respect and dignity. surely that is something we can all unite behind. we need to acknowledge the five latinos who also lost their lives in police incidents last week. their stories didn't get national media coverage, but their families and communities are mourning too. and at same time, we need to listen to the dedicated principle police officers working hard every day to rebuild trust with the communities they serve and protect. our men and women in blue put their lives on the line every day to keep us safe, and keep our democracy strong. remember what michael krol, michael smith, lorne ahren, brent thompson, and patrick

zaparippa were doing when they died. they were protecting a peaceful march. they were people cloaked in authority making sure their fellow citizens could kperds their right to protest authority. and there is nothing more vital to our democracy than that. and they gave their lives for it. david brown, the dallas police chief said that when it comes to overcoming systemic racism and so many other problems in society, we ask too much of the police and too little of everyone else. i think he's absolutely right. this is our problem, and we all need to work together to solve it. we also need to listen to the families crying out for relief from gun violence.

president obama's trip to dallas yesterday was the 11th time he has spoken to a city in mourning after a mass shooting. the wrong people keep getting their hands on guns. and not just any guns, military weapons, like the kind that the dallas killer had. which allowed him to outgun the police. and the vast of gunmans agree we have to come together around common sense steps to prevent gun violence. before looking for common ground, this is common ground and i hope that we will from washington to springfield to everywhere across america, come to agreement about that. now i understand that just saying these things together may

upset some people. i'm talking about police reform just a few days after a horrific attack on police officers. i'm talking about courageous, honorable police officers just a few days after officer-involved shootings in louisiana and minnesota. i'm bringing up guns in a country where just talking about comprehensive background checks and getting assault weapons off the streets gets you demonized. but all these things can be true at the same time. we do need criminal justice reform to save lives and make sure all americans are treated as equals in rights and dignity. we do need to support our police departments that are trying to get it right and honor the men and women who protect us every

day. we do need to do more to stop gun violence. we may disagree about how to do these things, but surely we can all agree with those basic premises and i hope and pray the past week has showed us how true they are. now these are the issues on many of our minds right now. and if we stop there, that would leave us with plenty of work to do. so i wish i could say, that was everything that we must address. but these events are taking place against a much broader backdrop revenue fear and anxiety. so i think we have to face all of it. we do need to make sure our economy works for everyone, not just those at the top. the changes that have royaled our economy over the past few

decades are not just numbers on a page that economists study. they are real forces that families are dealing with up close and personal every day. not long ago, i met with factory workers here in illinois whose jobs are being sent abroad and heard our painful the consequences have been for them and their families. i've talked to workers across our country who see good jobs lost to technologies, who keep being told to get more training, even though that often doesn't lead to a good new job on the other end. these economic disruptions have stripped too many people of their sense of security and dignity. and that can have devastating consequences. we have to ask ourselves, why are drug addiction and suicide

on the rise in parts of our country? that's not just about economics, it's about something deeper that is connecting to economics. a sense of dislocation, even a pessimism about whether america still holds anything for them or cares about them at all. that's why i've pledged that in my first 100 days as president we will make the biggest investment in new, good-paying jobs since world war ii. we need more jobs. you can support a family on, especially in places that have been left out and left behind. from coal country to indian country to inner cities, to every place tt's been hallowed out when a factory closed or a mine shut down.

because everyone in america deserves that fair chance in the race of life that president lincoln described. now i realize that our politics have contributed to the sense of division that many americans feel right now. and as someone in the middle of a hotly fought political campaign, i cannot stand here and claim that my words and actions haven't sometimes fueled the partisanship that often stands in the way of progress. so i recognize i have to do better too. i'm running for president with the belief that we need to face up to these challenges. and fix them in order to become a stronger, fairer country. and in times like these, we need

a president who can help pull us together, not split us apart. [ applause ] and that is why i believe donald trump is so dangerous. his campaign is as divisive as any we have seen in sour lifetimes. it is built on stoking mistrust and pitting american against american. it's their in everything he says and everything he promises to do

as president. it's there in how he wants to ban muslims from coming to the united states and toyed with creating a data base to track muslims in america. it's there in the way he demeans women. in his promotion of an anti-semitic image pushed by neo-nazis. and in the months that he spent trying to discredit the citizenship of our first black president. last night in an interview, he said, that he understands systemic bias against black people because, and i quote, even against me, the system is rigged, unquote. went on to say, i can relate to it very much myself. even this, the killing of people

is somehow all about him. it's there in his proposals on immigration. he says he'll round up 11 million people and kick them out. he's actually described a special deportation force that would go around america, pulling people out of their homes and workplaces, pulling children out of school. i got a letter from a mother the other day who said her adopted son asked her with a shaky voice if president trump would send him back to ethiopia. when kids are scared by political candidates and policy debates, it's a sign that something has gone badly wrong. and we see it in the violence that donald trump encouraged

toward protesters at his rallies, and the strange things he has said about the violence that will occur if we don't elect him. he says that if he doesn't win in november, we, and again i quote, won't even have a country anymore. america's not going to continue to survive. i do not know what he's talking about. [ laughter ] [ applause ] i do know we don't need that kind of fear mongering, not now, not ever. and he's gone even further than that. he has taken aim at some of our most cherished democratic values and institutions. he wants to revoke the citizenship of 4 million americans, born in this country

to immigrant parents and eliminate the bedrock principle enshrined in the 14th amendment that if you're born in america, you're a citizen of america. he said that a distinguished american born in indiana, a judge can't be trusted to do his job because his parents were mexican. he called him a mexican judge over and over again, he knew the judge had been born in indiana. but it was a cynical, calculated attempt to fan the flames of racial division and designed to undermine people's faith in our judicial system. why would someone running for president want to do that, and even that's not all, he says as

commander in chief he would order order our troops to commit war crimes. and insisted they would follow his orders, even though that goes against decades of military training and the military code. he's banished members of the press who have criticized him, is there any doubt he would do the same as president? imagine if he had not just twitter and cable news to go after his critics and opponents, but also the irs, or for that matter our entire military. given what we have seen and heard, if any of us think he'd be restrained. and he has shown contempt for and ignorance of our constitution.

last week, he met with house republicans in washington to try to get their serious concerns about him. one member asked whether he'd protect article 1, which defines a separation of powers between congress and the executive branch. here's the answer he reportedly gave, i want to protect article 1, 2, 12, well here's the thing, there is no article 12. not even close. that was a serious question from an elected representative, and he either didn't care enough to answer it seriously, or he didn't know where to begin. even the most stall work republicans were alarmed by that, and well they and we should be.

the very first thing a new president does is take an oath to protect and defend the constitution. to do that with any meaning, you've got to know what's in it. and you have to respect what's in it. [ applause ] i do wish donald trump would listen to other people once in a while. he might actually learn something. but he's made it clear, that's not his thing. as he has said, he only listens to himself. this man is the nominee of the party of lincoln. we are watching it become a

party of trump. and that's not just a huge loss for our democracy, it is a threat to it. because donald trump's campaign adds up to an ugly, dangerous message to america. a message that you should be afraid. afraid of people whose ethnicity is different or religious faith is different or who were born in a different country or hold different political beliefs. make no mistake, there are things to fear in this world. and we need to be clear-eyed about them. but we are each other's country men and women. we share this miraculous

country. this land and it's heritage is yours, mine, and everyone's willing to pledge allegiance and understand the solemn responsibilities of american citizenship. that's what indy visible means, that we're in this together, even if that's not always easy. so let's think better of each other, let's hold together in the face of our challenges. not turn on each other or tear each other down. let's put ourselves in the shoes of police officers, kissing their kids and spouses good-bye every day and heading off to a dangerous job we need them to do. let's put ourselves in the shoes of african americans and latinos and try as best as we can to

imagine what it would be like if we had to have the talk with our kids about how carefully they need to act -- [ applause ] how carefully they need to act because the slightest wrong move could get them hurt or killed. and yes, let's put ourselves in the shoes of donald trump's supporters. we may disagree on the causes and the solutions to the challenges we face, but i believe like anyone else, they're trying to figure out their place in a fast-changing america. they want to know how to make a good living and how to give

their kids better futures and opportunities. that's why we got to reclaim the promise of america for all of our people, no matter who they vote for. and let's be more than allies to each other. let's take on each other's struggles as our own. my life -- >> hi everyone, i'm kristin welk welker, you've been listening to hillary clinton talking about a house divided. clinton taking to the site of abraham lincoln's speech. did clinton strike a tone of unity at a time of historical and racial discord? chris mattheus, host of "hardball" at 7:00 p.m. week days joins us. thanks for being here. i appreciate it. i want to map out a few things that stood out to me. she used this speech to take aim at donald trump. it reminds me of other speeches billed as a major foreign policy address which was essentially a vehicle to take aim at donald trump.

she commented on the fact that last night he said he understands what it's like to be a part of a rigged system, suggesting that he understands some of the struggles of african americans, and then interestingly, she said, i cannot claim that my words and actions haven't sometimes fueled the partisanship. what were your takeaways? what did she accomplish here? >> it's interesting toe me the parallel. you're giving a cake with someone with a gun inside of it. these are strong speeches. the thing she said to her own rhetoric, what she's been saying on the campaign trail for years may be causing the anger in the country, but also to say, and people are going to jump on this. i don't want to be the first, but i'll do it. when she said that donald trump could use the military once he's commander in chief against his political critics including the media. that's powerful stuff. >> do you think it crosses a line? >> i think she's going to have to defend that comment. using the military, threatening the military in a fa shisic sense, use the military to do what to the critics, the press criti

critics, that's a strong statement. >> yeah, her goal today, and has consistently been in the past several days to draw a sharp contrast of donald trump. she's trying to paint herself as a candidate who's going to unite the country. donald trump is trying to argue, he's the law and order candidate. who is being more successful at this? >> they talk past each other, we'll see how close the polls is. whenever he goes for a two weeks without a mess up. the fact that he's in the run, despite the language he's used and the ethnic i did visiveness, he's still getting close. i think if you listen to hillary clinton, she talks about the awfulness of taking 11 million people who are here illegally, without papers, undocumented, and throw them out of the country. nobody believes trump's going to do that, but they do believe these critics and liberals and progressives that progressives and liberals aren't going to do anything about illegal immigration. it's going to continue to flow, more people coming here illeg illegally, they don't want to cost themselves any votes. i don't think she's being totally square about this or candid, but saying, you know,

just make the other guy the worst case scenario is one game. and the trade policies which her husband stood up for years. if you're living in pennsylvania or skrath ton or the stral areas that died, and people are leaving, you've got old earn person living there, an older couple living on social security and medicare. their kids have left. there's nothing coming into town in terms of jobs. diner still open, maybe. even a block buster is probably gone by now. they don't have hope about the future. i think the democrats have not served them in terms of immigration or in terms of jobs. and they also don't like these wars. that hillary clinton supported. the establishment supports. not just the neo cons, the establishment have taken us into iraq, killed 100,000 people, 4,000 americans, to what purpose? and they've got to wonder and they do wonder, are these people looking out for america. >> something she had to defend in 2008. you talk about the polls, ask you and shall receive. stand by, we're going to talk about new poll numbers.

we have breaking news, fresh msnbc wall street journal polls in key swing states. they show a tight race in iowa and ohio and a big lead for clinton in pennsylvania. let's get right to msnbc's senior political editor mark murray, the only person to help us break all of these numbers down. what are the headlines here? >> well, kristin, the headlines are that hillary clinton is ahead by three points in iowa, margin of error. 42% too. 39% for donald trump, in ohio we have a tight race, hillary clinton at 39%, donald trump at 39%, and in pennsylvania, we have hillary clinton, the nbc/wall street journal poll ahead by 9 percentage points. 45% to 36%. i think one of the big trends that's going on is that the race has narrowed, kristin. and it is worth noting the context of the polls. they were taken all after the fbi director james comey news on the e smal front. and this does show that a

tighter race from when these polls were previously in the field. but they all do also end up having hillary clinton either ahead or tied right now. and so, that is kind of the status of these contests, ohio as we know is such a pivotal battle ground state, so is iowa, pennsylvania, the state that donald trump is trying to make in roads. >> another quinnipiac poll out earlier today had similar findings that the race is very tight, also has new polling out of florida. how do you square these numbers because the quinnipiac poll shows a tighter race in some record regard. >> yeah, kristin, it's worth noting that polls, we're going to end up saying not only these polls, but hundreds if not sthous more between now and november on election day. and i would just kind of guide everyone to kind of look at the trajectory of the contest. and so what we've actually found in all the polls that have been taken after the big e-mail news from last week is that donald trump has made up some ground, but noticeably that hillary clinton, when you look at all the different kind of

battleground states where she is, that it's still a competitive contest. and in our poll, that she's up a little bit more particularly in pennsylvania. and so, again, look at the context, you know, the next two or three weeks after more events, after more speeches, after more tv ads, we might find the numbers moving a little bit in the other direction. there's one other piece of context too, kristin is this comes as hillary clinton has had the area of superiority in tv ads in the battleground states. she's been outspending donald trump by a 40-1 margin. she's been dealing with the e-mails, but at the same time, donald trump also has been dealing with a ton of tv ads that have been hitting him both from the clinton campaign aeroher super pac. >> fascinating stuff. mark murray, thanks for that, mark. >> thanks kristin. chris, back to you know, what do you make what have we just heard from mark. he makes the point that there is a trend here this this race is getting right toer. not a huge surprise given what

we heard from the fbi last week. >> i think the anger that the people feel, the outside people who don't like the democratic or republican establishment, either one. i mean, they're not going to fall for this sophisticated counterpunch like oh, we're not liberals anymore, we're progressives now. it's not illegal immigration, it's undocumented workers. they hear the sophisticated language of the establishment, these guys are playing to us, they're not solving our problems that we see as problems. they're just playing it language games on us. and you know, we don't like them. >> so let's take that a step further, obviously right now both candidates trying to determine who the running mates will be and -- >> that's a message they're sending. >> right, and they're going to pick candidates who are going to, they will argue try to close some of these deficits. let's talk about trump first. a lot of movement today. he was meeting with governor mike pence, the governor's mansion. what do you make of that? is he a safe pick? good pick for donald trump? newt gingrich obviously in the mix as well. chris christie. >> i think mike pence season his

spinach he has to eat. >> do you think he's going to eat it? >> sometimes like a death mask. he's not a popular-looking guy. he's not a popular guy, but he solves trump's problems, he's establishment, governor of big state, he's been a member of congress, respected guy. christian conservative, which trump is not. he's for a real religious guy. he i says, his christianity means more than his i'd kbrolg, his conservative philosophy, or his party. he's very clearly the real thing. i think trump needs the rock of that kind of genuineness. he doesn't need another guy who was clownish on television like chris christie or another sort of outlaw like newt gingrich. i think he needs a rock. >> we've been watching the chemistry. we had a quick glimpse of that. what do you make of it because when you see donald trump with

chris christie, get this -- >> they want to hang out together and tell jokes to each other. and the media. but, i mean, i just don't think that trump could afford to double down on trump. you can't have two trumps. you can't have bill clinton and al gore that worked. and i think by the way, i don't think this is a one many of man decision. everybody says trump is making the decisions. i think ivanka will play a big role here, and mr. kushner, you're going to hear wait a minute, you can't pick newt, the six wives club, you can't do that. you can't big christie because there's a lot of questions about bridgegate and the press will kill him on that. i think you told me that before. >> no doubt. >> it's a bigger urban issue. when you have the new york times coming down on you on bridgegate. >> it's a liability. >> it's too much for him to say. if you're donald trump you don't want anymore target zones. you have enough target material. you want a guy or woman, i mean

there's people i've been surprised he hasn't gone after, joni ernst for iowa would be great. or nikki haley. from the south carolina governor. i don't know why he didn't pick them. i'm sure there's a reason. >> getting a wrap, very quickly to hillary clinton. she's obviously going to make her pick fairly soon. >> i hope she's strong. >> considering tim kaine. >> bill zap, you see the polls in iowa. >> what a great guy he has. >> perez. >> i don't know if he's up to this level. >> who's a safe pick for hillary clinton? >> i think you have to have some elevation in terms of being elected before you become vice president. you to have statewide, u.s. congress, some kind of floor there, but i'm shurp he's a fine fellow. everybody seems to like him, but those make sense. because you've been perking up in the last minute. where'd he come from? i thought she was going to kaine. >> a lot of people did. >> i wish she'd help the kaine people clear up the gifts. there's nothing there.

that's not a story. they're intangibles, they're official gifts, some clothining buddy used some suits. who cares? she has to help him clear that up. but i think kaine would be great. bill sap is an undiscovered qualify person. and i think he'd be great. >> and they have good chemistry. chris matthews, fascinating, as always, thanks for being here. appreciate it. be sure to watch chris tonight for all of this and more on "hardball," right here at 7:00 p.m. eastern. and now the final days, perhaps hours of the trump veep stakes. fast-moving developments today. donald trump and family had one last visit with indiana governor mike pence just hours ago. nbc news reporting that each of the major candidates are getting one last such visit before the big announcement, likely comes friday. former house speaker, newt gingrich and new jersey governor chris christie rounded out the three most discussed candidates. let's get to kelly o'donnell

from cleveland. you've been reporting on this all week long. what is the very latest that you're hearing, particularly coming after that big meeting with pence? >> reporter: well kristin, sort of unexpected surprise has influenced how this day has played out. and that is sources telling us there was some kind of mechanical problem with the trump plane. and because of that, he ended up spending the night in indianapolis, of course you recall he had a big rally last night, fundraiser before that, so having to work with the circumstances at hand whatever's being done with the aircraft, they made the most of today by bringing people to indianapolis to meet the trumps, or making use of the time to spend more time with governor pence. so that's the wrinkle that made this so interesting today where we didn't expect to flow like this. what i can tell you, sources are saying that the trump oldest children and their father, the candidate, are having another round of conversations with those top tier options. we've talked about it. governor pence, newt gingrich,

chris christie, and what we also are hearing is that this is a chance for them to have some face time. so getting to know you time. that kind of thing. for governor christie it happened yesterday. we don't know the location, but for newt gingrich, he's been brought into indianapolis today to have this meeting. in some ways, it may be necessary to kind of touch all the bases again, maybe there are new questions to ask or things to talk about or maybe it's to try to even the scales a the this point to not make it look like one of these finalists is getting more time than another with about 48 hours or less still to go before the official announcement. some time on friday we expect to have the public event where trump and his choice will appear. and so, the clock is ticking, there's a lot of pressure to get this done. and why there is still some angst for lack of a better word, there are different voices in the trump circle, and somewhat outside the campaign who are really rooting for different, different candidates for trump

to choose. and that has affected the decision-making process we are told. we are told the decision has not yet been made. so maybe this is just the last round of talks. it's certainly interesting and it certainly has given us some kind of surprise and a little bit of showbiz right before the critical decisions have to be made behind the scenes. when we're able to see family members walking into the official residence of the governor. we know that newt gingrich is coming in. it's just interesting stuff that makes for political reporting and it's also raising the stakes of who have will he choose, and that seems to be adding to it as well, kristin. >> certainly fascinating optics, there's no doubt about that. nbc's kelly o'donnell covering all of the angles. really appreciate it, we'll check back in with you later. coming up, supreme smackdown, high court justice ruth bader ginsburg unleashes attacks against donald trump. trump fires back. has the 2016 race reached rock bottom? we'll discuss that after a quick break.

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donald trump is calling on supreme court justice ruth bader ginsburg to resign in a tweet. stretching back to one published last friday, justice ginsburg doesn't want to think about a president trump. then later that she quote can't imagine it. finally calling him a faker in a previously scheduled interview. editorial boards of the "new york times" and "washington post" chastised the appointee. so too have republicans, take a listen. >> i don't think it's something that a supreme court judge should do, given the fact that they're probably going to be facing some kind of decision in the future. and this clearly calls into question her bias. >> nbc news justice correspondent pete williams joins us from the washington bureau. we want to be clear, donald trump is the only one calling for justice ginsburg to resign, but there's a lot of backlash, houchl is she getting at this point? >> well, not a lot, i guess you

could say. there's a lot of comment in the legal circles about inappropriateness of a sitting judge getting involved in political campaigns and many legal scholars making the point in essence that paul ryan does, which is that by making these comments, she calls into question her impartiality, that if donald trump were elected, would she have to recuse herself from cases that would involve major administrative efforts by the trump administration, and if god forbid there's another supreme court show down over the election, would she have to take herself out of that? one legal expert even tongue and cheek says she's trying to do this now so that the court will go from eight where it is now to seven so there wouldn't be a tie, but in any event, that's what you're hearing from legal circles. lots of republican criticism from the leadership of the republican party, and some sort of lukewarm support for her among members of congress that are democrats, although there are some former clerks and some legal scholars out there who say

she's not doing anything appropriate, but as long as she's not commenting on pending cases, she can say whatever she wants. it's not usually done, but there's nothing wrong with it they say. so sort of lukewarm support for her, but some criticism from republicans and legal scholars. no apologies yet from justice ginsburg. >> pete, even the "new york times" editorial board is criticizing her, not calling for her to resign. you have said, you don't think she's going to apologize in this case, why not? >> well, i don't know. maybe she'll think twice about this, maybe she's mulling it over and seeing the response, but if you look at the sort of trajectory of all of this, she made some fairly mild comments by comparison on friday in the interview with the ap, then later in a friday interview with the "new york times" that was published sunday. she ramped it up. that's where she joked about how it reminded her of her former husband, martin ginsburg who

died in 2010 saying maybe they should move to new zealand, then when joan, the author, who's working on a book about the supreme court went up to talk to her on monday, she gave justice ginsburg a chance to walk these things back, and instead justice ginsburg turned up the rhetoric. that's where she said he was a faker and said whatever popped into his head and wondered why the press was being so kind to him about his tax returns. the posteditorial was quite kind of justice ginsburg and her legacy, but the post editorial concludes by saying it just shows that like all the rest of us, she's fallible. >> all right. indeed. nbc's pete williams, thanks so much, pete, appreciate it. >> okay. and we to want bring you into the conversation with today's microsoft pulse question, did justice ruth bader ginsburg criticism cross the line? the pulse is live. cast your vote now at pulse.msnbc.com. we're back after a quick break, stay with us. oming soon. ♪ i like the bride more than the groom.

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cameron sterling, the teenage son of a man shot and killed by white police officers in louisiana spoke to the media today. the 15-year-old touched hearts after weeping uncontrollably last week. it happened after his mother spoke to reporters about alton sterling. he was outside a baton rouge convenience store when he was fatally shot by police. today his son called for unity and calm. >> i feel that people in general, no matter what the race is, should come together as one united family. i want everyone to protest the right way. protest in peace, not guns, not drugs, not alcohol, not violence. >> the comments happened at the same time a search is under way for a possible fifty suspect in an alleged plot to kill police officers in baton rouge. nbc's charles hadlock joins me live from baton rouge. let's start first with cameron sterling. charles, so many people were

just struck by how composed he was today and by the power of his message, what was the reaction there? >> reporter: that's right, a lot of people were stunned that he told it off so calmly after what we saw last week when he broke down immediately after the news of his father dying here in the parking lot of a triple s store. today he came back to the exact same spot and pleaded with everyone to remain calm, to protest peacefully. he said there's no need for violence. at the same time, he thanked everyone for their support. the other news happening here is from the baton rouge police department. yesterday they arrested four people in connection with a burglary of a pawnshop on saturday where guns were stolen. now, there's a lot of confusing information, but basically the guns were all -- all returned, there were eight of them that were missing, six of them are back, including handguns and a bb gun that were stolen by basically teenagers in the age

range from 13 to 20 years old. they were charged with burglary and possession of firearms, stolen firearms, one of the gentleman that was arrested was charged with possession of stolen firearms. he didn't know anything about a plot to kill police officers. he says he merely handled the weapon when it was offered to him for sale. he couldn't afford it and gave it back to him. but his prints were on the gun and later arrested. police are still looking for a fifth suspect believed to be also a juvenile. >> stunning new details on that. charles hadlock, thank you. now to texas where funerals began for three of the five officers killed bay sniper last week. breath thompson, michael smith, and lorne ahrens are all being remembered. funerals for the two remaining officers will be held on friday and saturday. shootsnd burns its way into your day, i hear you. to everyone with this pain that makes ordinary tasks

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welcome back to msnbc live.

we want to show you one more time the breaking new poll numbers from nbc news. the wall street journal showing hillary clinton basically tied with donald trump in two key swing states and leading in a third. in iowa, clinton's up 42-29 points. a poll earlier this week showed donald trump ahead by 39%. in pennsylvania she's up 45% to 36%. and in ohio clinton and trump are tied 39-39%. meantime, after a week plagued by fatal shootings, hillary clinton traveled to springfield to deliver a speech outlining how the country can unite. the democratic presumptive normminee took responsibility f the part she may have played in the tensions felt in america roigt now. take a listen. >> now i realize that our politics have contributed to the sense of division. i recognize i have to do better

too. >> jonathan capehart is an opinion writer for "the washington post" and an msnbc contribute. eddie glaud is the chairman at princeton university and also the author of "democracy in black." thanks to both of you for being here for this conversation. really appreciate it. jonathan, i want to start with you and get your rereaction to hillary clinton's speech. you heard her take responsibility for the divisiveness. did she take enough responsibility and what do you think she accomplished today. >> i think this is a continuation of her when it comes to race, a continuation of what she did back in january when she spoke in harlem when she talked about race and talked about the responsibility in terms of healing the racial divide doesn't rest on the shoulders of african-americans, but white americans, all americans, quite frankly, have to bare some responsibility and in the speech today particularly

in the clip that you played, she's taking responsibility when she says her contribution to that rhetoric is the souper predator comment she made during the time of the crime bill that a lot of african-americans are upset by and pushed her to apologize for. so she is now doing what e she says white americans as a whole need to do in terms of helping to bridge the racial divide and that is take responsibility for their contributions to that divide. >> i want to switch over to you. you have a fascinating op-ed in which you essentially say you are not going to vote for hillary clinton. you say you disagree with her. . . i'll read you a little of what you say. what has hillary clinton offered the american people as an alternative? how would her position on immigration, call for common sense police iing in the face o

the murders of alton sterling in baton rouge redirect our course as a nation. tell me how you arrived at this decision and do you standby that this morning even in the wake of that endorsement by bernie sanders. >> i absolutely standby it. in some ways, i think the crisis that we confront as a nation boils down to we can no longer suffer business as usual. we have to ask ourselves the question. what is the fundamental problem? the problem is not donald trump. it's not the insecurity that many of his supporters or the racist bile that's spewed. i think it's the fact it's our way of life. the way americans live is no longer sustainable. and part of the question we have to ask is will hillary clinton fundamentally change that. let me be clear. i'm not saying i'm not going to vote. i'm going to vote. i want to make this perfectly clear. i think african-american voters in particular, all progressive voters should turn out, especially in the battleground

states in record numbers. if they choose to vote for hillary clinton, because we have to keep donald trump out of office. but in other states like red states where my mama and daddy live. if they don't support hillary clinton, that they can vote for a third party candidate. we have to do two things simultaneously. we have to keep donald trump out of office. on the other hand, we have to signal to the democratic party to all the relevant actors that business as usual is no longer tolerated. >> that may be a fair point, but i want to be clear. are you saying you're not going to vote for for a presidential candidate? you're going to sit out the presidential race? >> not at all. i live in new jersey. i think i can make a conscious decision that won't necessarily end up with trump in office.

i'm going to focus down ballot. i think part of the problem is this. i'm not a supporter of hillary clinton or a surrogate of hillary clinton. i'm a supporter of democracy. i believe that part of the tragedy of our current moment is folks want us to believe that our only choices are the choices right in front of us. i think we're in a crisis point in this country. and i say in the piece that imaginations will seal our fate. we, americans, we need to do something bold. we need to push these folk to do something bold er. >> let me let jonathan have the final word. he's speaking to a broader challenge that hillary clinton is facing. for a whole host of reasons, you have some democrats who aren't ready to get on board. for some it's about trust. is it too late to change the narrative for some of the folks saying we're going to sit this one out? >> no, i don't think it's too late for her to change the narrative.

but it's not too late to change hearts and minds in that we have three months or so of a campaign with donald trump saying and doing things that will appall folks in this country and should energize people on the progressive left and the democratic party to come out and vote. i think what you're doing is a principled thing. you're not going to vote and go down ballot. who are you going to vote down ballot for? i'm wondering how that's going to lead to the change that you're looking for. >> point taken. unfortunately shs we're out of time. what a fantastic conversation. thanks to both of you. in today's microsoft pulse question we have been asking your thoughts on the comments by justice gins burg and whether

you criticism of donald trump crosses the line. the pulse is live. continue to weigh in on the conversation. 90% so far. we'll be back after a quick break. it's time for the entrepreneur of the week. her husband suddenly passed away leaving her to manage his failing water damage business. she rebuilt the company from scratch, which is now grossing more than $2 million a year. for more watch 7:30 on sunday on msnbc. at clorox 2 we've turned removing stains into a science. now pre-treat with clorox 2! watch stains disappear right before your eyes. remove 4 times more stains than detergent alone. when you have type 2 diabetes, like me, hi, i'm dominique wilkins.

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