aleve pm for a better am. good to be with you this saturday morning. i'm frances rivera, msnbc headquarters in new york. we're about four hours away from hillary clinton introducing her running mate senator tim kaine. she'll do so at a rally in miami. in one of his tweets

about the newly formed ticket donald trump said this, bernie sanders supporters are furious with tim kaine who stands for the opposite of what they stand for. at the same time trump suggesting there could be renewed symptoms between clinton and sanders over her choice at the democratic convention, he's continuing to put a positive spin on the boos ted cruz got during the speech. it's part of an interview that will air tomorrow. >> the arena erupted in boos toward the end of his speech because he said he wasn't going to endorse. i thought that was a beautiful thing. i thought it was beautiful in a different thing. i thought it showed great unity. i think the party is unified, other than a few people. >> reaction from president obama about foreign policy message during his interview. it's part of "face the nation" tomorrow. >> if we start engaging in the

kinds of proposals we've heard from mr. trump or some of the surrogates like mr. gingrich where we start suggesting that we would apply religious tests who could come in here, screening muslim americans different than others, we are betraying that very thing that makes america exceptional. >> as clinton gets ready to deliver her speech at the party's convention, she's also attacking donald trump for the message in his. here is what she told supporters at a rally in tampa last night. >> he offered a lot of fear and anger and resentment, but no solutions about anything that he even talked about. >> let's head out to tampa. nbc's kristen welker has the latest reaction following clinton's vp pick. >> good morning. as hillary clinton and tim kaine

get set to hold their first joint appearance as a ticket, campaign officials tell me that kaine, a 58-year-old father of three is one who checks all the boxes. reaction is pouring in this morning. hillary clinton making it official. her number two is virginia senator tim kaine. clinton campaigned in tampa last night not mentioning her pick. >> are we ready to go win an election in november? >> reporter: about 7:30 soon after her event wrapped clinton called kaine who was in rhode island and offered him a job. an hour later a blast text to supporters, welcome him to our team. moments later kaine tweeted, i'm honored. >> she picked someone not who could help her best win the election but who could take over if something happened to her. >> reporter: some argue to pro trade and soft on wall street.

>> it's just a sign hillary doesn't feel like she has to do anything for the progressive wing of the party. >> reporter: republicans, is it the same kaine who took hundreds of thousands of dollars while governor of virginia. a reference to scrutiny for accepting $160,000 worth of gifts while in office, which were ultimately deemed legal. still for clinton the choice was clear. when the two campaigned together last week in virginia, campaign officials say clinton was impressed by the down to earth campaigning style. but the resume won him over, former governor with foreign policy experience who also speaks spanish, which could help rally critical latino voters. [ speaking spanish ] >> reporter: now clinton is hoping kaine speaks to all voters and helps her win the white house. as for that criticism kaine isn't progressive enough, campaign officials will spend

days showing otherwise. he's also criticized for being a little bit boring. that's something hillary clinton says she loves about him. they are hoping their event in miami has plenty of suzel as they try to court voters in this critical battleground state. >> joining me now katherine lucie for "associated press." katherine, thank you for being with me as we look at talk about tim kaine, perhaps the most low key vp choices, safe bet that she considered. could that backfire on her when it comes to that boring label she likes? could he be too boring, too low impact? >> it's a weird year when boring is the worst thing you can say about anybody. i don't think clinton was looking for the most exciting candidate. she, as we know, wanted someone with a strong resume, strong foreign policy experience. she really also wanted someone she could work with and she felt comfortable with in the white house. i think he hits all those marks.

he also, as we've heard, speaks fluent spanish. he could connect with the key party electorate. he certainly showed a lot of enthusiasm at the event they did last week together. so i think you really have to look and see how they play together today in florida. i think he's going to connect voters. >> when you see where he stands on the progressive meter, not so much. do you think him being from virginia may be more of an asset in that sense? he may help her clinch it? >> i think they -- the virginia piece of it is really key. that's an important state. it's part of his biothey are really excited about. i think in terms of progressive voters and bernie sanders supporters, a lot of those folks have been coming over to clinton. polling shows the vast majority of them are expected to vote for her and they have worked with sanders to make policy concessions, make some concessions on the party

platform, so it seems like they feel comfortable they are doing things to appeal to those voters. >> what makes this race really so fascinating in the general, both these candidates are such big personalities and yet you have how unpopular both really are and you consider that. does it really matter when it comes to vp picks if given that? >> i think that's always the thing with these selections. we spend so much time trying to figure out, so much excitement. ultimately voters vote on the candidates. they don't typically vote on the vps. maybe they give you help with some parts of the electorate, maybe their home state. at the end of the day, and in this race especially, this is going to come down to clinton and trump. >> let's talk about the republican side especially both convention, post cleveland. you've got donald trump who gave his wrap-up speech, first official nominee, this is what he chose to talk about. >> i like ted, he's fine.

again, i don't want his endorsement. if he gives it, i will not accept it, just so you understand. if he gives it, i will not accept. his father, i don't know his father, i met him once. i think he's a lovely guy. i think he's a lovely guy. all i did was point out the fact that on the cover of the "national enquirer" there's a picture of him and a picture of crazy lee harvey oswald having breakfast. >> you have trump going after ted cruz, that's so three months ago because he dropped out of the race then. what's the point attacking him? is it a lost opportunity for donald trump to leave the ted cruz thing alone and focus on hillary clinton. >> it is interesting obviously coming off the convention that this is what he chose to do yesterday. i think for trump ted cruz is his longest lasting rival. they had a very intense competition and cruz is out there with a lot of support

still. running again, trump wanted to send a message here. the question now is, yes, can he actually pivot to a general election, focus on hillary clinton. he really needs to try and appeal now to independents and voters who are undecided at this race. >> katherine lucy. be sure to join us. hillary clinton introduces her running mate. coverage on msnbc. a shooting rampage left nine dead and 16 others wounded. a gun mabz opened fire in munich shopping mall before leaving the scene. the gun was found a half mile away from where the shooting took place. officials say he took his own life. officials say this morning it appears to be a classic rampage shooting and not terrorism.

nbc's lucy kafanov is in munich this morning. lucy, what more are we learning, especially about this gunman and the investigation into him? >> reporter: good morning, frances. that investigation going on behind me, the mall closed as an active crime scene. investigators do believe this was the work of a deeply disturbed individual. no connection to isis or any terrorist groups that we can glean as of yet. no indication at this point anyone else was even involved. munich prosecutors telling us the shooter may have been getting treatment for depression. he was an 18-year-old german iranian, born and raised in munich. he wasn't known to authorities. he did not appear to have any sort of police record. but investigators say he did seem to have some sort of fascination with mass shootings. they went to his apartment, they searched through his possessions

and found various documents detailing ram pages. they even found a book about why students kill about school shootings. the timing is quite interesting because this shooting took place on the five-year anniversary of that devastating massacre in norway that saw 77 killed. authorities say the shooter reportedly hacked a facebook page in order to lure people to the shopping center. he posted something about a free giveaway to get folks to come out there. they also say the shooter had a 9 millimeter glock pistol and something like 300 rounds of ammunition. this is quite unusual for a place like germany, school shootings, mass shootings are not common. there are very strict gun control laws here so it's possible that he contained those things illegally. i have more on the victims as well. you mentioned there was nine in total, ten in total if you count the killer. we are learning eight of those

victims were under the age of 20. friday evening, the largest in bavaria would have been packed with families kicking off their holiday weekend. all those families from munich and surrounding areas. at this point does not appear any foreigners caught up in this attack. >> lucy, any indication from the investigation what may have sparked this rampage, something in advance that set the gunman off. why choose these particular locations, the mcdonald's next to the mall? >> i mean, in terms of what sparked this, that's really the million dollar question. that's going to take a lengthier investigation. they are going to have to go through the material they found in the apartment and see why he acted the way he did. no indication to authorities at least this was a disturbed individual poised to act. as for the location, this is the

largest shopping center in the area, 135 stores. h&m, all kinds of shots. if you wanted to pick a location packed, populated on friday evening this would have been one of the obvious targets. >> lucy kafanov reporting out of munich, germany. lucy, thank you. a new poll out on the battle for the white house. it may give a clue what people think of donald trump's performance at the convention. we'll bring that to you next. donald trump: i could stand in the middle of 5th avenue and shoot somebody and i wouldn't lose any voters, okay? and you can tell them to go f--- themselves! you know, you could see there was blood coming out of her eyes, blood coming out of her wherever... you gotta see this guy. ahh, i don't know what i said, ahh. "i don't remember." he's going like "i don't remember!" it'slexus performance iny to street-legal form.taking

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donald trump showered with chants of build that wall. before the convention, more republicans favor a path to

citizenship than building a wall. 62% of the republicans favor the wall along the mexican border but 76% are okay with allowing undocumented immigrants to become citizens if they meet serb requirements. republicans are about evenly split on whether to deport all immigrants living in the united states illegally. to the latest on the trump campaign, bring in jacob rascone. some tweets, what are you hearing so far? >> four tweets, one yesterday as well as a text message from the campaign. for mosh a month donald trump talked about senator elizabeth warren as a possible running mate. we know she and hillary clinton campaigned together. that and to go well. he called her pocahontas, that is senator warren. he's back out this morning with another text about that or tweet about that. here is what that o says. pock hantz sne or senator elizabeth warren -- wanted vp slot so badly but wasn't chosen

because she has done nothing in the senate. also, crooked hillary hates her, according to donald trump. he sent out a text as well to his followers. this was yesterday. he talked about tim kaine. tim kaine is hillary's vp pick. ultimate insiders, don't let obama have a third term. contribute. he's also talked about tim kaine giving him the nickname corrupt. he says crooked hillary clinton and corrupt tim kaine. this is how it's going to work for donald trump. he's not campaigning for the weekend. he doesn't come back until monday where he's campaigning in north carolina. he seems to be excited about this. he was up before 7:00 with four tweets specifically on this issue. frances. >> jacob, i was wondering how long it would take to come up with a nickname for tim kaine. doesn't take long. in true trump fashion. thank you so much, jacob rascone in philadelphia. want to bring in gabby,

political reporter for washington examiner and associate editor for the hill. thank you both for being with me, as you both were in cleveland covering republican convention. gabby, as we get started, reaction to this new poll reuters taken over the course of the convention in cleveland. it shows this hillary clinton at 41% and donald trump at 38%. do you think the convention will provide enough of a bump at least for donald trump coming out of it? >> donald trump tried his best to bring together the republican party after what was seen as a pretty raucous convention, beginning with rebel delegates trying to deny him nomination and ted cruz urging republicans to vote their conscious up and down the ballot. i think we will see a bit of a bump there but a lot of that will be thwarted by hillary clinton last night choosing her vp pick and now heading into a convention where she hopes to unify democrats and get -- earn her self a little bump coming

out this week. >> talking about unity, donald trump said ted cruz, a beautiful thing, brought about unity, was that the sense you got during the convention? >> no. in terms of the mentality of the trump campaign, they were very angry about what happened with ted cruz's speech. this was a huge event in prime time. i have not seen that kind of controversy in any convention i've covered since 2004. that really did disrupt the message donald trump wanted to portray, which was the idea of the republican party finally coming together. >> so if it was disruptive, why did he go around and call it a beautiful thing in the interview. was that the only option donald trump had? >> yeah. i think that was making the best of a bad situation. that was his tlefrt trying to put a brave face on a situation that was really very unhappy and unwelcome to the trump campaign. >> talking about that, gabby,

especially using that, thank you speech to volunteers yesterday and bringing up past feuds, how much of an appetite is there for this type of reigniting of the tensions that was, again, very, very three months ago. what does he have to gain from all that knowing he could use it to his advantage in targeting hillary clinton? >> well, you know, donald trump bringing up ted cruz during his speech yesterday, there's really nothing to gain from him doing that. we heard delegates on the convention floor thursday evening boo ted cruz when he came out encouraging them to vote their conscious. we've already seen the backlash from that. for him to get up yesterday and start talking about wild conspiracy theories about ted cruz's father, it's really a step back for donald trump. coming out of the convention, the one thing republican leaders, republican strategists hope he begins to focus on, the

one and only thing is hillary clinton and now tim kaine. it was a step back for him to start talking about ted cruz yesterday. hopefully when he hits the trail in pennsylvania monday, he will focus again on hillary clinton now that she has her running mate. as long as he begins -- as long as he continues to talk about his primary opponents, he's going to be stuck in the primary and that's not beneficial to his campaign whatsoever at this point in the election. >> he has a couple days off. let's see if that's the reassessment the campaign will make. we'll see that when he gets back on the trail. niall, talking about democrats lead story the liberal ire that clinton's running mate could face. is that something the trump team could seize on, especially when it comes to bernie sanders, especially when it comes to him not going so far to the progressives. could that be something they could build on? >> yes. it's absolutely something they are going to try and we've already seen that. we saw it in the republican convention. donald trump mentioned at least twice bernie sanders during his acceptance speech.

now that hillary clinton has chosen tim kaine, they are banging that drum once again, trying to tie tim kaine to what mr. trump is portraying as a rigged system and making a direct appeal to democrats on the progressive side to come over to them. whether they will or not is a different question, but i do think that the kaine pick is sort of representative of the hillary clinton that progressives no one particularly love, cautious centrist choice. >> all right. when it comes to this week in philadelphia, are we going to see anything near, in melania trump's words, drama and excitement, are we going to see that in philadelphia as well? >> well, i think we can expect a lot of progressives to push back on this vp pick of hillary clinton's. you're already hearing from members of the progressive change committee saying they fear donald trump will be able to outflank hillary clinton on issues of trade because of the positions that tim kaine has

taken on things like tpp and nafta. so i think there will ab lot of pushback for that certainly. >> quickly, niall. >> yes, i think there will be some degree of drama. this does not help hillary clinton in terms of winning over those bernie sanders holdouts who are still rather skeptical of their candidacy. so i don't think it will be quite the level we saw at the republican convention but not a totally unified democratic party. >> we'll see what he says especially when bernie sanders steps to the convention stage. to both of you, appreciate it. philadelphia convention spotlight up next. celebrities that will take the stage. names that might actually surprise some of you. ♪ using 60,000 points from my chase ink card i bought all the framework... wire... and plants

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chloe grace moretz who has spoken out on women's issues and been highly vocal in support of hillary clinton and also lena dunham will take the stage along with actress america ferrera to speak in support of hillary clinton. now to the weather and millions of americans bracing for temperatures in l.a. across the nation. is it a heat dome? is that what it's all about? >> that's what it's called, frances, that's where some of this hot air trapped by the atmosphere. it's actually coming back to the ground. that's what we're hearing outside of coney island. yesterday was the hottest day of the year peekiaking at 94. you mentioned this, the first time these cities have been under heat advisory in years. that's pretty year.

frances, where you're sitting in manhattan, what happens it's called urban heat island. basically that's from concrete and metal trapping that heat and making it feel hotter than it is. a deadly heat wave affecting millions of americans this morning as a dangerous cocktail of humidity and high temperatures leaves 26 states under heat advisory. >> sweating like crazy. >> in new york so much ozone pollution a heat advisory is in effect. people urged to take public transportation but the heat underground is unbearable. >> it's on fire. >> feels like i'm boiling in a pot of oil. >> reporter: in neighboring new jersey ac units are flying off the shelves. >> fans, air conditioners. >> reporter: meanwhile cooling centers are popping up all over chicago. >> got computers. >> reporter: much of the heartland caught under heat dome

where it creates a lid trapping air inside like a bubble and causing it to sink back to the ground. that's why cities are coming up with creative solutions to keep people cool like in rochester, minnesota, where you hop onto an air conditioned bus for free. >> stand in the heat too long, can you come in and don't have to pay. >> temperatures crippling this highway in texas. the american red cross said more people have died as a result of excessive heat in recent years than any other weather event. that's why authorities are remaining vigilant in california. fast moving fires have caused mandatory evacuations. temperatures across that state reaching as high as 117 degrees. >> really, really hot. >> beat the heat and cool off at the beach. >> reporter: frances, experts say you should hop in the water to stay cool, avoid caffeinated beverages and wear lightweight clothing. >> seems people are doing that. coney island bird walk for now

but i'm sure it will fill up later on. morgan in coney island, new york, thank you. like mother, like daughter, chelsea clinton will make history if her mother wins the white house. how can chelsea help to defeat donald trump? ♪ take on any road with intuitive all-wheel drive. the nissan rogue, murano and pathfinder. now get 0% apr for 72 months, plus $500 bonus cash. ♪ but i keep it growing by making every dollar count. that's why i have the spark cash card from capital one. with it, i earn unlimited 2% cash back on all of my purchasing. and that unlimited 2% cash back from spark means thousands of dollars each year going back into my business...

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welcome back. i'm frances rivera at msnbc headquarters in new york. let me get you on the latest for hillary clinton campaign. what's the reaction following hillary clinton's vp pick? interesting how dwayne plastic shopping bag had to do with the decision. >> reporter: that's right, frances. it all started over a year ago when john podesta, her campaign chairman put information on two dozen potential vp candidates into a dwayne reed pharmacy

shopping bag and took it to her house, to give you a sense of a couple of things, how long and methodical it was and how tightly it was, a job given to the aide at the very top of the campaign. at the end of the day, hillary clinton made the same choice and the chose that's been expected of her from the very beginning as much as she considered potential candidates, as much as they looked, as much as republicans unified, we may have to bring out a hail mary and go toe-to-toe on every news cycle, hillary clinton followed her footing and followed axiom, do no harm, picked somebody who checks all the boxes and believes can be a governing partner as well.

her campaigning in the wake of this talked about how she met with him twice, made sher families sat down and got to know each other a little bit. her top aide john podesta telling her at the end of the day you have to be happy when they walk in the room and want their input. clinton feels as though she has that with tim kaine, who, of course, does speak spanish. at the same time he's somebody they believe can appeal to blue-collar white men especially in states like pennsylvania and ohio. but we're here of course in miami to show off language skills that kaine has and also this is a state where if they win it becomes much, much harder to find a path to the 270 electoral votes he needs, frances. >> enough to watch out of florida especially with the official noubsment later today. thank you so much kasie hunt in miami, florida.

if hillary clinton does win presidency chelsea clinton will be first daughter once again. this time around older and wiser. what will her role in the white house look like? joining me tributing editor for the atlantic. michelle, good to have you with me. looking at the article, you just wrote the article "being chelsea clinton." based on your research, what do you think chelsea's role will be if her mother wins in november. >> look, this is kind of a touchy question. people talk to chelsea about will she move back in as first daughter, what role will she have. chelsea likes to stress she has her own life. she has her family and a job. that said she has always been possibly the best ambassador for hillary clinton in terms of humanizing, in terms of making people seem like they can relate to hillary. so you'll see a lot of that going forward on the campaign trail. once they get to the white house, chelsea has a lot of

background in health care policy but she also does a lot of work trying to do strategy trying to help her mother relate to voters. i expect that will be helpful as well. >> especially with those two babies, two kids she's had since the last time she was there. you met chelsea clinton for the first time when she was 12 years and then years later, she's 36 if my math is correct. with the perception, how has that changed and how can that be used to hillary clinton's advantage? >> it's funny. if you talk to voters on the trail, a lot of them see her as a gawky teenager and then they are so impressed when they see her on the trail. this time around she has done a lot of focusing on the fact she is a mother. her basic campaign stump speech involves talking about her kids and how important the election is because of the future and what kind of world she wants to leave her children.

the entire focus for chelsea is dealing with hillary's likability problem. people don't see hillary as relatable, sometimes they don't see her as human. chelsea is absolutely the best person to address that. >> do you think that's the biggest challenge given the history and scandals of the past? where before you talked about in your article how chelsea clinton has been off limits and maintained that sense of privacy. do you think that will change in the course of the next four months before november and personal if donald trump starts digging that up again when it comes to the scandals of her father. >> you know, she's had to answer some awkward questions on the campaign trail and she's gotten consistently better at it. she very much like her mother is not comfortable with the press. until this election she wouldn't talk to reporters, no field questions from reporters. she's still very careful and her press access is heavily controlled. she realizes she, in order to make an impact, has to get a

little bit more open in her dealings. but don't expect her to be out there just kind of going willy-nilly doing tons of interviews and fielding all kinds of questions. >> we are going to see her when she introduces her mother at the dnc before the speech. that's thursday, so a lot of eyes on her. will there be anything, comparisons faced on what we saw from ivanka trump? what can we expect to see when she hits the stage? i think it's almost unavoidable you're going to get ivanka comparisons. we're dealing with two nominees that have likability issues. ivanka's role was to try to humanize her dad, make him seem like a great guy. that's what chelsea always does with her mother. she tells stories about her childhood, hillary as a grandmother. she talks a lot about all those personal issues people want to see from hillary but hillary has never been quite comfortable sharing freely. that, too, they have been

working on. i think it's almost a deadlock that the comparisons are there. >> comparisons are there. in essence you have to consider they are self-described as friends a little more than acquaintances. it's not like they were strangers at all. what was the closest the two got and what is that relationship now? >> it's my understanding it obviously has been awkward. they do not discuss this, most sensible stay away from issues if they have a conflict. they were friends and they do have a lot of understanding what it's like to grow up in the limelight, grow up with larger than life parents, grow up very affluent, very privileged but at the same time make their own way. a lot of common bonds to share this. has been awkward. >> they can stick with the basics. they are both young kids. >> endless stuff to talk about with that. >> if they ever get a chance to

get together for that discussion. thank you so much. fascinating to hear and your read as well. michelle cotle, thank you. the direction of the republican party, that's next. if legalzoom has your back.s, over the last 10 years we've helped one million business owners get started. visit legalzoom today for the legal help you need to start and run your business. legalzoom. legal help is here. jofor their wedding one searching fbooking.com.ct place

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donald trump fundraising nearly matching hillary clinton in the month of june. new federal figures shows clinton with almost $24 million in june, trump hauled in $20 million for first official month of fundraising. joining us professor for women and politics at rutgers university. thank you for being with us, the all important female vote. hillary clinton with tim kaine. we'll see them officially together this afternoon. what is the benefit of choosing him especially when it comes to women voters. >> sure. a couple of benefits.

one thing you've seen hillary clinton has doubled down on experience. i think she's tried to paint tim kaine as candidate who is mayor, governor, senator, experience on armed forces and foreign relations, things she contrasts with donald trump and his ticket which she really painted as incompetent. she also presents somebody who is somewhat predictable, which some people have seen as a negative. gena contrast to donald trump and his unpredictability. lastly, this candidate is someone strong with political women. he's married to one. his wife is secretary of education in virginia. i think you can't discount those relational dynamics when we're seeing the first female nominee for president campaigning across the country with this person. >> when it comes to donald trump, describing another dimension we saw of him when his kids took to the stage especially ivanka trump.

we'll do that after we hear a take from her. >> my father of change labor laws that were put in place at a time when women were not a significant part of the workforce and he will focus on making quality child care affordable and accessible for all. >> it's no secret how unpopular donald trump has been especially when it comes to consistently low numbers with women. did those words in her speech help her father at all? >> reporter: i think they will if they build on them. what we've seen is a message from ivanka, more in line with hillary clinton affordable child care, equal pay for women but donald trump hasn't really talked about these issues. until he follows up on that message and presents his own vision for how he's going to promote child care affordable and make sure that women's lives as mothers and working professionals are easier, i

don't think necessarily that her message alone will work. harkens back to when candidates used only female surrogates to talk to women. he needs to talk to women. we haven't seen that. his message transitioned. it was quite a contrast with her optimistic message with policy in this area to a message quite pessimistic and all about national security. >> on the other side, chelsea clinton introducing her mother. will chelsea clinton be judged by the same standard as ivanka trump. >> she'll join presidential candidates grown children like ivanka and chelsea clinton are judged by a measure of how much they humanize or soften the candidate. so we'll see the same measure for chelsea clinton. she'll talk about her mother as

a mother. she'll a an easier time talking about her own mother and the policies she's supporting. it might be a little harder for ivanka. >> hillary clinton showing the human side, lighter side and grandmother as well. thank you for being with me out of philadelphia. >> thanks for having me. >> the eventual winner in two of the last 30 elections. why so accurate predicting presidential winners. ♪ using 60,000 points from my chase ink card i bought all the fruit... veggies... and herbs needed to create a pop-up pick-your-own juice bar in the middle of the city, so now everyone knows... we have some of the freshest juice in town. see what the power of points can do for your business.

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3w4r5. a new poll shows hillary clinton and donald trump deadlocked each with 40% of the vote. ohio has reputation as the most accurate state for predicting presidential elections, the eventual winner in 28 of the last 30 races all the way back

to 1896. i want to bring in kyle, managing editor of crystal ball university center for politics also author of the bellwether, why ohio picks the president. thanks for being with us. why is that the case? why is ohio always right picking the president? >> ohio has been a good microcosm of the united states going back to when it was founded. in fact some people refer to it as the first state, a lot of people from ohio, south, southern part of the state. so kind of from its very founding ohio reflected the culture and poll tib of the rest of the country and i think it sort of stayed that way. another major factor is that wheel we do have big cities in ohio, cleveland, columbus, cincinnati, those cities are not as big as like a chicago or new york city or detroit, so there's not really a region that dominates the state's politics.

the state is a good mix of urban, suburban and rural just like the nation is. >> there's so much of the election that the news says, all right, throw it out the window as far as breaking the mold. could this be also the case for ohio, breaking the mold in has sense and become a rare miss for that reason? >> it certainly could be. i think if donald trump has a path to victory in ohio, it's probably to do well in appalachian, ohio, sort of the eastern part of the state where he did well in the primary against john kasich. a lot of those places are particularly in the northeast typically democratic leaning but economically not doing all that well. might be open to trump's message. i think the challenge for trump is not only doing better than say mitt romney did in those parts of the state in 2012 but also maintaining romney's margins or improving on them in wealthy suburban ohio, the big suburban counties around columbus, cleveland, cincinnati. those are places that might be a

little more resistant to trump because they are wealthier and better educated. >> also impact of third party candidates when it comes to this polling we've seen new ohio polls so we put out numbers, donald trump and hillary clinton tied with poll head-to-head. then when you consider libertarian, green candidates, clinton pulls ahead by four points. why is that? how can this used to her advantage having these other two in the race. >> i was surprised by that. most polls across the country have shown when you add third party candidates in, it doesn't change the margin between colin and trump very much. that's something to watch in ohio. also generally speaking third party candidates poll better than election day. i would expect them to get about what they get nationally in

ohio. that's also been a trend, third party candidates don't really perform in ohio. >> interesting to watch that and see if hillary clinton and her vp pick with tim kaine will give her a bump in that sense as well. thank you so much, kyle, for being with me. >> thank you. >> that will do it for me on msnbc. appreciate being with you on saturday morning. i'm frances rivera. up next chris jansing live coverage from philadelphia. she'll look at the potential impact of protests come in siding with next week's democratic convention. & in a world held back by compromise, businesses need the agility to do one thing & another. only at&t has the network, people, and partners to help companies be... local & global. open & secure. because no one knows & like at&t.

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good morning, everyone. i'm chris jansing, live in philadelphia from the visitors center. so much history here. so much history will be made at the democratic convention set to kick off monday. today the big news will be made in miami where hillary clinton and her choice for vp, tim

kaine, will rally as a team for the first time. we'll get reaction to the pick. donald trump meantime wasting no time putting a label on clinton's vp choice. what is it and why? plus my conversation with ohio governor john kasich. does he envision ever endorsing donald trump. could that hurt trump in key battleground state if he doesn't. live in philadelphia two days and counting to the democratic national connection. okay. let's talk presidential politics and new ticket as we wait for hillary clinton to present tim kaine on the ticket today. moments after clinton tweeted last night, the virginia senator took to twitter in both english and spanish and then donald trump went on the attack. quote, is it the same kaine that took hundreds of thousands in gifts while governor of virginia and didn't get indicted while