can he sustain it or it will end as badly as it did for folks like perry, walker, carson, fiorina? this is "mtp daily" and it starts right now. >> good evening, i'm chuck todd, welcome to "mtp daily." here's tonight's take. with just 25 days to go until iowa does feel like the establishment is staring at their clip boards on the bench, rather than playing a full-court press. kasich, bush and christie all fighting for elbow room in new hampshire. who is missing from the tight? marco rubio. he's hoping to ride out the storm in iowa, a caucus contest that's been surrendered to the outsider wing of the party. rubio isn't hoping for a cinderella story in iowa. he's hoping to run out the clock. why? it might be the rubio campaign is watching the arc of what's happened in the past couple of

years. most of the non-trump candidates have seen a boom on the national scene, only to watch it fizzle in a couple of weeks. but chris christie, the break-out moment he's feeling right now, might not be all that it's cracked up to be. this week, christie is the beneficiary of the most buzz and relishing a shower of attention via new hampshire attack ads. he said, quote, it's good to be attacked, it means i'm in the game. but christie's advance didn't mean sustainability. his campaign is running on fumes and his bubble could burst too soon. let's look at the arc of this republican primary. starts way back in 2013. when "vogue" magazine asks if rand paul can win the presidency. not long after that, chris christie wins re-election as new jersey governor and sets off a biz himself. by 2014, jeb bush was making the rounds, but it was his december noumtz to explore a 2016 run.

the candidate had another rising star to worry about. it was one year ago, january 2015, when conservatives in iowa took notice of scott walker. the wisconsin governor rocked the iowa freedom summit, telling them that his crackdown on unions could be a reality for the country. six months later with walker flailing, bush hoped to take back the buzz, but that came to a screeching halt one day later. when donald trump entered the race and that story is still going. while trump has dominated coverage of the race, he hasn't stopped candidates from getting their own political booms, however short-lived they might be. john kasich had a moment in the sun after benefitting from home-field advantage in the first debate. carly fiorina showed it was possible to climb up from the undercard and enjoyed a boost in the poll, temporarily. ben carson snuck up on trump and got under his skin, reaching a tie with trump in october.

rubio flew relatively under the radar until his swift shutdown of an attack from bush stole the show. ted cruz ended the year surpassing trump's numbers in iowa and looking like the one to beat in the hawkeye state. cruz has been the only candidate to sustain his momentum so far, while others seized on break-out moments, cruz has been more disciplined and not faded away. but while he's the candidate to beat in iowa, he hasn't won anything yet. for a candidate to hit the campaign lottery, their buzz must hit at the same time as the voting. the last guy to did that at an all important primary was in 2012. while the caucus night result was uncler to begin with, ultimately santorum pulled off victory in iowa, the perfect storm of ground work and timing that bumped mitt romney from taking that state. so as the tides change rapidly this time of year, could we still yet see more turns in this race before caucus night?

rick santorum cracked the code in 2012, he's facing a steeper battle this type. and joining me now, the former senator and current presidential candidate rick santorum, welcome back, sir. >> thank you, chuck. good to be with you. >> i saw you smiling there a little bit as i went through this. what's been a -- >> very familiar to me. >> it is. it's been a roller coaster. >> it has. and very much, you know, people said the election, this election isn't going to be like the last one. it isn't. there's a lot more players, there's a trump factor, which is clearly different. the nationalization of this race because of the debates and the segregation of the two tiers of the debate, all of those things have made it much more difficult for people to rise and to sustain. having said that all, we've seen the same pattern, as you mentioned, which is people having their moment and not being able to sustain that moment, and that's where i sort of banking on doing what we did

last time around. keep your head down, work hard, build momentum at the right time, which is in iowa, 50% of iowa voters don't decide until the last week, and that's what i'm counting on. >> there's a little bit of difference between ted cruz perhaps right now and yourself or even yourself last time. he has money and resources, you didn't have. in fact, you were all of a sudden, you were trying to get the money and almost build a national campaign on the run after your upset in iowa. and that arguably made it harder for you to defeat romney. why can this time be different for you? >> well, it's going to depend on the voters. money's a factor, and clearly it was a factor. but if you look at the fact that mitt romney outspent us 6-1 in many states and some of the states we actual even won. money is a factor, but it's not the deciding factor. the deciding factor is whether you're connecting with voters, whether your message is one

that's authentic and whether people see you as a believable presidential nominee. and that's going to take the time that this month avails of the people of iowa to make that decision. >> well, let's talk about the two guys you're chasing in iowa, trump and cruz. >> right. >> i followed your career a long time. ted cruz, arguably the social conservative that you were to -- that you are. donald trump, the populist, working-class candidate that he's purporting to be. you sort of merge those two things, very effectively. but this time, the two guys you're chasing have a piece of your message. does it make it harder to catch them? >> i would agree with that. they've taken a piece of that message. i'm flattered by that, that donald trump is using the themes that i talked about, talking about immigration and the things that i think are very important for the republican party to

begin to emphasize if we're going to be a party to win the states that we need to win. i just believe that we're a more credible messenger, having won pennsylvania, having worked in these areas, having policies that i think are going to be much more compelling and being able to go up against a hillary clinton, looking for someone with a track record to show that you can accomplish those things. and on ted cruz, again, i've got the social conservative track record. he doesn't. he talks a good game. but there's a difference between someone who has done things in these areas and someone who parrots those. >> this electorate almost looks at political experience as a negative. i looked at your ad that went after cruz and the first observation, i'm going, you're talking about your senate record and i'm thinking, there are going to be voters saying, yeah, he's part of the problem. what do you say to that voter?

>> i can't argue that's the way it's been up to date. i believe that there's going to be a regression to the mean. if you look at the republican primaries in the past, you've had to have three things happen to you, or you weren't a republican nominee over the last 50 years. you were the vice president, the son of a president, or you ran before and you lost. and the reality is that republicans generally speaking don't take a pick and a poke. as angry as they are, i believe that ultimately when it comes down to it, that iowa voters and i think republican voters generally are going to look at the tough job that we have before us and realize that eight years ago, we did do that. we took somebody who had no experience, someone who had a lot of confidence in himself but not a lot of track record of working together and get things done. and it's worked out as a disaster for the country and i'm hoping republicans aren't going to make that same mistake. >> let me ask you about the news of the day in north korea.

how do you deal with who, many in government have called him a maniac, crazy guy, you know, this guy might be unstable. how do you deal with this? >> well, he is all of those things, but in and respects, he's a rational actor in this respect. he doesn't want to die. that's the big problem we have with iran and isis and these radicals in the middle east. they don't care about dying. in fact, they sort of seeing that as -- >> isn't that why iran came to the table? they are more rational actors than north korea? >> i don't believe iran is a rational actor. they came to the table and they stole not just the deal, the table, the chairs and everything else. they didn't give up anything. and they're not complying with any major terms of the agreement. they're launching ballistic missiles, not allowing access to their sites to determine whether the extent of their nuclear program -- all of those things

are a violation. i think iran is a theocracy, that is not a rational actor in this respect. they don't care about whether they die or not. i think north korea does. north korea, you can use the same tactics that we used on every communist regime in the past and that's mutual assured destruction. i think that would be effective against north korea. not too sure it's effective against isis and iran. >> so you would be threatening, basically president santorum would do what to north korea to get them to stop their nuclear program? >> north korea has a nuclear program so it's not -- >> what would you do to stop it? >> i'm not sure there's much you can do. you can't put the jeannie back in the bottle. that's why i'm so upset with the iran deal, because it puts iran on a path to a nuclear weapon which they do not have right now, and would not have if we had a better leader in place.

>> so you didn't really tell me what you would do about north korea? >> well, the policy of north korea is the policy of containment, of saying that we will respond if north korea uses any of their weaponry to attack us or our allies and that's -- >> what you're saying is, we're stuck with containment. >> we're stuck with containment with north korea at this point, yes. >> i will leave it there. good to see you, sir. >> thank you. coming up, donald trump's birther bash. and later, we'll get more into north korea. did they really blow up a hydrogen bomb? we'll look at whether the nation is a potential nuclear threat. we'll be right back. doers. they don't worry if something's possible. they just do it. at sears optical, we're committed to bringing them eyewear that works as hard as they do. right now, buy one pair and get another free. quality eyewear for doers.

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regrets? bp has a view.

or at least one. today he sat down with wvit. he was asked about his decision to stay out of this year's presidential race. as usual, here's a very candid response from the vp? >> any regrets to not throwing your hat in the ring? >> sure, i regret it every day. but it was the right decision for my family and for me. and i plan on staying deeply involved, and we've got two good candidates. >> any of us that have spent any time covering the vice president, knows that was a truthful remark. he does regret, he wishes he was in this race. but the vice president went on to say that the battle between sanders and clinton is stirring a robust debate. which means he's not ready to endorse. we'll be back with much more "mtp daily" right after this. and promise me that you'll try that taco place on south street. and we have portfolio planning tools to help you manage your ira. yeah, you're old 401k give me your phone.

the rollover consultants give you step-by-step help. no set-up fees. use your potion. sorry, not you. my pleasure. goodnight, tim. for all the confidence you need. who's tim? td ameritrade. you got this. with toothpaste or plain water.an their dentures and even though their dentures look clean, in reality they're not. if a denture were to be put under a microscope, we can see all the bacteria that still exists on the denture, and that bacteria multiplies very rapidly. that's why dentists recommend cleaning with polident everyday. polident's unique micro clean formula works in just 3 minutes, killing 99.99% of odor causing bacteria. for a cleaner, fresher, brighter denture every day. donald trump, the birther is back. the target this time, ted cruz. here's what trump said in 2013.

>> ted cruz, born in canada. is he eligible to be president of the united states? >> if he was born in canada, perhaps not. that will be ironed out. i don't know the circumstances. i heard that, that's really his thing. >> trump seemed to have his questions answered by 2015. here's how he responded when asked the same question back in september? >> no, from what i understand, everything is fine. i hear that it was checked out by every attorney and every which way, i understand ted is in fine shape. >> you see my pal, john carl, has been on this story with mr. trump. trump's doubts have come roaring back. coincidentally as ted cruz has surged in the polls. here was trump this morning with our pals joe and mika. >> and it's a problem for him, and it's a problem obviously for the republicans because if the -- let's assume he got the nomination and the democrats bring suit. the suit takes two to three years to settle. so how do you run? it's certainly a concern, i

guess for the party, but i hope that's not the case. >> ted cruz, though, is determined not to take the bait and start sparring with trump. >> i tweeted out a response to donald trump's raising questions about my natural born citizenship. it was a link to fonzi jumping the shark, and i think i'm going to let my response stick with that tweet. >> cruz wants to laugh off the issue, but with the iowa caucuses just weeks away, can he afford to take many chances? hallie jackson joins me from sibly, iowa. she's going to get a great blessing in all 99 counties. >> lot of pork chops, chuck. >> i would definitely think. if anything, trump distracted him for the day? >> reporter: that's exactly right. ted cruz was knocked off his message. he didn't want to to be talking about cuba and canada. he wanted to talk about north korea, tying it to the iranian

nuclear deal, this is something he wants to be discussing and he's simply not. you played that bit of him talking about the fonzi tweet. he does want to laugh it off, hoping this will not become an issue, but he was forced to confront it more directly today because people kept asking him about it. >> look, as a legal matter, the question is quite straightforward in settled law, that the child of a u.s. citizen born abroad is a natural-born citizen. people will continue to make political noise about it, but as a legal matter, it's quite straightforward. >> reporter: and one of the things that we've been talking about, is what happens among conservative talk radio circles. we got a little bit of a response today from rush limbaugh who talked about this. he said, if you didn't like donald trump's attacks, what he called liberal attacks on ted cruz, but at this one, he said, have at it, boys. >> he did. and also took a shot at us in

the media, saying they all want me to decide how this goes. i ain't touching it. hallie, thank you very much. let me bring in republican consultant, jamal simmons, and my pal mark murray. trump basically just sparring with him for the day, this probably goes away in 24 hours. but the larger picture, other than donald trump, what is with this issue, why is the rest of the republican field just letting cruz have iowa to himself? >> i think all of them are so focused on being the establishment candidate or the consensus candidate coming out of new hampshire, that they all realize that they will run sort of a distant third behind trump and cruz in iowa at this point and they're not eager to fight over that honor. they'd rather try to knock one out of the race.

so for many of them, they've written iowa off at this point, which is going to allow ted cruz, should he win iowa, to have a lot of momentum moving into the next states. >> mark, these establishment guys who have decided they can't afford to go after cruz right now. they got to beat each other up. they don't exactly start in a strong position as they start questioning each other's conservative credentials. >> right. john kasich expanded medicaid in the state. so did chris christie in new jersey. you look at their poll numbers among conservative republicans, they're not all that great. they might be able to win new hampshire, but to go into the march 1st states, to be able to win, it seems very difficult. one person who does have the ability to go in and upset ted cruz in iowa is marco rubio. and he's been criticized for mot campaigning as aggressively as cruz has lately. but recently rubio has been in iowa a bunch. you'll see him in new hampshire, it will be interesting to see if the campaigning of the last 30

days matters more than the months. >> you're a veteran, let's say -- [ all speak at once ] >> you're managing democratic senate candidate acts, let's say. which republican candidate that's fighting here, is it rubio, is it christie, is it jeb, is it trump, who is it that you want on the top of that republican ticket if you're in a swing state senate race? >> if you're a republican? >> if you're a democrat. >> if you're a democrat, you want donald trump. >> you still think trump? >> absolutely. because i think trump infects the rest of the republican brand. before we get off it quickly, there's something rich about the birther tiger getting let loose in the republican field against a republican candidate after democrats had to live through that for so long. and donald trump is at the center of it once again. >> i guess i go back to the -- so cruz takes iowa. how does he get stopped? >> i think the way they think he

would get stopped is that someone emerges in new hampshire, in whichever of the pack of four establishment-ish republicans does the best in new hampshire. the theory is that all the rest will drop out and say, we throw our support behind christie or rubio. but i think that's a fantasy? >> do you ? >> the idea that someone says i came in third or fourth is now it's game over. i think that's ridiculous. there are so few given out in new hampshire. the incentive to drop out for the good of the party, i don't think that will be particularly strong, unless it looks like a trump nomination. >> i've talked to republican operatives who say trump is so unpredictable, so unpredictable, jamal, let me put this to you, that actually the clinton campaign, they're uncomfortable running against trump, because he doesn't play by an agreed upon set of rules. ted cruz will. >> a friend of mine called him

the flaxen-haired don king, that he will say anything. the danger i think for the clinton campaign, you get somebody like trump and he pivots and starts to become rational going into the fall. but i think that his brand is so bad that it did infect people. it's not helpful. >> let's go back to cruz here. i get the idea, mark, of letting the social conservative candidate win iowa, because that person's never been able to pull it off before. but what's different from santorum, lucka bee and others? this guy has money and organization. >> yeah, and actually the discipline. ted cruz didn't take the bait of the birther charge. he used the fonzi reference on jumping the shark, stated his case and moved on. and he continues to hug donald trump and thinks that this is going to be that percentage of the donald trump plus ted cruz, if he can get a lot of it, that

it catapult him -- >> for a guy that supposedly everybody hates, does anybody ever catch this guy frowning? >> he's kind of a cheerful warrior even when he's warring against his friends and colleagues in the senate. >> as a democrat, i think cruz is much more dangerous than trump. >> starts off with 47, 48% of the vote. >> as pat buchanan used to call, a very good political athlete. you guys are going to stick around, join me later in the show. still ahead, threats named -- athletes named in a doping report are fighting to keep their names clean. and we'll talk with a reporter who uncovered fascinating information about that entire al jazeera story. "the times" got a big scoop and

it's amazing how it's been met with a whimper. >> and alabama judge halts same-sex marriage in the state. we'll look at the ongoing legal battle next. except that managing my symptoms was all i was doing. and when i finally told my doctor, he said humira is for adults like me who have tried other medications but still experience the symptoms of moderate to severe crohn's disease. and that in clinical studies, the majority of patients on humira saw significant symptom relief. and many achieved remission. humira can lower your ability to fight infections, including tuberculosis. serious, sometimes fatal infections and cancers, including lymphoma, have happened; as have blood, liver, and nervous system problems, serious allergic reactions, and new or worsening heart failure. before treatment, get tested for tb. tell your doctor if you've been to areas where certain fungal infections are common, and if you've had tb, hepatitis b, are prone to infections, or have flu-like symptoms or sores.

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shut your mouth and say goodnight mouthbreathers. breathe right roar moore, the once is future chief justice of the alabama supreme court, issued an order today say the constitutional ban on same-sex marriage in the state of alabama remains in effect and that probate judges should stop issues marriage licenses to same-sex couples. despite the ruling by the u.s. supreme court last june that legalized same-sex marriage. with me now, justice correspondent pete williams. has he stopped same-sex marriage in alabama or not? >> i doubt it. i think there will be probate judges who will issue marriage licenses. here's the deal. in march, the alabama supreme court upheld the state's ban on same-sex marriage. then the u.s. supreme court in june said such bans are

unconstitutional. judge moore has said, well, yeah, but the supreme court's ruling applied by his terms only to the four states whose bans were challenged and it's going to be up to the alabama supreme court to decide whether its ban will fall as well. so until the alabama supreme court decides that, probate judges have no authority to issue licenses because of the march ruling. the problem is, he ignores a federal court case in alabama in which a federal judge in may struck down the state's ban and ordered probate judges there not to stop issuing marriage licenses to same-sex couples. in october, the 11th circuit court of appeals, of which bheam is a part, said that the supreme court's decision in june made that alabama supreme court ruling in march legal. so the federal courts have said, the alabama supreme court, it's over. so the problem is here -- >> and this is the ten commandments guy from the past that people might remember. >> he's careful to say, i'm not

deciding the question. i'm just telling you, probate judges, as the chief administrator of the courts in alabama, knock this off, you can't do this until the alabama supreme court rules. the problem is, i think many probate judges will issue marriage licenses anyway. some already were. and they risk being found in contempt of a federal court order if they stopped. >> very quickly, do the feds have to reissue an order? >> no. >> should be null and void? >> a federal court sdig, an appeals court decision, it will get sorted out. i think it's written basically in disappearing ink. >> thank you, sir. "mtp daily," we got a lot more coming up. the white house throws cold water on north korea's claims about a hydrogen bomb. but something clearly happened. what does it mean for our national security and what happens next? but first here's the cnbc market wrap. >> all three of the indices up more than 1%. the dow slides 252 points, the

s&p up 26, closing below 2,000 and the nasdaq shedding 55 points. minutes from the fed reserve's last meeting showing some policy makers thought the decision to raise rates was a close call. the report comes two days before the government's employment data due out on friday. that's it from cnbc, first in business worldwide. with jublia. jublia is a prescription medicine used to treat toenail fungus. use jublia as instructed by your doctor. are you getting this?! most common side effects include ingrown toenail, application site redness, itching, swelling, burning or stinging, blisters, and pain. oh, epic moves, big j! fight it! getting ready for your close-up? ask your doctor if jublia is right for you. visit our website for savings on larger size.

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overnight, north korea claimed that it detonated its first hide yojen bomb. north korea called it a complete success. unlike the atomic bomb which used nuclear fission, hydrogen bombs use nuclear fusion, making it hundreds of times more powerful and more devastating.

the u.n. security council held an emergency meeting, as you might expect. >> the members of the security council strongly condemn this test, a clear threat to international peace and security continues to exist. >> secretary of state john kerry called it highly provocative. but the white house said it probably wasn't an h bomb. >> the initial analysis that's been conducted of the events that were reported overnight is not consistent with north korean claims of a successful hydrogen bomb test. there's nothing that's occurred in the last 24 hours that has caused the united states government to change our assessment of north korea's technical and military capabilities. >> whatever north korea accomplished, though, it certainly shook the world, literally and figuratively. it registered as an earthquake. joining me now is david sanger, national correspondent for "the new york times" and former ambassador to korea under george w. bush. david, let me start with you,

let's get into the facts here. they exploded something. it registered as a 5.1, the equivalent on the richter scale. what do we think they exploded? >> they've done three nuclear tests. the first one under president bush in 2006. this would be their third one under president obama. it's not at all clear that that was a hydrogen bomb. if it had been, it probably would have registered significantly higher on the richter scale. if you compare it to the hydrogen bombs the united states tested in starting in 1952, they would have registered higher. but i think the big issue here is while we were negotiating with iran, putting together an agreement that led iran to ship out 98% of its fuel last week, the north koreans have been moving right ahead on their weapons program, on their

missile program. they're likely to have a good size arsenal, 15, 20 weapons by the end of the year. that's a serious nuclear program and it's one that the united states has tried to deal with, with what they call strategic patience, which doesn't look like it's worked. >> ambassador, this is something you dealt with when you were ambassador over there in south korea. what is he up to, kim jong-un? is he waving his hand, hey look at me, i want some attention, or is there something bigger going on? >> i think there's something bigger going on. i don't think it's the rattling the spoon on the high chair. i think it's basically saying that north korea's going to go forward and be a nuclear state and we're going to have to deal with a new nuclear state as we've done with pakistan and india. and maybe in that context, we can have some mutual nuclear reduction. but they are pretty hell bent on

moving ahead and i think it really speaks to the fact that they don't care what the rest of us are doing, what the rest of us are thinking. the chinese thought they had a deal in the last few months. they thought if they were nicer to them, north korea would refrain from testing. that's gone by the way. i think it's part of their overall nuclear test and whether they were successful with a hydrogen device this time, maybe it didn't work, but they'll probably be at it the next time. so i think we have a big problem and i think as david points out, there's just a certain amount of band width in washington and i think we're very much focused on another part of the world. >> david, where do they get their money to do this? >> they get a fair bit of their money from china, which keeps them alive. they have got a very active counterfeiting operation. they usually have significant drug money and believe it or not, there are still ships that move in and out of north korea with goods all the time. which gets to the critical point of what happens at the united

nations? every time we're in this stance, the north koreans do a test, the they condemn it. but usually china and russia get in the way of any kind of sanction that would threaten the regime. if you cut off their shipping, if you caught off all their trade, it might be as it was on ir iran when they cut off the oil. >> so, ambassador, china losing their patience. could it be different this time? >> well, that's a good thing, but we have rolled a rock up that hill several times. and it's clear that the chinese just haven't developed the kind of consensus they need in their consensus-based system to go after the north koreans. obviously they're furious about this, it's embarrassing. >> this is their sort of backyard state. this would be the equivalent of somehow mexico, i don't mean -- but this is sort of like, hey, china, you want to be a

superpower, you're responsible for this guy? >> you got it. there's a lot of reason to push this back on the chinese, for a lot of good reasons. this is not about a matter of outsourcing foreign policy, but we do have to get serious, look at the chinese, look at all the problems we have with them and try to set some priorities and maybe put this one at or near the top, where we can sit down with the chinese and say, look, we're going to have to address this. and be very clear about this. the chinese worry about a north korean collapse, that the u.s. would take advantage of it. we need to have a deep dive with the chinese on security issues and to try to bolster the consensus within china, which exists within the shanghai business community. they'd throw north korea under the bus in a new york minute. but it's a different view from some of the chinese provinces. >> david, very quickly, japan

and south korea, they seem to have been losing patience about north korea. are they going to force the united states to get tougher? >> i'm not sure they have the capability. the japanese have their own issues with china on territory. the south koreaians know they're under our nuclear umbrella as is japan. so in the end here, this is going to work if the chinese are convinced it's in their own strategic interests. and as chris suggested, you need to have that conversation. there was a little bit of it, we learned, from wikileaks, that the u.s. started to have that conversation. it was a very difficult conversation for the chinese to have. >> and it doesn't feel like it's at the top. i would have gone on longer on this, but we'll have more "mtp daily" right after this. kermit, my man. you ready to fan out? i can't watch the game. what happened? she happened. cut the chit-chat, frog. we got a show to do!

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running again. you got it, former mayor rob ford said he wants that job back that he lost in a crack cocaine scandal. tweeted today, i'll be on the ballot, i'm running in 2018. the when. 6:00 p.m. today the baseball hall of fame will announce new inductees. slugger ken griffey jr and catcher mike piazza are expected to be voted in. tim range should be number three, that's what i say. now the why. jason chaffetz is endorsing marco rubio for president. he said he's the real thing, has a great record and i think he would be just an amazing president. as for the why, chaffetz is another young, high profile republican in rubio's corner. you see a pattern there. up next, we'll get to the how. how new details are raising new questions about the al jazeera sports doping report that included two of the most popular sports figures of the 21st century.

derek jeter and peyton manning. stay tuned. [ scanner beeping ] sir, could you step aside? "sir"? come on. you know who i am. progressive insurance? uh, i save people an average of over $500 when they switch? did you pack your own bags? oh! right -- the name your price tool. it shows people policy options to help fit their budget. [ scanner warbling ] crazy that a big shot like me would pack his own bags, right? [ chuckles ] so, do i have the right to remain handsome? [ chuckles ] wait. uh-oh.

>> now reporting by the "new york times" is adding more fuel to what could potentially be a fire storm. the most well known among the players was peyton manning. al jazeera alleged that manning's wife received shipments of hgh. manning is denying the allegations that he used hgh or any band substances. so are the colts and the broncos. this all comes after charlie

sly, the unpaid pharmacy intern who made the allegations while being recorded unknowingly recanted his statements. but the al jazeera reporter says sly was not their only source. >> what you didn't know until now is that we had a second source. absolutely impeccably placed, knowledgeable, and credible, who confirmed exactly what charlie sly said. >> "the new york times" reporter scrutinized the list of athletes named in the al jazeera report and found in "the times" words, nearly all of them were clients of jason riley, a fitness trainer based in florida. and get this, "the new york times" also reported that jason riley's business partner is none other than charlie sly. together they founded elements nutrition with a z. mike neil and dustin keller were

featured on elements facebook page. another baseball player, ryan zimmerman was on the company's web, but his photo has been removed. howard and zimmerman have filed defamation suits against al jazeera. we've reached out to charlie sly for comment and have not heard back. jason riley's attorney provided this statement. jason does not believe in and does not advocate the use of performance enhancing drugs and would not be involved with anyone using those substances. charlie sly was affiliated with jason riley and elementz, but this association was not related to the use of performance enhancing drugs. al jazeera gave us this response. we're aware of the business relationship between charlie sly and jason riley before we broadcast our documentary. it's not possible to fit eight months of material interest an hour-long documentary about a subject as complex as questions of sports doping. with me now, michael powell, who with his colleagues began to connect these dots.

michael, thanks for joining me. i want to start with that. it was after reading your report that i'm sitting there going, why didn't, if al jazeera who if al jazeera put that in there this looks like the tony bosh business in miami, balco in san francisco. we have seen this story before. >> yes, we have seen this story before. i think in fairness to al jazeera there is this international news network that kind of track the trenderals of this out to vancouver and the bahamas, the overall sports doping. i think americans are fascinated by some of the connections to the sports heroes that are big in the united states such as peyton manning and some of those that you mentioned that are connected through this sports clinic down in florida.

>> why did you guys go public? you make the connect, but it does while you make no allegations and went out of your way to say all of these athletes that were connected, there has been no evidence, but by connecting the dots there is an implication. >> there is an implication, though, of course, it's not unusual to find -- it would not be unusual to find at a sports clinic or at a training facility, some guys who are involved in something and some guys who aren't. we don't know. what i do know is that the attack was entirely on charles sly's credibility, the attack that is in the days right after the al jazeera. he was portrayed as this strange unmade bed of a guy. nobody knew him. and, of course, he then did his own kind of strange recantuation

on yahoo -- i mean on youtube. we said let's try to figure out was he just this kind of strange lone wolf. you start tracking it back and whether up in vancouver with a well known pharmacist or down in florida with a very well known trainer you start to find wait a minute this unmade bed of a guy turns out to have pretty intriguing connections. >> i can't help but wonder, barry bonds wasn't a popular guy. alex rodriguez wasn't a popular guy. peyton manning and some of these other athletes are very popular. you think that is why two are fire storms and one is not? >> i think these guys are coming on the heels of years of this sort of thing. i think there is also a certain i would imagine fatigue on the

part of reporters and fatigue on the part of fans. they look at this don't they all do it? in the case of peyton manning i think it is football. football is a particularly brutal sport. the guy had four neck operations. i think there is a sense that, well, wouldn't you do that? maybe yes, maybe no. if he did it, i want to say if, it is still in violation of the nfl's own rules. >> michael powell, fascinating connecting the dots, old fashioned research. interesting story. thank you for coming on. up next bernie sanders and hillary clinton. the democratic race is pretty feisty, too. get in on the issue of electability and look at the building tension on that side of the race. ♪ ♪

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whenever you need them. so your business can get back to business. sounds like my ride's ready. don't get stuck on hold. reach an expert fast. comcast business. built for business. i have a long record and have been on the forefront of change for decades. i'm a progressive who looks to get things done. i don't need a tour. i know right where the oval office is. >> i think a message is not at ". the message is that hillary clinton is the most electable democrat. >> panel is back. mark murray and jamall simmons. i get the sense democrats think about electability since they lost control of congress.

>> democratic insiders and regular voters think about electability. in order for a democrat to win they have to get atypical voters out. >> it is interesting democratic caucus goers think about electability. >> or electability has been redefined. we have had electable nominees who have not wound up at 1600 pennsylvania avenue. it's been completely redefined. >> bernie sanders made his own case here and he is starting to toughen up against her. >> absolutely. he was going after her on wall street. the last 24 hours have been fascinating because both messages have been. hillary clinton talking about electability and going after republicans. bernie sanders focus on the banks and wall street. it gives primary voters a chance. you probably will vote for hillary clinton.

do you think your biggest opponent is the power structure, corporate media. you are going to vote for bernie sanders. >> let me ask you this. you think democratic primary voters want become or barack obama? >> does hillary clinton know that? >> we were talking about this earlier. i don't understand any effort they take on the campaign to just even lightly distance from barack obama. >> not at all. >> 80% of the time. >> why not 95? >> interesting. because there is a hangover from 2008 particularly with african-american women. she has to get the voters excited about her campaign and turning out in a big number. >> juanita brodrick is on twitter. does bill clinton's past -- is that effective thing? >> hillary clinton's favorables were never higher than the

moment that bill clinton's escapades. it makes hillary clinton the victim again. >> we will be back tomorrow for the thursday edition of mtp daily. with all due respect starts right now. with all due respect to north korea your latest claim is literally kim jong-un believable. the material boy. you have a friend in me. but first oh canada. trump was given the chance to rekindle when the paper asked