thanks for watching. this sunday, the democratic na this sunday, the democratic national convention gets underway here in philadelphia after a ruckus and unpredictable republican convention that ended with the nomination of donald trump. >> i am with you. i will fight for you and i will win for you. >> this morning my sitdown with donald trump on his convention speech. >> the only negative reviews were a little dark. >> on whether he's backing off from the muslim back. >> i don't think it's a pullback.

in fact, you could say it's an expansion. >> and on hillary clinton's choice of tim kaine. >> tim kaine was a slap in the face to bernie sanders. plus, hillary clinton and tim kaine hit the road in florida. >> tim kaine is everything donald trump and mike pence are not. >> but some bernie sanders supporters are criticizing the kaine pick as a sellout to moderates. i'll talk to sanders and get his reaction to that and to the dnc wikileaks e-mail release. joining me msnbc rachel maddow, former chairman of the rnc, michael steele, nbc news chief foreign affairs correspondent andrea mitchell, and host of "hardball" and philadelphia hometown boy, chris matthews. trump, sanders and reaction to the new democratic ticket. welcome to sunday, and a special edition of "meet the press" at the democratic national convention. >> announcer: from philadelphia, this is a special edition of "meet the press" with chuck todd. good sunday morning.

we are at the wells-fargo center here in south philadelphia, home of the nba 76ers and nhl's broad street bullies, the flyers. democrats have begun to arrive with a pretty mad heat wave and beginning tomorrow, they will gather to officially nominate hillary clinton as their presidential candidate. yesterday in miami, clinton was joined by her new running mate, senator tim kaine of virginia, in an upbeat event notable by the contrast to the disorganized rollout of donald trump's running mate a week earlier, mike pence. >> hillary clinton, she doesn't insult people, she listens to them. what a novel concept, right? she doesn't trash our allies, she respects them. and she'll always have our backs, that is something i'm rock solid sure of. >> we will get to reaction to the new democratic ticket later in the show, including my interview with bernie sanders of

vermont in a moment. but first, we'll talk about sanders about the wikileak e-mails and what they may say about dnc favoritism but we begin with the man that's taken control of the republican party. it's nominee, donald trump. i traveled to trump national golf club in new jersey, sort of his weekend getaway last night, for his first face-to-face interview since becoming the nominee. trump's tax returns, proposed restrictions on muslim immigration and why he says he alone can fix the country's problems, but i began asking him how it feels to be the republican nominee for president of the united states. >> well, it really feels great and we really have a very unified party other than a very small group of people that frankly lost and we have a very unified party. you saw that the other night with the love in the room and the enthusiasm in the room. the enthusiasm. there are people that say they never seen anything like that was going on, especially thursday night. >> you bring up thursday night. i've got to ask you about your

entrance before we get serious. that monday night entrance was something else. i know you got feedback. how did you come up with that? >> i got lucky and a couple peopled a that idea and i went along with the idea and everything just worked right and it was so good that they wanted to do it on thursday night. i said never in a million years because you'll never get it that way again. >> i don't think i've seen that even on wwe. >> i know. vince is a good friend of mine and called me and said that was a very good entrance. i didn't want to do it a second time, never works out the second time. >> let's go into the speech. i want to put meat on the bones. let's talk about you've seen some of the positive reviews, some of the negative reviews. some of the negative has been it was a little dark. >> that's the only thing they said. >> what would you say? what would you say to that? >> the only negativity and i call them the haters and that's fine, but the only negative reviews were a little dark, and the following day they had another attack and then today you see what happened in

afghanistan with many, many people killed. they have no idea how many. so many killed. yesterday was munich, and, you know, i know they are saying maybe it wasn't terrorism. maybe it was just a crazy guy but in the meantime he's screaming allah akbar as he's shooting people and people say maybe it wasn't dark at all. only, the only thing that some people said, it was a little dark and tough. >> did you think it was a little dark? >> no, to me it was an optimistic speech. >> what makes it optimistic? >> because we're going to solve the problems. we're going to solve the problems. sure, i talk about the problems but we're going to solve the problems. >> one of the phrases, i alone can fix it. and some people that sounded almost too strongman-ish for them. that criticism, what do you make of it? >> part of it was i'm comparing myself to hillary and we know

hillary and we look at her record. her record has been a disaster. and i am running against hillary. not like i'm running against the rest of the world. i know people very, very capable that could do a good job but never get elected. i can give you ten names of people that would do an extraordinary job but could never get elected. they wouldn't know where to begin but for governing, they would be good. i'm running against one person. >> you said there would be consequences for any company that tried to move a factory. >> absolutely, so simple. >> you bring up carry -- >> so simple -- >> what -- >> explain -- >> i understand that. explain the consequence. >> here is the consequence. >> what would it be? >> they come in and announce they are moving to mexico and fire people in indiana and say hi, here we are, mexico, enjoy the plant and the rest of your life and hire people from mexico. they make their product and put it into the united states where we'll have a very strong border but put it into the united states and we don't charge them tax. there will be a tax to be paid. if they are going to fire their people, move their plant to mexico, build air conditioners and think they will sell them to

the united states, there will be a tax. >> what kind of tax? >> 25%, 35%, 15%. i haven't determined. it could be different for different companies. we've been working on trying to stop this government because we don't know what we're doing. not only obama. they have been trying to stop this before obama. they tried low-interest loans, zero interest loans. >> some of these things won't get through the world trade organization. >> doesn't matter. we'll renegotiate or pull out. these trade deals are a disaster, chuck. world trade organization is a disaster -- >> you know the concern on some of this is it would rattle the world economy. look what brexit did to the world economy? >> what did it do? the stock market is higher now than when it happened. i'm the only one of all these people at the higher level of the wonderful world of politics, i'm the only one that said brexit is going to happen. remember, i was asked the question. i said i think they will improve approve it. they want independence and don't

want people pouring into their country. >> you think a fractured europe is good for america? >> no, no, but we're spending a lot of money on europe. don't forget, europe got together, why primarily did they get together? to beat the united states when it comes to making money. in other words, on trade. >> economic -- >> okay. now we talk about europe like they are wonderful. i love europe. i have property in europe. i'm just saying the reason that the reason it got together was so it was like a consortium so it could compete with the united states. >> you're saying this stuff is good for america if it's not good for europe. >> look at airbus. they make more money than boeing. they got together, all of these countries got together so they could beat the united states. okay? so we're in competition. so you know, we're in competition in one way and helping them in another way. it's so messed up. >> the muslim ban. i think you pulled back but you tell me. >> we must immediately suspend immigration from any nation that has been compromised by terrorism until such time as

proven vetting mechanisms have been put in place. >> this feels like a slight rollback. >> i don't think -- >> should we interpret it as that? >> i don't think so. i actually don't think it's a pull back. in fact, you could say it's an expansion. i'm looking at terrorists. people were so upset when i used the word muslim. remember this. i'm okay with that because i'm talking territory instead of muslim. but just remember this, our constitution is great. but it doesn't necessarily give us the right to commit suicide, okay? we have a religious, everybody wants to be protected and that's great and that's a wonderful part of our constitution. i view it differently. why are we committing suicide? why are we doing that? i live with our constitution. i love our constitution. i cherish our constitution. we're making it territorial. we have nations and will come out with a number of the places and it's very complex. >> i was going to say -- >> we have problems in germany and france. >> i was going to ask that.

would this limit immigration from france? >> what we're going to have -- >> they have been compromised by terrorism. >> totally. do you know why? it's their own fault because they allowed people to come in from the territory -- >> so you would toughen up. you're basically saying hey, french want to come over here, you have to go through an extra check? >> it's their fault because they allowed people over years to come into their territory and that's why brexit happened. the uk is saying we're tired of this stuff. what's going on, we're tired of this. >> you can get to the point where you're not allowing a lot of people to come into this country. >> maybe we get to that point. look what is happening. look what took place in afghanistan where they blow up a whole shopping center. they have no idea how many people were killed. happened today. so we have to be smart and we have to be vigilant and be strong. we can't be the stupid people. >> france, germany, spain, places that have been compromised. >> here is what i want. >> all right. >> extreme vetting. tough word. extreme vetting. >> what does that look like? >> tough. we're going to have tough standards.

>> give me one. >> if a person can't prove they are from an area and if a person can't prove what they have to be able to prove, they are not coming into this country and i would stop the syrian migration and the syrian from coming into this country in two seconds. hillary clinton wants to take 550% more people coming in from that area than barack obama. i think she's crazy. i think she's crazy. we have no idea who these people are for the most part and you know -- >> you don't -- >> i seen them on different shows but more importantly, i read about it and studied it. there is no way you can vet some of these people. there is no way. law enforcement officials, i've had them in my office and talked to them. >> you realize some of these folks have nowhere to go. they are truly victims of the civil war. what do you do with them? >> we will help them and we will build safe havens in syria. >> we, the united states, are going to build these --

>> we will get gulf states to pay for it because we're going to have $21 trillion very soon. trillion. in debt. we will do safe havens and safe zones in syria and we will get nations that are so wealthy that are not doing anything, they are not doing much, they have nothing but money, and you know who i'm talking about, the gulf states and get them to pay for it. we would lead it but i don't want to pay because our country is going down the tubes. we owe too much money. >> mitch mcconnell said this about nato, about your remarks in "the new york times." he said it was a rookie mistake and once you -- let me finish the comment here. it's a rookie mistake and proves that trump needs people like us around to help steer him in the right direction on some basic things. >> he's 100% wrong. okay? he's 100% wrong if he said that. i didn't hear him say -- >> he did say that. >> fine. if he said that, he's 100% wrong and frankly, it's sad. we have nato and we have many

countries that aren't paying for what they are supposed to be paying, which is already too little, but they're not paying anyway. and we're giving them a free ride where they owe us tremendous amounts of money. and they have the money but they're not paying it. you know why? >> so is there -- estonia is paying. >> i feel differently. >> if a country hasn't done the 2% -- >> we have countries that aren't paying and this goes beyond nato because we take care of japan. we take care of germany and south korea and saudi arabia and we lose on everything. we lose on everything. if mitch mcconnell says that, he's wrong. all i'm saying is they have to pay. now, a country gets invaded. they haven't paid. everyone said oh, but we have a treaty. they have a treaty, too. they are supposed to be paying. we have countries within nato taking advantage of us. with me, i believe they are going to pay and when they pay, i'm a big believer in nato.

if they don't pay -- chuck, this isn't 40 years ago. this isn't 50 years ago. it's not 30 years ago. we're a different country today. we're much weaker. our military is depleted. we owe tremendous amounts of money. we have to be reimbursed. we can no longer be the stupid country. when we come back, what donald trump says about david duke, bernie sanders and whether he really plans to spend millions for the sole purpose of defeating ted cruz and john kasich. and later, i talk to bernie sanders about trump, and about his reaction to tim kaine becoming hillary clinton's running mate. we're in philadelphia, site of the democratic national convention. stay with us. ratic national convention. stay with us.

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you live life your way. we can help you retire your way, too. financial guidance while you're mastering life. from chase. so you can. such a beautiful city here. welcome back. more of my interview with donald trump in new jersey and since we had a limited amount of time, i ended up speeding things up by asking trump for some quick reaction to simply some prominent names in the news. i'm going to literally throw out a name and you'll know the question i'm asking. bernie sanders. >> great respect for what he's done. he is being taken advantage of and, frankly, the system was rigged.

and i'm the first one to say it. was rigged against him. >> you took after him. you took after him for supporting hillary clinton. >> i'm not a fan of bernie sanders but i am a fan of one thing he talks about, trade. he's the only one on that side that understands trade. he can't do anything about it because that's not his thing. but he has been gamed. he has been -- it's a rigged system against him, and what happened with the choice of tim kaine was a slap in the face to bernie sanders and everybody. i was shocked. i love it from my standpoint. >> why do you love the kaine pick? >> first of all, he took over $160,000 of gifts, and they said, well, they weren't really gifts. they were suits and trips and lots of different things. over 160 -- legal. >> legal in the state of virginia? >> bob mcdonald, meantime had, to go to the united states supreme court to get out of -- >> they proved quid pro quo in that one. >> excuse me, bob mcdonnell took

a fraction of what kaine took and i think to me it's a big problem. now how do you take all these gifts? hundreds of thousands of dollars. the other thing about him, he's bought and owned by the banks. and the third thing, he's in favor of tpp and every other trade deal he has ever looked at. and that means he wants people not to work. now, he is going to change his tune, and i understand he's now going to say i'm against tpp. hillary clinton was totally in favor of tpp, which is a job killer, right? so is he. when she watched me on your show and other shows, all of a sudden she changed because she knows she can't win that in a debate. >> all right. ted cruz amended, are you really going to fund a super pack to help defeat hillary in 2018. >> not the number one thing on my mind. what's on my mind is beating hillary clinton. what's on my mind is winning for the republican party. with that being said, yeah, i'll probably do a super pac, you know, when they run against kasich. >> okay.

>> for $10 to $20 million, against ted cruz. >> all right. >> and maybe one other person that i'm thinking about. >> who is that one other person? >> he's actually such a small person i hate to give him the publicity. yes, i will probably do that at the appropriate time but i'm not going to do that until -- >> give me the small person here. >> don't worry about it. we'll give it to you another time. >> let me ask you about this one. david duke announced his senate candidacy, claiming your agenda for his own, essentially saying glad that you spoke out. >> are you ready before you ask the question? >> newt gingrich said every republican should repudiate what this guy says. >> i did and i do. >> would you support a democrat over david duke, whoever necessary to defeat him? >> depending who the democrat would be but the answer is yes. as quick as you can say it -- i wanted to answer you before you said it. >> totally -- >> because last time with thoer person in your position, i did it very quickly and they said he didn't do it fast enough. rebuked.

is that okay? >> done. >> okay. >> tax returns, a lot of conspiracy theories are being out there about why you -- what's in your tax return? >> are you ready? >> you would get rid of all these conspiracy theories tomorrow, probably make people look stupid. >> let me give you a little lesson. first of all, you don't learn very much from a tax return. i put into the federal elections group 100 and some odd pages of my financials. it showed, as you know, that i'm much wealthier than anybody even understood. tremendous cash, tremendous assets, all that stuff. that's it. i'm going through a routine audit. just a routine audit. i've had it for 13 years, 14 years. every year they audit me. routine. i would never give my tax returns until the audit is finished but remember this, mitt romney four years ago was under tremendous pressure to give his tax return and held it and held it and held it and fought it and he didn't do too well, okay? he didn't do anything wrong on his taxes.

when he gave his tax returns, people forget, not now, he gave them in september before the election. >> so you might release them at some point? >> wait a minute. wait a minute. when he did and his tax returns are a tiny peanut they went through his tax returns, there was nothing wrong and made him look bad. in fact, i think he lost his election because of that. >> because of tax returns? >> i'll tell you why. he did nothing wrong. mitt romney did nothing wrong but they would take -- his weren't too big. have you seen mine in the picture? they're this high. >> i've seen that picture. >> they took his tax return, nothing wrong, just standard and made him look bad. very unfair. with all said, i would love to give them but i'm under audit. when the audit is finished, i will give them. >> roger ailes? >> he's been a friend of mine for a long time and i can tell you some of the women that are complaining, i know how much he's helped them and even recently. and when they write books that are fairly recently released, and they say wonderful things about him and now all of a sudden they're saying these horrible things about him, it's

very sad because he's a very good person. i've always found him to be a very, very good person. and by the way, a very, very talented person. look what he's done. i feel very badly. a lot of people i think will run my campaign. my campaign is doing pretty well. >> mr. trump, until we meet again. >> thank you very much. >> thank you for your time. appreciate it. up next, the man who had hoped to be the candidate being nominated by democrats here in philadelphia this week. senator bernie sanders of vermont. what does he think of the leaked dnc e-mails? we'll get his first comments since it happened. we'll be right back in just a moment. e-mails? we'll get his comments since it happened. we'll be right back in just a >> announcer: brought to you by -- by charles schp?p?h

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tremendous shots there of a beautiful city. welcome back. not the kind of thing you want happening days before your convention. this weekend wikileaks released nearly 20,000 e-mails sent and received by members of the

democratic national committee, some of which seem to confirm what a lot of people had suspected, the dnc was playing favorites with hillary clinton over sanders. they either stole the e-mails or got them from a source. remember the dnc was hack aid few months ago. among the e-mails was one from the chief financial officer brad marshall looking ahead to contests in early may. not mentioning sanders specifically by name, the e-mail appeared to question sanders' faith. he wrote this, quote, does he believe in a god? i think i read he is an atheist. that this could make several points difference with my peeps. my southern baptist peeps would draw a big difference between a jew and an atheist. senator sanders joins me now. senator sanders, welcome back to "meet the press." i should note you talked about your belief in god last fall in an interview i think with your hometown paper there. i want to get that out of the

way. let me start with this question, questioning your faith. brad marshall apologized on facebook. has anyone apologized to you personally? and what is your response to this entire discussion? >> well, no, nobody has apologized to me and, as you've just mentioned, this really does not come as a shock to me or my supporters. there is no question but the dnc was on secretary clinton's side from day one. we all know that. and i think, as i said a long time ago, the time is now for debbie wasserman-schultz to step aside. not only for these issues. we need a democratic party that's open and will bring young people and working people into it, that is going to stand up and take on the big money interest and work for working families. i don't think debbie has been that type of leader. i would hope and i said this many months ago that she would step aside and we would have new leader ship. >> do you think it needs to happen now today before the start of the convention? would that help calm your supporters down?

>> i think what is already happening is it's clear she's not going to be speaking to the convention. that is the right thing. right now, what we have got to focus on is democrats is the feeding perhaps the worst republican candidate that i have seen in my lifetime, donald trump would be a disaster for this country. he must be defeated. we got to elect secretary clinton on every single issue fighting for the middle class on health care, on climate change is a far, far superior candidate to trump. that's where i think the focus has got to be. >> do you believe that the dnc's favoritism cost you this race? >> there are a lot of reasons why one loses. we started off 50 points behind secretary clinton. we had the opposition virtually the entire democratic leadership in every state in this country

and by the way in terms of media, we did not get the kind of media attention that somebody like a donald trump got because media is not necessarily interested in the issues facing the middle class, more interested in attacks in personality. there are a lot of reasons. i'll tell you this, chuck, from the bottom of my heart. i'm extremely proud of the campaign we ran and the issues we raised, the fact we got 15 million to vote. people who know the economy is rigged in favor of big money, people who know that our middle class continues to decline. and we have to go outside of establishment politics and economics. people who know that we need to reform a broken criminal justice system and we need comprehensive immigration reform. the people, what we did in our campaign is bring people together to say you know what, this country, our government belongs to all of us and not just a few. so i'm very proud of the campaign we ran and the supporters that came on board. >> so just to sum up here, these leaks, these e-mails, it hasn't given you any pause about your support for hillary clinton? >> no, no, no.

we're going to do everything we can to protect working families in this country. again, chuck, i know media is not necessarily focused on these things but what the campaign is about is not hillary clinton, not donald trump. it's the people of this country. people who are working longer hours for lower wages. people who do not have health care or are under insured. hillary clinton and i worked together on a higher education proposal, which will guarantee free tuition at public colleges and universities for every family in this country making $125,000 a year or less. we're going to fight for family and medical leave. those are the issues that the american people want to hear discussed. and i'm going to go around the country, discussing them, and making sure that hillary clinton is elected president. you know, the green party presumptive nominee jill stein put out a release about the e-mails and said democratic party elites have been caught red handed sabotaging a

grassroots campaign that tried to bring independents and nonvoters into their party. instead they have shown exactly why america needs a new major party, a truly democratic party for the people. are you going to urge your supporters not to support jill stein and try to thwart her efforts? >> let me say this, as the longest serving independent in the history of the united states congress, as somebody who came into office by defeating a democratic mayor in burlington, vermont, i know something about third party politics and i respect jill. but right now, the focus to my mind is to make sure that donald trump does not become president of the united states. i think by temperament, he is unqualified to be president. his views, you have a guy running for president that rejects science. doesn't even believe climate change is real, let alone wants to do something about it. wants to get hundreds of billions of dollars in tax

breaks to the top two-tenths of 1%. my job right now is to see that donald trump is defeated. hillary clinton is elected. >> he makes a big deal out of the fact that you and he agree on one big issue and that is trade deals that these trade deals have been bad for the country and he basically says clinton and kaine as a ticket, their opposition for instance, vp, johnny come lately that it can't be trusted and that sanders supporters should support trump if they care about trade. what do you say about that? >> in terms of who could be trusted, i think the evidence is clear that there has been in candidate i have ever seen that lies more often than does donald trump. not just me saying it. that's what any independent media analysis has shown. in terms of trust, you can't trust a word mr. trump has to say in the teams of the tpp it's no secret.

i think our trade policies for many, many years have been a disaster. they benefitted corporate america at the expense of working people. secretary clinton has come out in opposition of the tpp and does not want to see it appear in the layman dume duck congres that's me, as well. >> some of your supporters are disappointed in the pick of tim kaine, he's not progressive enough. i know tim kaine called you after he was picked. do you consider tim kaine a progressive and are you happy with the pick? >> the pick is secretary clinton's. i've known tim kaine for a number of years. we served in the senate together, obviously. he's a very, very smart guy and nice guy. his political views are not mine. he's more conservative than i am. would i have preferred to see an elizabeth warren selected by secretary clinton, yes, i would have. >> finally, do you feel as if

that you -- when you got glass because one thing both parties may agree on in their platforms is in favor of reinstating glass stiegel. will we so this happen in the next congress? >> i'll do everything i can to make it happen. when we talk about our campaign, one of the things that we have been able to do, chuck, is create the most progressive democratic platform in the history of the democratic party including breaking up the large wall street banks and re-establishing glass stiegel. the american people understand that we cannot continue to have a hand full of reckless, irresponsible banks often acting illegally, that something has to happen and they have to be broken up. >> senator bernie sanders, big speech tomorrow night. we'll be waiting for you here in a very, very hot philadelphia. over 100 degrees. senator sanders, thanks for coming on. good to see you, sir. >> thank you very much. when we come back, reaction to hillary clinton's choice of tim kaine as a running mate who showed why he might have appeal,

unique appeal to a very important voting bloc. [ speaking foreign language ] >> we'll be back in a moment from philadelphia with this great panel, rachel

we are back. so much to talk about already. our panel, rachel maddow host of the "rachel maddow" show. former rnc chair, michael steele, sort of a fish out of water here. andrea mitchell, chief foreign affairs correspondent and philadelphia native himself, mr. brotherly love chris matthews. >> mr. brotherly love. >> and sisterly affection. >> throw that one in there. >> new pictures of tim kaine walking into church in richmond, virginia. he realized and his parish is realizing what it's like to have secret service following around a member of the parish there. >> you know what his secret service name will be? >> if you're boring enough your

secret service name is tim kaine. >> you're having too much fun here. let me throw it out. we heard what bernie sanders said about tim kaine. >> his politics are not my politics. he does not share my political views. that's an aggressive take from bernie. i'm not surprised bernie is an aggressive politician, and i think when senator sanders speaks at the dnc, i think everybody will be on the edge of their seat and he's not going to pull a ted cruz. >> he said i'm for hillary and he was tough on trump. >> yeah, and he doesn't relish going after trump. he likes going after the democratic party to try to move the democratic party. that's his target and always has been. >> it's still obvious he's not feeling the burn for hillary. he didn't say he trusted hillary clinton. he said he didn't trust donald trump. so the reality of it is there is still tension there that bernie is reflecting among his supporters, and it was evident there. >> he's got a mission bigger than one election.

he always has. >> that's true. >> in fact, he could quiet the march that is planned to go from the center of center city square down to independence hall. this is going to disrupt the city today. no matter how peaceful because this is a city in 100-degree heat planning for a convention and it will be a very large outpouring. >> the and hotter it is, the crankier people will be. >> and he said tim kaine doesn't share politics and not only that but he would prefer elizabeth warren and said tim kaine is a nice guy but he's not endorsing or embracing -- >> the look on your face, chris. >> call tim kaine a progressive. >> he didn't get the pick. hillary clinton did. i've watched hillary clinton. i've watched politicians throughout the years, you can tell when they are actually happy, not when they fake the laugh. she looked delighted during his speech yesterday and i haven't seen her that delighted in a long time. she had found her guy to be her running mate. i think she loved it. one thing we're getting excited about. i understand progressives but one thing we know is the selection of a vice president is

a poor predictor of the direction of that administration. fdr picked john nance garner and kennedy picked lyndon johnson and we got the new deal out of that and got the great society and new frontier. it's a poor predictor. if this is about spoils, they got an argument. there is differences between spoilers. >> one thing trump is trying to hit kaine on. one is the gifts in virginia. i throw it out i heard rendell asked to defend it and he struggled. he said it's illegal in pennsylvania. [ laughter ] >> virginia. >> illegal in virginia isn't a resounding defense. >> virginia has a very string, let's face it, strange gift law. the difference with bob mcdonald who came, who was convicted and then the supreme court overturned it is not quid pro quo and computed higher numbers

to staying in friend's houses and put everything down. he was meticulous about it. they don't think it was a big ethics thing. he has this civil rights background. i mean, i was in the room and what you saw on tv yesterday in miami in that largely hispanic campus, that wonderful campus in miami, it was extraordinary. the enthusiasm for him and the affection and having watched through all of these years, you're absolutely right, chris, she's found her guy. she was a happy camper. >> they won't tell a progressive story about his history. the party moved to the left and he's sort of -- >> both of them. i feel like both clinton and kaine are trying to catch up to the party's movement. >> true. >> he was heroic in virginia on gun law. >> they are moving. might l, the trump campaign says we love the kaine pick because it reinforces that they are the political professionals and here

is tim kaine in office and the whole point of trump, i'm the total outsider. if they want to double down, fine, go ahead. by the way -- >> brought that up. >> i said what about pence? it's top of the ticket. >> ignore that man behind the curtain. >> what do they say to that? do they have a point? >> i think the broader point, it's interesting because what he's comparing himself, he's comparing himself, trump, to kaine and clinton so it's me against them. pence is not part of that equation, necessarily. when he talks about the maverick and outsider, he's assuming his ticket -- >> this wasn't part of his rollout, if you remember. hillary clinton -- >> the strength will be on the argument, this notion that tim kaine is progressive is not just believable. for a host of reasons, that's an opening. >> there are elements of his record not progressive but on ballots, i would argue he is. >> the guy is two doors from you if you're president, look at the structure of the west wing.

not some guy that goes back to maine. he or she is right with you. you want a good person two doors from you, somebody who has values and it's not just smart politics. i think what hillary clinton will love having is a guy that's a true blue good guy and progressive. >> let's sneak in a break here. when we get back, the dnc reaction and your guy's reactions to interesting

welcome back. panel is here. before i jump to trump, welcome back. panel is here. before i jump to trump, the dnc leaks, cleveland we expected rowdiness, we expect order here but i wonder, rachel, if i'm hearing from the bernie bros, i'm in an e-mail just -- i'm the complaint department here sometimes at nbc. somebody complaining about coverage and i said okay, let's talk on the phone or whatever but we didn't do anything about it because i get complaints about coverage every hour, every day but i think bernie supporters may like this place, at least outside they may be upset and do something about it. >> there will be that big protest andrea is talking about today to start things off and

there will be a lot, there will be hundreds of bernie delegates inside the room. now honestly, from the top down he said we got to elect hillary clinton. he's been unequivocal about that. it will be interesting to see if the fights end up in the end. there might be. >> one thing -- >> do you think debbie wasserman schultz needs to get in? >> we knew from the beginning watching the debate schedule they were telling the scales to hillary clinton. middle of the night debate, absurd debate schedule saying we're for hillary. >> bernie said she's not going to be giving a speech. when did the party chair not give a speech at the convention and apparently that's the case. >> right now -- >> her quitting right now before -- the dnc will be running a big part of the ground game for the whole -- >> i tell you -- >> suicide. >> this doesn't help her own fight for reelection.

she'll be okay. it's a district she knows well. >> bernie endorsed her opponent. >> her reelection fight is in her district. michael steele, what did you hear from donald trump? did it make you feel better or worse about his chances? >> well, i think donald trump did a couple things he needed to do. one was and you can see it in the room that night, people began to say okay, i can get there. the speech that he gave when you read it seemed darker and harsher than the way he delivered it. >> i thought the opposite. i wasn't freaked out. >> no, for me, it was the reverse because the reaction, i'm sitting in the room getting reaction from the crowd and the reaction from the crowd was this guy is going to be a fighter and i think that's a strong message for him coming out of this convention. >> rachel, you have never pulled the covers up. >> no. [ laughter ] >> you're not afraid of it. >> this is a lot of personal information here. this is sunday morning, guys. >> he said what he needed to do, chuck. >> standing under the 15-foot tall letters and spent 76 minutes screaming red faced

about terrorism and death and destruction. >> i think that was technical. i don't think he knew how to read a script like that. his daughter knew how to do it. it's tough to read a script in a conversational manner so you do a scream thing. >> it takes an ego to turn into 30-minute script into a 70-minute plan. >> he said he was the person who will fix everything. they are focusing on that. kaine was focussing on that. it is the we, not the i. they are comparing him to a dictator. it's the language and the delivery. >> a lot of americans are out there saying it is the "we" who screwed us up to this point. it is the "we" who got us into this mess. so they're looking for the "i," someone who will step up as a leader to get us through this mess. this is the voting population right now and it will be interesting to see which of these arguments -- >> did you hear bernie? >> the strong man. >> there really is, rachel. >> we've seen this around the world. that's not supposed to be us. >> we have to reach outside the establishment to get the solution, these really bad

economic problems affecting working people in this country. >> right. >> same message, different side. >> same message, the question is whether or not one man is supported to deliver salvation. we're not supposed to be that kind of country. >> i want to throw one more he seemed in the interview with me and goes after mitch mcconnell, ted cruz and john casic. >> he's fearless in that regard. >> exactly. he brought kasich up to himself. >> another player to be named who we may infer can be an editor. look, the fact is that he is not playing by anybody's ground rules except donald trump's. what he said about nato was extraordinary because he doubled down on that. and the whole system of collective security, if you're in poland -- >> what's amazing is the trump campaign tried to walk it back on the nato stuff and he's basically saying, don't walk it back. >> beyond nato to talk about europe as a threat for america, what's good for europe is bad for america and we have an interest in europe being weak and divided.

they only got together to screw us? like hold on a second. >> it will play up there. in erie, pennsylvania, it will play. >> try to not have world war iii. >> people think we're being shoved around and exploited and he's saying i'm going to shove back. >> markets -- >> you guys are great. i'll try to get another half hour but let me sneak in the break. we'll be back in a moment with, we'll call it, half time segment. no, end game segment and look at hillary clinton's popularity compared to nominees on the eve of their convention. >> announcer:

the panel never stops. we just went to a commercial break. it's end game time. i want to show you quickly numbers because it will help us judge whether this is a successful convention for hillary clinton. these are favorable ratings, personal favorable ratings whether you're right side up or upside down for every democrat going back to '92 and as you can see, hillary clinton in the worst shape of any presumptive nominee going into their convention.

now let me show you what the other -- what everybody else came through after their convention. successful convention for bill clinton, successful for al gore. flat for john kerry, successful barack obama. we'll find out for hillary clinton what does she need to do. >> what they will do is have films, the same films you saw in 1992, same producers. >> jfk. >> they will have these films, biography and know her resume is not resinating with millennials. people know what she did, they know who -- you know, the list of what she was. they don't know what she actually did and accomplished. they will do all of that. the balance is going to be very different. >> tv networks don't always take the movies -- >> they have validaters and things she's done and it will be very much all about her and much more -- >> i think it will be a magic moment in the convention, thursday night and a lot of women and men, too, will see hillary clinton as the first party nominee. it will be like the president. she has the advantage and misty eyes across the country. any wisecrack will guarantee another vote for hillary clinton.

i think it's a very emotional minute for people that haven't got to. i think it's going to be magical and if hillary clinton just stands there with a little emotion, this is an amazing historic moment. >> michael, was the republican convention too much anti clinton and not enough pro trump? >> the republican convention had to go anti -- >> what about this one? >> as you were talking about barack obama and hillary clinton being likable enough. this is going to be a convention in which they will showcase her so you can like her. those numbers show don't like her. it's going to be everything you said, chris, plus more. the problem is what happens afterwards. >> here is an out question, besides hillary clinton's speech, what will be the other buzziest speech or speaker when we walk away. >> a huge one on night one. bernie is a big deal. the democratic party is going through a transformation. liberals are having their moment and this convention has to reflect it. has to reflect it. >> every democratic convention i can remember going back to god, '64, the best speech was never

given by the nominee, whether bobby kennedy or jesse jackson or cuomo, the candidate has never able to deliver the best speech so bernie. bernie or president obama. >> michelle obama and barack obama on day two. >> i think it's barack obama on wednesday night. i think it will be to hillary clinton what bill clinton was to barack obama four years ago. >> all right. that's all for this sunday morning. >> we agree. >> i'll be hosting a special edition of "meet the press" daily at 5:00 eastern on nbc. i know that's what everybody on this table will be watching and throughout the week i'll be joined by lester holt, savannah guthrie right here beginning 10:00 am eastern, 7:00 pacific. if you missed it last week, you should be regretting it and we'll be back next sunday, because if it is sunday, it's "meet the press." t is sunday, i "meet the press."

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