and keeping our people safe in america is the first and foremost thing we must do. >> you mentioned the 50 states comment by fbi director jim comey and the need for this vote. but you have been critical at times of president obama. let me ask you, today, senator, in your view is that executive order on immigration illegal or unlawful? >> i think he overstepped. this is my personal opinion. i was an executive.

i was governor of the state of west virginia. i knew how far the boundaries were. i would say, i'd like to do this, can you work with me? is this something you'd rather not do and i'll do it because you don't have the political will to do it? you'd work through these things. i think he did overstep. i was never consulted, never worked with. i believe we passed that very progressive, very bipartisan immigration bill in the senate. we're just asking for some sort of a vote. if mr. boehner and all of his colleagues over there doesn't like the clean homeland security and they think that's the only vehicle they have only thing we have said -- and think about this. 98 senators out of 100 voted to get on a clean bill today. it'll pass overwhelmingly. that sends a pretty strong signal. if you want a vote on repealing the president's -- which i would vote for. i know that runs amok with some democrat, but i believe he did overstep. i believe he could have worked a little more. >> just so we understand you,

when you say overstepped and that you would vote differently there, are you saying it was a bad idea by president obama or are you saying that he broke the law, that this was an illegal act? >> i just don't think he did enough as an executive. we got setbacks all the time being the executive of our states or the executive of this country. you have to work with the legislative branch of government. you have got to make it work. and that takes an awful lot of work and effort. i think more could have been done from the white house, period. >> okay senator. so let's set aside the issue of whether or not the president overstepped, and let's just deal with the core issue here which is what we're going to do with the 11 million undocumented folks who live in this country. as the president said to jose diaz-balart last night we are not physically able to deport all those people. that's not going to happen. so what sir, is your plan, your idea, for what we should do with all those folks? >> my plan is exactly what i voted for, which is a comprehensive, you know -- in west virginia, it would have

been very easy for me to vote against any type of immigration plan. that's not realistic, just as you said. who believes anyone will round up 11 million people? some came here basically with the intentions of having a better quality of life a better opportunity. they came here illegally. we had a bill that basically said this. democrats and republicans and the border control, which really tightened our borders, which needs to be done. then it said you must go and register as an illegal, coming here and breaking the law, paying a fine getting in line and start a process of legalization. and if you commit a crime while you're going through that legalization, you'll be deported, but you're going to have a chance for a better quality of life. you're going to have a chance to be paying your taxes, be an american, and have all the fruits of this great country. i think we all want that pathway now. if you come to the realization that they're here and they're not going to be deported back. those who are in a perfect world saying let's go round up 11 12, 13 million people and send

them out, that's not even realistic. that's what we're trying to say. sooner or later, the house has to come to the conclusion we've got to have a good immigration bill, protecting our borders, pathway to legalization, being an american paying your taxes, learning english, having a job. >> makes sense. >> senator on the president's executive action i understand you feel that he overstepped and are planning on voting with the republicans on that one. the president has already said that he will veto that if it does come to his desk. isn't this any way an issue better sorted out by the courts? >> i think the courts are. i think it was perfect. everybody can walk away as a win/win here. we, who believe very strongly democrats and republicans, don't mess with don't play politics with homeland security. fund it. we've done that. let's do that separately. the other thing is the court in texas has already said listen i believe there's reason that we should let this go on let's see where it goes. the president has even said

i'll stop. and he's agreed to stop. i think that's very commendable. stop his executive action and wait for the court's decision. so if the president, if everybody is just bent on getting this repealed just because they want to vote i'm voting because i truly believe there was an overstepping. i think the administration as far as the white house and the legislature has to work. but if it goes to him, he can say, listen i'm vetoing this because i have agreed to wait on the court action. everybody can walk away a winner. >> do you think republicans have every right to put forward another bill to roll back the president's executive action, which they've said they're now going to do? you're saying you're upset. do you think they have every right to do that? >> i don't have a problem. that's the legislative branch of government, abby. they have a right to do that. i just don't think that they have a purpose or a right and they should be single purpose here. don't you believe that securing our homeland is more important than putting any political jargon in there, any type of

other legislation, any type of the policy? this is pretty simple. we're going to make sure every state has the ability to keep the people safe in their state. i'd like to find out where this nest of terrorists in west virginia may be. i think we can take care of it in west virginia. trust me. we'll take care of that back home. just give us an idea where they are. we'll go get them. >> senator joe manchin, thank you as always for being with us. >> thanks abby. >> and we'll talk about what's happening on the house side with congressman peter welch in just a bit. first, one of the nation's top terror experts explains what we can all learn from a history of violence in the middle east. plus, the south gets slammed by winter storm rema. drivers stranded and hundreds of thousands without power. when will it end? and later, a boston headline that has nothing to do with snow. the one sports contest beantown may want to throw. the cycle is rolling on. it's thursday, february 26th. meet the world's newest energy superpower. surprised? in fact, america is now the world's number one

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the fbi's new arrest of isis sympathizers in brooklyn are another reminder of terrorism's global appeal. and while westerners say terror is ineffective, it clearly endures as a tactic across many conflicts. bruce hoffman, a terrorism expert who worked for the u.s. military's elite, documents many examples where he says terror did work. the islamic jihad attacks on u.s. troops in lebanon in 1983, and the ability of islamist terrorists to force israel into negotiations for hostages to this day. and israel is an example that offers lessons for today. hoffman has spent years studying

the political violence in palestine. he argues that effort included everything from diplomacy and lobbying to civil disobedience and, yes, terrorism. he writes, quote, the jewish terrorism campaign was arguably the first post-world war ii war of national liberation to clearly recognize the publicity value inherent in terrorism. the violence was often choreographed for an audience far beyond the local population. that's from his latest book. hoffman is director of the center for security studies at the georgetown school of foreign service. he's one of the top terror experts in the u.s. and also expert of the classic study inside terrorism. an honor to have you here. welcome, bruce. i want to start off the bat and ask you, how did political violence and terrorism impact

britain's posture towards palestine? that period you write about before world war ii? >> well first and foremost i think whether we think terrorism is effective or not, the terrorists certainly believe it's effective. and the problem is they learn from one another. so the jewish terrorists modeled their campaign on the irish terrorists from the 1920s. and they especially, i think in the post-war era, were able to use daring dramatic acts of violence to capture the attention of the media and appeal to audiences throughout the world. >> and you've written in this book about how hard it can be to define terrorism versus traditional military action or what some would call resistance to any kind of occupation. how do you draw that line in your study here of jewish and palestinian groups' actions in that era? >> the main problem is again, that on both sides the arabs and the jews in pre-state israel was

the mandate of palestine. both believed they could use violence to intimidate persuade, or coerce the british. the problem was that the british dismissed this as a threat, didn't take it all that seriously, but i think the fundamental issue is they didn't learn as well or study past experiences and learn from them as well as their enemies did. and that fundamentally meant their intelligence was often weak, their cultural understanding of the environment was poor. their linguistic abilities were lacking. many of the same problems that we've seen for instance over the past decade in afghanistan and iraq where u.s. and coalition forces were deployed existed in palestine 60 years ago. i think one of the lessons from the book is terrorists in order to survive, learn very well. unfortunately, the governments and militaries don't learn nearly as well. they catch up very fast. but at the same time, there's often a period where they're struggling. >> bruce, let's deal with some of the central questions of the beginning of the book. you begin with the question does terrorism work?

you quote several important figures, the prime minister of ra dee ja saying terrorists can never win outright. caleb carr after 9/11 saying the strategy of terror is a spectacularly failed one. yet, you write if it's so ineffective, why has it persisted for so long? surely terrorism scares people. it scares governments. it gives small forces a chance to fight with much bigger ones. but it never really wins wars and it never wins hearts and minds. what do you say to this question that you raise of is terrorism effective? >> well i think firstly, we have to study it unemotionally and objectively and realize as a tactic, it's often very successful. the bottom line of most terrorist organizations is simply the desire to attract attention to themselves and their cause, to thrust their causes on to the world's agenda. terrorism has, unfortunately, often succeeded.

throughout history, it hasn't had the power to win war, but it's been the cause of many wars or many wider conflicts. i think that's why it's so important to understand the genesis of terrorism and the foundations that terrorism seeks, that terrorists seek to establish to carry out their campaigns as the most effective way of countering them and defeating them quickly. >> an incredible part of that is the media, keeping terrorism afloat, i would say, especially today when they use media to recruit people but also to send out their messages. and you write about propaganda, the theater of terrorism. talk to us about back in this era in the 1940s when they essentially didn't have very much media at all. >> that's the very depressing thing. even in an era before 24/7 news coverage and instantaneous satellite transmissions, the terrorists in palestine deliberately sought to play to an audience beyond the foot

lights. an audience firstly in world capitals across the globe, to an audience in the united states to an audience especially in the united nations, and use their violence as a means to get attention to themselves and their causes and to put pressure on governments. today, unfortunately, the situation has become even more complex and more diverse. now we have terrorists not just using traditional media, not even just using the internet but very effectively mobilizing and seizing upon social media to even more effectively, more rapidly and less expensively communicate their messages of radicalization and recruitment, as we see exist today across europe and the united states. >> so bruce, are there lessons we can learn from what you argue were past historical successful terroristic campaigns? are there lessons we can learn to more effectively combat terrorism in the future and make them less successful? >> absolutely. that's one of the reasons i wrote the book really.

i've been studying terrorism for 40 years. i really thought we have to go into history and be as good as learning as the terrorists are. first and foremost we have to understand that terrorism is a strategy of provocation. that's not to say we don't respond, but we choreograph our own response in a way that doesn't play into the terrorists' hands. unfortunately throughout history, that hasn't necessarily been the case. i think, too, we have to understand the paramount importance of intelligence. this is what undermines and undid the british in palestine and what has been our achilles heel in the war on terrorism. it's also the linguistic knowledge, the cultural and regional intelligence and expertise that enables us to really understand the population that we're trying to wean from the terrorists. and only in that manner can we effectively counter the terrorist propaganda and messages of violence and hatred. >> your book covers so much of that, some of it depressing because it is so familiar. bruce hoffman, thank you so much. we have a very different story to show you right here.

these are live pictures right now. i'm not kidding. this is a pair of llamas that are on the loose in arizona. one was just captured. the one you see there is still giving the maricopa county sheriffs office a little bit of chase. this is live footage you can't make up. there is no word on who owns these llamas or where they belong. they have been running through the backyards. this is a story we will stay on as long as we need to. >> we trust that you're all over this, ari. thank you. >> let's not leave this. these pictures are amazing. >> it's a thing that's happening. you can see it there on your screen. now it's not even moving very fast. i do want to tell you, loyal viewers, that up next we have more snow, ice, and freezing rain. it's all over the country. some of it heading towards many places you'll want to know about. your forecast is straight ahead. >> do we have more llamas? major: ok fitness class! here's our new trainer ensure active heart health. crowd: yayyyy! heart: i'm going to focus on the heart. i minimize my sodium and fat... gotta keep it lean and mean. pear: uh-oh.

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llamas that have been on the loose, giving police quite a chase and made for great video. they have now been contained. they've been caught. ari, i want to make sure you were updated on the latest there on the llama news. we want to go now to the forecast. domenica davis what's going on? >> we're talking snow. we have big historic snow in the south. that's what's happened today. it's ended now, but look at these storm totals. parts of alabama picked up a foot of snow. tupelo, 7 inches. this puts them in the category of top five snowstorms in some cases. here's a look at ratthe radar. you can see that's ended. we still have some snow showers in eastern massachusetts. that's clearing out as well. and it's back to the cold. so the snow is gone. we get another reinforcing shot of arctic air over the next 48 hours. that means bitter windchills will once again be up through the northern plains and the great lakes. it will feel like by 7:00 tonight temperatures are going

to feel like they're below zero through parts of the great lakes. friday morning, minus 9 for your feel-like temperature in chicago. and then this cold air continues into friday. now, we do warm up some for the weekend, but we have another storm to talk about. we'll have this one form in the rockies late on friday and saturday night. early sunday, we're looking inging a swath of snow from denver to chicago. 3 to 6 inches with isolated higher amounts. this will move off to the east sunday night into monday for the northeast. so yet another weekend and another storm. that's the latest from here. back to you. >> all right, domenica. thank you. and another weather friend touches on a question many of us want the answer to. when is this winter going to end? he's got a new piece up on nbcnew york.com with five reasons why spring is just around the corner. we're linking to it as well from

our facebook page. hey, while you're there, we could always use some extra likes because, let's face t guys, we like you too. >> oh so sweet. and a little transition. it is currently 38 degrees in washington, d.c. right now just enough to thaw the frozen ground. but can anything thaw the frozen politics around funding our national security? sometimes i wish idina menzel would tell republicans, let it go. >> i think it's outrageous senate democrats are using homeland security funding for blackmail to protect the actions of the president. >> american people are frightened and rightfully so. isis appears to have money. terrorists appear to have money. why shouldn't our homeland have the ability to protect itself? >> just moments ago on this very program, we heard from another prominent prominent prominent democrat senator, joe

manchin. >> don't you believe securing our homeland is more important than putting any political jargon in there, any type of other type of legislation, any type of policy? this is pretty simple. >> the house will be next and hopefully final battleground for the funding bill. congressman peter welch is with us from there. he serves on the national security homeland defense and foreign relations subcommittee. once again, it's come down to the 11th hour. this time it's about funding arguably the most important department right now. what's your reaction to how things have played out over the last few days? >> it's more of the same, and it's got to be pretty dispiriting for americans. obviously we have to keep homeland security funded. 535 members of congress are in agreement that we should fund it. we're having a debate one that's going to continue on immigration. but why in the world would you shut down the agency that provides for a national security as a way, as a tactic of trying to get your way? what we're seeing is a replay. the republicans have embraced

this tactic of shutdown. they used it on the debt ceiling. they used it on obamacare where they actually shut government down for 17 days. and they're using it now on homeland security. and it's an indication that they're in love with this tactic more than they are in trying to get a political outcome. it's doomed. it's dramatic. but it's doomed. >> and congressman, in terms of how you're planning to vote obviously you would support a clean funding bill through the end of this fiscal year. but what if what you're asked to vote on is a shorter term funding bill let's say two months instead of all the way through the fiscal year. would you vote yes on that? >> i would consider that. i don't want to have a shutdown. we can avoid a shutdown if something is clean. my much stronger prmpbs erer preference is we have a clean bill for homeland security through the end of the budget year. then we can have these debates that are really important on immigration policy. but we're not in the driver's seat here. john boehner at a certain point has to make a decision. i expect he's actually already

made it. that is, he's going to put a bill on the floor that he knows will pass with democratic votes and probably with a few republican votes. but he's just delaying when the moment of truth is and that he actually has to put that bill on the floor and face his republican colleagues who think a shutdown is the way to victory. >> congressman it seems that the senate is trying to move past the habit of governing by crisis, but the house seems to remain attracted to it like a moth to a flame. why is the house still attracted to governing by crisis? >> well i think there's two things. i think, one, politically they want to keep up the fight with obama, and now they have a new adversary and it's mitch mcconnell. a lot of my republican colleagues are saying if we cave, it's caving in the senate and it will be more of the same for two years. the second is they come from districts where they're going to be rewarded for standing and fighting, even though that's a doomed fight. it's like they want the charge of the light brigade rather than a successful outcome in any political strategy that has a chance of moving us ahead.

>> congressman, thank you as always for your time. >> thank you. >> and this entire debate sounds all too familiar. fortunately, we have a familiar face to help break it all down who knows all about government dysfunction from her time working on appropriations bills. have you ever seen it this bad? >> no, no. i don't think really anybody has. usually the house and the senate actually try to fund the government. taxing and spending is a big part of what congress is supposed to do. yeah, you debate back and forth over funding levels here and there, but not actually whether or not to keep the government open. it's usually a very rare thing. >> yeah and senator chuck schumer was talking about this just recently today in the senate judiciary committee hearing for loretta lynch but touching on multiple issues. take a listen. >> i have to tell you, i feel a little like i'm in the twilight zone this week. it's like an alternative reality when my colleagues across the aisle who have strong records in

history of supporting our national security are first blocking the funding for dhs and second blocking the chief law enforcement officer. >> and he's speaking there about the fact many republicans did vote against loretta lynch, even though they supported her previously as a federal prosecutor. having said that though in national security news here she did get out today on a 12-8 vote, which means we could have a new attorney general soon. what do you make of that step and the way it fits in the larger fight over republicans and immigration? >> well, the thing to know about loretta lynch's nomination is that she has been languishing more than any other a.g. nomination in the past. i think what that does is reflects what we're seeing now with this funding fight. there's a cultural shift away from -- or a disregard for energy time and people as a government resource that needs to be managed, not just money. time is money. and when the government wastes time, it is wasting the people's money, and it's a valuable

precious resource. so the fact that we're going back and forth over what to do with dhs, meanwhile dhs has to have a plan for a shutdown. they're required by law to plan. regardless of what happens on friday, whether or not we manage to pass a bill dhs has already spent time, energy and people resources towards planning for a shutdown. so that money, that time that energy has already been wasted. the second thing there is it's really concerning that so many people are okay with having government workers go to work without pay. the department of homeland security, these are the people who are fighting terrorism on our home turf. there's no real difference between them and the men and women in our armed services. we would never not fund military paychecks, but yet we're okay with not funding dhs paychecks. so there's this kind of idea that government workers, again the people resource isn't as valuable as maybe cash or political clout. >> yeah erica, thank you as

always for being with us. >> happy to be here. and up next some of the biggest gop names for 2016 are sounding off at cpac today. we'll listen to a bit of what they had today. and the president did a bit of sounding off on his own last night on msnbc. >> he looks a little better because, you know, i don't dye my hair. jack's heart attack didn't come with a warning. today, his doctor has him on a bayer aspirin regimen

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immigration fight to prove their conservative chops at today's annual cpac gathering just outside of washington. but the president's take if you don't like it then vote on it. last night in an exclusive town hall right here on msnbc, the president dared majority leader mitch mcconnell and speaker john boehner to pass a bill declaring his immigration executive actions illegal, a bill that he would then probably veto. and instead of holding up homeland security, he challenged the gop to actually work on a comprehensive immigration reform package. surprisingly, he says he's optimistic. >> i haven't given up on passing it while i'm president. we're going to keep on pushing, and although so far the republican party has been pretty stubborn about this issue, if they start feeling enough pressure, that can make a difference. >> let's take this to the table here. and i had to say, watching that town hall last night, it was not softball. the president very much challenged, had to get feisty

and i wouldn't say combative, but definitely had to defend what he's done on immigration. and this is a guy who has worked to pass comprehensive immigration reform who has taken executive action to halt deportations for some, and he's taking that kind of heat. can you imagine when to you have a republican nominee the kind of heat they're going to take on this issue and the type of heat that the republicans who hope to be president are going to take in the primary? i look at what's going on right now in the house with john boehner and these other congressional republicans. i think they're doing everything they possibly can to hand the white house back to democrats in 2016. >> you know it was a great town hall last night. and he talked about republicans very much in general. people do this all the time here on msnbc as well. republicans think this republicans think that. when it comes to immigration all republicans are against immigration. it's amazing to me because you look at the polls and see what the reality is outside the few voices that speak for the rest of us. reality is majority of republicans support immigration

reform. they might not agree with the way the president went about doing it, and i don't think we should debate immigration reform. maybe we can debate how we go about it, but this is the future of this country. that's something president obama spoke to, saying this is on the side of history. do we want to get to that or not? i think it would be smart for a republican to stand up and lead the party. the one person that seems to be able to do that is jeb bush, someone who's supported immigration reform for a very long time. the president spoke to him directly last night. take a listen. >> i appreciate mr. bush being concerned about immigration reform. i would suggest that what he do is talk to the speaker of the house and the members of his party because the fact of the matter is that even after we pass bipartisan legislation in the senate, i gave the republicans a year and a half a year and a half to just call the bill. we had the votes. they wouldn't do it. >> you know this is tough for

jeb bush. here he is at cpac for the next couple of days. talking about immigration reform, it's not going to go so well. but if he wants to be someone that's part of history, part of remaking the republican party, this is something he's got to get on and get on it today. >> yeah it's third-rail stuff among the republicans, especially at a place like cpac. you talk about history and where this country is going, supporting immigration reform is absolutely where we should be. the country is moving in a certain direction, and that train is not going to stop. let me show you my favorite moment from last night. >> now, over the long term this is going to get solved because at some point, there's going to be a president rodriguez or there's going to be a president chin or a -- [ applause ] you know, the country is a nation of immigrants. ultimately, it will reflect who we are and its politics will reflect who we are.

>> ari, this is a nation that's browning. we're not going back. we need to embrace that future and not be afraid of it. because new folks coming in has made this country stronger. you think about the irish, the italians, the eastern europeans who came here, demonized at first and then became extraordinary americans. that's the trajectory that mexican-americans are on. >> you think we'll see a president toure some day? >> i don't know if i can answer that at this juncture. >> ari doesn't comment on the future. i forgot that. >> but i hear you, and i think that it is a funny thing because immigration is such an old debate in this country. and yet, it is one that we know time and time again has been a place of progress of self-improvement, of -- >> it's what our country is about. >> so there's -- it's bittersweet. there's something sad about the fact this feels so intractable. yet, as the president was trying to emphasize, there is something hopeful here and progress too. the other thing i wanted to play was him talking about the legal challenges which we were just discussing with senator manchin. let's take a listen.

>> of course we weren't surprised. i've got a bunch of lawyers. we saw the judge who was rendering the opinion. the fact that we weren't surprised doesn't mean we can stop the judge from rendering an opinion. it means that we then go forward in the appeal process. that's how the legal system works. >> is that how the legal system works? >> that's how it works. he's trying to put a good face on the fact they got a bad ruling from a texas district court. that's the first cut. and there's a whole set of other courts including the supreme court, that can weigh in. i do think it goes to something that's broader than immigration, which is the impasse between the republicans and this president. which has continued now even though they have both houses of congress and could be more functional if they wanted to be. it goes to a real break down in the way we govern ourselves. it's true in life if you're always going to court to settle your problems then your problems are pretty acute. and it is true in governing as well. we have a lot of questions that are essentially political or policy disputes and we're going to the courts and it's not just over big things. it's over little things.

and it's republicans litigating everything. next week we have obamacare back up before the supreme court. a lot of americans would say, you know what, i feel like that's been resolved. why can't you work on it? if there are problems legislate to fix them. that's the case with immigration as well. i will be the first to say less lawyers, more legislators would be a good thing. >> wow. >> whoa. >> yeah exactly. >> how about they just pass a bill? then all of this would be moot. all right. up next when winning is losing. why boston should hope it does not win its bid to host the olympics. some residents actually agree. like, literally ran into him. [rambling]. this story had 30 minutes left... until kim realized that stouffer's mac and cheese is made with real cheddar aged to perfection for 6 long months. when you start with the best cheddar, you get the best mac and cheese. so, what about jessica? what about her? stouffer's. made for you to love. nestle. good food. good life.

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right now, boston now, boston the city of champions is fighting to win the right to host the 2024 summer olympics. it's hard to think of poor snowy boston even thinking about summer. our next guest says boston will win if his bid loses. big cities seem to look at the olympics and the world cup like the sexiest imaginable girlfriend. like the civic version of adriana lima. dating a supermodel is not all it's cracked up to be. trust me. . stop laughing! and hosting the olympics or world cup is often a bad idea for a city. the revenue that stayed in brazil because of the last world cup just about $2.5 billion. that's a fraction of the percent of the nation's gdp and brazil's world cup budget was 15 to $20 billion. now the country is littered with large stadiums that will never

be used again. for just $4 you can now tour the ghost-filled stadium built in capetown south africa for the 2010 world cup. boston, this could be your future. billions spent on stadiums that are never again used and you see no appreciable increase in tourism. sound good? to help talk bean town out of it we have a man some folks in boston would call wicked smart. andrew, economic professor and author of circus maximus. the economic gamble by hosting the olympics and world cup. please explain to boston why they will be better off without the olympics. >> you just did. you stole my punch line i think. according to the bid documents that boston submitted to the united states olympic committee. they're planning or hoping to spend $3.4 billion building venues. $4.7 billion for the operation of the games. and $5.1 billion on infrastructure.

the head of the state finance transportation committee, bill strauss, says it's going to cost $13 billion in infrastructure. the $3.4 billion on venues and the $4.7 on operating, those are pipe dreams. every single olympic games that we have records of has had massive cost overruns. the average cost overrun has been 3.5 times. so boston is looking at a final bill that is north of $20 billion. why? what's it all for. as you suggested, there is no evidence that tourism increases in the short or long run. we don't have solid evidence for increases in trade or foreign investment. so what's it for? clearly, there will be some interest in boston that benefit from it. construction companies will make a mint off it. and other beneficiaries. but that's quite different than saying that this city will benefit or that the state will

benefit. are cities wakes up to the idea that these are not good ideas. are some saying maybe we shouldn't bid for these things? >> interestingly since 1997 until this year there has been a declining number of cities who have expressed an interest in bidding. and for the 2012 winter olympics, there were five or six candidates to host those games. all of the european candidates withdrew. three had referendums and the people voesed against it. because it requires the host government to financially backstop. to guarantee all the projects that they project. so today the only two cities left in the bidding to host the 2022 world cup are beijing, china. and beijing will have the game two hours north to the mountains where they have a drought and no

snow anyway. so you have two authoritarian governments that don't have to worry quite as much about what the people feel, quite as much about the mix-up of priorities between building olympic venues or taking care of education and social and medical needs. so those are the two countries left for 2022. so thomas bock saw this train wreck comingment as soon as he was nominated president back in september of 2013, he started globe trotting trying to convince cities to bid. he introduced the program called the 2020 agenda which has some reform efforts, and will save the host country, maybe 400 or $500,000. but we're talking about bidding costs here that go into the billions of dollars. so it's a very very small amount. in any amount bach has succeededed in drumming up the interests again. we'll see what happens. >> speaking from personal experience. i moved to salt lake city a year after the the olympics.

u moved to beijing a year after the olympics there. the cities never looked more beautiful. the airports were new and improved. the things that tourists could do. i saw a lot of benefits from the olympics being in these cities. talk to us about the good things that can be a part of the cities and which cities have benefitted the most? >> well, apparently the one good thing we can identify is you moved to the cities that host the olympics. there's really not much. of course it's true that if you're spending $5 billion or $20 billion on the infrastructure, that there will be some infrastructure projects that are salutary for the countries' development and meets their needs. the question isn't if there will be some incremental improvement. do you spend $20 billion on infrastructure to get 3 or 4 or $5 billion of infrastructure that's valuable. want you know. it's misspent on stadiums and venues that you don't need.

it's costing millions to maintain. it's spent on parking lots to accommodate the venues and special roadways that go from the airport to those venues that have little to do with the development needs in the country. >> so here's to hoping for once boston loses. andrew, thank you very much for that. we're back with a final word right after this. of supercomputing time 3 million lines of code, 40,000 sets of eyes, or a million sleepless nights. whether it's building the world's most advanced satellite, the space station, or the next leap in unmanned systems. at boeing, one thing never changes. our passion to make it real. ♪ ♪ sunday dinners at my house... it's a full day for me, and i love it. but when i started having back pain my sister had to come help. i don't like asking for help. i took tylenol but i had to take six pills to get through the day.

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okay, that does it for this cycle. have a really great day. "now" with alex wagner starts now. the the man behind the isis mask has been identified but the group's terror continues. it's thursday february 26th. and this is now. >> the man known as jihadi john,

the face of isis. >> we are just hearing from a u.s. intelligence official. >> seen carrying out brutal beheading in isis videos has been identified. former london resident mohammed emwazi. >> born in kuwait. liveded in west london. >> graduated with a computer engineering degree. >> from a well to-do family. >> there's a spectrum of people who join the groups. you don't have to be down and out. >> something in the system isn't working. >> authorities are aware of the militants, yet they keep slipping through the cracks. >> i don't know of a time more beset by challenges and crises. i worry a lot about the safety and security of this country. >> jihadi john. the masked man with a british