mr. speaker, the pope of the holy sea. [ applause ] >> good morning and welcome to morning joe. what a historic moment yesterday as pope francis walked down that center i'll that we as americans are use to seeing our president walked down before delivering the state of the union but this pope delivered something much more historic yesterday and the response different than any speech than anybody seen in the

history of washington certainly when they're in that chamber. that is the speech that brings americans together and brought members together. we have president and ceo of capitol new york and host of msnbcs politics nation and t of the national action network. the week, matt louis and a lot of politics to talk about. if it's 2015, there's a lot of politics to talk about. pretty surprising pole from both to democratic side and the republican side. new poles out and a big shift on the democratic side. we'll tell you about that in a little bit. we got to talk about the pope's address to congress first. it was a remarkable moment.

democrats and republicans alike walked away from there unified. which as you know in that setting is extraordinary in itself. what were your take aways though? >> well, the whole day was remarkable from beginning to end and just even seeing the pope walk into that chamber for somebody like me who up in the era when it was difficult for a catholic to get elected president, to see the pope walking in was just a whole new part of america. then after his speech he came out on that balcony on the west front of the capitol and members of congress came running out to be there while he was coming and blessing everyone and there they were, leaders of congress ducking down to get their pictures taken with the pope above them so they can have the same shot at the pope. at that moment, they're absolutely right. democrats and republicans

together, they didn't care what party they were as long as they got the picture with the pope. >> it was so emotional for some people we could see john boehner tearing up and i thought that was just john boehner. i'm like keep it together, the pope is talking. then you see him crying. while he was talking to clair last night he talked about watching the pope and tears rolling down her face and she looked over and there was senator crying and tim cane. she looks over and tim cane has tears welling up in his eyes and he's starting to cry too. >> was some of. >> extraordinary moment. >> some of that is the man himself. francis really is a charismatic person and cheerful. everybody's gotten so tired of people scolding them all the time and he doesn't do that.

like the contrary, when he got to the touchy issue of climate change he said we can make a difference. i think we can. i'm sure. it was rather uplifting than something that made you feel glum and gloomy. i think that was a lot of it but i think many of the people you mentioned are catholic politicians and operating out of their own personal experiences as well. >> it was a pope nonjudgmental. the past 30-40 years in this country it seems that when you see religious leaders on television, too often they're coming at you with a judgmental stance. again, mike barn,ical is a man who takes christs'word and lives

out his words and it's really the center piece of who this man is as a leader. you were there yesterday. you were at mass yesterday at st. patrick's. describe that scene for us. >> yes, joe, st. patricks to see this person. i think it makes a huge difference. to come into a building recently refurbished, just a beautiful building, beautiful cathedral. a cathedral built with the hands, labor and love of immigrants. very young country at the time it was constructed and we're still a very young country. i am not embarrassed to tell you, joe, that i had tears in my eyes as this pope came down the center aisle of the cathedral past schoolteachers, day

laborers, nunns, doctors and billionaires all trying to reach out and touch him and take a picture of him. he brought joy this to country. you can see it on his face. you can see it in his smile. his smile is contagious because you see him and you smile and someone like me who grew up in the catholic faith, i remain a catholic, i'm not a lapsed catholic, all the dust and years of sitting in school and going to children's mass at 8:00 in the downstairs of the church and all swept off my shoulders. you see this huge person and

yeah, i had tears in my eyes. i think the country had tears in its eyes. >> alex and our entire staff is running for breaking news banner, michael barnical just announced he's not a lapsed catholic. >> big difference. >> i'm not a backsliding baptist. >> the thing he gave the most joy to at st. patrick's last night were the american nuns, the religious women who had the cloud over their heads and the investigation from the vatican which was one of the most ridiculous things to happen. the pope said last night he reached out specifically to the religious women of the united states. that was the first time he got applause in that talk and it was sustained and then he said i

wish to say thank you and then more applause and then tell you i love you very much. that was in a very, very important moment. >> i'm a baptist. i went to catholic schools long enough to know the nuns run the catholic church. >> this was an extraordinary trip. it's done remarkable things in this country. after ferguson, we've been talking about the visions an awful lot. you and i were down in charleston after those tragic shootings but the remarkable response by christians found if charleston to forgive the shooter, this is another example of how the church, whether it's in the deep south or whether it's out of rome actually has the power to eunite and bring

people together. this year we've had a couple of powerful reminders of just how unifying the church can be. >> i think you're right. i'm attending a service of interreligious meetings with the pope this morning. they have a group of us that have been invited to ground zero where he's actually showing the hearing. here is where people of different faiths, different religions and nationalities were killed and we're going to be there with the pope to show we must live together. i think as i was listening to them talk about the excitement they had as catholics, it was thrilling to me to see that pope stand before congress and talk about dr. martin luther king.

i grew up under his lieutenants. to see this pope summons this country to abe lincoln and martin luther king i think shows the kind of unity. >> i felt a general sense of calm from the pope in our political world and what we cover every day. there's a fight every day, a tweet battle between candidates and yesterday i just felt calm. it may not last more than these couple of days. hopefully it has lingering effects. he was talking about building bridges and things people can do together when they put their differences aside. >> and washington, the first day he got there, the whole city was just smiling.

that was a beautiful day but still people were nice to each other in a way they normally aren't. it was marked to see it. arthie day started out at the houses to help the poor and there are still almost 300 catholic worker houses in the united states of america and people giving up everything to go and work to do what jesus said. abandon your mother and father and go work with the more. >> he gave that message of service. leadership of service and made that clear by raising the mandate as well. >> well, willie, we have been

celebrating the peaceful and the unifying for 11 minutes. let's jump into the fray and get into american politics. yesterday we got a couple of significant poles out of new hampshire. >> put that calm on hold for a few minutes. >> the latest from cnn shows them now up 16 points over hillary clinton in that state. since july she's up 10. look at the transformation on opinion on who will leekly win the state. clinton has fallen 26 points since july. voters overwhelmingly believe hillary has the best shot at winning the election at more than 30 points.

a lot of people don't think hillary clinton is honest. that's all people are hearing and all they are -- we love the calm and the pope being in town that's why bernie sanders could be a socialist and be successful. that's the moment of poll teches we have. that margin has widened. >> it has widened and we can sit back and keep saying hillary is going to win.

i think most of us will still put our number on hillary clinton. when you start seeing in a state like new hampshire one candidate having that favfavorite blt fal those numbers matter. i can only project myself under that situation. if i have those numbers and net favre rablorites dropping, i wo in a full blown panic. supporters say hillary's going to win anyway. >> yeah, i think it's well past that point in their campaign. i think bernie sanders from what

jim is it's not just negative. it's positive. that is the case with bernie sanders and new hampshire has the advantage of being a neighbor from vermont and new hampshire is most likely to go that way. what hillary clinton has to worry about is losing iowa and new hampshire. when that happens it becomes very, very difficult. >> people don't realize how difficult it is to run for president. it's tough to do the first time.

i think bernie sanders is an exception to that rule. i served with him in congress. i liked bernie. i didn't go wow, that's a fire ball that's going to go far when he goes on. bernie has been enlarged by this process and gotten much better by this process. i agree he's really, really good on the campaign trail. >> there's one other aspect to it, joe. i certainly don't mean to twin or align bernie sanders with the pope. there's a similarity in the two in that both men believe in their message. if you see him, whoever he is, i've seen him in new hampshire, there's total belief in his message and people buy it. >> he believes it a long time. here's a man in his 70s.

they know he believes it. he's always said this. >> that's really the difference, willie, between the front runner in new hampshire on the democratic side and the front runner in new hampshire on the republican side. donald trump also is a protest candidate but donald hasn't believed the same thing on the same issues for years. there's a power for bernie sanders to say i said it last week, last year, last decade. when hillary is flopping on keystone and can't figure out where she stands on other issues, that makes bernie's message that much more powerful. >> bernie sanders has been saying the same thing since 1962 when he was organizing rallies on the university of chicago. that's who he is and what he believes in. before we move to the republican side, bernie 16 points in the

poles with joe biden in the race. when you pull him out in that same pole he's still up by 16 points without joe biden in it 49-36. >> one thing on joe biden, if you start with his appearance on colbert. if you haven't watched it, go watch it. one of greatest performances by a politician. he pointed out think about the services and humility that could lead to him getting into the race. as skeptical as some of us are. he sounds like he really wants to do it. >> let's look at the republican side. 50% of new hampshire republican primary voters backing outsiders.

donald trump up 26%. 10 point lead over carly fiorina who claimed 150 points. marco rubio now sitting at 9%. jeb bush falling five points down to sixth place in the state of new hampshire. more troubling news for bush where his net rating trails the other top candidates including donald trump. republicans feel trump and bush are the best choices to win the general e election. nearly three out of five say they are still deciding. >> matt louis, carly fiorina has had nothing short of an extraordinary month. i saw her on the stop at three different places on the weekend in new hampshire. she's great. she's without notes. she goes into the crowd.

she's fiery and then one on one she's very good. i would not have said this before. i limited people i thought could win to bush and trump. why is she shaking up the republican party like she is? >> i always assumed maybe this is to raise her profile possibly and be somewhere in the administration if the republicans win. i think all the sudden you started the wow, she's an iron lady. carly fiorina could be president. you have to imagine people winning before they can win. we started to see that. she's so good, so confident, so tough. obviously, the fact that she's a woman and she can go after hillary clinton in a way that other candidates can't or can't get away with doing. i think she's doing amazingly well and she mates it when you

talk about her as the running mate but i think she would make a great running meat. >> i think she is except for the fact she could be a great president. >> she started to show the other side of her tough personality and that is a powerful one two punch. >> it is. she's had a great run here. i think in the end she and trump and carson are not going to be the nominee and i think that's why the others are so confused because they think that too but they're not sure who it is going to be and they're all trying to jock can i to figure out how to get that person in the position

to pick up. >> you know, willie, if i'm ever president of the united states, you know who my running mate is going to be? >> whose that? >> tammy taylor. tammy taylor will be whatever she wants to be in my administration. still ahead, cony briton will be on the big stage at tomorrow's global city festival here in new york central park. we'll talk to her in a bit plus tom brokaw joins us with a look back at the popes who have come to america. fed up and not taking it anybody. marco rubio finally responds to donald trump's attacks. you're watching morning zbrjoe. we'll be right back. but i keep it growing by making every dollar count.

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willie, donald trump has a new target. he's directed more and more attacks to marco rubio.

>> you can guess whose rising in the poles based on who donald trump is going after and right now it's based on marco rubio. >> marco rubio as an example has no money, zero. i think that's okay. it's fine. maybe it's good politically to say you owe money because you overborrowed on your credit cards. i get light weights like rubio that says donald trump don't talk about foreign policy. i don't want to tell too much. >> he's a young guy and he sweats more than any young person i've ever seen in my life. i've never seen a person sweat and seen a guy down water like he downs water. they bring it in in buckets for this guy. >> that was trump yesterday on morning joe. >> if anybody gets close to him

or any time he hits a rough spot, that's what he does. he had a bad debate last week. he can't have more than a 10 second sound bite on any key issue. i think he's a touchy and insecure guy. that's how he reacts. some people can through it. >> when the debate turned to policy he stood there for 23 minutes. he's very sensitive to criticism but he can't have a conversation about policy because quiet frankly he doesn't know anything about policy. his foreign policy is a is secret because he can't tell us. >> trump is not backing down. he tweeted last night quote just watch marco rubio on television. just another all talk no action.

>> it hasn't worked out well for anybody else. i think the only person whose figured out how to crack that code is carly fiorina. these other guys that dress like, look like and talk like and act like politicianpolitici might as well go on the treadmill and spend their time exercising because that will have about as much impact on donald trump. you saw marco doing that. from politicians to dresses and looks and acts like a politician, it doesn't work. carly seems to be the only one that can draw blood. >> that's true. you keep waiting for something else to happen. what's happening with donald trump is the crowds are not showing up. that is a big change and so i think what's really happening is the person reeling in donald trump is donald trump and that

was likely to happen at some point and seems to be on the way. >> the question is matt louis and i've always said this, it's the stainability. how does he sustain the excitement over the past four or five or six months. i think you book smaller rooms and in september turns into october and november, the crowds will get bigger but you know, the beetles only come to jfk one time and you get to work. but i don't know that's a problem for trump so long as he doesn't admit that the crowds are getting smaller here and there. >> yeah, it's like the spinal tap room. all the answers are getting smaller and slethivelective. >> and boston is not a college

town. >> marco rubio has done a good job of keeping a low profile and staying under the radar and showing up every day building the campaign, doing the work and now all the sudden deciding to go after trump. if it's just a temporary thing, that's fine but i don't understand why he would change his strategy. seems like he's doing a good job to build his campaign. >> funny you say that. donald trump hits back really hard yesterday. there was a photograph in the new york times that showed a light crowd in south carolina. he said all the crowd pushed forward. he's really fighting back. i want to go back to marco rubio for a second. if you listen to conservatives, they love marco rubio and hung in with this guy and still believe he will be the nominee. what is it about him that draws

such enthuse nachl? >> i think marco rubio is the most inspiring candidate for if you're a conservative whose a thoughtful conservative, whose somebody who can appeal and sell conservati conservatism to a new and sort of broader more diverse elector. he's the guy that has the all american story, st. son of immigrants who can talk about why free markets are the best for americans. i think it could come down to rubio verses trump or one of the outsiders and that may be the choice conservatives have to make. >> we've been talking about sometime, he's the darling of at least the establishment conservative class that have been talking about him for some time. my only krit schl to marco is get a little more experience

than barack obama had when he ran for president in washington d.c. and you'll be a lot better. we'll see how it goes. i think willie, the best move for marco is let carly cut donald trump up and keep doing what you're doing. taking him head on does not make sense for established politicians. >> he took him head on yesterday. coming up, jeb bush gives his keys to handing over minority voters. it sounds like a message mitt romney was criticized for in 2008. we'll explain that next. just wanted to touch base. we came to manage over $800 billion in assets, through face time when you really need it. it's how edward jones makes sense of investing.

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welcome back to morning joe. joining us is gene robinson. earlier we showed the new pole that shows jeb bush falling to sixth place the new hampshire. meanwhile, while he was taking questions a man said look around and how many black people do you see? how are you going to get them to vote for you? >> republicans can affomake up e african american vote. if you double that, you're at a low number. if you double that you win

elections in place plas like ohio and virginia and we should make that case because our message is one of hope and aspiration. it isn't one of division and get in line and we'll take care of you with free stuff. our message is one that's uplifting that says you can achieve success. we're on your side. >> critics of jeb bush have pointed out the comments mitt romney was criticized for in 201. after being booed he told a montana fundraising dinner quote i want people to know what i stand for and if i don't stand for what they want go vote for someone else. that's fine. if they want more stuff from government, tell them to go vote for the other guy. more free stuff. joe. >> well, it's robinson, the tiner of jeb's argument reminds me of something we've said on the campaign trail in 1994, the first time he ran for governor.

he said he was probably doing nothing. that was jeb though saying i'm going to treat everybody the same and i'm not going to just have special plans for one group. i'm not going to get the electric. it didn't come over particularly well. we've got to be more careful after the 47% comments in 2012. >> yeah, how did that 94 election work out for jeb bush? not very well. how are you going to win people's votes if your introduction is all you want is free stuff. that's ridiculous. again, it's another example, i think, of jeb bush's surprising to me clumsiness on the campaign

trail. >> that's not going to help him in south carolina or anywhere. it makes him look like a candidate not performing. >> you're a daughter of the south. >> i am. >> i would like to ask you and i would like to ask the reverend in this period of time in our country's history we've seen ferguson and seen charleston, south carolina. we've seen baltimore. how can people dealing in politics be so tone deaf to something in front of us? >> it's quiet remarkable. i think in addition to ferguson

and charleston and baltimore you have voting right billing in all kinds of places in the south right now and that's a bigger problem in the end. getting back to the pope yesterday he talked about martin luther king's march from selma to montgomery to get rights for african americans and that's what he was doing a lot of people put their political rights on the line and now being restricted. that's the problem the republicans have. >> voting rights is not free stuff. >> right. >> dealing with whether or not the criminal justice system is fair is not free stuff. the issues that we're facing today has nothing to do with

free stuff. it has everything to do with protecting your rights and making sure you treat it equally. what is somebody asking for in ferguson or staton island or charleston. they're asking about cases of criminal justice. even in republican history you can go back to this so called free stuff. those are not the issues we're facing today. a rising tide lifts all votes. liberals hate that language.

that is something that seems to be missing from what jeb bush said, from what mitt romney said and what a lot of other people say when they seem to get into a defensive crouch. this is not about giving things away to other people. this is about an economy so broken and been so broken for so long that has crippled the middle class over to past 30 years that's taken great jobs away from great people and then made them go back and take jobs that weren't quiet so good. you know very well after my dad passed away i talked about a man that played by all the rules and worked his ass off day in and day out that finally worked up to get a great job and then they

ran into trouble during the vietnam war and laid off an awful lot of people. my dad was one of those people for two years. when i would go off to college and people voted republican like me, it enraged me and a lot of middle class and working class people. today when they hear republicans talk that way. it doesn't make sense if you want to win elections. if you want to speak to a small group of people, keep talking leek that and keep losing every four years to democrats. >> jeb bush's campaign came out after that comment and clarified a little bit and suggested exactly what you're saying. conservative principals are good for everyone. didn't necessarily say it that way.

>> the unfortunate part is the question came and made the answer so much worse. >> the president of china heads to the white house. we'll ask whether we should take the new cap and trade program seriously. back after this. (patrick 1) what's it like to be the boss of you? (patrick 2) pretty great. (patrick 1) how about a 10% raise? (patrick 2) how about 20? (patrick 1) how about done? (patrick 2) that's the kind of control i like... ...and that's what they give me at national car rental. i can choose any car in the aisle i want- without having to ask anyone. who better to be the boss of you... (patrick 1)than me. i mean, you...us. (vo) go national. go like a pro. they come into this iworld ugly and messy.

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who knows, one of these kids just might be the one. to clean the oceans, to start a movement, or lead a country. it may not be obvious yet, but one of these kids is going to change the world. we just need to make sure she has what she needs. welcome to windows 10. the future starts now for all of us. dr. jeffrey sacks is the director and speeshl adviser to the u.n. secretary and also the author to the end of poverty celebrating the 10-year anniversary with the release of a special new edition and forward. complete with a cd.

you know the united states has a long way to go as far as cutting emissions. we have improved over the past 10-20 years. you've talked about it on our show before. there's not going to be a real movement until we get some of the developing countries like china and some of the expanding countries like china from getting on board. is this proposal we're hearing about actually meaningful and can it work? >> it's a big deal with president obama getting together because the two largest carbon emitting countries in the world are really teaming up and behind the scenes there's been a tremendous amount of work over the past year and their going to make important announcements. so this is all on the step to

paris where 1993 countries are suppose to reach agreement. but the whole world is looking at the top two countries, china and the u.s. in terms of emissions and they're going to be very gratified by what they're hearing. >> you know, jeffrey, it's so interesting. we've always assumed the country has an economic advantage. sean is actually at a tipping point where i'm hearing more and more business executives and people who run countries going over the china and staying there saying there's no way i'll bring my family and no way for the corporations to come over here because it is just too filthy. it's actually a move in china's best interest. >> well, it's cutting both ways. on the one side the air is so miserable it kills and it's shortening lives. on the other hand, china has been investing so heavily in the advanced renewables it's the

world leader. it's driven down the price dramatically and that's one of the reasons the whole world can make a break through on climate. >> there's so much in the atmosphere as the president sits down. there's so much there. what else will you be looking at besides climate change? >> there's so much. obama, the pope. >> all together at the u.n. >> there's actual a bit of breakout of good will. the pope brings that. putin and obama are going to sit down next week and i think they can make real progress on syria. >> china, there's a lot of

cooperation behind the scenes. we got a lot of problems. there's a feeling that things were a little bit spinning out of control on many fronts and maybe they're starting to pull back. >> what do you think they walk away with from the trip? it's amazing this story has gotten so little coverage. in a different week this can be what's happening with the economy. >> with china and u.s. leaders. it is a big deal because of especially what's not recognized is december is the make or break for finally agreeing on doing something about climate and there's been years and years of work towards december and this meeting is exactly in the time to get it right and so behind the scenes today at the united nations and all weekend, all the world leader rs gois are going working on this. >> there's an awful lot of doubt

within a certain economic circle especially in you're not united states about the actual strength of the chinese economy and if the numbers are accurate they put out. if this is halfway implemented, what does it cost the chinese, what does it do to their economy? positive or negative? >> it's positive or everybody. we're short sited right now. what's happening is the disruption is becoming bigger every why. droughts, floods, heat waves. big destruction of crops happening all over the world. everybody knows now they have the move. i think there's a consensus on how to move. they're trying to figure it out. the u.s. and china are looking at what kind of longer term process can be put in place. you can't change this one day to the next but you can get on a path and that's what they're trying to figure out how to announce. >> busy week for you. he will also be participating in

tomorrow's global citizen festival. i'm hosting and you'll be opening. >> i'm opening for beyonce. >> doing the single lady dance. >> we'll be there together. >> coming up, another celebrity on stage tomorrow in central park. connie britain. you're watching morning joe. frds when you're not confident your company's data is secure, the possibility of a breach can quickly become the only thing you think about.

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. coming up at the top of the hour, carly fiorina is rapidly rising. we're going to have brand new poles out of new hampshire plus new questions about hillary clinton's role and getting her aid a state department job and after becoming the first pope to address congress, the pope francis heads to the u.n. today. we're going to have live coverage of that extraordinary visit that continues. it's all ahead here on morning joe. this bale of hay cannot be controlled. when a wildfire raged through elkhorn ranch, the sudden loss of pasture became a serious problem for a family business. faced with horses that needed feeding and a texas drought that sent hay prices soaring, the owners had to act fast.

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hi llary clinton was asked which woman should be put on the $10 bill. >> have you given any thought as to what woman should be put on the $10 bill? >> i am torn about it. i want a woman on a bill. >> that's what she said. >> my goodness. okay. we'll just leave that there. welcome back to morning joe. reverend al sharp and eugene robinson still along for the ride. senior writer for bloomberg politics. she previously served as the new york times realm bureau chief and in washington we got nbc political news director and

chuck todd from meet the press. we have a lot of things going on this politics. you were on capitol hill yesterday. give us your impressions. >> i'm not a catholic and i thought it was something we'll not see for a long time. i was amazed at how the entire body, every member of congress i saw come out. going in they were excited. that was to be expected but coming out conservative and liberal alike were beaming about what they heard and what they experienced. it was, look, it was a speech with a clear agenda. i think he made it just like any other politician that came in there. he had a list of issues he wanted to work on. i thought the most important thing he said was at the start when he talked about how everybody in there should be working for the common good. he basically made a case against

polarization and he used american history and used americans in a very polite optimistic way lecture that body and say set aside, do what you can but be a good politician works for the common good. i would say those are words those guys need to hear and i'm sure speaker boehner is saying i hope all of my conference listens to the pope's words. >> it's words they need to hear now especially with washington more divided than ever and so much of this seems so unique to so many of us. the other morning we were looking at the pope coming in and a woman reached in to grab his face and we were so shocked he leaned over and kissed her on the cheek. somebody had seen him and said every little old lady in italy has been kissed on both cheeks by this pope. they ask for it, they get it.

he does not shy away from people. it's pretty extraordinary. what are your thoughts as someone who served for the times and saw this a good bit? >> it's very extraordinary. you know when i was covering john paul the second, it was really at the end and he was really not well and struggling and giving a witness to people on really how to die well. it was a sad time actually especially against the backdrop of the sex abuse zan dscandals. here you have this guy calling us in different ways. i thought one of the most moving things yesterday in his address to congress was the fact that he was struggling with it with the english. to me, the very whole presentation was just underlining his plea for the

immigrant and it also made us have to listen really closely to what he was saying. you could see what it cost him, how difficult it was to get through it, anybody who speaks another language, can you imagine yourself having to do that and what for him, i think this was his fifth language. so many of the things that he and his lifting up his four great americans, a couple of them more surprising than the others, but to me, his choice of dorothy day and thomas and mlk, all those people known for a civil disobedience. even though i know some republicans were a little less happy than democrats with the speech and with many of his themes, i'm thinking you know, he's just saying if you think the law is wrong, if you think the law is in conflict with the gospel, your duty is to the gospel and not to the law.

>> you know, mike, i struggle with english every morning but it doesn't have the same effect as the pope struggling with english yesterday. i was moved by something that you said, mike, last hour when you talked about being a catholic going to one mass after another seeing dust build up on the pews, seeing more and more young people leave and going through scandals. it's been a hard long slog for a lot of practicing catholics but you talk about the spiritual pay off you're getting now. this was worth the wait. >> there is a nara to this man, to this pope that's unmistakable as i indicated earlier at last night's service in st. patrick's. when the pope entered the cathedral, the cathedral built with the hands, labor and love of immigrants more than a century ago.

he came down the center aisle past nuns and laborers and some people living on the margins and some poor people who had been given tickets and passed billionaires and everyone was trying to reach out and touch this pope who touches us. melinda just spoke to something else of this pope. pope did indeed speak in english before and during session to congress. to many people of a certain age, his words, the way he slowly articulated each word in a strange language he did not speak, they could hear the echos of the streets they grew up on, the streets i grew up on. they come to the united states to build and develop a life. you could hear that in his voice. it's a powerful message he's

dl delivering to this country and to the world. it's a message of basically, why can't we get along better? >> like young people tuning into religion for the first time because of this pope and hearing how different he is, how does he compare to the previous pope and pope john paul. why is he so different? why is he so exceptional? >> again, this is my personal prejudice. my opinion and my opinion only. he's a judguate. pope john paul was a great man. there's no doubt about it. his role in world history is truly epic in helping collapse the walls of communism within europe. this pope because it is judguate roots, help those who need help the most. the least among us. >> add to that a little bit in

that if you think about the christian faith and role in politics, it's been so schooled on abortion gay marriage over the last 15-20 years and i think one of the great things this pope has done and the reason he resinates across denominations is he speaks to putting emphasis on the poor and not the issues. >> there's one other thing about pope francis and this pope and his history, he's from argentina and from the catholic church in argentina which was very conservative and made terrible mistakes during the dictatorship in the 1970s and there is a sense of atonement in what he's doing now and in his preaching about uplifting the poor and liberation. >> all right. we're going to come back to the pope in a minute. let's turn to politics. bernie sanders leading by 16 points over hillary clinton inside the state of new hampshire. since july senator sanders up 10

points and clinton down 12 points. look at the transformation and opinion. secretary clinton has fallen 26% and while voters overwhelmingly believe hillary clinton has the best shot of winning the general election action that's more than 30 points. her net favoring in this pole. >> hillary clinton down 26 points over the past few months in new hampshire. her favoritability minus 20 compared to bernie sanders. what's the feeling inside the clinton camp? how low can this go and what's the plan to stem the bleeding? >> i don't know if they have a plan to stem the bleeding now. i think part of it is to put her out there more. i've got her on the show this sunday. i think she's doing a town hall with the today show a week later.

that seems to be part of their plan. >> how bad do those numbers look to you, chuck? >> i saw them yesterday and i said double digits. she's down double digits in new hampshire? can we take a minute here and realize hillary clinton is down double digits to bernie sanders? i get that it's a, i remember the fist time, i thought i was misreading it. i know he's doing well in new hampshi hampshire. >> that's an astounding number and he's still ahead. >> sanders is not given the credit due. all of this is not a response to

hillary clinton and whether it's the e-mails or foundation money or the clinton campaign having to deal with the negative stories one day after another. it's a nightmare because it keeps trickling out. there's a positive side of bernie sanders too. he has a strong positive message. he's been saying the same thing since 1962. he's a pure progressive. he makes no apologies for it and that's something that would excite voters on the left as much as a pure unbridle conservative would excite voters on the right. >> i do think that poling number that's the most important is when you have more people thinking you're dishonest than honest, i don't care what party you are, what political environment you are, that is a huge issue and that's why these e-mail stories day in and day out that keep cutting at that issue as long as people don't trust her, she's extremely

vulnerable. >> i've got, i'm not just saying my best friends are democrat, i've always been surrounded by democratic friends. most of my friends are going to vote for hillary clinton. when the camera is not on and they're sitting down, they're saying the same thing to me they're saying to you. they are discouraged that hillary can't get in front of this and discouraged that she didn't take your advice earlier and discouraged she's still parsing language a couple of days ago when she was confronted i forget exactly by whom.

there's a couple of other things that's going to be disproved by the people that know this. they tell us all this. at some point they're going to have to make a decision to follow your advice, put it all out on the table and do a real apology or else this bleeding is going to continue. it's got to be frustrating and is for my democratic friends that want her to win. >> i said for a long time and thought she could do more to get behind her. i think she should and she's going to have to i think she can take affirmative action to kind of shove it more into the backgrou

background. if you take biden out of the picture and i suspect. >> we actually talked about that in the last hour before you came on. if you take joe biden out, the margin is still the same, right. >> it's a 13 point spread. >> it's who is the reason for your run. what is the bigger issue for you? i think that's what bernie sanders has tapped into. it comes all the way from those that are act pied to those that

want to deal with the issues of income and equality. what is the rational on why you're running. why should i not care about the questions about you and i think that's what's driving a lot of bernie sanders and there's a reason they're excited about the pope. there's a reason here. >> let's go to the republican side. that same pole inside new hampshire. voters there are backing outsiders as they have been in poles all across the country. donald trump up two points from july. that's a 10 point lead over carly fiorina who has climbed 15 points after her strong debate performances. marco rubio rising and six points up. look at jeb bush, governor bush falling five points to sixth

place. more troubling news for bush in the favre rablt ratings where his net ratings trail the other candidates. fiorina has the bet there. trump and bush are the best choices to win the general elections and votes do not appear to be locked in. nearly three out of five saying they're still deciding, joe. >> well, chuck todd, as we move toward the beginning of these contests in early 2016, one thing is for certain. we don't do coordinations in the united states of america. that bush clinton match up that everybody was so afraid of, so bored by, both bush and clinton struggling with favoritable ratings. >> you look at the list, to be behind both christie and donald trump at this time yet alone behind rubio and carly fiorina,

that i'm not as surprised at. to be, to have a worse net rating than trump in new hampshire, that burden of carrying around that last name can't be underestimated. that was the thing that struck me the most in the last debate. are they going to defend the bush here or kick it to the curb? i think they're struggling trying to do both. i think the public wants it one way. i think they might be more ready to kick it to the curb than at that party realizes.

>> talking about pacing and timing. she went from being an asterisk to being at the little kid's debate in cleveland to being on the main stage, barely getting there for the next debate. dominating there and here you have new hampshire her jumping in double digits now in second place. it's been a great rise she's starting to draw attention with the weekly standard. last week has not been a huge carly fan. the weekly standard said of all candidate, the only one whose witho out performed is carly. >> the only one not surprised is carly fiorina. she said all along this was going to unfold this way.

a lot of them left after she was over and the guy sitting next to me said that's what you call a home run. they loved her because she takes him on. she comes across intentionally as the american maggie thatcher. that's what she's going for and tough, tough, tough on absolutely everything and the voters love it. >> they really do love it and you do have a lot of people, matt, lose that love donald trump that will defend him to the very end and are going to vote for him and be excited about it but there's also a large group of people looking for the anti trump they look at jeb bush and marco rubio and they look like politicians that

can't step into the ring with donald trump. carly has shown she knows how to go after him and fight him in a way these politicians in their blue suits and red ties don't. >> never wear the red tie. that's my thing. >> mine's fuchsia by the way. >> i think you're right. you don't want to go with the game show host typical politici politician. >> i think donald trump has done carly fiorina is a lot favors ch i think they've created a mission structure. carly becomes the compromise and that's great news for her.

>> it is great news for her. great news for people who love news on sunday morning. chuck todd. a big meet the press. i guess it was last week your interview shook news events for three days. no pressure on you. give us three or four days of material to talk about. tell us who you have. >> i have hillary clinton and carly fiorina. >> that's going to be exciting. that's going to be this sunday exclusive with hillary clinton and carly fiorina. there are quiet a few who are starting to wonder if that's going to be your general election match up. >> how about that? >> that would be something. as the only major power left on the globe that hasn't elected a woman or at least one of the few, that would be quiet a general election match up.

>> and about time a lot of people would say. >> and about time. go kings. who do you have this weekend? >> we have no chance of losing. we are three point favorite again against. >> did you stay up and see the alabama game last week? it was pretty incredible. >> i did. you know, i thought you guys got man handled and all the sudden i woke back upnd you guys had the ball and had a chance to win. >> it was a great game. ole miss has taken it to us two years in a row. congrat ewe la con gracnecticut -- congratulat rebels. it's been a conventional week for pope francis. we're going to talk about how this trip compares to john paul

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pope john paul the second in america. first day in this country and first visit to new york city in 16 years. the occasion, the 50th anniversary of the united nations. he was greeted by school children. later the pope asked both nations to do more and help the poor. even in the pooring rain a crowd of 80,000 strong. >> a look back at his visit 20 years ago. joining us now, the great tom brokaw. tom, compare and contrast what you saw 20 years ago to what you seen over the last couple of days. >> pope john paul is a -- he

brought that in his per sauna as well. this pope born in italy and lived in argentina. entirely different kinds of cultures and the way people react to what's going on. their style was profoundly different. mike and i were talking earlier. i grew up at a time where i was a prodistant and the pope was a mystical figure and every community in america was played between prodistants and catholics. what's impressive about this visit is he's become the kind of meeting place for all the different not only religions but cultures and believes in this country. it's really a hiss or the ek time. >> it's trans sece send nt.

>> i'm a part of a political party that can't seem to pick the right guy or woman. every four years, look what the catholic church has done. the brock si of the catholic church that's been criticized for 2,000 years. look how successfully they have done in picking two of their last three leaders being transcendent figures that have completely in their own unique way captured the world's attention in a very positive life. this pope at the same time i have in rome across from the hotel buying sun glasses.

i think in many ways it's good for the country to find we can find common ground and people can come together. this is against the backdrop of all the religion we're seeing and the democratic debates. i was very touched by seeing speaker boehner who grew up in ohio, catholic, sitting behind him and the things he was talking about boehner is opposed to put he weaponed because he was sitting behind the holy father of a catholic growing up in america.

>> he also knew what was going to happen. a lot of time he appears here without a tie. >> the impact he's had on the united states. are you surprised? >> no. i don't want to say that because i'm not, no because i see it every week in rome. i see tens of thousands of people coming and i see the pope reaching out to them. this reminds me of a freshman in college of john pall's first trip here in the eyes and new york which turned the town upside down semi. i think what's happened is people connect. there's a simplicity and genuineness to him and it's the buzz factor. it's there and i see it every

week in rome and it goes both ways. people reaching out to the pope and also the pope everyone in the audience greeting anyone in a wheelchair and anyone that's sick and that leaves people moved. >> you talk about the humanity of the pope and tom, we bumped into john paul the second in 95. he was horrified in front of the pope wearing ripped gene jeans and this is him lecturing the women in the church and on abortion and mika remembered seeing the pope smile slightly and winking at the doctor saying it's okay. it's okay. and talked about his common touch and what a beautiful man

he was and i do, they have a lot of differences but they do share that in common, don't they, tom. the remarkable ability to reach out to the powerful and unpowerful alike. >> as i said earlier, the holy father has been a distant figure but these two have taken it down to ground level. i was in poland and remember that was a time when everything was up for grabs. the soviet union had a hard, hard hand going in poland and it turns out pope john paul was an effective mediator working with the soviet union about having a peaceful resolution about all thi this. i stood behind generations their

heads were the same shape and a lot of people in poland were saying to the barricades and this man was absolutely transit fixed to be in the presence and i thought you know, he has long views and going to trust this man his son will have a future. not just as a catholic but as a pole as well and as i say, it was one of the most moving experiences i've had as a rec d reporter. >> tom, so great to have your perspective on this. thanks for being with us. coming up. street closures of biblical proportions. behind the scenes look at the washington and new york lengths they are going for the pope's visit next. ♪

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there will be street closures, et cetera, but i think people can navigate that. they can navigate. if someone has the option to stay home and work from home, that's great too.

everything's going to belong as normal. >> that was new york city mayor bill de blasio. on the other hand, the new york post had a different take. they're going to make traveling in new york city a living hell. that might be true. chief engineer of the department of transportation out with his latest book, street smarts. good to have you with us. i think most new yorkers agree with mayor de blasio's point of view. it's one day, an incredible day. can you put it in some kind of perspective, the lengths this city has gone to make this possible. >> this is the first time i've seen this many streets being closed since 9/11. 9/11 closed every street south. we may have had more streets close but this time it's all over manhattan from the u.n. to east harlem to central park down to madison square garden and

9/11 s. ea 9/11. each becomes frozen zones which means nobody can move at times the pope the present and that's going to be difficult. >> the thing that amazes me, sam, is with all the street closures, the city still funks and there's still many parts of the city where traffic flows. obviously, the subway flows and the city functions. i can't think of another major american city or world city really where if you didn't look at what's happening here it would still function as well as new york city. >> i absolutely agree. that's one of the reasons i'm calling out the pope to bless our subway system. that's what saves us. we have an underground system where you can get anywhere. also people that know how to walk, we haven't forgotten that. a lot of cities have forgotten how to walk.

someone 10 blocks away, my god, how am i going to get there? we get out there and walk it. >> it is amazing though because even yesterday traveling there was a lot of closures. people function and people got through and i think it's also amazing the pope's spirit is a hazard such that morning joe bill seeking being commended. talking about bringing people together, joe commending the de blasio administration. joe has not weighed in on this yet. i know your specialty is traffic. with the traffic i'a big large part of that is security. when you put together the pope's visit with the u.n. assembly, now you got those two things

combined. >> yeah, we have a confluence of a lot of things going on. we have the yankees in a race and we have to provide security up there. >> they know when there is a major event at the united nations they follow that play book. it's just like a football play book. it tells police to go to certain locations, what they're suppose to do and how they're suppose to control the traffic in the locations. the more difficult i see is philadelphia. we've been working on the philadelphia one for quiet a bit. they're shutting down. they're just closing down the city. they're closing the benjamin franklin bridge. that would be like new york closing the brooklyn bridge. why they're closing the bridge, i'm not sure. what that means is new jersey is going to be in for a lot of traffic jams going forward.

>> this i do know. there is no other city where the police department would perform as effectively. >> so far, so good. thanks so much for being here. we appreciate it. the book is street smart and there's another big event going on in new york city. the global city festival. tens of thousands will be in central park tomorrow to change the world and rock out the pearl jam and beyonce in the process. we have a look at the big event. ♪ i built my business with passion. but i keep it growing by making every dollar count. that's why i have the spark cash card from capital one. i earn unlimited 2% cash back on everything i buy for my studio. ♪ and that unlimited 2% cash back from spark means thousands of dollars each year going back into my business... that's huge for my bottom line.

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tomorrow the citizen festival takes place in new york city central park. cold play, beyonce will be performing. hew evans joining us and co-star of the abc show nashville.

welcome to you both. good to see you. let's set the backdrop for people a little bit. this is not just an incredible concert. there's a lot more behind it. >> absolutely. our goal is to celebrate the united nations global goals. today in the united nations 182 world leaders are getting new goals to end extreme poverty,ty. our focus is how to make the new global goals famous and hold world leaders accountable to make sure they achieve the goals. >> what's your interest in this group, connie? >> i've been working with the u.n. as a good will ambassador and the new global poles is a very important moment for the u.n. and the world in terms of how we're looking for it and e rat kating poverty and i love the connection between these two

groups because global citizens is all about everybody coming together and knowing that we can actually accomplish this and that is very important. >> joe, what a moment for this. the pope will be parading through central park tonight and in the next day we'll talk about the issues he's advocating. >> you can take the pope, the leader of china, all of the stars that are the rock stars that are going to be on stage for a huge remarkable pefestiva. you can wrap them up in a ball and none of them comparatively would come close to comparing to tammy taylor. [ laughter ] >> i literally had no idea. >> connie, everybody knew where i was going because mika and i,

we talk about the god father and pizza commercials. we are both massive fans of what you did and what kyle did with friday night lights as well as what you are doing right now. as we became huge fans we've been looking into stardem. it lines up with how you live your life every day and what the pope tells us to do every day. what is your hope out of this festival? >> well, thank you. first of all, i had no idea that's why you were going. for me, this is a dream because my intention has always been about creating a voice in the world with the intent to use that for good and for change and to be aligned with the

organizatio organizations it's a place i feel like i belong and can make an impact and a lot of making that uniting people together and bringing them together for a common cause. >> and hugh, you of course probably weren't even board when live aid hit the stage years ago but you'd always hear stories after about how the money went to the right place or it didn't went to the right place. we been trying to do this for a very long time but you think global citizen is going to be different. you talked to me about it. it's really exciting. you really think you can really chip in in the fight against global poverty. how are you going to be different from so many organizations who have tried this before? >> there's a couple of ways we're going to be different. the first way is when you look at extreme poverty, it's a $260 billion a year challenge. we're not focused on just black

tie gala dinners and raising money. that's not going to end poverty. in the words of mandela, overcoming poverty is not an act of charity, it's an act of justice. we focus on the systemic way to change poverty. we have members around the world and they call on world leaders with a united voice. this year global citizens all simultaneously called on the prime minister of norway to increase her investment into girls education. she received 150,000 tweets and e-mails in one day. she responded, invited us to oslo, said i'm coming to the vest fa festival and i'm going to make girls education a priority. we believe if citizens come together en masse -- >> that's what impresses me about what you do and certainly

i joined joe in admiration for your activism, but i think that this is a bottom up kind of movement rather than top down because i looked at it last year kind of cynically and then when i really looked at what you were doing and how it was being done and the diversity of people involved, it's not like we're doing this for them, this is us and i think everybody should support it. it really a great thing. >> and i love the connection, too, with the organization -- the part of the u.n. that i'm involved with is the undp, which is the u.n. developmental program. it's about development. it's about getting in from the ground up in all of the different countries around the world. and that's where the chang needs to happen. that's where we're going to find sustainable impact. >> we are honored to be a part of it. i'll be hosting starting at 3:00 tomorrow. joe, if you want to have a connie briton contest, i'll

tague you back to brother's mcmullen. you don't want to start with me on that. >> did you guys hear tammy and -- might be getting a divorce? >> why did you -- wamp, wamp! >> you saw that coming, didn't you? >> i didn't want to believe it. >> tomorrow live on msnbc starting at 3:00, it's going to be an incredible event. more "morning joe" next. the do. you're like the poster child for paying on time. and then one day you tap the bumper of a station wagon. no big deal... until your insurance company jacks up your rates. you freak out. what good is having insurance if you get punished for using it? hey insurance companies, news flash. nobody's perfect.

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still ahead, pope francis waking up in new york city for the first time in his life, set to arrive at the united nations in the next hour. the pope will be addressing world leaders then. it is off to ground zero, a stop in harlem, a parade and then friday evening mass at madison square garden. what a whirl wind schedule for the 78-year-old pontiff and we're going to have live team coverage throughout the day opinion it may be the biggest stunner in new hampshire since hillary clinton's victory in 2008 but this time hillary is on the losing side.

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welcome back to "morning joe." a lot to get through this hour and a lot of cover today. let's bring in the vice president for mission and ministry from georgetown university, kevin o'brien, john meacham, the author of "destiny and power," and senior communications for the vatican, greg burke and we also have mike barnicle with us.

as we said before, pope francis is waking up in new york city for the first time after arriving yesterday from washington. what a trip through washington that was. after landing in new york, the pope headed straight for 5th avenue in the heart of manhattan. he emerged from his black fiat, gathered were thousands of people who lined the street headed for the cathedral for evening prayers. and bill deblassio apparently will some back and forth with the pontiff in italian. the pope paused to bless 17-year-old stephanie gabode of white plains, new york, sitting in a wheelchair. and he received huge applause when he said this to the

religious women and nuns of the united states. >> translator: what indeed, what would the church be without you? and i tell you that i love you very much. >> i agree with the pope, going to catholic schools, what would catholic schools do without people like this. i grew up with sister margaret and sister barbara and so many others. today it another jam packed schedule for the pope in new york city. his day is going to include a visit to the u.n. general assembly this morning, then a grip to ground zero, a procession through central park and what's got to be a remarkable evening mass at madison square garden. and new york governor andrew

cuomo met the pope yesterday, he's here with us this morning. governor, talk about what a special moment that was for you and what an historic moment this is for new york city. >> well, joe, thank you for having me. i'm a former altar boy and i went to a jesuit college. to meet the bone ispope is a th. to me this thrill, when you are in his presence, the realities exceed even the expectations, which are very, very high. it's not just catholics. that underestimates the message. his message is universal. he's saying to a world that is filled with clutter and

irrelevancies, he's saying jesus was about love, finding common alities, not differences. to preach that to congress, to preach that to new york city, these complicated metropolises and say get it simple and remember what it's about, it's about doing good things together, it radiates with everyone. it really does. >> governor, we've been talking a lot about the spiritual this morning. you certainly did there. let's talk about the security. it's got to be a great challenge for new york city and also for the state of new york. is this the most extraordinary security apparatus that new yorkers have had to put in place for any visiting dignitary? >> i think the combination, joe,

you have the u.n. general assembly to begin with, so that's a high state of alert. you put on top of it a pope visit and it is all hands on deck, i'll tell you that. we have all the state resources deployed, of course working with the nypd, the federal government has been a great partner here, the secret service. so when you put those forces all together, they're a considerable at that time n talent. it's not that we haven't done this before, it's not that we do it perfectly but we know how to do this. >> there are extraordinary talents every september and every september i'm glad my place is on the upper west side. i thank you for coming on the show and i want to say

congratulations, what a special moment that had to be for you and your entire family yesterday. >> it was. and on the way out, joe, he took time to do a special blessing for sandra lee, who as you know has just gotten over a bout with breast cancer. so to show in the midst of everything he was doing that he still have a personal connection and the time to make personal connections with the city, the locale that he was in was really special for me personally but another glimpse of how multi-dimensional this man is. >> and as you said yesterday, the genius of his message, even in a complicated city like new york city, strip it down, simplify it, come together. governor, thank you so much for being with us. we greatly appreciate it. >> now let's go to the united

nations and talk to nbc chief correspondent and host of "andrea mitchell reports," andrea mitchell, yesterday morning we were trying to figure out exactly what the pope's message was going to be in the house of representatives. it ended up being a message that brought both sides together, despite the fact he challenged both sides either directly or indirectly. but you suspect the themes today at the united nations may be a bit different. tell us about it. >> i think it's going to be, if possible, even more challenging, as difficult as congress is, i've never experienced a day like yesterday in washington being up there on the hill. when he came out on the balcony and said -- and i'm not catholic -- when he said for those of you who are not believers after saying "pray for me," send good weshs my way, i felt so included, all of us felt

so included. it was the most uplifting day i've ever had. and now to be here at the united nations, 170 countries, heads of state coming here and the fact is that on today the u.n. special agency, the people who deliver food in ukraine were ordered out by separatists so 150,000 people are being forced out of ukraine and the u.n. has done nothing, nothing about the situation there. the world has done nothing about the situation there. vladimir putin is coming here on monday. we want to hear what the pope has to say about ukraine, about the civil war in syria and about the palestinians. that's going to be difficult and what he's going to say about the cuba embargo. he's helped bring together the united states and cuba. every year there is a u.n. vote

on the cuban embargo and the u.s. has stood with -- has stood alone on this and now is in a completely different position. but if we know anything about this pope from what we did yesterday, he will not lecture, he will not scold, he will find a way through brilliant, deft language through his sense of humility and pastor al service to build a bridge and lift people up. if there's anything more dysfunctional than the united states congress, it's the united nations, joe. >> you're exactly right. to hear you report that yesterday was one of the most moving moments that you've had in washington, d.c. as a reporter -- >> absolutely. >> it speaks to just how unique this experience was. follow up on andrea's comments

about the uniqueness of this visit and how this man seemingly is bringing light to a darkened world that's been dealing with syria, a refugee crisis, isis, the ukraine, ferguson, so many negative stories, this seems to be a ray of light. john meacham? >> let's take just a step back and think about this. here's a man who is the leader of an institution that is 21 centuries old. the very clothes he's wearing, the vestments he's wearing are white because they represent resurrection and here he is in the middle of the most powerful

city, more powerful than rome, bringing a message that in death there is light, in evil there is good. this is a man who represents an institution, a faith, a set of values that while often corrupted have endured from century to century to century around the world. we've seen with john paul ii in the cold war context, tom was talking about it last hour, we were seen an extraordinary role for the papacy. this is a little different it seems to me. this is a pope clearly comfortable talking about the gospel in action. there's i think one of the reasons all of us seem a little dazzled by it is we're so used

to religion being simply another source of contention, as andrea was just talking about, faith is just another issue, another thing for to us fight about. what francis is saying is that, no, fundamentally at the heart of the message of christianity is mercy, forgiveness, goodness. and if we can tend to that, if we can stick to that, then the world will be a better place. >> and a message that is in line with the church and the institution that he runs that message that comes from 2,000 years back where jesus talked about the blessed or the merciful, the very messages that jesus preached 21 centuries ago, we have a pope that's bringing that message to new york city. mike barnicle, he's such a

unique pope. the first pope from the americas, born in argentina, the first jesuit pope as you've brought up and the first pope ordained after vatican ii. i want to ask you for yourself how unique last night. talk to us not only as a reporter but as a practicing catholic, what was it like for you to be sitting in st. peters or sitting last night and watching the pope? >> joe, i told you earlier and i'm not embarrassed to tell you again that it was a hugely emotional moment, evening vespers at st. patrick, to have this pope enter the cathedral, beautiful cathedral and pass by people who have received invitations, some very poor

people, school teachers, nurses among them, not that they're poor, nuns, a flock of nuns and then encountered billionaires along the way as he came down the center aisle, all of them wandering out to try and touch the pope or take a picture of the pope, the sentiment, the aura around this man is incredible. he epitomizes for me and many other catholics the roots of the church, matthew 25, i was hungry and you fed me, father. it leads the most ringing quotation that this pope is now known for is who am i to judge? but when he says that, it doesn't mean that it's going to be just oh, forget it. it's the roots of the faith, please just cling to them. >> i think in this case the man is the mission. we can have -- we can teach a lot of things from the bible and from the tradition of the

church, but he embodies them. and i think words speak but his actions have touched so many people. i was in washington for some of the events down there and what struck me as a jesuit, as a catholic, was the authority that this man has. he was surrounded by politicians who would love an ounce of the moral authority that he has. and i think he inspires all of us to live by what we actually profess to believe. >> non-catholic. >> yeah, i'm very excited about what he's done. i'm attending the service at ground zero in a couple of hours, and i think one of the things, though, that you've got to really find that's striking about this pope is when he talks about being forgiving but at the same time he challenges us on certain moral issues. so he's not giving you a pass. it's not like let's have rosie

colored glasses, there are things we need to get done. we need to do it as a positive rather than a negative. i i think it's very, very unique -- >> i thinkor right about that. he makes you feel good and at the same time makes you feel bad. it's interesting, you mentioned matthew 25. he often recommends people to read that. this is power, washington's power but new york is really power when you come down to it and he's talking about service. i think that's the message, that's the gospel message and that's the message he's trying to bring to everybody, individuals but also at a global level and on a political level. >> father, whether he's speaking at st. patrick's or whether he's speaking in congress or speaking in a place not quite so iconic,

i go back to what barack obama said yesterday, the president as he was introducing this pope. he said we revere you not only for the position you hold but for the unique characteristics of your personality, the remarkable man that you are. that really is. it's not just the robes, it's not just the position, it's not just the title. americans and people across the world sense that this pope is somehow different. >> a constant refrain to his speech yesterday was dialogue, dialogue, dialogue, dialogue. he told the bishops there as no room for harsh words among us, on open hearts. he said the exact same thing in different words to congress yesterday, that as reverend sharpton said, we're going to have differences and the church will challenge because it will stand for different issues but it will always engage the person

before we engage in policy. i think that type of approach is effective for church or for politic. >> joe, there's also something you more than others would recognize in this pope. it's a very visual nation we live in, people look at their cell phones, tv screens. the pope encounters the president of the united states the other day, just arriving at the united nations right now as you're seeing these scenes, looking at these scenes, just as we saw him greeting president obama on the white house lawn, as we saw him greeting andrew cuomo, public people sometimes have stern faces, joe, but this pope makes you smile. >> he certainly does. i saw a picture of andrew cuomo while we were talking to the governor. i don't think i've ever seen the new york governor smile as big as he did there, claire mccaskell talking about tears

streaming down her face, she looked up, john boehner was crying and jim cane, senator from virginia, tears were rolling down his face as well. this is a remarkable man. he's arriving at the united nations. at 10:20 he's going to address the u.n. general assembly in both english and spanish. and after that he's going to be doing something that certainly means an awful lot to new yorkers and americans alike. he's going to be going down to visit ground zero. and, john meacham, what are your thoughts as you see pope francis going into the united nations for an address that we hope brings this body together as much as his address yesterday before a joint session of congress brought together america's leaders. >> i think there are two levels at work here. there's a line in the psalms

about put not thy trust in princes, that truly faithful people know that earthly power is corruptible, that it's something you cannot work on, have to work for the kingdom of god, you have to put your faith in the transcendent as opposed to the temporal. and here he is, here is francis talking to the princes of the world. yesterday in washington. today the ambassadors, today the leaders of the world. but if i were those leaders, i would be feeling challenged as opposed to comforted. and i think that he -- this message of faith in action is one that puts those in authority on the spot. and so that's one level of the message. and the other is reaching out to the people, to those who would then put pressure on those princes. it's a complicated moment, it's

an emotional moment, no doubt. >> it is. >> it's also about what happens tomorrow, not just what happens today. >> and also what happens tomorrow not only in congress but also with the united nations. andrea, we are coming up now on the 70th anniversary of the united nations and this pope is going to be holding bilateral meetings with the secretary-general and the president of the general assembly to the u.n. but, andrea, as united nations comes up on its 70th anniversary, it is seeming more irrelevant than ever. mike barnicle asked the question several weeks ago, it was going through my mind as we saw the tragedy, the humanity, the masses of humanity in europe with the ref jif crisis where there seems to be no answer, there seems to be no answer with a syria that continues to fall

apart, a destabilizing entire middle east and mike barnicle asked the question on set, where the hell is the united nations? i wonder what sort of challenges the pope is going to present to the united nations today? >> reporter: well, clearly he's going to speak about the migrant crisis and conflict resolution. he spoke against arms and weapons in congress and where better to speak about that again and about development and the need to take care of those who are homeless, who need shelter than here at the united nations. you know, joe, i've been covering this institution for so many years through the tumultuous iraq war debate in the decade past and now we see the middle eastern chaos. he's got to be speaking about that and about ukraine but certainly about syria, the root cause of the vast migration we're now seeing from the middle east and northern africa into

europe. and the u.n. agencies that had at least been able to ameliorate some of these issues, just last week we heard a report criticizings world health organization for missing the ball on ebola. so this is a critical moment for this institution and its agencies and for its member states, certainly including the united states. and i'm not sure that the pope alone can solve all those problems. but if he has the spirit and the brilliance that he has exhibited in washington, then certainly in his initial moments here in new york last night at vespers, i think nothing is impossible. those of us who cover politics perhaps too much should perhaps get more in the mood of having faith and having spirit as we approach this day. >> well, let us -- faith and

hope. let us hope that this remarkable man, this remarkable leader of a remarkable institution can provide that at the united nations like he did at congress yesterday. right now you have the secretary-general speaking with the pontiff. we showed you pictures earlier of young children waiting to wave and hopefully shake the hands of pope francis. mike barnicle, jesus said let the children come and the little children have come and they're safely tucked behind barricades. >> the u.n. way. >> don't let them get too close. they might have sticky fingers. we're covering big events, united nations today. but the pope's itinerary

involves more, it involves who he is, starting with catholic charities yesterday. >> that's important. he didn't have a big fancy meal at congress yesterday. he went and ate meals with the homeless and he'll go up to harlem today to visit school children. this is where his heart is. when you think about all the attention this one man is receiving, has received in two and a half years, one that could easily feed anyone's ego, you have to be a strong man of prayer and discipline to know what your mission is and not be seduced. he makes it about the gospel and the children who he points to, the children, the affirmed and the alienated. >> what he did yesterday shows that, going to harlem. what was striking to me was the

four people he raised in his speech before the congress. because these all were people that stood up for emancipation and freedom and fought against the order of that day. and he could have chosen a lot of people but he didn't. and those models at that he chose i think is a real message. it was moving to me to see him do that. >> he's given a huge bump to the church here. when meeting with the president, the president noting all the work the catholic work has done in education and in health with immigration, the pope saying yesterday nobody's done more in immigration than the church. i think that's been huge because it's taking a little bit of the attention off of himself but these are the things he truly does care about. joe? >> we're coming up on 8:30 on the east coast, 5:30 on the west coast. pope francis arrived a few

minutes ago, he is holding bilateral meetings with the secretary-general and president of the general assembly and he will abe dressing after he addresses the u.n. staff in english, he's going to be addressing the general assembly in english and spanish. we expect the speech to be 30 to 35 minutes. and aftery leaves the united nations, he will be going down to a place that is near and dear and holds a special place in the hearts of many new yorkers. in fact, most americans and that is ground zero. let's go done to ground zero right now in lower manhattan and talk to nbc news correspondent miguel almaguer.

>> yes, we're expecting the pope to i rife here. we'll told he'll lead an interfaith prayer service here with religious leaders from all across the area and then he'll wrap up his time here before heading back to get a little rest before heading to harlem and central park. many people here gathering, expecting the pope to arrive and looking forward to his visit here, which will no doubt be a very reflective moment here. >> miguel, thank you so much. we'll get back to you. john meacham, one of the things that has always struck me, you can be cynical about politics, you can be cynical even about

certain people that assume the presidency, who may not be doing one thing or another the way you want them to do it, but it always struck me in a time of crisis and a time of disaster, the impact of a president's visit, especially if my area, we had four hurricanes, i believe, while i represented northwest florida in congress. and for people whose hands were on everything, who were going through damaged wedding pictures or trinkets that were passed down bip their parents, the visit of a president, the hug of a president, the understanding of a president could bring tears to their eyes and just a little bit of relief to their heart, i think when we look at what's going to be happening at 9/11, that's got to be magnified tn fold for the men and women who lost their loved ones on

september 11th, 2001, who are going to be able to embrace this remarkable man we've been talking about all week, pope francis. talk about certain leaders really can bring peace and i leavate heartache to the suffering. >> well, it's really an interesting question about the role of charisma and not in the glitzy way that's usually used. charisma is the sense of being touched by the gods, of having the capacity to comfort, to inspire, to challenge, as we were talking about. you're exactly right. a scottish traveler came to the united states and was struck by our culture, that people seemed far more interested in the apostle of the faith, the political faith, than the details of the creed. that is, theshl attra-- they we

attracted to the personality of great leaders. the mystery of leadership, the mystery of chris ma, is something that has shaped all of our lives and does unto this hour. i suspect the most moving part of today will be the bishop of rope going to ground zero. and we all know, i think, i think even his most fierce critics would agree that george w. bush really became the president of the united states with his -- what i would think of as his henry the v's most when he really unified the country in the wake of the attacks. it's a place for symbolism when

we're all focused on a particular person, the pope and what this message will be about what do we do about a world that leads to moments like the attacks of september 11th. that's the challenge going forward. >> what we're looking at right now is the united nations staff that is sitting or standing and waiting to talk to hope francis. he's going to be addressing them for a few minutes in english. when that happens, of course we will bring that to you. let bring in nbc news special anchor and founder of shriver media, maria shriver. let's begin with you, maria. what have your reflections been overs past 4 hours? you certainly have spent much time in the church, much time in washington and much time in new

york city. these towns aren't going to be the same after the past 24 hours. >> well, i hope they won't be the same. i hope none of us won't be the same if we actually listen to these sermons the pope has been giving. he's asking all of us to think about how we can be of service, how we can be more compassionate, how we can recognize that each of us are a foreigner, so to speak, how we can look at numbers and look at the stories within. i was particularly pleased last night at st. patrick's, he did a shout out to the nuns, their work on the front line, which has been so amazing and life affirming for so many people, he recognized they have stepped in in ways perhaps that they haven't gotten credit for. but i think he has talked to all of us about the importance of dialogue, about talking to

people we might not want to talk about and building bridges. so i hope that people will really reflect on what he has said, take it in and adapt it to their own lives. >> robert draper, as you were putting your book together, what surprised you the most about the new vatican that pope francis has brought about, has created? >> well, the new vatican is kind of in a state of confusion right now. they're still taking the measure of this mans, as he institute -- it's more a change in tone and emphasis. >> can we stop there for a moment? that is such an important point to make. there are so many people that are so moved by hough he's changing the church but the doctrine has remain relatively unchanged. it just his empa set, on murphy,

on go it's gra great message for all lead that's you don't have to change the world overnight if you have the right touch, the light touch. >> and the irony is what he says sounds so revolutionary on the one hand and yet on the other hand it's entirely in keeping with anyone who has read the bible. but it was remarkable yesterday to see this man essentially make time stand still has an he stood in a very political chamber and talk about politics as a noble caller, that politics is the expression to act as one. he mentioned a few things related to the death penalty, about private change but primarily it was about tone, promoting unity in a chamber that hasn't seen unity in some time. i think what's remarkable about this man and what separates him from the politicians he was speaking to yesterday, though he

has been a lead are all his life, he has never sought out the positions of leadership to which he's been thrust. the people have been drawn to him because there is no disconnect at all about what he says, what he thinks and what he feels. that's the mark of a remarkable individual. >> yesterday the joint session of congress, robert mentioned a key element of this pope's particular appeal, his tone. but his themes, themes that he speaks to, he spoke to them yesterday, he'll speak to them again today, they aren't focus grouped like they are in wa there as two themes that have been prevalent throughout his papacy. joy and mercy. joy and mercy. if there are two worlds that we

in the world need to and across faith traditions. >> and i think that that is why those of that was said by joe, the reason he's been such as transcend ent figure is pause he's been as traditional as he's been progressive. so doesn't take you out your comfort zone to deal with what appears to be new doo and as a nonpeacher, i got to give joe credit for this. >> can i you can talk a lot of

what he's been stay say be open, change your tone, be on. >> i'm sure you would agree, mara and it's much easier to be open minded and sit on the floor with your young child if it's your fourth than your prp by the fourth you become very zen and much more pontiff like and sit down and say now lou does this make feel, instead of waving a report card at your poor oldest child and screaming. ? . i say that as a youngest child who got away with so much.

john meacham, i want to bring you in and just talk and i'd love love everybody else to reflect on this. in our lifetime, john, two sons of the south, two sons of the protestant church, it is really telling to see how much america's attitude has changed, not only towards the catholic church but toward the pope himself. there was an otherness about the pope, a sort of strangeness about all the sacraments that the catholic church went through that we baptists didn't. these things that we're seeing in 2015 would not have been seen in, well, let's say 1960 where j.f.k.'s very fitness for president was challenge $ ba p because he was a catholic. >> well, maria certainly knows this in her bones. what a difference a half century makes.

senator kennedy had to go to the houston ministerial association to mack clear he would not be taking orders in the white house. he was the second major roman catholic nominee. al smith was the first. now we look at a supreme court that's majority roman catholic. we look at a country that can in a very common sense in a common moment watch these events. it is remarkable. and there's one of the great texts about liturgy, the actual ceremony of the church, is by a scholar who describes his methodist grandmother who used to say that what the catholic priest was doing when he faced

the alter and said mass is he was keeping all the rats in one place because they were doing strange and occult things. my old boss has always argued that anti-catholic prejudice disappeared because of john kennedy and john xxiii, who is a precursor to pope francis and i think there's a lot to do that. >> the majority of the justices on the supreme court catholic. and a handful of p-- you wouldnt have seen that 20, 30 years ago. >> we showed a third of catholics polled still feel that if a catholic were elected president, he or she would first be beholden to the pope before the will of the american people.

and it was especially young people who felt like that. so i think faith does play out in these presidential elections. we saw it i think with romney and faith has been already an issue in this campaign. so i think maybe it will always be an issue, certainly very different. i think uncle jack's speech is still worth looking at and rereading in these current times. but i also wanted to pick up what we were talking a little bit about earlier about the pope's message being about joy and mercy. i think it's also for me been very much about service. he asked us all to go be mary of the first disciple. she went outside and became of service. i think that certainly might be a theme today, so many people helped one another after 9/11, they were of service to their fellow human being and i think that that's also a responding

theme that he has said and i hope will continue to stress. >> the pope, pope francis, has just had a private meeting with the u.n. secretary-general. and, mike, at any moment the pope is going to be addressing the united nations staff. we expect the speech to be short, maybe five minutes. he's going to be speaking in english as he continues himself tour through the united nations toward the speech to the general assembly at about 10:20 this morning. >> and we will cover both speeches live, joe. father o'brien is still here, march maria, off of what you just said, pope john paul was a warrior, a cold war warrior against kitsch. he was so instrumental in changing the shape of the world.

i view this pope as a warrior against exclusion, one of his themes. doesn't exclude the immigrants, don't exclude the gays. >> he's definitely inclusive. the image which i think is very helpful is not just a church, he says, we should not just be a church with open doors but a church that goes outside into the streets where you meet people in the gritty reality of their lives. he said the church is like a field hospital and we must tend to people's wounds. that to me is a call to be uncomfortable, to be challenged and meet people different than myself. >> he's trying to change the bureaucracy, especially the financial aspect of the vatican. what is your view on how this is going and how this pope is handling it? >> he's essentially assigned

cardinal george pell from australia, a pretty tough guy to oversees these financial reforms. i think slowly but surely you can see some puchbacks, that there have been some leaks coming out of the vatican trying to suburb that cardinal pell has lived a lavish life. there are clearly elements on thein side resisting these forms. i want to go back to a through line throughout his career. it's also how pope francis became pope francis. he was elected in the conclave largely due in part to a speech he had given a week before in which he said the church had been too insular, that it needed essentially to blow out its doors and go out into the prefry and have the encounter. and that doesn't mean people

having right and wrongs but to have a dialogue, listening. that was so much so that message we've been hearing and the directives that he's given to parish priests at least within refugee family is very much inbueno saries. >> obvious i it had a deep and profound many pabt on his ministry once he became the pope. you can't help but look at this pope, pope francis all these years later, and wonder how much he impacted by what happened in his home country, the early mid

70s, the assassination of alynne ooe, the rise to power of pinochet, the rise of power it brought to his country so his focus far different from pope john paul ii's focus. >> that's absolutely right. and the rise of per own in his world. mark shriver, maria as brother, is writing a biography of him right now. we're all products of our experiences, we're all products of the world from which we came and i think one of the things about francis is that he understands that politics is an imperfect business.

he understands that there are always sins and shortcomings and failures, which is why, it seems to me, he returns again and again to what he believes to be the great constant, which is the gospel. the other factor here, and there are those around the table who know vastly more than i do about this, he is a jesuit and the jesuit is a mission to go out into the world and that's what he's do ing. one other quick thing about new york today, he's at the u.n. on the east side. he'll be down in lower manhattan. i think americans should take a certain amount of pride today because of our tradition of religious liberty. at ground zero, he will be near st. paul's chapel where george washington went on the day of his first inaugural in april of

1879, it was a washington who said that we in america would give to bigotry no sanction, to persecution no assistance. so francis is speaking in a country founded on our first freedom, which was freedom of conscience, freedom of religion. >> and a freedom over the past several weeks that has actually been debated by some presidential candidates, who have suggested that is there, in fact, should be a religious test for those seeking the presidency. it was a statement that fortunately met with immediate condemnation and that presidential candidate had to back down, but it certainly underlines the fact, john, that that is a great part of who we are and that most republicans, independents and democrats alike, were offended by the suggestion that there should be a religion test, whether it's a muslim in 2015 or whether it was a catholic in 1960.

we are seeing pope francis move through the halls of the united nations. a number of meetings. he's going to be speaking to the group that you're looking at right now, which are u.n. staffers. we expect a speech of about five minutes. he's going to be speaking in english. and when that happens, we'll certainly bring that to you. right now let's go outside the united nations, the sight of the pope's address, nbc news national correspondent and i stand you just had a discussion with samantha power. >> reporter: i did speak to the u.n. ambassador to the united nations samantha power. she's been moved by the language of pope francis already. as she communicated, the real problem this is going to be the

largest, most powerful gathering under any real roof. as she said, the challenge begins when the pope leaves, the activation process, to see a that some of these proposals, these wishes that he puts forth today can be implemented. that's been the refugee crisis. but also what's been going on with vladimir putin expected to be here early next week and even on this day as ambassador power indicated. the united nations is being forced out of eastern ukraine, the head of the humanitarian process there admitting now 3 million people at risk without the aid and food that they need.

>> father o'brien. >> john talked about the jesuits. he was appointed a provincial, a leader of the jesuits at a very young age. he learned a lesson there. he admitted publicly that he was too authoritarian, that he didn't listen enough and he was too young and too immature to assume such power at a young age. i think since then since he was provincial of argentina, he's learned that you begin first by listening and then speaking. it's a very jesuit approach, one first listens and then speaks. secondly he was at a meeting in the 1970s in which the jesuits preserve their --

>>ism really appreciate and i hope you will grace them and bless them so that they continue to work upholding the charter of the united nations for world peace, development and human rights. thank you for taking the time to meet with them because they are the heart and soul of our work. regardless of faith, we draw inspiration from humanity and

from your global call for action on social justice, climate change and ensuring a live of dignity of all. let me say, your holiness, thank you for your spiritual guidance and blessings and love for humanity. >> you're watching the secretary-general. he's going to be speaking to the u.n. staff in english and is expected to focus remarks on the environment, poverty, immigration and economic inequality. we expect the speech to last about five minutes.

dear fans, good morning. on the occasion of my visit to the united nations, i am pleased to meet you, the men and women who are in many ways the back bone of this organization. i thank you for your welcome, and i am grateful for all that you have done to prepare for my visit. i would ask you all to offer my greetings to the members of your families and to your colleagues who could not be with us today.

because -- the vast marriage of their work here is not of the kind that makes the news. besides the scenes, your daily efforts make possible many of the diplomatic, economic and political initiatives of the united nations, which are so important for meeting the hopes and expectation of the peoples who make up our human family. you are experts and experienced

field workers, officials and secretaries, translators, cleaners and cooks, maintenance and security personnel. thank you for all you do. your quiet and devoted work not on contributes to the betterment of the united nations, it also has great significance for you personally for how your work expresses our dignity and the kind of persons who we are.

many of you have come to the cities from countries of war. as such, you are a microcosms of the peoples, which this organization represents and seeks to serve. like so many other people world wide, you are concerned about your childrens' welfare and education. you worry about a future of the planet and what kind of a world we will leave for future generations. but today and every day i would

ask each of you, whatever your capacity, to care one another, be close to one another, respect one another and so embody service, this organization's ideal of a united human family living in harmony, walking not on for peace but in peace, walking not only for justice but in a spirit of justice. [ applause ] dear