alleged attacker, even after the woman pleads for leniency. what's being said about that judge today. good morning, everyone. i'm tamron hall. we begin with that breaking news on capitol hill. house republicans gather this morning in a closed-door meeting amid the chaos created when kevin mccarthy surprised everyone and dropped out of the race to replace john boehner as house speaker. pressure is mounting on former vice presidential candidate paul ryan to step up now and accept the job he's insisted he doesn't want. here's kevin mccarthy just in the past hour. >> we have very good conference, working together, trying to work together. i know a lot of speculation about who should run and others. paul is looking at it, but it's his decision. if he decides to do it, he'd be an amazing speaker, but he's got to decide on his own. and in today's "gut check" powered by bing pulse, we're

asking you, what does your gut tell you? do you think that paul ryan will change his mind and run for speaker? cast that vote at pulse.msnbc.com. let me bring in nbc's luke russert. he joins us live now on capitol hill. a couple of things there, this behind closed-door meeting. what have you learned? and let's compare what paul ryan said to you yesterday, luke, when you were chasing him down yesterday to what we're hearing now that he's going home to think about it. >> reporter: yeah, hi there, tamron. i'm actually in the room where the house gop conference just met. you see it's empty right now. a lot of garbage there in the back, coffee and danishes and what not. but this is the room where they just gathered to try and figure out a way forward, and that way forward is really centered on paul ryan. he has not definitively said no to running for speaker. now, i just caught up with him when he left this meeting. he said, look, nothing's changed from yesterday. and yesterday was, i'm pointing to my statement where he said he would not run. but tamron, there's all this speculation. if he wanted to quell the

speculation, all he would have to do is get in front of some tv cameras and say i will not run for speaker of the house. he has not done that. so, until he does that, we'll be in a holding pattern on capitol hill. i spoke with his colleagues today. they all think he is the best man for the job, that he would without a doubt get the 218 votes necessary on the house floor to become speaker, but he has some soul-searching to do. the pressure on him, i've got to tell you, is immense. now, what happened at this meeting earlier? it was really about trying to come together. house speaker john boehner said that he would stay on as long as necessary until the conference could agree on a nominee and said, look, let's not focus on the divisions we have here, let's focus on coming together for the american people and to go against the democrats. so, that's what they're trying to preach. whether or not members will take that literally, we'll see. and tamron, i'll close with this here. members now go back to their home districts for the columbus day holiday. and as of right now, the speakers race is still very much in flux. whenever members go home, that's usually when they hear from

their most vocal constituents. so, that usually tends to make members more antileadership, antiestablishment, when they hear from the people in their districts who don't like the status quo and business as usual in washington. >> right. >> reporter: so, how they go home and what they hear about this should really have an impact on how they see things a week from now, tamron. >> all right. thank you, luke. let me bring in republican congressman charles dent of pennsylvania, a leading voice among house gop moderates. congressman, thank you so much for your time. would you support paul ryan? >> thank you, tamron. yes. i believe paul ryan would make a very fine speaker. he could certainly gather at least 218 republican votes on the floor of the house of representatives to become speaker, but the real challenge is not whether it's paul ryan or anyone else. the real challenge is how do we change the underlying political dynamic or the governing dynamic that we've been experiencing? my fear is that the next person that we put in the speaker's position, whether when it was john boehner or, you know, kevin

mccarthy, or perhaps paulry everyonan, he will have the same challenges that john boehner had to deal with. that means governing. so, paul ryan is going to have to step into some really big issues, or the speaker -- debt ceiling, budget agreement, an omnibus appropriations bill, tax extenders. what we know is that each of these measures will require a bipartisan coalition in order to enact them. we all know that. and so, the new speaker will have to make those accommodations, cooperate with the democrats to pass them. if that new speaker does that, he'll likely take flack from the flank. if the speaker chooses to accommodate the rejectionist wing of the party, well, then the speaker will be perceived as weak and ineffective and will be stalemated in a state of dysfunction. >> the laundry list of scenarios you laid out is similar to what many democrats have pointed out why the obama administration has not been able to find any middle ground with the republican house. the very issues that you pointed out between moderates like

yourself versus the freedom caucus and many others is why we have come to a grinding halt on a number of issues and why a debate over spending is locked into a debate over planned parenthood. so, if the republicans in the house can't move forward, how would any president, especially a democrat, ever be able to get any compromise with that group? >> well, look, we can certainly make accommodations. look what we did earlier this year on the way we reimbursed physicians under medicare, the sgr. we came to an agreement. it was a bipartisan agreement. it was good policy. it was good for america. it was good for health care. we did it. we can do that going forward on a number of issues -- a budget agreement? we can get a strong budget agreement that can adjust the caps and rebalance the sequester for this fiscal year and the next. we can do that. and i think we can work with both, you know, house and senate republicans as well as democrats and the administration and come to an accommodation. i think we can do it. i don't think it's as hopeless as the administration's saying,

i really don't. >> let me ask you this, you describe what happened to kevin mccarthy as being frag, that essentially, the hard right threw a grenade and destroyed his chance of becoming house speaker. what makes you believe that that won't happen, for example, to paul ryan? this morning there was a member of that congress on with "morning joe," and he was asked, can john boehner hang on and work through some of these budget issues? do you have confidence in john boehner? and flat out, the answer was no. >> well, look, i think speaker boehner has said he wants to help clean the barn out. now sh he's not going to clean the whole barn out, but he might be able to deal with the debt ceiling and a budget agreement, and perhaps make some progress on transportation. i think we can get this barn partially cleaned. so, we can do it, absolutely. now, look, default -- it's interesting that those members who very much wanted to undermine john boehner, wanted to force him out, now they got exactly what they didn't want. they have john boehner, because john boehner's going to remain the speaker of the house until a new speaker is elected.

so, between now and then, we can make progress on these issues. john boehner knows it and st of us on the house republican conference, the governing wing of the party, we know we need to make progress on it, and we intend to drive forward whatever the consequences may be. >> you know, it's interesting, presidential candidate lindsey graham, senator graham was on, and he is concerned that if the house has a meltdown, which were his words, and shows that it cannot govern, that it is going to hurt anyone's chances, a republican, of winning in 2016. does that concern you at all? >> i think senator graham's absolutely right, that to the extent there is dysfunction in congress, that does not accrue well -- that does not accrue to the benefit of the republican presidential nominee, whoever that may be. so, to the extent that the congress functions -- and that is the key thing here -- we must get congress back on a path to functionality. so, to the extent that we function, that will accrue to the benefit of whoever the republican nominee is. dysfunction, this instability

and uncertainty does not help the republican party. it's not good for the country and it's certainly not good for the republican party or our future nominee. >> and last, let me ask you, yesterday, paul ryan's answer was essentially no, no, no to the question of whether he wants to be house speaker. today it is let me go to my family. it is interesting that here you have this leadership position. you had so much momentum with the house in many ways in the number of seats you were able to hold on to and also pick up. why would someone as successful as paul ryan, and obviously, liked by many, including yourself, not want this job? is it that lousy of a job, leading house republicans, that john boehner with a big smile on his face said good-bye and paul ryan needs an entire weekend to think about it and maybe even more time? >> well, because, look, winning -- you know, winning the speakership for paul ryan is not going to be the challenge. he'll win, no question. >> right. >> the question is, what's he going to do with it? you know, the political dynamic is what it is. i just went over that with you a moment ago about all the things

that need to occur. paul ryan would have to put together a governing coalition that would include republicans and democrats, and he will be criticized for that on the flank. he knows it. and so, that's why paul -- i've spoken to paul -- he needs to think about this. it's a hard -- it's a difficult decision. he knows -- i'm confident that he knows he could pull it off and win. the question is, can he change the dynamic? and that's the thing that he has to think about, and frankly, all of the members of the house republican conference have to think about. >> is it a job you would want at this point? >> oh, i have no plans to run for speaker at this time, but you know, anything's possible in this world. >> all right, congressman charles dent, thank you so much for your time. >> thank you. >> greatly appreciate it. >> thanks, tamron. >> absolutely. developing now, republican presidential candidate ben carson facing backlash again for controversial comments that he's made. this time, the remarks are about nazi germany and the holocaust. the anti-defamation league is now slamming carson for suggesting in his new book just out this week that the holocaust could have been prevented if jews had been better armed, had

better access to guns, a view he repeated in an interview just yesterday. >> i think the likelihood of hitler being able to accomplish his goals would have been greatly diminished if the people had been armed. but realize there was a reason that they took the guns first, right? >> so, you believe that if they had guns, maybe it could have been eased, is that what you're saying? >> i'm telling you that there is a reason that these dictatorial people take the guns first. >> the anti-defamation league called those statements "historically inaccurate." and while ben carson continues to generate controversial headlines, the candidate he's trying to catch up with in the polls, donald trump, appears re-energized on the campaign trail, speaking for over an hour in front of a packed crowd in las vegas. trump complained of all things about his photograph in "people" magazine, calling it unflattering. he then brought this fired-up supporter to the podium. >> where are you from? >> i'm from colombia!

>> colombia! and this is a setup? did i ever meet you before? huh? >> i'm hispanic and i vote for mr. trump! we vote for mr. trump! yes, mr. trump! we love you! >> let me bring in our political panel today, matt k. lewis is a senior contributor for "the daily caller and "jane walsh is msnbc political analyst, national affairs correspondent for "the nation." matt, i'll start with you. we won't pick up on that woman and her exuberance. we will talk about it, but i want your thoughts on what's happening in the house here. you heard my interview with the congressman, willing to support paul ryan, but he is greatly concerned about a side of the house republicans that he believes are disruptive and could potentially cause problems, including impacting the 2016 presidential race. >> yeah, look, i think it's a well-founded concern. you know, paul ryan, it's like the obi wan kenobi candidate.

help us, obi wan, you're our only hope. who knows what he's going to decide? it's a thankless job. it involves herding cats. and no good deed goes unpunished. will he be drafted? it's unclear. but look, i think that things are really chaotic right now, and this is a microcosm of the larger chaos happening. but i do want to caution everybody, sometimes things look really bad and they turn around. in 1976, you know, in the post-watergate era, the republican party looked doomed. and of course, you end up with ronald reagan a few years later. so, it looks horrible, but who knows what the future may hold? you could potentially have a republican president, a republican senate and a republican house in 2016. >> you could, and potentially, your nominee could be ben carson, matt. he's in second place right now in those polls. what do you think of the comments that he's made regarding the holocaust? these aren't off-the-cuff comments. this is actually an excerpt from

a book, a newly released book. >> yeah. first of all, what in the heck is he doing opining on nazi germany and hitler? it's crazy for someone running for president to really go there. clearly, look, i mean, let's be honest, authoritarian regimes, of course, confiscate guns. that's part of what they do to stem, you know, to make sure there's not a resistance. i think the notion that had people -- and by the way, i think i can opine on these things, i'm not running for president. and i think it's fair to say that the notion that had jews been armed, that that alone would have been able to stop the holocaust seems dubious at best. >> at best. and joan, you have this following, of course, the comments in oregon, saying that, you know, if he were in a situation, he'd say, hey, come on, guys, neglecting the fact that 20 of those killed in newtown were children. >> children. >> what were they expected to do to protect themselves? >> remember, they're teachers. >> the teachers are supposed to rally there. and while many of the teachers

took those children in closets, attempting to save their lives and hide them, carson in his book wrote, "through a combination of removing guns and disseminating propaganda, the nazis were able to carry out their evil intentions with relatively little resistance." the anti-defamation league has pointed out, has come out against these comments here. carson asked about them yesterday, sticking by them. but we cannot negate that he is still number two in the polls. >> he's number two. this may take a toll, because he sounds crazy. but on the other hand, the base has shown an appetite for cruel and delusional comments. okay, you're not supposed to bring up the holocaust. we all know that. talking about nazi germany never ends well. but you know, this is a guy that compared obamacare to slavery. so, he's got this history. he's this mild-mannered seeming guy, soft-spoken, obviously very bright, who's got this history of very cruel and kind of crazy statements, but he's still -- >> do you think that's a part of it, because he has this very mild delivery -- >> i do. >> -- not that same, you know, strong presence of a donald trump.

>> right. >> and that these things that he said that are highly controversial don't get the same pushback? >> they don't have the edge, i think, because he's not shouting them. he's saying them in a very well-spoken edge. but i think they are getting the attention, tamron. and i think this thing about guns, too, it's also playing to the fever swamps of the right wing, where people believe that obama is coming for their guns. and you know, there are all these conspiracy theories about that since he took office. none of them are true. but the paranoia just grows. and you know, ben carson -- i'm not saying he doesn't believe this -- he may well believe it but he certainly knows that this is a ticket to at least that portion, that strident portion of the base. >> and matt, carson's comments from oregon to the holocaust have given donald trump an opening, if he chooses to attack ben carson as he has with other candidates. he's not taken on ben carson, which is very interesting. i do want to play what he said, donald trump, this morning, regarding the dip in the polls, just the slight dip that we're seeing with him.

>> and i made this statement that, well, you know, if i could see i wasn't going to win, and if my numbers were really terrible and if you wouldn't call and everybody's not calling, if i saw it wasn't going to happen, of course i would. the next day, headline's "trump considering maybe getting out." it was so ridiculous. >> yeah. >> so, you know what i say right now? give more of a political answer. i'm never getting out. >> he's never getting out, and that scene -- and we can roll the "b" roll of the woman running up on stage. we've seen some of his fans be excited, but we cannot neglect the fact that this was a latino voter. she says she's a voter. there you have his numbers. 11% of latinos had a very negative -- or a very positive or somewhat positive view of him. 15% say they had a neutral. but 67% had a very negative view of donald trump. you talk about a gift given to him yesterday. he was so excited. he couldn't focus on the "people" magazine cover because he was so thrilled to have this woman. you see him in the video holding

her hands up as someone he will likely point to as proof that he's picking up steam with latino voters. >> yeah. reminded me of "the price is right," when somebody runs up on stage and is so excited. look, who knows if it was a setup? i'm going to assume it was legitimate. >> yeah. >> but it's completely anecdotal. sure, is it possible that there are dozens, even, of hispanics who love donald trump? of course. but i think in the long term, and if you look at the polling, donald trump does really well with a certain segment of the population that tends to be older, whiter, and non college educated, in fact. and that just happens to be a big problem that the republican party has, is that -- and the conservative movement. in order to grow, they have to reach out to some people who don't fit into that cohort. so, donald trump, i think if he's the nominee, would spell long-term disaster for the republican party. >> and quickly, joan, he pushed back really hard on this notion

that he would drop out of the race if he saw a dip in the polls. clearly, he was being flippant when he made the comment on "meet the press." >> right. >> but he's had time to think about it, and he doesn't like the feedback of, oh, you're really not in it unless you're on top of every poll. >> this is probably the only thing that i agree with donald trump on. i do think those remarks were kind of inflated. it sounded like he was saying, if the impossible happens, and i really crater going around with 2%, i would pull out, but not if i dip or, you know. i think that was misinterpreted. i think otherwise, you know, the criticism he gets in the media and elsewhere is very fair. as matt says, he dooms the republican party to really only appealing to an older, white, mostly male base, and the party can't survive past the next ten years with that kind of voter base. >> all right, joan. thank you so much. matt, it's a great pleasure having you on as well. thank you both. >> thank you. >> thank you. turning to more breaking news, the obama administration is officially ending the military's $500 million program to train and equip syrian rebels

in the fight against isis. defense officials say that program only yielded about four or five trained rebels, and many of the arms provided to moderate syrian rebels have fallen into the wrong hands, including an al qaeda-backed group. addressing reporters just a short time ago, defense secretary ash carter acknowledged the program was not working but said the u.s. will still need a strategy to help moderate rebels defeat isis. >> we have been looking for now several weeks at ways to improve that program. i wasn't satisfied with the early efforts in that regard. and so, we're looking at different ways to achieve, basically, the same kind of strategic objective, which is the right one, which is to enable capable, motivated forces on the ground. >> nbc's ron allen is live at

the white house with more. ron, what are we hearing? obviously, people are now confused by this. this was supposed to be the plan "a." so, then it asked what's the plan "b"? and at the point that the administration knew only four to five rebels had been trained, why not change this program or this train and equip mission sooner? >> reporter: well, it's hard to say "a," "b," "c," "d." and the critics of the administration would say that there never has been a plan, a coherent plan, or a plan that's successful or going to be successful. the essence of the problem, of course, is that the u.s. military is not going to put boots on the ground in syria. most of the strategy there involves air strikes against isis targets, and those have been of limited effect based on what we're hearing from there. so, now they're saying, essentially, they're going to focus their efforts on established units there on the ground, try to train and equip them. and the part of the country where they've had the most success has been in the kurdish areas of syria and iraq, not the heart of syria, if you will.

there's been some success the united states has had on the ground militarily when they've been able to work with established military units, which are few and far between. and of course, now this whole situation is complicated by the fact that the russians have severely, seriously escalated their involvement here militarily. they've fired cruise missiles, they've launched air strikes, they've got ground troops. they've established a base there, all of which is in support of the regime of bashar al assad there, which is not what the united states wants to see happen there. they want to see the russians and others attack isis targets, which the russians are not doing. so, the bottom line here, tamron, is that the united states' strategy in syria has been complicated and not very effective for a long time. they're trying to refine it. they're trying to get past this embarrassment, these revelations that only a few fighters were trained and that significant amounts of arms were surrendered to the opposition. but until the united states -- and we won't -- put troops on

the ground, or our coalition partners put troops on the ground, there's really going to be this problem of how do you really effect change from the air alone and by trying to use essentially proxy fighters on the ground? so, we'll hear more details about what they're trying to do today to try and resolve this ongoing problem that's led to hundreds of thousands of deaths and refugees and migrants and just continuing to deepen crisis there. >> all right, ron allen live from the white house. developing now, protesters are planned for president obama's visit to roseburg, oregon, today. the president will meet with victims' families and survivors of the community college shooting there. a live report is next. and this -- >> i have a 1-year-old son and i try to take care of him by myself, but i'm begging you, please, please, don't. >> a florida judge is being criticized for sentencing a

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developing now, one person is dead, three others are injured after another campus shooting. this happened around 1:20 a.m. at the northern arizona university in flagstaff. police say the suspect, identified as 18-year-old steven jones, opened fire after an altercation between two groups of students outside a dorm housing fraternity members. jones remains in custody. the delta chi fraternity has released a statement confirming the shooting involved some of its members. also developing, thousands of protesters are expected in

oregon today as president obama meets with families and victims of last week's mass shooting at a college that left ten people dead. the president left just a short time ago for roseburg, where at least three events are planned to protest the visit, organized by people claiming that the president is turning the tragedy into politics. a facebook page called "defend roseburg" tells attendees it's their right if they want to bring a gun but to keep them secure to "show the world that american gun owners are responsible patriots." roseburg's mayor says officials are welcoming president obama to town, despite their political differences. and at least one survivor's family has turned down the invitation. >> on principle, i find that i am, you know, in disagreement with his policies on gun control. and therefore, we will not be attending the visit. >> and joining me now from roseburg is msnbc's jacob soboroff. and jacob, the white house has

released a statement, saying the president's visit is more there to offer his support for the victims and condolences and not about gun law. >> reporter: yeah, that's exactly right, tamron. you know, this is going to be a very emotional and historic day here in roseburg on many levels. we expect to see the president most likely fly probably directly above us in marine one to downtown roseburg, which is directly behind me, to meet with the family members of the victims and some of the survivors. but he is also going to face sizable protests. as you said, maybe thousands strong. it's something that white house press secretary josh earnest was asked directly about yesterday, and this is what he had to say -- "the president has made clear that the goal of his visit is to spend time with the families of those who are so deeply affected by this terrible tragedy." and tamron, as a matter of fact, this is not the first time that a president has visited oregon following a school shooting. bill clinton was in springfield in 1998, and that double visit is not a distinction any state wants to have. >> and just going back to this facebook page where the person,

the organizers encouraging attendees or telling them it's their right if they want to bring a gun, but keep them secure to "show the world that american gun owners are responsible patriots." obviously, that increases tension there. what are local authorities saying to make sure, obviously, that everyone is responsible and safe? >> reporter: well, that's exactly the point, tamron. you know, the local authorities will be following the letter of the law here, but there are, you know, i would say that the gun control laws here are in the middle of the road, you know. even the campus of umpqua community college permits people to conceal a weapon on campus. and i think that the people here in this community want everybody to know that. >> all right. thank you very much. we'll follow the president's visit to oregon and all of the details that come from that visit. and up next, thank you, jacob, a respected professor at the university of texas says that he plans to resign over a new law in that state that allows concealed handguns on campus. i'll talk with that professor next. also ahead, vice president

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it's the brand more doctorsose recommend for minor arthritis pain. plus, just two aleve can last all day. you'd need 6 tylenol arthritis to do that. aleve. all day strong. welcome back. we've got some breaking news regarding the chaos in congress regarding the search for republicans to find a speaker of the house. we reported at the top of the hour that paul ryan was going home to wisconsin to meet with his family to debate whether or not he would take on the position. well, now we're just getting word in. a spokesperson for paul ryan indicating that chairman ryan appreciates the support he's getting from his colleagues, but he is still not -- he is still not running for speaker. so, the search continues. and at this hour, despite the earlier reports indicating that paul ryan had gone from no to let me consider this, he's back

at, according to his spokesperson, a no, that he is not running for speaker. well, fears of another school shooting have escalated the contentious debate over the so-called campus carry gun law in texas. now, that law allows licenses gun owners to carry their concealed weapons in classrooms, in dorms and other campus buildings. it's set to go into effect next fall. now, amid the backlash, one of the most esteemed professors at the university in texas has just announced his resignation, citing fears for his safety. in a letter to the university's president, professor emeritus daniel hemmerman writes "with a huge group of students, my perception that a risk of a disgruntled student bringing a gun into the classroom and shooting at me has been substantially enhanced by the concealed carry law." and the professor joins me now. professor, thank you so much for your time. >> my pleasure. >> you've taught at the university of texas since 1993.

prior to that, princeton, michigan. you're well respected with your colleagues, with many of your students as well. but obviously, this had to be a tough decision. but what was the, i guess the last straw that made you want to give up your position? >> it was this passage of this campus concealed carry law. we've always had concealed carry for 20 years on the campus, but now they can bring concealed guns into my classroom, all 500 students. and a student can come to my office with a gun hidden, gets upset about something, a grade, and pulls out the gun at me. i don't want to put up with that. the risk isn't worth it. >> there's an organization called students for concealed carry. they posted a statement on their facebook page, calling you a "false martyr." they write, "given that professor hamermesh tendered his resignation two semesters earlier than planned and now intends to take a job at an elite university halfway around the world, his decision to publicly blame a law that would not have impacted his class

wreaks of political opportunism. opponents of campus carry needed a martyr, and they found one in a professor who was on his way out anyway." your reaction to that organization? >> in some sense, they're right. this is a cheap bit of courage on my part, and i'm fortunate in the sense that i have lots of alternatives. i'm old with a very good pension. and therefore, i can do this. i think the real problem is not me. i don't view myself as a martyr or a poster boy. the real problem is this creates an atmosphere and a feeling among others who might come here that this is a bad place to be, and it hurts texas's ability to recruit good faculty. people we might recruit have lots of alternatives. this makes our alternative less attractive. >> what kind of support are you getting from other professors at ut? >> well, i haven't done a poll of all 3,000 faculty members, but i think with one exception, i've gotten nothing but favorable comments. some people saying i wish i was

in your position to get out of here. so, yes, mostly favorable. >> as i pointed out, the law goes into effect august 1st, 2016. that happens to be the 50th anniversary of the day charles whitman climbed to the top of the ut clock tower, shooting 43, killing 13. being at texas, obviously, that's a day of infamy in our state and at that university. with that said, is there anything that would convince you to change your mind at this point? >> no. at this point, i think the dye is cast. but in any case, i can't imagine the administration of this university putting the law into effect in any way other than to allow people to carry guns into my office and into my classroom. i don't think that's going to happen, and therefore, i want out. >> professor, thank you so much for your time. we greatly appreciate you joining us. thank you. >> thank you. coming up, a florida judge is under fire for this dramatic confrontation that played out in a courtroom. >> why didn't you show up to court? >> i just -- my anxiety, and i'm

just -- >> you think you're going to have anxiety now? you haven't even seen anxiety. >> she sentenced a domestic violence victim to jail, the judge did, for not showing up at her alleged attacker's trial. more of what happened in that courtroom and why people who stand up for domestic violence victims are concerned the case could impact many others. plus, more on the breaking news from capitol hill. we just heard a new statement from paul ryan's spokesperson, indicating the congressman is not running for speaker. so, if not paul ryan, then who? and what does this mean for john boehner? does this mean he sticks around for a lot longer than he had planned? nbc's senior political editor mark murray is next.

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at ally bank no branches equals great rates. it's a fact. kind of like shopping hungry equals overshopping. the scramble is on on capitol hill as the search continues for a speaker of the

house. his spokesperson just in the last few minutes indicating that paul ryan is still not running for house speaker. joining me live now, nbc news senior political editor mark murray. mark, let's just talk about how remarkable this is. yesterday you have kevin mccarthy surprising everyone, even though there are a few pundits who said that they kind of saw this coming, but in reality, no one really did, other than kevin mccarthy. he says, you know, i'm out of this, i'm out of this race this morning. paul ryan indicating that he may think about it over the weekend after the interview with luke russert saying no, and now we are back to i am not in this, i am not running. >> tamron, it's remarkable. and you might be able to look at that statement that paul ryan's office ended up giving our nbc's alex moe on capitol hill and say, you know, maybe if you look at it, i'm still not running, that maybe there is a little bit of wiggle room. but i think we should take it at face value, that if he really wanted to be speaker of the house, he would have put out a

statement saying i'm carefully considering this or i've decided to throw my hat into the ring, and we haven't seen anything like that. and so, tamron, if you do take paul ryan off the table, the question is, who's next? and really, from every indication on capitol hill, there isn't someone right now who could get the 218 votes needed to be speaker and need e to actually on the republican side get the blessing of the entire republican caucus. and if that is the situation and there is a scramble to find someone, i wouldn't be surprised if house speaker john boehner has to stay in his job a few weeks, if not a few months more. >> you know, that scream you just heard is john boehner somewhere screaming at the -- >> he won't be doing "zip-a-dee-doo-dah" anymore. >> right, we all just heard john boehner scream. trey gowdy, greg waldon, darrell issa this morning on "morning joe" expressed his interest. a lot of talk, though, with

daniel webster. and some of the support from the more conservative members of the party. what do you make of that list? >> yeah. and tamron, from my colleague who's been on capitol hill, daniel webster, who had already thrown his hat into the ring for the speaker race before we found out kevin mccarthy and him dropping out yesterday. he said he's still in this race. one other name to add to the list would be peter rask yom from illinois. his name has also coming up. the question is, if not paul ryan, who else? i think that is the takeaway at least from this current statement we got from paul ryan. there was this thought earlier this morning that paul ryan would essentially do it, even on a temporary basis, because there is no other option. as my colleague, luke russert, puts it, he'd fall on a grenade just to help the party. but again, if it's paul ryan -- if we are to take this statement at face value, this means there's a mad scramble on for

someone else. and we just don't know who that person would be, and can they actually get the votes? >> the larger picture here, mark, how do you describe the state of the republican party in the house? >> tamron, i actually wouldn't describe it just in the house. i would take it the entire republican party, as we even see on the campaign trail with donald trump, ben carson and carly fiorina, almost your one, two, three in the current polling. and this is a party in which leaders don't matter as much as they used to. you don't have the party discipline that the elites aren't necessarily calling the shots. now, it's important to note, back in the 2014 midterm cycle, we saw the establishment more often than not end upbeating the tea party and beating the insurgent rebels. in fact, the only casualty was eric cantor in the 2014 midterm cycle, when he ended up losing his primary race. but right now, we're seeing something where there just isn't cohesi cohesion, where there is a mad scramble, where there isn't trust in party leaders, where the leaders actually want to hit the eject button as soon as possible. and if at this stage -- and we

have a long ways before election day 2014, tamron -- it's not a good sign for the gop. >> i point out house republicans, because as you well know from the first time we uttered the words the tea party, to the tea party caucus, some of the support that the more conservative members have offered to help someone like a ted cruz become a household name, especially for those who are politically engaged -- a lot of that anger that donald trump has been able to capitalize on right now, it started with house republicans. and you and i both remember so many headlines of john boehner saying, you know, it's like herding cats and that constant struggle that's boiled and now boiled over with him wanting out of that job, and it started with house republicans. >> and tamron, what it really comes down to, when you're just looking at house republicans, is just the functioning of being able to govern in divided government. and i do think that that is when house republicans took over the house of representatives in 2011, now we see republicans are in charge of the united states

senate after their 2014 midterm victories. and there is a sense of not sometimes doing what needs to be done to govern, to make the compromises necessary just to do the basic functions of government. and with this instability in congress right now, tamron, we have a debt ceiling vote that's going to come up in november, potential default. we have to keep the government open come december. these are just the basic functions, the bare minimum that needs to be done, and that is up in the air as things stand right now. >> it is up in the air, and you already have some republicans who don't believe that speaker john boehner, if he has to stick on, can lead through some of those battles. we heard that just this morning. but we're going to continue to follow this breaking news. mark, thank you for sticking around. we'll be right back with more breaking news on what's happening on capitol hill. and as mark pointed out, if not paul ryan, then who? per! its official, i work for ge!! what? wow... yeah! okay...

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thinner. even curvier. but what's next? for all binge watchers. movie geeks. sports freaks. x1 from xfinity will change the way you experience tv. welcome back. october is domestic violence awareness month. there is outrage today after a

video surfaced of a florida judge scolding a victim and then sending her to jail. the woman failed to show up in court to testify against her husband, who she says choked her and threatened her at knife point and put her head in a microwave in front of their 1-year-old son. this happened in april. the video is from a court appearance in july when judge jerry collins ordered the woman to explain why she didn't appear for trial. the woman apologized, saying she had suffered from depression and anxiety since the attack. >> why didn't you show up to court? >> just my anxiety and -- >> you think you don't have anxiety now? you haven't seen anxiety. we had a jury, six people there ready to try mr. [ bleep ] who had a prior criminal history of domestic violence. >> obviously we protected the identity of the woman. you hear her there.

she sobs when the judge sentences her to three days in jail for contempt of court. >> turn around. >> judge, i'll do anything, please. please. >> you should have showed up. >> i have a 1-year-old son and i'm trying to take care of him by myself. i'm begging you, please, don't put me in jail. >> i already issued my order. >> joining me, leslie morgan steiner, a survivor of domestic violence herself. what is your reaction to what happened in court there? >> well, tamron, it's a heartbreaking case. it shows three terrible obstacles domestic violence victims face when they go to court. one is the judge here is female and it just goes to show that women can be just as awful to domestic violence victims as men can. the second thing it shows is

how -- the judge knows she's being taped. she knows there's a record of it. she has no compunction about being cruel and continuing to abuse this poor victim who is crying the whole time. lastly, it shows how desperately we need the federal government, particularly the justice department, to educate judges and family court judges in particular about the complexity and lethality of domestic violence because this was not justice. this was further abuse of a victim and we cannot allow this to happen in our country. >> the prosecutor in the case released a statement saying the victim refused to attend court the day of the trial, going so far as to tell the state attorney's office that she didn't care if she was arrested as a result of her not complying with the court subpoena. how often do you see this where a victim or alleged victim is sent to jail, found in contempt for not testifying or showing up? >> well, it's rare that somebody is sent to jail. i think the judge had a lot of options here. she could have given the victim

a second chance, showed some compassion and support for this poor woman. but it's a very real problem that we in the domestic violence community must address that victims often recant and they do not want to prosecute their abusers. there are very good reasons. they are terrified of facing their abuser in court. they don't want their abuser to be penalized because often, they are their financial support. so again, it's complicated and we need to give victims the support they need so that they can go to court. >> leslie, thank you for joining us and discussing this story so many are talking about. let me go back to the breaking news regarding congressman paul ryan. a few minutes ago his spokesperson indicated that ryan is not running for speaker despite support that he's received. msnbc's steve kornacki joins us. he got the support, he said he was going home for the weekend to think about it. we don't know if the plane ever got in the air but we know paul ryan is out. >> i wouldn't necessarily say

he's 100% out yet. i would parse this statement where he says still not running. so he's saying the status hasn't changed, you could add as of yet. that still allows the possibility that he goes home for the weekend, talks about it with the family. i think the wild card in all of this is how much more pressure does he receive over the weekend. how many more republican luminaries weigh in on it. we know he doesn't want the job. certainly if he takes the weekend, takes a few more days, he would be hoping that somebody else emerges, a consensus candidate emerges, he doesn't have to take it. >> why then lead reporters like yourself to go okay, maybe he meant this, meant that. he knows the stakes. he knows the headline is chaos in congress at a time where lindsey graham, for example, indicated if they don't get it together, there's a meltdown, there affects the presidential race and a couple key budget debates happening right now. it simply could be a silence from him as opposed to this ubiquitous or strangely worded

statement from his spokesperson. he didn't have to say that. >> he didn't have to say it but again, i think he didn't say i'm not going to run for speaker. he said he's still not running. we know he doesn't want the job. we have known for a long time he doesn't want the job. it still leaves out the possibility that nobody else emerges who can unite the entire conference and over the weekend, republican leaders continue to call him and tell him that. the other part of this is we know he doesn't want the job in part because it's such a difficult job to have right now. you have to keep the house freedom caucus happy. keeping it united, boehner couldn't do that, mccarthy clearly wasn't going to be able to do that. the longer he holds out and the more desperate the situation becomes, if they do finally turn to him, he will have more leverage then than he does now so if he's looking at this as an impossible job to keep the caucus, keep the conference united, if he really has to wait until the last minute to be called in to save the day, he'll have more leverage to make more demands to set more conditions and he may be able to impose a little more discipline as speaker than somebody like john

boehner. >> who has more leverage than paul ryan right now on thank list? no one. >> but if he says no right now and you go through the weekend and nobody else emerges or a couple other names are floated and shot down by the house freedom caucus, his leverage does increase. >> now we know. still not running, subject to interpretation. >> could be. could be. >> we'll see what happens. that does it for this hour of "msnbc live." i'm tamron hall. up next, "andrea mitchell reports." her interview with presidential candidate ben carson. e not confr company's data is secure, the possibility of a breach can quickly become the only thing you think about. that's where at&t can help. at at&t we monitor our network traffic so we can see things others can't. mitigating risks across your business. leaving you free to focus on what matters most.

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