mr. hardball. ♪ ♪ >> good evening, in washington. the big action politically tonight is still senate in new york where donald trump has dumped a bomb on the 2016 chances. what if this loud new york voice is able to trump and he's got the name for it, the lesser names in the clown car. what if he out spends out sells and out draws his middle welter and light weight opponents.

what if he comes out the champ and what then for the theory that this whole republican '16 scenario is the clown car and what if the driver of thet vehicle ends up beating them. >> and april ryan and american urban radio networks. and anyway, the 24 hours since trump announced he will fight anyone. >> you don't really take criticism all that well. you lash back. >> yeah i lash back. why wouldn't i lash back? >> you know when i watch a george well i watched them for years, they're just losers. >> the daily news put this picture "clown runs for president". >> the daily news will be out of business soon. they're all talk no action. if we have another politician

that includes hillary, we have another politician this country is going down. >> it may to some people bs but only 10 or 20%. and the republican party lights up when he said it's working clasand this guy is a real street guy. he can get something done and create jobs. >> heez rar street god but he fires people on tv. >> he at least hires them first. >> but he's a smart, savvy street guy. he's come back from the bring and that name trump is something people invest in and gucci is in one of his build gdsings. >> that's important to you personally. [ laughter] >> jeb bush is nark leptic at

times. and nothing exciting p. and scott walker give me a break and a little life. and rubio, he's the shooting star but no wouldy even know what he looks like a police line up. the ones they know are boring trump ain't. those are my thoughts what about yours? >> first let me dust off my guccis. and here's the problem -- >> have you read all those books, or is this just for show? >> i haven't looked at them since college, i have to admit. anyway, you know, the thing about this is is this is a great media story and he's incredibly quotable and he's dwoegoing to get some votes because on both sides of the aisle, they're angry and

want somebody to stir things up. and don't forget in 2012 donald trump led the pole frds as for a couple of weeks and probably not good for the republican party. >> remember gresham's law, bad money drives good money out of circulation. the ugly aspect of all politics which is anger and right out of the gate he targeted a candidate, ugly. and he just blasts away ethnically. >> i would build a great wall and nobody builds walls better than me and i build them very inexpensively. i will build a, great, great wall on our southern border and i will have mexico pay interestfor that wall, mark my words. >> so strangle them

economically -- >> and the wall will go up. and they'll start behaving. >> or you'll break them economically. >> we're like a dumping ground like a bunch of dumb group. >> we have drug deerlz coming across, rapests, killers, murderers. it's commonsense. are they going to send thus best and finest people? >> so you're sitting in the house of jeb bush and your wife spouse for life is mexican and you're listening to this garbage. why don't you respond to it? >> if you're jeb bush the more you respond, the more pressure you give to him. >> and the trouble with that is -- mike dukakis believed that. don't fight back. >> he's a big problem -- listen

if he gets on the debate stage -- >> he's going to aim directly at jeb bush's head. and again back to nixon. pat buchanan nixon. he'll tag bush. >> let me -- >> here's the really big, big problem for the republicans. republicans are trying to undue the brand they've had for the last lord knows how many elections. they don't like hispanics, gays immigrants or women and they're trying to undue that brand and working hard at it and all of a sudden this guy comes along and -- this is the republican brand whether it's pharaohfair or not. i don't see how anyone in the republican party can survive,

other than jeb bush what this guy is going to do with the party. and don't get in a wrestling match with the pig because the pig likes it. >> pigs are skunks. >> i think the pig stinks. so so here's where i am. i spoke to someone omarosa -- >> did she get fired? >> she got fired. >> of course. >> okay governor dean. she said one thing that gets donald trump in trouble is that he doesn't see color but he sees party affiliation and i have a little bit of a problem with that. meaning that it's not about race especially when it came to obama -- >> playing to the worst instincts. >> of the party, yes. but she knows this man and they communicate publicly.

i'm going to say on the woman's issue. last time i saw donald trump, he made a point, and ran right after susan rice the national security advisor and talked to her, smiles and valerie jared. so he wants to create a name and throw everything out there to just keep building up his brand. >> he's all over the place. and he's a money maker, that's what he is good at although sometimes he loses money and ultimately he's going to collapse on his own rhetoric. >> do you remember ross perot? >> he had a wonderful thing with jimmy fallen last night. and they're talking about donald trump -- >> and anyway i didn't think bush was much. and trump has made jeb bush

number one target. and i don't think he's going after the lower, he's going after the big guy. >> bush is totally in favor of common core. i don't see how he can possibly get the nomination. he's weak on immigration, and how the heck can you vote for this guy? you just can't do it. i watched jeb bush yesterday. he can't even put on a tie and jacket. he's running for president. >> that's what you call an opportunist. >> donald trump took you on in a speech today about common core and immigration. i want to ask you. >> i'm sorry. i shouldn't have done that. there are a lot of people running for president of the united states. last time i checked another guy showed up yesterday. i mean it's like i haven't czeched this morning but i'm

sure there's somebody else running. >> governor i think he'sez's going to be a big show and the problem with jeb bush who should be the frontn are er runner. would you play dukakis or slug him out? >> i would get somebody else to take him on because you debase yourself if you take it on. and bush goes on has a good show with jimmy fallon and nobody cares because they're looking that incredible spectacle. and the spectacle runs out and god help the republican partfy he gets into one of the top tier debates. >> and every time i get in a situation in traffic where somebody is mad at me or i'm mad

at me, i close my eyes and count to 10 and don't look in the rearview mirror, i'd rather go to work today than be in a street fight with this guy. i don't know if you can keep that up if you're with trump. he's going to blow his horn at you. >> if you're below the 10 line you're not going to get in the debates. >> and the only woman in this field, gets knocked off and ends up number 11 and mr. donald trump owns the show. >> and you know what he may own the show because he's dwoeing to be struategic. and he's going to be strategic and get a prep team. i think he's going to -- >> and here's perry being

pressed by fox's bill hammer on trump's great wall of mexico. >> and what do you think about that idea? get mexico to pay interestfor a wall? >> i'll suggest it makes for pretty good tv but americans don't want rhetoric they want action. >> is he right on that or not? >> i'll let him run on that. i'm going to run on actual experience of dealing with this. >> see how it works, he makes the other guys talk about his tough stuff. and let's watch. >> i think donald trump, who shouldn't be underestimated, by the way, i think he's hitting on issues that americans care about. they clearly believe the economy isn't growing quickly enough they're worried and afraid of what's going on in the world, not just isis but other issues

as well. they realize that china has turned into an adversary. >> you notice john how the republicans, your party always wants to talk buteabout a wall. it's a bidding war over this wall. and i've seen ugly wall said before. and it may be necessary but it's ugly as hell and not going to make us proud as a country and it's not going to work because if you or i were down there and the only place to get a job is on the other side of the wall that's where i'm going. and most guys like him in construction and other trades make lot of money off illegal labor, a lot of people do. grounds keeping, landscaping, tons of money made off of illegal labor.

>> and the fact of the matter is we need comprehensive immigration reform. i think he's speaking to the base in a way that -- a lot of archie bunker's. >> and doing so in a way that doesn't offend business. because they don't care about walls, as long as they get cheap labor. it's symbolic. they want cheap labor. coming up police in new york are expanding the search area for those convicted killers that broke out of prison and the big question now after day 12 is what do they do now. and authorities talking about, in other words, they got away. and hillary clinton facing stiff competition from her republicans in key swing states. and in new hampshire she's getting a scare, sort of from

bernie sanders. and why marco rubio is the stephen curry of the republican party. and let me finish with pope francis. turns out it wasn't the machine, it was our detergent. so we switched to tide turbo clean. now we get way cleaner clothes way faster he turbo clean. 6x the cleaning power in ½ the time how do you get to the top of your game? give it everything you've got and leave those sticky sunscreens behind. new neutrogena cooldry sport. powerful protection designed to feel good. micromesh technology lets sweat pass through and evaporate so skin stays comfortable, while clinically proven protection keeps going strong. don't get stuck with a sticky sunscreen. stay protected and comfortable

with every move. new cooldry sport. neutrogena. well, the fight against isis is based on training iraq troops and so far, that effort is slow going. and the united states is having a tough time finding credible and capable allies to fight in both iraq and syria. here's secretary carter. >> we simply haveabout received enough recruits. of the original forces we had originally envisioned training we've only received enough recruits to train 7,000. >> and the white house announced they're sending more otroops in the

♪ ♪ >> we're talking about two men that have been very illusive. they came up with a very creative and elaborate plan to escape from oneprison. >> we're going under the what i think is the logical belief they can be anywhere. >> they can be anywhere. welcome back to hardball. they can be anywhere. that was the stark conclusion from investigators hunting for the two convicted killers. they're into day 12. they escaped from a maximum security prison in upstate new york and authorities still have no solid leads. they shifted their search to other areas but wouldn't say where or why. and 1300 leads have flood in. and it's getting colder. but so far, it's as if the two

escapees have disappeared from the face of the earth. and pat brown is here with me a criminal profiler and author of the book "the profiler, my life hunting serial killers and psychopaths." and they were confident these killers were somewhere in the wooded area. >> they're expanding the mile and this was a very secure zone. many check points all along route 73 here and now they're going to look at trains ferries, highways anyway to get out of here really really fast. they have 1400 tips as you mentioned, but they still don't have that one solid lead they can hang their hat on chris. >> do they know if any trains passed through that area before

the authorities were notified of the escape. >> reporter: the question is did they get out before the full search began? and maybe there are photos on the ferry or highway or maybe from a week or 10 days ago that would give them some sense of where they're headed. >> and what about the intelictual background and i have that this was a highly sophisticated plan. it wasn't just charm some woman who worked in the taylor shop and get her to give you tools. there was something more to it. what do we know about the sophistication of their escape? we know their >> reporter: we know they're wylie, smart and some suggested there was a plan a, b, and maybe a c, someone else who

helped on the outside. and maybe there were people on the inside. so investigators said they're still talking to people on the inside. and they're looking at everything going down aervgevery single avenue. >> and what is your think about this as a pro? >> that they're smart. they're not survivalists. these guys are really not into survivalism. so chances are they're not going to think let's go and hide in the woods while they're looking for us for the next two weeks. and they're smart enough to go through all of this escape and do it so well my think is they got out of there quickly and my guess is they set something up. >> and the original clue was that she was supposed to be the get away driver and if she chickened out, they would be stuck and could only walk away

in desperation. >> first of all, why are we believing joyce mitchell? hopefully they're going to conduct a good interrogation. and she may well have set them off in the wrong direction on purpose. so, to say, she was absolutely going to pick them up? really? how do we know that. i think we need to take that with a grain of salt. >> what does viable high speed avenue say to you? if you're in the prison you know what trains go by and when you could jump aboard or not, things like that. whatever is going on. >> i'm assuming it's somebody on the outside to look at all the viable options. because if you only have so much time and they knew. these are not stupid guys. so they're going to find some way to make sure that they have a methodology to get outd and get out quickly and since they

haven't found them in the area i'm going to say, chances are, they did. >> these are criminals, killers cold blooded. nobody's been reported missing, nobody's said they sold them food or dinner or anything. there's been no human evidence of food outside, so that means they got someone to feed them or they were in cuhoots with them. >> reporter: were there any break ins? apparently not most res dntsz say if they haven't found them in this perimeter, they're gone. >> i love that name by the way. thank you so much. we'll have you back i think because they'll probably be gone next week. >> probably. and a story of charm and certainly curage and this is hardball, a place for politics.

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we're back to "hardball." he was a kid from south dakota who got to cover the end of the nixon nightmare and more importantly, the falloff the berlin wall. >> it's over cast as president nixon and family plan to leave for the last time. >> and he interviewed the great nelson men delandelamandela. >> have you been able to block the worse memories of those from your life? >> no it's difficult to do so. >> and he offer adreassuring voice when the nation was hit by 9/11. >> there's been a declaration of war by terrorists on the united states. >> and now a book about his personal battle.

and tom brokaw it's so great to have you on. and the book has so much charm and a lot of guts in it. and i have to go back to the berlin wall because i was there five or six days later and you were there. and i want to pay credit to you. it's showing up, being there and then you're there when the lightning strikes. can you describe it when you got the word that the bureaucrats had something very casual like we're letting people out. >> i had gone because as you remember, east germany in term oil and not much going on here and he said why don't you go to berlin. we had no idea that the wall was going to come down around us. and there was a announcement by a bureaucrat who had misunderstood what they had in mind.

and i realized how symbolically important it was. if the wall was down it was the final nail in the coffin of communist soviet union and it was great to be there, chris. >> and you were asked to viz at u.s. soldier whose leg was about to be amputated and you had to buck him up. what did you say? >> what happened is that i had been out hunting in south dakotau who lost a leg in vietnam and i went down to the orthopedic war and the doctor said i just remove aduvoved a young man's leg but he insisted on saying something to you and won't talk to me until you go in there. and i grabbed his hand began to

squeeze it and said i was just with a friend of mine who lost a leg in hunting. and i couldn't keep up with him. there is life after losing your leg and i want to thank you for your sacrifice and service. he gave me a very weak smile and closed my hand back and i stumbled out and the doctor said i'd like you to go room to room because that's the kind of story you want to tell and i said bob, you got me through this really tough day and he said you talked about my hunting? and i said yeah he said you didn't tell them i couldn't hit anything, did you? >> in your book you took president obama and democrats to task. and the original promise that everyone can keep their doctor but you called out the republicans to not pull out

anything of their own. and now we have this whole question this summer with the supreme court ruling and how do you feel of being a person involved in this system a cancer victim. and you've been through it and seen people with no money, no connections, just regular every day people as hillary calls them. what have you learned phylisophically. >> it's a very complex plan and people were tied into the medical establishment they have in this country. they like their doctor and the health plans that weren't perfect wutbut they were theres. and then this document came out and was a political football. it's working well where it's

working well and others there's a lot of confusion. and republicans say to me you know a big, big part of the burden is on the republican party because they haven't come up with everything. it will only stay there or get larger because of the cost of producing all these new medical miracles that we are producing in pharmaceutical laboratories and in the operating room chris. so there is no more important part interest the country. it's a big idea that needs to be engaged. and the only big idea is to go small and i think that's wrong. >> well people like you tom brokaw and i want to ask you a personal question the late governor of pennsylvania once told his son, in the end celebrity disappears and what you're left with is your family your god and your health insurance. youv've been there, what have you

learned because you've been there? >> your family counts most of all. i couldn't have gone through this without my wife, daughters and my grand children. they bucked me up at the right time. there was no self pity going on in the house hold. she was the -- not nurse ratchet but she's stand in front of me and say, no you're not going to go there and the doctor would give me the latest notes she compiled on the disease. and the daughter would keep me up to date and my youngest daughter gave us our first boy. and she'd say, dad, i know it seemed like a terrible year but we had archer and that gave me a real lift as well. so, you start with that and at the end of your life however famous or successful you are, if you don't have that core

nothing else counts. >> as they use tootd say, a good little book it really is. "a lucky life interrupted" and it's almost like beach reading. it's an upbeat book a lot of charm and a lot of great little stories of things not related to being sick. thank you for being on. >> and i've been very gratified from hearing from cancer families who said we needed to hear that story and people who don't have cancer, also need to hear about it. it really accomplished what i set out to do which is share my experience with everyone else. >> it's a good affordable book. i checked the price. thank you, tom brokaw. and how worried should hillary clinton? and is mark rubio the steph

curry of republican party? i think he is.

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i'm angie goff with breaking news. we're covering a shooting at a church in charleston, south carolina fp carolina. so far, 9 fatalities. the murderer is still at large. benji, can you bring us up to date? >> reporter: that's right, the latest news. we do go that nine have been killed. but they aren't releasing any of it victims. but one has been identified as clemente pinckney. and histhe description of the suspect is sandy blond hair.

and antiviolence groups have been holding regular prayer sessions and providing support for anyone who wants to be there. but in the mean time the focus is on finding the suspect and make sure no further violence can occur. >> and we know they've brought in several agencies to help out with that search. and once again, nine people have been killed in this church shooting in south carolina. the gun plnman is still at large. now back to "hardball".." >> well i may not be the youngest candidate in this race but i will be the youngest woman president in the history of the united states. [ applause ] >> welcome back to "hardball."

well hillary clint could make history if she makes to the white house but she has to make it past the republican opponents. and poles show several potential gop rivals could give her a run for her money. and hillary leads marco rubio by four and jeb bush by 3. and she ties rand paul in pennsylvania. and hillary trails boith rand paul and a marco rubio by a pointed. and for more on what these swing states mean for hillary clinton. lauren victoria burke is managing editor of politic 365. david, you first. why are these so damn close? no matter who the candidates

are? >> because i think any republican running against hillary clinton starts at 45%. and the thing interesting about the pennsylvania number chris christie is next door and he does the worse, so that indicates to me rand paul and marco rubio, are more like generic republicans running in a lot of these poles. they haven't been in a lot of a aads. and you spend a year with attack ads against them, they may not look as good. >> and by the way, pennsylvania are the closest to the george washington bridge. they've seen the cones. >> and they know chris christie really well. >> what do you think about no matter how much she may be the

most important woman in history, seriously, that she still has to face the 50/50 battle. >> honestly 509 days before election day. i don't know that these numbers really mean anything other than name recognition. i know you're right, but it is -- >> it does matter. >> but when we look at the poles, let's face it christie was the big flavor of the month before and now -- >> i happen to have an answer here. i think most people have made up their mind about hillary clinton and i think it's more about them than about her. they've just made an attitude about her, age gender ideology. >> and when you get on the debate stage, they're going to make a decision about those guys. especially when you see rand

paul versus anyone and trump is going to make it entertaining and crazy. >> and lauren made the point that these poles don't mean anything. >> and the landscape is we basically have a country divided pretty much right down the middle. it's almost like a brand name for the democrats and brand name interest the republicans and everybody is stuck. and in hillary's case you're right. that most people have decided. and they have to focus on young melennials. not even the older ones the younger ones who don't know and haven't made up their mind. >> they haven't live would the clintons like we have. >> and the appeal making hits wrae a history with a woman as

president. >> we have seen women went for romney pretty well. i do think there is a history factor there. she gets a large -- bigger block of women than romney obviously she's going to do very well. and obviously, pennsylvania went democratic the last six races. and i think if you have rubio and casic in the coal -- >> this is going to be hand to hand combat. using all the big data to pluck individual voters because it's so close and it's not just state by state -- >> and that explains why hillary clinton and i respect -- excuse me this is something you care about -- has been so careful to not indorse or trash the trade deal. because she doesn't want to

alienate labor and she needs the manufacture workers and labor. but yet she's obviously not happy with opposing a trade bill which she was for. >> she can't afford to lose any big block of voter at this point in time. i think by the time the election comes round, the trade deal will be pretty far in the past and there will be four or five things between then that will effect how people vote. and we haven't seen them really perform on the national stage. there's a lot more potential for them to go south than there is for hillary clinton. >> so you agree. so something being kept secret like mental history, and it's difficult to imagine that with

hillary. >> and there's still investigations ongoing. for rubio. and he's had his wife on the payroll. and i'm not even talking about scandals or skeletons. >> i like the way you throw word scandals out. >> i would agree with david a little bit. and i think you're right about hillary clinton. i think a couple of the republicans, you have to say have some upicide potential if they can make the sale and i think marco rubio is the one that the hillary crowd is most concerned with. >> he's the shooting star. anyway, the round table is staying with us and up next why i'm calling marco rubio the steph curry of the republican field. i've never seen shooting like that. when a moment spontaneously turns romantic why pause to take a pill?

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. we're back with our round table. howard lauren and david. if you've watched the nba finals you've witnessed something we've never seen before, the incredible outside shooting of steph curry. i have never seen anything like it i don't know who has. and rubio is the steph curry of the republican field. nobody expected him to do as well as he has. and washington post senator marco rubio of florida as a

candidate and make him the "it" candidate. and a pundt recently ranked rubio is the most likely candidate to win the nomination saying that democrats fear his prospects. and he fairs better than any republicans against hillary clinton and that's why he's the steph curry of the republican field. and looks like he has the best shot at taking on hillary. and you know this better than i do why are they tremulous about this guy? is it age? >> because of the potential and contrast he presents and because of the story he has. if you feed it all into a computer, you come out with a young, care zharismaticcharismatic, from florida and you have the perfect contrast on paper to hillary.

and he's like steph, when he came out of davidson college, everybody said he can shoot but is he tough enough for the league. you look pretty taking the 3 pointer but you have to be able to take it fldunder the board. >> so you say it's all in the paint. >> i say this is preseason, howard and preseason, we have president fred thompson now. and until i see marco rubio in a debate playing at least in the playoff, let alone a championship series i think this is all -- >> who is the guy with the towel over his shoulder? harris? smart guy. >> i think rubio is the best speaker in the field and when you have hillary, not really passionate and kind of flat he

stands out. and the problem is he doesn't have much of a record in the senate. he blundered on the immigration thing and they need the hispanic vote. >> i know -- >> it's going to -- >> did they know they need some hispanic vote? ab >> absolutely. they've got to know that. and for them it's a huge win if they get a few more percentage points. >> and what happens when a guy like that walks on the stage and starts speaking perfect spanish? >> well jeb bush can do that do. and he's terrible on immigration so far and that's going to matter to the voters in the swing states like florida. >> greatest speaker out there. and lauren and what's your

middle name? >> michael. >> and when we come back this battle brewing between conserve ♪ (lightning strike) ♪ (kiss) ♪ lead your heroes in the hit mobile game download heroes charge now!

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rarely the commandment of reference when these topics stand high on the u.s. agenda. we go to war and even the most dubious hearing no one on the right about the immorality of the decisions. and religion is as reference point. and the coming call from pope francis to act on the man made causes. and the moral question posed by the church stand in the way of individual freedom as perceived by the american supreme court. and the argue tat in a free society, government has its limits. what is inconsistent is to argue the need to protect life in the case of human reproductive systems and if it's okay to save the life of the fertilized egg, how much more is it to sustain

the living of this planet and here pope francis is rightly consistent. and his opponents are daminably not. and >> aim angie goff with breaking news. a gunman opened fire at emmanuel ame church in downtown charleston south carolina last night around 9:00 p.m. local time. so far 9 confirmed dead. police are searching for the gunman considered extremely dangerous. benji sarlin is in charleston with the latest. what do we know? >> right now, the focus is entirely on the certainly for the alleged gunman. police say they have a suspect. they are searching for him who is 21 years old, sandy blonde hair is, slight build and they're asking people to give any help they can in locating this person. one thing we did notice recently is helicopters have started