answers that we were hearing from donald trump as he took questions from reporters onboard his plane. that, of course, is the video that was released by the jupiter police department of this event back in march, on march 8th. that does it for this hour. i'm erica hill. "mtp daily" starts now. if it's tuesday, it's an arrest for donald trump's campaign manager. trump just reacted with a full-throated defense of his top adviser. and he's set to hold his first rally since the charge starting any minute now. that is "mtp daily" and it starts right now. . good evening. i'm chuck todd in new york. welcome to "mtp daily." it is nearly april. we are supposed to be in the middle of a serious nominating contest for the highest office in the land. yet, here we are again, folks. this has gone to another level.

we would say it's been a strange and bizarre day in the history of this presidential campaign. yet in many ways, it just feels like yet another day on this campaign trail, when it involves donald trump. he just spent the better part of the last 30 minutes defending his campaign manager, who was, technically, arrested today, on one charge of simple battery. relating to a confrontation with a reporter on the campaign trail. he's heading now to a rally -- trump is. he's heading now a rally in janesville, hometown of paul ryan. we'll take you live to trump's rally when it begins. trump's campaign manager, cory lewandowski, turned himself into police in jupiter, florida, today after being charged with that one count of simple battery. it's a misdemeanor, against former breitbart reporter michelle fields. you're looking at new video of the incident that police obtained from trump's security team. something trump, i'm sorry, kept saying that he provided this video. police say the video parallels what fields told them about the confirmation. she says lewandowski yanked her arm as she attempted to ask trump a question during a

campaign event in jupiter, florida, earlier this month. she showed police bruising on her arm after she tweeted this image following the incident. after calling fields "delusional," and insisting there was no video of the incident, trump's campaign now says they are confident lewandowski will be exonerated. lewandows lewandowski's attorney says he is absolutely innocent of this charge. trump took to twitter this afternoon, with an attack on the accuser, questioning her motives and suggesting that she's lying. then he tweeted a about the incident in question, saying, why is she allowed to grab me and shout questions? can i press charges? then moments ago, you heard trump defending his campaign manager. trump spoke to reporters when he landed in janesville and took quite a few questions. it lasted about 30 minutes. let's look at some highlights. >> those tapes to me are very conclusive. a lot of people are looking and saying, how can anybody be charged. she was actually -- if you look

at her, she's grabbing at me and he's acting as an intermediary and trying to stop her from doing that. the news conference was over, it was done and finished and she was running up and grabbing and asking questions and i don't think she should be doing that. and i told him, you should never settle this case. you should go all the way. i think they really hurt a very good person. and i know it would be very eased for me to disregard people, i stay with people. that's why i stay with this country and stay with a lot of people that are treated unfairly. and that's one of the reasons i'm the front-runner by a lot. if you look at that tape, he was very, very seriously maligned. and i think it's very unfair. >> now, as you might expect, the campaign trail lit up with reaction over this. this all, of course, before trump, himself, reacted. ted cruz spoke to reporters today while campaigning in milwaukee and here's what he said of the arrest. >> it's a very sad development. and this is the consequence of the cultural of the trump

campaign. the abusive culture. when you have a campaign that is built on personal insults, on attacks, and now physical violence, that has no place in a political campaign, and it has no place in our democracy. and i think it is a really unfortunate development, but i do think it helps clarify for the voters, what the trump campaign is all about. >> john kasich addressed the news, as well. he did so after holding a town hall in waukesha. >> my understanding is that the report is that he grabbed somebody, and that's frankly, totally and completely inappropriate. it could have been one of my daughters, for that matter. look, i think i've said what i have to say, which is, if it was me, if i was in this circumstance, i would take -- i would take some sort of action. either suspension or firing. >> folks, you've got to ask

yourself, how long can this continue to go on? look at what trump's two rivals have done when they staffers landed in hot water? kasich's campaign fired a staffer earlier this month when they learned he was arrested and charged with simple assault for domestic violence. and today, kasich's chief strategist tweeted that, quote, campaigns reflect the values of the candidates. i know ours does. if this bully worked for john kasich, he would have been fired long ago. ted cruz fired his aide, rick tyler, after he re-tweeted a misleading report about something marco rubio said. now, trump risks having a campaign manager that has zero credibility with the press corps. and no matter what trump says, he does need that press corps. that said, he is showing loyalty to lewandowski in a way that i'm sure there are other former fired campaign managers that are out there that wished they worked for candidated that loyal. all of this is playing out against a volatile backdrop at trump rallies in general, and perhaps tonight. this is wisconsin, after all. they know how to protest here. six anti-trump protesters were

arrested last night while staging a sit-in demonstration at tonight's venue. and local police say they have reserved, quote, all levels of force to maintain safety. they're predicting just as many protesters to show up tonight as trump supporters. something we haven't seen since chicago when trump ended up canceling one of his rallies due to security concerns. by the way, what happens in trump goes to madison? we'll leave that aside. i'll be curious to see if he ends up in madison some time before the primary. but let's not forget. we're in the midst of a presidential contest here, folks. we're one week away from the wic primary. the badger state is trying to take on a role that is similar, frankly, to new hampshire. sort of a halftime version of it. it's less about delegate math than it is about momentum. someone or something has to prove that they have the power to slow trump, or the power to slow clinton. our new nbc news survey monkey weekly tracking poll of the republican race shows trump hitting a new high. a 48% support. that's a big deal. if he can get that over 50, you know what that means. trump keeps climbing.

up three points since last week. let's check in with katy tur, she's in the trenches of the trump campaign. she joins me now from janesville, wisconsin, where trump is about to take the stage. and it's interesting, katy, that he chose to do the on-plane presser before the event. that tells you, he wants the event to be all stump speech. he's not going to talk about this incident at the event, is that what we are here to assume? >> reporter: yeah, exactly. and notice, he did the all -- the presser on his campaign plane, when the majority of his normal campaign corps of reporters are here at this janesville rally. so the majority of people who were asking questions, were not people who have been there with him, as a number of these events have occurred or been there, certainly, when that michelle fields incident occurred. i would note this. a couple things to note. number one, the campaign initially came out and said that this never happened. that michelle fields never touched cory lewandowski. then they said there was no video to support it. that if it did happen, there

would have been video to support it. now they are saying that it is michelle fields who was the agr aggre aggressor and trump is trying to say that she is the one who was going after him. and that is why cory lewandowski did what he did. that's a real change over the course of time from the trump campaign itself. this was also not donald trump walking down the street. this was not a donald trump campaign rally. this was donald trump in his own estate, in the jupiter golf estate, having a press conference with reporters, who each one were vetted by the campaign and allowed into this press conference. each one had gone through secret service. everybody else in that room was a donald trump supporter. so the idea that he may have felt like he was under threat is certainly interesting, especially when you consider that the people in those -- in that room were people that cover the donald trump campaign -- excuse me, campaign. as for the -- >> katy? >> go ahead. >> something else jumped out at me during his presser, he said,

"i stick by people," but that's actually not the case. there's actually quite a few people he has fired in -- during, when a piece of controversy has flared up. roger stone and sam nunnberg. >> and sam nunnberg endorsing ted cruz just this week. he does stand by people who, though, he feels benefits him and have been loyal to him. the core of people around donald trump today are a core of people that have been around donald trump for quite some teime. i'm talking about those outside of the campaign. when it comes to cory lewandowski, he has been by his side for a well over a year and a half now, or a year and a few months, from before he announced his candidacy. and initially cory was regarded at a lightweight operative who didn't really know what he was doing. he was going to be leading this no-chance campaign. joke campaign. now he is on the verge of

clinching the republican nomination, potentially, and cory lewandowski is being credited, at least to some degree, with that success, because he did one thing that most people would not have done. he allowed donald trump to be donald trump. so donald trump has been extraordinarily loyal to cory lewandowski this entire time. he's only grown more loyal to him as he's continued winning. we saw him on stage with donald trump, in mar-a-lago a few weeks ago, after this controversy unfolded, after charges were pressed, after the police started looking into this incident. and cory lewandowski stood by donald trump, and he said, "good job, cory." that right there was an indication that donald trump was not going to part ways with him. it should not come as a surprise that today even after these charges have been filed, he's not parting ways with him, again. instead, blaming me ining miche fields. >> katy tur, in the trenches of the trump campaign, thanks very much. and one other point on cory is that not a lot of people were

lining up to take this job, and cory was willing to do it under the terms that trump wanted, as you were saying, katy. thanks very much. i'm joined now by our chief legal correspondent, ari melber. and ari, why did jupiter police department file a one-count misdemeanor charge? >> well, i think they filed it, because michelle fields came in on march 11th, and wanted to make this, basically, this complaint that was her reaction to what she felt was a completely unwarranted spearing of her, and a denial by the trump campaign. and by march 12th, they obtained this video we've all been seeing today from trump national hotel and got the overhead view that they thought was a clearer view and moved forward with what they have. a probable cause affidavit, alleging there was this physical contact. you and katy just now were having such an important conversation, chuck, because you're talking about what a candidate, donald trump, is saying politically about his employees' actions on the campaign, and donald trump has every right, of course, to strike back and cast this however he wants. i could tell you, legally,

donald trump is not cory lewandowski's lawyer and he's not doing his legal team any favors. the -- >> explain. >> well, the standard defense to a misdemeanor battery is not, oh, this young woman was a physical threat to me. indeed, misdemeanor battery is not necessarily intent to harm. that is to say, when you think of a battery, where you're trying to punch someone or knock them out. it could be called unwanted touching. you've got a real tension here i think we'll see over the coming day where donald trump's political interests, chuck, may diverge sharply from his employee, cory lewandowski's legal interests. his lawyers will want to say, hey, maybe we want to work this out. maybe we want to strike a deal. >> i want to say, it's a misdemeanor. this isn't going to go to trial, is it? >> well, what you're going to have on legal order, you'll have a may hearing, a probable cause hearing, several steps whereby this could not go to trial. but again, the reason a lot of times these things get worked out is because the victim comes forward, talks to the prosecution and the defendant, and you might say, you know, this was unwanted touching, this

was not a serious thing, can we work it out with an apology or an anger management course -- >> we're past that point. >> we're past that point because donald trump is talking the way he is. cory lewandowski was going to do an interview on prime-time television and then canceled it. there is going to be further tension here between what is good legally for the campaign manager and what his boss wants to do politically. >> it made no sense legally for him to do an interview tonight. that was no doubt that's the lawyers going, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. that's an insane thing to do. ari melber, thanks very much. let me quickly now check in with kerry sanders. he's been in jupiter, florida, where all of this was happening. kerry, you cover the state of florida all the time. the jupiter police department knew the minute they went through with this, that this was going to become a circus. >> reporter: exactly. and that's probably why we don't see anybody out here speaking for the jupiter police department. look, here's sort of how it all went down. they had michelle fields, who

made her complaint, and they had ben terrace, "the washington post" reporter, who seemed to corroborate what she had to say. but it was really this video here, the video that ari pointed out, came from donald trump's estate to begin with. and if you look at this video, it was that that pushed it over the edge. so the police department has to look at that and say, okay, do we see something that's going on here that could warrant a charge, an arrest? it's important to note, the defense attorney says there was no arrest, but here is the actual paperwork and according to the police department, if you look right up there at the top, you can see, it says, arrest, notice to appear, and the police department spokesman sent me a note saying mr. lewandowski was issued a notice to appear in court. this is an arrest. he was not placed in handcuffs. now, as you take a look at sort of the timetable here. we have the alleged incident, which was on march 8th. the police are contacted on the 11th. on the 12th, they get this video

and then we have the arrest. so really the next steps will be up to, as ari's pointed out, the state attorney. does the state attorney take this to the next level when there is a first appearance on may 4th? we'll see how it all goes from there. >> it would be hard to believe that this will continue to go through the court system, but you know what, a lot of this campaign has been hard to believe. kerry, thanks very much. let me check back in with janesville right now. police are preparing for a sizable crowd of anti-trump protesters tonight. tony dokoupil has been covering that angle, talking with protesters. he joins us now, wisconsin, of course, ground zero for the protest movement of politics back in 2010. so a lot of folks, i would imagine, are well organized out there. what are you seeing, tony? >> reporter: that's right, chuck. wisconsin is a state that knows how to protest. i'm in the center of those protests right now. the anti-trump contingent is moving in a circle around the main road leading up to the holiday inn conference site where donald trump is about to take the stage. we're seeing something unusual

here, something we have not seen since chicago, where the number people inside, about 1,000 people, mirrors the number of people outside, about 1,000 people. now, these are not all opponents of donald trump. what makes it a dangerous situation, you have trump protesters walking directly in front of people who could not get in, who are trump supporters. so there's an exchange there that's troubling. these pictures, these scenes are not very helpful for donald trump, because they underscore a lack of civility. and while wisconsin knows ho uh to protest, wisconsin voters also tell protesters they like civility, they like decorum. this is paul ryan's hometown. so when you layer on top of scenes like this the cory lewandowski news and the arrest for simple battery, well, that can give some gom voters who are already predisposed not to like donald trump, that could give them significant pause. we caught up with two of those voters earlier today and take a listen to what they had to say. >> he should be arrested. he should not have put his hands on anybody. you know, like you said, he could use his voice.

there's too much domestic violence, men, you know, abusing women. and it should not habe condoned. >> it's not even just about women. he seems to get away with saying terrible things, negative things about people that anyone else would probably get in big trouble for. >> reporter: and chuck, what you see there is something you highlighted on sunday, on "meet the press." you have female voters who in large, large numbers, about 70% have negative views of donald trump. that is a big problem, if he hopes to win wisconsin, because in the counties, milwaukee, three out of four voters view him negatively. those are the most active, highest turnout counties in the country of the republican race. if he cannen win there, it's hard to see how we can win this state overall. chuck? >> it's a great point. and wisconsin is very similar to minnesota and iowa. there's this nice atmosphere to it, to the people, to both parties. donald trump lost minnesota, donald trump lost iowa. something to watch when it comes

to wisconsin. tony, nice work. we are awaiting donald trump, to take the stage in janesville, wisconsin. we'll bring you a part of that rally live. tomorrow, trump will join my colleague, chris matthews, for a town hall in green bay, at 8:00 p.m. eastern. it's part of a big night on msnbc. i'm moderating a town hall with john kasich at 7:00. and rachel maddow will interview both democratic candidates at 9:00 p.m. eastern. four of the big five on msnbc tomorrow night. we'll be right back. soup and sandwich and cannonballs and clean and real and looking good and sandwich and soup and a new personal best. and a little help and soup and sandwich and study group. good, clean food pairs well with anything. try the clean pairings menu. at panera. food as it should be.

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you're looking live here at a crowd in janesville, wisconsin, waiting for donald trump's arrival. we know trump is on his way to that rally right now. and one with week to go until the wisconsin primary, the biggest spender on the airwaves in the badger state, it's all of the combined anti-trump group. two combined outside groups are spending $1.7 million in wisconsin alone in tv ads opposing trump. in contrast, donald trump's campaign has spent less than $400,000 on ads in the state.

that's less than half of what his rivals are spending. kasich and his backers have spent over $900,000 on wisconsin ads. cruz and his backers have spent $850,000. on the democratic side, it's the sanders' campaign that is outspending clinton by a nearly 6-1 margin. sanders is shelling out about $1.5 million on ads in wisconsin compared to just over $262,000 from clinton. whether that is a good delegate cost-per-delegate spending decision by the sanders' campaign, we'll find out in a week. we'll be right back with more "mtp daily." they say you shouldn't spoil your kids. but your grandkids? how about front row seats to the best show in town? and that is why you invest. the best returns aren't just measured in dollars. td ameritrade®.

wrely on the us postal service? because when they ship with us, their business becomes our business. that's why we make more e-commerce deliveries to homes than anyone else in the country. here, there, everywhere. united states postal service priority: you i just can't stand by and watch a man's life be destroyed, be destroyed, and take a look at her original statement. just look at her original statement before she knew that donald trump is rich and has cameras all over the ceiling, so we can protect people from the standpoint of security, fire, et cetera, et cetera. take a look at her original

statement. the first words out of her mouth, about her going down and, you know, pulled down, or something to that effect. she was pulled down. she wasn't pulled down. she doesn't even change her expression. >> that was donald trump, on his plane, a short while ago. a little press available, mostly with wisconsin press folks. the national press corps that follows the trump campaign was already at the event and could not participate in that little press avail. whether that was intentional or not, only the advance people know. joining me, mary kissel. ra d'ka jones, and tamara dry with demos action. all right, mary, let me start with you. you're not shy about being a trump critic. in some ways -- >> it's not personal. it's about policy. >> no doubt. >> we have critiques of cruz and kasich, as well as hillary and bernie. >> no doubt. i don't think there's a candidate left that "the wall street journal" editorial board is extremely happy with, these

days. i will concede they lost their favorite candidates. >> again, we don't endorse -- >> it's pretty clear who you don't want, though, that's -- >> i don't know, you don't work for the editorial page. i'm telling you we don't endorse candidates. >> fair enough. but let me ask whether this, today seemed yet to be another ridiculous day in this campaign. that this was the focal point. all of a sudden, this was the feeding frenzy, and yet it was just sort of par for the course. >> i think that's the feeding friends kbri we've chosen to focus on. of course, the other story out of wisconsin is the fact that ted cruz has pulled even in the polls and governor scott walker, who has more than an 80% approval rating, by republicans in wisconsin, just came out for cruz. now, it didn't seem to be as much of a from-cruz endorsement as it did to be an anti-trump endorsement. but the real story here is that this is a neck and neck race in wisconsin. and wisconsin voters, as you say, they're discerning voters. they're also very sophisticated, because -- >> they're civil.

>> it's not that they're civil, chuck, it's also that they've been through several campaign cycles now. remember, they elected scott walker, they had that big recall. they're sophisticated, they're tuned in. so when you see press conferences or events like that by trump, he's trying to motivate more of his base to come out in the face of a very, very tough election there in wisconsin. >> you know, mary brought up an interesting point, though, radika, just now. she reminded me that walker's endorsement wasn't necessarily pro-cruz, it was just anti-trump. and that seems to be the sort of, why isn't the anti-trump movement taking over the party right now? because they're just not ready to get enthusiastic about cruz. that that seems to be this bottleneck here. >> that's part of it. it seems to me among all of the playground politics going on, there's also that very old maxim, that you can't beat 'em, join 'em. and i think people are really wrestling with some of those choices. you know, how strongly do you want to come out against trump if he ends up being the guy? there's a cold calculus there

that -- >> it's interesting you say that. because scott walker, he went -- and look, he was prevent anti-trump when he dropped out. it would have been weird if he would have not been anti-trump. but tamara, contrast him with ron johnson, who wisconsin senator, trouble, you would assume he would be distancing himself from trump, and he just made the calculation, radhika, basically, you know, i don't agree with him on anything, but maybe i should be more on his side than against him. >> i think the timidity is explained by that new figure in the new poll, 45% of republicans now supporting trump. and i think -- >> 48, actually. 48. >> sorry, no, no, but edging ever close to 50. >> but you know, what that says to the elites that have been running the party, they have lost the economic case they have been making to the white working class, their base, and they're not getting it back. trump is getting it. he has the oddest mix of policy positions. he has really shown everyone think to people whose livelihoods have been destroyed

through our trade policies. he wants to expand social security and strengthen medicare. now, that is not the typical conservative economic playbook. i disagree with him on a lot of other economic issues, but what it shows is cruz isn't going to take over those positions. he's not going to come out in support of expanding social security and protecting medicare and, so, they're at a loss. they've lost their base. the playbook of tax cuts, tax cuts, tax cuts, deregulate, deregulate, deregulate is no longer resonating with a core part of their base. >> well, it's the size of government. he wants a bigger government, donald trump does. >> he also wants to cut taxes, though. >> that may be the only time we agree. that donald trump does want a bigger government. >> what does it say that the speaker of the house, paul ryan, who in many cases -- i know, you don't endorse candidate, but the perfect "wall street journal" editorial board republican, or the perfect "wall street journal" editorial board republican. >> you mean conservative -- it's not a party -- >> i understand that. but paul ryan fits the profile

of somebody that certainly you guys like a lot. what does it say if trump is winning janesville, is winning his district where he's not able to sell that conservative, small government approach and trump is winning it. >> but you have to look at the polls. the polls show a neck and neck race in wisconsin and i think, you know, this is an excellent argument here, that the gop has stopped talking about pro-growth policies. now, you and i are going to disagree a lot on what those pro-growth policies should be -- >> they've not talked to these people. >> this is what's been interesting about cruz in wisconsin. is that he's starting to connect what his policies would mean for growth, for the middle class. that's not something that he's done in prior contests, very effectively. and that shows that he's learning, as a candidate, but clearly, donald trump has taken the focus away from what seven years of government stimulus, more regulation, socialized health care, what that has done is produce a 2% economy.

it's very abnormal, but we're not talking about that, because we're covering things like cory, the campaign manager, instead of talking about growth, that actually, most conservatives want to talk about. >> but, i guess, radhika, the thing that everybody does agree on is that none of these candidates, until recently have said, oh, we've got to start talking to the trump voters. marco rubio did it in his concession speech. that was the first time where he actually made a compelling case to the trump voter. before it always was, well, if we just say he's not a conservative, trump voters will believe that. they're not ideologues, and that's been the mistake. >> no, there is no boilerplate way to talk to the trump voter. the only way to talk to the trump voter is to talk like trump, but only trump can do it. >> you really think that? you have to talk like trump? >> for me, that's been one of the lessons of the campaign. trump can say things no one else can say. >> but he has the highest

dislike numbers we've ever seen. let's not talk like all conservatives think trump is great. >> and one thing we're making a mistake on is this idea that nothing hurts trump. nothing hurts trump losing supporters, but his numbers keep getting worse with people who are going to vote in november. there's a new jury coming in november. this jury, he may win. there's a new jury coming up in the fall. >> and there's a whole other part of the working class he has not been able to make any inroads on, and that is the latina, african-american, and female working class. you know, we feed to bring jobs back, but we also need to improve the jobs that people are doing here at home that can't be shipped overseas. i haven't heard a single plan from him about that. so, i think he's taking the tired playbook of the republican party, which is to scapegoat the other members of the working class, to rile up the white working class. and it's working. and it's a shape. he really should try -- >> i have good news here. you guys are sticking around.

mary, you'll have more time to respond. i promise. and radhika gets to play referee. new reaction from hillary clinton and sanders on the campaign trail. all of that for you in a minute. we're awaiting trump in janesville, paul ryan's home state, one week before the badger state votes. we'll bring it to you live when it happens. stay tuned. ♪ in new york state, we believe tomorrow starts today. all across the state, the economy is growing, with creative new business incentives, the lowest taxes in decades, and new infrastrture for a new generation attracting the talent and companies of tomorrow. like in rochester, with world-class botox. and in buffalo, where medicine meets the future. let us help grow your company's tomorrow - today - at business.ny.gov don't let dust and allergies get and life's beautiful moments. with flonase allergy relief, they wont. most allergy pills only control one inflammatory substance. flonase controls six.

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w time, starting with the who. it's new york governor andrew cuomo barring all nonessential state travel to north carolina. this after they blocked a law blocking protection for the lbgt community. now to the what. it's more interstate fire, this time from ted cruz directed at georgia governor nathan deal. the presidential candidate called diehl's veto to have a controversial religious liberty bill very disappointing. now to the when, it was a few hours ago, president obama unveiled new measures to improve

treatment for heroin and opioid abuse. the white house also increased the availability of overdose treatment drugs and investment in community policing. by the way, that's one of the few great bipartisan deals congress has done in the last few weeks. now to the where. it's the supreme court. a 4-4 split this morning on whether state workers who do not join a union can be compelled to pay a share of union dues. the tie leaves the lower court ruling standing. more scotus in the why. illinois senator mark kirk met with president obama's nominee, merrick garland, this afternoon. he is the first republican senator to meet with the nominee. here's why it matters. kirk is among 16 republican senators, more than a quarter of the caucus, who have agreed to meeting. kirk along with kelly ayotte and pat toomey are blue state republicans up for re-election. by the way, 10 of the 17 are republicans up for re-election in 2016. we'll be right back. [woodworker] i live in the fine details.

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it interesting that the campaigns feel compelled to jump on this story, almost help make it a feeding frenzy, and not try to move in another direction. >> reporter: i would say, though, chuck, remember that ted cruz and others are responding to questions that are being asked of them. i haven't yet see a candidate come out and unprompted begin to discuss this. because this is in the headlines, because, obviously, donald trump is talking about this, because of the charges, it is something that it is being, you know, brought up when these candidates are coming in to do these media availabilities and press gaggles. i had the opportunity about 20 minutes ago to ask senator cruz about this, specifically about the idea of whether or not trump's campaign manager should be fired, which is something that he hadn't spoken to earlier in the day. you heard his response just there. this actually is consistent with what cruz talked about back on march 14th, he was in illinois, and asked about this when news of the incident first started coming out. this was prior the charges. cruz said something similar at the time about it being a

fireable offense and also talked about the responsibility for any campaign, lying with the candidate, ultimately lying at the top. so, what you're seeing from cruz is a continuation of that theme. what i'm interested in is to see how the response shakes out tonight. both candidates at town halls in milwaukee here in wisconsin. chuck? >> and the real test of this, hallie, is going to be, does this make air and paid advertising? do they try to tie this to something bigger on trump, and it's something that the anti-trump campaign -- >> like a character attack. >> sometimes they do it. sometimes they don't. they don't stay consistent, it so will be interesting to see how they try to use this in going after trump. hallie jackson on the road with cruz, thanks very much. we'll sneak in another quick break here. we're awaiting donald trump in janesville, wisconsin. protesters, not surprisingly, it's wisconsin. they've been protesting a lot lately. they're making their voices heard outside the event. we'll be back with more "mtp daily" right after this. ♪

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. look, i think that every candidate has to be responsible for what happens in their campaign, and as i've said repeatedly, what donald trump has been doing over these last months is inciting violent behavior, aggressive behavior that i think is very dangerous,

and has resulted in attacks on people at his events, and including this charge that was now brought against his campaign manager. i'm not going to comment on a pending legal or criminal case, but i think that, you know, ultimately, the responsibility is mr. trump's. >> that was hillary clinton, earlier this hour, responding to the latest on trump's campaign manager, back with me today is round table. mary kissle, radhika, how many days, saying the exact same thing about donald trump. that's happening more and more these days. >> a lot of consensus in american politics, chuck. i don't know what you're talking about. >> people working together all the time, cruz and hillary coming together. >> this is what we look for when we look for bipartisan deals, right. >> let's talk about wisconsin itself. it is kind of -- on the calendar, we're at half time. as far as the delegates, we're past that, more than half the

delegates have been picked on each side. believe it or not, more calendar days left in the primary season than have past. which is, i know, sorry, i sort of depressed people the other day. so wisconsin is serving look a new new hampshire, sort of like a reset, where it's about momentum, it's not about -- this isn't a delegate fight per se. this a perception fight. sander/clinton, perception. trump, not trump is a perception fight. >> it is. wisconsin, i am a midwestern. >> you are from ohio. my father from iowa, never has allowed ohio in the midwest. >> what is it? >> some people argue, part of the rust belt, you don't get to be midwest because you're in the big 10. >> wow. you're blowing my mind right now. >> old school, i know. >> i love wisconsin, because it has such a long history of civic tradition. as we were saying, like the people are out, and they're standing up and making their

opinions known, whether they're for trump or against trump, and fingers crossed that it remains civil. i think it's great new hampshire isn't getting the only number one in the primary caucus. it's time to spread the love around the country. >> it's interesting about wisconsin is that it can be counter cultural on left and right. and it various times in its past, whether you want to -- it is -- >> the birthplace of the progressive left. >> progressive left. >> labor unions. >> joe mccarthy. >> it has had a little bit of everything. trump and bernie sanders should do well here on paper. and yet, they both could end up losing. >> well, you know, they -- wisconsin voters also vote for what works. remember, they reelected scott walker. he has made a lot of reforms in wisconsin. that was the basis of his presidential campaign so you could run conservative pro growth policies, and look at the results. he had great results there. >> well, actually he didn't.

that was the problem. the results hadn't about there. >> let me finish. so what we're looking for in wisconsin, and i do believe by the way, chuck, it's about the delegates. it's not about what the media perceives as momentum. it is about the numbers here. we don't have a 1237 yet, we don't have a gop candidate. >> if you cannot -- >> the question is, the question is, can ted cruz expand his base in wisconsin. can he reach out to the people that he was unable to reach in, for example, illinois. can he get moderates? can he get suburban moms. can he get and prove that he can be competitive when it moves into the northeast. >> this is the issue, i think. i think if this were a kasich/trump one-on-one, i'm not going to contest it, telling my voters to back kasich, kasich could be tailor-made for it.

again i'm going to get all sorts of -- do you want to be rust belt or midwest. you can't be both. but in all seriousness, but kasich doesn't have the resources. >> the thing is that, well, it's interesting to -- what would happen if someone stepped back, people run for president because they want to win. that's something that donald trump is right about, i think. and you know, cruz is going to do everything he can in a state like wisconsin. why wouldn't he. >> i want to go to the democratic side here, madison, wisconsin is a place where ralph nadere, there is a base here, the great rally he had, 20,000 people showed up, that got donald trump jealous the size of

a rally, i think took place in madison, wisconsin. it is there for the taking for him. but he has to -- he has to win it, to sort of keep this going. >> yeah, he does. the stakes are much higher. i think when you look at the ad spending, it's clear. >> he knows it, they put their money where their mouth is. >> 1.5, 260, it's clear where the stakes are on the democratic side. i think -- i think bernie is it in it for the long hall. no matter what happens in wisconsin, he still has a lot of money in the bank. and i know he is in it to win it, but i also think that he has accomplished one goal, which is agenda setting. i think he has changed a lot of the democratic play that we're seeing in the cycle. >> no doubt there. >> i think that's a very important observation. >> i thought he won the issues. >> absolutely. >> she may win the votes, and probably win the nomination, but he has pushed her on policies in ways she maybe wouldn't have

gone down. >> bernie sanders, also president obama achievement, he has pulled the party very, very far to the left of where it was under president bill clinton. you see that reflected in -- >> it's funny you say that. where the beating heart of the republican party. i thought it was cruz. i thought he had sort of where the energy was. and it turned out not to be. where is the beating heart? >> that's a great question, chuck. we're going to find out when voters vote. >> what would you conclude right now? >> one point i do want to drive home. there is a process, and the process is working. there is not a clear-cut front-runner, because i don't think anybody took donald trump seriously and they didn't make their arguments against him. they didn't explain what his policies would mean for economic growth or to combat the war on terror to fight the global disorder that has erupted under this administration. you see trump's support is very sticky, but you see voters now go to the polls on polling day, they're not going for him. they're going for cruz and kasich, because they're finally

starting to explain what trump ideas actually mean for the country and the world. so i'm not going to make predictions. it's a long race here. the polls are running even in wisconsin. i think governor walker's endorsement is important. we'll see what happens on ballot day. >> where is beating heart. i don't know if i had i i have an answer any more, and i think used to. >> i think that's what the party elite is asking itself. that will be a big question at an open convention. because ideally, the beating heart of the party is the person who shows up in the general election. >> i thought of the republican party still as a small government, a small government party, and donald trump is not -- >> he is not a republican, he is not a conservative. >> he is not a 21st century. >> he is all over the map. i mean, he's got some progressive policies, he's got some very conservative. i mean, let's remember, he still wants to usher in a gigantic tax

cut, which translates to small government. >> rhetoric is not small government. >> he is not a small government guy. he wants to do nothing to reform the entitlement state, that's the vast majority of the federal budget. he is exactly the same as the president on foreign policy, if not worst. he wants to building at home, isolation, broad, we didn't get to the comments on nato, which were pretty shocking. >> the nato thing is stunning, and it's interesting that john kasich tried with me to make the case fortunate to nato, no doube been searching for a place. but the electorate isn't interested in that debate. >> not so much, no. i mean, i do think you've posed this question on this show in multiple times over the last few months. if, as we're saying, donald trump is in no way a -- >> pro growth conservative.

>> and he is getting republican votes, then what is the party? >> that's right. >> he is not getting -- >> the party is what the voters say, not the elites. >> he is not getting the majority of the republican vote. we don't know. he may. >> i have to pause it here. our hour is over. thank you all, marie, radhika, tamra, keeping an eye on the trump rally in janesville. it will happen, and when it does, you'll see it right here. for now, "with all due respect" will begin right now. i'm mal. >> i'm john helemann. with all due respect to the presidential campaign, no, no due respect. we have been saying for months now that the 2016 presidential c