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tv   Hardball With Chris Matthews  MSNBC  July 23, 2015 11:00pm-12:01am PDT

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cover it. without that we don't cover it. whether paul sticks to so the debate we'll see. >> we will see. >> we will see. i'm not holding out hope. thank you. that is all in for this evening. right now time for rachel. stopped at the border. let's play "hard ball" >> good evening. our guest tonight is texas senator ted cruz, candidate for president. we all know that donald trump dominated the tv screen today traveling to the mexican border. his mission was to speak with the u.s. border guards but he learn they were not to make the rendezvous. here's the back and forth. in an interview yesterday, trump said the border patrol invited him because they want to honor me. thousands and thousands of them.
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hours before his scheduled visit, the local border patrol union was forced to ditch trump saying, just to be clear, an endorsement was never declared. trump addressed the conflict in two press conferences at the border. let's watch. >> they're the ones that invited me. they wanted to give me an award. the border patrol is petrified of saying what happened. >> the border patrol invited me and they canceled. because frankly they don't want to get involved. so they invited me and at the last moment i mean we were virtually in the air and they said, we can't get involved. i heard they got those orders from washington. >> senator cruz, thank you for coming on. i want to ask you a bigger picture than the little kerfuffle at the border which could have been anything, whatever it was. there wasn't anything. what has donald trump got hold of here? the biggest possible picture, i don't think it is just
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immigration. what is it that is grabbing the emotions, the thoughts, whatever, the fears of the republican voter who is talking to these pollsters? >> listen, i like donald trump. i appreciate that he's focusing on illegal immigration. it is an issue i've been very concerned about for a long time. i think people are very concerned about the problems of for example sanctuary cities. and people are finally turning their attention to it. just this week we had a number of the family members of people who have been murdered by illegal aliens with criminal convictions, the obama administration has released. i had an exchange with the head of immigration enforcement under the obama administration where i asked her why the obama administration in 2013 released 104,000 illegal imaliens with criminal convictions, including 198 murderers, 400 people viced of sexual assault, 16,000 drunk drivers. she couldn't give an answer.
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i think people are concerned that they have serious allegations and here illegally. >> are you against local cities like new york city with giuliani where they didn't turn in everybody every time there is a police incident? how strong would you be in terms of turning people in to i.c.e.? >> look, sanctuary cities are wrong. the city of san francisco, we've seen the murder of kate steinle on the pier, shot and murdered. san francisco is a city that proudly calls itself a sanctuary city. with the case of the illegal immigrant and career criminal who murdered kate steinle, the federal government put in a request when he is released they would be notified so he could be deported and the city of san francisco refused to honor that detainer defied federal law and kate steinle is dead because of it. and i've joined with a number of
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senators to provide that federal funds will not be provided to cities and local jurisdictions that defy, that actively frustrate federal law. and that in effect release violent criminals to endanger the safety and security of men and women across this country. >> when somebody is arrested in a locale like san francisco or new york, if they're arrested and they find out that they're not here legally, should they be turned over to the immigration authorities? >> i think we should enforce federal immigration laws. i think we should not have local officials >> so cities should turn them over. >> i think we should comply with the law. it is an amazing thing that people treat it as unusual that we should follow law. when i asked the head of immigration enforcement, why did the obama administration release 104,000 criminals. people with separate criminal convictions who were here illegally. she couldn't answer me. i asked the question. how many murderers did the obama administration release yesterday? she said i don't know.
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that ought to trouble anybody. anybody with children who doesn't want murderers on the streets. >> i think we should talk to rudolph giuliani about this. the. i think they're afraid, if you turn everybody you deal with over to ice, you won't get any. >> i would suggest the very simple principle we should enforce the law and keep violent criminals off the streets. so 2013 16,000 people with drunk driving convictions. imagine if your loved one, if someone in your family was killed by a drunk driver that the federal government had in custody who was here illegally and they simply released that drunk driver at the hearing in the senate we heard testimony from a man whose brother was killed by a drunk driver who had been released by the government. it doesn't make sense. >> you are covering the
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immigration issue heavily in the area of crime. do you think it is fair to say when you talk about immigration to go to crime levels in big cities? do you think they are related that closely? >> i'm focusing very directly on illegal aliens with criminal convictions. when the obama administration releases 104,000 illegal aliens all of whom had a separate criminal conviction, yes there is a direct connection there. when you release 193 illegal aliens with homicide convictions, yes, there's a direct connection. >> i agree with that of course. let's go to the latest polling. look at the "washington post" abc poll. donald trump is up there and many others are down. he is up 20 points since may, while rand paul is down five you are down four rubio and santorum down three. remember the law from economics, bad money drives good money out of circulation. what's it feel like to be driven out of circulation? everyone else is pushed down while trump goes up is that god
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for the republican party? >> what we are seeing on the ground is enormous support and enthusiasm from the grassroots. everyone filed fund-raising records out of 16 republican candidates, you know who raised the most of the entire field, we did. we raised 14.3 million. we beat jeb bush in second place with 11.3 million. what's amazing, chris, that came from 175,000 contributions in all 50 states all five territories. the average crickontribution was $81. i will tell you why. people are looking for someone who will stand up to the washington cartel. the reason is we're fighting over the export-import bank an example of corporate welfare. chris, your party, the democrats who uses a lot of rhetoric about opposing big business and big money, the democrats virtually all of them are supporting this
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cronyism and corporate welfare. the one standing up strong is bernie sanders. this is an issue where bernie and i are in complete agreement. we need to end the corporate welfare. far too much democrats and republicans are supporting hundreds of billions of dollars of loan guarantees to giant corporations at the expense of the taxpayers. i think people are fed up with that. they want someone who will stand with the working man and woman, against the bipart ann corruption of washington. >> is that a strategy on the right to build up bernie sanders? >> i've said for a long time, i like and almost bernie sanders. >> you're building him up. you took an opportunity. what is the strategy to build up bernie sanders from the right wing perspective? >> chris, chris, i respect honesty in politics. bernie admits he's a socialist. >> he is a socialist. you admit you are a tea party guy.
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it is a fact. that's not an admission. >> the difference is i think there are an awful lot of democrats in the united states senate whose policies are every bit as liberal or socialist but they don't admit it. i'm enjoying watching hillary clinton explain to the voters explain how she is as much of a socialist as bernie sanders. >> that would be a mistake and you know it and that's why you are saying it. if she goes out there and matches bernie lead her around, she'll end up looking and sound know like him. >> let me ask you a question. we were talking about the export import bank. the reason i folksed on bernie sanders is he is one of the few to stand against it. let me point out another democrat who had the courage to stand against it. then senator barack obama. he said the export/import bank is a classic example of it. now they get contributions from big lobbyists in washington.
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mao he now is the for corporate welfare. bernie is honest about this. i wish the career politicians. >> you are building him up. so enthusiastic. i know what you are up to. it is called trouble making. let me ask about your party. top ten, you're watching this debate. some are in, some are you'd. what happens if they choose john kasich for the ticket and you have two centrist tickets at the top. isn't that going to drive the tea party crazy? that you've been cut out. >> let me be clear. >> no one in their right mind would describe hillary clinton and sherrod brown as a centrist ticket. hillary and sherrod would win because you turn out the far left base and the conservatives would stay at home. >> you are beating the drum for bernie sanders and sherrod brown tonight.
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this is your game. i know you are trying to get hillary out of position. i'm asking are you in a position to decide between a third party candidate of the tea party people if you have to take on beb jeb bush in a general election because you are stuck outside of the contest. if you get jeb bush in there you can't vote for bush. >> i will be unequivocal. i'm not a third party guy. i'm running in the republican party. i will support the republican nominee, but if we nominate another candidate in the mold of a bob dole john mccain or mitt romney, all are honorable men but what they did didn't work. if we do it again the same conservatives that stayed home will stay home in 2016. >> to tie up that thought, is jeb bush in that mold? >> i'm going to let him speak for himself and the republican primary voters answer that. i agree with reagan the way we win is paint in bold colors not pale pastels.
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i will tell you something that will worry you, chris, as i travel the country men and women stop me and say i'm a democrat but you are fighting for me and i'm with you that's something that has to terrify the heck out of a lot of democrats. we saw in the this last 0 years with one republican has a group of democrats named after him, reagan democrats. when you paint in bold colors you build a broad coalition. >> you are a bernie sanders republican from what i have heard. i understand the strategy you are up. to senator ted cruz teejic tonight. coming up donald trump's run to the border comes as he makes the biggest threat about running third party. he said if he is not treated well by the republican party he may run an independent. that would lead to an easy win for hillary clinton the polls say. the hot question for president obama will enough support the nuclear deal with iran. and the political odd couple the 2016 election a
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contest that could pit one ex-president's wife against the other's brother and donald trump's ability on offense, hillary clinton on defense. she can take a punch. can he? this is "hard ball," a place for politics. hello, everybody. i'm betty nguyen with breaking news. three are dead and nine injured follow ing a shooting at a movie theater on thursday night. police and investigators are at the theater right now. they located the gunman's vehicle and are looking for suspicious items inside. meanwhile, we know the shooter who died from a self inflicted gunshot wound has been identified as a 58-year-old white male. an eyewitness in the building spoke to us a short time ago. >> whenever we came out the back we weren't sure what the evacuation was for and once we got to the front all the cops had the building surrounded and
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the shooter was inside. pushed everybody behind the barricades. >> witnesses describe hearing about six shots during the screening of the film "trainwreck." the victims were taken to three hospitals with conditions ranging from nonlife-threatening to critical. and ladders. sfx: [screams] they have all those warnings on 'em. might as well say... 'you're gonna die, jeff.' you hired someone to clean the gutters. not just someone. angie's list helped me find a highly rated service provider to do the work at a fair price. ♪ everyone can shop, but members get more with reviews, live customer support, and better pricing. come see what the new angie's list can do for you.
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in texas today donald trump got no though a heated confrontation over his comments about mexicans.
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here's what happened. >> many feel that what you said when you said they people across the border are rapists and murderers. >> no, we're talking about illegal immigration. everybody understands it. you know what that is a typical -- wait that's a typical case of the press with misinterpretation. [ cheers and applause ] they take a half sentence by the way, they take a half sentence and a quarter sentence and put it all together. typical thing. telemundo should be ashamed. i want to thank you -- no you are finished. you have obviously been [ cheers and applause ] . >> for reaction to that i am joined by michael steel, john walsh of salon and paul sipger of "usa today." you have sot thoughts. you thought there was misquoted numbers by senator cruz.
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>> i admire him for sticking to his script but the numbers, the obama administration did not release those people. half were released by judges. we also have a situation where immigration combines illegal and legal immigrants. so you talk about criminal aliens. they are not all subject to deportation. it is a complicated situation and he has come up with a scary number. >> why there is there a perception that illegal immigrants have a lot of criminals in their ranks. i have heard the story -- talk about generalities but when they get across the board er they go to work, hardest workers in the country. >> the at least likely to commit crimes, they are. >> you start with an illegal immigrant that have broken the law already. >> by definition. >> it is easy to say, all of thel these criminals. >> why the perception he's been able to pomle gate in that interview. >> cruz jumped on it, trump is
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selling it. >> it is fear combined with about antidotal information like if san francisco that get blown up and in to a larger narrative. a lot feeds in it to. to joan's point. when you break down the numbers you see where it falls. . the generic conversation that americans have and the perception is what ted cruz is talking about and what donald trump is talking about in the area of immigration. >> i'm not going to say most americans. >> >> let's talk about the perception and the disquiet on the right, largely on the right or somewhere close to the right. i believe in polls. i don't buy the fact if you don't like results you throw them out. we used to say in politics pay attention. don't act on pulse don't act like it didn't happen. why is trump bouncing other
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candidates and now in a position he doesn't like he way he is treating mean he doesn't win he goes third party. if you have two establishmented candidates, hillary clinton and say jeb bush. the tea party right will say that's what we hate. they are going to find a candidate if it is not trump but he has the money to do it. >> i would be stunned if donald trump runs as a third party independent. >> why? >> it will be an mor mouse original fete to get it done. you can buy it but you have to manage it. all 50 states have different ballot rules. >> you don't think he is a good manager. >> it is a pain in the neck and requires too much policy. >> interview at the hill today trump was asked whether he would run as a third party candidate and his answer was a shot across, quote, so many people me to. if i don't win. i'll have to see how i am treated by the republicans if they are not fair that would be a factor." if trump decides to wage an
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independent bid for the white house. according to the latest poll trump would get 20% of the vote in a hypothetical three-way matchup. clinton would win with 46. a healthy third and bush down to 30. joan. this is great news. it's so weird how each party trying to be ta teejic ted cruz pushing up bernie. come on. >> if hillary agrees with him on anything he is leading the band i'm enjoying donald trump. i'll admit it because it shows the right wing really crazy. >> absolutely. which we know that. my question is when you look at him there and he is so upset who's he talking about? the republicans are michael steel, jeb bush too many republicans criticize him. >> throw kisses. by the way jeb bush is throwing
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kisses. his future running mate john kasich said he will make sure he gets a call out. what is it the buddy system. >> they want to make the landscape as nonvolatile as possible between now and the first debate. they want to bring rhetoric and noise down. i do not think that you'll see a third party candidacy emerge here. >> if jeb runs they will let it go. >> at the end of the day, conservatives are the ones that will control the outcome of the primary process. if they want ted cruz rand paul, they have to muster up the ballots to get it done. you can't sit back and do as a you have done in the past three presidential cycles. >> third party candidate? no. >> maybe. you want me to say yes, but maybe. >> it will be a libertarian candidate. and a constitution party candidate who the conservatives will -- >> donald trump will the right winger run third party. >> i believe he will not but
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dangle it out there as long as he can. >> i think he is crazy not to run. the opportunity to sit with three people up on the national stage including hillary clinton worldwide sebly and republican party nominee and be in a three-seat situation three times is brand. >> he is pay to get in. >> all show shown in the numbers what the outcome would be. >> the idea the tea party is going to get together they are not. they are splitting the vote. >> he might be within striking distance of the big one. thank you. coming up can president obama rally his party to support him on the iranian nuclear deal? i think so but i will ask a top democrat who is coming here next. this is "hardball," the place for politics. why pause to take a pill? and why stop what you're doing to find a bathroom? with cialis for daily use, you don't have to plan around either. it's the only daily tablet approved to treat erectile dysfunction so you can be ready anytime the moment is right.
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if this deal is rejected we return immediately this to this reality, except the diplomate ic
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support we have built with all of these other countries that we have accumulated would disappear overnight. let me underscore the alternative to the deal that we have reached is not what i've seen some ads on tv suggesting disingenuously it isn't a quote better deal. some sort of unicorn arrangement involving iran's complete capitulation. that is a fant sassyasy. plain and simple. >> welcome back. that is secretary of state john kerry making the case for the nuclear deal with iran there at the senate foreign relations chit tee hearing today. he faced hostile questions from republicans on the committee who accused him of making a bad deal. >> this deal is fundamentally and irreparably flawed. i believe it weakens our security and makes the world a dangerous place. throughout this process, this administration, in my opinion, has repeatedly da pitchcapitulated
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on important items. >> not unlike a hotel guest that leaves with a bathrobe on its back, i believe you have been fleeced. >> anyone who believes this is a good deal joins the ranks of the most naive people on the face of the earth. with all due respect you have been bamboozled. >> that hostility translate to a congressional reaex jexjection of the deal. also joining us steve clemens for the atlantic and msnbc supporter. it seems like the republicans were trying to out do themselves in terms of met force and interesting language there. i don't know what it means to leave a hotel with a bathrobe. that's the strangest one i have heard. they are getting to the point where they seem to talk to the other side of the other part of the world in iran trying to talk them out of a deal they have already made. i don't see why they are saying the minute we get in,
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republicans get in we will erase the whole thing. why would they do that as a tactic at this point. >> i don't understand. we're in day four of a 60-day review and as you can see many members have made their decision on this agreement. as secretary kerry said there are two parts. first we have to understand the agreement and determine whether it is worthy of support. the other issue that secretary kerry raises and each has to take seriously is what is the consequences if we don't go along with this? what are our options if we are isolated from the international community? >> what are they saying on the other side if we go back to the bargaining table and get a tougher deal? that seems what netanyahu is saying. they all seem to be saying we can get a better deal. >> well with, that question has not been answered. yes, it's always possible because of u.s. sanctions iran will feel like it needs to negotiate but would they
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negotiate with a president that showed he could not get it approved by congress with one agreement i think it is hard to see how iran negotiates with all members of congress. i have not made my decision on the merits of this agreement but i recognize it would be a challenge as to how we could go forward rejecting this agreement with international partners who look at us as being -- as splitting up this deal and with iran and its hard liners who would otherwise say, look we told you couldn't trust america. how can you negotiate now? i think it is challenging. >> republican senator and presidential candidate marco rubio said they should rip up the first day in office if they get elected. let's watch. >> this deal is your deal with iran. yours meaning this administration. and the next president is under no legal or moral obligation to live up to it. the iranian regime and the world
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should know the majority members of the congress do not support this deal and the deal could go away on the day that president obama leaves office. >> i'm confident that the next president of the united states will have enough common sense that if this is being applied properly if it is being implemented fully they are not going to arbitrarily end it. >> marco rubio is running for the most hawkish candidate on the republican side and backers so fiercely hawkish in that part of the world, i don't know what he is up to. this idea that a presidential candidate would undermine a negotiation still being put together internationally by saying it won't carry any influence in the next administration. >> it is absolutely unpresidential number one. number two, it assures on day one. say marco rubio becomes the next president of the united states it assures he has a global crisis of confidence in his leadership on day one and you have a possibility of decline in
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u.s. power because we will be walking away from the rest of the world. that's what this is doing. you have a unique moment of a 15-0 u.n. security council support for an interesting deal. he's saying -- you know barack obama when he came in didn't walk away from george bush and what dick cheney had done. a lot of it was continuous. a lot of people want to believe obama was different but presidents continue important policy and foreign policy positions their predecessor has taken and them next will as well. >> senator karnd, thank you for joining us. can you give us a sense of how it looks? i know to sustain a veto the president needs 137 votes. how does it look for him now? i don't know where you stand yet. >> frankly, i think most of the members of the democratic caucus are using this period to try to understand it before reaching a decision. i think there's a lot of undecided members at this time. clearly, though, we know a lot
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of republicans have expressed their view. the question that will be asked, what happens if we reject it? i think it is too early to make a prediction but i can tell you that when marco rubio makes his comments and undermines the president of the united states there's only one president at a time i don't think he is helping his cause. >> i wonder whether it is legal or diplomatically acceptable, yes or no, for somebody running for president who has a shot at the presidency basically writing foreign policy to undermine the current president who is the only president we have. >> they can do it as long as they are not in a foreign country. >> it was very similar to what senator cotton did in his letter signed by most of the members of the republican caucus when he told the supreme leader disregard what the president of the united states is doing. it is over the edge. it should have no place in american politics. >> i think people should remember when they observe the constitution and their oath of office all laws coming from that
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constitution, the lowgan act is one of those and you are not supposed to negotiate for the united states unless you are the united states government. up next the unlikely appliance between george w. we call him w here and bill clinton revealing details from the former presidents themselves how they are getting along the two-buddy system. you are watching "hardball." the place for politics.
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a gunman killed two and injured seven others. he took his life with a self inflict ed gunshot wound. we know the shooter was a 58-year-old white male. police believe he's a criminal his richl the victims injuries range from nonlife-threatening to critical. and range in age from the teens to late 60s.
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>> i know jeb and i'm confident secretary hillary will elevate the discourse. i can't attest to their surrogates. i can attest to this surrogate but i'm not going to be a surrogate. >> we got a lot of tough decisions to make. that's all i really care about besides i know who i'd like to win. but the more important thing for america is that we know what the heck we are deciding on and we make a pretty good decision. >> welcome back. those are familiar figures. form presidents bill clinton and george w. bush appearing together this month. the political odd couple sat down for a rare joint interview with "time" magazine to discuss how they will handle the 2016 contest that could pit hillary
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clinton against jeb bush. president clinton told "time" magazine i think most of my role will be giving advice if i'm asked for it and i try not to offer it at home unless i'm asked but she's been pretty good about asking every now and then. isn't that humble. president bush said i can't tell you who will win but i can tell you what is going to happen. there's a general pattern and will be a flash in the fans or the pans that will be this crisis and this funding thing and there will be all of these things that happen but eventually the person that can best lead their party will be nominated. time for the round table. cornell, you start. let me ask you. first of all this is a little chummy. you think the country in the midst of the revolt against the establishment is happy to see the ultimate establishment figures charming each other? do they like it or dislike it?
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>> i think what you see in the rise of trump is a really anti-establishment move. >> what is at the scene, revolt in that scene. >> no. i think the republican base in particular right now is very much revolting against their incumbents. they didn't go easily with mitt romney. now you have them fed -- >> are you getting my point? it is a particular point. if you don't like the bushes because you are anti-establishment, an you don't like the clintons might you dislike even more them sitting around having fun together? you are not going to come back on this, are you? >> no i'm not. >> he is holding back. >> i think people's heads will explode to see them on the cover of the magazine. that's one of the reasons we did it. in this anti-establishment moment here's are these guys. it is not an accident. >> they are running against this undisclosed revolt in those parties. bernie sander and donald trump and everybody on the wings
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saying we are tired of those players. >> clinton said people don't like divisive viemplts but frequently award them in elections. that in some ways is the best summation of the clinton political theory that divisiveness is difficult and unpleasant but often reward it if you are willing to walk toward it. the clintons are not afraid of it. >> they are seen as centrists. they don't want to hear that but they are political centrists. they are not lefties. >> compared to the extremes. both jeb and hillary are sentists and those two who used to be president -- >> these two insiders talking about how great it is to be insiders. >> putting back on my midwestern detroit hat here, i don't think that people believe it. they know the history of the father, george bush sr. and bill clinton. the history between clinton,
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bill clinton and george bush is more recent. i don't think it will take much to scratch that. >> they were like brothers from a different father or mother same father. any way, there was a time when hillary clinton said she'd never get in to politics. bill told "time" magazine hillary told him a long time ago i will never run for office i'm too aggressive and nobody will vote for me. cornell, is that the real hillary? it is very much self recognition that she can be aggressive as a politician. is she saying i'm not electable when they were dating. >> our politics awards aggressiveness. i work for a guy named senator obama who they thought he was too aggressive. but our policies award aggressiveness. trump is awarded because he is going out on those issues that the core of his party loves in a way that jeb bush and others are holding back on. >> will that work for a woman, heidi?
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>> she was right on at the time she made the comments. not only is it harder but especially as an aggressive woman. >> can they be as rough and ready as any other candidate. >> yobl i don't know if they have changed to be honest. look at her approach to the previous cycle to soften up to show her grandmotherly side to focus on her relationship with her mother. i don't know that things have changed, you know that much. she will have plenty of surrogates. >> nasty with her like rick lazio, served her with papers in that debate. he lost big. >> that is something republicans have to be conscious of. believe it or not the reason why george allen's campaign told me they could be a good candidate against hillary clinton because he was a southern gentleman. >> remember new hampshire, the primaries in new hampshire where it look like barack obama went too hard it backfired. i will say this. >> you say likable enough that wasn't likeable enough.
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w. talked about the scrutiny of thiz brother jeb which is likely to come telling "time" i'm sure there will be moments when somebody says or writes something about jeb that will sting. bush said i shouldn't say i'm used to it but the emotions i felt when our dad was criticized got me for a while. i think i will feel the same thing about jeb. it will be interesting to see how affected i become. that's an amazing admission that you hate when your relatives are hit. >> that is one thing that binds them together. they have a loved one in the race different being a spouse than sibling but bush talks about how he feels. >> missed one point. the attack will be on w. not on jeb and jeb will have to defend his brother who started the war that cost the lives of 200,000 people. >> as many attacks will be on hillary's husband. >> really? he is old news. how do you attack bill now? how do you go after him now. >> whose e-mail server was it?
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>> he is the most popular politician in american politics. i could see him, the likelihood of him used as a surrogate is higher than george bush used as a sur gachlt i could only see him raised as a fund-raise ing circuit. >> bill clinton comes and puts his big arms big paws over the edge of the leg turn and feels at home, he is at home. he's good. >> we seem like old people. a large swath of the majority electorate that elected barack obama last time they weren't around when bill clinton was president. >> how old are you? >> 41. >> stay in your box. up next bernie sanders is trying to pry the democratic nomination away from hillary clinton, good luck with that but can he do it with little support from the base african-americans and this is "hardball," a place for politics.
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there's movement in the united states senate currently occupied by pat toomey. the chief of staff to pennsylvania governor resigned today and is expected to challenge former congressman in the democratic primary. he ran for the senate in 2010 and was defeated by toomey. the state democratic establishment voiced concerns about him and we'll be right back.
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>> hold on hold on. >> it's okay with me. listen i spent 50 years of my life fighting for civil rights but if you don't want me to be here, that's okay. >> no sir. we want you to be here. >> i don't want to outscream people. >> no, no. >> we are back with the round table. that is vermont senator bernie sanders interrupted at the conference by young african-american activists in phoenix recently. he has gained traction in the democratic presidential race against hillary clinton. a poll puts support among african-american democrats at 2%. sander and his supporters point to his work on behalf of civil rights in the '60s but they say that's the past. he is giving another speech a few hours after the earlier confrontation out in phoenix. >> while we have overcome a lot of racism, we have come a long
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way, we still have a long way to go. [ applause ] >> any way, sanders represents one of the whitest states in the country. the census figures show there is 7500 african-americans in vermont. he has work to expapd his appeal to a diverse group of voters. it seems to me he is a socialist. therefore an ied log and everything comes down to economics. economic determine anymore and restructure our economy. he doesn't like to depart from that message. he doesn't want to get to ethnicity or race. >> there is a disconnect here. he has a wrong tone and culturally there is a big disconnect here. >> blacks don't have brooklyn accents? >> more than accent. i worked for howard dean who wasn't bad at connecting. this is what is happening at the base where you have these young minority voters typically african-american voters who see
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gay rights immigration rights and gender rights and there's all of these groups that have their rights pushing forward and in this country apparently we can't talk about group rights when it comes to african-americans. i think when obama is not in office or when obama steps back from politics i think you will see more pressure placed on these white politicians to say specifically what you are going to do for the african-american community. >> say mip my name. what's it mean? people in the back of me the room were saying that. >> that means black progressives feel shut out from the broader progressive movement. what you saw in that clip was an old kour mujingly white man saying get off my lawn instead of welcoming them in and saying let's talk about this new era of civil rights movement and how i can be your leader. i want to learn from you. he screwed it up. as you saw he is trying to make up for it.
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as we know in politics the first time foot in the mouth, that's the reel that is played over and over. he will spend a long time making up for it. >> we have a country that is increasingly diverse, especially on tv and you see it wherever you go but african-americans are losing their position. they were here before any of us. yet you see all of these people from south asia west africa even coming here freely and they are doing well. i wonder if there is a sense there was an historic wrong done to african-americans, that has to be righted. which means breaking up families, or killing work ethic, one way to kill a work ethic is to make somebody a slave. i'm not making a case for reparations but i understand why african-americans are saying don't forget the historic wrong donetous in particular. >> not to other people asians south asians, indians pan
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stanmystan stannies. also in the last year there's a huge am of stuff that hasn't been talked about in this campaign in the last year in the realm of criminal justice. >> is there an elitism in the bernie sanders campaign? >> i'm sorry. >> is there elitism in the bernie sanders campaign? >> give it to the progressive elites in washington and new york. it looks a lot more like older white guys than those young people. >> thank you. when we return, let me finish with trump's ability in offense. hillary's on defense. she can take a punch. can he? you are watching "hardball." a place for politics.
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let me finish with this. it is about trump. you have heard the expression a
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bull in a china shop. to fair phrase winston churchill, donald trump brings the china shop with him. he is leading in polls because he is getting the attention, pretty much all of it. why because he is smashing any name that pops up before him. what happens hen runs out of people to attack or they stop smashing back? will he be there in the polls? he seems to have the opposite problem hillary clinton faces. unlike trump who's at his best on the attack the recent secretary of state seems to be at her best when people are attacking her. she didn't look so great when she was beating barack obama in the polls in the 2008 race. when the going got rough in 2008, she found her voice she'd come across most appealing as a person and candidate. what is it we have here? we have a guy leading the republican polls because he is on attack. a woman strongly at the top of the democratic polls because i assume people see through the attacks on her and respect her
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for her life-long, positive commitments, personal commitments. this could get interesting if it gets that far. what if donald trump one day across the stage from hillary clinton who rises to the o tack? yes, it could, not just be interesting, but downright wonderful. wonderful. that's "hardball" for now, and thank you for being with us." all in with chris hayes" starts right now. we have continuing coverage of tonight's breaking news. here's what we know so far. three people dead nine injured in a sheeting in a theater in lafayette, indiana. one dead is the gunman who turned the gun on ies say the injuries are in local hospitals with injuries ranging from critical to nonlife threatens. the alleged shooter was a 58-year-old white man. that's all we know at this time. no victims have been identified, but earlier tonight, the governor said this was an awful night for