>> this guy will say anything. a nasty guy i know why he doesn't have one endorsement from any of his colleagues. >> whenever anyone starts pointing to their actual record they start screaming liar, liar, liar. >> i do not know any progressive who takes $15 million from wall street. >> what has happened to our party? what has happened to the conservative movement? >> the fact of the matter is jeb has no foreign policy experience. >> senator rubio, your five years as senator does not match up to my capabilities. today, once again, the people will pass ultimate judgment with their vote. the nevada caucus and the south carolina primary. i'm chris matthews from las vegas on a day of big stakes hillary clinton and bernie sanders here in nevada. donald trump and his number one challenging ted cruz in south carolina. we're kicking off a big day of politics across two states with much as stake as i said for

nearly every candidate in this race for president. here in vegas it's big casino for national democratic politics if bernie sanders defeats hillary clinton here he'll have scared her in iowa, beaten her in new hampshire and here in nevada. it will be seen as an all-out challenger for the democratic nomination for president. caucus doors close in the next hour. the latest polls show an extremely tight race between secretary clinton and secretary sanders. the big question is, of course, can clinton bund sanders' momentum right now after a big win in new hampshire? he's got the mo and we'll get an answer to that very soon. meanwhile, republicans are voting in south carolina today. in a real primary down there. the latest polls there show donald trump ahead anywhere from, catch this, anywhere from 17 points to 3, so no one knows how close that one is. i've said for weeks, by the way, that things in south carolina would get dirty and they have. yesterday united states congressman mark sanford a ted cruz supporter accused done always trump for being a 9/11

truther, that he said president bush himself was inside 9/11 that's an election eve dirty trick to benefit cruz in a state south carolina where last-minute sleaze has a solid track record. we've got reporters fanned out across both states with candidates and polling places and caucus sites. as soon as we get results this afternoon we'll bring them to you. with us throughout the coverage is john ralston an expert on nevada politics and the host of the las vegas-based, "ralston live" and then an msnbc analyst, tell us, we're sitting -- i'm sitting here talking to our reporters and i'm trying to figure out if there's anything that doesn't meet the eye. is this simply a question of can bernie sanders continue his momentum from new hampshire all the way through this week and overtake hillary clinton? the trend continues he wins. if she blunts that trend it looks like she can hold him off. what do you see beyond that? >> yeah, i think that's the dynamic that's going on right now, chris. but i think what we have to watch today is what's going on

right where you're sitting, in las vegas. and how big a margin hillary can win las vegas by. that's where the minority vote is. about almost half the vote in congressional district one which is urban las vegas, is non-white. she had hoped to dominate there and then hold her own in the rural and northern parts of the state where bernie sanders is thought to be a little bit stronger, but, so i have to tell you i think that -- i -- and i think that -- i'm sorry, chris, i'm getting a lot of feedback in my ear here, i apologize. but up in the north hillary clinton ignored that last time, you may remember, chris, and that's how she lost the delegate fight to barack obama. >> okay. well, thank you, john ralston, will be with us throughout the coverage tonight. it's great to have him. he's an expert. steve kornacki is at 30 rock with a look at the numbers here. do what you always do magically with the numbers and tell us that we can't see when we're looking at people. >> let's look at what will be

happening this afternoon. again, this is one of the caucuses like out in iowa, if you are looking for the raw vote, the number of people who show up today and vote for each candidate we're not going to get that. all we're going to see today are what they call the county delegates, so what we have on the screen here, john's aleuting to this a minute ago, this is what the county map looked like the last time they had kaw diss obama/clinton. in terms of the county delegates clinton won 51% of them in 2008. barack obama won 45% of them and the key, john was just talking about this, around las vegas, clark county, this is a big state geographically, but get this, about 70% of all the vote in nevada today is going to come out of this one county. las vegas basically. las vegas, henderson, right around there. the other lion's share will come from right up here, reno, sparks, about 15% is going to come out of here. and there's another small population center around elko, that's where the big vote is in the state. the rest of the state very

rural, very wide open and as john said, back in 2008, down here, this is where hillary clinton got her vote. this is a heavy latino vote here. up in this part, this is where barack obama won by ten points around reno and this was actually elko, that was barack obama's best county in 2008. the reason that barack obama was able to declare victory in the state in 2008 is they actually give out the national convention delegates by congressional district. another wrinkle in all of this so we got two things to watch for today as these results come in. one, how are the county delegates being allocated, who is winning that battle, hillary clinton won in 2008. then, who is actually getting the national convention delegates and that's where barack obama actually won by won in 2008. >> steve, who is going to get -- which of the counts will be the headlines in the papers tomorrow and all next week, when you say who wins nevada, will it be the one who gets the delegates in the first count today or how it's recalculated later? who wins tonight and over the weekend? how do you decide that? >> 2008 is such a good example

because if you remember how that day played out for the afternoon that the vote was coming in in 2008 the story in the headline was hillary clinton wins. she follows up the win on new hampshire with a win in nevada. >> right. >> then they started doing the computations. these take a while and these are estimates in terms of the national convention delegates but it took about eight hours in 2008 to run the numbers on the national convention delegates and then the obama campaign was able to say, well, look, we're playing a longer game here that has to do with national convention delegates and because hillary clinton's support was so concentrated in the southern part of the state we got one extra delegate, so the obama campaign by the day after was probably winning the headline battle but on the day of in 2008, hillary clinton did. >> well, we have something more to disaggregate later today and tomorrow, of course, according to that, steve, thank you so much. let's bring in nbc's political director and moderate of "meet the press" chuck todd. can you explain for everybody watching how this all fits into the race for president, iowa and new hampshire and now we have this in nevada and how does this

lead into the south carolina democratic primary next week in south carolina and then super tuesday a week later? >> well, look, to me the game here for sanders is what? to prove he can beat her. how do you prove you can beat her. by starting to win in more diverse states. it's one thing to win in iowa and new hampshire, it's another. to me this is why this is such an important day, more for sanders than it is for clinton in this respect. this is the easiest first shot he has over the next ten days, the easiest first shot he has to win a diverse state. and the fact that it comes first is more of a benefit to him, right? because he needs time and he needs momentum. a victory for him in a state that's 30% to 40% nonwhite in the electorate, which is what this will be, it's very winnable for him. the rules are -- play to his strength, same-day voter registration, he brings out a lot of new people. that's why it's so important. if he comes up short, and even though you can sit there and say, well, this is a state she won, she's a -- the problem for

him if he comes up short is this, chris, if you can't win a diverse state under the best of circumstances for your campaign, then where are you going to win? then instead this is going to be a really, really impressive campaign that gets 45% of the national delegates, is a player at the national convention but doesn't get the nomination. that's why today matters so much to him. >> let me ask -- >> a win here he gets to say, i can win in a diverse state, give me more time, i can do it. he'll get -- raise more money and then suddenly the air of inevitability with minority voters goes away with her and starts to go -- starts to sort of leak out of the balloon. >> let's talk about the way the parties pick their candidates. if they were a nationwide caucus, you'd probably get a different result than a nationwide primary. because the passionate people -- >> a little bit. >> -- the ones that really want to vote. bernie, it's all around you, you see it on the campuses and everywhere, people really excited about electing him. >> right. >> the people for hillary may be

more casual and centrist in many cases and may be more used to voting for people they know to and got to know them over time. and here we have a -- what is it the fact that we're having a caucus state here due to help bernie? it seems like it automatically helps bernie. >> look, the caucus process in general always helps base candidates. it happens on the republican side, too, right? the more conservative candidates -- we'll have the minnesota caucuses on super tuesday, it will be one of the big delegate wins, you know, sanders and cruz will likely be the strongest candidates there because, again, it's the same thing, the activists, they're more conservative on the right and the activists more liberal. >> right. >> i'm a proponent, it goes -- the reason you end up having a little bit of both in case people are wondering is that primaries are very expensive to hold and if the state doesn't pay for it, a state party has to figure out how to pay for it. it's a lot cheaper to put a caucus on than a primary and that's the bottom line. and if the state didn't going to

fund a primary, then sometimes the state party has no choice because it seems like to raise all of this money for a primary -- to hold a primary when the state already has the infrastructure to do it, is -- is what makes it i think so prohibitive for these states that don't get help from governments to put on primaries. >> okay. thank you so much chuck todd as always with me. with me are kristen welker who covers the clinton campaign and casey hunt who covers the sanders campaign. i get the feeling -- are we right, there's a sense of momentum on the part of bernie and there's a question can hillary break it? >> i do think there's a sense of momentum and i think chuck's right there is a lot of the line for him tonight in as much he's it's the first chance he has a chance to prove he can win with minority voters but if you listen to sanders himself, he's gone as far as i've ever heard him go even the night before the new hampshire primary when they knew they were going to win big,

bernie sanders is using the same language today that he was using ahead of new hampshire. there is this element of unpredictability. this state is so transient the electorate changes from year to year and the polling is really tough. i think at this point most people on the sanders side would be more surprised if he lost, but it's still a possibility. >> you and i know -- you and i know both big city politics. philadelphia. >> philadelphia. >> i'm wondering if union voting is more like the old day of ward voting when they have an influence and puts the ballot in your hand and says vote for this guy or this woman. how much of that is a controlled vote along the unions and the culinary workers? >> they didn't endorse. that's significant. i don't think anyone is telling them how to vote. they're being very careful when you talk about the union leaders in terms of them talking to their stwint constituents. but there's a big push to get out the union workers, by the

way, 55% of them is latino. the body language in the clinton campaign says everything, she's added extra events. >> and bring in jim clyburn. >> and they've been downplaying since new hampshire since the big loss in new hampshire and secretary clinton leaving tonight at about 6:00 eastern so -- >> let's talk about the latino vote. because it's a growing vote obviously in this country. it's growing out here. it was 15% last time but we know it will be higher, we assume it will. what has bernie done? he's a newcomer to this electora electorate. >> they feel he's done a better job breaking into latino communities than african-americans and part of that is so many of them are young people especially latinos who are actually able to vote in the united states if their parents can't vote because maybe they are not citizens maybe their children can and are and they are politically engaged because they care a lot about the future of their families, they feel that he's resonating there. they've run into some trouble because of his vote against the immigration bill under the bush

presidency, he didn't back that because of all the reasons under normal circumstances the afl-cio might oppose such a bill, the guest worker programs, all the reasons to oppose that from the left. so, that's the tension with him especially here when you're trying to appeal to the seiu union voter is different than the afl-cio voter. >> and the clintons have a long history with both minority groups. >> they do. and i think they are surprised by the fact that senator sanders is getting so much support among the latino voters. hillary clinton was fund-raising and reaching out to african-american voters and she got the key endorsement yesterday from james clyburn and it sends a strong message to african-americans in south carolina and also here. >> once we get past nevada we go straight to south carolina and on tuesday all the other big states votes, so even if clinton picks up momentum in south carolina she doesn't have much time to capitalize on it. the question for sanders will be can he show win -- i was talking

to david plouffe about this, he helped obama win here -- or come out ahead in the delegate count in 2008 he's looking to see can sanders pull ahead in texas, georgia, in the big southern primary states and i think that that's where the clinton people see her future. >> where secretary clinton going tonight? texas. >> look, look, there's 11 states in one day. that's a hell of a lot of country to cover when you're a newcomer where aas the clintons have been around a long time. thank you both. when we come back we'll go to a caucus site to figure out how the caucuses work and you'll see it in action and talk to supporters of both the clinton and sanders people and the actor 90-year-old dick van dyke, someone we grew up with and lived with "the dick van dyke" show. and can donald trump hold off ted cruz? our live coverage of nevada from the caucuses and south carolina

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hurry! sleep train's presidents day sale ends sunday. ♪ your ticket to a better night's sleep ♪ welcome back. and we're looking right now at live picture -- there she is secretary clinton talking to voters. this is a last-minute effort i can see it from the clinton point of view, they are political professionals and they're trying to hang on to what they thought and believed to be their lead out he going into these caucuses. it's a tough challenge when you are talking about feeling the bern and everything and she's out there talking to the voters and this is when you see a candidate who knows it's going to be really, really close because every person she shakes hands with she thinks maybe she can pick up one vote at a time, you know, that's not a delegate at a time but it's the start of one. look it, she also wants to be on tv to show she's there for

everybody watching here now to get a sense of how much she wants it. people want candidates who want the job and ask for the vote. they want to see you asking. because that's how democracy works. you ask and people say yes and trust you with the office. and these selfies and all this it's amazing, but we're seeing real american democracy. this is it right now the cutting edge. the caucus doors will be closed in a little over 40 minutes now so it's getting very close to who is getting in the door. let's go to the city of henderson, nevada, it's 12 miles to the south of here, i'm on the las vegas strip right now, chris hayes is live at a caucus site inside a middle school, take it away my fellow named chris, go ahead. >> reporter: here here at dell webb middle school in henderson, a big suburb outside of vegas. it's a huge location and they've got about 12 precincts that will be caucusing. this was the iowa caucus model

imported into the state of nevada under the you a businesses of harry reid. i have a voter on line right now, sherry, how are you? >> good. >> reporter: you told me you were on your phone making up your mind as you walked in. >> yes. i was hiking up the desert in my house and looking up the issues. i am undecided because i think they are both awesome. i think they would both be great so it's a really tough call. >> reporter: it's interesting you say this because sometimes i think when we cover the primary and you are dealing with folks who are die hard, right, you feel like there's all this acrimony between the two candidates but you feel positively about both. >> i think we would be great to have either one in office. which one can actually go up against, say, a done always trump in a debate and win and i'm leaning towards hillary because of that because she's proven she doesn't get flustered. she stands her ground. >> reporter: fascinating. electability, who will be the strongest democratic party nominee. you did not participate in the

2008 caucus. >> no. >> reporter: but you've caucused before. >> i have once before. i'm sorry to say i followed the issues and been as involved as i would like to be, i have small children, but this is a very important election and i think we need to make sure we get a democratic in office. >> reporter: thanks so much. thanks for coming out. i think is a sort of important window into the minds of the democratic primary voters because obviously as this contested primary has gotten more contested and intense, there's a sense that we think the two camps are battling each other but among a lot of democratic primary voters they feel pretty favorably about both canned it didat candidates. >> i think you pointed out how it is difficult to poll the caucuses, and how do you predict how they are going to vote when they haven't decided even as they walk in the door? >> reporter: that's exactly right. >> okay. well, that was an old mike

mansfield answer from the old days, three words, four words. thank you, chris hayes. that was how you shorten an interview. you ran out of questions on me. jacob is live at a caucus location. i'm at new york new york the big hotel/casino one of the big places on the strip and he's right here. jacob? >> reporter: hey, chris, i'm upstairs outside where you are right now inside the new york new york and this is just -- i mean, i saw it up close in iowa but this is an extraordinary piece of american democracy because this is what is called an at-large caucus and the name of the game and i'm not making this up, getting these folks out by 1:15 which is their lunch break. come with me. most of these folks are workers at casinos within a 2.5 mile radius of where we are right now, new york new york, excalibur, mgm grand and all the other hotels around here. and people are signing up and registering in this area right now. in 2008 they said 1,000 caucusgoers came to this location. they don't expect that many this

time, but if you come in here, i'll show you where they will line up. this is the caucus room. mind the carpet. some may like it, some may not. they'll divide into their preference groups. bernie sanders over there. hillary clinton on this side. another extraordinary piece of information here is if it ends up somehow in a tie, a statistical tie and it will come down to a percentage point, the way they'll figure out who the winner is and gets the 34 precinct-level delegates from this location is by pulling a card out of a stack of a deck of cards and the high card is the winner and that's where the delegate goes, chris. >> well, jacob, you know, again, back to the gambling reference, in blackjack the customer, the better, is allowed to keep their cards down. but in nevada you got to show your cards. you got to walk in a room and walk to that location and tell everybody in the room i'm for hillary clinton, i'm for bernie sanders. wide open. announcement to everybody you know and everybody will go home and talk about how everybody they knew voted. >> reporter: that's part of the reason, chris, why some say

caucuses don't have as high a turnout as a primary system even with 118,000 people who showed up all-time record in 2008, that's still, like, a 9 % overall turnout of people who are eligible to vote in the general election. this is not a secret ballot and that's a staple of american democracy. people are allowed in the rules to wear t-shirts with the candidates they're supporting and go to the side of the room that their candidates support. if you look at these guys here, these are the precinct captains for bernie sanders and it says it on their shirts, nothing is a secret when you come to the caucus, the cliche is -- nothing is staying in vegas this time around, man. >> you know, i love the way you report, it's like eliot ness racing into a speakeasy and you show everything that's going on at the time. i love it. because nobody's ever done this before like you're doing it. jacob, you're a pioneer, sir, thank you, jacob. we'll be right back when the caucus gets under way and i'm joined by supporters of the sanders campaigns and the

clinton campaigns and you know this guy from his classic roles on the big screen as bernie in "mary poppins" and "the dick van dyke show" and has a new role for bernie sanders. i thought i would never meet you, sir, and also with me is david huerta, a local president of the seiu which has endorsed hillary clinton. let's start with mr. van dyke. mr. van dyke, what made you come out -- come out, not come out the other way, but come out so much for bernie sanders? >> well, i haven't campaigned since eugene mccarthy, so you know how political i am. but i'm 90 degrees -- 90 years old so i like to give a hand to young aspiring campaign. bernie has lit a fire that's been lit a hundred times over the years but he's caught the

eye and mind of young people and i think this time it will happen. we got to put him in the white house. he goes back to woodrow wilson who said there was an invisible force over and above the united states government. the banks and the insurance companies, and it's been going on that long. ike warned us, and even jimmy carter warned us of what was happening. it's time for this to happen. and he is -- he's a new deal democrat. i was there back in the '30s and the '40s. bernie is a new deal democrat. >> so, you don't think -- you don't think much of his self-description as a socialist, democratic socialist, that means to you just liberal democrat? >> i don't -- i don't think young people are bothered so much by that word, socialism. >> yeah, i agree. i agree. >> it used to be classed along with nazi and communism and facialist, but socialism has a whole different connotation now thanks to countries like sweden.

>> yeah. i was with you on mccarthy. i have to tell you that. i leavoved gene mccarthy and hes the only one to get out there with guts and do it. by the way, dick van dyke, we're all huge fans so i need not get into that. i would love to hear you sing something from "mary poppins." "a jolly holiday"? ♪ a beautiful day a morning in may ♪ i feel like i could fly ♪ ♪ have you seen the sun so green ♪ >> how about my cockney accent? better? >> great. mr. huerta, the seiu, what role will they play? >> we have hundreds of members hitting the streets and can nothing on doors several weeks now not just within nevada but

members from california and other states hitting the streets and knocking on doors and getting the one-on-one conversation with working families to come behind hillary clinton so we're really excited and we hopefully anticipate a victory here. >> tell me, we're explaining the caucus system, how does the international, the seiu here locally, how do you decide how to pick a candidate? how's it done? >> we have a very robust pro tess in seiu and we started early last year by putting out the platforms for the working families and saying what is the platform for working platforms in the united states. and we had a large worker convention that weighed in on that. we did polling and surveying and we did teleconference town halls and over 80,000 people participated. >> was it a spanish and english? >> yes. our executive board which is all rank and file voted in favor for hillary clinton for the endorsement and we passed that up to our president and it's really been really rank and file driven in the sense of getting that endorsement for hillary

clinton. >> are there many members of the seiu for bernie? >> we respect the opinion of all of our members but 70%ve our members across the country 2 million strong are supporting hillary clinton and we got to respect the majority. >> okay, great, thank you, david huerta, the seiu an important and powerful union here and across the country. dick van dyke, i never thought i would meet you but i have, great to have you on, especially since you entertained us as well as informed us both in one day. when we come back we'll check in on the big race on the other side of the country, the south carolina republican primary. it's a real primary where everybody gets to vote on the democratic side -- actually this time the republicans. the democrats next week. donald trump is looking for a big win tonight. he's up by 3 or 17. you pick it.

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south carolina in the republican primary out there. we're out here in las vegas and polls close there at 7:00 eastern tonight. we're following that race as well as the one here in nevada. and for what's going on outside or inside those campaigns this hour we bring in katy tur with the trump campaign in south carolina and halle jackson is following cruz and let's go to katy with the strange charge to hit the airways last night and there's other stuff going out on the robo-call. give us the dirt from south carolina. >> reporter: i hope you could have seen the donald trump advance team behind me making faces. they are now making faces at me overhere. that's what's going on currently with the trump campaign. but let's talk a little bit about last night and the rally in north charleston, he's getting a lot of notice for a general pershing story which has been discredited on the internet, an internet hoax and take a listen to what he was

trying to say by using this story, take a listen. >> he caught 50 terrorists who did tremendous damage and killed people and he took 50 terrorists and he took 50 men and he dipped 50 bullets in pig's blood. you heard that, right? he fit -- he took 50 bullets and he dipped them in pig's blood. and he had his men load his rifles and he lined up the 50 people and they shot 49 of those people. >> reporter: so, they shot 49 of those people he said and then that one person went back to tell his friends, the other quote-unquote, terrorists and nothing happened for 25 years. that was the point donald trump was trying to make that the u.s. used to be tough and they are no longer tough. the crowd in that room enjoyed that story. they cheered to that story, this is on top of donald trump talking about torture, bringing back waterboarding saying it's not tough enough.

he says over and over again this country needs to get tougher when it comes to terror, tougher when it comes to our relations overseas right now what you are hearing overseas foreign powers of people who are genuinely scared of what a donald presidency could look like that's the latest headline coming out of the donald trump campaign. chris? >> thank you. halle jackson, tell us what's going on with the cruz campaign with the latest robocalls. >> reporter: absolutely. the calls coming from a superpac trying to hit donald trump on a couple of different topics, his position on the confederate flag and the gay and lesbian rights and they support cruz and hoping to change the momentum for cruz and make sure he ends up in second place even though he's in a tough fight with marco rubio for that position. we're at a polling place in columbia, we've been talking to voters who have been coming here and we want to show you what one had to say about her last-minute position. >> i knew who i was not going to

vote for but up until the end it was between a few candidates and i feel marco rubio hasn't been angry in his approach with the other candidates and that was real appealing to me in the end. >> reporter: so, fran sullivan a rubio supporter but we've seen supporters of every candidate here and it's hit or miss, they come and sign up here. and this sign is actually a pretty good example of what's at stake in this south carolina primary. you can see the other candidates have been crossed off, right? by tomorrow it looks like we will see probably more names crossed off that list potentially. jeb bush insists it won't be him. he told reporters this morning he plans to continue on to nevada tomorrow. that's what his travel schedule is and what he wants to do. john kasich isn't here and he's up in new england, his strategist this potentially is the last day for jeb bush's campaign. and ted cruz is showing he can be viable when he moves on to the other primary states and

they feel good where they are in the states, 27,000 volunteers in texas and 7,000 in tennessee and ben carson hoping for a surprise, chris, but we'll see. >> i can ask you about this charge from sanford down there, that -- that donald trump has accused george w. bush, the president of the united states, of being involved in the 9/11 horror. how does that set with people? how does that set with them? how do they put it together in their minds when they go to vote, a charge like that? >> reporter: we haven't heard much about it from voters, chris, yeah, as we talk to people here, that is not something that anybody has brought up and frankly you talk about all these endorsements that these candidates are getting mark sanford for ted cruz and nikki haley out for marco rubio and that's not

something you hear, why are you pushing that polling button. what we've heard a lot about frankly are not these attacks that have been all over the airwaves in south carolina, you're hearing about personality. a little bit of policy. one trump support said he really liked his position on immigration but a lot of is, hey, i like this guy or i don't like this guy. >> thanks for that. let me go to dave gutierrez and how this rubio thing is going. what does marco rubio -- i don't want to use it surreptitiously, but what is he up to? is he aiming to get in third, possibly going to second? what is he hoping to do today here in south carolina? >> reporter: hey there, chris, his campaign as you know, they are very hesitant to get into the expectation game but the expectation is that marco rubio has to finish at least in third place here and possibly second. but the campaign is basically arguing, look, once the -- the republican field winnows down he's going to be able to coalesce his support. they are trying to ride this

momentum after that nikki haley engorsement. they got tim scott with them on the trail and they are trying to make the argument that this is the new face of conservatism but many of his rival campaigns are criticizing him, saying, look, he hasn't won any primary, third in iowa, fifth in new hampshire and even if he finishes third in south carolina that doesn't really say a whole lot. so, the rubio campaign looking to finish strong here. the conventional wills d aal wi need to finish in the top three, and they say if they can do that they make a case they can take on ted cruz and donald trump as this race moves forward, chris? >> i got to tell you just in terms of cosmetics, him standing there with the governor down there in south carolina is an attractive look of youth and positive future. it looks very good. i don't know whether they cooked that scene up, but that was a great press avail they had for both of those people. thank you. the race in south carolina took a decidedly dirty turn as i mentioned mark sanford a

supporter of ted cruz made a wild and untrue of donald trump in his statement. he said, quote, i like what mr. trump is getting at. i have just come to believe passionately that the way he is doing so is both dangerous and destructive. to suggest that former president bush was a conspirator in the 9/11 attacks is to flame all the conspiracy theories that undermine the trust essential to representative government. that's in a statement put out by sanford. he repeated the claim again today on msnbc -- >> i say dangerous because i think ultimately you cannot play to people's worst fears. when you talk about bush being a co-conspirator in 9/11 that's crazy talk. >> well, look, i think it's outrageous to say that anybody has accused george w. bush of blowing up the world trade centers and if that's what he's implying by suggesting a role in 9/11, it's awful. whatever you think about trump. anyway, i'm joined by the national political reporter for "the washington post" and an

msnbc political analyst and kathleen parker a syndicated columnist and an msnbc political analyst. kathleen, what is it in south carolina where they don't just wretch at politicians and teams that put out garbage like that? sanford, are you that desperate to get in with cruz that you would put something like that out? why do they have the robocalls about lgdp? what is the story down there? >> i said to republican party leaders, why do you do the nasty things, it's awful and blah blah blah, and you reporters always say that and then we get a three or four-point bounce. mark sanford waited until the very last minute to endorse ted cruz whom i have on very good authority he cannot stand. and he did this for two reasons. well, wait, let me just back up. the other thing he did is the statement about george w. bush. what he's doing there is -- is playing up the -- his alliance with george w. bush who has an 85% approval rating.

so, basically what he's doing -- is protecting mark sanford. he's going to always have problems because of his history in getting re-elected. but this way he's indicating clearly to the voters who matter to him that he is a superconservative, so he's -- this is totally all about mark sanford and not about donald trump or ted cruz. >> and the voters respond to this stuff? >> does that clarify things for you? >> it does in a way because it explains self-interest which often explains everything, kathleen. but i was going to ask you about the larger question. do the voters really believe that donald trump as wild as he can be has accused a former president in having a hand of blowing up the world trade center and the pentagon? do they really believe trump said that? >> no, they know that he didn't say that because they could hear what he did say and it's been clarified a few times. but, you know, people don't really care that much what endorsers have to say about the candidates. they know what they know, and i

think there's also -- there is a movement within the republican party to try to get anybody elected but trump as you know, and so what you've got to do -- i mean, who is there other than trump? i mean, who can unseat him in the first place and that seems to be ted cruz, so even though it doesn't make them happy, people like governor perry of texas said, you know, he endorsed ted cruz and he gave all the reasons that he wants the public to believe but the real reason is because he wants -- he feels he's the only one who can defeat trump and that's what has to happen. >> robert costa, tell me what you think is all going on down there in south carolina. >> great to be with you, chris. i was at the trump event last night, talked to the trump campaign. you get a sense they're confident in south carolina. this is going to give them a boost going into the nevada caucuses. going into the super tuesday in march 1st. the real race is for second place between rubio and cruz. rubio people have the establishment behind them in south carolina. the open question, though, is does cruz gotvf-ers eclipse the

networks of the other? and the third place a subcompetition governor bush is trying to stay in the race and trying to stay upbeat this is an important stand for him and governor kasich is attracting some eleventh hour converts who like his message and he's trying to stay in through mid-march as well. >> okay, robert and kathleen -- go ahead, kathleen. >> i was just going to say one thing that i'm hearing that jeb bush is going to hang in there until florida. >> okay. not going to quit even if he does bad tonight. anyway, thank you, thank you kathleen and robert. >> the polls in south carolina close at 7:00 eastern. 7:00 eastern. and right now we're under 20 minutes away from doors closing at the caucus sites at the democratic caucus out here in nevada. when we come back we'll take a look at the crucial latino vote here in nevada. i know how it is.

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we're just minutes away right now from the doors closing out here at the democratic caucuses in nevada. we're here -- i have to tell people we're actually here on the las vegas strip and it is beautiful weather out here. for more on the critical latino vote here in nevada we go to msnbc's steve kornacki in new york. steve, i was looking at the numbers in 2008 the last time we had a really, hot, contested race in that case between hillary clinton and barack obama. about 15% were latino. what do you expect on that front? >> yeah, so that's the thing, again, you can look at, we can put on the screen here what the results looked like in 2008, again, hillary clinton 51% statewide. the latino vote when you're talking about where it's really a factor here in nevada you look right around las vegas and also to a lesser extent up here wa o

washoe county and 15% was the figure in the 2008 caucuses 15% of the participants said they were latino or hispanic. however, the most recent census numbers for nevada show the actual number of people in the state, the number of latinos in the state, is higher. and part of that is because these numbers are changing every year. the state is becoming more diverse every year, so the 15% could be higher today. we'll look to see if that is true when we get entrance poll da data. but this is the key, the bottom line in 2008 is that hillary clinton ran up very big numbers over barack obama with latino voters. she beat him more than 2-1 a 38-point margin which was the key to winning statewide for her eight years ago. >> so, what is the -- what can change? i mean, could change feeling the bern like every other community? we'll get to our questions on that, steve, that's great stuff. we are joined by reuters and alex sites walled and robert lang of brookings mountain west.

i want to start with luciana with this, as they are in the caucuses voting, how can we anticipate the participation level? is it beyond 15%? >> one thing that will be tricky this year is the culinary workers union did not enforce someone. they are not doing the full-on mobilization that they would if they had a candidate to back. they said they are more gently encouraging their members so we could see it hit latino participation. >> no actual union-backed polling operation. no polling. no bringing people in the cars. going around and making sure they're there. none of that. >> no. it will be a lot more low key. you know, they're really focused on contract negotiations, that's what they told me. they want to get their workers a fair contract and they can't afford the divisiveness that might come with endorsing someone right now and annoying members that don't back the candidate. >> let me get to you on this. i'll get back to you on this. let me ask you about ideology, they are all generalities, but

they are important, abortion, same-sex, latino community is as conservative as anyone in the country. >> yeah. >> how does it cut? >> there's mixed opinion on that, actually, despite the fact that there's heavy catholic population some of the polling shows on areas like abortion and so on is not in line with southern evangelicals and it may not translate the same way as the white community in the southeast. >> what would people vote on mainly? >> economic interests and especially whether or not some candidate is saying build a wall and throw you out of the country and -- >> that raises the great old nbc question november doesn't count, are they thinking in putting up a -- a woman we had a few moments on the air, i want to vote -- she's a voter going into the caucus, i want to make sure to get the person who can beat those guys. >> let me tell you what my students are saying. >> unlv. >> it's a very diverse

university and i have a lot of latino students around me and graduate students and they are saying they are reaching out to their parents and join the caucus, a lot of the dreamers are mobilized. a lot of the issues around immigration are mobilized young and if they bring their parents in, maybe they are also sort of feeling the bern. >> if i could jump in here -- >> i want to get doug in here first. the old question you face every time in a primary or caucus, do you vote strategically thinking about the general or do you vote your heart? >> i think it depends what phase of the caucus you are talking about, earlier in iowa and new hampshire and here in nevada i think people are voting with their heart and passion. later on when you start to think -- you get closer to nevada and, you know, if bernie sanders really has a shot at winning the nomination because i don't think a lot of people who vote for him think he's actually going to get there necessarily, then you might be talking about more strategic voting interesting and who is best up against republicans but if you talk to the hardcore sanders supporters they think he's the

best able to go up against the republicans. and they point to the enthusiasm for him and they think he'll turn out people in nevada up and down the ballot. >> and i think that's the question are they more fearful of socialism or hillary clinton or more angry at either one. you had a thought? >> i had a thought dovetailing on something you said. one thing to remember a lot of latino households are mix status, so you might have someone in there who is undocumented or someone who is documented or might have someone who is in the process of getting a green card right now and those issues in latino families are family issues and very personal. i talked to one woman at a bernie sanders in east las vegas and she was talking about feeling the bern and she spoke in spanish, you know, "fire in the belly." and part she's worried about her mom because she's undocumented. she was born in arizona, she's fine and her sister is fine, but for her it's about her mom. >> she thinks bernie is better

than that. >> this is all about the fire! and that's what bernie sanders brings. >> one thing clinton has really hit bernie sanders not backing barack obama on everything but i think there's a lot of disillusionment in the latino community with barack obama he's deported more people in presidential history. >> it's hard to be in government. it's better to be a candidate. it's much better to promise what you can promise. i want to thank the panel. we'll have more time later. we really appreciate this information. anyway, caucus doors about to close right now. it's 3:00 here and almost noon here. let's check with jacob who is live in one caucus location in new york new york which is the name of the he hotel casino. >> this is lucy, she's an ambassador at the excalibur hotel, if you win the jackpot, she comes and pays it out to

you. lucy, who are you caucusing for? >> hillary clinton. >> reporter: and why hillary? >> because i think that we need a woman. i think it's better feelings -- i have feeling for her. >> reporter: you feel for her? how about you, art? you deal out cards. >> yeah. well, i don't deal cards. i hand out the players card that you can -- >> reporter: you are for hillary? >> i am for hillary. i had to go with obama in 2008. >> reporter: i have to go to this woman who is undecided. you haven't made up your mind yet? >> no. >> reporter: how come? >> i'm not 100% sure. >> reporter: when will you decide? >> hopefully today. >> reporter: that's one thing you have to remember there's an undecided preference group as well and if they are not viable the other campaigns will pitch them and try to bring them over to their side. >> well, jacob, i don't know -- how do you make the people play their hands faster? you know, you want an extra card

or you don't want another card? it looks like the dealer has to move a little faster out there. this is fascinating stuff. again, are you sitting now at an undecided area or are you sitting at a hillary area? >> reporter: this area over here -- everybody's mixed up. let me walk you over here again. if you look at the people sitting on the floor they are literally having a picnic for hillary clinton. i have not talked to them before. i'll quickly slide in here. hey, man, what is your name and where do you work? >> i'm at the mgm grand at the sky lofts. >> reporter: what do you do there? >> i'm a concierge. >> reporter: what are you eating? >> a ham sandwich. >> reporter: eating a ham sandwich and ready to caucus for hillary. everybody is mixed all throughout this place. >> great work, jacob. that's fascinating to meet the people you meet out here all day and they are also citizens that vote and have political insti t instincts and fill lophilosophi we got tickets last night to the jersey boys. we actually got a discount i

think and it was fantastic. the four of us went from our show from "hard ball." the doors about to close at caucus sites statewide from nevada. when we come back our first characterization -- i love that word -- of the race between hillary clinton and bernie sanders. our coverage continues. you'll get results pretty soon now after this. unless you have . then your eyes may see it differently. only flonase is approved to relieve both itchy, watery eyes and congestion. no other nasal allergy spray can say that. when we breathe in allergens our bodies react by over producing six key inflammatory substances that cause our symptoms. most allergy pills only control one substance. flonase controls six. and six is greater than one. complete allergy relief or incomplete. let your eyes decide. flonase. 6>1 changes everything.

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