you see, he has on a distinctive sweatshirt that has markings. i point out the vehicle you see as a distinctive front license plate. >> there are operators to take any information. regardless of how small people that the information they might have may be we want them to call us. we have investigative teams that are prepared to go out and follow every lead that is sent into this hotline number. and that's what we really need at this point. we need information. we've got a good starting point here. we've got a good suspect.

and what we need now is to get the assistance of the community. if they see his car, if they see this individual they do not want them to approach this person. we want them to call 911 and allow us and our partners to address this situation. [ inaudible question ] >> we have no reason to believe he's not in the charleston area. he could be outside and we're disseminating in information broadly across all of our law enforcement partners not only on the charleston region but also on the east coast. >> any motive? >> well as i said earlier, we believe there is a hate crime. that's how we're investigating it. [ inaudible question ] that's part of the investigation and we'll talk about it. >> where is your search happening right now? can you tell us? >> well we have investigators in various locations. we'll talk more about that at

7:00. >> can you tell how he escaped? >> we'll talk more about that at 7:00. >> anything about the suspect or the suspect vehicle? okay. >> we have broadway of communicates to law enforcement agencies throughout the united states. that communication process is in place. same information that you have has been broadcast to law enforcement at the local state, and federal level all across the united states. >> you're talking specifically about the suspect, at 6:00 and the rush hour commuters, what do people need to know? >> well obviously, at this point we want everybody to be vigilant. we want them to see -- if they see anything that is suspicious we want them to call us. right now we have teams of investigators. we have uniform officers we have fbi agents, sled agents all

over the city and law enforcement partners. we'll be looking for this individual and for this car just like everyone else. this is an all hands on deck effort with the community as well as law enforcement and with that effort we'll find this person quickly. what i'm telling you when people go out, they should be vigilant. they should be aware of their surroundings. if they see anything suspicious call us. >> what is the make and model? >> i'm not going give a make and model because at this point we're not 100% sure and that would be inappropriate. we want people to look at this vehicle and if they see one that matches that description to call law enforcement. thank you very much. we'll be back at 7:00. >> so charleston north carolina, is in mourning this morning. in about an hour the it is ji

going to hold a news conference announceing a reward and more information on the shooter who is still at large. a prayer vigil set for noon today. people were taking part in a prayer service last night but around 9:00 police were called to the mother emanuel ame church in the heart of downtown. what they found inside was devastating. eight people dead two more rushed to the hospital one of them has also died. sources confirm to nbc news that among the dead is the pastor state senator clemente pinkney. most are in town to cover hillary clinton in orangeburg yesterday and a planned visit by jeb bush in charleston today has now been canceled. >> you noiknow martin luther

king's mother was shot in a church while playing the organ. i remember my grand mom saying that is the purest form of hate on this rnlg. i remember that. i must have been 5, 6 years old. it ended up actually he was a disturbed young black man that came back from the war. but this is -- this appears to be the purest form of hate. all across the southeast, people gather in church onz a wednesday night whether it's wednesday night supper or bible study here. and it's just a fabric of these people's lives. >> this is as ugly as you can get. when people can't trust the refuge of a church to have this kind of violence. apparent litly the police chief saying it's a hate crime. we don't know if he's disturbed,

whether he's alone or not. but the chilling fact that this would happen in a church nine people is just shocking. when i reached out and started getting calls, we have a chapter there and elder johnson who heads our chapter was at the scene. he had to tell me over and over for me to even believe it. and then reverend pinckney just two months ago i was in charleston leading a prayer vigil on the shooting of a walter scott. and he reminded me he was there with us, led the prayer. he's a man that stood against these kinds of things and now becomes victim of it. it is something that is almost inconceivable. >> reverend pinckney was a political leader as well. >> state senator. elected to the state house at the age of 23. so he's been in public service

for all of his adult life. the first order of business is to find this guy. we don't know what else he may have planned. he's still at large right now. let's go to charleston. we find msnbc reporter benji sarlin. he has been on the scene of that shooting all night. benji, take us through your night last night, what you saw, what you can report this morning. >> as you mentioned, there were quite a few political reporters in town many of whom the first to the scene to cover hillary clinton or to cover jeb bush today. that appearance by jeb bush has been since canceled. i arrived shortly after the shooting. at that point, there were only a handful of people. people were he is extorting some people that seemed to be in just shock away from the scene and into a hotel. after a while, we were pushed back as you mentioned early, there was a bomb scare. there was an immediate threat. later we were given an all clear. people were still pushed back a couple blocks. what happened there was truly incredible.

there railroad large gatherings of people holding prayer circles, almost hourly. very intense emotional prayer session that's people just speaking directly to god, asking for advice expressing anger, frustration, also their hope for the community. and at one point it was very moving, a pastor said god if, we're not safe in our churches where are we safe? tell us where to go. it is stunning to have a place like this that is such an important house of worship just taken away from them like that. and it's especially disturbing because as many people reminded me as i talked to them there is a long history of terrible racist violence against black churches throughout the south and throughout america. this is something everyone is familiar with. several people liken it to the birmingham bombing of 1963 that killed four young girls. people have long memories and this is just unfortunately to see a church wrapped in violence is disturbing for everyone. >> benjy, i'm sure will is

concern for other churches in the area. what level of security you are seeing around the city and other areas of worship, particularly those for african-americans in particular? >> now there are several churches are oigt here nearby. we haven't seen any particular up level rather than just general police presence. the police presence has been substantial. but it's not stifling. it's no not overwhelming. people are trying to restore some sense of normalcy. they opened more of the streets. we're now significantly closer to the church than we were allowed to be earlier. but there is no doubt this is still a manhunt going on. at various points there are helicopters circling over with flood lights. police were using dogs to such. there is no doubt everyone's going to be uneasy until they know that gunman is caught and that the threat has passed. >> all right benjy sarlin again, the police are looking for a young white male between

20 to 25. >> sandy blond hair. >> and a four door black sedan vehicle they believe he left in. >> obviously, mika calculated move. horrific calculated move where actually reports coming out that he let one woman leave so she could tell the world what he was about to do. also reports coming out that a young 5-year-old girl actually survived by pretending to be dead, lying on the floor motionless. >> another survivor told family members the gunman initially sat down in the church for a while before standing up and opening fire. the he emanuel ame church is a sis horic site in charleston and the oldest ame church in the south and the oldest black congregation south of baltimore. it dates back to 1787 as free blacks and slaves worshipped

together. as a per igser helped organization a slave rebellion, the church was burned and the pastor fled to philadelphia. the church was rebuilt and services continued until black churches were outlawed in 1834. worship continued in secret for three decades until the church could formally reorganize after the civil war. according to king center it played host to dr. martin luther king when he visited charleston in the '6 o's0s. >> with you on the phone is a person that knew two victims of the church attack including the pastor. and it is always good to talk to you. but under these circumstances, obviously tragic. you were actually a block or two away from this shooting when it was happening at an event for hillary clinton. take us through the night. >> well you know i described it as being a day of so much

joy. you know being in the presence of former secretary clinton and just having that type of joy and hope brought to the state of south carolina. and then as i was leaving the city, you know twitter and my phone began to blow up. and that day of joy turned so much darkness in such a quick amount of time. so, you know in south carolina and throughout the south as you all know one of the things that we always go to in times are tough are prayer. and so there hasn't been a lot of sleep tonight. but we're going to pray extremely hard and many of us will be descending back upon charleston this morning. >> talk about your friends that you lost in the shooting. >> well you know i started in the south carolina house of representatives from 2006 to 2014. and senator pinckney was always

there. we actually started in the same delegation. our districts overlapped for a period of time. i think i chuckle that i think about his voice and how booming it was. he was somebody who didn't always speak but when he did, people listened. and even more importantly, he was a man of god. so you know went out serving his people. he went out serving his lord. and at the end of the day may he rest in peace. >> bakari sellers, thank you very much. i know there's a church a prayer vigil today at noon. we'll be following that as well. and also in just about 45 minutes, there will be another news conference on the part of the city of charleston. they're going to be announcing a reward for the suspect who is still at large and more information so people can perhaps help find him. >> reverend i want to ask you, mika touched on the significance of this particular church mother emanuel in the south

historically. this is a very important place. >> very important. as mika said this was formed in the late 1700s. it was a church that was investigated for having housed the planting of a slave rebellion in the early 19th century. it was a place civil rights people went to all the way through dr. king. i remember i think the first time i met pinckney when running for president, we would always go to this church and as i was listening to representative sellers, i shared what he did yesterday. yesterday morning was such a glorious morning to me. i was in washington. the president in stalling loretta lynch, the first black woman attorney general and i go to bed last night and this happens. all in one day. it shows how far we've come and it shows how far we have not come. and i think that we have got to deal with these issues head on.

avoiding them does not make them go away. >> i'll tell you also, willie, just bombarding of bad news. it's hard -- it's hard to put in perspective. you know we do this every day. but, you know you wake up every morning. this morning i woke up with this horrible tragedy on my phone breaking news. it seems every morning -- it can be almost overwhelming. and that's part of the information age that there are so positive things but it seems -- i know for a lot of people, coming up in an elevator with a with someone saying god, it seems like a tragedy every day. >> we all have the same experience. i went to bed with word of a shooting in charleston and you wake up with nine dead. oh my gosh. fwz this town too. they have the walter scott shooting not long ago in charleston.

this city has been through an awful lot. but nothing as bad as this. this is completely unimaginable. let's go to washington. former fbi profiler and hostage negotiator clint van zandt. we just heard law enforcement describing the suspect, a young white male with sandy blond hair. early to mid 20s. what are they looking for in particular? >> willie they've got apparently a fairly good picture of the suspect as well as a picture of the car. this is one more time again they need the public's cooperation. they need people watching your show to look at this. this is a recognizable individual. somebody in that area. somebody knows who this guy is. somebody knows where the car is. is this should be an easy individual to find. we'll find him and prosecute him and deal with him. but it's the hate that prompted this willie. like last year for example, there were 176 incidents of

significant violence in churches in houses of worship -- >> 176? >> 176 incidents of serious violence. 7 74 of them resulted in death much the four of you are talking and al sharpton made the reference that a church should be a place where we feel safe. we thought that same thing about our schools. and between our schools and our churches, these should be places of safety and refuge. instead, they become hunting grounds for the mentally challenged. individuals who really want to hurt us they know if they go in our schools, if they go in our churches, they hurt all america when they do something like that. >> clint, talk about the mentally challenged. this doesn't make sense to any of us. it doesn't make sense when people go into schools and shoot little children.

but talk about the specific and your profiling. the specific sort of twisted, demented person that would say to one lady you leave and go tell the world what i'm about to do. >> you know, there are people who commit these terrible acts and somehow -- somehow in our world today being infamous is a positive thing. in my era as a profiler, there were serial killers who wanted to beat ted bunlddy's record. they wanted to kill more so they would be on the top of that list. you have individuals, too, in these terrible ways that they harbor hate animosity, fear probably of themselves through challenge their life doesn't work out. their job, their relationships. well, folks, get a life. you know it's not easy. this world is not easy today. but people want to blame somebody else. we want to blame the schools.

we want to blame blacks. we want to blame whites. instead of it's just like cho, the shooter at virginia tech who so many years ago mowed down so many people. he looked out the window and he shot at people just like the shooter did at the church. what these sheeters needooters need to do is look in the mirror. that's their problem. that's their challenge, that's what they need to deal w instead of striking out, they need to reach inside of themselves. we're not doing that today. and our churches and our schools are becoming sites of mass murder instead of mass education and worship. >> all right. we're clint van zandt, thank you very much. we'll be monitoring what is happening in charleston and go live to news conferences as they happen. there is one coming in next half hour. prayer vigil as well. any new information, of course we'll get right on. also ahead this morning, our extended conversation with donald trump. what the presidential conditioned date says about china, his net worth and where

his family stands on the white house. >> and also his favorite president over the past 25 years, not a republican. >> and on tomorrow's show we have an exclusive interview with democratic contender martin o'malley on the set in washington. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. this summer, get ready for suspense. unbridled jealousy. she's still there. new beginnings. goodbye. and sheer exhilaration. and sheer exhilaration. lock and load. roger. it's the event you don't want to miss. it's the summer of audi sales event. get up to $3000 bonus on select audi models now during the summer of audi sales event. before earning enough cash back from bank of america to buy a new gym bag. before earning 1% cash back everywhere, every time and 2% back at the grocery store. even before he got 3% back on gas.

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welcome back. we have a lot to cover this morning. economic analyst and president of "politico" is with us. in washington sam stein. we're obviously keeping tabs on what is going on in charleston, south carolina and will be dipping back into that story. >> also sad news closer to home. we all lost a friend. >> this was a shocker. >> mika and i knew but you knew very well jimmy lee who worked for j.p. morgan chase. just a real force and investment banking. and he must have had a heart attack on the treadmill

yesterday. i read the news this morning. you know we were just shocked by it. i know you're especially shocked. >> i was totally shocked. he is one of the larger than life figures. happens to be my age 62 but very fit, worked out and that's where it happened. spent a lot of time with him in the trenches on some problems trying to fix the deficit. jimmy is part of the team trying to raise money to deal with the deficit. and most of all, he was an extraordinary family man. >> yes. >> he was an extraordinary family man. he met his wife in college. three kids in their early 20s. and it's xwust one of the saddest things i've been through in a while. >> that's one of the first things we talked about this morning. you talked immediately about what a great family man he was and what a great father he was. zbh and how much he loved williams. he sent his kids there. he supported the school and that's all we talked about was kids and williams. >> yeah. >> he bled williams.

>> he bled williams. >> let's go now to turn to politics. jeb bush canceled campaign events in charleston that were scheduled to day obviously because of last night's fatal shooting. >> a spokesman said governor bush's thoughts and prayers are with the individuals and families affected by this tragedy. yesterday bush visited iowa for the first time since announcing his candidacy. and had this to say about a gop field that continues to grow. >> there are a lot of people running for president of the united states. last time i checked, another guy showed up yesterday. i mean it's like i haven't checked this morning. i'm sure there are somebody else running. there are a lot of good people running for president. i admire them. many of them are my friends. who has the leadership skills to take conservative ideas and turn them into reality? >> so that other guy that he is

referring to is donald trump. he entered the field. he continued to go after jeb. >> i think that bush is a nice man. i call him -- he's a man that doesn't want to be doing what he's doing. i call him the reluctant warrior. and warrior is probably not a good word. but i think bush is an unhappy person. i don't think he has any energy. i don't see how he can win. in addition to that, he's in favor of common core. and he's weak on immigration. >> and trump had this surprising answer about which president since ronald reagan has been his favorite. >> of the four who is the best? bush 41 clinton, bush 43 or obama? and why? >> i would really say clinton probably. i would have to say clinton. >> and why? >> there was a little spirit. frankly, he would have been -- had he not met monica, had he not met paula, had he not met

various semibeautiful women, he would have had a much better deal going. do you agree with that joe? he would have had a much better -- seriously. he was destroyed by that. he was really hurt by it. >> we've got the full interview later in the show. steve ratner -- >> and by the way, it's not dull. >> oh, no. that's just a little small, small piece of what happened in that full interview. one of the issues is his fortune and releasing his financial records and i guess that's to come. you have a look steve, at some of the charts of the pocketbooks of the major presidential contenders. what did you find? >> so donald put his $9 billion in the ring. he is literally off the chart. if you look ate chart of some of the other candidates for president, you'll see some interesting news. carly fiorina released her net worth before she was actually

required to. literally down to the penny, $59 million. she wanted to say to the world, i'm giving you all the information. i think in part of the speculation around hillary clinton. >> where do you ghaet number? >> she's a woman. >> only because it's well below all the estimates. >> but it is actually what she filed in her may 15th filing. she gave a range of about $11 million to $52 million. we took the average. that but then we added in our houses which are estimated worth $9 million. and that's the number you get. there is a lot of speculation, but that's what's out there. there is not a lot of information out on jeb. he'll have to report in 120 days after his announcement. the press is saying he's worth $10 million. and then can you see everybody else is in very small numbers. scott walker actually has a negative number. he has got a lot of credit card debt that he incurred along the

way. that's been in the press. but you can see that it's a pretty wide range from top to bottom. >> you say small numbers. ted cruz is worth $3.2 million. >> you tloflove to get after me. >> i mean for a lot of americans, $3.2 million is pretty great. but in comparison to hillary clinton and carly. where did ted cruz get the $3.2 million? >> i have no idea where he made his money. >> but the thing that makes the number that matters most is not like how much they're worth, it's how much they're going to raise. the next big story is the rebound of jeb bush. his fund-raising numbers is going to be more than every other candidate combined. he has so many institutions in this race. when people see the number of big donors and super pac and firepower behind him, he's going to get, most serious

of the candidates. dan ald donald trump is web click candy. it's going to come down to a bush or rubio or walker. >> donald trump is going to have you on his list. >> okay. let's go to the second chart. where donald's money came from. >> so with donald trump, it is amusing. everybody was amused when he popped up with his $9.2 billion the other day. because forbes thinks that donald trump is worth $4.1 billion. now he will also have to file his official disclosure forms in 120 days and we'll find out more. but what was amusing when you look at the disclosure is that he has a line which he calls his real estate licensing deals, brand and branded developments. in other words, his name. and he valued his name at $3.3 billion to get to his $9 billion of net worth. >> how much is your name worth?

>> not as much as yours. >> mine is worth nothing. i will say this trump's name obviously is. sure. it's worth a loutt. it's amazing he slaps the names up on a building and for a lot of people especially international clients, they rush to that. they flock to that. across the globe. >> i'm being tongue and cheek. but $3.3 billion is a lot. >> you're saying that's inflated. his brand is worth a good bit. you're just saying that's inflated. >> okay. chart three. >> getting to average americans. >> i'm interested in this. >> so let's look first at congress people. the average congress person in 2013 was worth a little bit over $1 million. >> wow. >> so they were 271 of the 535 almost exactly half were millionaires. and that was up -- >> jim, has this -- i mean most of the guys that i know -- i remember like having dinner with dana warbacker and talking about

not being automobile to buy tires for three months and he was budgeting out sending his kids to school and being able to afford tires. by the way, nobody else was around. you know? but i'm shocked that -- things changed since we were first there? i mean a million dollar average -- i knew john was a millionaire. i didn't know a lot of millionaires in congress at the time. >> i think that gets skewed by people that make a ton of money. there are a big number of people that don't make that much money in congress. it changed a little. who wants to run for congress given the unpopularity and the cost of getting in. you have to be wealthier than your average cat to be able to run for congress. >> the question is we can discuss now is do these numbers matter? do they affect the way you govern? if we say sam stein that hillary clinton makes all this money so can she relate to the average american or carly fiorina, you go down the list or member of congress worth $1 million, it's a narrative out there. is there a line to be drawn

between making a lot of money and not being able to connect to people which is the line that was drawn for mitt romney in 2012 by democrats successfully? >> certainly some of our country's wealthiest presidents have been populouses. i think what jim is getting at is that we have a political system that's vastly different today than back then in that one, you do have to have a bit of wealth if you want to consider to run for office in most cases. but, two, you have to spend a lot of your time rubbing elbows with really wealthy people in order to raise that money. i think that's where you get people disconnected from reality because they don't spend their time actually talking to people on the lower end of the income scale. they spend their days calling people on the phone or having diners with fundraisers f you don't have any association with reality out of the fund-raising circuit, you end up losing touch with reality.

that's where the problem comes in. >> really quickly. >> i want to make one last point on the other clart. so in addition to everything they said the average congress person's net worth has gone up 14% since 2007. the average american's net worth has gone down 40% since 2007. you can see it on the chart now from $135,000 down to $81,000. so you have this even greater disparity now between the afrnl congress person and the average american. >> and you heard it. >> that's terrible. >> what? >> i'm all for putting a woman on a bull but the wrong bill. alex ander hamilton saved -- created the financial system in this country. andrew jackson almost destroyed it. he should go on to the $20. a woman sh go on the $20, not the $10. >> you're right, should be the $20. just kidding, i like the news that at least they're thinking of putting a woman on a bill. i didn't know you'd have a problem it with. >> just the wrong bill. >> just the wrong bill. a bigger bill. >> bigger. >> all right. coming up we have much more on

the man who opened fire during a bible study session at a church in south carolina. the latest on the manhunt. and what we do and don't know about him at this hour. "morning joe" is back in a moment.

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he's a white male much he's a younger white male. we're estimating between 21 and 25 years of age. he's approximately 5'9" in

height. as you'll see, he has on a very distinctive sweatshirt that has markings and i would point out that also the vehicle that you'll see has a very distinctive front license plate. so again, hopefully these things will help us identify this individual and our people our investigators are standing by. >> that is the chief of charleston south carolina police describing the suspect that they are looking for right now in last night's massacre at the historic eemanuel ame church last night. police released pictures of the photo the car he fled n he left in this car. officials were unable to give a make or model. police are calling this a hate crime. they won't say why beyond the fact that this is a black church and the shooter as you heard from the police chief is a white man. we do know that pastor 41-year-old clamenta pinckney was one of the nine people

killed. we expect to learn more at the top of the hour when officials say they're going to hold another news conference. they're going to announce a reward on that might have more on the suspect, the shooter who is still at large at this point. we're going to carry that news conference live and continue to follow the story throughout the morning. also ahead on "morning joe," the u.s. plan to train fighters against isis is missing one key element. >> but it's a small element. >> yeah. just the fighters. >> they don't have the fighters. >> richard haas weighs in on an american strategy that depends on an opposition army that so far is not signing up. keep it right here on "morning joe." how's it progressing with the prisoner? he'll tell us everything he knows very shortly, sir. as you were... where were we? 13 serving 14! service! if your boss stops by, you act like you're working. it's what you do. if you want to save fifteen percent or more on car insurance, you switch to geico.

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book now at choicehotels.com our training efforts in iraq are slowed by a lack of trainees. we simply haven't received enough recruits. of the 24,000 iraqi security forces, we had originally envisioned training at our four sites by this fall we've only received enough recruits to be able to train about 7,000.

in addition to 2 thou dhounter terrorism personnel. as i told iraqi leaders, while the united states is open to supporting iraq more than we already are, we must see a greater commitment if all parts of the iraqi government. >> that was defense secretary ashton carter saying the training of iraqi forces is not moving fast enough because of a lack of recruits. he said he remains confident that training program will work but it's the latest instance of carter saying iraq's government is not doing enough. >> with us now -- >> can it? >> i'm sorry. we have the president of the council of foreign relations. if he's not careful, he's going to develop a reputation for telling the truth in washington d.c. this is the second or third time he's come out and he's said what foreign policy leaders know but that the administration won't

tell us. that the army just not stepping up. >> virtue of being true. he has tremendous interlekt you'll freedom and using it properly. and it isn't working. the reason is people don't want to fight for this iraqi government f you're a young man and why you would fight if you're a sunni in particular for a government that is dominated by iran where shia militias are the most powerful force? and i think what ash carter has done is saying it's not working. what i'm hoping is this triggers a serious debate within the administration and people start saying let's start working directly with the kurds and sunni tribes. anything that goes through baghdad is simply not going to fly. >> it's not going to work. and the administration is fixated on going through this government in baghdad which we have all been saying around the set it's not going to do a damn thing, especially if you're

talking about trying to bring any stability to anbar province. >> this time last year i was in northern iraq in the kurdish area speaking to kurdish officials. one of the things they were complaining about, the u.s. wanted to send it through baghdad. if they were sending them weapons and money, it would go through baghdad. by the time it got to the kurds. zbh and iranians. >> about it time it got to the kurds, big parts were missing or the kurds would only get a small portion whast u.s.is of what the u.s. wanted. we're holding our own. we can't advance beyond a certain territory. zbh richard, for sunnis across the middle east this has to be so jarring to hear the administration backing down on a one significant demand after another on the nuclear negotiations. we saw the bob corker letter yesterday. and now demanding that they help the kurds, we have to go through the iranian influence baghdad

government. does that cause you concerns that the president is almost fixated on building a relationship wi ran that's just not going to be constructive? >> short answer is yes. in terms of the iraq policy, when you're in a hole, stop digging. we continue to dig. this lily pad thung we talked about yesterday, the small bases, it's not going to work. this is a time for fundmentsa rethink of our policy. there is a such thing as wanting an agreement too much. the story was devastated yesterday. if we keep dropping our demand yeah, we'll get an agreement. but the purpose of the negotiations and diplomacy is to get something worth having. and the danger is that we will get an agreement that will not in this case won't have a clear baseline for inspections. after ten or 15 years we'll allow iran tremendous freedom to rebuild the nuclear capacity essentially on unfeddered. and the administration is setting up a middle east where i

actually think the chance not just iran but several neighbors will have some sort of a nuclear program is going up. so you can't look at -- to define success is getting an agreement i believe is the wrong way to go about this. >> his approach to iran is baffling to friends and foe alike since 2007 when talking about engageme in. t with iran in 2007 and 2 o008. people being shot down in the street. the president was mute. >> well he is saying mubarak must go and kadavy must go the iranians were shooting people in the street. and he said nothing of significance that people around the country, the region the world could have taken heart in. i don't understand this fixation with iran. >> now you see iran as a big player in iraq too and other places. is there a chance the united states will walk away from a deal june 30th? do you think this administration prepared to say no deal?

>> virtually no chance f we were to walk away the only terms now because we are where we are is we should walk away because the iranians have adopted position that's make it truly untenable. if we walk way from a deal however flawed and we're the ones that blew it the sanctions regime will unravel. so that will be worst of all. i'm frustrated and disappointed we are where we are, but given where we are, i don't think simply the united states walk ago way at this point is the answer. that would make a bad situation worse. >> but it's okay if france and others walk away? >> if they were to do that fine. then we have support to keep sanctions in place. it has to be collective. we don't want to make it a unilateral decision by ourselves that this isn't good enough for us. but if everyone else sees it as sufficiently good, then we're isolated rather than iran. >> i want to avoid that outcome. >> okay. richard and amon thank you both. appreciate it. we'll be talking about this much more. coming up we asked donald trump

who he would appoint to fill his presidential cabinet an he added names and added a long list of qualities he is not looking for. >> we have people that are great. we have people that are better than any of their positions. we don't use them joe. we use people that are soft and weak and frankly stupid and incompetent. >> okay. just wait until he starts talking about the other candidates in the race. a conversation with the presidential candidate donald trump just ahead on "morning joe." leave early go roam sleep in sleep out star gaze dream big wander more care less beat sunrise chase sunset do it all. on us. get your first month's payment plus five years wear and tear coverage. make the most of summer... with volvo.

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it doesn't happen often but president obama and republican leaders are coming together on capitol hill. it's part of a last ditch attempt to rescue the white house's trade agenda n just a few hours, the republican controlled house is expected to take up fast track legislation that lets congress vote on trade agreements without amendments. house speaker john boehner and mitch mcconnell also say they approve legislation that gives aid to u.s. workers who lose their jobs because of trade. meanwhile, president obama met with pro trade democrats at the white house to try to shore up their support. it comes just days after progressive democrats voted to defy him on his trade agenda. >> steve ratner are your friends, some within hillary's own camp that obviously you're a big part of concerned that

hillary's waffling on trade? concerned that democrats are getting in the way of this trade deal? >> the people who are in faf favor of the deal in my camp are certainly afraid that hillary is getting in the way. the pro grossive side is trying to pull hillary closer and closer away. >> but what about investors? what about people that you work with that help run the economy? >> the business community, whether they be democrat or republican are massively in favor of this trade bill. >> are they concerned that democrats, nancy pelosi hillary clinton are not being definitive on trade? >> they're being negative. yes, they're very concerned. >> and we see this. we saw this with bill clinton supporting trade when a lot of people and a lot of republicans had problems with free trade deals. the populous republicans. what's going on here and -- what is at stake in passing the trade bill? >> certain things economically are at stake. certain jobs. i think consideration to gdp is

important. what is really at stake is america's reputation in the world for reliability and dependability f we don't go through with this, this will be the latest enormous example that you can't depend on or put your faith in the united states to follow-through. this was a major, indeed the major foreign policy initiative of this administration. its legacy is much of anything. it's pivoting to asia. if this doesn't happen that pivot goes away. hillary clin is one of the architects of this policy. this is central to this president's legacy and if we are worried about china, well basically we would put out the welcome mat to chinese domination of large parts of asia if he we don't go through with this. >> all right. coming up at the top of the hour, we're moment as way from a police news conference on the horror at a church in south carolina. nine people killed during a bible study session. who police say they're looking for and how they need the public to help in the search.

plus, john heilmann joins us. and donald trump uncensored that, is if he is ever uncensored. this is really uncensored. we sut down with the republican candidate for president in an interview you don't want to miss. we'll be right back. u think of when you think of the united states postal service? exactly. that's what pushes us to deliver smarter simpler faster sleeker earlier fresher harder farther quicker and yeah even on sundays. what's next? we'll show you.

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pain. smash it! make the call and ask your doctor if jublia is right for you. new larger size now available. he's a white male. he's a younger white male. we're estimating between 21 and 25 years of age. he's approximately 5'9" in height. as you will see, he has on a very distinctive sweatshirt that has markings and i would point out that also the vehicle that you'll see has a very

distinctive front license plate. so again, hopefully these things will help us to identify this individual and our people our investigators are standing by. >> all right. that was the charleston police chief moments ago. we're awaiting another news conference this hour in charleston south carolina. the breaking news this morning, nine people are dead after being shot in a historic african-american church in the heart of the city. police say they believe it was a hate crime. this is the first image that we have of the suspect. still at large. he's being called extremely dangerous. right now officials are pleading with the public to help identify him as soon as possible. that's the car that is also the focus of an intense manhunt this morning. the gunman opened fire at around 9:00 p.m. at the mother emanuel ame church. the victims taking part in a bible study. when police arrived, they found eight people who were already dead, two more were rushed to the hospital and one of them died later. sources confirm to nbc news that

among the dead is the pastor clenta pinckney. we want to listen in to the press conference which is -- this is the one that happened about an hour ago? alex? >> no, this is live now. >> the new one. this is the police chief. >> first of all, we're going to briefly go over the facts that we started with last night. and we'll add things as we go along. i think as you've been told already at the conclusion of the comments, we'll start to my right. if you have questions, we'll identify you. please don't shout questions out to us. we want to make sure that we answer your questions logically and so that everybody understands them. last night at approximately 9:05 the chals tonrleston dispatch received a call for a shooting that happened at the emanuel ame church. officers were dispatched and arrived at that location. when we did, we initially

identified eight victims inside of the church that had suffered gunshot wounds. earlier, we told that you there were two victims that were transported to the hospital. there was actually one victim that was transported to the hospital and that individual is deceased as well. so we have a toteal of nine victims involved in this very tragic situation that occurred last night. the victims, there are three males and six female victims in this tragedy. as we told you last night, we have a unified command that has been set up that is compromised of the charleston police department charleston county police department, federal bureau of investigation, alcohol, toeb and firearms and other federal agency that's are working with us.

we are committed. we are determined. and we are definitely working right now with a number of agents and police officers in our region to identify the individual that we passed out to you about one hour ago that is the suspect in this case. this is a situation that is unacceptable in any society and especially in our society and our city. we are committed to do whatever is necessary to bring this individual to justice and i am committed and all the people that are working with us are committed to do whatever it takes to work as long as we have to. our partners are committed. we're bringing in the resources from washington, d.c., from the fbi headquarters to help us. we set up a hotline as we mentioned earlier. 1-800-call fbi. we have agents and police officers manning that phone.

we'll continue to man that phone until we've identified and arrested this suspect. it's critical that the members of the community who have seen the picture of the vehicle as well as the suspect, to call law enforcement. this is a very dangerous individual. he should not be approached by anyone. call law enforcement if you recognize the individual or the car so that we can take the appropriate action to address this situation. again, this is a very dangerous individual. we do not want more people harmed trying to approach him or trying to follow the vehicle if they see it. we're also very concerned about the families the victims. we set up a senter in downtown charleston. we have members of the charleston police department victim advocacy unit as well as the fbi victim assistance unit

as well. i want to say this from the time this call came in we had resources coming from all over the east coast. we've got more resources that are coming in this morning from the fbi and other federal agencies. the state law enforcement division has committed a significant number of resources, crime scene, vekt i agents. and we're not leaving anything any stone unturned. this traj dha we're addressing right now is undescribable. no one in this community will ever forget this night. and as a result of that and because of the pain and because of the hurt that this individual has caused this community, this

entire community, the law enforcement agencies that are working on this are committed and we will catch this individual. the important thing for you as the media is to help us catch this individual. you have the ability to get this picture, get this car out to places quickly. social media is here please help us to help our community. >> first of all, i thank you, chief, and members of our police department and all the department that's are here state, fbi county other jurisdictions and the immediacy and the quality of the work of

our law enforcement agencies has been inspiring. this is an unfathomable and unspeakable act by somebody filled with hate and with a deranged mind. this person is dangerous. we need every tip we can get to bring this person into custody as soon as possible. and, of course we'll make sure that he pays the price for this horrible act. in our community which is a community to gather people loving and respecting each other. it is a community that honors how religious institutions and respect the different cultures

and beliefs we call the holy city. all the church fires that reach up to the sky, including iman ualu al -- emanuel ame church where this horrific crime committed last night. so for all communities, and in charleston you have horrible hateful person go into a church and kill people there to pray and worship with each other is something that is beyond incomprehensible. >> okay that, is the charleston

maryland riley. we'll go back it to as more information comes out. the recap from the police chief there in charleston nine dead, eight on the scene, one after being transported to the hospital. four three males, six females. the shooter is still at large. somebody that walked into the church at charleston at 9:00 last night opening fire killing nine people. among them reverend sharpton is state senator clementa pink any,pi pinckney. >> he was a wonderful individual. i was doing a story about walter scott and i was reminded by a staffer that senator pinkckney did one of the prayers us with. he's been a senator since his early 20s. rib meeting him when i ran for

president in '04. he was already in the senate. for he and eight people to be killed in a church i mean what is sacred if we can't go to bible study in a church? and i think what is so stunning and shocking about this is that this happens in a church, we're told by the one survivor the man came in and sat down for a while. so obviously, he's deranged. probably a hate crime. but he's rally done something that is not only appalling but frightening. and i think it is a time for all of us in this country to come together. >> and reverend al not just any church. i mean this place of worship has a history of resilience and really represents the black struggle and perseverance and pride and so many other things. emanuel ame church known as mother emanuel is a historic religious site in charleston. it's the oldest ame church in the south. and the oldest black congregation south of baltimore.

it is nearly as old as the country itself dating back to 1787 as free blacks and slaves worshipped together. after a parishioner organized a slave rebellion in 1822 the church was burned and the pastor fled to philadelphia. the church was rebuilt and services continued until black churches were outlawed in 1834. they worshipped in secret for three decades until they could organize after the civil war. according to the king center it played host to dr. martin luther king when he visited charldz eded eded charleston in the '6 o0s. >> it's been a must stop for any civil rights leader going through charleston. >> everywhere you look in history, civil rights leaders from dr. king down would go to this church. it's not far from the charleston slave market. the largest market was there in

charleston, not far from where mother emanuel s i think it is a must stop. i remember going to many times during my years out. and to see this church violated any church but this church with its history violated is just -- it almost is unfathomable that this would happen. and in a the killer is still at large is frightening. >> a couple other things we pointed out in our last hour was that reports say that one woman was allowed to live and that the law enforcement says this man said go tell people what i did. i wanted a witness to this. it gets uglier by the moment. joining us from charleston benjy sarlin. he was in south carolina to cover jeb bush. jeb bush cancelling the event for today. what heelse can you tell us? >> the big news is of course the most concrete information

we've had yet about the suspectedunman. police are really putting this in the hands of the public right now. they released a photograph of the gunman. he is a slender a'9" while male between the ages of 20 and 25. and they're asking people to distribute as far as wide as possible. they really are looking for any tips they can possibly get. they also distributed a picture of his vehicle, a four door black sedan. they did not name the specific make on it. no one is going to be satisfied or able to move on to the grieving process until they're assured that threat passed. so that remains local officials top priority. and they are asking the public to do everything this he can to help in that regard. >> benjy for people waking up and that don't know what happened. as you were on the scene, how did this unfold at 9:00 last night? >> according to police the very first reports of a shooting came around 9:05 p.m.

by the time i arrived on the scene, someone later there were a few people that gathered the last people who seemed to be bystanders, direct witnesses who were in a stast shock or did he leer yum were being carried off by police. shortly after that, police pushed everyone back a couple of blocks due to what she said was a bomb threat. later it was revealed there was no threat. police said whatever warning they had had passed. gradually things calmed down. one consistent threat is that late into the night, 2:00 in the morning, 3:00 in the morning there was almost every hour groups holding a prayer circle. many community activists were in the area. pastors were coming fwoi lend support to ask what they can do to comfort each other. many were there without any specific goal or intention. they just wanted to be there and wanted to be there for each other knowing that victim's families were nearby dealing with this horrific news. it was an incredible scene. and now as people wake up to day to the news that the killer is still on the loose, i can only

imagine what everyone is going through in this community. >> earlier this morning we spoke to bakari seller who was friends with the pastor of that church. take a listen. >> that day of joy turned so much darkness in such a quick amount of time. you know in, south carolina and throughout the south as you all know, one of the things that we always go to when times are tough is prayer. and so there hasn't been a lot of sleep tonight. but we're going to pray extremely hard and many of us will be going to charleston this morning. i served in the south carolina house of representatives from 2006 to 2014. and senator pinctney was always there. we served in the same delegation. our districts overlapped for a

period of time. i think, you know i chuckle because i think about his voice and how booming it was. he was somebody who didn't always speak but when he did, people listened. and even more importantly, he was a man of god. so you know went out serving his people. he went out serving his lord. and at the endst day, may he rest in peace. >> al the southern poverty law center says there are 784 hate groups across america and that while hate crimes have decreased a great deal through the years, there's still 6,000 hate crimes every year. >> i think that -- i've seen the study. i think that what is shocking about that is that we don't hear anything about the activity until there's a situation like this. we don't know that this person was a member of a hate crime.

certainly it's been deemed by the police chief as a hate crime. but we don't know if he's a member of a group. but i think that we have got to deal with the fact that there is still hate groups in this country against not only african-americans but jews and gays and others. and we've got to deal with it. i was saying earlier to you, joe and mika yesterday morning i was elated. i'm in washington. watching the president of the united states install the first african-american woman as attorney general, hand on the bible of frederick douglas. i go to bed last night hearing about this horrific hate crime in south carolina. it shows where the country has gone and shows where we still need to go. we can't avoid it. >> still ahead on "morning joe," we'll bring you the new details as they continue to emerge about the massacre at a historic church in south carolina.

also ahead, john heilman and steve schmitt join the political round table. and we offer constructive criticism to donald trump. >> strategic advice for you. do not call people losers. say they have lack of a command in the issues. something like that. okay? >> that takes too long. >> won't listen. >>, no he won't. reverend al thank you so much for being with us. we'll be watching tonight at 6:00. you're going to be following this throughout the day. >> absolutely. >> please -- >> i'm available to do whatever we can to help. i hope we can find this guy. we're going to put up a reward with the city. >> great. great. full interview ahead. "morning joe" with the presidential candidate.

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there are a lot of people running for president of the united states. the last time i checked another guy showed up yesterday. i mean it's like i haven't checked this morning. i'm sure there is somebody else running. there are a lot of good people running for president. i admire them. many of them are my friends. but the question to think about

is who has the leadership skills to take conservative ideas and turn them into reality? >> i think that bush is a nice man. i call him -- he's a man that doesn't want to be doing what he's doing. i call him the reluctant warrior. and warrior is probably not a good word. but i think bush is an unhappy person. i don't think he has any energy. i don't see how he can win. in addition to that he's in favor of common core. and he's weak on immigration. >> joining the conversation former mccain senior strategist and msnbc political analyst steve schmitt and john heilman. sam stein is still with us in washington. i wonder if sam notices what you notice? >> what? >> that jeb stance. what it is heilman? >> it's a little hunched. he has a hunched shoulder thing. >> i think he looks good though. i like the announcement with no

tie, no jacket just the button down shirt. very casual. i like that relaxed. >> hunched. he has a little hunch there. >> i think it's nice. he lost incredible amount of weight. he looks braet. >> you said looking at him over the past couple days you said he seems like a very likeable guy. >> yep. >> i mean that's you know it's nothing to do with his points of view. but he's coming off very likeable and approachable. and trying to appear like he's putting himself out there. >> but you remember -- i was thinking you about the other day. do you remember, steve, there was a story about how he lost all this weight and on the paleo diet. he said he's hungry all the time. it made me think of you when you had that period and you said screw it i'm not going to be hungry all the time. >> and you see what happened. >> yeah, i'm in better shape.

i'm hungry all the time. >> yes. that is very understandable. that's what i wrote about. some people can never actually lose weight and feel like they can sit there and eat normal again. you always have to be on a special clear diet. and you're hungry all the time. >> so talk about the week for jeb. you know this is how the horse race goes up down up down up, down. right now we're in an up phase for jeb. and, you know go back to what i'm going to say. this smart money has to be on marco right now. >> this is an endurance race. and so we -- mike murphy the strategist who run the jeb super pac, he used a phrase that may be best line of the campaign. he talked about the president of april and may. people that are, you know for a short period of time up in the polls. so jeb bush had a rough preseason. we're if the regular season now. he's off to a great start. the speech was very good. his initial campaign appearances are very good.

his appearance on jimmy fallon's show, he's accessible he's likeable. he has a lot of strengths as a candidate and he'll have a record shattering amount of money raised when they report. and he's certainly if not favorite, one of the couple of favorites to be the nominee of the party. >> and, willie these days it's sort of the exception to the rule that you got a guy that will stand in front of reporters, take all their questions, wade into crowds and demonstrators and sit there and be able to talk. again, that's the exception. that doesn't happen much. and right now it's happening with a front-runner. i have to believe that helps in the long run. >> he's been doing it long before he was a candidate. we had a clip of a college student confronting him. he was hostile and he handled it well. he looks pretty relaxed on the campaign trail much he's going to raise a ton of money. you have to say if you look at

this big wide field whatever jeb bush's faults are, he's the frontrunner or number two guy. i think he will be to the end unless there is a big stumble. >> sam stein, good week for jeb? >> i think there is a ceiling to his type of support in the republican party. you know his last name remains a problem. the exchange that willie talked about where the girl accused his brother, the president george w. bush of creating isis. i have a feeling that is the beginning and not the end of these types of things. he helped out a lot about it money he has. i it this real assist that he has here is the sfeeldfield is so crowded. there are so many candidates that for someone like him, it could be that all you need is a third of the vote to advance. and if that's the case then he is in the driver's seat. there's a lot more questions that are going to pop-up that are going to cause him trouble

like the iraq question did. nobody asked him about medicare part d and, you know i'm waiting to see how he hand lz those types of inquiries before i get on this jeb band wagon. >> there is no band wagon. >> you'll never be on a jeb band wagon. >> i'm with you on those issues. >> i can make a point. why do the people like he has this paleo diet before he enters the most stressful part of his life. obama quits smoking before he goes to the white house. why are the people making it harder for themselves in the moments of intense stress? it doesn't make sense to me. >> i don't it this president quit smoking. that's his business. >> true. >> i don't think running for president if you're 30 or 40 pounds overweight is not necessarily ideal either. >> being hungry all the time does affect your energy. >> it gives you a headache. >> it affects your mood et

cetera. everybody likes to donald trump is a joke. it is fashionable here and in washington, d.c. he tore a page out of ross perot's book. he was hammering on mexico. he was hammering on china. he was hammering on all of these other countries. and i just sat here thinking this is a guy with a lot of money. he does well in the polls. even though everybody calls him a joke. and if he hones in on that ross perot message right now, that is a 15% of the republican field. >> you cannot be more right on. this the commentary that calls him a joke is nuts. he is saying the things that millions of americans shout at their television sets every night. he is saying it with authenticity. he is a cultural icon in this country. he's a unique person. he's been in the public stage for four decades now since the 1980s. he has a very successful

television show. he is a master showman. and there is a strain of populism that is in the republican party. they're going to resonate with large republican debates. let's say marco rubio is answering a question. who are the people watching the debate going to want to hear from in the next question? they're going to want to hear from scott walker or an answer from donald trump? he's endlessly entertaining. endlessly fascinating. he has the potential to be very impactful in this race. >> i'll tell you how he is dangerous, also. everybody can say what they want to say, but if he focuses and does well he can get a percentage that makes a difference. fwhut is how he's dangerous. this is how he's dangerous. it hasn't been reported here. and we're not picking on george stephanopoulos. but this is how he is dangerous

to other candidates. he doesn't play by the rules. george stephanopoulos interviewed him. he started to ask him a question about hillary clinton and donald cut him off. he said come on, should you really be asking me a question about hillary clinton? you're laughing. i guarantee that you george liquified when that went on. should you really be asking me a question about hillary clinton right now? is that really appropriate? he goes answer the question. come on george. he said you shouldn't be doing that. okay. that's fine. that's a tv anchor. whether he's on the debate stage and he turns to scott walker or marco rubio or jeb bush and hits them with something not mean spirited but truthful that nobody else in polite political society would say. it can shape a race. and so all these people saying that he's going to have no impact, they don't get it. >> who is the candidate on the debate stage that is going to be able to take him on? >> he's fearless.

>> and he's fearless and he doesn't care. >> sam, what you are laughing at? you almost sound a little bit -- hold on. >> he just -- >> look the elite opinion about him is he is a clown and joke. a lot of things he says doesn't withstand scrutiny. the claims he makes are not true. you point out correctly. he doesn't play by the rules and not afraid of anybody. that make himz dafrpgs him dangerous. we went and looked at yesterday what local tv coverage. national press comedians, jon stewart, everybody mocks him. if you go and see how he was covered when he went to iowa after his announcement they treat him like a celebrity, like an icon and like a plausible serious presidential candidate. i know that's how the coverage is in new hampshire. too. he arrives in places where voters are. and the donald is here. that's great. >> sam stein, what's so funny? >> i mean listen. no one's doubting his

entertainment value and he can deliver a good line and he might have an impact on a debate stage. that's not in doubt. but to say that makes him serious is ridiculous. >> we never said that. >> yes, that's the whole conversation. git is talking about how mexicans are rapists during his announcement speech. he is talking about selling junk to the saudis because they'll blow it up anyway. i don't think we can just brush him aside. >> sam, you're missing the nuance in the conversation which he could have a serious impact. >> i said that. >> but -- it's not funny the impact he can have on the race. >> it's potentially damaging too. it's damaging to the discourse and to the republican party. for steve, do you see parallels to schwarzenegger at all in this i know you worked with schwarzenegger. people didn't take him seriously at the beginning. do you see any parallel what's sofr? >> he is the two term governor of california. and i don't think it's exactly analogous.

i think schwarzenegger has a substantial record of success in the state of california as a governing leader. i think the point about donald trump is this. in a field where there are 15 16 candidates you have an iconic cultural figure who is running for president with vast amounts of wealth who is completely fearless who all of these issues that he is talking about, there is resonance with them with huge swaths of republican voters in the early primary states. and so when donald trump goes out there at a time where trust is completely collapsed and every institution in this country and says i'm going to fight for you, the regular guy, i'm going fight for you, regular americans out there that are struggling that, are getting sold short by the political class in the country. it's a powerful message. he can be very impactful. >> and all i'll say, we have to wrap up. all i'll say is all the people that call this guy a joke you talk about schwarzenegger.

schwarzenegger, compare what swarts neg der before he was governor and what donald trump did before he was governor. it wasn't a close call. everybody talks about trump being a joke and he says things that are crazy, but you don't become a billionaire, you don't become one of the top developors in new york city you don't have the best-selling one of best-selling business books of all time you don't have the most successful tv shows of the past decade and graduate near the top of your class at warton by mistake. so all i will say because at the beginning of this campaign people who think he's a joke and fool need to be careful because by the end of the campaign, the joke may be on them. he'll say things that are outrageous. just don't simplify our words. we're not saying -- he could have an impact on the race if he's disciplined. >> steve some mitt thank you very much. sam, not so much. just kidding. >> we're on jeb bush's band wagon. >> i'm not. but anyhow when we come back the latest on a manhunt for the suspect accused of killing nine

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she says the suspect then sat down next to him and according to the city's police chief, the suspect stayed at the bible study for about an hour before opening fire. here is sylvia johnson describing what else she was told. >> one of the survivors said that he reloaded five different times. and her son was trying to talk him out of doing that act of killing people. and he just said i have to do it. he said you rape our women. and you taking over our country. and you have to go. at the conclusion of the bible study, from what i understand, they just started hearing loud noises ringing out. and he had already wounded the suspect had already wounded a

couple of individuals including my cousin reverend clementa pinckney. >> that is chilling and unthinkable what happened especially there of all places. full coverage straight ahead. we're following a news conferences that are happening about it hour and also there's a prayer vigil at noon in charleston. we'll be back in a moment with much more "morning joe." hey, you forgot the milk! that's lactaid. right. 100% real milk, just without the lactose. so you can drink all you want... ...with no discomfort? exactly. here, try some... mmm, it is real milk. see? delicious. hoof bump! oh. right here girl, boom lactaid®. 100% real milk. no discomfort and for a creamy and delicious treat, try lactaid® ice cream ♪ mamas, don't let your babies grow up to be cowboys ♪ ♪ don't let'em pick guitars and drive them old trucks ♪

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down. >> all right. that is the 911 call out of charleston south carolina yesterday at the scene of the oldest ame church in the south where nine people were gunned down including the pastor. we just heard before the last break witnesses saying that the gunman came in the gunman is still at large right now. came in and sat next to the pastor for up to an hour before he opened fire and even reloaded, is that the -- several times during the carnage. we're following this story. there are several news events that we're looking into. there is a reward the suts inspect is at large. they have a picture of him. they have a picture of his car. and they're announcing a reward. we heard from reverend al that national action network is going to be adding to that reward. they plan to find this guy. they're very confident they will. they say they plan to -- it's a matter of time. they want the public to help. again, there is this picture. there is also a scene of his car in a parking lot that they

believe he fled in. this horrific crime happening, of course, at the site of the oldest ame church in the south, the oestest black congregation in south of baltimore and the parishioners there were taking part in a bible study of all things. so we'll be following that as new information comes in we'll be jump in. >> as you said we knew overnight the gunman had at least sat for some of the prior meeting. we didn't know now we're learning overnight that he sat there for almost an hour. and according to the account of the woman we heard who was a cousin of the pastor there pinckney he reloaded five time. this is according to a survivor. the people in the church were pleading with him, please stop. and in a very cold calculating way he explained why he had to do this. >> hard to imagine they're not going to catch this guy. they have pictures and just a matter of time. >> there he is right there. >> so we're going to get to the cover of "time" magazine now.

nancy gibbs is here editor of "time" magazine to reveal the new cover. i'm assuming you have reporters now all over this as well as we look into following this over the next week. your cover this week hits close to home. i was about to say for women but i actually don't think that's the case anymore. it's called nip, tuck or else. now everyone gets work done this is an incredible industry at this point. >> it is. and we sent our wonderful columnist to explore what is happening in cosmetic procedures. they went mainstream a long time. but what he is finding is whether we're reaching a tipping point where it's going to become weird if you haven't had work done. >> oh, no. >> if the stigma that was once attached to having any kind of procedure is now the language as well you're letting yourself go. it's like if you stopped exercising. if you're not getting these -- either botox injections or liposuction that somehow

suggests a lack of self-esteem. and this is only a few years ago that therapists would tell patients who were considering plastic surgery that that was a sign of depression or something. and now it has become so much the norm and so much a sign of sort of empowerment and taking responsibility for yourself. and even in economic calculation because we know from research that your earning power and the way you're treated in the workplace has a significant relationship to your appearance. and so there are all of these factors that have been driving this industry for years. but i think it's fascinating if we're reaching a point where having work done is the norm and -- >> is this mostly for women then? i do feel like there is a discrepancy or an -- an impact on effectiveness or what happens you to or your fate at work for women is more impacted in term of the way they look. >> it is more still. it is more than 90% of procedures are women. but it's growing very quickly for men as well. and a lot of that is because

many more of these procedures are nonsurgical. it's not as huge a deal. and i think we all have seen if you go to your dentist's office or dermatologist, those are turning into beauty salons. the whole other cash flow is around all of these other procedures. it's an enormous industry. >> there is a donnie deutsche joke in here somewhere. i'm sure he is getting it right now. >> you also nancy, have a piece from joe klein about jeb bush and hillary clinton and the campaign launches. he talks about the double edge sword of dynasties. >> i've been fascinated all along at the -- there was one focus group in colorado that where one suggested it would be nice if congress passed a law that no one named clinton or bush could ever run for president again and half the room agreed. this is something that we have real, i think, a real tension about. and, yet, you know obviously, the experience that both of these candidates bring to this race, their experience -- zbh has to be considered. >> their seriousness, focus on

poll sichlt all of which makes them entirely legitimate. it's not because they're in the race because of the power of the family names but it is something there's this abiding discomfortable it is it really possible in this country we're only generating candidates out of these two families. >> the new issue of "time" magazine is out now.

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i'm one of the survivors,

and she said he reloaded five different times. and her son was trying to talk him out of doing that the killing people. and he just said i have to do it. he said you rape our women and you're taking over our country. and you have to go. at the conclusion of the bible study, from what i understand they just start hearing loud noises just ringing out. and he had already wounded, the suspect had already wounded a couple individuals, including my cousin reverend clementa pinckney. >> a nightmare scenario. >> we're going to be following a bunch of developments in charleston. at the top of the hour the latest on this breaking story.

we're going to look at the extraordinary history of this church plus our in-depth conversation with donald trump and why he should be a candidate. we'll be right back. welcome to fort green sheets. welcome to castle bravestorm. it's full of cool stuff, like...

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i want some gray...but not too much. only touch of gray uses oxygen to gently blend away some gray but not all for that perfect salt and pepper look. satisfaction guaranteed. just you and the look you want. just for men touch of gray we are not leaving anything any stone unturned. this tragedy that we're addressing right now is undescribable. no one in this community will

ever forget this night. and as a result of that and because of the pain and because of the hurt that this individual has caused this community, this entire community, the law enforcement agencies that are working on this are committed and we will catch this individual. the important thing for you as the media is to help us catch this individual. >> all right, so charleston south carolina, is in mourning this morning, and also mobilizing. that was police chief greg mullen. people were taking part in a prayer service last night, but around 9:00 police were called to the mother emanuel ame church in the heart of downtown. what they found inside was devastating. eight people dead two more rushed to the hospital one of them has also died. sources confirm to nbc news that among the dead is the pastor

state senator clementa pinckney. at one point, there were reports of an explosive device and police rushed onlookers and the prayer circle out of the your yeah. there's a heavy media presence in town most of them in town to attend hillary clinton's event. >> reverend sharpten i remember back when i was a young guy, martin luther king's mother actually was shot in the church while playing the organ. i remember my grandmom saying that is the purest form of hate. on this earth. i remember that. i must have been 5, 6 years old. it ended up actually he was a disturbed young black man who came back from the war. but this is this appears to just be the purest form of hate all across the southeast, people

gather in churches on wednesday nights whether it's wednesday night supper or bible study here. it's just a fabric of these people's lives. >> this is ugly as you can get. when people can't trust the sanctity of a church and the refuge of a church to have this kind of violence. apparently, the police chief saying it's a hate crime. it appears we don't know whether this person is disturbed, whether he's alone or not. but the chilling fact that this would happen in a church nine people, is just shocking. when i started getting calls, we have a chapter of national action network, and elder johnson, who heads our chapter, was at the scene, he had to tell me over and over for me to even believe it last night. >> to comprehend it. >> and then reverend pinckney, the senator, just two months ago, i was in charleston leading

a prayer vigil on the shooting of walter scott, and he reminded me reverend pinckney was there with us led the prayer. here's a man that stood against these kinds of things and now becomes victim of it. it's just something that's almost inconceivable. >> reverend pinckney not only a leader of his church and community, but also willie a political leader as well. >> yeah state senator. elected, i believe, to the state house at the age of 23. he's been in public service for all of his adult life. and obviously, a leader in the church. first order of business, though is to find the guy, because we don't know what else he may have planned. let's go to charleston where we find bengie. he was in south carolina to cover jeb bush but now he's been on the scene of the shooting all night. take us through your night last night, what you saw, what you can report this morning. >> as you mentioned, quite a few political reporters in town many of whom were among the

first of the scene to cover hillary clinton or jeb bush today. that appearance by jeb bush has since been canceled. i arrived shortly after the shooting. that that point, there were only ahandful of people. police seemed to be directing people in shock or delirium away from the scene. then there was a bomb scare of a kind, we were told there was an immediate threat, and then we were given an all-clear. what happened there was truly incredible. large gatherings of people holding prayer circles almost hourly. very intense emotional prayer sessions of people speaking directly to god, asking for advice expressing their anger, frustration, and hope for the community. at one point, very moving. a pastor said god, if we're not safe in our churchers, where are we safe? tell us where to go. it's stunning to have a place like this that's such an

important house of worship just taken away from them like that and especially disturbing because as many people reminded me there's a long history of terrible racist violence against black churches throughout the south and throughout america. this is something everyone is familiar with. several people liken it to the birmingham bombing of 1963 that killed four young girls. people have long memories and this is just unfortunately, to see a church wrapped in violence like this again is disturbing for everyone. >> i'm sure there's concern for other churches in the area with this gunman this mass murderer at large. what level of security are you seeing around the city and other levels of worship, particularly those for african-americans in particular. >> there's several churches nearby. we haven't seen any particular up level, other than general police presence. the police presence has been substantial, but it's not stifling. it's not overwhelming. it's not like you feel like you're in some sort of martial law. people are trying to restore

some sense of normalcy. we're now significantly closer than we were allowed to be earlier. but there's no doubt that this is still a manhunt going on. various points there have been helicopters circling over with heavy flood lites. at other points police using dogs to search. everyone is going to be uneasy until they know that the gunman is caught and the threat has passed. >> bengie on the ground in charl charleston charleston, south carolina. police looking for a young white male, they believe he's between the ages of 21 to 25. >> sandy blond hair. >> sandy blond hair and a four-door black sedan vehicle they believe he left in. >> mika calculated move. a horrific calculated move where actually reports coming out that he let one woman leave, so she could tell the world what he was about to do. also reports coming out that a young 5-year-old girl actually

survived by pretending to be dead lying on the floor motionless. >> another survivor told family members the gunman initially sat down in the church for a while before standing up and opening fire. the emanuel ame church known as mother emanuel is an historic religious site. not just in charleston. it's the oldest ame church in the south and the oldest black congregation south of baltimore. it dates back to 1787 as free flacks and slaves wurxp ss worshipped today. the church was burned in 1822 and the pastor moved to philadelphia. the church was rebuilt and serviced continued until black churches were outlawed in 1834. worship continued in secret for three decades until the church could formally reorganize after the war. it even played host to dr. martin luther king when he

visited charleston in the '60. >> with us is south carolina representative representative, bakari sellers. and bakari it is always good to talk to you, but under these circumstances, obviously tragic. you were actually a block or two away from this shooting when it was happening. at an event for hillary clinton. take us through the night. >> well you know i described it as being a day of so much joy. you know being in the presence of former secretary clinton, and just having that type of joy and hope brought to the state of south carolina. and as i was leaving the city you know twitter and my phone began to blow up. and that day of joy turned so much darkness and such a quick amount of time. so you know in south carolina and throughout the south, as you all know, one of the things we

always go to in times are tough are prayer. there hasn't been a lot of sleep tonight. but we're going to pray extremely hard and many of us will be descending back upon charleston this morning. >> senator, talk about your friends that you lost in the shooting. >> well you know i started in the south carolina house of representatives from 2006 to 2014. and senator pinckney was always there. we actually started in the same dellication. our districts overlapped for a period of time. i think, you know i chuckle when i think about his voice and how booming it was. he was somebody who didn't always speak, but when he did, people listened. even more importantly, he was a man of god. so, you know he went out serving his people. he went out serving his lord. and at the end of the day, may he rest in peace.

>> bakari sellers, thank you very much. >> i wanted to ask you, mika touched on it a minute ago, but the significance of this particular church of mother emanuel, not just in charleston not just in south carolina, but in the south historically, this is a very important place. >> very important. as mika said this was formed in the late 1700s. it was a church that was investigated for having housed the planning of a slave rebellion in the early 19th century. it was a place civil rights people went to all the way through dr. king. i remember i think, the first time i met pinckney when i was running for president in 2004 we would always go to this church and as i was listening to representative sellers, i shared what he did yesterday. yesterday morning, such a glorious morning to me. i was in washington. the president and loretta lynch,

the first black woman attorney general, and i go to bed last night, this happens. all in one day. it shows how far we've come and how far we have not come. i think we've got to deal with these issues head-on. avoiding them does not make them go away. >> i tell you also willie just the bombarding of bad news. it's hard. it's hard to put in perspective. we do this every day. but you know you wake up every morning. this morning i woke up with this horrible tragedy on my phone, breaking news. it seems every morning it just can be almost overwhelming. and that parts of the information age that there's so many positive things, but it seems, i know for a lot of people, i was coming up in an elevator where someone said, god, it seems like a tragedy every day. sometimes it's hard to put in proper perspective. >> i think we all have the same

experience. i went to bed with word maybe of a shooting in charleston and you wake up with nine dead. you go oh, my gosh. it's about this town the walter scott shooting not long ago in north charleston. this city has been through an awful lot, but nothing as bad as this. this is completely unimaginable. let's go to washington. former fbi profiler hostage negotiation, nbc crime analyst clint van zant. we heard them describing the suspect, a young white male sandy blond hair. early to mid 20s. >> they've got apparently a fairly good picture of the suspect as well as a picture of the car. this is one more time again, they need the public's cooperation. they need people watching your show to look at this. this is a recognizable individual. somebody in that area, somebody knows who this guy is somebody knows where the car is. this should be a relatively easy

individual to find. that's, you know we'll find him, prosecute him, deal with him, but it's the hate that has prompted this willie. last year for example, there were 176 incidents of significant violence in churches in housing of worship, i should say. >> wow, 176. >> 176 incidents of serious violence. 74 of them resulted in death. you know you're sitting there, you're talking. the four of you are talking, and al sharpton made the reference a church should be a place where we feel safe. we thought that same thing about our schools, guys. between our schools and our churches, these should be places of safety and sanctity and instead, they become hunting grounds, apparently for the mentally challenged. individuals who really want to hurt us they know if they go in our schools, if they knowgo in our

churches, they hurt all america when they do something like that. >> clint you talk about the mentally challenged. this doesn't make sense to any of us. it doesn't make sense when people go into schools and shoot little children. but talk about the specific in your profiling, the specific sort of twisted, demented person that would say to one lady you leave and go tell the world what i'm about to do. >> you know there are people who commit these terrible acts and somehow, somehow in our world today, being infamous is a positive thing. you know in my era as a profiler, there were serial killers who wanted to beat ted bundy's record. they wanted to go out and kill more so they would be on the top of that list. you have individuals, too, in these terrible ways they harbor hate, animosity, fear probably of themselves through

challenge. their life doesn't work out. their job, their relationships. well folks, get a life. you know it's not easy. this world is not easy today. but people want to blame somebody else. we want to blame the schools. we want to blame blacks. we want to blame whites. instead of -- it's just like the shooter at virginia tech who so many years ago mowed down so many people. he looked out the window when he shot at people just like this shooter did at the church what these shooters need to do is look in a mirror. that's their problem. that's their challenge. that's what they need to deal with. instead of striking out, they need to reach inside of themselves, and we're not doing that today. and our churches and our schools are becoming sites of mass murder instead of mass education and worship. >> clint, thank you. all morning we'll bring you the latest details on this deadly church shooting in south carolina that has left nine people dead. also ahead, our wide ranging

and extremely interesting conversation with donald trump. >> that was something, wasn't it? >> way off the rails at times. and on tomorrow's show an exclusive interview with martin o'malley. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. here is a simple math problem. two trains leave st. louis for albuquerque at the same time. same cargo, same size, same power. which one arrives first? hint: it's not the one on the left. the speedy guy on the right is part of an intelligent system that creates the optimal trip profile for all trains on the line. and the one on the left?

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coming up on "morning joe," donald trump joins the conversation here on set. his presidential announcement must have been an emotional moment, right? >> really touching. >> i'm trying to humanize you. i hear about the time with your family. what was it like? did anyone cry? >> nobody cried. it wasn't a dry eye in the house. nobody cried. >> we threw a couple clips on the web yesterday and it nearly broke the internet.

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well after years of speculation and flirtations, donald trump formally entered the race for the white house this week. we sat down with the wealthiest presidential candidate to get his ideas on the economy, jobs and also something else. what was that? >> well his surprising answer to who the best president of the

last 25 years was. but first, we wanted ded to know why jump in now? take a look. >> it's official. >> you're doing it. >> you are doing it. >> why did you decide to do it this year when you passed all the other years? >> i looked at it but not seriously. mitt romney let a lot of people down last time. he was supposed to do better and he disappeared. he choked. something happened to him at the end last time. the country is in trouble. we have a big fat bubble. we have artificially induced low interest rates, a stock market that benefitted me but we're in a bubble like you have never seen before. >> explain. >> probably 20% unemployment, not 5.6%. i think the country is doing terribly. we're ripped off by every country, including china, including mexico. >> you're talking about this bubble. what bubble? >> we're in an economic financial bubble in my opinion. it's got to be fixed fast.

we're at $18 trillion going to the $20 trillion mark quickly. we'll see what happens, but i predict bad things. without proper leadership i predict bad things happening economically. you probably have a 20% unemployment rate. you have interest rates, i borrow money like i'm buying the old post office that's nothing, free money. that's bad, not good. you know who gets hurt? the people who saved their money, for 30 years, saved their money. now they go to the bank, they're kweting getting a quarter of 1% on their savings. those are the people the middle class in this country has been wiped out. >> what policyies would you put in place, change would you make to try to lift up the middle class in ways that have not been accomplished before. >> the biggest thing is new trade agreements. china is killing us mexico is killing us japan is killing us. everybody is beating us.

we have incompetent people negotiating trade. we're losing money at every single step. we don't make good deals anymore. >> give us an example. >> i go out to speak, and i think mark will tell you, although he's only about 70% there. i think he'll say i get the biggest crowds, the biggest ovations. i'm getting very good poll numbers and nobody until yesterday thought i was running. it's funny. >> give us an example of how, because a lot of people believe that right now, especially while we're negotiating the latest trade deal that the united states is always outnegotiated on trade deals. >> china and all of these people mexico is the new china, by the way mexico is unbelievable what they're doing with cars and industry. they're taking our business like we're a bunch of babies. we don't have our best and our brightest negotiating for us. we have a bunch of losers a bunch of political hacks. we have diplomats, and china puts people -- hey, look. i know the smartest guys on wall

street. i know our best negotiators. i know the overrated guys the underrated guys the guys that nobody heard of that are killersering that are great. we can use those people. we're using people -- >> who would be a guy? your secretary of treasury? >> let me give you an example. caroline kennedy, i have seen 60 minutes. she says to the white house, i would love a job. would you love to be ambassador to japan? really, wow. she's like a negotiator for us in japan. it's ridiculous. japan is doing a number on us with the yen. they just valued the yen again. >> again, specifically give us a name on wall street you might consider as a secretary of treasury a tough negotiator. >> i like guys like jack welch, like henry kravitz. carl icon. we have people that are great. we have people that are better than any of their negotiators. we don't use them, joe. we use people that are soft and weak and frankly stupid and

incompetent. >> what's your position on the issue of whether or not to raise the minimum wage? >> i would say leave the minimum wage. that's not the problem, mika whether somebody is getting -- >> people can't live on what they're being paid. >> the problem is we have to get jobs in the country. the jobs are being taken by mexico and china. the jobs are being taken by india. you call up american express, and you talk to somebody on the phone, they have an accent. you say where are you from? we're talking to them in india. and i say, we can't do that ourselves? we have to bring back jobs. >> don't you think wages are a part of that issue, and okay obviously, you don't agree with raising the minimum wage but do you agree that stagnating wages are a huge part of the jobs crisis in this country, and if so, what would you do to fix that? >> gross domestic product for the first quarter. went below zero. that's unheard of. it's unheard of.

where do you see going below zero? in china, it goes up 8% 9%. ibd yeah you look at these countries, look at japan now. by the way japan is bagck, big league. they just devalued the yen. people are buying komatsu trailers. we have a president who is incom incompetent, doesn't know what he's doing. >> two things. you're smart enough to know that words -- >> what do you mean smart enough? >> you're smard enough to know that words are weapons. >> i went to the wharton school of financial. i have to say that. but go ahead. >> words are weapons. you have to have some form of collegiality if you're president of the united states. >> i get along with everybody. i get along with the chinese. by the way people think i don't like china. i love china. i sold an apartment for $55 million to a chinese gentleman.

the largest bank in the world from china, citi is like i asked them like a small subsidiary, they told me. the largest bank in the world is a tenant of mine in trump tower. i own the bank of america building, big deal. i own the bank of america building in san francisco. i deal with china. i have a great relationship with china. business week magazine has an article, what do the chinese most want? one of the ten things anything trump. china cannot believe they're getting away with what they're getting away with. >> what would you do with the tax code? >> at a minimum, simplify it. too complicated. i spend millions of dollars a year for lawyers and accountants to do my taxes. they do a great job, and somebody said, do you pay a lot? i said i pay as little as possible. frankly, i was sort of getting a kick out of watching poor romney last time. he choked so badly. joe, he choked.

that should have been won. that should have been so easy. he said oh, well i pay 16 but it could be 18. everybody wants to pay as little as possible. including warren buffett, by the way, despite what he says. and so they said what's your tax rate. i don't know i pay as little as possible. because i'm an honest guy. i say it like it is. you have to simplify the tax code at a minimum. you could go to the fair tax, the flat tax, a lot of things you could go to but at a minimum, you have to simplify the tax code. >> we had four presidents since president reagan. which one was the best and why? >> well you know if you're asking me about the different presidents, first of all, i'm a reagan fan. i was a very good friend of reagan. i was a young guy, he was an older guy, but i was a friend. >> i'm talking about the four presidents after. >> i have had relationships with -- i can tell you who is our worst president. >> i know what you're going to say for that but of the four who is the best.

>> who am i going to say? >> i would guess you would say bush. bush 43. >> i'm not a fan of bush and a lot of people are surprised, but he got us into iraq. if you look reuters in '04, i said don't go into iraq. you're going to destabilize the middle east. and the worst elements are going to take over the oil. that's what happened. >> okay so of the four who is the best? bush 41 clinton, bush 43 or obama, and why? >> i would really say clinton, probably. i would have to say clinton. >> and why? >> there was a little spirit. frankly, he would have been had he not met monica had he not met paula, had he not met various and sundry semibeautiful women, he would have had a much better deal going. do you agree with that joe? he would have had a -- seriously. he was destroyed by that.

he was really hurt badly by it but it's amazing. look at the e-mail situation. anybody else she would have been brought down. i know how strong you are on that subject. anybody else can you imagine if a republican deleted all of their e-mails after getting a subpoena. they would be in jail right now. with her, it's like i don't even hear them talking about it anymore. so i have to hand it to clinton. her, to a lesser extent, but now maybe more. >> ahead, trump's rare personal insights into raising his family. what he had to say about marco rubio's hair -- >> what? >> -- too. marco rubio's hair? >> that's straight ahead. you're watching "morning joe." are you kidding me? no, it's only 15 calories. with reddi wip fruit never sounded more delicious with 15 calories per serving and real cream the sound of reddi wip is the sound of joy. ♪ mamas, don't let your babies grow up to be cowboys ♪ ♪ don't let'em pick guitars and drive them old trucks

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we asked the presidential candidate to reflect on his three simple rules for raising children. they're good ones. first, he shared his rough assessments of his republican opponents. >> before you get to hillary, you have to go through the republican field. is jeb bush conservative enough to be president? >> i hear you talking about jeb bush, and except i know you're a very honest guy. i would have said you're on his pay roll. i say what is he talking about? he couldn't answer a simple question on iraq is iraq good or bad, the war? we spend $2 trillion thousands of lives lost, wounded warriors all over the place who i help and love, and we have nothing. yesterday, iraq went to iran meeting. they're doing to merge. exactly what i said in the reuters article. you ask him, it took four days for an answer. i think you're wrong on him. i think bush is a nice man. i call him, he's a man that doesn't want to be doing what he's doing.

i call him the reluctant warrior, and warrior is probably not a good word. but i think bush is an unhappy person. i don't think he has any energy and i don't see how he can win. in addition to that he's in favor of common core. and he's weakening immigration. >> what about marco rubio? >> highly overrated. he lost me when he grabbed water when he was responding to obama's speech. he grabs the water. it wasn't in a glass or even a cup. see? it was a bottle of water with a label on it and i said what happened? i think he is highly overrated, and by the way, i have much better hair than he does. okay? >> better hair than rubio. >> i tugged on it once. he let me. >> tugged on it crazy. >> hairspray, but it is mine. >> we're going to go to mark for the next question. >> then i have a question. go ahead.

>> yesterday was a pretty big, your announcement day was a pretty big day. what was it like for you and your family to be declared a candidate. you spent a lot of time with them. >> it was exciting. i have gotten tremendous reviews on the speech. i had a few people -- i'm not a fan of krauthammer. i think he's a total dope. he's angry. he made a speech at mar logo and at the time i wasn't interested. it was a terrible speech george will, and i didn't show. i'm the one who got him there, i didn't want to go. i found him to be a boring person. it was like 12 years ago. i probably should have gone but you know i'm not a fan of those guy guys. generally speaking fantastic views. >> i'm trying to humanize you. your time with your family what was it like? you announce for president. did anyone cry? >> nobody cried. it wasn't -- it wasn't a dry eye in the house. >> nobody cried.

>> nobody cried. >> was there hugging? >> hugging, almost kissing. >> almost. >> that's not -- like somebody said donald you do really well on this stuff. you know i'm doing and i think you will say, considering nobody thought i was running, i think i'm doing quite well. they're all saying, oh, gee, he's taking the place of some senator who is a stiff. all thee people right? i built $9 billion worth of net worth. i own some of the greatest properties in the entire world, mortgage free for the most part low debt. i do a show on nbc "apprentice" was one of their hugest shows, still a big show and they renewed it. i can't do it. i do a book called "the art of the deal" probably the number one best selling book of all sometime. i went to the wharton school of finance, a good student at the hardest school to get into it. and then they say, he's not

qualified. and they take some dope who becomes a senator, who doesn't have -- who's nothing, and he's qualified to be on the stage, but trump isn't qualified. give me a break. >> what do you think is behind that? >> i don't want to say it because that would sound conceited. >> please, go ahead. >> why would i do that? i don't want to be that way. my family is behind me 100%. the reason i sort of want to laugh at the question a little bit, and i think it's a great question and i have a great family and a great wife. she's beautiful and my kids are beautiful, and ivanka did an unbelievable job. they had 37 live feeds. they had cameras, that place was mobbed yesterday. you know it. more cameras than to any other presidential announcement by a factor of three or four. >> not by a factor or three of four. >> come on. >> there were as many cameras at the bush announcement on monday. there were.

you didn't have many more. how do you know how many cameras were there. >> because the people who do it told me. but here's the point. the point is very simple. somebody said to me yesterday, mr. trump, do you think you have the personality? you're not a nice person. do you think you have the personality to win? i said, actually i am a nice person. i have great relationships, great friendships, great everything. i am. it doesn't matter because this is going to be an election in my opinion, that's based on competence. because people are tired of being patsies for china, for mexico et cetera. >> all right, so mark you tried to humanize him. >> you tried. >> didn't work. so for people who don't like you from a distance, and there are many -- >> and you don't know what that feels like. >> and many people who do. >> but let me finish. it's building up to something here. >> it sounds good. >> then they meet your children.

and they do a 180. and they will all say, all across new york i know you have heard it too. they say, you know what? he gets on tv and he's like a blow hard and he's this and that, and then you meet his children, who are humble and kind and sweet. >> and accomplished. >> and giving and accomplished and they're working with their dad hard around the clock. then they knowgo, i don't know what he's got but he's got something because he's a hell of a father. talk about that. talk about, i mean that must be at the end of the day, you talk about a lot of different things. but at the end of the day, your two greatest accomplishments, with the help of their mother as you always say, are your children. >> smart children good children. i'll give you an example. yesterday, ivanka got up and in front of a tremendous throng of reporters and cameras and killers, some good some bad, mostly good really good

response. i said, would you do me a favor? would you introduce me a couple weeks ago. she said daddy, i would love to do it. ivanka went to wharton, a phenomenal student. she was a successful model and she gave it up cold turkey. she's a phenomenal student and does great. a great kid. she got up in front of that throng yesterday which was crazy, and she delivered the most beautiful five-minute talk on her father. it was great to watch it. it was really great. and i said there aren't many young women her age that could even think about doing that. i was very proud of her because that was not easy to get up and do it. she did it flawlessly. no stuttering there was no mistakes. other than the good things she said about me of course. she said great things about me. but she's terrific. i have terrific children. and they're doing very well in the business. and i'm lucky. i'm very lucky. i was tough with them. >> i was going to ask you, how did you keep them balanced?

unfortunately, we have seen these documentaries of kids of billionaires and they end up on drugs and end up in rehab, and they end up a lot of them dead and they end up lost and wandering around for the rest of their lives. what did you do? >> i always tell me children i drive them crazy. you know drugs, no alcohol, no cigarettes, before they could speak. like when they're 2. i take ivanka don, eric now barren, doing really nicely a good boy. tall and just turned 9. he's 5'5" just turned 9. i hope he's not 7 feet. he's a beautiful kid, good kid. i tell them no drugs, no alcohol, no cigarettes. usually say no tattoos, too. if you look at society, i think we have given up on that right? i say no drugs, no alcohol, no cigarettes. and i remember ivanka she said dad, you're driving me crazy. and she didn't even know what

drugs and alcohol was. and from a time because i have seen joe, friends of mine that are very successful people and they have kids that are very smart kids. they go to harvard, wharton, stanford, they get on drugs and alcohol. they're wiped out. >> no alcohol ever not a glass of wine? >> i own the largest winery on the east coast, in virginia. i bought it. bought it at a bankruptcy good deal. i make good deals. they were in for $178 million. >> anyway. back to your point. >> but the point is i just think -- first of all, you know you're born smart, born not smart. >> finish that story. what were you going to say about alcohol? >> i have seen people that have very smart children. when they go bad on drugs or alcohol, and i add cigarettes in there. when they go bad, these kids are wiped out. doesn't matter how smart. the world is so competitive that you can't lose that extra percentage. and i've seen children that were

really really brilliant kids top students top scores in tests. they get into drugs, so i really think that the drugs, you've got to stop them. one of the things, because a lot of people sigh how did you do so well with your children? how it is possible? and i do get a lot of credit from my children. they're very good children. who knows, but they're great children. but i really have been -- >> he sounds like a dad there. who knows? >> every time you say something good about your kids you knock on wood. then i cross myself. >> you get a phone call and you say oops. >> exactly. >> by the way, we all get that phone call. up next the conclusion of our interview with donald trump, where he tells us whether or not he can do the apprentice from the oval office. keep it right here on "morning joe."

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welcome back to the conclusion of our wide ranging interview with donald trump. >> this is like epic. it's kind of like north and south. miniseries back in the '80s. >> kind of fascinating. where he told us what kind of

vacations he would take as president, and what's going to happen to "the apprentice." >> donald let me ask you, following you, listening to you, can be xauszing because you do it from one topic to another, and you know high speed. do you ever stop and just reflect on things? and what do you reflect on if you do stop and slow down upstairs? >> i love what i do. and you can see that. but i love what i do. i'm having fun doing it. now i'm doing this. i gave up a lot to do this. i'm not -- you know these politicians, they run, they lose, they win. they just run. that's what they do. i give up a lot. i give up hundreds of millions of dollars of deals. i give up a major television show. it's not like a normal thing. you've got to love what you do. i like it so much i don't really need a lot of down time. but when i have down time and when i have down time i have the greatest resorts in the world. i go to scotland, i only go to my places because they're better. but i do have down time.

joe knows i have down time mika knows. >> so "the apprentice" is not going to happen? >> it's been renewed. nbc loves donald trump, at least that part. we had a very good season. and a very successful season. so they called me. i hate that i'm doing this they hate it. and i said well use somebody else. they don't want to use somebody else because we had 15 copies of the aprentds. every one of them failed. so many copies, 15, everyone failed. i said what about ivanka? i think she would be great. but they said no no, they renewed eded "the apprentice." mark burnett said you're the only guy i have ever seen who didn't take a big renewal. i'm not doing it because i'm doing this. will they wait can they wait? we'll see what happens. i want to do well. but i'm not a masochist. i have always heard than a very successful person cannot run for

a political office. i always tord that. maybe it's true. >> strategic advice for you. do not call people losers. say they have lack of command on the issues something like that okay? >> that takes too long. >> could you do "the apprentice" as president? >> you're not allowed to do it because of the equal time rule. >> what about as president? >> honestly as president, i wouldn't be thinking about "apprentice." if i win i will make the country great again, and believe me, there won't be time to go on vacations. there won't be time to go golfing all the time. i mean obama plays more golf than professional players in the pga tour. tiger should play as much as obama. he'd be doing much better. >> all right, donald trump, good to have you in. good to see you again. thank you very much. congratulations on officially jumping in this time. this is it. >> we'll be right back with much more "morning joe."

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this tragedy that we're addressing right now is undescribable. no one in this community will ever forget this night. and as a result of that and because of the pain and because of the hurt that this individual has caused this community, this

entire community, the law enforcement agencies that are working on this are committed and we will catch this individual. >> that was charleston's police chief earlier this morning on the manhunt for the suspect accused of killing nine people. this just in. the justice department says it is now opening a hate crime investigation into the shooting. here's what we know right now. the massacre occurred in a bible study at mother emanuel ame church, an historic african-american congregation. six women and three men are dead. this is the man police are trying to track down. early 20s, 5'9" with blond hair. police said he was in the bible session for nearly an hour before he beginning his shooting rampage. this is the car the public is urged to look out for. officials say the suspect is extremely dangerous. one of the victims was pastor and state senator clementa pinckney. his cousin is describing a

horrifying scene that was described to her inside the church. >> she said that he had reloaded five different times. and her son was trying to talk him out of doing that killing people. and he just said i have to do it. he said you rape our women. and you are taking over our country. and you have to go. at the conclusion of the bible study, from what i understand they just started hearing loud noises ringing out. and he had already wounded, the suspect had already wounded a couple of individuals, including my cousin reverend clementa pinckney. >> and right now, a black cloth

is covering pinckney's seat in the senate chamber. that does it for this morning's edition of "morning joe." "the rundown" picks up right now. good morning. i'm jose diaz-balart. let's get out to breaking news at the top of "the rundown." a massive manhunt in charleston south carolina for misman who opened fire on a prayer meeting on a historic black church. and the department of justice is opening up a hate crime investigation. nine people are dead. three men, six women. one victim identified as the pastor of emanuel ame church clementa pinckney who was also a state senator. this is the suspect. a church surveillance camera captured these images of the shooter walking into the church. investigators have also released photos of the suspect's vehicle in the hopes someone will provide police with a critical tip. >> this is a very dangerous individual. he should not be approached by anyone. call law enforcement if you recognize the ind