painting while drinking classes has become hot. but how do you construct a sustainable business model based on a trend, coming up next on "your business."

hi everyone. i'm j.j. ramberg. welcome to "your business." getting your customers to embrace your brand is hard. but when you do it right it is sort of magic. that's when you get customer loyalty and a business that is more than just a passing fad. we visited one company which combined panty a few glasses of wine and a smart business plan that's making it all work. >> i think it's still here because it hit a nerve. >> people have said it's a fad. and i always say, well was golf a fad? >> they have a colorful future. they know it's more than just a trend. >> we guilty this concept thinking it would be a fun night

out for women. >> if it had been a fad it would have fallen off way before now. we started every session and never miss a beat. >> the founders of painted with a twist say they saw demand right from the start. >> people are waiting, open open, open at the front door. we noticed people were coming from the city. they were driving across two bridges. >> after eight years in business, they know why their customers keep coming back for more. >> a fun night out where we paint and drink a little wine. >> we have champagne in the back if you want need a little liquid courage. >> you walk out with a bottle of wine. you completed painting and everybody else cleans up. yeah. it works. >> the pair owns five locations. and there are now about 200 franchises. from the beginning, the focus

has always been on the customer. >> we want them to know they're the most important person. every time they look at the painting or think back to the night, i want to make sure they haved most positive experience. >> of course drinking wine is part of the fun too. >> it took the fear out of it for people like me who are intimidated by art. >> they wanted a place for customers to unwind and be social. >> they're forgetting about the day to day life. they're not thinking about the bills, and the stress and the life that is out there. they can escape here. >> the staff learns as much about them as they can. >> mrs. jones knows that mrs. jones is important. we build it in every part of our system. so from our back panel system when mrs. jones calls, there's notes there. she likes to sit in the front, and be on the right-hand side. she likes to bring her mom. >> renee and cathy took customer service a step further. they give people reasons to come

back. >> making sure there's ava right of music, variety of artists, of experience. >> ava right of times is important too. evening classes don't work for everyone. >> the original model was a girls night out. in looking at the numbers we saw we were making 75% of our money in 25% of our time. >> they added classes at times to fill studios that were otherwise empty. >> that's when it morphed into more. it turned into coffee and campus in the morning. >> corporate team building and parties are part of it too. >> 5,000 pieces of copyrighted art. that's grown daily. we have to make sure there's new product that people are excited about. >> it helps with employee engagement and keeps juices flowing. >> you have to be happy in order to give the experience that you need. you have to let them create.

most of our art is being created at the can franchise level. >> there are certain ones that are customer favorites. >> we can see what's the top 10 in the country. the artists in the studio when they are creating new art, can see our customers really love red. or our customers love a local flavor. so we can look at the a analytics of the artwork and what the customers like. >> the business is also designed with flexibility in mind. >> you can see how many people have signed up for that event. if someone doesn't seem like they're really excited about the egret saturday night, it can get excited and then it's a popular painting. >> since they make dozens of visits they're always talk about new concepts. >> we always test everything in those studios. so that way we know what's going to work and what's not going to

work. >> working with larger canvasses was one idea that is a winner. but not every idea is successful. having winners and losers is part of the innovation products. >> we do focus groups. who is our customer and what do they want? franchise partners are boots on the ground. they know what's going on in their community. >> the employees get evaluated regularly too because they are on the front lines of the company's growth. so customers get the chance to rate instructors. >> we do surveys with our customers pretty often to find out what they are feeling about a certain person. when they come into the system we train. and we will do training after they come in if we feel they need it. >> cathy isn't looking back. and renee says she's more focused than ever. she's not backing down because this business is not just a trend. it's here to stay. >> we gave people what they were looking for.

with competition it really keeps us on our toes. and really it just makes sure you're on your "a" game. you give the best experience out there. >> to get new customers and particularly repeat customers, you need to excite them. they have to leave your business wanting more. that needs to be felt all across your business, not just marketing but your tech team needs to feel this. a strategy group helps customers with customer experience and customer satisfaction with b to b and b to c businesses. so good to see you. that you know for stopping by. i like how you excite your

customers and your employees. i love your first point, which is customers are not always right. don't try to excite everyone. try to excite the right people? >> absolutely. most businesses are following let's grab as many as possible. some customers can be toxic to your business. you can overservice them and underservice your loyal customers. be conscious of who are good customers, who you want to focus on. send the others to your competition. that is what i call a win-win. >> focus on profit not market share. same thing really right? >> small businesses focus on growth. sometimes they pursue growth at all costs. we call the best sales maker

selling ice to eskimos. the cost will be greater than the margins. figure out what is your sweet spot, the customer who appreciates your value, and delight them. they will become advocates. like you can't belive what this company just did for me. >> it is hard for companies. >> focus on emotions not on rational. let me give you a great example. this is a true story. i personally witnessed it during our work. a customer calls a flower shop early in the morning very stressed and he wants to ship a dozen roses to a certain address. rationally speaking the employee had all the details. he said i'm a busy executive. i worked late last night. a forget my anniversary i slept on the couch, my back is hurting. she temperatures to him and said, sir, with your permission

i would like to put a small note to your wife that it was our fault and shipped the flowers to the wrong address. and i'm going to throw in a small box of chocolates. and i couldn't believe that. he said are you going to do this for me? there was no negotiation on price. two days later she said how is your back? everything is great. do you mind giving me all the addresses and phone numbers of your friends and family and their anniversaries. i'll call you before two days and i will decide what to do so this will never happen again. she took a $29.95 converted it to a $5,000 relationship by paying attention to the emotions. we are so focused on processing that we forget. the same thing we need to do as small business owners step back and say what's the emotional context context. how are they going to use the

product? how will they celebrate? who is involved. try to connect and create a story, a story they can then go and share with others. you're going to invest in sales or upgrading your product to a story. that's just through empowering sharing values. people are craving for purpose. people are craving for passion. where you serve yourself it is going to the ones who supplies to you. >> i love that. thank you for sharing that story with us. >> thank you very much for having me. there is no better way to welcome a new employee than by setting them one success on a good way into the industry. here are five books to have on a new-hire's book.

zero to one. two, rework by jason fried and david heinmeierhannson. three, the hard thing about hard things. this book provides good background on building and running a small business. four, the art of the start is a step by step playbook how to handle many of the things start-up faces like branding and pricing. five, icarus deception. seeing your work as art and yourself as the artist to inspire your newest hire to think of more than just the bottom line. msnbc joined new york's 92nd street on a special project called "7 days of genius." the network will devote this

week to looking closely at geniuses who changed the world. today we're highlighting five innovators great thinkers whose business ideas have mid a big difference in the way we live. richard branson's genius comes from his love of a challenge. early on he latched on to the attention-grabbing brand virgin and launched virgin records, going after the big established record stores. then the record labels which had big hits. his love of aviation led to virgin atlantic airlines. and these days he's taking on another challenge, leading the way in developing commercial space travel. >> if you are thrown in the deep end, if you are thrown into a swimming pool you have your parents watching you, you end up

swimming. >> jeff is is the genius pioneer of e-commerce. he launched amazon.com in 1995 to sell books on the internet. explosive growth led to expansion of other products making it a template for other online retailers. >> i want lots of happy customers. >> we're in this for the long term. and we're going to take great care of our customers. >> he is busy turning amazon into a digital media hour house. >> she cut the legs of a pair of panty hose leaving the top part and called them spanx. she self-funded the company with $5,000 and did focus groups with friends and family. her keen sense of marketing led to incredible success. >> i took a really different

approach. the whole industry had beige and gray and white packaging. the same half naked woman on every package. i went bright red and put three animated cartoon women. and i think women just really responded to it. >> she still owns 100% of the company, becoming the youngest female billionaire in the world. >> when travis and garrett black couldn't get a cab in san francisco they decided the taxi industry needed disrupting. the result was uber. an app-based network that allowed users to find a taxi or town car. it became a touch stone in the economy. and andre young, better known as dre is the rapper record producer and created beats by dr. dre. they became wildly popular. in 2014 the company was bought by apple for $3 billion.

>> there are of course many, many more entrepreneurial businesses. gene marks is the head of the marks group, providing technology and consulting services to small and medium businesses. and julie hannah entrepreneur and investor a board director. so good to see both of you guys. >> it's interesting you use the word genius. to be a genius, it's more than coming up with a good product, right? we can be smart and good business people. but you look at someone like jeff bezos. i would say he is a genius. what separates the two? >> people have creative genius. we all have different definitions what they are. i deal with small business owners. they are really one in a million kind of guys.

>> right. >> the genius i see in people that run companies and grow them are the ones that know how to buy something for a dollar and sell it for five. although it doesn't sound like a genius it is a fundamental thing that business people need to know to be able to process. people say, oh he's smart. he knew what to do. he was born that way. some people are not capable of being successful entrepreneurs because they don't have the dna to do it. one of the basics of the dna is knowing how to run a profitable business and grow it. >> julie, you are an investor. great companies you have been in, lift and lending club. when you're talking to entrepreneurs who are thinking about backing, how do you determine, okay i think there's a little bit of genius here someone who is not just going to build a good company but they're going to build a great company. >> i'd say it comes down to one

thing, which is aspiration. so what defines the difference between having a big idea and a gigantic idea is the aspiration of the entrepreneur. are they thinking on a mass scale basis from the get-go. and that's really i think a defining factor. it's what makes an idea big versus small. it is this relentless perception and better way and a boldness around that. >> if you're julie, maybe you don't always want to invest in the genius but the great business person. when you find the person who is both, then aren't you lucky and isn't the world lucky? thanks, guys. i think this is a fun topic to talk about. we went through a big list of geniuses. there are so many more in all kinds of fields that we will be talking about on msnbc this week coming up a lot more help

to help your business grow as we go from freelance to full-time employees and building a customer base online. american express for travel and entertainment worldwide. just show them this - the american express card. don't leave home without it! and someday, i may even use it on the moon. it's a marvelous thing! oh! haha! so you can replace plane tickets, traveler's cheques, a lost card. really? that worked? american express' timeless safety and security are now available on apple pay. the next evolution of membership is here.

it's time to anxious some of your business questions. gene and jewel where are back now. the first is about taking staffing to a new level. >> as a small business owner, i'm focused on running a lean organization for budget reasons and also legal reasons.

when is the right time to hire full time employees. >> julie, i'm going to start with you. i think when you talk about budget reasons, part-time, freelance staff can be cheaper but it can also be more expensive as i found with my own personal experience because there is this great turnover and training. and you don't necessarily take it into consideration when you first make these decisions. >> that's exactly right. first of all i would commend her on being so resourceful and lean. i'm a believer in starving your way to success. we often talk about being resource constrained as an issue. but there is an up side as well. it drives things to first things first. you're absolutely right, there is a cost to outsource or part-time employees.

and it comes down uniquely differentiate your business. you want those to be committed employees. that's a core asset. we live in a corporation kind of world. >> i have 10 employees and a dozen subcontractors as well. you can rely less on subcontractors to get the work done. they have the ability to leave any time they want. they go work for competitors of yours. they're just a contractor. the other thing that terrifies me is exposure to the irs. people that you rely on more they're doing work for you. if you're not complying with the rules you could be subject to liability. >> i'm so glad you brought that up. it is important to understand

the difference between an employee and a contractor. you do not want to be in violation of that. >> that's correct. in the end it's like buying a tuxedo. you're looking at me nuts. like why do i have this guy on the show. >> if you're going to a lot of parties, you commit to having a tuxedo because it's going to be part of your life. >> cost per wear. >> it's still the same thing. >> great. let's move on to another question about getting customers. >> how do you go about building your customer base when you don't have a brook and mortar store but you don't want to inundate your customers with too many e-mails? >> you're in the heart of silicon valley. so i'll start with you. >> this sounds like it should go without saying is having a product that people love and that they love so much they want

to tell others about it. and then the next is really about building a trust and incredible relationship with your customers. e-mail isn't about selling customers. it's about establishing a relationship with them. it's about earning the right to communicate with them so they want to hear from you. and off times the starting point is how do we get you to buy our product, let us tell you how great our product is. but if you flip it and say how do we make this about you, what's the walking around problem, the opportunity where the customer's mind is. how do we add value to their lives. then we earn a right to talk about the product. and then they want to hear from us. >> absolutely right. you never want to put a sales pitch down a customer's throat. you want to educate them and provide information that will help them so when they're getting e-mails from you they're

look forward to e-mails because it's got good stuff in them. it is a service. one thing i recommend look where your business is coming from. most comes from referrals. i.t. technology information, firms. rather than going out to end user customers, a few years ago we built a list of core people that refer us work i.t. areas. it's 25 30r, 30 people. once a month i send some e-mail something to show that relationship. i can't put a gun to somebody's head and say buy from me now. all i can do is when a person is needing something, they think of my firm fitter. >> great. skwraoep gene and julie, thank you for this advice. really appreciate it. we answer questions every week on the show. if you have one and haven't been able to find the answer yet, we

will do it here. head over to openenforum.com/your business. hit the button ask the show. or yourbusiness @msnbc.com. we know that it is the entrepreneurs just like you who have the inside scope that help you grow your small business. here are the ones our viewers tell us they use regularly. >> we use hyperlapse created by instagram. it takes video and shrinks it to 15 seconds. it is good for vine and intra gram videos, which is a marketing tool. >> one app i like is schedulegram. you don't have to be on every

second of the day. you post. when people respond then you can respond to them. it's 13 a month for one account or 40 for multiple accounts. >> one of the dailies i read pretty much every damon through friday, they don't publish on the weekend is a newsletter called the skimm. taking the headlines of the most important news stories of the day and making them fun and witty so you really feel like a real person when you're reading them. >> 99 designs is an excellent website. it allows you to reach out internationally to designers for branding contest. basically give a rate and you have designers internationally provide you with content and you choose one. >> i love the flipboard app. i can couple my articles from all over the internet whether it's matchable in social media

or investapedia. it allows me to have a number of articles based on my interest on one platform. >> one app i love is the adp payroll app. it helps me facilitate my payroll easier quicker, time saver, life saver. >> one site that i love to use is rent the runway. it allows you to shop high-end designer looks, gowns, day dresses, and rent them for just a period of time. it allows me to save a lot of money on clothing when i have to attend nighttime events premiers galas. >> to learn more about today's show, head over to openforum.com/yourbusiness. once you get there you'll find all of today's segments and web exclusive content with a whole lot more information to help you grow your business. you can follow us on twitter.

@msnbc yourbiz. and facebook and intra gram as well. >> next week a phoenix-based web photographer who knows how to make sure it is a good representation of her brand. she hires people who are as passionate about her company as she is. until then i'm j.j. ramberg. and remember, we make your business our business. american express for travel and entertainment worldwide. just show them this - the american express card. don't leave home without it! and someday, i may even use it on the moon. it's a marvelous thing! oh! haha! so you can replace plane tickets, traveler's cheques, a lost card. really? that worked?

american express' timeless safety and security are now available on apple pay. the next evolution of membership is here. they thought they had a plan. they thought they knew what was going to happen. but then it all fell apart in the most public way possible. last week at exactly this time you might remember we were in a countdown to the shutdown of the department of homeland security. because republicans thought they had a plan but their plan did not work. republicans in congress thought they would get president obama over a barrel. they would force him to change his immigration policies by threaten to go shut down the home land security department if he doesn't. president obama face these threats from congressional republicans before. he has adopted a consistent policy of not blinking when they do stuff like this.