that's the last word for tonight, special live edition of gun smoke. let's play "hardball." good evening. i'm chris matthews with a late night edition of "hardball." hillary clinton will term nagt the right to bear arms and the only way to possess her will be for the so called second amendment people to take action. >> hillary wants to abolish the second amendment. by the way, and if she gets to pick -- if she gets to pick her judges, nothing you can do, folks.

although the second amendment people, maybe there is. i don't know. >> i don't know. paul ryan was asked about trump's comments. >> i have been a little busy today. i heard about the second amendment. i hope it is a joke gone bad. i didn't hear the comments. i only heard about the comments. >> we have shown supporting an alternative explanation of what he said. >> so obviously you're saying there is a strong political movement within the second amendment and if people mobilize and vote they can stop hillary but that's not how the media is spinning it. what is your reaction to that? >> i just heard that but nobody in that room thought anything but that. this is a strong powerful movement.

you know, hillary wants to take your guns away. she wants to leave you unprotected in your moment. the nra is endorsement. wayne and chris, they have already. they tweeted out and agree 100% with what i said. there can be no other interpretation. even reporters have told me, give me a break. >> the problem is it wasn't about what voters should do during the election. it is what he said, what you do if he has the power to select judges. then what do you do if you're stuck? he puts it in there. oflk they can use their second amendment. he shouldn't have said anything like it as paul ryan made cheer. trump tweeted media desperate to distract from clinton's anti-2 a stance. the problem with that is that

when trump spoke today his prescription was what second amendment people could do if hillary wins and begins picking judges they don't like. the call was loud and condemn that toir. it is an assassination threat says chris murphy. elizabeth warren says trump makes death threats because he he's a pathetic coward who can't handle the fact that he's looszing to a girl. clinton's campaign statement -- but strongest of all was dan who had to deal with the shootings and what he had said on "hardball" earlier tonight. >> it is a sickness.

it's an evil and republicans and democrats have to stand up to this. i am infuriated that someone running for the highest office in our nation would play with the kind of language. this is not a dog whistle. it is a confrontation which he is calling for. also the appearance last night of the orlando mass shooter's father standing behind hillary clinton at a florida rally. the former secretary of state says she disagrees with the man's views and disavows his support. with me tonight political analyst ron reagan, and john thomas. what do you make of what he said today? >> i think this thing is getting way blown out of proportion. he is trying to activate a voter block. if he can activate gun owners to

come out and vote for him and against hillary that would be a big win for him in november. this is to barack obama talking to the democratic base when he says do boo, go vote. he is saying hillary is bad for you on this issue. he didn't do is finish the sentence but he meant vote. >> why did he say it the way he said it then? he didn't say it the way he said it. >> nobody will accuse him of being a word smith. >> what did that mean? once he said it like this he starts -- >> yeah -- >> and by the way, the guy sitting behind him, he goes like wow, looks to his wife and goes do you believe that? and they both laughed. they both reacted.

watch this when he says it. you see that? it wasn't like some casual bring out the vote fans. that wasn't what he said. don't you think he was also doing a wink? >> no. not at all. >> fair enough. what do you think he was doing there? a lot of reporters think he was doing just that, hinting at violence. >> i had the same reaction that you did. i'm glad you set it up which was simply to play back trump's own words which clearly do not defer being at the ballot box. they referred to what would happen after they go to the ballot box and hillary clinton chooses judges they don't agree with. i think paul ryan was representing that it was a joke gone bad. the problem is that donald

trump, if he is running for the highest office in the land should know you don't joke about something so serious given our history in this country and the fact that tensions are so high right now. you don't say something like that and not have the judgment to know you better clean that up immediately and make clear what you're saying. >> well, he didn't clear it up. let me go to ron reagan. rudy giuliani didn't deny he said it. it was to try to help out trump by saying he was helping people to come out and vote. it was a sick joke about assassinations. that's what it was. >> yeah. yeah. i think so. as a fellow whose father, you know, was nearly assassinated, missed by a quarter of an inch being assassinated by a devastated round i don't find

jokes like this particularly amusing at all. this is more evidence, still more evidence, as if we >> they reminded of sharing angles in

more evidence, as if we >> they reminded of sharing angles in 2010. when you read the institution and the founding fathers they intended this to stop tier -- >> it is. >> it might be right now. >> it is to defend ourselves. you know, i'm hoping that we are not getting to second amendment remedies. i'm hoping it will be the cure for the harry reid problems. >> what did she mean by i hope we are not getting the second amendment remedies? >> i can't speak for her. >> yes, you can. you can listen to her. >> i can't -- >> want me to play it again? >> i can't -- that's how we talk.

my intent is for you to answer the question. >> sure. >> what did you just hear her say? what is your intent? not to answer the question? >> it sounded like she wanted to protect herself with the second amendment. >> the case of a revolt against the government. >> and to take out people she didn't like. that's what she said. do you want me to play it again? >> i can't speak to that particular situation, but i know as it relates to what we are talking about tonight to donald trump to think that it means anything but stumping for votes and motivating a voter block -- >> okay. fine. i know what you're doing here. trump allies were quick to defend this. let's watch the remarks. >> what donald trump was clearly saying is people who cherish that right, people who believe firearms makes our communities

more safe, not less safe should be involved in the political process. >> what he meant by that was you have the power to vote against her. you have the power -- you have to power to campaign against her. >> he was talking about the nra. this is something he talked about all along the campaign trail. if god willing hillary clinton becomes president and gives -- we have to fight that. >> i think the media is blowing this up. i don't think it's a story at all. when you talk politics you use metaphors and analogies all of the time. >> that's not what trump said. he knows he is being watched with acute interest. when he talks about that as being something he can do, if it

doesn't work out your way in the election and he does win and picking judges you have second amendment people that can do something about it. that is irresistibly what he meant. it took him eight hours later to explain to him an alternative explain nation. he said that's right. >> isn't it odd that droves of people have to immerge every once in a while or rather often actually. but this remark is all of a piece we have been hearing since at least the republican convention with the cries of "lock her up". some saying she should be put in front of a firing squad. the parents of a benghazi victim and then trump's allegation that the election he's heard is actually rigged. this is all a piece, a part of

delegitimizing a presidential presidency before it even happens. >> this has touched your family in a very historic way. one person it touched is gabby giffords. she is not the media. she was shot in basically an assassination attempt. she said quote responsible, stable individuals won't take trump's rhetoric to its literal end but his wards may provide a magnet for those -- to condemn those remarks and the violence they insinuate. king said i find trump's comments distasteful, disturbing, dangerous. something in the atmosphere and

try to kill somebody in politics because they don't like their politics. that's the reality of american life. >> that's why you have to be so careful with these statements and that's why this goes back to the whole judgment argument. it's really ironic he goes off script one day after the supposed new reboot with comments like this. like those statements suggest you can see the people behind him laughing. clearly they thought this was a joke. >> yeah. >> to some who may be watching you don't know what they will read into that. donald trump should know you just don't joke around like that. >> and last night's rally in kissimmee, florida, the father of the nightclub terrorist was spotted sitting in the stands behind the candidate. an official for the campaign

said the rally was a 3,000 people open-door event and the campaign was unaware of his attendance until after the event. they say hillary clinton disagreed with his views of the father of the shooter in orlando. john, your thoughts? >> i'm not going to blame the hillary clinton campaign. anyone can attend these rallies. he has said he supports the democratic party. why wouldn't he support hillary? she wants to allow terrorist nations to continue to immigrate to america. of course his views are going to be more in line with what hillary and the democratic party are pushing. to think they solicited him to go to the rally is ludicris. >> but she does -- >> well, she is allowing them to. the fact that she is not doing anything is music to that guy's ears, clearly.

>> it is not going to do anything to fundamentally change anything. the people what already don't like hillary clinton and already have preexisting conspiracy theories run amuck during this election will have fun with it on social media. >> it will be big on certain stations tomorrow. >> as long as we are mentioning people who endorse somebody, the ku klux klan endorses donald trump. all right. coming up, donald trump's comments could mean we are in for a wild ride in the presidential debates coming up, that is if trump agrees to the debates. will trump even show up? that's coming up next. paul ryan defeated his

opponent who sounded a lot like donald trump. just as donald trump is trying to make his comeback this week, he suggested hillary clinton is to blame for the execution of a nuclear scientist in iran, the latest in a long line of conspiracy theories. finally "hardball" round table is coming up. it's a special late night edition of "hardball," the place for politics. it's not a quick fix. it's my decision to make beauty last. roc retinol started visibly reducing my fine lines and wrinkles in one week. and the longer i use it the better it works. retinol correxion from roc. methods, not miracles.

we have an exclusive with paul manafort at 7:00 p.m. "hardball." we'll be right back.

everybody caught it.

welcome back to "hardball." that was donald trump saying if hillary clinton gets control to pick the judges she will terminate the right to bear arms. the only way to stop her will be for those people afraid to ask the second amendment people to take action. how will this effect trump's standing with voters? michael steel is a former adviser for jeb bush and john boehner. and john shrum, bob, what do you think of this? everybody says stay on your

script, read the prompter and otherwise shut up. there he is with that kevin spacey aside to the audience. we are looking for this. we are all listening. it is catnip for us. he goes back to showing and having him clean it up. >> look, i think it's the real him. if you lived through some terrible events, if it's a joke it's a really bad joke. did you watch that whole tape? he was reading off of a piece of paper saying i'm for this, she for that. then he let loose. in those debates which i think will be interesting to be in the trump debate prep, he can't seem to control himself. they always have to come up with

complicated explanations. it was a joke. he was saying it could happen but he doesn't want it to happen. finally, it's really a call for unification which doesn't hold any water at all because he is holding off until after the election, michael. >> he gave a reasonably well received speech yesterday talking about staying on the prompter, talking about the things he is supposed to talk about, the things he needs to talk about and today it is back to square one. that's what i think you're seeing reflected in those polls where he is losing republicans in droves. >> and that's my bag, if you will. you know, we have had an unusual experience in this country. no other country, you can call what that that republic all you want.

garfield, lincoln, almost lost teddy roosevelt. almost lost the mayor of chicago. they got him. we almost lost truman. we lost kennedy. jerry ford twice. we almost lost ron reagan except for fantastic work by the secret service. we lost bobby kennedy, martin luther king. we lost -- >> and -- >> yeah. why would anybody think it is funny? it has to do with maybe second amendment people take care of her. >> it is not appropriate. there is a responsibility with being the nominee of one of the major political parties.

you're one of two people. you have to take that seriously and taking that seriously means speaking in a calm, measured and appropriate tone and donald trump seems incapable of doing it in a sustained way. >> this is the pattern you mentioned a minute ago which is this pattern where every time trump speech there has to be a big clean up operation. you and i might remember this. back in '64 they said we shouldn't have to wait until saturday to find out what the republican candidate meant. that's what we are doing again. is that funny? it is the normal practice of trump. did he really say that? >> we have seen it whether it is john mccain, megan kelly. i'll say a rare word for

goldwater. i thought he was way too far out there on the use of nuclear weapons. he was articulate and he made an argument. donald trump i don't think believes in anything but himself. the result of that is he caters to the people who got him the nomination. he gets up there. he reads it off of a teleprompter like a third grader who has finally learned to read and then he just lets loose. i think the race is fundamentally frozen right now. through the olympics and until the debates except for the fact that donald trump is capable even in the middle of the olympics of inflicting great damage on himself. he is a self-destruct machine. >> the commission has basically taken hold. the clinton campaign agreed they have throwing down the garnet.

they agreed with what the commission wants. there will be three presidential. i guess it's all agreed on. they want donald trump to do the same. clinton campaign released a statement saying it is concerning that the trump campaign already, we will accept the commission's invitation and accept donald trump to do the same. today donald trump held out saying i want a debate very badly, but -- by the way, he once said ignore everything before the word but. i have to see the conditions. i think they will be very fair suggestions. he also added he wants a role in selected monitors. i would say certain moderators would be unacceptable, absolutely. i will demand fair moderators. >> he has also got to realize

there is an advantage of looking like a president and also a lot of danger for him. >> like information questions? >> he did not do well in the primaries and having an informed candidate and the scrutiny that comes from a moderator -- >> danny -- is he is afraid -- >> it's tough. >> it is devastating to mitt romney. he did say that. a moderator dared to speak up. how dare they dare talk to me. that's the thought. what do you think trump is afraid of? some moderator asking an

information question like who is the prime minister of canada? i don't know. >> i think it would be a cheap got you question. >> but canada? >> you don't have to know canada? >> i bet he doesn't know it's -- >> aren't you proud of yourself? [ laughter ] >> you had to get it in there. what is he afraid of? >> he is afraid of the amount of prep he has to do. he is afraid i think he will give into his instincts, he'll turn it into an insult fest against hillary clinton and it will be a disaster for him. he says he wants to debate have been badly. he will. >> will he call her crooked hillary from 5 feet away? >> yes. >> all of the producers are telling me it will be the biggest audience of anything like it ever, ever, ever in the world. >> he would always say he always counter punches, never punches. >> there you go again, mr.

president. thank you michael steele. up next we go live to wisconsin with results of paul ryan's primary out there. the house speaker tried to fend off a challenge. let's face it. he had 85 or 90% tonight. this is "hardball," the place for politics. this is shaving.

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between now and november i am committed to doing everything i can to make sure that the status quo which isn't good enough is not continued because we can do better. we are going to make the case that house republicans are offering a new idea for a new day.

let it be known that we can't afford another four years like the obama years. let's be very very clear, that's exactly what hillary clinton and her party are offering. we can get this country back on track. >> welcome back to "hardball." that was paul ryan where he defeated his opponent who was on here last night in the state's first congressional district. with the majority of the votes in ryan lead by more than 60%. it is 84 to something like 16. trump endorsed ryan days later. he endorsed when it mattered. tonight nehlen delivered listen to this. >> we have lit the spark of a raging fire of rye shous populism that will lift up this nation. it will put the hopes and fears

an aspirations of american citizens first before any consideration. as a result of our campaign people know where ryan stands. the mask has been pulled off. the sher raid is over. the con is up. >> i'm joined by kelly o'donnell. >> i'm glad you there. this is a big night for paul ryan. he has a couple of johns that go between now and election day. he had to win his own primary. he needs to hold onto his seat. it should not be in question based on his electoral history here. another job, he will be in a dozen states trying to hang onto the house majority and the next job of course is to try to be supportive of the republican nominee.

i and a couple of my colleagues try today ask about the donald trump comments today related to the second amendment. ryan was able to say he was busy and had not heard about it. maybe it is a joke gone bad and no one should joke about security. so tonight he really wanted his message to be about what house republicans stand for, what he stands for, separating himself in the message he delivered about the sort of ideas done in a nice way without some of the fearful hateful rhetoric. you can see an asterisk in that. even with paul nehlen, he did not call paul ryan and the tone of those remarks, it was not a gracious concession. he can say whatever he wishes. that populism is on fire, certainly.

but that gives you a sense of the unpredictable nature of this campaign season. even the old tradition didn't play out here tonight, chris. >> yeah, usually concession is the best speech of the night because it is honest. you explain what it meant to you personally. you know better than i do. i was impressed by paul ryan's smart answer because it was honest. he basically said you shouldn't joke about this type of thing. i thought he looked good tonight. congratulations to him, to the speaker that has been renominated. it is great working with you in the night of wisconsin. thanks for coming on "hardball," our late edition. >> any time of day i will be there. >> i think that's your track record, being very loyal. coming up, donald trump, a new conspiracy theory out there, the latest from republican nominee coming up. this is a tough one and a nasty one.

you're watching "hardball," the place for politics.

it's a crooked system. it's a rigged system. we are running against a rigged system. >> welcome back to "hardball." that was donald trump telling supporters recently that he thinks the outcome of the election will be rigged. he embraced the idea that president obama was not born in the united states. this was trump back in 2011. >> people have birth certificates. he doesn't have a birth certificate. he may have one but there is something, maybe religion, maybe a muslim. i don't know. >> he accused ted cruz's father of being in ka hoots with lee harvey oswald. >> it was prior to oswald being

shot. what is this prior to his being shot and nobody even brings it up. that was reported but i think it is horrible. what was he doing with lee harvey oswald shortly before the shooting? it is horrible. >> yesterday trump tweeted that an iranian scientist was executed because of hillary clinton's e-mails. kol lean you know, i don't know whether these dlut each other because you throw a couple of these out and you know a couple of them are crazy. but what do you think?

>> he makes stuff up on a daily basis. you have a speech on monday and the next day he comes out today and he is -- i mean he just sees stuff on the internet and shrugs his shoulder and says i don't know, it's out there. i heard this. there is such a stunning -- if he were still doing howard stern in the morning it would be one thing. >> you can always get somebody that said we never landed anyone on the moon. you can always find somebody who believes that. is he just trying to get the skeptics? >> no. i think with a lot of these smaller ones like the ted cruz thing -- >> not if you're ted cruz's father. >> but it deflects away from whatever is going on. there are the larger things like the birth certificate thing and

that the election is rigged. >> 69% of his supporters believe that right now. >> right. that is a narrative that will never go away. if he looses the election he sort of baked that into the cake >> i did remember that. it is probably a pretty normal state for that. >> like jeff sessions is going to begin impeachment proceedings. >> this is third world politics. it makes them look bad but every time an election goes the other way, stalling. >> and this is something we haven't seen before. this is certainly a way to create a defense. we haven't seen a candidate ever really do this before in the united states. even al gore immediately talked

about the integrity, set aside -- >> even nixon did not campaign for the rest of his life that democratics played a little hanky panky. >> yeah. but it's stunning how much sway he has over his supporters and the fact that he throws this out there to see what sticks. they say nearly half of the people said they had seen the iranian video that doesn't exist. >> the news flash, here it is. here is it. you're getting it now. that's the front page tomorrow morning at the newsstands. this isn't a joke anymore. it goes onto say when trump hinted gun rights supporters shoot hillary he went from offensive to reckless. is that real? that's the publishers talking.

>> i don't know if that's going to happen but he is undermining people's faith. he says maybe the second amendment people can do something about it. american democracy is about not using violence to determine who controls our government. he is suggesting maybe it isn't. it should be problematic to people including second amendment people. these are people who say they always tell you we are law-abiding gun owners. trump is suggesting they are not. >> trump says when he talks about black lives matter movement he is like the world is going to hell is what he is telling people. we need to have a strong thing and people start to become more and more scared. these are the kind of things that he never intends for people to try to do this but this is where you create a dynamic that they become very afraid of the world and you throw this hand grenade of a room.

and some crazy person goes and gets a gun. >> all it takes is one member of a community to do something and we are mad at that whole community. they all did it but those people are triggered. when oswald shot kennedy, whatever else went on, he did it. there is an atmosphere in dallas which is hateful. it's in the air. you start building this stuff up and which ever sicko is going to act. >> it is happening where we are in a prolonged period of violence. we are seeing unrest in urban areas. he saying he is the law and order candidate but he is joking about this time period. >> you think he connects to reality? the president was born in hawaii. it is all in the newspapers.

she is a white woman from kansas. she married an african american. it wasn't like she was 35 years hence. there is no evidence that she names the kid barack obama. it doesn't make any sense. why would anybody, no matter how hateful, racist you are, why would you believe that? why am i looking at you? in other words the stuff he says is not logical. it is not logical. >> it doesn't matter how much evidence is presented. he doesn't move. he doesn't apologize. he doesn't say he misspoke and one lesson he hasn't learned is that words do have consequences. when he says things his supporters react. they take action. he gets them revved up and he throws it out there and steps back and says i don't know,

people say it. he doesn't understand these words have consequences. >> this is his week, by the way. this is his week. , unless he tops it with something worse. >> it is not grounded in reality. >> this is "hardball," the place for politics. tell me something i don't know. romantic moments can happen spontaneously, so why pause to take a pill? or stop to find a bathroom? cialis for daily use, is the only daily tablet approved to treat erectile dysfunction so you can be ready anytime the moment is right. plus cialis treats the frustrating urinary symptoms of bph, like needing to go frequently, day or night. tell your doctor about all your medical conditions and medicines, and ask if your heart is healthy enough for sex. do not take cialis if you take nitrates for chest pain,

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>> this is "hardball," the place for politics. tell me something i don't know. this is a shameless plug but away from politics we cover this campaign and say nothing matters. go see the movie gleason. it is about a former nfl player living with als. it is a reminder of what does matter. next week obama and hillary clinton will converge. it is sort of a right of summer but it is how their relationship has evolved.

hillary clinton they had to have the famous hug it out incident. this year they will be back in martha's vineyard and clinton raising money and they will be united in their determination to defeat trump. >> you know, i can't get excited about that. you know, how did clinton -- does he have a house in martha's vineyard? >> they do no. they just swing through and visit. >> rnc is trying to attract black voters. they have hired bell who is a big long-time operative. so far the rnc and trump campaign have shown zero interest of getting into leaders and communities and trying to help them work on their problem. >> zero? >> yeah. >> those are the same numbers

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that does it for this

special late night edition of "hardball." join me tomorrow at 7:00 p.m. eastern. paul manafort will get tough questions from me and we'll have plenty that talk about, his candidate especially. see you then. >> tonight on "all in" -- >> hillary wants to essentially abolish the second amendment. >> -- donald trump does it again. >> if she gets to pick her judges, nothing you can do, folks. although the second amendment people, maybe there is. >> tonight the clinton camp responds to what they say is a call to violence and how the trump campaign is defending its apparent endorsement of second amendment remedies. plus, another gop senator jumps ship. the latest hedge on debating clinton and the latest attacks on the muslim father of ai