what a day. let's play "hardball." good evening. i'm chris matthews in washington. we are covering a big day in politics across the country. what a day it has been. president obama joined vice president joe biden and former president george w. bush at the memorial service for the five dallas police officers killed by an assassin last thursday night. i would say in all seriousness it was president obama's finest hour. let's watch a bit. >> i understand how americans are feeling. but dallas, i'm here to say we must reject such despair. i'm here to insist that we are not as divided as we seem.

>> there's so much good in what he said today. also today, senator bernie sanders endorsed hillary clinton for president, ending his long quest for the office. >> secretary clinton has won the democratic nominating process and i congratulate her for that. she will be the democratic nominee for president and i intend to do everything i can to make certain she will be the next president of the united states. >> meanwhile, expected republican presidential nominee donald trump campaigns with front-running vp candidate mike pence of indiana tonight. we are awaiting trump's remarks. governor pence will also speak. we begin with the mus that bernie sanders, who had called for a political revolution is now backing hillary clinton.

he follows others in throwing his support behind the nominee-to-be. it comes after backers of sanders and clinton put together a platform that sanders called the most progressive platform in the history of the democratic party. the two spoke about their shared commitments today. >> i have come here to make it as clear as possible as to why i am endorsing hillary clinton and why she must become our next president. >> this is one of the most important elections in our lifetimes, so i'm asking you to stand with us and then i'm asking you to keep working in the weeks, months and yes, years ahead. you will always have a seat at the table when i am in the white house. so i need your help. please join this campaign, make it your own. we accept $27 donations, too,

you know. >> wow. nina turner is the former state senator of ohio and sanders supporter, of course. ed rendell is the former governor of pennsylvania and msnbc political analyst. he's a clinton supporter. stephanie shrerock is the president of emily's list, also a clinton supporter. so it's two to one, senator. i want to give you a chance to start. are you holding out or are you joining sanders in endorsing clinton tonight? >> well, i know people want to talk a lot about endorsements but this is not just about endorsements. it's about endurance. we put it into words, now it's on paper via the democratic platform. now it's about implementation. i certainly plan to go all the way to the democratic convention and beyond to make sure that what we put in that platform is actually executed. >> when are you going to endorse? ' >> well, this is not about my endorsement. >> i'm asking you. i'm curious. when are you going to do it? >> i got you, but you know, this has to be processed.

those of us who support senator bernie sanders, this has not been necessarily an easy day for us. we were hoping that this day never happened because we wanted to see him become the democratic nominee. so again, the endurance, what it's going to take to hold the status quo accountable is what happened in that platform committee fight in orlando and beyond in making sure that if the president is secretary hillary clinton, that we uphold all those values that were written on that piece of paper. >> fair enough. that's your right to negotiate. let me ask, do you think secretary clinton won fair and square? >> well, chris, obviously she got the most votes and senator sanders was very clear about that. >> fair and square. fair and square. >> chris, she got the most votes. senator sanders was clear about that. this is really about how we take this country to the next level and to make sure we take care of the folks, the middle class folks, the working class folks in this country who deserve that type of leadership. also, we cannot forget that

senator sanders supporters, many of them who have reached out to me, many of them who have been on social media, they are hurting right now. i'm not going to ignore the pain they are feeling today. >> do you believe 78%, according to the latest polling, of sanders folks like yourself are supporting hillary clinton, 78%, about four out of five, do you believe that number? >> well, i don't know what measures they use. polls are snapshots in time. but i will tell you this. it is not just about the polls but it is how we get people out to go vote. so that is the most important thing. as democrats we will have to work very hard to do that. polling came out today that shows that the millenials, 18 to 35 year olds, still have a strong distrust of the secretary. so we have to work. >> do you? >> those votes have to be earned. >> last question. do you? do you have a distrust of her? >> well, i'm not taking away from anything that the secretary has worked so hard for. this is not about me as the individual but it really is about the movement.

i want to see this political movement continue because it is bigger than just who's in the white house. it is going to take teamwork to make the dream work. we'll have to keep pushing to make sure that that happens. >> we will keep listening to you. stay on the program. i think you will be a voice right through this process. senator sanders did not suspend his campaign today. a spokesman for his campaign told nbc he plans to go to philadelphia and have his name placed in nomination. someone will give a nominating speech for him. governor rendell, you hear a very strong voice from senator turner which obviously represents at least a portion of the sanders voters who are holding fast to the policies he ran on and hoping to get them through even if it's through hillary, they want the policies through. what do you make about almost four out of five are coming around, i think that's impressive that four out of five have come around to hillary clinton already. >> i think that's a good fast turnaround. i think senator turner hit it right on the nose. the key here is to implement the things that senator sanders and senator turner and all of their supporters worked so hard to put

forward before the american people. the message has got to be clear. the only chance to make real progress towards the implementation of those goals is with the election of hillary clinton, not donald trump. you can't vote for the green party candidate. lovely person, lovely values, but she's not going to win. you have to make sure someone wins who will implement the things that senator sanders worked so hard for. in terms of him placing his name in nomination, he has every right to do that. secretary clinton did it in 2008 at the convention in denver and then as you recall, the roll call went down to new york and when it reached new york, secretary, then senator clinton stepped up and moved to make it unanimous and none of us alphabetically behind new york could vote. we couldn't cast our votes in pennsylvania. if senator sanders does that, vermont's near the bottom and only virginia, washington and wyoming can't cast their vote at

that point. he has every right to do that and should do that. his supporters are going to like casting that vote for him. >> i understand completely. it's not completely shared by senator turner because she's holding out for positions all the way. hillary clinton has always struck me as a moderate, on foreign policy she's too hawkish for me. on some issues like trade, she's become more anti-trade than she was. maybe there's a nuanced difference but it's to the left of where she was. i think that's also clear in the platform. somebody was holding out for free trade. somebody was holding out for tpp. the anti-tpp forces did not win in the platform fight. so there is a push me, pull me thing going on in the democratic party between center, center left and left, right? we are hearing it tonight. it's not over. >> well -- >> is it over? >> i think that to this primary process has really allowed for a significant discussion about where we are as a party. i think the platform over the weekend really reflects a party that is a progressive party not

just on economic issues but on women's health issues which we don't talk about nearly enough. hillary clinton really pushed to the left on women's health care, repeating the hite amendment and expanding funding for planned parenthood. >> talking about funding for abortion rights. >> yes. >> that's new. secretary clinton made a concerted effort to reach out to sanders supporters. let's watch that. >> we need an economy that works for everyone, not just those at the top, not just the millionaires and billionaires, but everybody. both senator sanders and i believe anyone who is willing to work hard should be able to find a job that pays well enough to support a family and bernie is right, $7.25 an hour is a starvation wage. as bernie and his supporters have argued so eloquently, we won't get anywhere unless we overhaul our campaign finance system. we will do everything we can to

overturn citizens united. senator sanders and i will be working to get unaccountable money out of politics and the voices of everyday americans back in. >> earlier today, donald trump tweeted quote, bernie sanders who has lost most of his leverage has totally sold out to crooked hillary clinton. he will endorse her today. fans angry. in a statement, his senior policy adviser wrote in part the candidate who ran against special interests is endorsing the candidate who embodies special interests. bernie's endorsement becomes exhibit a in our rigged system. the democratic party is disenfranchising its voters to benefit the select and privileged few. senator turner, what do you make of that? trump's going over there trying to poke bernie voters. according to the latest poll, i did mention trump's getting about one in ten of the bernie people. >> well, certainly mr. trump is shrewd in trying to get senator sanders voters but let me be clear.

senator sanders has said from the beginning that he would do everything in his power to defeat mr. trump. so there's no secret, no news flash there. but politically it is smart for mr. trump to try to get some of senator sanders' voters. >> what do you think is the idealogical difference between secretary clinton and senator sanders? you have been through this campaign from the beginning and you have been quite serious about it. there are differences. what are the differences? >> well, senator sanders made it clear not just in his words but in his deeds that we need to get big money, millionaires and billionaires, special interests, out of campaign finance. he mirrored that. a senator from vermont actualized that through his campaign process with $27. he affirmed from the beginning that people deserve to have a living wage, $15 an hour. he didn't capitulate on that. he didn't have to be pushed that way. when you want to talk about the fight of the tpp, i was there in orlando with others and we fought very hard, senator sanders platform members fought very hard to get the democratic

party to affirm -- >> what stopped you? >> -- that tpp is wrong. it was stopped by the platform committee members who support secretary clinton and those on the dnc. so again, as you clearly saw, there is still some tension there. there's still more work to be done. i will say to the positive that we have gained lots of ground and all of the things that you heard the secretary talk about today would not have been talked about but for senator bernie sanders and his 13 million voters pushing the democratic party. >> i got a "hardball" question for you and the others. who's your favorite candidate for vp for hillary clinton? >> oh, god. i don't know. that's her choice. >> you have been thinking about it. come on. give me somebody. >> it's her choice. i wish she would have selected my senator, senator sanders, but he want even vetted. that's my choice. >> okay. governor, you have a candidate for vp? >> i would like to see tom

vilsack or duval patrick. either one would be a great president. >> wow. now, there's one that makes sense. >> of course, he's working for bain right now. >> thank you for dropping that sugar plum in his lap. stephanie, do you have a candidate? >> we are so happy to have hillary clinton on the top of the ticket for the first time in history, a woman, we will stand by this ticket no matter who she chooses. here's the thing about hillary. she will choose someone who can do the job, who she can work with. this isn't about politics for her. it is about doing the right thing for the country. >> there's no better guy than tom vilsack. no better guy. thank you, governor, for that. i think that's great. nina turner, thank you so much, senator. thank you, governor rendell and stephanie. we are just minutes away from donald trump taking the stage in indiana with governor mike pence who looks to be the front-runner to be his vice

presidential running mate. he will apparently announce this friday, we are hearing now. that's coming up tonight. pence and trump. plus an emotional day in dallas today. president obama paid tribute to five police officers gunned down last week. it's the 11th time the president had to memorialize victims of mass gun violence. this time i think he's presenting a wonderful united front alongside former president george w. bush and texas senator ted cruz was there.

we're waiting for donald trump to take the stage at a rally outside indiana indianapol he will be there with indiana governor mike pence who may end up as trump's presidential running mate. we have new key polling. according to a monmouth university poll, hillary clinton has 45%, trump 41%.

look at this in iowa. another new monmouth poll shows trump with the lead in iowa by two points with 44%, clinton 42%. we'll be right back.

those of us who love dallas and call it home have had five deaths in the family. your loss is unfair. we cannot explain it. we can stand beside you. >> i have been to too many of these things. i've seen too many families go through this. but then i am reminded of what the lord tells ezekiel. i will give you a new heart, the lord says, and put a new spirit in you. i will remove from you your heart of stone and give you a heart of flesh.

that's what we must pray for, each of us. a new heart, because with an open heart, we can learn to stand in each other's shoes. >> welcome back to "hardball." so interesting watching that group of people there. most were police officers. some with them from the beginning, some got with him later on and some didn't get with him. that was former president george bush initially and president obama speaking at the memorial service honoring the five police officers killed in dallas last week. also their families. five empty seats were reserved, there they are up front for the officers who gave their lives. whose bravery was remembered today. president obama consoled the grieving families and colleagues of the officers but also expressed a disgust attentions between law enforcement people and minority communities and addressed reasons for the growing violence and divisions. it was so honest. here he is. >> we wonder if an african-american community that feels unfairly targeted by police and police departments

that feel unfairly maligned for doing their jobs can ever understand each other's experience. as a society, we choose to underinvest in decent schools. we allow poverty to fester so that entire neighborhoods offer no prospect for gainful employment. we refuse to fund drug treatment and mental health programs. we flood communities with so many guns that it is easier fora to buy a computer or even a book. we tell the police you're the social worker, you're the parent, you're the teacher, you're the drug counselor. we tell them to keep those neighborhoods in check at all costs and do so without causing any political blowback or inconvenience.

don't make a mistake that might disturb our own peace of mind and then we feign surprise when periodically the tensions boil over. >> i watched the whole thing. cornel belcher knows the business, and perry bacon, what did you think of that speech? >> i thought it was really important. i think the president was going in the first place and the president obama being there, too, great to see them both there at the same time. i really thought he tried -- it's a hard needle to say i'm pro-police but also pro black lives matter. i understand both communities. >> did you get it? do you think he made the point? >> i do. you could tell a lot of times you saw everybody applauding in the room. it's a hard point to make. he also made a great point. he said basically we are making advances on racial issues. we are much better than 1960s. i think he's a racial optimist. >> we are better than we seem. >> better than we seem. >> that's apparently going to be the lead coming out.

>> there's not a lot of leaders we have had over the last decade that could have made that speech. he threaded the needle. it was quintessential obama. he lays out a critique of both sides. >> tell me how you heard it. >> even going back to his race speech, he lays out this is what white america sees, this is what african-americans see. he critiques both side. this is what he did with both sides, calling, those attack him for american exceptionalism but our answer is our exceptionalism. he falls back on american exceptionalism, we can solve it. >> what do you mean by in this context american exceptionalism? >> we are better than this. we are americans and solve problems. >> i guess he means the community, african-american community and police force, men and women in blue, need to, be honest with each other. here he is. >> we know those things to be true. they have been true for a long time.

we know it. police, you know it. protesters, you know it. you know how dangerous some of the communities where these police officers serve are. and you pretend as if there's no context? these things we know to be true. and if we cannot even talk about these things, if we cannot talk honestly and openly, not just in the comfort of our own circles but with those who look different than us or bring a different perspective, then we will never break this dangerous cycle. >> i thought that was something. >> it was. he really was basically saying we need to have a conversation but not with each other, but with people of different races and different feelings. i think he's been reluctant

throughout his presidency to say he's always of the view that usually policy matters and us talking is not going to solve anything but today, he really basically said we need to talk to each other more and better, particularly the rudy giulianis need to talk to derays. that may not happen. but i think it's important for him to say that. even if it's not going to happen. >> how do you get to the truth in the midst of this spectrum of what a militant guy may say, they are assassinating young black people. these cops go out for eight hour shifts to assassinate people. another group may say, the white community if there's such a thing say these guys are scared to death when they go on their beats, they are afraid to approach a car with a bad tail light because they don't know if the guy inside has a gun and bad attitude. they're scared of getting killed before they go home at night. a professional cop should be able to take some heat, take some fear and walk into it and say this is the job i accepted, right, and i'm not going to shoot first and ask questions later, i'm not going to operate, what do they call it, itchy trigger finger.

i'm not going to do that. some of the black/white cases where the cop shoots somebody, it looks like the guy's shot before thinking or when he had plenty of opportunity to protect himself and that person. >> that's why this conversation is important. that's what the president is trying to lay out. also, kudos to president bush, who was also fantastic. kudos to him. but laying out a positive perspective now what comes next. police training and let's not pretend there's not bias. we have to act upon this bias and understand this. >> how do you tell a cop who works in a high crime rate area where a lot of crime is committed by the community and he says, you get that -- bill maher says it, whatever community you police, you end up not liking. because you are constantly going up against them. what do you do about that? >> we hope that's not true. most people in every community are not committing crimes. let me be very clear about that. i think cornell's right. there are some policies, some officers support body cameras. the idea of implicit bias training, you will hear about

that coming up. i don't think that has to be necessarily controversial. i actually do think on this set of issues there's a way for the two communities, the police and african-americans to come together. i'm not sure they will be every part of the agenda but i do think there is some possibility here. in two years we could have fewer -- the goal is to have no police shooting. that will be hard. >> how do you get a cop who's had a lot of experience in the african-american communities, arrested a lot of people, has been scared a lot of times and taken steps to put him in a situation that's rough and he sees a black guy driving a car and says i got to erase that history i been through and open my mind to the idea i have no idea what this young man is like. i have no reason to believe he's scaring me, right? how do you keep that open mind in a scary job? >> that's the quintessential question for all of us americans. this country doesn't work unless we start to try to figure that out. not just for the police officers but for the school teacher, for the doctor. >> who makes a prejudicial decision. >> how do we have this conversations in a growing

diverse america about we are all one america. >> how do you keep people from making profiling decisions? >> we hope that everybody thinks of each person as an individual entity. how do we get there? i think that's training, i think that's, look, we have a society where a lot of movies are based on the idea that black equals not as good, equals criminal and so on. i think part of it is an education process. part of it is we have this african-american president who gave a very eloquent speech. i hope that moves things along. i feel like we are making progress and i think people are aware of it. there's a lot of polling data showing a lot of the videos are proving to people oh, black people are not making it up. >> think they work? >> i think they tell people it's not in our heads. it's like there is some police problem. people are getting it. >> at the same time, you could have all these shootings on video and no cops have been -- >> the laws are the problem. >> no cops have been convicted. >> what are you saying? some on video and what happens?

>> no cops have been convicted for these shootings that we have seen. but i think -- >> the videos almost always show misconduct. don't they? >> but there's not misconduct -- you shouldn't die for selling cds. >> i meant misconduct by the officers. you see a guy running across the field. he's not threatening you. he's running away. >> that's my point. there's no conviction. the bias is still there. this is part of the problem that starts to be fixed, this you had a black lives matter group, and you had white lives matter and the leaders came together and said we will work on this together. the groups came together and hugged each other. that's america at its best. >> i thought the president's speech was powerful today. >> and george bush's. >> i tuned in when the president came on. i will watch bush tonight. thank you both. we continue to await donald trump tonight to take his stage, the stage he's taking in westfield, indiana tonight alongside the guy i think will be his running mate, indiana

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welcome back to "hardball." we continue to wait for donald trump tonight and indiana governor mike pence. it's a rally outside indianapolis. earlier today, governor pence was asked why he's open to being trump's running mate. others have declined to be considered. here he is. >> there are a lot of republicans in office and former office holders who say that they just are not interested in being donald trump's running mate. why are you different? >> well, i'm very humble. my whole family is very humble and very honored to be considered for this position.

what i can tell you is that i think this is no ordinary time in the life of this nation. i'm very confident that republicans are going to come together, that we're going to have a great convention next week regardless of who donald trump picks to be his running mate. le assemble a great team around him, have a great message and his message i believe will continue to resonate with millions of americans who are frustrated with the erosion of american strength at home and abroad. >> how loud can you yell choose me? anyway, politico reports say that pence insiders in indianapolis and washington are laying out a detailed case for why pence is a no-brainer for trump. as one indiana strategist told real clear politics, quote, everyone here is operating as if this is happening but a decision could come this week because pence only has until friday to withdraw his name from the ballot for re-election as governor according to indiana state law. i'm joined by three experts who know much. susan page, the washington bureau chief for "usa today" and traveling around but you are on

everybody's doorstep at a hotel. former rnc chair michael steele and megan murphy, washington bureau chief for bloomberg news. here's what i think. i think it's pence. i think pence is almost horny for the job. it's clear that he wants it. it's clear that he thinks it's his. this is a special moment, all of a sudden. you have to step up. if i step up, i'm better than anybody else because if i step up, i'm better than all these ne'er do wells who are hiding in the bushes. i'm willing to step forward so i would be the perfect candidate for 2020. i think he's making his move for 2020. is that all true? >> that is all true but that doesn't mean that trump is going to choose him because it's all up to trump. >> he may choose somebody who wants him. groucho marx' wouldn't accept a vp. >> he's not going to coax somebody to do it. christie wants it too. >> is bridgegate over? >> for trump, yeah.

you think that's over and who would you have more fun with on a campaign trail if you're donald trump? christie or pence? pence makes more sense politically. christie would be a lot more fun in the debate. >> i think she's -- >> let's answer the fun factor. i didn't know that would come up. is christie more fun than mike pence? >> oh -- >> i think that's -- >> by far, yeah. in so many ways. i think that personality, that cult of personality that exists between the two of them is very special for them. also with newt, he has a very dee seated relationship with newt. >> the six wives club. how can you do it? >> this is how it plays out. but no, that personal piece is an important part for donald trump. >> i didn't know it would be as important as it would be for hillary clinton because hillary clinton expects to win now and is really picking probably a guy to be two doors from her for maybe eight years. a partner like joe biden is to

president obama. >> eight years is a very long time. i think she will be looking at the first four in particular. >> that's what my brother said, it's a long time. eight years is a long time. >> returning to trump and pence versus christie, i think the issue is as well when you ask is bridgegate over, not like mike pence walks into this with no baggage under his car as well. >> what's his bad baggage? >> we look at indiana, at what happened with so many corporations revolting over what was perceived as an anti-lgbt bill. >> what did the bill do? >> it would have -- it was the guise of religious freedom. >> so if a guy walks into a wedding store for candy and they ask who's getting married? >> i think that's the most interesting thing about this comparison. people talk about bridgegate. of course christie brings bag age is very known and i'm not sure people care about it. >> common sense, a point of clear sanity, trump said i'm

looking for somebody who is not an outsider troublemaker like me, basically. some words to that effect. i need somebody on the inside to give me an anchor on the inside. somebody who works with the establishment. that would be pence. is chris christie an insider? >> i think so. christie at least has some experience. he's been elected to office. >> he's running about 26%. >> he's not so popular at the moment. >> where is he on the inside where people like him? >> there's not very much a vice president does for you, right? maybe a little bit. so therefore -- >> i'm not sure that's true. lbj brought kennedy home. >> that was the last time. >> well, clinton. >> clinton and gore was really the last time. even in that instance you had two people from the same place. it was really about how the personalities sort of forced the argument. the vice presidential role doesn't really take shape until you win. then you begin to define the job in terms of the white house. i think for the rest of this

campaign, trump as well as hillary will be asking themselves can i hang with this person for the next three months. >> that's why -- >> or the next eight years. >>' does pence pull it off, does he come across as a big character with personality when he does this rally with trump? >> does he have a -- i never thought of him that way. >> this is his chance to show us we're wrong. >> the thing christie brings you is the ultimate attack dog over the next three months. >> you are a northeasterner. >> i'm from chicago. from chicago. >> this would be the most northeast ticket in the history of either party. >> if i was going up against hillary clinton and had chris christie as a possible -- this guy took marco rubio out of the race essentially. he will destroy her every single day and hit her at the points he thinks she's weakest. >> who will do that? >> christie. >> that's what the ironic moments where trump gets to stay above it all. >> exactly. makes him look more presidential. >> let christie go into the

weeds and start tearing the weeds up on hillary. that dynamic works very nicely for him. i still get back to the question that i think trump is ultimately musing on. that is who do i want in my ear. who do i respect enough to tell me how and why and when and where in this job as president, because he's coming to this completely blind with no political experience and now has control over this megagovernment. someone with that kind of understanding of capitol hill, someone with that kind of understanding of how the states work in relationship to the federal government. >> of course, that's what dick cheney did to bush. ruined him. >> well. he didn't ruin him. >> he did ruin him. thank you, susan, michael and megan. you're all staying with us as we wait for donald trump and mike pence, to see how they get along. we will have a great hour coming up tomorrow on "hardball." the one and only bill maher will

join me with just days to go before the republican convention in cleveland, he has plenty to say about this race and of course, donald trump. here he is, a bit. >> what are the odds on him right now, do you think? >> look, i want to scare people into coming out to vote. >> how many out of ten? what are the odds? two out of ten? five out of ten? >> people say this to me all the time. can he win. yes, he can win. i want people to be very scared until november 8th. don't get complacent. anything can happen in this country. people have dumb ideas about what makes a president. they say things like well, we need to run the country like a business, he's a businessman. as long as they believe that, anything is possible. again, a terrorist attack could help him and they don't like hillary either. so it's always possible. so be scared. be very scared. the zombies are in the maul. go out and vote. don't think this is in the bag. it's not two out of ten. say five out of ten. >> wow. >> i don't really believe that but i want to tell people that because i want them to be scared.

>> look for my interview with bill maher tomorrow night here on "hardball." get ready for the rio olympic games

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we continue to wait for donald trump to take the stage with the man who could be his vice presidential running mate, indiana governor mike pence. nbc's katy tur is inside the arena in westfield, indiana and joins us now. katy, you have got the greatest job in the world following trump around. here's the "hardball" question. is it pence or is it christie? or is it somebody else? >> reporter: i don't know. i can tell you that sources around donald trump say that pence is the likely pick. i have heard quote, newt is not our guy, it's going to be pence. but this is donald trump we're talking about. ultimately it's up to him. i don't think anybody knows what is in his head unless it's donald trump himself. people can make predictions, they can make advisements, they

can tell him what they think he should do but ultimately he will go with his gut. as for pence, he makes a lot of sense. but is he somebody that's going to get along with trump, are they going to click. >> is he warm enough? >> reporter: exactly. they're worried that even though pence is a good option, they likes him, the ones that favor him are worried donald trump will not necessarily click with him and he's going to want to go for somebody more like chris christie. that being said, i can't imagine donald trump will want to pick somebody who might outshine him or upstage him. someone like chris christie or newt gingrich potentially could. pure speculation on my part right now. they are still, donald trump is still at a fund-raiser in downtown indianapolis which could mean one of two things. it could mean that he's getting a lot of good advice about mike pence and is considering him more deeply or it could mean he's actually just having fun. he enjoys making us wait. one of those two things. ultimately i don't think anyone will have an idea until they know. the campaign is saying, sources

from the campaign are saying we will know by friday but newt gingrich went on tv today and said it could come out as early as tomorrow. the only thing you can predict is that it's completely unpredictable. >> back to one point, because we were laughing when we came back from break. is donald trump interested in having a buddy, someone who will make him feel warm and call him at midnight and say great job today, great job today, you really hit it out of the ballpark. does he want that kind of familiarity or can he put up with a churchy guy like pence? pence is so churchy. only thing about donald trump, he can say all he wants about religion, he ain't churchy. that's one thing he's not. >> reporter: and pence is very earnest. he's completely unlike donald trump. we spoke to him today. >> that's his face right there. >> reporter: we asked him you disagree with trump on a number of issues, can you run with him. he gave a very stock, very practiced and very controlled answer over and over and over again. he's not loose in the way that donald trump is.

but when i speak to people that are close to the candidate, they say that maybe he would want somebody like ed mcmahon to his johnny carson, somebody who will say yeah, you're doing a good job, somebody who will go to the funerals, do the ceremonial stuff he may not be interested in doing rather than somebody like chris christie or newt gingrich who he might have fun with, might have a good time talking with, but who will know how to legislate more than he does. who will know washington more than he does. who will maybe potentially outshine him when it comes to being a legislator. is donald trump going to want that? i'm not so sure. but i don't know. i'm not in his head. i can't predict this. >> you're great. thank you. by the way, if he picks pence he's getting the davinci code. this guy is serious. back at the roundtable, susan page, michael steele and bloomberg's megan kelly and susan page, who is actually the

dean of all journalism these days. okay. now, here's the question. was ruth bader ginsburg out of line, in line, out of her lane when she took those shots at trump? she's an associate justice of thsupreme court d has to rule objectively and blindly on the law. >> i think she was out of line. i think she doesn't care. i think it was inappropriate. >> you can't play ann richards. >> right. it says to me she thinks this is a really serious election and she plans to retire soon afterwards because -- >> it may be too late. if trump wins. >> well, yes, if trump wins she's in some trouble. >> bad life planning. bad retirement planning. >> you can turn over your seat to donald trump after saying that stuff. >> i don't think it's known this would be seen as inappropriate. she did it in three different interviews, with the a.p., the "new york times" and at cnn. i think she was prepared to take

the lumps she knew was going to come. >> he i think going to come. >> yeah, i thought it was out of line. we were talking before, if justice thomas had said something like that about hillary clinton, it would have been on fire. it's out of line. she doesn't care. i think she sees the exit door at this point and is moving in that direction. >> the roundtable is staying with us. it's a nice word for mortality now, the exit door. i like that. up next, these three will tell me something i don't know. be right back. >> the audacity in the end, that is god's greatest gift to us, the bedrock of this nation. >> seeing the first black president, and the reason i say that is because i think the immigrant experience combined with the african background,

combined with the incredible education, combined with his beautiful speech -- not every politician gets helped with a speech, but that speech was a piece of work.

he's set to appear with the man who might be his vp running mate. indiana governor mike pence. we continue to monitor that rally, however, and we'll bring it to you when it happens. back after this. (lock clicks) (dramatic music) (group) surprise! oh my goodness! happy birthday! oh, you. (laughing) oh!

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i'm getting kicked around, attacked on all sides. he wants somebody else to do the dirty work. that's interesting. it may mean chris christie. anyway, thanks for joining us. when we return, let me finish with what the president did and said today down in dallas. you're watching "hardball," the place for politics.

>> let me finish tonight with what the president said and did today. i believe it may be his finest hour. what he said at the memorial for the five dallas police officers was so finely balanced, such an exquisite, element station about the social and unpredictable situation of today's policemen and women. we send them into dangerous areas undercut by bad schools, poverty, and too many guns and we ask them to keep the dangers from getting nearer to us. we ask policemen to do all this, without ever sharing in the tensions these conditions breed, without ever making a mistake on their part. he did something else, the president. he talked to the critics of police, who refuse to admit the context in which jobs have to do their work and simply get home that night. survive. i've had great hopes for president obama over the years and i've been proud of many things he's done as president. as a man who is serving as our president, today was a high point, again. it may have been his finest

hour. i'm here to insist we are not as divided as we seem. i know that because i know america. that's the president and that's "hardball" for now. thanks for being with us. "all in with chris hayes" starts right now. >> tonight on "all in" -- >> these men, this department, this is the america i know. >> president obama mourns the five officers killed in dallas, as he addresses america's racial tensions head on. >> even those who dislike the phrase "black lives matter," surely we should be able to hear the pain of alton sterling's family. >> we'll discuss the president's call for unity as the man running to succeed him suggests black lives matter is inherently racist. >> when you have 11 cities absolutely ready to blow up over the last three or four days, and it could very well get worse.