or black stools. the most common side effect is diarrhea sometimes severe. if it's severe stop taking linzess and call your doctor right away. other side effects include gas, stomach-area pain and swelling. talk to your doctor about managing your symptoms proactively with linzess. good evening. i'm christmas christma matthews. from dan baltz from "the washington post," a subdued trump plays it safe. from politico trump's rivals pull their punches, "the new york times" put it this way this republican debate candidates lower volume and "wall street journal" said they dial back, debate fights.

one he deliberately avoided taking the bait when he was attacked on his position on social security. >> i will do everything within my power not to touch social security to make this country rich again and bring back our jobs and get rid of deficits and get rid of waste, fraud and abuse which is ram pant. >> the numbers don't add up. we can't continue to tiptoe around this and -- >> senator rubio says your numbers don't add up. what's your response. >> i don't know if he's saying that. i'm saying very simply, we have a country that i've never seen anything like it. i've been going over budgets and looking at budgets. we don't bid things out. >> well, trump couldn't help commenting on the civil tone of the debate. here he is. >> i would say this, we're all in this together. we're going to come up with solutions. we're going to find the answers to things and so far i cannot believe how civil it's been up here. [ applause ] >> well, the debate wasn't entirely without controversy as

trump defended his remarks that many construed as anti-islam. >> in large mosques or in all over the middle east, you have people chanting death to the usa. now, that does not sound like a friendly act to me. >> let's bring in nbc's katy tur from the spin room. thanks for your reporting tonight and throughout it, this whole campaign. you are so close to the action. especially close to trump. having to cover him in his changes of mood, i guess, and changes, reactions to any legitimate question by the press. what do you read tonight is going on with him? >> i think that he's as we've been saying i think he's playing it safe and doesn't want to lose the state of florida right now. he's doing really well. i think he wants to do well in ohio and he's trying to keep the rhetoric at least a little bit more above the board tonight but we were really pressing him today on what's going on at his rallies and lately the past few

week, past week and a half or so there has been a lot more tension at these rally, a lot more violence and when omarosa says it's one protester who's done this or mr. trump says it's just one -- excuse me supporter who's punched a protester, i have to take issue with that because we've seen a number of occasions where protesters have been roughed up by trump supporters. yes, there are thousands of people, if not hundreds of people in these rooms. yes, these protesters are just small pockets of people who are trying to disrupt this rally. but oftentimes these protesters have their hands up like this, they're being led out by security, they're being led out by the police and that is often when we're seeing these trump supporters go after them and get aggressive with them. so the idea that it's just one guy acting out of bounds is just, frankly, not true and i try and press him on his tone and rhetoric at these rallies and jake tapper did during the

debate, as well, saying that, you know, he says get them out, in the old days we used to be able to take care of them sooner or punch them in the face or i'll pay for your legal bills if you rough them up. and this is not the sort of rhetoric that calms these situations down. often he'll start saying that as these protesters try to disrupt and are being let out while he keeps saying this over and over again and the crowd gets whipped up into more and more of a frenzy. we have felt at times me and the other reporters in the room that we are on the precipice of something potentially very bad happening. so, it's not just one person. it happens very frequently and it's happening even more so because now we're getting more black lives matter protesters who are deliberately trying to disrupt the rallies and asked mr. trump as you saw about this michelle fields incident and his campaign manager, his campaign manager has been extraordinarily antagonistic towards the press this entire time clearly he did not like that line of questioning, so far there has not been video to prove any of

her allegations but there is an audio clip that's out there and she has posted video of bruises on her arm. she's even asked mr. trump what he would say if that was his daughter. but so far when it comes to pushing back on the campaign in any way, or trying to get them to admit that maybe at times they've gone a little too far they have not done that. in fact, i spoke to somebody who's very close to this campaign earlier today and he said that they basically thought that cory was a ticking time bomb and they were hoping that the campaign manager that he didn't go overboard. that nothing like this happened but they're not surprised that these allegations have surfaced from this breitbart reporter. >> let me ask you about your close observance of donald trump. he looks angry now. he looks dark i don't know -- he doesn't look as good as he used to look. he doesn't look happy. he looks angry up there. the performance after the primaries when he went into all his product lines defending each one of them. i know everybody's touchy. his touchiness seems to have

made him angry. what is that -- has anything to do with the audience out there, but there's a little smile on the guy's face. it was always a little lilt to his voice, a little charm that went in with a lot and a sense of whimsy, now it just seems angry. what is going on? >> he's got a lot more to lose now. of course, he's got a lot more to lose now, on the precipice of clinching the republican nomination. earlier this was more of a let's see what happens sort of campaign but as we've gotten farther and farther along he's realized he is about to get something and now he has a lot more to lose so these attacks against him, this pushback against him and tougher questioning is not something that he is enjoying because he doesn't frankly like to be pushed and the farther he gets down this road the more he's going to be pushed and the more he's going to get a little bit angry from that. we've seen that this entire campaign. i saw that from the very first interview i had with him back in july. he does not like being pushed and after that interview ran, he

was extraordinary liang bring at the line of questioning because he didn't think it was fair. this idea that everything has to be fair to donald trump is something that has permeated this entire campaign but i think to your question, chris, the farther he goes down this line the more he has to lose and the more -- the tighter he is holding on to this so any sort of tough questioning is not something that he welcomes. he's not used to being questioned. he's run these businesses and he's run them on his own. so this is a new world for him to be questioned in this way. >> well, you know, there's a duchess between business press and political press. with political press you just got to live with us because we're here. with business press you can close the door on some guy or woman and they're gone. >> he's trying to change the libel laws and wants to change the libel laws to make them much stricter essentially so that reporters can't report negative stories about him. so, he wants to change that. >> yeah, that would be a change

in america, i think. thank you, katy tur. you got great energy out there tonight as i can always tell. former presidential candidate carly fiorina is with us right now. she endorsed ted cruz yesterday. miss fiorina, thank you so much for joining us, carly, i mean that because it seems like the people in this contest are now taking sides. i mean, you are -- the anti-trump faction for lack of a better phrase and, of course, ben carson is due to come out for trump tomorrow. chris christie has come out for trump tomorrow. this battle royal. this end game working out, how do you see it? >> well, you know, one of the things i appreciate about ted cruz and that i tried to do in my own presidential campaign is he never gets down in the dirt. he doesn't hurl insults. his tone isn't angry or violent. he doesn't talk about spray tans or body parts. he talks about the issues. he talks about the substance. and i think that is what voters desperately want. and i think tonight what was

crystal clear is that ted cruz has a lot of substance. and donald trump doesn't. i think what was also crystal clear tonight is this is a two-man race and only ted cruz can beat donald trump at the ballot box which is where he's got to get beaten and it's why i wanted to come out publicly and tell people how i had voted in my own home state of virginia, you know, i saw my own name on the ballot. it was cool, it was very tempting to check the box next to carly fiorina for all my supporters who had worked so hard and then i thought about why i ran and i thought that, hey, we need a conservative in the white house actually and we need someone who is going to challenge the system and we need someone who can beat donald trump and ted cruz is that guy. >> you're a business republican. i think i know what that means. conservative, but you're used to the real world. ted really seems like a hard conservative, a person all the way over in the hard rail and that's where he wanted to be even if it means stopping the government. he doesn't want to move into that center right area at all.

are you with him politically and ideologically? >> well, look, i, you know, people are always surprised but i actually am a conservative. and i'm a conservative because i think our policies work better for everyone. regardless of their circumstances, i'm a conservative because i think we have way too much power, economic and political power, concentrated into the hands of too few and that's why the system has to be challenged, yi, i have disagreed with ted cruz on tactic, absolutely, but i don't disagree with him on goals. obamacare has to be repealed. and i also believe that donald trump and hillary clinton are two sides of the same coin. they are the system. hillary clinton has made millions selling access and influence from inside that system. and donald trump has made billions buying people like hillary clinton off. donald trump and hillary clinton are not going to reform the system. they are not going to challenge the system, they are the system.

but ted cruz will challenge that system. and it needs to be challenged. because the system right now benefits the big, the powerful, the wealthy and well connected and it crushes the small and the powerless. >> if it's based on money just to get -- you're a business person. if it's based on money, this model we have now, you run for office, you raise a lot of money or you have a lot of money. most have to raise a lot of money. how do you keep that system from being run by those who contribute, the donors? >> well, you know, here's the thing, of course, chris, that's right. politics is about money. but governing is about money too. that's the shame of it all. let's just look at obamacare. who helped write obamacare? the drug companies, the hospitals, the pharmaceuticals, all the industries who are going to benefit from obamacare helped write it. let's look at dodd frank, who wrote that?

the wall street banks. instead of ten wall street banks to fail we have five and almost 2,000 community banks and 20% of the credit union industry has gone under. because they're not big enough to handle it. so, see, money in fact affects politics and not just governing and democrats and republicans have been part of that corrupt system. government has become incompetent and corrupt and the only way to level the playing field is to move power and money out of washington and back to the citizens and the states of this nation, which is where our founders intended it to be. >> well said. one of the reasons why i think lobbybyists have power is members of these committees that write tax law and they write banking law have no idea what they're dealing with so they bring in the experts who all come in with an interest. >> sure. >> it's a big part of the problem and they write the bills with the interests of their people in mind but because the

people who are elected to write the bills have no idea how to fathom what wall street is all about high world of finance don't get it because they're afraid of making mistakes bring in those people and that's a big part of it. i know -- >> that's part of it, yeah. no, no, no you're absolutely right but here's the other part of it. see, all that complexity, it keep nast system going. and it's why simplicity is the antidote. that's why a complicated tax code that is 27,000 pages long benefits the system and that's why you got to get it down to a very simple tax code which is why when ted cruz says people are going to mail in their taxes on a postcard or a phone app he's absolutely right. it's not just about lowering the level of taxation, his plan calls for 10% on individual, 16% on business. it's the simplicity of the tax code that levels the playing field between the big and the powerful and the wealthy and the small and the powerless and not so wealthy.

>> you're actually right from my perspective because i met people who make a living on complexity, lawyers who love the intricacies of tax law. >> of course. >> and love the intricacies of legislation that makes them necessary. someday when we're alone one-on-one with no microphones i'll tell you my favorite lawyer joke. >> okay. >> thank you, carly fiorina. you're still very much in the game. >> thank you. >> let's bring in three reporters. sabrina and david and eli, a reporter with preliminary co-. david, you first. give me a track or a ringside analysis. i didn't find the fight tonight a biggie. it wasn't a championship bout. but what did you make -- i'm afraid, i guess, that trump probably by pulling his dukes back and not taking he big roundhouse punches at anybody probably left the field over to the guy who's always giving short speeches as long as he can get enough time to give them and that's rubio. he gave a bunch of short

speeches. generally his normal recitative way. >> he played rope-a-dope without the others punching him too hard. laid them on his rope. i thought your analogy of the four corners defense when you slow everything down, but i think there's a purpose here. you know, now that it's, you know, he's trying to get the scene as a two-person race with him and cruz and little marco out to the side and probably gone after tuesday if not beforehand, he wants to look presidential. it's all about uniting the party. we have all these millions of people, not that many millions, but, you know, in his mind millions of people coming into the party, let's all get together. this is the argument he wants to make because as he goes to the convention if he doesn't get 1,237, he may be close and wants

to start playing somewhat nice or at least not acting like oliver cromwell would so that's what tonight was about and he could do this because rubio basically neutered himself in the race and cruz is not really a threat on the states coming up on tuesday so had the space to start creating a new persona. his angry people will keep following him and wants to be seen as less threaten as he gets closer to 1,237. >> i heard him describe what it's like to become a washingtonian. that's exactly. you realize today's enemy is tomorrow's ally. don't call them bad names. two weeks from now you'll need them. he'll need everybody by july or one or two other guys to build up a majority. your thoughts. >> i think that david is exactly right. i think that donald trump has built his candidacy as this resociety against the republican establishment in washington and

tonight you heard him say explicitly it's time for the washington establishment for the republican establishment to embrace what's happening and in his mind that is he is on his way to clinching the republican nomination. he believes he's going to edge marco rubio out of the race in florida on tuesday and like david said, he doesn't see ted cruz as a real legitimate threat even if it is a two-man race moving forward donald trump is obviously at a significant advantage so pivoting now to the general election and focusing much more on hillary clinton even in terms of policy again showing flexibility in what some of what he said before and advocate for before and i think this is a new donald trump that you're going to see and helped that his rivals were rhett sent to punch at him and drew some policy contrasts but tried to avoid attacking him and i think that he felt that if they're not going to attack me there's no need for me to engage because it will only look like he's tipping with gutter politics but instead wanted to appear more presidential and a sign of what's to come in a general election and why democrats can't

just assume that donald trump is a throwaway candidate they could easily defeat. >> let me go to eli. eli, i'm wondering after we all got blown out in polling this past couple of days ago on michigan, i thought the polling has been very good this year. i've been looking -- you can't poll, you know, what do you call them? >> caucuses. >> and this came and my god way up by double digits and these politicians are looking at their own polls apparently trump doesn't poll but everybody looking at the public polls and suggest a ten-point spread in florida and suggested trump as a much more if he has any edge in ohio. what do you think is the gaming here, is it smart gaming based on the polling or is it just luck they're hopes to get here? i don't think we can predict ohio at all thousand and i'm not hour what trump is thinking about how strong his predictions

are for florida. >> yeah, he didn't act like a candidate tonight who is so confident that he can just basically stake it to the house and go home. florida could be close and as close as those polls showing as a single digit margin and ohio close to. given the trajectory of the rubio campaign over the last couple of weeks he has to feel better about florida at this point because he looks dead in the water here and trump may move chips to ohio but really what you saw in the stage tonight was a complete and utter surrender from the three remaining trump rivals on the stage when it comes to really engaging trump. i mean, they have lost and they understand that they have lost when this comes to having any chance of beating trump at his own game, playing the way he plays. they just can't do it. that's what's to blame for rubio's collapse at least in part because people did not like that look of the sort of school

yard insults that he started trading with trump over the last couple of weeks leading up to super tuesday and the contests last week and so i think you saw tonight pull back, let's do policy contrast. trump was able to as other folks pointed out to really try to be more presidential, be a little more mild but i think it's just a full recognition that at this point, yeah, they're playing to survive but also playing for legacy, for what's next and i think you're starting to see an end game for a lot of folks. >> i think they are basically pro-tensioning their cards and protecting their constituencies whether pro-israeli in southern florida or anti-castro. people were doing what you normally do in politic, make sure your constituencies are solid without doing anything dramatic. david, sabrina, all stick with us. much more ahead on this republican debate. you're watching a special edition obviously of "hardball." late up tonight. i'm actually out here for the funeral tomorrow for first lady nancy reagan. that will be quite an event tomorrow and a lot of regard for

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wins a modest victory in florida, say, three or four points, we're up somewhat late that night, trump wins illinois and that's everything next week. where are we going? i think -- only place sanders can win is with trade. it means he has a hot at illinois hillary's hometown, the numbers are overwhelmingly for her. if ohio goes against the front-runners, what changes? if that's all that's expected? >> i think it remains a protracted race and no one is running away necessarily with the nomination just yet. even though the front-runners are in a very comfortable position. now, the implication, of course, are very different in each party where if republicans and still want to try and force a brokered convention if they're able to succeed in doing that even though it seems implausible that

obviously really shifts the direction of that race whereas on the flip side hillary clinton looks a lot more comfortable, i think, people still believe she is going to be the presumptive nominee even if bernie sanders has the cash on hand to stay in the race. he would stay largely to shape the conversation as he has been doing to shape the issues that are being talked about. not actually operating under the assumption that he's going to be the democratic nominee. of course, the republican party, you're still seeing this collective effort. notable you didn't see it in tonight's debate and telling of where this race is headed in the coming weeks. >> let me go to eli on this question of, it seems to me if you look at the two parties, the one that seems to be closer to holding together is the democratic party because hillary clinton will probably win, but not necessarily but probably win. and the issues that separate her are not so much style as particular sets of questions. how do we help kids, young people with their tuition bills? how do we help older people low income people who are having a

hard time on the existing social security benefits? too hard to live on those things and deal with health care and moving toward 100%? but these are all negotiable and make progress on as senator sanders can take credit for and go back to being a senator for vermont and have an influence on the platform and hillary clinton will move a notch to the left on some social issues and everybody is a party again. i think that makes more sense than the republican party where half the party now just -- at least half the party doesn't want to have trump as its standard-bearer and doesn't want to have lawsuit the guy or be the nominee and certainly doesn't want him to be president. a much tougher fight. >> not even close. night and day, the democrats are going to come together around a person a known commodity in the public sphere for the last three decades and who at the end of the day, you know, people will be okay with. on the republican side you see a party completely coming apart at the seams and the establishment side of the party is sort of

itself splintered over can this guy actually help us? can we unite behind him or win or is this a total catastrophe destroying the party and better to lose and regroup in 20 -- >> would they prefer to have him president of the united states? would people like jeb bush and carly fiorina and all the rest of them, would they actually root for trump to be president of the united states for four to eight years? >> well, none of those people would. they won't -- they won't say, no, if he's not nominee we won't support him but tonight before the debate reince priebus made a speech and said eventually whoever the republican nominee is we're all going to unite behind that person. there are a lot of people sitting on their hands when they said that. the applause was pretty tepid. you can just understand there is such a reluctance among some republicans who have this idea of the republican party as one thing and donald trump completely blows that up and the people who are supporting him, you know, a lot of people in washington, d.c., republicans

who work on the hill, they talk to me and they say, i don't know a single person who is supporting donald trump and that tells you about the divide within that party that's been there for a long time and the disconnect between the power base and the establishment as it's called and really the grassroots activist base of this party so this reconciling, this reckoning has been a long time coming but it's here this cycle and certainly the republicans as a party are dealing with it now and remains to be seen just how messy it gets before they arrive at a nominee. >> i can't beat what you said. thank you sabrina siddiqui and eli stokols. our coverage will continue in a minute. monday night again join me for an exclusive hour long town hall with hillary clinton in springfield, illinois. guess who started their campaign there? barack obama. we'll be there on the eve of the primaries in illinois, ohio, florida, north carolina and missouri. we'll be there on election eve really. a hot night for hillary clinton and a hot night for you to see her. it's coming up right here on "hardball" monday night again 7:00 eastern.

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they are unhappy with how the people are voting and they want to parachute in their favorite washington candidate to be the nominee. i think that would be an absolute disaster and we need to respect the will of the voters. >> what you just heard there, welcome back to our coverage of the republican debate, robert costa of "the washington post" and luciana lopez of reuters. my thought, it's amazing how people talk about their self-interest. trump said that artificial random number is a majority of the delegates. it's not artificial and it is not random. it's the majority number and, secondly, the other guy, ted cruz said somebody can't parachute in. in other words, if it's not trump because he can't get the majority, it's cruz. it was so obvious what they're up to. robert, it's not hard to read these guys. >> 1,237, that is the magic number for the delegates. speaking of people close to trump they believe they'll likely have the lead if they continue on this pace but you get a sense within the party

talking to trump's rivals that if he gets close to that threshold of 1,237, if he's 37 to 40 or even 50 delegates away he will have a serious case to make for the nomination and so at this point if they can't get to that number themselves his rivals are trying to stop him from getting close enough. >> but can all this be done? it seems to me if it's within reach and he had to get off the vp job to kasich, and pick up 200 or 300 delegates, it seems to me doing by the first ballot. >> it's very doable and i think that's what trump's eyeing the deal. a deal can be made if trump doesn't win on the first ballot, it will be about getting the second ballot. discipline is needed on the second ballot. if you study the convention rules they become unbound and chaos on the floor unless you have a strategy. >> i think he can get -- >> i think kasich -- if he's close, i mean, cruz believes if he stays in this race and he goes to a lot of these more

conservative states question rack up enough to get some kind of right wing coalition to combat trump. >> enough to get a majority? >> probably not. maybe multiple ballots and the other scenario and people weren't talking about this for awhile but now they are is a mitt romney, a paul ryan. still a hope in washington some kind of consensus establishment emerge. >> donald trump closed the evening in a measured tone tonight predicting with him as the nominee, the republican party's numbers would grow exponentially. >> the republican heart has a great chance to embrace millions of people that it's never known before, they're coming by the millions. these are people that will win us the election and win it easily, embrace these millions of people that now for the first time ever love the republican party and unify. be smart and unify.

>> luciana, your thoughts about what we're talking about? i still see -- i guess i'm a traditionalist and see candidates getting to the majority and making whatever deal they can to get it and got most of the cards, maybe 90% of the delegates they need and get last 10% by negotiating other people who have those delegates. your thoughts? >> well, i mean trump is clearly trying to paint himself as someone who can bring everyone together and he's not just talking about people who are perhaps new to the republican party or to that tent but frankly those establishment people who are just up in arms about what do they do about him and people still thinking mitt romney, come save us. this is really his way of trying to consolidate support as much as possible and try to throw some elbows before we get to that convention and just say, i can do this, we don't need to go ballot after ballot. it's me. it's all me all the way. >> i just don't see -- i want to get back to robert on this.

do you see when you talk to top republicans, insiders, do they imagine somebody as cruz put it parachuting in from outside who's never ran for office for the presidency and somehow install that person as the republican nominee? >> they only see that scenario if trump stumbles in ohio or that and doesn't consolidate the party in the coming month and kasich and cruz stays in and gets dragged out there's a thought someone else could emerge. at this point as much as we talk about kasich joining the trump ticket should trump be the nominee, another scenario top republicans have been floating my way trump/cruz. saw in 1980, ronald reagan and george bush didn't get along and thought they may have to go to the top two guys to unite the party. >> that makes it a pretty right wing ticket, doesn't it? >> it does and trump is not running a right wing campaign. it's right wing. >> how does he shut up cruz?

>> i think it's more about party unity at that point. trump's message of unity is, of course, about trying to get the party behind him but at a convention unity is about numbers. >> yeah. i guess it's a party of desperation. thank you robert costa and thank you, luciana lopez watching a special edition of "hardball" live from the republican debate in miami. stay with us. >> i'm not interested in being politically correct. i'm not interested in being politically correct. i'm interesting in being correct. look like this.

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>> hey there, chris. yeah, his campaign typically they say he had a great night. i think the key was he needed a fantastic debate. i don't know if he got it. he had a good debate certainly had that great answer on cuba against donald trump and really took him to task over some of his foreign policy and including israel, but, you know, will it be enough? you know, he's down 20 points and most of the polls here in florida, but, you know, some of the polls have him down in single digits. he had a great night and still think he can pull off a victory here in florida. >> what do you think of the numbers down there? these polls are, one is a 23-point spread. one is something like 7 and one is 9. what do you make of them? >> the fox news poll is at 23 and "the washington post"/univision poll is at 7%. some of those polls, the ones in single digits allow, you know,

republican voters to self-i.d. so the campaign is discounting or rather the one that had him at 23% allowed him to self-i.d. so the campaign is discounting that poll. they say that one is an outlier and think this is a tighter race than, you know, than it appears to be. however, you know the enthusiasm gap with rubio and i've been to some of his rally, a rally in hialeah, a lot of cuban-american voters there and he only had several hundred people in a venue that held several thousand so the question will be, will his voters turn out on tuesday or is his campaign done? something that was interesting tonight. this was the debris that marco rubio said that he really wanted to have. a debate on policy. and it devolved into the school yard insults and his, you know, after that houston debate which he got pretty good reviews for taking on donald trump. remember, chris, you know, you and a lot of other people, almost criticized or really criticized marco rubio for not

taking on donald trump for awhile. he kept trying to have this positive message where he would, you know, go after the democrats and try to argue that he was best positioned to take him on in the profession and a lot in his own party were coming down hard on him. he finally did. he got good reviews in that debate but the problem was a couple of days after that he really, you know, started talking about his spray tan, hi hair and, you know, volved into personal insults and two nights ago after midnight in that town hall with chuck he admitted he regretted that but this debate, he got the one he wanted. this one was about policy, the question is, is he going to be -- is it too little too late? >> doesn't it feel like every day is a week now? this is the strangest -- i've been on airplanes two out of three days now for two months, every day i'm moving somewhere and what i'm seems like a saturday night was two nights

ago. it's an amazing time. speeding up of time, i guess you call it. thank you, gabe, for this for coming to us well after midnight tonight. let's bring in ted johnson of "variety" curtis lee from the "l.a. times." mr. johnson, does hollywood feel the burn? where is hollywood left, if you women. >> they're mainly with hillary. you do have a contingent a pretty high profile contingent of people supporting bernie sanders. you have adam mckay who directed "the big short" a movie that jells right with sanders' campaign was an early supporter of sanders. i talked to him well before the election even season even started and he just was not having it with hillary. >> what is it? is it trending left or -- is it just, you know what goes on. people want to be with it and avant-garde without getting too deep. do they really want to see attacks on all equity investments with these people that have their money in equity?

>> yeah, the common theme you have are people who are upset that there were no arrests, no charges made against wall street executives, you know. that resonates with a certain contingent out here that believe that -- >> bernie is not going to arrest anybody. everybody evacuate everyone w h everybody with a 401(k) will have to pay -- it's something. i don't get it. >> some of the unhappiness with hillary that you saw when she went up against obama in 2008 when hollywood was almost split down the middle equally continued. you know. >> there are people who didn't like -- >> easily bored out here. >> yes. you hit it right there too. they want the next big thing. >> you know, what are we going to do now? we did that before. i think obama was so exciting, i think, you know, i admitted i

was overwhelmed by his speeches and would go to all these rooms and never heard anybody speak like obama. his presidency couldn't live up to that level. it couldn't. it was so stellar. the excitement in those crowds. first african-american, young guy, educated and couldn't give a speech since kennedy. >> one of the best that a lot of people have seen on the political stage and, yeah -- >> nobody can match that. >> i mean, there was talk about rubio being solid on the stump. but, you know, that kind of fell -- >> rubio, this message has been prerecorded. that's what i think every time i hear him. >> yeah, i talk to a big obama bundler and about supporting hillary clinton this time of year. this time around. he's very -- you know, he very much in the hillary camp but says as far as going out there and raising money for her, it

doesn't feel like it was with obama. it feels like, it feels like another part of my business. >> it feels like a re-election. >> yeah. >> isn't she already there? you know, it's like -- anyway, they're sticking with us with more ideas coming back. much more ahead on "hardball," some more. miami, the last debate before the big next tuesday. tune in monday, by the way at 7:00 eastern. i'll host a town meeting with the aforementioned and we'll make that sparkle in springfield, illinois. back after this. (son) pa, i know we settle for cable... but directv has been number one in customer satisfaction over cable for 15 years. (father) how 'bout over 15 satisfying years with

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of "hardball." hollywood isn't shying away from politics this year especially on the democratic side. susan sarandon, mark ruffalo, will ferrell and dick van dyke have campaigned for bernie sanders and hillary clinton have landed dozens of celebrity endorsements and released this ad by tony goldwyn and shonda rhimes with ellen pompeo. >> every day i wake up and play a brilliant -- >> complex. >> overqualified. >> get it done woman. >> who obsessively fights for justice. >> who cares. >> who gives a voice to the voiceless. >> who gets knocked down and always gets back up. >> i make television filled with a kind of characters i imagine we all can be. >> strong. >> but flawed. >> human. >> but extraordinary. >> our characters are on television. but the real world -- >> the real world has hillary clinton.

>> the real world has hillary clinton. >> the real world has hillary clinton. >> a bona fide -- >> rolls up her sleeves. >> fights for what's right. >> in it for you. >> won't back down. >> champion for all of us. >> that's why i'm with hillary. >> so interesting, you know, all attractive people obviously and i wonder in it works. i guess it does. it doesn't hurt. >> what i find is interesting they started running this ad on the night when all these shows are on. all of shonda rhimes' shows are on and abc had to release a statement saying we had no choice. we had to take the ad because it was a political ad under fcc guidelines, because i think they were worried about criticism of running an ad with all their series characters that was supportive of hillary clinton. >> they were all women of color, weren't they? >> most of them. majority. >> i'm trying to think about it and think about how the age thing is going on in this country, older black women,

more -- older white women more pro hillary. younger not so much so northern african-americans not so much -- >> you see that generational divide. >> geographic. >> big cities northern more labor oriented. a little more ideological. >> you see that generational split among latinos as well as well as whites, the split between bernie and hillary. >> if bernie is not running in the general, hillary is. what do the younger people do, sir? what do all the younger people do in the general? >> has to gather enthusiasm amongs younger voters flocking to bernie or she'll have trouble in some of these state. >> explain the bernie -- >> he is appealing because his populist message -- >> is it free tuition? >> that is a part of it. i was in south carolina talking to young people there and they were appealing to bernie because of free college tuition and felt like he had more passion. and he -- >> he's good. >> i think he's a better campaigner now than bill.

>> you do ask. >> right now. i think berner is better than bill clinton right now. >> i think he also -- he has this certainty with how he speaks. he's a different type of candidate. >> he's been singing this song for -- howard dean said he's been singing this for 50 year. >> repeats it over and over and over again and you saw it alt the -- >> i think what makes it work not just the self-interest of kids going to the vietnam era, 1a you have an attitude about the war but when he says we have to stop them from running our system, i think that grabs everybody. it sickens us to think people with billions of dollars could decide who wins an election. it kills us. great to have you on. temple grad in ted johnson. right back, tri at 7:00 p.m. for more "hardball." coming up next, "the rachel maddow show" show with hillary clinton and senator elizabeth warren. what a lineup.

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but zzzquil is different have pain medicine because why would you take a pain medicine when all you want is good sleep? zzzquil: a non-habit forming sleep-aid that's not for pain, thanks to you at home for joining us this hour. chris is right. boy, do we have a lot to get to tonight. we, on this show, this hour, have both an interview with hillary clinton, the leading contender for the democratic presidential nomination and we also are going to be joined tonight by elizabeth warren. senator warren, of course, looms large in our national politics as the other populist hero. not named bernie sanders but she's not made an endorsement.