let's play "hardball." good evening. i'm chris matthews still out in los angeles. the party is over, the beer bottles are all over the living room, people are having a hard time getting their heads together. certainly not clear headed yet. and yet, i think something did happen last night, something valuable for the country. did you see the big air force one sitting behind the candidates last night? do you think it might have meant something to the millions actually watching it? especially those who care about how the country is going to be run? do you think people may have even subliminally realized we are picking the process for someone to fly in that plane, to decide the big questions of peace and war, to champion in an american economy, to look out the general welfare and make the mid of the tonight decisions that are never easy but very often crucial. i would like to think the site of air force one had at least a sorering effect on the laugh fest that served as the

republican nominating process, do you? jeb bush is holding a rally in las vegas, and we are awaiting donald trump in a town hall meeting of his own in rochester, new hampshire. howie jackson is at the trump event and joins us now. halle is this an attempt to get to those who cheer them and away from the expensive donors, 10 out of 11 of them all for the other candidates? >> right. not donald trump's crowd last night. a very different story here, chris, as folks are still filing in. we know donald trump is already inside this rec center here in rochester. they're looking at a crowd of about 3,000 people. when trump walked in, trump was mopped. we spoke to some of these potential supporters here, and some of them said some

interesting things. they said they wanted to see more specifics from trump, especially when it comes to foreign policy, when it comes to issues like gun control, national security. these are the topics they want to hear a little more substance on. but a lot of them also said they liked his style last night. they acknowledged that he appeared to have toned it down. but one woman said hey, every time he opens his mouth, he gets into trouble, so that's sort of a given when it comes to his candidacy for now. >> get the sense from him -- i it's always hard to get a sense from the advocates, the cheerleaders that they didn't think he had a good night last night. i didn't think he had a good night. >> here's one indication. we were inside before donald trump came in. they said raise your hand if you think donald trump kwon last night? i'll be honest, it wasn't a big roar. you wonder if that's maybe something where folks here are

saying hey, we want to see a little bit more substance and policy from our guy. >> i think we're going to have some kind of a speech coming out. it looks like he's going to talk right to his people. and here he is. i see his head moving over to the center there above the person waving that placard. i think he's going to try to make up for last night, rather than to climb on any victory stump. let's catch the -- well, what's going to happen here? this is a very magisterial entrance here. ♪ you're the best around >> he's wearing a -- what we used to call a power tie. this crowd here, did they have this planned before last night? i guess they did. >> yeah, they did. worth noting, too, chris, trump already said he won the debate.

he believes he's the guy that came out on top. >> here's donald trump i think trying to make up for last night. >> sit down, relax, we'll be here for a while. >> you know, i said today that we just got back, as you know, we came from mobile, alabama, two weeks ago. we had 31,000 people. 31,000! then we just left dallas where we were in the great mavericks, as you know, the mavericks building, the basketball team, a great team, a wonderful tea. and mark cuban was so nice. we know mark, right? good guy. what happened is he said what about using the arena i said how much do we have? how many seats do we have, he said 28,000 seats. they filled it up in two days. is that good?

i then flew from dallas, always making speeches. because we have to make our country great again, right? i then flew -- and this was sort of fun -- we flew to a very nice place, los angeles, right? and we went to the u.s.s. iowa and we were honored for a great vets group which gave me an endorsement. they endorsed me. the vets like me and i love the vets. we have a lot of vets here tonight. [ applause ] we have a lot of vets. but the vets on the u.s.s. iowa -- that is some ship, by the way. they don't build them like that anymore. but they endorsed me. and then i knew, as you know last night, we had a little thing called a debate at the reagan library. and it was -- it was sort of an amazing thing.

we had an incredible time. >> we love you, trump! >> thank you. thank you. that was some evening. now, i'll tell you the problem with evening. it did so well that cnn said, let's make it an hour longer. can you believe this? that debate was three hours. it felt like more than that. now why did they do that? for the young children here, because we have to teach them to be entrepreneurs, they did it because they wanted more revenue coming from the commercials, right? isn't that terrible? terrible. i think it's terrible. and the money should have gone to the vets, right? right? the money should have gone -- they made a lot of money. they made a lot of money. but in the end, it was an incredible time. we had an incredible time. and i got such great remarks. look at this. we just wrote this down. "time" magazine, they did votes as to who won the debate last

night, right? so "time" magazine, 114,000 votes as of 6:00 p.m. trump, 56 -- [ applause ] >> carly, fiorina, 19. rubio, 7, ben carson 4. the rest not doing too good. thej drudge, we love drudge, we love drudge. donald trump, 51%. we had a total of 668,000 voters cast. trump, 668,000. think of it. 51%. second, fiorina, much less. like much. then rubio, then cruz then, i'm not going to mention the next ones because i don't like them very much. then newsmack, way up ahead.

you like newsmax. i like it, too. donald trump, first place by a lot. the street, donald trump, 52%. that's a lot when you have all of these guys. that's a lot. you know, it's not against two people. it's not against two people. it's against -- 52%, first place. then you had slate. and that's also donald trump. we had a great time. you don't read that so much in television. coming out, boy, fox treated me shabbily. they treated me shabbily. but that's okay. cnn, a little bit better. they treated me a little bit better. but the end result is, people know what happened. it was an incredible time. and we are going to do something very special. there's a great movement going on. and it's a special movement. it's a movement where people want to see our country be great again. they want to see things happen. they want to see the right things happen.

they want everybody to get together, work, work. you know, the people of new hampshire, you love to work, don't you? don't you love to work? huh? and, you know, so i had a little news yesterday, because he's a great person and he's a great winner. i love winners. we love winner, right? so a great winner, tom brady. tom brady. right? incredible guy, totally champion. he endorsed me yesterday, right? he didn't even tell me about it. when you get tom he's a great champ. and we have some others, i won't mention them now, but we have so many people that are endorsing. coach ditka in chicago and people i don't even know are coming out in favor of trump

because them to see the right thing happen. when cnn did its poll recently, they had a couple of different categories. one was leadership. in leadership, i win like forget it, not even a contest. so much higher than everybody else, like two or three, i don't know. they had all these cameras going, they can tell you. but leadership, way through. the other thing is called the economy and jobs. the only thing is they didn't love my personality, can you believe it? so here's what happened. we went to dallas, went to mobile, alabama. we went to the iuu.s.s. iowa, making speeches all over the place. then we had the debate last night which was exciting.

how many cams are lit? yeah, there's a lot of them. every time i speak now it's on live television. you know why? if i didn't get ratings, those cameras would not be on. they would not be on. so when you ask a question, remember you're on live television. we're going to talk for just a couple of minutes. military, so strong, so great, so powerful. we'll probably say we never have to use it. who wants to use it? got to have it because right now, what's happening in the world, we need the military, we need the protection and we're going to have it if trump is elected president. that i can tell you. >> as part of that, because i consider it part, we're taking care of our vets, okay? the vets are going to be so

happy. they love me anyway. i'm just telling you, stand up. we're going to take scare of things. so many vets in new hampshire, they're not treated right. two weeks ago on wepz, they had the longest wait in a waiting room that anybody can remember. think of it, they would wait three days, four days, five days. not going to happen anymore, folks. not going to happen. >> we're going to come out with a plan. when you're going to have to wait that kind of time, you're going to go to private practice. you're going to go to private hospitals. we'll take care of costs. and believe me, it will beless expensive and you get much better service. but you're not going to be waiting in rooms in five, six,

seven days to take care of conditions that can be done immediately. it's not going to happen. it's not going to happen. >> the other thing i want to dwell on is -- and you've probably heard -- we're going to build a wall at the border we're going to build a wall. >> people are going to come into this country. they're going to come legally into our country. so when i announced as you know a couple of months -- can you believe it? i've been a politician for almost three months. can you believe this? iner thought in a million years i would be a politician. >> [ inaudible ]. >> i know, i know, but we're running this time and this time is going to be incredible.

and by the way, you look not just as the new hampshire i told you about, 40%, but you look at all the polls, it's absolutelien credible what we're doing. and what we're doing really together. how many politicians are in the room tonight? raise your hand. these are fabulous people. stand up. my guy he has been with me from the beginning, right? what? how about elected officials. how many elected officials, stand up. these are all fabulous people. we are going to do something, and when the wall gets built, i've been saying mexico is going to pay for it. i love the mexican people. i do business with mexico and mexican people and entrepreneurs. i have many, many people, hispanics working for me. many, many, many hispanics.

but you know what, the problem is whether it's china or japan or mexico, they're outsmarting our leaders and we're not going to let it happen anymore. i asked about a week ago. i want to know, what is the trade deficit? what sit with china it? 's almost $400 billion a year. we're talking about a year. we're losing almost $400 billion. that's almost china. in japan, it's close to $75 billion every year. and it's been pretty steady. it's going up. why wouldn't it? then we get to mexico. and you know with mexico, it's about $45 billion. it could be even more than that.

i see the people i'm competing against, the so-called candidates. some are very nice, by the way. you couldn't do that, why would mexico pay? they'll never pay. i say why wouldn't they pay? and just think of it, we send hundreds and hundreds of millions of dollars into mexico. you have a huge problem at the border where a tremendous cartel, the drug cartels pour in with drugs, pour out with money. they are coming in with hundreds of -- you have to see this, the numbers. they're staggering. get chipped all over the eyes, and then people say oh, the wall doesn't work. you ask israel whether or not the wall works. believe me, a wall properly works, a trump wall works. that i can tell you. these guy, they're politicians. they'll say, you can't get

mexico to pay for the wall, it will never work. i say why? why would they do it? because we're losing almost $50 billion. think of it, $50 billion a year on trade. they say it's going to cause 10 or 12. that's the people who never built anything. you'll do it for muchless. differences that will be bigger, better and stronger. people aren't going to home depot and buying a ladder. not this wall. and by the way, this wall is going to have a big, beautiful open gate. when people want to come into this country legally and they want to go through the process, we all welcome them. is that a correct statement? we welcome them.

when someone goes to harvard, number one in their class, stanford or the wharton school of finance or yale, they go back and go back to their country, we want to keep those people. we want to keep people of great talent. so we've got a plan in terms of illegal immigration, and remember this, when i first announced, and this was an incredible two weeks, believe me, rush limbaugh said i have never seen anybody receive more incoming -- a word i never hear before -- incoming means really bad press. -incoming. he said i've never seen something like it and then he doubled down. i doubled down and it's true. i knew the problem, i knew what was happening. and we have tremendous crime, whether it's kate in san

francisco, whether it's jameel in los angeles, whether it's the woman two weeks ago who was killed in california, a 66-year-old veteran who was raped and sodomized and killed, unbelievable. by illegal immigrant. it's not going to happen anymore, folks. it's not going to happen pe eel have a border. you have a lot of gang members who are illegal immigrants. you have a lot of these tough -- these are tough dudes. we're going to get them out of here so fast your head will spin, all right? your head will spin. so i'm really honored by the crowd and we're going to have some fun now. instead of making a speech, which i've been doing and over and over. i want to take questions. don't we like that, right? let's start with this group right over here. come on. this man, i like this guy.

>> we have a problem in this country, it's called muslims. we know our current president is one. you know he's not even an american. >> we need the question. but anyway, we have training camps brewing where they want to kill us. that's my question, when can we get rid of it? >> we're going to be looking at a lot of different things. a lot of people are saying that, a lot of people are saying bad things are happening out there. we're going to look at that and a lot of other things. go ahead, yes, ma'am. >> i definitely have to ask you a good veteran question. welcome first of all, to new hampshire. last night was a disgrace. cnn did not touch on any of the issues that are going on with veterans health care. women veterans health care. >> it's true. i asked them about that. there wasn't one question relating to the veterans. that's true. >> did anyone even ask them

why -- i know that's a clinton news network. is it that they don't like veterans? >> there was not one question relating to that, and not too much on the military, by the way. those days, believe me, are over. yes, ma'am, go ahead. >> hi, mr. trump. thank you for being here. i just finished my master's degree. during my job search i'm told i'm either overly or underly qualified. what can you do to improve the job market like me, qualified, talented, educated, u.s. citizens. >> it's such a question, i get it all the time. it's an amazing question. one of the things we'll be doing is we'll be taking our jobs fwrak china and japan and all of these other places that have been ripping us for years. i've been talking about this for ten years, 15 years.

we're bringing our jobs back here, our manufacturing back here. it's probably maybe the question other than the vets, maybe it's the question i get asked the most. many people in a lot of cases borrow a lot of money to get through college. they get out, they can't get a job. there's an expression, i will be the greatest jobs president that god ever created. i'll tell you that. >> can you hire me, please? >> go ahead, go ahead. go ahead, let's go. >> i was wondering when we can get together and work on the unsafe conditions at the plant. it's been a month b since i gave you that information.

>> i remember that. i remember you gave it. >> and i think you can not -- you and i should have a press conference because both governors in massachusetts and new hampshire aren't protecting the first responders. i would like to work with you on it. >> we'll take a look at it. next, back here. go ahead. >> the united states doesn't have as good of a record there. i have a question about the trump wall. when it comes to paying off debt. >> the trump wall? that's what's going to happen. that's why i'm going to make this wall so beautiful. when i'm gone they'll probably change the name to the trump wall. so i've got to make it beautiful. he said trump wall, i didn't. >> in the united states, we don't have such a good record paying off debt.

>> not such a good one, no. we owe $19 trillion. i would say we're not doing so good. >> how do we expect mexico to repay their debt -- >> because they make a fortune off us. they're taking our business. you know, nabisco -- >> we borrow a lot and don't pay it off. >> do you like oreos? they're cookies. nabisco is closing their big plant in chicago and moving it to mexico. ford is building a $2.5 billion plant in mexico. mexico is doing very well. we love mexico, but they're doing very well. we need leaders that can deal with them. we need leaders that are smart and tough and cunning. i have some of the greatest leaders in the country lined up. really tough, smart piem. they're going to help us and go and negotiate and we're going to

make great deals and bring jobs back so that you can get a job. you like that? okay, come on over here, question. yes, sir, go ahead with the hat. >> welcome back to new hampshire. >> thank you. do you think it's hot enough in this place? man. last night was pretty hot. this blows it away. go ahead. >> i applaud the gentleman who brought up the muslim training camps here in the united states. the fbi has information on that. but the americans also have guns pointed at ordinary citizens here. one of the -- >> don't get nervous. you're on about seven television networks. don't get nervous. don't choke. >> the bureau of land management. >> go ahead. >> and the agriculture. they're going into different ranches, shutting them down. >> right, that's right. >> but they seem to be pointing

a gun to make sure they get their fees. this is our own government putting us at siege. how can we get in there and stop them. >> so many things are going to change. these are regulations and they're -- but so many things -- that's one. you know, one of the things, being in real estate, we have army bases, navy bases, so many are for sale. and so many have been sold over the last short period of time. you say how many can we sell? i see it all the time. so many. things are going to change. go ahead. you have a question over there? go ahead, you. young handsome guy. go ahead. >> this gentleman, daniel tabus was a friend -- >> he was a great man. my friend, he was my friend. he passed away. he was my friend. >> he's one of america's rags to riches stories. >> it's true. >> i think that america has kind of lost that american dream. what can donald trump do to bring that back? >> so dan is from philadelphia, became a big banker, but a really good banker. a real banker.

and he was a friend of moon he passed away a few years ago. and he was a very, very successful guy and a great guy. look, we will bring the american dream back, that i can tell you. we are. >> bringing it back. i can understand what you're saying. i get that from so many people. is the american dream dead? they're asking me the question, is the american dream dead? and the american dream is in trouble, that i can tell you. okay? it's on life support. it's in trouble. but we're going to get it back and we're going to do some real job. how about the man with that beautiful red hat, stand up. stand up. what a hat. what does that say on it? wow. make america great again. that's beautiful, beautiful. >> mr. trump, can you please explain your position on the second amendment? >> on what? a. >> the second amendment. all for it. you need the protection.

we had an incident in new york which was very interesting. the two prisoners six months ago, seven months ago that escaped from a maximum security prison, a real beauty in new york. they escaped. and they went up and people were really scared. these were killers. and tough cookies. and a man and a wife were in their home and the wife was totally anti-gun. she hated that the husbanded that guns. and the guy was pro. he was a big second amendment guy. he was pro. and all of a sudden, they're waiting and these two tough cookies, bad guys are somewhere around their home within a little bit. she all of a sudden is totally pro. she was so happy that her husband had guns. and they had the gun on the table an the gun they were carrying. and you know what, they never had to use it.. they never had to use it.

remember, only the bad guys use it. but they were secure. now she's bigger than the husband in terms of wanting that. so i think that's pretty much what you want to hear. 100% pro second amendment. yes, sir, go ahead. >> mr. trump, i'm a veteran of both iraq and afghanistan. >> good shape. were you hurt at all? were you wounded ever? were you ever wounded? you look good. >> an ied blast and a couple of ground incidents. >> well, you look great. go ahead. >> seen a lot of human suffering both on the iraqi side and the afghanny side. what if anything should the u.s. be doing for the humanitarian crisis that's happening in syria right now. >> well, look, you have a crisis that's massive. and i'm gting that question a lot as of about two weeks ago where you have hundreds of thousands of people. but, you know, there comes a

point, and we all have to have heart, and i think i have as big a heart as anybody, but there comes a point where this country has to say, we have to get our own act together. we have to to do it. the other thing is what happens if a lot of these people are al qaeda? isis? you could have 15 different things. you don't know, they don't anything about them. now, with all that being said, europe, they've got to help themselves. every once in a while, it can't always be the united states. we have our bridges, our roads, our tunnels. we have problems here. we owe so much money. we owe japan $1.4 trillion. think of it. they sell cars by the thousands. they come off -- i saw boats two weeks ago in los angeles. thousands of cars all over the place. we owe them money. how do you do that? they're selling to us, we owe

them money. very simple, we have people that aren't very smart. china, with eowe them the same amount of money. $1.4 trillion. we've got to straighten out our own country. with that being said, you have the gulf states. very rich, saudi arabia, qatar, bahrain, they take nobody. they don't want to have anybody. you have europe, all these places. they've got to help. what i do like is a safe zone, you know got a lot of sand. a lot of sand in syria, right? i do like the concept of a safe zone where you put them there, you build it out, you have security, you create a little bit of an environment until they can ultimately go back to their homes, which most of them really want to do. they're great people. they're caught in this horrible conflict. but the concept of safe zone is something that really make sense. probably they even like it better. they stay and we help them. but we have to help europe. and the gulf states have to

contribute. saudi arabia was making so much money, beyond anything and bond anybody's comprehension. all of these countries have to get together and they have to fund it. we can do something. but we have to get other people to help us. we can't be the patsy. every time there's a problem and then in the meantime our airports are third world, our bridges are falling down. you see the safety record on our bridges? like 62% are in danger. our roads are collapsing all over the country. we are a mess. we want to build our country and we want to help people on a humanitarian basis, but we have to do some things to help ourselves. it's time maybe for us to help ourselves. in the back, go ahead. in the back. let's go.

>> trump taking questions in a town hall meeting up in new hampshire right now. i'm joined right now from robert and april ryan and in seattle msnbc ron reagan. all of you, i want first reactions to what i just saw there. the first person who spoke said we've got problems in the country. let's take a look at it. here's trump taking that question from the audience and here's his response. >> we have a problem in this country, it's called muslims. we know our current president is one. you know he's not even an american. >> this is the first question. >> anyway, we have training camps growing where they want to kill us. >> we're going to be looking at a lot of different things. a lot of people are saying that and a lot of people are saying that bad things are happening out there. we're going to be looking at that and plenty of other things.

>> the question to the candidate for question, when are we going to get rid of muslims in this country. the president is one of them, he's not an american. he had a full opportunity there to correct that guy. donald trump is still a birther. clearly so. your thoughts? >> yes, clearly so. you saw two problems for donald trump right there. one was donald trump, the fact that he went through, he watched, i don't know, 20 minutes of donald trump and he said virtually nothing that made any sense or had any substance to it. but then you got a glimpse of his supporters there. who is it that's act capitol hill buying the bs here that donald trump is peddling. and it's guys like this who think the big problem is that we have muslims in america. or the person who thinks the bureau of land management is taking people's ranches away at gun point or something like that. these are some disturbed people out there that support donald trump. and of course, donald trump isn't going to correct this guy. this is his base. he's going to go along with it and repeat the same blater.

>> this is racist crap, of course. and to me it's the biggest original sin of donald trump. before he went after people from new mexico as rapist, which was outajuice. long before that, he said our president was an illegal immigrant. he played that card and he's still playing it. i like to let him talk himself to death. i think he should build his own grave instead of people saying don't show him an action. i'm glad as hell we throw this in action. your thoughts? show him as he is. >> as a journalist, yeah, we need to see who he is. his comments are divisive and we saw that first questioner. and president obama had to deal with this birther issue with donald trump several years ago. and this was his first issue with donald trump, the racist issue. this election cycle we're talking about this wall and mexicans.

but yes, the first issue was against this president. and you know, what if he happens to be muslim? but he is not. he's a bible-beating christian. and i know that for a fact. and you can go to any church and see him. he calls on jesus. and it doesn't matter whether he calls on jesus or he was a muslim. it would not matter in this country. but the issue in this country is there's a division in this country. it's been perpetuated over the last couple of election seekles. take back our country. those are code words. take back our country. then we heard the percentage numbers for mitt romney last presidential election cycle. now we have donald trump in full -- his full glory talking racial, divisiveness. and chris, the interesting thing, tomorrow at the congressional black caucus annual legislative week, i am hosting a panel discussion on race solutions, 2015. i'm quite sure donald trump will be coming up in some of these

racial undertones that he's bringing. >> let me go to robert. you've been covering this guy. i'm not a hater. a couple of people really get to me. cheney does, of course. i try to understand trump for what show he's putting on. and the original sin of trump is this birther thing. john mccain i think had a profile in courage a couple of years back when a woman said the same thing at a town hall meeting just like this. she said he's an arab. he said no, he's a good american, we just happen to disagree. donald trump had that opportunity to show us his character and he showed us something else. he showed a willingness to go with the tide. that's not leadership to go with the tide. your thoughts? is this going to be part of his ongoing road show to prey to people who think we're overrun by muslims in this country. >> every moment in the presidential campaign is a test. and one of the things that's propelled trump to the front of

the pack is his instincts. his instincts with the conservative base. at the same time, becauses he's not a practiced politician like mccain, when he heard someone like in in the crowd, he chuckled along. that's a telling moment, whether you're a supporter of him or no the. he's trying to be more disciplined in the debate last night, but still in moments like these, not acting like a senator would, like mccain did in 2008. >> let's watch him again, here he is. >> we have a problem in this country. it's called muslims. we know our current president is one. >> right. >> you know he's not even an american. >> we need the question, this first question. >> but anyway, we have training camps growing where they want to kill us. that's my question. when can we get rid of them? >> we're going to be looking at a lot of different things. a lot of people are saying that and a lot of people are saying that bad things are happening out there. we're going to be looking at that and plenty of other things. >> there's a lot of detail

there, ron. the president is not an american. he showed us a birth certificate. the candidate for president, a leading republican candidate there said, right, sarcastically, like he doesn't believe the birth certificate either he is still on this campaign trail. i think it's going to limit his base. i think it's already -- people who are willing to buy that malarkey have a really bad attitude about things. whatever else you say about barack obama, you can disagree with him completely, he's an american success story. he said only in this country is my story possible. he sold american exceptionalism better than anyone in this world. you can come into this country with a name like barack hussein obama and bf president. he's not my favorite, but a lot of people said he's the best guy running. he'll make smart judgments and look out for us. we may disagree the whole time he's president, but he's an american. why is it in donald trump's interest to say -- a real simple question.

why is it in his interest to keep saying barack obama is an illegal alien? why does he keep saying that? >> his supporters believe that. >> do they really buy it? >> yes, these people really do believe that stuff. he really believes that barack obama is a kenyan muslim who's come here as a man churian candidate to tear down the united states from within. these people really do believe it. it's not the majority of the country by any stretch of the imagination that buys this stuff, but it's a good sizable chunk of the republican party and that's the chunk of the republican party that donald trump is playing to. it's what's got him to his 25, 30% of the electorate in the republican primaries here. and he doesn't want to let that go. >> you're so right there. joan, i think there's a larger subset of americans that have been betrayed by the leadership

class of both parties. the jobs are a problem, the unemployment trade isn't real. they do think trade is the real. who wouldn't worry about iran. who wouldn't be upset about the splurge of illegal immigrants because no one seems to have a reasonable, fair plan to deal with it. democrats i think do but they can't seem to sell it to republicans. i understand why there's dissatisfaction with our leadership class. >> we seem stuck. >> but they seem to hate the demographic change in this country, which is part of our history. long before you and i ever got here, there have been african-americans and native americans and hispanic americans. i like last night when someone said last night hispanics are americans. trump still thinks he needs a guy who says we've been overrun by muslims. he's saying the president showed us a phony document to get into the white house and he says right.

>> i think we have to visit this question of whether he doesn't need it. maybe he does need it. maybe his appeal is based, if not entirely, because there are these other things, his base is really heavily in this group of people who will never accept that this president is a legitimate president. and you're right, when i was listening to this with one of our great camera people here, the two of us were like wait, what? what did that guy say? and what did he say? and you've done such a wonderful job breaking it down. so you captured him saying "right" when the guy says that our president is a muslim. and then he says we needed that question. what what does he need by that? we needed someone to say he's a muslim? and then to assert without any evidence that we have muslim training camps in this country. that what? our president is running them? it's so sick. then someone comes up and says the blm is taking our land at gun point. and that's a big problem.

>> that's something else. i want to go back to robert. we'll come right back to you, joan. it's a great cast of people we have to talk about this. three candidates now all competing for the role of anti-governor candidates. we have the three musketeers out there, each with their different appeals. fiorina had a good show. she had a stunning response, every woman in america knows what it's like to be made fun of for her looks and judgment on her looks. she nailed that. and then it comes out that her testimony regarding planned parenthood was like ronald reagan saying that he had visited the death camps. well, she didn't see this on television. she didn't see this picture. okay fiorina. let's take a look at that. she has a flaw right up front with her failed testimony here. "the wall street journal" just came out tonight saying she's wrong.

she never saw any tape like that. your thoughts? >> she was making an overt appeal to anti-abortion conservative women. i think that was actually the most telling moment of the debate, rather than her exchanges with trump. she sees herself as an outsider, could compete with carson and trump. she also has a ste cat toe tone, a professionalism that i think appeals to many republicans. that's different than trump's presentation. >> fiorina scored some huge applause lines like this one about planned parenthood. then i want jones to respond. >> in regards to planned parent hood, anyone who has watched this videotape, i dare hillary clinton, barack obama to watch these tapes. watch a fully formed fetus on the table, its heart beating, its legs kicking while someone

says we have to keep it alive to harvest its brain. 23 we do not veto this shame on us. >> let's watch him. >> in writing in vox, she watched all 12 hours, she concluded either fiorina hasn't watched or she's knowingly misrepresenting the footage. >> rest assured i have seen the images that i talked about last night. rest assured that human lives are being aborted fully formed in order to harvest body parts. rest assured that this erodes at the character of our nation, and once again, i will say i dare mrs. clinton and president obama to defenders of planned parenthood to watch these videotapes.

>> well, joan, this is all about one question in a larger videotape. we're going to argue abortion rights forever. but should planned parenthood be the reason for shutting the government down? she says she has seen images of what we're talking about here. >> something horrible, horrible. >> and, in fact, there was no images on the screen in the video. "the wall street journal" says tonight, reporting that tonight, it reminded me of ronald reagan saying he had been over there in the death camps. and he had seen some footage on the screen. she didn't see footage. i don't know what she's talking about. what ronald reagan talked about had happened in history. she's talking about something that didn't happen. but everyone who has looked at the long, long tapes. the tapes they say are completely unedited were still edited 37 however, no one, even strong anti-abortion people who have looked at these tapes have seen anything like that, chris.

so it's a moment, when you play it again and you see how excited she gets, it's a little bit crazy spp she didn't see this. >> we had this before. she had a big night and in a sense built a time bomb around her credibility at the same time. >> right. >> i'm so glad you brought this up. i'm so tired having discussions in the media about the planned parenthood videos when all of us who have seen these videos know that they indicate nothing about planned parenthood selling body parts for medical experimentation. that simply does not appear on the videos which have been deceptively edited and distorted in various other ways. there have been other technical investigations that have proven that. so there's no evidence of wrongdoing on planned parenthood parts at all and this incident

she describes, it's less like my father and a little bit more like, i don't know, brian williams or somebody describing something he saw. >> i've got to go to april, my friend on this. this is a vicious, unhappy crowd of people. she's not special here. the three are all going for that kernel within the kernel from the angry into the ferociously angry right wing. what do you think? >> they're touching something in these people to make them fired up and go to these events like the trump event and say the things they're saying.

there are people out there who feel this. but we are in 2015. we are a nation that was built upon bring me your tired, your poor, your hungry. you just heard donald trump say we need to take care of our own and basically let europe take care of its own problems. he doesn't want the refugees here that the 10,000 the u.n. can be allowing to come here and seek shelter and care for a moment. then he doesn't want the mexicans. the list is going to keep growing. we'll see what happens. we'll see. >> thank you so much. thank you for joining us. april ryan as always, ron reagan, joan walsh. it's a turning point. i think it's a point of inflection. if you're still with trump after what he plays here, you've got to really examine your conscious right now. much more on what we heard from donald trump tonight and also from carly fiorina last night. this is "hardball."

when you see how excited she gets and the passion in her voice, it's a little bit crazy.

anyway let's watch this. here is mccain answering a similar situation. about the muslim training camps. and that bad things are happening there. and that bad things are rand paul went for susan b anthony. when can we get rid of them.

stake. >> children should not be this guy is talking about truth. he's playing with the belief, i would argue, some would argue, this guy is some sort of interlope. he somehow snuck him. he wasn't really in the high

schools like the records weren't really his. he was snuck through and created a false biography and somehow got to the white house. this is really conspiracy nut case stuff and there he is perpetrating it. saluting it. >> i'm not surprised, though. the sort of scooby do logic of birthers that somehow they figured out that barack obama snuck in but no one else has that's been the thing he's been playing for years. >> can you repeat that for me, jason? i couldn't hear it. >> the scooby do logic of birthers they somehow figured out that barack obama snuck into the country but no one else figured it out before them has been a core of the republican party since obama announced in 2006. >> give me a percentage that believe under sodium -- put him in a box, put him in a lie detector. what percentage would pass a lie detector saying this guy is from kenya, whatever, indonesia. how many would buy he's an illegal immigrant?

>> about 60% of trump supporters believe it. it seems like a safe number. >> that's 60 of 27. >> okay. >> right. that's 60 of 27. but let's not call the whole country whacky. i love that word element. there's a word that we don't like an element. anyway let's watch this. here is mccain answering a similar situation. he was in trouble at this time. he wasn't leading obama at that time. he was fighting for his life. here is how he responded quite differently than trump did tonight. >> i can't trust obama. i have read about him and he's not -- he's an arab. he's not -- >> no, ma'am. no, ma'am. he's a decent family man citizens that i just happen to have disagreements with on fundamental issues.

that's what this campaign is about. he's not. thank you. >> he makes you proud. >> it does. >> it makes you proud it's an american answer. maybe we shouldn't be saluting it but it made me proud at the time. >> especially after watching trump's performance right there. because not only did he have one opportunity to knock that down. let's say, you know, any crowd can have one nut. a few questioners after him said, boy, am i glad that you took that question from that guy about the muslim training camps. because we really do need to do something about the muslim training camps. trump engaged in this joking back and forth saying don't get nervous. you're on national tv. then the guy proceeded to stumble through a question how the bureau of land management is pointing weapons at farmers to extract fees from them. there's a belief among democrats that bringing this out in the open ends up helping them in the

long run because it exposes a crazy element. i wonder how dangerous that is in the long-term. because in a way you start normalizing this. if we keep seeing this kind of language accepted as part of the conversation, i'm not -- i don't know where this is headed. i think it's uncharted territory. >> it's been charted to some extent. people are moderate republicans don't want to be thought of. they may have moved away from the city to get away from people whatever they did. they are not proud of the fact they're perceived as anti-black. they don't like it. they don't like known being that way. women especially don't want to be known that way. >> exactly. >> i think trump will have a big problem going beyond 25 or 27%. we'll see. thank you guys for sticking around tonight. it's "hardball" for now. we caught a big one today. "all in with chris hays" starts now.

tonight. >> i think she's got a beautiful face. >> short, tall, fat, ugly. >> i never attacked him on his look, and believe me, there's plenty of subject matter right there. >> debate number two is in the books, and in between the insults there were untruths. >> as it relates to my brother, there's one thing i know for sure, he kept us safe. >> tonight debunking the top three falsehoods from the reagan library. then, is it finally time to sell high on donald trump? >> i think america is about to -- >> the mohamed story gets bigger. >> i didn't think i was going to get any support because i'm a muslim boy. >> my interview with the irving police chief who is standing by the arrest. >> it's a very suspicious device. >> of course, there is backlash to the backlash. >> does anyone think it did not look like a dangerous weapon out of a die hard movie? >> "all in" starts right now. ♪