going. that's it. rachel maddow is up next. >> it is i have had the opportunity on this show this year to interview democratic presidential candidate hillary clinton a handful of times. i've not yet had the pleasure of interviewing republican presidential candidate donald trump. i live in hope that that interview will happen here and sometime soon, but in the meantime, i'm very excited to say that i've got what i think of as the next best thing. we are joined tonight for the interview by donald trump's campaign manager, kellyanne conway. thanks so much for being here. >> my pleasure. thank you for having me. >> i have to ask you, if it's a hard decision to do a show like this with liberal comy pinko like me. or do you guys -- >> i've never described you that way. no, it's a pleasure. i wanted to pass along a hello

from donald trump. i told him i was coming on your show and he said it was a terrific idea. and i said i hope i'm your warm-up band and you'll come on the show sometime too. >> i would love to do that. i don't want to spoil it, so let's call it off here and say, that's the end of the interview. no. let me start by saying, congratulations. this is your first presidential campaign -- >> as a manager, yes. >> but it's also the first time any woman has managed a republican presidential campaign ever, so you're in history for that. >> can i ask you, how did you get the gig? did you interview? >> thank you. i didn't know i was the first female republican presidential campaign manager until someone pointed it out to me on twitter. i said, that can't be true. then i realized, this must be such a small group of women. and right away i know them all and i respect them enormously, and it took me about two seconds into the job to see how much is on your shoulders, when you are the campaign manager.

and they did it far longer than i did. i'm coming in toward the end of the campaign. so hats off to them. i think i got the job the way donald trump has promoted women through the trump corporation for decades. i saw the way i move. he knows i don't sugar coat things, but i'm very polite in delivering them. i felt like we were losing for a couple weeks. instead of going in there and saying, we're losing and if you have another week like this, it's done. i went and said, we're a little bit behind and we're really behind in some places, and so let's bring it to a slightly new direction. i think when you have a buoyant candidate who feels comfortable doing the pivot on substance, where he's gotten so many people giving him advice, solicited, unsolicited, to pivot on style. he's so comfortable going out and telling everybody, he's my ten-point plan to reform the veterans administration.

i hope it's a non-partisan issue, that we share the goal of treating our veterans with dignity and in a timely fashion. if he goes out and says, here's my four-point tax plan, or my three-point way to defeat isis and he has specifics, he's so comfortable and enjoys doing that. and you can look at the specifics and say, i disagree with them, i think it will never work, but at least you can see them. >> when you say pivot on substance, do you mean that he's changing some of his policy positions? >> no, no, i think the pivot has been more to substance. my own view as a voter and old hand politically, is that so much of this campaign and campaign coverage has been content-free cacophony, like no substance being discussed, and i think that's a shame for the voters. i don't know a billion things about a billion things, but i know consumers. i've been doing this for decades.

when i talk to voters at their household income, and look at the unemployment status and i hear them, i know they deserve to at least have a full debate on the issues. why do we have to wait for the debates for that? let's have a debate on his vision for the next steps after the affordable care act otherwise known as obamacare, and secretary clinton's. let's compare them on energy independence. she referred in her convention speech to isis, but she called them our determined enemies. he calls them isis. i was offended last year, when she referred to pro-life republicans as terrorists. i didn't think that was nice or true, but she won't refer to the terrorists as terrorists? >> you think she doesn't recognize isis as terrorists? >> i sure hope she does. >> she's never called isis terrorists, or she didn't in that instance? >> of course she has. but here she was to her largest audience ever. >> so you're saying let's keep it on substance, it shouldn't be

this cacophony that's about the campaign itself. >> great word. >> it is. but some of the cacophony has been because your candidate has picked some unusual fights, because he has conducted himself as a candidate in a way that other campaigns haven't. right after you started, he gave this remarkable set of remarks, where he said he regretted some of the things he'd said because they caused personal pain, and he refuses to say which of those things he regrets. but i want to know whether or not any of those things are going to be put to put because he'll apologize for them. when he said judge cuial couldn't do his job as a judge because he was inherently bias, because of his mexican heritage, that is something that i imagine caused great personal pain. did donald trump ever apologize to the judge for that? >> i don't know that he has. >> do you think he will? >> well, here's what i do know. i think that his now running mate, governor pence, when he wasn't his running mate, put it

best. i said, i know what donald trump meant. here's what it is. every american deserves a fair trial with an impartial judge, but we don't question one's impartiality based on their ethnicity, race and a whole host of other -- >> which he did, explicitly. >> i don't know if mr. trump noticed that response at the time, but i thought, that really captures it. but i do hope, rachel, that people who feel that they have been caused personal pain by donald trump, looked at his regrets last week in a very public form and it's very unusual for anybody running for political office to frankly, to ever say they regret causing personal pain. and i hope that anybody who feels that way will at least see that contrition and take that and at least accept his regret. >> but there's no apology. i mean -- >> that would be done in private anyway.

>> so you're saying it may have been done and you don't know, or you know that it hasn't been done? >> i don't know either way. >> and with the khan family, with mrs. khan, in terms of personal pain, he said about her that he didn't -- i can tell you what he said. he said, she had nothing to say. she probably, maybe she wasn't allowed to have anything to say. she rebutted that by saying, she didn't speak in that moment, because she's so grief-stricken. talk about personal pain. what a thing for him to accuse her of. and he said he regrets causing it. do you know if he's apologized to the khan family directly? >> i don't know. but i hope they heard him last thursday in charlotte when he said that. rachel, let me just say how i feel if it's at all relevant. i think the khan son is a hero, and i'm glad he's in arlington national cemetery, and i think he made the ultimate sacrifice as did they, and they deserve our respect and our gratitude. i have four small children, including a son.

i can't even put my mind where their hearts are, because that is a very painful thing to even think about, but i also think people should look at the full measure of each of these candidates and not always judge -- well, not just judge him by one or two things that he has said here. i just feel like we with should look at -- >> i think to be fair, those things that he's getting judged for and people are not letting them go, it's because they're so unusual. i mean, for any presidential candidate, for any politician to get into a personal fight with a gold-star family is so strange, it's so unusual. i mean, not just a political miscalculation, it's humanly shocking and i think that's why he is the only one who can ever put that to rest. as his campaign manager, you're going to get asked about these stories again and again and again. >> and i can't speak for him on that, because it's very personal. >> let me ask about policy then. is it still the policy of the trump campaign and of mr. trump

that there should be a total and complete shutdown of muslims entering the united states until our country's representatives can figure out what's going on. is that still the policy of the campaign and the candidate? >> what he's said, and people can pull it up for themselves if they'd like. what he said recently, when he was delivering his entire fighting radical islamic terrorist speech -- >> the ohio speech. >> that's right. a week ago monday. seems so long ago. they're like dog years, in politics, i've decided. what he said there was, we are going to ban people from entry here from countries that are known exporters of terrorism, which we can't sufficiently vet. so that is not every continent. >> but does that statement rescind the earlier statement? i mean, it was very clear what he said in december, and he put it in writing. a total and complete shutdown of muslims entering the united states. it was very clear. is that now no longer prabel as

the statement of the trump campaign? should we see this new statement about countries with a history of exploiting terrorism, does it supplant it? >> no, it doesn't supplant it. >> so they both exist? >> yes, because it clarifies it, in terms of what does this actually mean. >> what about a muslim who wants to emigrate here in australia? >> depends. do they have a record of terror? are they tied to go groups? his entire point is very simple. whether it's an american-born lone wolf terrorist in orlando who shoots up 49 innocent people in a nightclub, or it's folks coming in on a fiance visa that federal agents i've talked to didn't even know existed, in san bernardino, to kill 14 innocent co-workers, or it's what happens in paris and brussels and nice. this has to stop. we have to do a better job as a government, because we're not doing a great job. >> do you stop it by stopping all muslims?

>> no. >> so that policy is no longer -- >> you look at his speech from last monday and i think you find your answer, but he says, look, we are going to stop allowing countries that export terrorists, that we can't get a good vetting system with them. >> i got the quote. suspend immigration from regions of the world that have a history of exporting terrorism. >> that's right. >> so on 9/11, four airliners were hijacked. three of the four were piloted by men who had most recently lived and operated their cell in germany. we all know this, right? hamburg, germany. so is germany a country from which we will not allow immigration anymore? >> no, not wholesale. because there are so many other ways that we could have at least captured, or i should say, known that those particular al qaeda cell was here. and who were the people teaching them how to fly a plane in florida, but they never had an interest in how to land it.

after 9/11, it was see something, say something. but before that, they could have been monitored in a way, if there was a reasonable suspicion that they had, that they were tied to terrorism. so in that instant, with the 9/11 terrorists, it's hard to believe it's been 15 years, rachel. but with that particular instance, i'd have to go back and resue what we knew about each of them at the time before i answer your questions completely. but the general policy is what he says it is. >> what he says is a total and complete shutdown of muslims entering the united states. >> that was -- >> so you are saying that's no longer operable. >> i'm saying you should see what he said last monday, suspended it from countries that are known exporters of terrorism. >> like germany. there's a reason why we keep not moving on from this stuff. december 7, when he made this statement, it was like every political fire work went off at once. because nobody could believe he was saying, if you are from a

specific religion, you're not allowed to come here. if that's no longer the case, that's a big deal. in the same way that his statement of regret, if it's meant to apply to the khan family, the curiel family, we can't give him credit to that, unless he tells us that he's communicated that to them. this is stuff of his own making. if you want the campaign to not be about this stuff anymore, he's the one who has to end those controversies. you're in a position of trying to defend what he said last week, and not refer to what he said in december, but only one of them can be true. >> well, rachel, i have memorized the list of 22 flip flops that hillary clinton has made on policy, and they have nothing to do with the corrupt clinton foundation pay to play connection, and i think bernie sanders was right on many of those things when he was calling her out for them.

and we will call her out -- >> but your own campaign is about your own candidate? right? >> no. there's a choice. -- yes, this campaign is about two candidates. if i can say one thing about the coverage, it's not that it's biased or slanted. it's incomplete. it's a referendum of donald trump, like you're going to the ballot box and it's going to be a big picture of donald trump with a light. you either put a black x over him, or you say yay. >> but when one candidate is planning on banning people from the united states -- >> and the other is hiding. >> not doing press conferences is one thing. but proposing a ban on people coming to the united states over a specific religion -- >> i think it's a disservice to the voters in that he's now giving speeches, several a week, where he's laying out specific policy prescriptions including on the matter you asked me. where people can say, i don't

believe that, or i don't like that, or wow, i didn't realize that. let me digest this. this is the stage in the election cycle where voters start to want to hear your specifics. >> let me ask one more specific on that. from the ohio speech, the terrorism speech, which i thought was a fascinating turn, and it was on this issue of extreme vetting. what he's describing as extreme vetting for people who want to emigrate to the country. and what he said was, in the cold war, we had a screening test. time is overdue to develop a new screening test for the threats we face today. what is that about? >> he's basically saying, this is not the first time the country has done this, or that it's been done. that we've done this before, but for some reason, we've become lax. >> when did we do it before? >> he's saying, there's a cold war precedent. >> but what is that? >> for vetting. and he's saying that in this case, it's that we -- past is not necessarily prolog, but when you talk about vetting, people

haven't comment like, oh, my god, that's a new situation. what if we did vet people based on their ties to terrorism, if we did that a little bit better? is anybody arguing that we're not letting people in the country right now who do have ties to terrorists? >> the cold war precedent was an ideological vetting. that did exist in the cold war, in the early '50s, it was called the mccarron act. and truman vetoed and it congress passed it some other way. but what survived famously was thrown out by the united states supreme court because it was ruled to be unconstitutional. so there's a cold war precedent for ideological vetting of immigrants. in this case, it was to stop communist front groups. but it didn't pass constitutional muster, and we've never had anything like that since that ever has passed constitutional muster. so what he's asking for is a new extreme vetting system, which has previously been tried and ruled unconstitutional and we abandoned it half a century ago. >> 67 years ago, right? >> yeah. so that's a hard case -- so i

want the pivot on substance to happen too. i really do. >> like four issues a week now that he's talking about. [ all speak at once ] >> he has to make sense. he has to make sense when he makes the policy pivots in order for them to be successful. >> sounds like you disagree with the policy, and that's fine. >> you can't have a mccarron act now, it's unconstitutional. >> people can look at it and say, it's ridiculous, unconstitutional, or they may say, that may work, i'd like to hear more about it. but either way, i feel confident that our campaign respects the voters, and they say they want policy prescriptions, a conversation about substance. i said it before, i would rather lose a campaign about style, than -- or who said what today about whom, than not -- than lose it on substance. because i feel like the issues that favors us.

people in the last 200-something polls taken on obamacare, you have many people who still have problems with -- you have many millions of americans uninsured, you have people looking for work, schools that are failing our students. and the fact is, hillary clinton from what we're told is going to give a speech tomorrow about none of that. her speech is -- >> she's going to give a speech about you guys. >> but that's odd. it's odd for this reason. again, it's not -- she's running for president of the united states. and presidents have to have vision and so leadership in a way that you make the election about the future, not the past. and you make it about your own beliefs and your own values and vision, not just trying to make the other person look like he takes the wings off butterflies. i watched robby mook last week, probably such a smart guy. very loyal to hillary clinton. he knows what he's doing. he's a great competitor, and yet most of his interview was about donald trump.

and i keep looking at that and saying, when are we going to hear from you? i mean, scarcity is their strategy. politico ran a headline today that said hillary clinton's strategy to run out the clock to november. i think that's a disservice to voters. she ought to lay it out and say my policies on x, y and z are right, and yours are wrong. >> kellyanne conway, the first female republican campaign manager in a presidential election. and i've chained her to the desk. so we'll be right back. hold on.

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[ clock titime. ] you only have so much. that's why we want to make sure you won't have to wait on hold. and you won't have to guess when we'll turn up. because after all we should fit into your life. not the other way around. donald trump's brand-new campaign manager, kellyanne conway, is here tonight. we have more ground to cover. she'll be here when we get back, i promise, unless something terrible happens. we'll be right back. clean food.

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tums smoothies starts dissolving the instant it touches your tongue. and neutralizes stomach acid at the source. tum-tum-tum-tum-tums smoothies, only from tums. >> we're back with kellyanne conway, campaign manager for the donald trump for president campaign. one week ago tonight she became the first woman to ever run a republican presidential campaign. thanks again for being here. >> thank you. >> why -- don't take this the wrong way. [ laughter ] >> why on earth is your candidate in mississippi tonight if everything you could possibly imagine that was bad for your candidate happened between now and november and everything great for hillary clinton happened between now and november, your candidate is still going to win mississippi by double-digits. why is he in mississippi? >> that's right. and hillary clinton is still going to win california by double-digits and she's been raising money there. >> but she's doing a fund-raiser. you're spending money to keep him down there, paying money to rent the venue, having him do this rally. again, don't take it the wrong way --

>> it's on national news in a non-swing state. >> but you're wasting your donors' money. the best possible outcome is that he might win by extra double-digits. why is he there? >> he was there because he wanted to do a rally in jackson, mississippi, because he -- the governor has been talking to him about coming down and he had -- i don't know if your audience is aware, but he had mr. faraj, the leader of brexit, on the stage with him tonight -- >> so weird to have the successionist guy give a speech in jackson, mississippi. you get why that's weird, right? >> i think the people who came before me developed a sound infrastructure. but we have inherited a schedule that we're taking better control of. i'm a focused person and i see which states we're going into with candidate appearances, that's for governor pence and mr. trump.

>> you can't get out of mississippi because -- >> it was already planned. and honestly, when i first asked about that rally, to give you a little inside peek, when i first asked about that rally in a scheduling meeting last week, they said, it went live this morning. and the venue was already 3/4 full. >> it's mississippi. >> but it's national news. you're covering it. >> let me ask you another one. new york. home for donald trump. the national political director for your campaign is -- >> jim murphy. >> -- jim murphy, yes. he's quoted in the "new york post" two days ago that there's going to be an all-out, full steam ahead, top speed effort in new york, full plan, ground game, media, internet, direct mail, and maybe phone banks. he then told the "new york post" he was acting at your behest specifically and named you, in saying this is why there's such

a focus on new york state, where you are on a good day, behind by 17 points. that doesn't sound like you. >> it wasn't me. but it would be exciting to challenge hillary clinton here, just on her senate record in new york alone. i hope you get an opportunity to interview her. i hope if she enjoys her time in the seat as i am tonight, that you'll ask her the question, why was your senate record here in the state so unremarkable? but i have a 3:30 call with jim tomorrow and i'd ask him about that article. i'll say something else, jim is onto something very important that i think is missed in the non-conversation conversation politically, rachel, which is, we have great teams in different states. we may not be competing at this moment. and we're going to start moving people around to these swing states. and that's typical of campaigns, they do that.

you decide where are your strengths, where do you want to sew up some of the poll numbers. even in north carolina today, we're behind by two, according to a public poll. arizona, we're ahead by five. so things are starting to look a little bit better. battle ships turn slowly. but if we have a fabulous director where we end up not competing as hard, we'll move them around. that's what smart campaigns do. you say, how do we focus our talents and where do we put our candidates? and we've been working with governor pence's staff as well. he's an incredibly strong speaker in swing states. he gets large crowds. they want to hear his message. they connect with him. i told him, you're like the golden child, you eat your vegetables, do your homework, he's just done a phenomenal job for this ticket. he keeps his own schedule. every ten days or so, we'll try to get trump and pence together in one place as well. but you'll see some changes. you'll have a post labor day bonanza of a new type of schedule. promise. >> okay. you used the schedule, golden child, there, which i have to

quote back to you, because that is one of the phrases that was used ironically, or sarcastically by the new chief executive of the trump campaign, steve bannon, to describe paul ryan. he's called paul ryan a liar, a golden child, and he didn't mean it in a good way. >> i did, by the way. >> you did, when you were talking about governor pence. but that's not how he meant it about paul ryan. he said he was raised in a petri dish at the heritage foundation. so breitbart, under steve bannon's leadership has been the biggest media cheerleader on the right for the resignation of john boehner, and for this year's challenge to paul ryan, current republican speaker of the house. how's it going between speaker ryan and your campaign? >> it's going well. >> since steve bannon came on board? in the past week -- >> nothing's changed in terms of speaker ryan having endorsed donald trump and donald trump having endorsed speaker ryan.

i did tease mr. trump by saying, you went and endorsed him, he won his primary with 84% of the vote. had i been here, you would have taken the credit. >> if you really need paul ryan down the stretch, he has a certain amount of power. >> he's speaker of the house. and he will be in a trump presidency. >> so you've now got his chief political antagonist from the conservative media with you, running the trump campaign. steve bannon has been not just a provocateur on the right, not just a controversial guy, he specifically set his sights on trying to destroy paul ryan. he's after john mccain, he's after paul ryan. he stood up and cheered about john boehner, and about eric kanter. the way that he celebrated eric kanter losing his seat. i understand, if you're a republican insurgent why that must be very exciting. but if you're the republican party, if they're going to be responsible for a lot of the ground game and all of this stuff, how could they work with him? >> we had sean spicer in our shared office just the other

day. >> they're just swallowing it. >> no, i talked to chairman priebus once or twice a day now. i really like the way that the official, you know, the republican party nationally, rachel, and treating us and working with us. i'm pleased with that. i think it comes on the heels of this -- letters people are writing, please put the resources down-ballot and please, don't destroy the republican party. chairman priebus doesn't feel that way and speaker ryan doesn't. in a trump presidency, i'll be the first one to go up and thank speaker ryan and work with him. we both work for jack kemp at different points in our career. >> how about steve bannon? >> he'll do it too. >> after doing everything he could to destroy him, calling him a liar. >> they both have really big jobs now. they both endorsed donald trump. >> this is like a chain mail that you go to work, this environment that you work in, it's actively on fire every day. >> come and visit us. >> i will. >> i just invited you. i just got my first piece of hate mail to my home. >> i'm sorry. >> no, it's a crazy time, but it's very rewarding and i think

the case for change that so many americans are making. 70% is saying, take us in a different direction. that's a change election. you see the polls, including nbc's, that a vast majority of americans dislike and distrust hillary clinton. it's happened for so long. there are some serious revelations this week. someone from the other side of the aisle last night said the following, the clinton foundation scandal unfolding seems serious and we'll take a look at t but the next time donald trump says something crazy, then we'll forget about this. and i thought, if it's worthy of examination, if the allegations of pay to play and these visits from people, and these foreign donations are actually bothersome, and worthy of examination on a show like yours, rachel, then that doesn't wash away because donald trump said something that day. that's my point about full coverage.

>> on that issue of the clinton foundation, the very strong statement from your campaign two days ago, saying the clinton foundation is the most corrupt enterprise in political history. if it's such a vehicle for corruption, why did donald trump donate so much money to it? >> he donated $100,000, and certainly not for the reasons the foreign donors did, apparently. he didn't ask for a meeting with the secretary of state to talk about donating to the clinton foundation, like apparently 85 other people did. >> asking and getting is not the same thing. >> but the clinton foundation does some good work. there's no question about that. they do very important work. >> but they're the most corrupt enterprise in political history! apparently you can be both. we see the work they do around the globe. they could do much -- they could do even better, more good work, if you will, if some of those donations weren't, you know, weren't, i guess, received as a way to, in the state department,

and why are you giving any? do we need to have meetings with the state department with foreign donors and then pretend all that money is just for vaccinations? >> there's no indication that the money went for anything other than -- >> let's find out. i think governor christie had this right yesterday. he said, we actually don't know the facts. three divisions of the doj refused to investigate. he said yesterday, we as americans have the need to know what the facts are before we cast a vote. i think there's something to that. we already know how america feels about washington. the lack of transparency, the lack of accountability, the corruption, the rigged system that helps insiders. this doesn't look good for someone who is already distrusted and disliked by a majority of americans. >> but to the same point, i hear you, absolutely, but to that same point, every presidential

candidate in the modern era has released his or her tax returns back to nixon. nixon set that precedent and he was under audit. so that's not an excuse to not release your tax returns. previous presidential candidates have. donald trump is running for president in part on the basis of his financial acyu mean, and saying that the system is rigged. and there's been troubling reporting about his business practices, a lot of stuff that may or may not been followed to its conclusion. but talk about raising questions there have been stuff. why should it audit out only apply to him? >> that's the conclusion that his lawyers and accountants have given him and he's respecting that advice. >> do you respect it? >> i do respect t because i once thought, transparency, release your tax return. but now that i'm hear, i hear the advice from the lawyers and the accountants. but i don't think we need to see his tax returns to verify his

financial acumen. i walk to the trump tower every day -- >> i want to know if he pays taxes. >> we all want to know what taxes we would pay under his -- >> no, trust me, i really literally want to know if he pays taxes. i have two more things to ask you. do you mind staying? >> no. another break? >> i promise just one more break and we'll be right back. ♪ one day a rider made a decision. the decision to ride on and save money. he decided to save money by switching his motorcycle insurance to geico. there's no shame in saving money. ride on, ride proud. geico motorcycle, great rates for great rides. get between you and life's dobeautiful moments.llergens

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we're back with kellyanne conway, who is the first woman to ever be the campaign manager for a republican presidential campaign. she's been in this gig for one week, most of which you've spend here in the studio with me tonight. it feels like i'm never gonna let you go. i have two more questions. >> yes. >> one is about this health issue, and i have a very specific question about this. mr. trump personally and members of your campaign have repeatedly raised this question of secretary clinton's health. the only testimony we have of mr. trump's health is this letter from his gastroenterologist saying his results and that he's the healthiest individual that would ever be elected to the presidency. that's really funny, but as a doctor's letter, it's a non-serious letter. it's full of typos. most of the letter has no medical meaning. it links to a website that doesn't exist. if he was elected, donald trump would be the oldest person to ever be sworn in as president. whether or not he's going to try to make hillary clinton's health the issue, doesn't he owe it to the american people to release an actual medical report, a more credible, more complete

statement? >> perhaps. but i want to say something about hillary clinton's health. it's not an issue that i care to comment on, because i'm not a doctor. she's not my patient. i can tell you what i see with my own two eyes. i don't see someone who enjoys campaigning the way he does. i'm with him practically every day. he keeps such a crazy, ridiculous pace for a man his age, that it's very difficult for the younger staffers, of which i'm not one, to keep up with him, rachel. i mean, it's really insane. he called me yesterday and said, i need more rallies. he doesn't just show up and do

the rallies. he prepares for them. you have to travel. he's always reading, he's always thinking. i confess, i don't know when he sleeps. >> but you as his campaign and him talking about himself have made his physical vigor part of what he brings to the campaign, and they've made it a contrast issue with hillary clinton, but hillary clinton released a normal doctor's statement. what we have from donald trump, that letter really is absurd. and we've contacted the doctor who wrote it to try to get some background. turns out he was using a medical credential on his name that he's no longer entitled to use. like there's a lot of really upstanding things about what we know there. and so for one, why is a gastroenterologist is a digestive specialist. why is donald trump seeing a gastroenterologist for 35 years? >> that, i don't know. >> as the campaign manager, can i make a request? >> absolutely. >> can we get a more substantial medical -- >> i will pass on the request. i assure you he has doctors and physicians. and i was told by a different anchor on a different network,

that hillary's doctors have released her history and she's in great health. i think stamina is different than health. vigor on the campaign trail. but i look at hillary clinton not being out there more as a strategy. it's scarcity as a strategy. it's that we don't want to put her out there, because when we do, people are reminded that she doesn't meet the 70% of americans who want a change election, a new direction. she is the person who has earned a majority of americans saying, i dislike her, i distrust her, but -- i can't imagine what comes after the "but." >> as a political observer, i think the reason she's not out on the campaign trail as much, they think they're winning and they don't want to interrupt the

narrative. >> i think that's terrible and i'll tell you why. if we were winning because hillary clinton was failing or tripping over her words, or messing up, or she was down in the polls for whatever reason, to say the clinton foundation investigation helps her go down in the polls, we're not going to disappear, i promise you, because that's not what the voters want. they want to see the candidates, they want to hear the candidates. they want to digest their proposals that we've been discussing tonight, rachel and they want to see the contrast between these two. not contrast in style, not contrast in stamina. contrast on substance. we're going to fight her on substance. and i'm very disappointed from what i know publicly, that her speech tomorrow in reno, nevada -- >> is going to be all about you. >> it's not about substance. >> it's about the trump campaign, and this is my last question for you. and i'm asking it just because i feel like i shouldn't have to ask you, but i don't have any access to anybody else at the campaign. so i have to ask you. is roger ailes working as part

of the donald trump campaign? >> no. neither formal or informal. they're old friends. he's donald trump. he talks to a lot of people. >> so the meeting in new jersey on sunday, august 14th, that didn't happen? this is what "the new york times" reported in terms of him coming on board to help donald trump prepare for the debates, that didn't happen? >> i was not there on august 14th. so i didn't see who was or was not there. but i will tell you that they're old friends and they talk. i'm sure they talk, but he talks to many different people from every side of the aisle. >> roger ailes, no role in the campaign? >> no formally or informal role in the campaign, no. but he is a marketing genius. >> and just resigned his job under a cloud of terrible sexual harassment allegations. >> thank you for having me. i know you work hard, and i work hard. but not every woman gets her shot. for that i'm grateful. i watched you for years and i said, she should have her own show and you have for a long time.

and i respect that enormously. i know you disagree with us philosophically, and i hope mr. trump will take the seat one day. >> thank you. and back at you. you have made history and women breaking glass ceilings in politics is always important when it happens. thank you. and good luck to you. see, that was fine. everything went okay. we can talk to each other. we'll be right back. ...clear for take off.

see ya!

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i just want to find a used car start at the new carfax.com show me used trucks with one owner. pretty cool. [laughs] ah... ahem... show me the carfax. start your used car search at the all-new carfax.com. >> so, that of the kind of awesome. i mean it was awesome in this exact sense. that was an in-depth conversation over multiple segments with donald trump's brand-new campaign manager kellyanne conway. and we still have a show with lots of other things to say. the reason i'm glad that happened is because kellyanne conway and i could not be more different ideologically, right?

and she's working on this project, she's the campaign manager for the donald trump campaign, which i find endlessly fascinating and in lots of ways endlessly scary and i've talked about that here on this show. but to be able to have a conversation that covered that many different topics and was that substantive and that didn't devolve into a shout fest and that wasn't mean toward either of us, makes me feel good about this as a medium. so if you felt disappointed that we didn't kill each other, i'm sorry we didn't kill each other, i'm really glad that we didn't and i hope it can be the start of even more dialogue. and to that point and to that end, i would like to say, donald trump you have not yet done an interview on this show. and i think if you would bring yourself to do it, you would not regret it. i think it would be substantive and helpful and a different kind of conversation that we're usually getting. come on, it will be fun. we'll be right back.

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an event in wilmington, north carolina but then real quick right after he hopped a plane back to his home state of indiana. it's not necessarily an unexpected move. his schedule did have him plan to be traveling back to his home state today. but what mike pence had to head home to is decidedly unplanned. central indiana has been dealing with tornadoes for much of the day today. as of right now there are no reports of any deaths, but thousands of indiana families and businesses are without power. we've seen images in some cases of significant structural damage. a tornado watch had been in place for 25 different indiana counties and was supposed to expire at 9:00 eastern tonight. but it's now been extended until 11:00 p.m. eastern as new tornado warnings and take cover alerts are still being issued across central indiana. tomorrow governor pence is expected to visit kokomo, which has taken a pretty severe beating. tonight kokomo declared a state of emergency after these storms. we'll keep you updated on any further developments. ♪ with this level of engineering... it's a performance machine.

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one other big political event stin unfolding right now. senator bernie sanders right now is speaking live to supporters at over 2,600 house parties across the country. it's the livestreaming launch of a new political project he's calling our revolution. to recruit and train and fund progressive candidates down ballot all across the country. and honestly, the fact that senator sanders went through with tonight's event is notable itself. yesterday it emerged that over half the staff of this new project resigned en masse over the weekend. that walkout came before they

could fully promote tonight's event, leading to doubts about how many people would show up tonight. well, tonight we now know. a spokesperson for the project tells us that they got rsvps from 30,000 people. we're going to get a live report on how it went and how it's going next. you totaled your brand new car. nobody's hurt, but there will still be pain. it comes when your insurance company says they'll only pay three-quarters of what it takes to replace it. what are you supposed to do? drive three-quarters of a car? now if you had liberty mutual new car replacement™, you'd get your whole car back. i guess they don't want you driving around on three wheels. smart. with liberty mutual new car replacement™, we'll replace the full value of your car. liberty stands with you™. liberty mutual insurance.

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and may stop treatment. side effects may include diarrhea, nausea, upper respiratory tract infection, and headache. tell your doctor about all the medicines you take, and if you're pregnant or planning to be. ask your dermatologist about otezla today. otezla. show more of you. alex sykes wald is a political reporter for msnbc who's been covering the launch of bernie sanders's new political organization tonight. he's also been reporting recently on a little bit of turmoil in bernieville. alex joins us now live. alex, thanks very much for being with us tonight. >> thanks for having me. >> how is this launch going? >> well, rachel, i just came from one of these launch events just down the street from our studio. people were happy about it. they're pretty excited about 30,000 people watching the live stream. but not an ideal way to start. as you mentioned, about 2/3 of the staff quitting over jeff weaver being brought back in. he's bernie sanders' former campaign manager. a lot of turmoil over the structure of the group. it was set up in a way that could collect larger donations and hide the donations.

it's not what people wanted. and they say this contradicts bernie sanders' whole message about gethd out the millionaires and the billionaires from politics. they want to use this group to support candidates up and down the ballot but the way it's structured it's going to make it difficult. they can't coordinate directly with those candidates. and looks like bernie sanders can't himself be a face of this group. so major questions going forward, rachel. >> in terms of money, obviously when they talk about supporting down-ballot candidates it's organizing but it's also money. particularly huh can't quornd with a campaign. do we have any dollar signs attached to the size of the effort in terms of understanding how big this is? >> yeah, i learned that today before these staffers quit that they had raised about a million dollars directly for this group and another 600,000 directly for those candidates. you know, kind of a lot, the power of that bernie sanders fund-raising list, but they say they could have raised a lot more with a different structure. >> alex seitz-wald, political reporter for msnbc. covering this event. thank you. >> thanks.

>> now it's time for "the last word" with lawrence o'donnell. good evening, lawrence. >> hey, rachel. i just saw you book a donald trump interview through kellyanne conway on your show. she's now booking for you. >> i feel like if you've got to have somebody promise something for somebody else that person's campaign manager is about as good a recommendation as i can get. >> that is as good as it gets. it would be donald trump's first msnbc primetime interview. >> really? >> i don't know why he's been avoiding us, rachel. i can't figure it out. >> i can't imagine it will ever happen. but please, god. thanks, lawrence. >> just have faith, rachel. kellyanne conway on your show. well, glenn beck is here tonight. yes, that glenn ck