it's a great day for the british people. it came out in huge numbers and they didn't fall for project fear, the scaremongering tactics cameron brought in. it's a great day for britain, great day for freedom and great day for democracy. >> you don't want to keep people out. i feel the choice was taken away by being inside the eu. >> the world is still recovering from the shock after voters in' the united kingdom decided it's

time for a brexit. it was a big win for team leave in thursday's referendum when a 52 percent majority voted for britain to withdraw from the european union. world markets took a nose dive in response to the unexpected result, with stocks dropping in the u.s., europe and asia. british prime minister david cameron who decided to hold the referendum to quiet the calls for withdrawal coming from his political opponents and who had been confident that his countrymen would decide to remain in the eu announced his plans to step down after the vote. support for the brexit was driven by a strain of nativism particularly among backers of the u.k. independence party who wanted to see british borders tightened against the flow of immigration and increased autonomy over trade. if that sounds familiar, it's because the same sentiments are helping fuel the u.s. presidential campaign of the man who happened to arrive in the u.k. the day after the vote. republican presumptive nominee donald trump. trump's trip was strictly business. his visit was a promotional trip

for his new and not entirely welcome golf course in scotland. he took the opportunity to talk about how the brexit chaos might benefit the latest edition to the trump golf empire. >> look, if the pound goes down they're going to do more business. when the pound goes down, more people are coming to turnberry, frankly. >> joining me is chief global correspondent bill neely. let's start with what kind of reception trump received in scotland. >> reporter: not a very good one, joy. scotland voted overwhelmingly to stay within the european union and i don't think donald trump made very many friends there by implying the opposite was the case and that scotland would now have its freedom. he's popular up there, let's face it, because of the multi million pound investment in those golf courses, but as a politician, i would suggest he shouldn't stand for any kind of election there, regardless of

his heritage. here, it's all about divorce. officials here are now working on what is the world's most complex divorce. dozens of treaties to be unravelled, hundreds of trade agreements, 50 years of foreign policy, thousands of questions. on top of the pile of those questions is how long will this take and the answer is that nobody knows. everyone thinks it will take about two years. that is within the european union that any country wishing to leave it would be a two-year process. some people think it might take a decade. over in germany at the minute, the founding members of the european union, the six countries are meeting and their talk really is about survival. they know that this is a grievous blow. to use a movie analogy, the "titanic" has been holed below the water line. the question is will it sink.

it was certainly heading towards the icebergs without any care, it seems, and that's one reason people in britain decided to leave. those european leaders want a quickie divorce. they don't want this dragged out because they see the european union's very survival is at stake and indeed, one french minister said britain should choose a new prime minister within days. david cameron announcing his resignation yesterday. that is not going to happen. that will take months. that gives you an idea of how, if you like, panicked they are. >> really quickly, i want to play for you a little something we saw on i-tv the other night, the night of the vote which was really stark and showed you the split demographically between those who voted to leave and voted to stay. tlichb. . >> let's also look at coastal towns. those were areas we thought would be more likely to vote leave. just look at all of that support for leave all around the coast and all those key coastal areas. let's look at areas of country where there were higher

proportions of people who were retired. let's just look at how well leave has done. the only areas where remain is done is in scotland where there were entirely different reasons for that vote. >> we also know there was a youth versus older people split. there was a sort of rural versus urban split. now we find out that there is a referendum petition that's going around by people who regret their vote to leave. 1.5 million people and counting. is there now a generational sort of fight going on between britons as to whether or not the rural voters have in a sense hijacked the future of the young? >> very much so. my daughter is 18, she voted to remain. like most of her friends. she says on social media, on the kinds of social media they use, it is full of people saying that the old, their parents' generation, grandparents' generation, has robbed them of

their future. they feel very very resentful. as you say, there are huge divides in britain. coastal towns, rural areas, working class areas, there was a howl of anger, people saying hey, you elite, rich people in london, you don't know what it's like here. we don't have jobs. we can't get our children into the schools that we want to put them in. we can't even get an appointment with the doctor because of all these romanians and bulgarians coming through. that's the visceral howl of anger that won't easily be quieted even by their victory. as you say, regionally, britain is split so that scotland, london and northern ireland decided to vote remain and this morning, scotland's leader has said she is opening talks with european union leaders to find a way that scotland can remain part of the european union. they are also beginning plans for a second referendum on scottish independence. as i said earlier, about the

sort of survival of the european union being at issue, the survival of the u.k., europe's first european union stretching back 300 years, it's also at stake. the vote's over, the decision is there, but the anger, the result, the aftermath of this will last for a very, very long time. >> indeed. because united kingdom really means britain, scotland, wales and northern ireland. that's the point of it. thank you very much. appreciate it. i want to bring in my guests. cnbc contributor ron insanneh, kim gaddis. that last thing you heard bill say, the sense among coastal residen residents, rural people, that the elites in london don't understand them and they really blame their woes, not being able to get a doctor's appointment on the big banks, the bankers e ,

elites in london. what do you make of that? >> that's a wave that seems to be washing around the world right now. we hear the very same sentiments in the united states. you see it in the far rightist movement in france, the afd in germany. this is washing over large parts of the world. there are groups of people who are disenfranchised and don't feel they have a stake in their country's dream, whether the u.k., u.s. or any other country. at times, obviously, the political elite have not listened. in some cases, they thought they knew better and didn't. that's why we are seeing this expression of anger here. there is also, when you look at the demographics, older folks and i'm paraphrasing a quote i saw this morning, are re-romanticizing their past, trying to recreate something that is now gone to the detriment of the youth of their country. >> amazing, because the nostalgia voter is driving the donald trump campaign here. so interesting. kim, to what extent is what's happening in england right now a

result of the austerity that was put in place by the cameron administration which was voted back into power after he had done it after the great recession. >> that's what's so amazing when we look at the results of this referendum. the indictment that it is of david cameron himself who has had to resign and is now being pushed out even faster by the eu who are saying you have got to leave even more quickly than you said you would. he won a resounding victory not that long ago. so what people are voting on is indeed how they have felt left out of the system, left behind, because of austerity measures. not all of which can be blamed on the eu. what i found very interesting was that areas where people voted in large majorities to leave are the ones where there is the lowest net migration. in other words, it means that those who voted for remain are

in contact with immigrants, they are in areas where there are immigrants and so you can deduce from that that a lot of the sentiments that drove the leave voters was the fear of the unknown, of the other, and that's why we're talking about nationalism and populism and some people take it as far as calling it xenophobic. but it is feeding into the sense of being left behind by the system. those voters have not been brought in, have not had their fears addressed properly. there was a real lack of leadership on all sides. but the result is that everybody's waking up this morning with a hangover because as ron was just saying, there is a nostalgia for the past that perhaps wasn't exactly how people remember and certainly can't be recreated so quickly. it's not by leaving the eu that wages are going to rise. it's not by leaving the eu that suddenly the national health system is going to be funded fully again and be something that people can go to and not have to wait weeks for an

appointment. in fact, just one last point, there was a lot of rhetoric that was divorced from reality, what i call disinformation, and we saw that very clearly the morning after when nigel farage, the head of the u.k. independence party, sort of said actually, our claim that the 350 million pounds we send every week to the eu are going to fund the nhs. that promise that was very prominently displayed on the vote leave banner was a mistake. he said it was a mistake. so i think a lot of people are waking up perhaps still confident of their vote to leave but wondering what exactly is it going to mean really now. >> it's interesting because the googling of what is the eu and what happens if we leave that spiked after the vote was pretty incredible. bob, i want to play you just to kim's point sort of the uncertainty that we are now seeing among people who actually voted to leave. this is one young man who has gotten a lot of play probably to his extreme sadness -- or woman,

about the regret about the vote. take a listen. >> my family this morning even though majority of us voted to leave, we are actually regretting it today. i wish we had the opportunity to vote again simply because i would do so many things differently. >> i was thinking there's a young man at a roundtable who was even more famous than that poor young lady. that kind of regret you are seeing now, what do you make of it? >> well, i think that people are basically saying i'm mad as hell, to use the cliche, i'm mad as hell and i'm not going to take it anymore. that's what they were saying with their vote. if you ask them what are you mad at, they can't really say what they are angry at is not only is this nostalgia for the past but fear of the future. probably it's a valid fear. they have been talked down to and taken advantage of by the elites, whether the intellectual elites, political elites, certainly the economic elites and of course, that is the feeling in this country and

forms the basis for the support for donald trump. >> indeed. ron, our colleague chris hayes wrote a book called "twilight of the elites" where he talks about this dystopian future where the choices between the elites who garner all the wealth even after a crash like 2008, only a small percentage of people get anything out of it. or base populism that pits people against each other in race, region and class. have we reached that future? >> i think we're close. if you look at the gains in the wake of the crash, 95% of the gains that came in the stock market and rebound in real estate prices went to the top 1%. there's a reason for people to feel left out. those who were hit hardest in the recession did not recover with everyone else. that's a failure of policy. more than it is actually a failure of information. we should have had a large fiscal policy program in the united states. the fed did as much as it could do to lower interest rates and help people get back on their

feet but there are political failures all over the world in this regard and it's reverberating now in the way just described. >> thank you very much to ron, kim and bob are sticking around. up next, prime minister david cameron falls on his sword. what's next for the british government and the 70 year' l l special relationship between the u.s. and britain? >> we are europeans. we are citizens of the world. we didn't vote to leave europe but you are snatching it away from us. >> why does my future be influenced by a generation who can't receive in benefits compared to a nostalgia that can never be again? uncomfortable it can be. but did you know that the lack of saliva can also lead to tooth decay and bad breath? well, there is biotene, specially formulated with moisturizers and lubricants...

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but i do not think it would be right for me to try to be the captain that steers our country to its next destination. this is not a decision i have taken lightly, but i do believe it's in the national interest to have a period of stability and then the new leadership required. >> that announcement by british prime minister david cameron was not supposed to be the way that yesterday went. but having lost his big gamble on the brexit referendum, cameron is accepting reality and will turn over the reigns of a soon-to-be untethered britain to someone else. the timing of cameron's departure in the middle of the u.s. presidential election adds yet another question to the long list of uncertainties in the wake of the brexit. what does a new prime minister and a new president mean for the special relationship between the u.s. and our closest ally? kim and bob are still with me in washington. i will start with you, kim. first of all, is there a realistic chance that boris johnson or even more probably

terrifyingly for americans, nigel farrage, could be the next prime minister of britain? what would that mean? >> i think there's still too much uncertainty in the day after brexit to know exactly how this is going to unfold and who might rise to the top. at wh at what point does david cameron leave or not. he said he would leave in october. now eu foreign ministers are pressing him to leave sooner. all of this plays into who could be the next prime minister of the u.k., who could be the next leader of the party and of the labor party as well. when it comes to the u.s./u.k. relationship, we have heard assurances from president obama, from candidates like hillary clinton saying this doesn't affect the relationship, it will continue to be strong, but it does raise a lot of questions about trade, about defense, about even exports from the u.s. to the u.k., with the pound crashing, the dollar soaring, what does that mean for u.s. businesses. all of these are questions that

are going to come into play. as you have been saying as well, some of the issues that drove the vote to leave the eu in the u.k. are also at play here in the u.s. i think hillary clinton will be watching those very closely but i would just like to make one more point. i see what we are witnessing in the u.k. and in the u.s. in terms of this fear of the unknown, fear of the future, the sense that people no longer feel this is their country for those who do feel like that, because of immigration, is a reflection on a country level of a wider global malaise about the rise of the rest, the west and other countries that are rising, and this uncertainty about what globalization means for everybody. there is always a fear of being left out, but there is certainly a way forward whereby everybody can share in this sort of global advancement. it doesn't have to be a zero sum game.

that is something that i think leaders have not explained properly. >> absolutely. i think that the leaders who are the loudest are people like boris johnson. i want to play a little bit of him. you make an excellent point, this notion that people can share in the benefits of globalization has definitely not played out for a lot of people. let's listen, then bob, i will come to you. >> there is certainly no need in the 21st century to be part of a federal system of government based in brussels that is imitated nowhere else on earth. it was a noble idea for its time. it is no longer right for this country. >> what does it mean for a country of the importance and magnitude of great britain to withdraw essentially and say we want to be an island unto ourselves? >> well, first of all, let me be a bit contrarian here and say that maybe people need to step back just a little bitnd say was the european union really a flawed concept. i'm among those who think that

it might have been. what you are talking about is a union of people and nations that have for most of history been at war with each other. they certainly have different cultures, that type of thing. that is really hard to meld into some sort of union like they were trying to do. economically it was possible, although the british people have said that they don't want to do it. at least those who even understood what it is. i think that what you are seeing right now is a rebellion against the status quo but not the normal kind of rebellion. this is a rebellion from those who would normally endorse the status quo. that is to say, the loyal americans, for instance, if we take it to this country. now they are saying we have really been taken advantage of by a really rigged system and it's time that there are changes, i don't care what they are. >> but it's interesting because we are a federation of 50 states. this country, the united states, is exactly what the eu tried to be when it was formed. it sort of was like a super united states. it's interesting that you have

that take. i want to play for you, kim, the great j.k. rowling or read what she said. she wrote extensively about the outcome of brexit, saying leave has been busy threatening us with monster, a tsunami of foreigners heading to our shores, among them rapists and terrorists. and there's this anti-immigrant ad that shows this flood of brown faces menacingly coming to the shores. that wasn't even great britain they were showing there. how much of what happened is straight out xenophobia and racism? >> i don't want to underestimate the feelings of those who voted for leave and how they feel left out of the system and they have legitimate grievances. they do feel that their leaders have not listened to them, have not made their lives better. they do have a beef with the eu and i don't want to contradict myself but i do agree with bob

that the eu is not a perfect union and there does need to be a moment where we step back and think how can this be made better, how can this be made to benefit everybody, and there does need to be on a global level a rethinking of international and regional organizations so that they are better adapted to the 21st century. but i think there's no doubt that the leave campaign did play to people's basest fears about immigration, did feed the xenophobic sentiment. that's unfair for voters that they be made to fear something that isn't necessarily to their detriment. yes, there are problems with wages, with access to the nhs and all of that, but immigration also has its upsides, if it is done properly. >> yeah. indeed. so many issues that as you are saying, as you are speaking them, you can hear them reflected in what's happening in the u.s. thank you so much. you guys are great. thank you. coming up, donald trump is in the united kingdom but not

for the reason you might think. stay with us.

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what's happening is historic so it's an honor to be with you. my mother was born in scotland. to think that we would be here owning turnberry one day would be incredible. because it's one of the most spectacular properties in the world. it always did well but now since we opened we actually opened a number of weeks ago, the course and we haven't had an empty slot. reviews of the course have been phenomenal. not just like good. even people that truly hate me are saying it's the best they have ever seen. >> if you didn't know that donald trump gave that press conference in scotland just hours after the historic brexit vote. the monumental global economy-risking decision to leave the european union. if you didn't see the make america great again hat that he was wearing, you might think that we were playing you an archival clip showing that he

had gone back to the private sector. that opener was followed by more than ten minutes of trump flacking for his new golf resort, complete with descriptions of its luxury suites. he didn't fully address the consequences of the brexit vote until he was asked about it by reporters. but that didn't stop the folks at the right wing website breitbart.com for giving him the credit declaring britain votes with trump. it didn't stop the candidate from taking a little credit, too. >> well, i think the brexit deal, i think when you talk about leave, you know, i felt again, knowing the people here very well but not wanting to get involved but i felt that was going to happen. i felt it was going to happen. and there was great similarities between what happened here and my campaign. yeah. people want to take their country back. >> so that's a long way from the sentiment that trump expressed in a 2003 -- 2013 op-ed about investing in europe when he wrote quote, we will have to leave borders behind and go for

global unity when it comes to financial stability. consisnt or not, trump does seem to have a little more confidence in speaking about the brexit now than he did when he was asked about it just three days ago. >> i don't think anybody should listen to me because i haven't really focused on it very much but my inclination would be to get out. >> nothing like learning on the fly. or on the t-box. >> we must stop the terror. i call upon all nations to do everything they can to stop these terrorist killers. thank you. now watch this drive. ♪ what are you doing? sara, i love you, and... [phone rings] ah, it's my brother. keep going... sara, will you marry... [phone rings again] what do you want, todd???? [crowd cheering] keep it going!!!! if you sit on your phone, you butt-dial people.

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♪ ♪ the fight is not over. this is just one step. but when we come back here on july 5th, we are going to continue to push, to pull, to

stand up and if necessary, to sit down once again. >> we are not going to allow stunts like this to stop us from carrying out the people's business. why do i call this a stunt. well, because it is one. >> on thursday afternoon, house democrats emerged on to the u.s. capitol steps after wrapping up an unprecedented nearly 26-hour sit-in on the house floor. the dramatic protest was aimed at forcing the gop-led house to vote on gun reform bills. proposed in the wake of the orlando nightclub massacre. but the republican response to the sit-in ranged from condemnation to at times heated confrontation. speaker paul ryan derided the protest as an election year stunt before and after adjourning congress for a nearly two-week recess. house dems say they will continue their fight when congress reconvenes. joining me, stretched and rested, i hope, are two of the

participants, new york congressman joe crowley and gregory meeks. thank you for being here. let's first of all start with that question of july 5th. we heard your colleague, the great john lewis, saying you guys will come back and resume the fight. what does that mean? >> something's changed in washington. it's no longer going to be business as usual. i think there's an energy now within the democratic caucus that i haven't seen in my 18 years there. we are focused, we look at this issue as a life and death issue and it's very clear, massacre after massacre continues to take place, we stand for a moment of silence and then sit and do absolutely nothing. what you saw was really a frustration boiling over. part about being in the minority is we don't control the agenda of the floor but to have a benghazi select hearing, to have -- select committee, to have a select committee on planned parenthood and see people slaughtered, no movement toward committee. we know benghazi was all about

politics. mccarthy made that very clear. the same thing for planned parenthood. this is about human lives and no, there's no select committee to look into gun violence. we know it's against the law for the cdc on to do a study on gun violence in america and give that information to congress. there is so much here. i think the emotion is real. we are not done. more to come. >> what's different here, too, is 90% of americans, democrats and republicans, if you go to rank and file people, 90% say they want a vote on the bills that we have been fighting for. they want to make sure we close the gun show loophole and buying guns over the internet. they want to make sure if you are on the no fly list, you can't buy a gun. i think you will see when we come back on july 5th, it will surely energize me, there were hundreds of people outside while we were inside and they stayed in the rain and i think they will be back when we come back on july 5th. >> to your point, nbc did do

this poll that talked about support for stricter gun control, strongly support, 42%, opposed somewhat, 14%, opposed strongly, 24%. the numbers are on your side. but is the refusal of your colleagues, of the speaker of the house paul ryan to bring a bill to the floor, is that about the money the nra gives? >> there's no question about it. not only the nra but the gun lobby itself, gun makers, who support the nra as well. i think what we are asking for, we weren't asking them to vote for a bill. we just wanted a bill like the senate had the opportunity to bring a bill to the floor. they have different rules. we just want the bills to be brought forward. we want the american people to understand where their legislator stands on this seminal issue and they will not allow that. that's what we are tying to change. >> then how do you isolate the nra? do democrats have to stop taking their money? >> a lot of democrats don't. i think the way you isolate them

is with the american people. that's why having the people continue to come, calling their representative, especially those republicans who, one of the things that's not talked about, this bill, there's a republican sponsor of the bill. it's a bipartisan bill. so we need those individuals, john lewis talks about dr. king when he was in jail talking about how good people who remain silent, they have to start stepping up for good things. so those silent people, democrats and republicans, now have to make sure their voices are heard if they want this to happen. >> i want to play you a sound bite of one of your colleagues from texas. his response to what you were doing on the floor. take a listen. >> -- it's time for a real debate on these issues. >> are you talking about radical

islam. radical islam killed those people. >> no fly, no guns! no fly, no guns! no fly, no guns! >> you saw congressman gohmert coming in and screaming it's radical islam. we decided to look this up. our great producers looked it up. gun deaths versus domestic terror casualties, for the years between 2005 and 2015, this is not including 9/11, 302,000 people, americans killed by domestic terrorism, 71. if you add the 9/11 victims, you are talking about 3,071 people. then let's look at guns in terms of suicides. 20,000 suicides by gun every year. 20,000 people. when you look at those numbers, and you contrast the numbers much people killed by terrorism which is awful, nobody is -- wants that to happen, the numbers are so much greater in terms of just homicide, suicide.

why don't your colleagues take an interest in that? >> i think what gohmert was doing is using a tactic. that is falling back to the radicalized islam and all these other terrorism issues as opposed to what really is at stake. it's done to dismiss what we are talking about. it's done to belittle what we are talking about. i think you are absolutely right. in the constitution, in the preamble it says we the people in order to form a more perfect union, and ensure domestic tranquility. after the comma it doesn't say except for first graders in newtown, connecticut. doesn't say except for the lgbt community. it doesn't say except for people dancing in a nightclub at 2:00 in the morning having fun. that's where i my think my colleagues misunderstand. when you deny it to the least of us, deny it to children who have -- there's no one standing up for their right, no one standing up for their right to due process. that's what they were chanting on the floor. is it really due process?

what about the people who were executed every day, what about their due process? we are sensitive to due process. we can make a bill that includes proper due process. if you are on the list, go to court, get your name off the list. it's simple. that's the american way. >> 33,000 people died of gun violence last year. 33,000. and when you look at the deaths, we had our colleague robin kelley from chicago talking about the prior week, 65 people over the weekend in chicago alone. while we were on the floor, there was another 45 people that died as a result of gun violence. if that does not say that we should focus on it, when you look as joe indicated, the millions of dollars, this was tragic, but the millions of dollars that they spent in the benghazi, to talk about the tragedy of the four americans that lost their lives, but yet we have 33,000 americans and

they don't want to put any money to making sure that we save those lives. there's just something wrong with that. >> this is from bottom up. this was john lewis and john larson and katherine clark and david sicilini. this wasn't leadership-led. this was led by the members. that's what made it so true and so honest to the american people. >> i can tell you that millions of americans applaud what you guys did and hope you guys keep it going. we will watch july 5 and see how you keep it going. great to see you guys. glad you got some rest. up next, should bernie sanders endorse hillary clinton? ? thanks for the ride around norfolk! and i just wanted to say, geico is proud to have served the military for over 75 years! roger that. captain's waiting to give you a tour of the wisconsin now. could've parked a little bit closer...

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stop taking cialis and get medical help right away. ask your doctor about cialis and a $200 savings card bernie sanders is not going away. why he's not dropping out and what he says hillary clinton has to do to win his endorsement.

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are you going to vote for

hillary clinton in november? >> yes. yeah. i think the issue right here is i'm going to do everything i can to defeat donald trump. i think trump in so many ways will be a disaster for this country if he were to be elected president. >> it wasn't an endorsement. in fact, bernie sanders kind of walked back his comment later on on cnn saying he would vote for clinton quote, in all likelihood. despite not winning the nomination, sanders has given no indication that he plans to quit the race any time soon. sanders says he will be making appearances across the country supporting down ballot candidates and wants a major role in the drafting of the party platform. representatives of the clinton and sanders campaigns began discussing that platform yesterday in st. louis. as for actually endorsing clinton, sanders told "morning joe" there are few things he wants to hear from her first. >> i would like hillary clinton to say you know what, yeah, public colleges and universities should be tuition-free. can we do other things?

yeah, we can. i would like to see hillary clinton move us closer, she's not going to adopt my view of a medicare for all single payer program, i know that, but i would like to see her go a lot further than she has in making sure that we are moving toward a day in the very near future where all of our people have health care as a right, not a privilege. >> let's bring in my super girl power panel. nina turner, bernie sanders surrogate and former ohio state senator, democratic strategist and senior fellow at the council chrystal ball. this is wonderful. this is exciting. i will turn to you on this, nina. you are looking fabulous. i love to see you. like the glasses. i have been an outlier in saying i'm not sure it is as important as the rest of the mainstream media thinks it is that bernie sanders say yes, i endorse her. do you think it's important that he do it? if so, when would be the operative time? >> i think he has to continue to

stand on this. he made certain promises on the campaign trail. he certainly has been a politician of his word. let everybody vote and i'm going to the convention. there is no secret, no surprise, news flash, he's going to the convention. it is important that he continue to fight to force the democratic party to adopt some of his platform, which, by the way, many americans do agree with. the fact that just yesterday during the platform committee debate, i applaud congressman keith ellison, he brought up the $15 an hour minimum wage. they voted it down. >> wow. >> jesus, mary and joseph. this is the democratic party. so it is important that he stay true to his word and to his vision. he's always said this is not about him. it's about us. part of that is making sure that democrats -- >> i will stop you just one second. it has been trending, the platform debate. people are talking about it. very quickly, what else has been going on in that committee? are there things that sanders has asked for that have gone through? >> i think they have some

agreement on some immigration stuff, some gun stuff. some of what i would -- >> i think death penalty. >> death penalty. but on fracing, tpp, minimum wage. >> isn't that the point? does bernie sanders need to come out of this campaign with substantive changes to the platform? >> he already has them. just think about this one issue, expanding social security. this would have been a no-go just two years ago. now you have president obama coming out after he tried to strike the grand bargain and cut social security coming out and saying yes, social security should be expanded. you have hillary clinton doing the same thing. so he has already moved the debate so much and i totally agree with you, him endorsing hillary clinton when and how he does that is so much less important than the motivation that progressives are getting from donald trump. that's what it really comes down to. at the end of the day everyone will say this man is utterly unacceptable for the presidency. >> so much to say.

one, just a clarity. $15 minimum wage was already -- is already in the platform. what was voted down was a particular amendment put by keith ellison on changing some of the language of the $15 minimum wage. that was already there. it's not like democratic parties opposed the $15 minimum wage. it's in the platform. we agree that everybody should -- >> how is it in the platform? >> i just want to clarify that. as people are talking about it, they are talking as if democrats don't believe in it or the party doesn't believe in it, which is different in terms of the how and the specifics. so i just want to clarify that. i agree that the endorsement doesn't matter. it particularly would be i think harmful for bernie sanders and his supporters in the overall movement if that happened, because he can't -- the coalition and the support that he has is for him and for particular ideals and it's not easily transferrable.

it's similar to what we talked about about barack obama's coalition. it wasn't something that he could put together -- >> here we go. >> but here's the question i have and i have had about the sanders campaign. we talked about this. when barack obama launched his campaign, when jesse jackson launched their campaigns, they were democrats, core democrats in their core, so when they ended their campaign they had an incentive to continue on as democrats and they had incentive during the campaign to register lots and lots and lots of democrats. bernie sanders doesn't have that core incentive. that's not really what it was about. he doesn't necessarily have a personal interest in continuing as a democrat. so without that, if the point of what he's done is not to bring more people into the party necessarily, and he wants to sort of hold them as this separate independent thing, why should the party then give in to him? >> i don't think that's exactly right. he ran as a democrat, he fully understands that, even though he's been getting pressure to run as a third party. even when he was in new york just a couple days ago, doing a

town hall, people were senator, please run as independent. he's really ignored that. he does want to grow the democratic base. as we see millenials are responding to him overwhelmingly. i wouldn't say his endorsement doesn't matter. i don't want people to say that it doesn't matter. but i do agree, in terms of his brand and what he stands for, it would be a slap in the face to the progressives who have stood up with him to come out and endorse him and the $15 an hour, we still have to, because they are being cute with it. i got to put that out there, too. the democrats need to get out there and absolutely con -- >> is it a question of progression from 12 to 15 which hillary clinton supports? >> i agree, as somebody who said yes, i believe people should make a living wage. what living wage is in different areas is different. >> that's a sticking point. >> that's the sticking point. and the particular amendment was sort of the next president i believe doing an executive order or something for federal minimum wage. for me personally, my personal

politics, and for a lot of democrats and a lot of other people, yes, i believe in it but how it's implemented -- >> i want to play you guys a sound bite of the proposal that i will make right here live on tv of what bernie sanders actually could do that could be helpful to the party whether or not he becomes the democrat when this is all over. this is sanders on the competition on cbs. take a listen. >> the establishment sometimes forgets that real live flesh and blood people in this country are hurting and they are hurting badly. you are the average male worker in this country, you know what, you are earning less in real dollars today than you did 40 years ago and you are worried to death about the future of your children. it's the 30 years, the middle class in this country has been shrinking and almost all new income and wealth is going to the top 1%. you know what? the american people are unhappy. >> there's been a lot of criticism of bernie sanders not talking about race and divorcing that class argument from race. does that make him a good

ambassador for the democratic party to go to appalachia, to go to the south, to go to places like kentucky and make that argument on behalf of hillary clinton? even if not for her, against trump? >> you're right that his focus is more class-based than it is race-based but i do dispute that he hasn't cared and made that a central part of his campaign as well. but i think you are absolutely right. i'm living in kentucky now and in east kentucky there are a lot of folks who have no use for hillary clinton but really like bernie sanders and the democratic party from the '90s has really relinquished working people. they were the party of nafta, the party of wall street. this is a party that gets lots and lots of corporate and wall street money so it's no wonder that people turn around and say you know what, i don't know that this party is really speaking for me. he could, could make a difference there. >> coming up in the next hour, what do pro-brexit voters and donald trump supporters have in common? plus i bring out the big board for another round of veep stakes. that's next.

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i'm shocked that we actually have voted to leave. i didn't think that was going to happen. i didn't think my vote was going to matter too much because i thought we were going to remain. the david cameron resignation blows me away. >> the world was shocked by the u.k.'s vote to leave the eu this week including apparently some of the very people who voted to leave. just after the polls closed on thursday, google trends reported a 250% spike in searches for what happens if we leave the eu? speaking of voters' remorse, donald trump wasted no time in making the brexit all about him, tweeting they took their country back just like we will take america back. no games. trump could be on to something. the feelings that fueled the brexit especially among the working class are similar to those that have carried trump to

the top of the ticket on this side of the pond. just listen to the u.k.'s justice secretary and brexit campaigner michael gove explain to a journalist why so many voters supported the leave campaign. >> i think the people in this country have had enough of experts with organizations -- >> people in this country have had enough of experts? what do you mean by that? >> saying they know what is best and getting it consistently wrong. because these people are the same ones who got consistently wrong -- >> this is proper politics. >> no, it's actually a faith -- >> this week, meanwhile, working class voters in pennsylvania shared their thoughts about donald trump. let's listen to how their thinking compares to that of pro-brexit voters. >> it's about blasted time we can have our own country back at last. >> the people that work [ inaudible ].

>> -- get what we paid for. >> somebody doesn't want muslims per se that are terrorists in the country, then i'm glad he is saying it. because i don't want them in there either. i don't want terrorists in our country. they say there's a lot of countries that don't care for him but it's not their country, it's ours. i think he wants to protect us. >> wow. joining me is nina turner and whitney dow. so your reactions to hearing those british voters saying the people who built this country, it's our country, we are taking it back. then you go to this side of the pond and essentially donald trump supporters are saying the same thing. >> it's really incredible. the three big pillars of the brexit campaign are the same three of donald trump's campaign. this sort of immigration's out of control and is responsible for all our problems, the fact that the institutions, whether political institutions, are

corrupt or incompetent and guess what, if we do this, there will be absolutely no consequences. i think that's sort of a really interesting way and it's been really sort of fascinating to watch this discussion unfold in britain and see how many parallels there are with the u.s. >> not trusting experts. >> it makes my skin crawl, actually, because it really takes us back to a time especially in our country, we want our country back. what does that mean? >> right. >> because this was native americans' land, first and foremost. just to go history on you. it really is a problem that mr. trump continues to paint certain folks in this country as the other and he's tapping into a fear factor that is real. whitney and i were talking about this. i also think the bigger concern for us as a country is that mr. trump actually won the republican nomination, that we have sisters and brothers in this country who believe all of that stuff, that we cannot divorce ourselves from. this is real. this is bigger than him. >> speaking of the republican

party, let's bring in a member of it. from cincinnati, former ohio secretary of state ken blackwell. thank you for being with us. this is about your political party embracing these ideas that we are seeing on both sides of the atlantic taking hold on the far right, anti-immigrant views, fear of the other. i want to play you a little bit more of the focus group, it was a focus group of pennsylvania voters that talked about sort of why they support donald trump and what their support for him comes from. >> he's not a politician. everybody hammers him for it because they can't believe he said that. >> i respect that he said something. >> at least he answered the question. >> he's a real person. >> politicians are shh, don't say that. >> he's unapologetic which i think is kind of nice because it's a change from these dirty politicians and he's not that. >> he just makes me feel very comfortable and safe. i like to listen to him. i think he has common sense. he speaks my language. just the way he is. he seems like a normal person to

me. >> to what do youi you attributt desire to have someone who sounds like me? is that in part an indictment of the republican party for having promised voters things they couldn't deliver? >> no, i think it's a consequence of dysfunctionality in washington, d.c. the fact of the matter is that it is a reasonable expectation that we have borders and immigration policies that we actually control to serve our interests. if you go through the inner cities of america, you see the effects of the downward pressure of unchecked immigration policy and illegal immigration on working class people of all colors. if you look at the labor participation rate that is so low, it does not affect just

whites only. it affects blacks and latinos across the board who are here legitimately and as a consequence, people actually want borders that matter, a rule of law, that serves our national interests and gives some order to economic growth and job creation. i think -- hold it. let me just say. i think it's easy to dismiss the concerns as nativism and racism. that is not the case. all you have to do is listen to longshoremen, listen to truck drivers, listen to meat packers of all colors, and they in fact tell you that this economic stagnation is something that all politicians of all parties should be concerned about. >> let me ask you, we don't have a ton of time, that's why i'm trying to get in and get another question to you. what does unlawful migration, how does that directly cause joblessness among longshoremen, in the steel industry, in the

auto industry, far from the southern border? >> well, look, if you talk about policy in terms of low income, low skills -- >> but they are mostly agricultural workers. those are agricultural workers. >> excuse me. excuse me. you asked me a question. >> right. i'm just saying, how does it affect steel workers? >> let me -- i look at this from an economic standpoint. not only have i been a u.s. ambassador to the united nations on human rights that dealt with migration policy across the globe, i have been undersecretary of hud and have been in all of our cities. so i understand the economic pressures of letting in droves of unskilled workers on wages and on, you know, economic participation or labor rate participation. look, let's stop pointing fingers and start talking about solutions. it is reasonable for people to

have control of their borders. it is reasonable to expect respect for the rule of law. >> you are talking about immigration but you haven't answered my question about how that affects the steel industry, the auto industry, the longshoremen. i have to get the rest of the panel in as well. >> i just told you. there are workers -- >> mr. blackwell, i'm sorry. there are three people on the panel. they haven't had a chance to talk on the panel. i want to bring them back in. let's look at what the data says about the voters who are supporting donald trump say themselves. the brookings survey which is a fantastic survey, public research institute, they start with this question of discrimination against white people. it shows that particularly trump supporters, it might be hard for folks on tv to see that graphic, trump supporters are the most likely to believe that discrimination against white people has become as problematic as discrimination against blacks. it's highly correlated with support for donald trump. to the next one, the question of immigrants. contact with immigrants.

if you can see that, sorry for making you skiquint, trump supporters are more likely to be bothered when they come in contact with immigrants who speak little or no english. republicans are the next highest group to be bothered by that. this question about whether or not the country needs a president who is willing to break the rules. this survey shows that trump support is highly correlated with saying we need someone to break the rules. now let's go to ohio. the new quinnipiac poll, hillary clinton, donald trump tied up in ohio, it's a must-win state for both parties. i will come to you on this, senator. is there a nexus between people's economic anxiety and developing views like this that are tied to race and ethnicity? >> absolutely. it's all really -- a lot of it is we continue to paint certain people as the other. that is bubbling over and i'm not surprised in my state because i have traveled my entire state and there is this kind of deep-seated, even when i was in the legislature, they

were trying to block immigrants in our state which made absolutely no sense because we are not a border state in any way, but it is really disingenuous to say as you were pointing out that this frustration has to do with jobs and immigrants when those jobs do not line up with what folks are concerned about. mr. trump is -- he's shaking up this fear in a way that really does a disservice to this country and again, we are a nation of immigrants. for god's sakes. >> you have done this terrific project called the whiteness project where you have actually talked to the kind of people that we are discussing. how do they explain this sort of anxiety about immigration that they mostly tie to from mexico which is immigration that is mostly feeding the agricultural industry and the loss of their own industrial jobs, because respectfully, mr. blackwell didn't explain at least to me what is the connection. >> it's really interesting. look, the demographics in the country are rapidly shifting.

they are rapidly shifting in all sort of these white countries around the world and i think people trying to grapple with it. it was really interesting to watch nigel farage who is donald trump's evil twin, if there were two evil twins, and talking about the victory for decent people, for ordinary people. it's the same language that donald trump is using but i think also, it also speaks to this idea of distrust. i think both the democrats and republicans have really failed this group of people because they are both seen as the party of big banks. one of the most striking things on watching brexit but i think it reflects america when people were cheering the fall of the pound. and that's if you are sitting, if you are someone being affected by globalization, steel workers, you don't care what the dollar's doing internationally. that's banker-speak. that's like the world of bankers. if you are paying 35% on your credit card, but when you put

your money into the bank you are getting .5% return on it, both the democratic party has failed these people and the republican party. >> i will give you the last word on this, ken blackwell. do you believe donald trump is helping to improve the debate we are having this morning about what both political parties could do to more properly serve americans who are in the working class, who really are feeling anxiety? >> i actually think that anybody who speaks to the rule of law, speaks to a nation that controls its borders, a nation that in fact has been based on the latin term e pluribus unum, from the many, one, when he speaks to those issues, making us one america that is multi-racial and ethnic, i think he is in fact speaking to the future of the country. look, i'm one who -- i'm

slow-walking my embrace of donald trump. i really want to see what he's going to do in terms of religious liberty. i really want to see if he will give in to imperial impulses or if in fact he will respect the rule of law and separation of powers, something that this president has ignored. i want to see a real alternative to business as usual and i think people across this country are in fact looking for a disruptor of the status quo. >> we will see if donald trump at some point speaks about us being out of many, one. haven't heard it yet but we will see. thank you, ken blackwell. what happens to the world economy once the dust settles on the brexit vote? ll your businesy when growth presents itself? our new cocktail bitters were doing well, but after one tradeshow, we took off. all i could think about was our deadlines racing towards us. a loan would take too long. we needed money, now. my amex card helped me buy the ingredients to fill the orders.

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across the world, people have been watching the choice that britain has made. i would reassure those markets and investors that britain's economy is fundamentally strong. >> despite prime minister cameron's urge to keep calm, the brexit has thrust the global economy into uncharted territory. yesterday, the pound fell to its lowest rate since the thatcher era. even u.s. markets took a hit. the big question, however, is what happens after the panic dies down, the reality sets in and the world comes to grips with a fractured europe? joining me are david k. johnston, author of "the making of donald trump" and from paris, daily beast foreign editor christopher dickey. christopher, the big story at least on this side of the pond is what you might call the regrets, bregrets over the brexit. i want to play a sound from one woman in particular who says she regrets her vote. >> i would go back to the polling station and vote to

stay, simply because this morning the reality is actually hitting in and the regrets are filling in of actually that we have actually left eu. >> christopher, when people listen to that it's sort of shocking. was there not sufficient information given to voters in britain about what the economic consequences of the brexit could be, or did people just not believe them? >> i think people didn't listen to them. i think what was driving the whole brexit thing was essentially fear of immigration, fear of terrorism, fear that somehow, this contagion would move from the continent of europe across the channel into britain. all of that was being driven by people like nigel farage and to some extent, by boris johnson in the conservative party, and all for their narrow political ends. nigel farage made it clear he was lying about some of the economic arguments he made about the amount of money that britain was paying into the eu, what would be done if that money were

saved. all of that now is becoming evident and people are saying what the hell did we do? a million people have now signed a petition saying let's have a new referendum. let's do this again. so there is a lot of second thinking, second thoughts about what was done. >> it's amazing. there's no do-overs in politics. people wake up to find the pound is declining and also to now find out that sales of things they really like, my goodness, my iphone will go through the floor. but the thing that i don't hear people discussing is whether or not the underlying anger and anxiety that you saw in people who voted to brexit had something to do with austerity. to david cameron's own economic programs. political elites program of austerity set the stage for the brexit, it says the poorest have borne the brunt of austerity and had little left to lose. warnings that the u.k. faced economic ruin if it voted to leave, borne out by sterling's collapse to its lowest point since 1985 today, had little

effect on communities that already feel excluded from the reported growth in other parts of the eu. is this about people who had already been knocked down by austerity just saying you know what, we have nothing left to lose, we don't care? >> oh, very much. people not understanding what the real forces were at work. so it's very easy for a demagogue like nigel farage to come along and say it's immigration and to say you know, get out of the eu and we are going to put all this additional money into the national health service even though as soon as the election results came in, he said maybe we should just get rid of the national health service. the same thing is happening in america. i spent more than 20 years trying to show these government policies that are stripping money out of the pockets of working class people, taking away their jobs, and funneling that money through all these subtle government rules up to the top. that's why so much income growth is going on at the top. people in britain have the same, who have the same experience, they are older workers particularly who voted to exit because they don't understand the real forces at work, but

somebody, nigel farage, provided them as donald trump is in america, with an explanation that makes sense to them and so they ran to it. >> exactly the point. christopher, i want to show a graph and i will explain for the viewers at home, these can be a little complicated. it shows essentially that the areas of the u.k. that are the most dependent economically on the eu, if you are above the line, you are more dependent on the european union for your basic economy, voting more commonly for the brexit. one more bit of graph is on education, on the higher educated really voting remain and the opposite happening for those who voted leave. i wonder if part of the problem is that the people who are voting remain or pushing remain are themselves the elite, so when they try to explain to the people who voted to brexit, they themselves are discounted because they are benefiting as well from these economic forces that are creating inequality.

>> well, look, everybody in this debate at the top was from the elite. there are wonderful photographs of boris johnson and david cameron when they were in the same club at oxford wearing uniforms and going out and carousing all the time. look, these guys, it's a very small group. they have rivalries among themselves and think they can exploit, literally exploit the masses to reach their own political ends. boris johnson is one incredibly talented and incredibly cynical politician. even people close to him don't think he believed what he was preaching about pulling out of the european union. he seemed very sobered up yesterday when he looked at the possibility he might actually have to deal with this. cameron said you know, boris, you are going to have to deal with it. that was the import of cameron's resignation speech. so all of these elites are playing these games just like donald trump, self-professed billionaire, is talking about crooked hillary and the elite of

the democratic party. what on earth are we looking at? we are looking at people who are less educated, who have less money, who are being exploited and manipulated by people who have a lot of money and a lot of resources, and are putting across a media image that has nothing to do with the interests of those people. >> david cay johnson, who won't have to live with the consequences of the things they're saying. >> right. cameron, in departing, did the right thing although i'm surprised he's staying until october. here's what we are likely to see now. there's going to be chaos for the moment as businesses and individuals try to figure out how to cope with this. but the scots, leadership of scottish independence will call for another vote to leave the united kingdom. we will probably see a similar effort in northern ireland to leave the united kingdom and maybe therefore we get a reuniting of ireland. but cameron and those people are not going to have to live with this. if in fact this was really a plan to get rid of the national health service in the u.k.,

that's going to turn out to be also a very big story. >> yeah. indeed. wow. we will keep following this. thank you both so much. really appreciate it. coming up, let's play veep stakes. hillary clinton style. there are two billion people who don't have access to basic banking, but that is changing. at temenos, with the microsoft cloud, we can enable a banker to travel to the most remote locations with nothing but a phone and a tablet. everywhere where there's a phone, you have a bank. now a person is able to start a business, and employ somebody for the first time. the microsoft cloud helped us to bring banking to ten million people in just two years. it's transforming our world. your hair is still thinning. you may have inactive follicles. re-activate them with women's rogaine® foam. the only once a day product, proven to regrow new hairs up to 48% thicker. revive your va va voom and save on any rogaine®. ♪

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to space planes, across the universe and beyond. and if you thought that was amazing, you just wait. ♪ are you qualified to be commander in chief? >> you know what, nobody should ever say they're ready for that responsibility, because it is so -- so huge. >> the most important job of being a vice president is to be ready to be president if god forbid something happened to the commander in chief. i know you don't want the job, but do you believe you would be capable of stepping into that job and doing that job if you were ever called to do it? >> yes, i do. >> either incredible modesty from one tim kaine or a little shade because elizabeth warren had already said yeah, i'm qualified to be commander in chief if i was so asked. well, this is of course the veep stakes that are taking place as tim kaine and elizabeth warren

are increasingly looking like maybe the finalists as hillary clinton looks for her number two. let's talk a little about what goes into this decision by a presidential candidate about who to pick as a running mate. traditionally, historically, there have been three different kinds of running mates you could pick. you could go for your regional pick, think john f. kennedy, 1960. a senator, young senator in his 40s from massachusetts. the democratic party traditionally winning across the south. who does he pick? he picks lbj, a southerner, somebody to balance the ticket and help him out in the south. the second kind of vp you could pick is a demographic play. think about barack obama running in 2008. a black guy, right, he's running and needs to be balanced out in terms of trying to convince white men, white voters, to come to his side. so he picks somebody like joe biden. joe biden can go to scranton, pennsylvania. he can argue on barack obama's behalf and validate him with white voters. let's talk about brand.

bill clinton. he's running in 1992. what is the theme of his campaign? don't stop thinking about tomorrow. change. he's running against an older incumbent president. he's running against the establishment. he wants to reestablish and re-enforce with voters that his brand is change so he picks al gore, somebody of the same brand. he's already a southerner, doesn't need a southerner or regional play, already a white guy, doesn't need a demographic play so he picks somebody who is exactly like him. doubling down on the idea of a young southern change candidate. all right. so what does that mean for hillary clinton? let's first start talking about tim kaine. tim kaine has been the subject of the most buzz if you talk in democratic circles. what kind of play is he? let's talk about regional. tim kaine from virginia. hard to imagine democrats winning without a combination of either virginia, florida, ohio. so picking somebody, running mate from one of those states, it really can't hurt. tim kaine, former governor of virginia. demographic, well, hillary clinton and her team may think they have a white male problem. so you pick a white guy.

it reinforces the idea this isn't some sort of feminist takeover. you have a white male candidate. brand, maybe not so much. those would be the two kind of plays you would be going for with tim kaine. would he help in virginia? right now, hillary clinton doing pretty well in the state of virginia without tim kaine. does she need him to push that margin up a little further? right now she's at 44-40. it doesn't seem absolutely necessary to have tim kaine but it couldn't actually hurt. let's get off of this and go over to hillary clinton's favorability among white men. this is the big if with hillary clinton. if she's picking tim kaine as a play to help out with white men, she's in real trouble. she's already at 75% unfavorable with white men. here's the catch. as we have talked about before here on "a.m. joy" democrats don't win white men. they don't win a majority of them. haven't done so since lbj. would tim kaine change that? probably not. it's just not a demographic democrats are going to win. let's talk about elizabeth warren. she's not really a regional play

by any stretch of the imagination. i'm going to pop to the next slide. here's hillary clinton in massachusetts. elizabeth warren's home state. hillary clinton is already doing monster numbers there. she doesn't really need elizabeth warren for that. what about on demographics? let's talk about that. let's go forward and take a look at what hillary clinton is doing right now among women. she's plus four with women right now without elizabeth warren on the ticket. look at donald trump, down here. negative 54 with women. typically, republicans enjoy an advantage, particularly with white women, with matter white women. does hillary clinton need elizabeth warren in order to improve this number? maybe. among younger voters and younger women she doesn't do necessarily so well. elizabeth warren could help her. this is what elizabeth warren is. she's a brand play. she allows hillary clinton to improve her brand in areas where she's weak, issues like wall street, like the economy, talking to working class voters. if she picks elizabeth warren, it ain't about region, it's not necessarily about demographics.

you would be doubling down on your brand. two women and a woman who is the bane of wall street. let's listen to the other thing warren brings to the table. the fire. take a listen. >> we can whine about donald trump, we can whimper about donald trump or we can fight back. me, i'm fighting back. i'm fighting back. you bet. and hillary clinton is fighting back. democrats are fighting back. and here's the best part. america is fighting back.

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♪ using 60,000 points from my chase ink card i bought all the framework... wire... and plants needed to give my shop... a face... no one will forget. see what the power of points can do for your business. learn more at chase.com/ink so really, i have no knowledge of that, no direct knowledge of any vetting that's occurring, whether for me or anyone else. >> i don't think so. you know? i think there would be a number of us who would be surprised if we were chosen. >> look, i know there's been a lot of speculation about this.

the truth is, i love the work i do. >> ah, the art of the non-denial denial from those in contention to be a presidential running mate. back with me, whitney, crystal and joining me, april ryan from american urban radio networks. april, coming to you first. you know i'm going to ask you, we have to get the obama of it. we know team obama has its little fingers all over the hillary clinton campaign. is there a white house preferred candidate to be the vp? >> they will never tell you there is one. not publicly. but of course. we have heard about tim kaine. tim kaine was very high up for the position of veep when the obama, the president-elect obama -- not even president-elect, when he was the presumed nominee and the nominee, when he was looking for this vp to carry the torch with him, so the interesting thing is that tim kaine is a politician. he's a former head of the dnc.

they really like him. they like a lot -- they also like julian castro, the head of hud in the obama administration. but the one who has the policy experience, the one who is a politician because hillary clinton has more of the heart about it than the politics, i think it really is tim kaine. they won't tell you publicly but i really believe it's tim kaine when it comes down to that. >> i heard a lot of this sort of tim kaine speculation which the reaction from a lot of democrats is -- what is it that makes tim kaine such an attractive candidate? >> i guess i have a different view because i'm a native virginian. i was living there when he was governor. he was a very good governor. something people don't realize about him, he was a big part of this left ward shift we have seen in virginia. now in virginia we have every state-wide office held by a democrat. obviously the president won it twice in a row. he's very effective. he's very likeable. i think he could do a really good job appealing to the sort of women in the suburbs who might be turned off by trump.

tim kaine's strategy in virginia was really to target the suburbs. he knows how to do that. he did it very well. of course, you have the added benefit of a democratic governor in the state who would appoint his replacement and terry mcauliffe. could be him. so i think tim kaine makes a lot of sense. honestly, i like a lot of these choices. i think they all have different strengths and merits to recommend them. >> let's put up the quick poll while i go to whitney for just a second. monmouth actually did a poll of registered voters to ask who they would like. bernie sanders got the biggest number, and he's not under consideration. the question on tim kaine i think is whether or not he can solve what you might sort of inartfully call hillary clinton's white male problem. she polls horribly with white male voters. is tim kaine the answer to that? >> depends on which white people -- what white voters you are talking about. i think the issue for her is that there's like this idea, there's the disaffected working class white voters that have a problem with her and then

there's also sort of like the conservative traditional republican white voters. i think there's a lot of those people that are looking for any reason to vote for her, not to vote for donald trump. the idea that trump is such a destabilizing force in the universe that what can she give them that will allow these middle of the road people to come to the table and vote for her. i think tim kaine can do it. it's also sort of the other issue she has is this idea of do i need to like go after, do i have to go after the progressive side or the conservative side. she's fighting the same battle with white people. >> that's the question of whether or not she goes after the conservative or progressive side. it's baked into a lot of these calculations that she doesn't need a play that helps her with voters of color. why do you suppose that is? >> well, i actually think she does need a play to help her with voters of color. so if i was advising i would more or less put more at the top of my strategy how do i address

the enthusiasm gap for voters of color and how do i pull them out because if we pull them out, i win. >> which of these candidates do that? >> nobody does that. nobody mentioned considers that. nobody is oh, yes, that's going to pull me out. not necessarily, i know people share this view the presence of donald trump on the other side is good enough and it's not. it's not going to be enough to pull people out to vote against donald trump than they are going to vote for hillary clinton. so less about identifying white suburban or working class male voters but more of don't take for granted the people of color and particularly black people coming out to vote for you, because we may not be there if there is no real strategy to continue to engage and also speak to -- >> i think that all of that is well said. you never want to take that group of voters for granted because while as an overall percentage they are likely to vote democratic, how many of

them turn out matters a whole lot. but i'm not sure how much the vp pick matters for any of that anyway. you need to see from the top of the ticket real commitment and real engagement which i think hillary clinton has made an effort at doing and needs to continue. >> the president's going to do it -- april? >> i want to say this. it's all about american psyche as well. you already have a first, possibly a first woman president and i don't know if necessarily the country is ready for a woman and woman or woman and minority. i'm thinking back to the years when bill clinton was running for president. he had his campaign manager who was an african-american, ron brown, the late ron brown, and you know, he was considered the first black president but he still got another southern white man. so i'm thinking about the strategy and i'm also thinking at this time, you know, how would the late ron brown and the late alma brown think about helping hillary clinton craft the next steps for this vp pick. >> at the same time, though, we live in uncharted times. this is --

>> true. >> i mean, donald trump, reality show guy, is the nominee, presumptive nominee of a major american party. you almost feel like in an asymmetrical time, you need asymmetrical strategy. is it insane to think you can put two women on a ticket, create that brand identity, get women out and maybe even close that gender gap that's in republicans' favor with white women? >> i think it's really hard. i think that elizabeth warren is a really tough pick for a lot of reasons. the thing that i haven't seen is that one of the things that we haven't seen is anybody, this is the first time there's a major candidate running that had military experience. why there isn't like the military equation. in the earlier segment i talked about, i was talking about this poll where the people's loss of faith in institutions. there's one institution that americans have faith in. congress is at 10%. the military is at 80%. there's still this idea, i just finished a project where i have been traveling around the

country with a group of 9/11 veteran film makers doing films of military civilian divide and everybody is like really interested and looks at people who have served in the military as people who -- politicians talk about serving their country. these are people who served this country. mike mullen is like this way outside potential choice. where is that in the conversation? >> interesting. >> that's what actually gives me more hope for the future in terms of who will lead the country in the future, because military is much more -- gaining much more diverse and you have more people of color sort of coming up the ranks of the chain. so what does that look like for the future, where you have people, a person of color with military experience, with leadership experience, at the top of the ticket. >> i will do a quick lightning round. who do you think will be the vp pick if you had to pick now? >> tim kaine. >> tim kaine. >> tim kaine. >> tim kaine. >> kaine-mania.

all right. thank you very much. up next, to my all-star, all woman panel declares winners of the week. ♪ booking.com offers free cancellations, so you're free to decide if the trip you're on... hahahahahaha! ...isn't really the trip you want to be on. hahahaha... hahaha... [mountain woman and key laughing together] (mamost of the show. we missed (woman) and there's no way to restart it.

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let's find out who won the week besides "am joy" whale. >> i think congressman john lewis. despite my, you know, conflicted feelings about the sit-in, i do think that he specifically continues to demonstrate that he is a leader and can lead among many things and not just in the civil rights. >> why conflicted feelings? >> i have conflicted feelings about people who are elected in power sitting in.

you know, and sort of what that represents. >> but he gets a -- >> right. that's why i say john lewis and not specifically -- >> sure. he's the reason why i have zero conflicted feelings about the sit-in because he has so much credibility. >> and i believe him. >> yeah. >> and i believe in the reasoning we have to take some action and take a stand and do something. i'm looking forward to what they're going to do next. >> yeah. >> as they come back in session. but definitely john lewis who continues to demonstrate leadership and continues to demonstrate the conscious that needs to exist in congress. >> absolutely. k.b. >> so in the week of brexit, which i actually know what that is unlike donald trump. >> girl. >> i think i have to say former london mayor boris johnson, who is likely the next prime minister. >> and who is also donald trump. >> whatever's left of that country and who is very charismatic and all that stuff and really spearheaded part of the leave campaign clearly successfully. >> but can you explain his hair? explain the hair. he's like one part chris

matthews in the face, right? but he's like eight parts donald trump, right? i mean, he looks like -- >> that hair makes sense. that looks like real weird hair. but real hair. >> it's actually growing out of his head, yeah. >> donald trump. >> it's a source of controversy. it's a source of controversy. we're going to leave it alone. >> oh, my god, lebron james and the cavs, baby. hands down. >> clear the table. done. >> 52 year drought in my city of cleveland, ohio, the biggest winners of the decade, can i say the century, baby. >> unbelievable comeback. >> the king lebron james and the cavs because it takes teamwork, but i want to thank you king james. >> my only conflicted feelings were when they handed the trophy to the team owner who treated lebron james so shabbily. >> i don't want to go there. >> we don't want to talk about him. >> we just want to talk about the fact cleveland is the city of champions and it is all due to lebron james made a promise,

promise made, promise kept. please, king james, run for office. >> absolutely. absolutely. >> outside v.p. pick? >> it's a winner. >> have you asked him. it's a wirn. we have to get back into politics for a minute, what do you think of the republican national committee taking down that incredible king james photo. >> they shouldn't have taken it down. that's an insult to greater cleveland to the state of ohio. i think it was a bad move, poor taste. and just tone deaf. just optically deaf about what it means to the city of cleveland and all that embrace. it was wrong. yeah. >> and do you guys expect if there is some sort of unrest in cleveland at the republican national convention you could see lebron james sort of come forward and have his harry moment and really be called upon to calm the city. is that something you could see happening? >> i don't see it happening only because i don't -- i mean, n ni may know more than me in terms of the wading in political

waters. >> yeah, we haven't seen that. >> but it could be. i don't necessarily think unrest in political sense are bad things. you know, i mean, certainly when there's violence and people hurting and things like that, that's different. but in terms of political unrest, we're overdue in the united states anyway. >> it could get ugly though. we're talking about the donald trump rallies now have become sort of places where violence happens. you also have just the anger in your city over things like tamir rice, over john crawford iii, the justice related to black lives matter, what should we be looking for? are we too paranoid to think it could get really ugly? >> just a little bit. even when all the things took place in cleveland, clevelanders were amazingly calm. i agree with l. joy, people need to lift their voices, similar things in nevada which there was no violence, i got to throw that out there, people booed, but there's no violence. it's my hope with all that cleveland has earned is not

tarnished by violence. protests, yes, violence, no. >> i think we've seen particularly in the young people in great britain who've had this massive horrified reaction to the brexit that really the future is in the hands of the young. and i think the robbing of the futures of young people by the brexit was dramatic. but i think you can name those young voters in great britain as winners of the week because they voted more than 70% to remain. they understood the issues. and they've spoken out and are speaking out against it. they're not taking it lying down. >> and that's a positive parallel you can draw with this country because if you look at the politics of young voters, it gives me a lot of hope for the future even when things get ugly in this campaign and when i feel like the whole world is going to hell in a hand basket, i think about what those future leaders look like and i feel incredibly encouraged. principled, principled people. >> i almost think we should give them the country now. >> we should. >> because we're not doing a great job. we got donald trump. thank you very much, nina turner

as well as to l. joy williams and crystal ball, so great to see you guys. >> thank you. >> that is our show for today. join us for more at 10:00 a.m. eastern. my colleague alex witt is next with a trump insider who is going to explain why his campaign manager was fired. more news at the top of the hour. (avo) after 50 years of designing cars for crash survival, subaru has developed our most revolutionary feature yet. a car that can see trouble and stop itself to avoid it. when the insurance institute for highway safety tested front crash prevention nobody beat subaru models with eyesight. not toyota. not ford or any other brand. subaru eyesight. an extra set of eyes, every time you drive. customer service!d. ma'am. this isn't a computer... wait. you're real? with discover card, you can talk to a real person in the u.s., like me, anytime. wow. this is a recording. really? no, i'm kidding. 100% u.s.-based customer service.

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