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west. i'm alex witt and here's what's happening. we begin with politics. the trump campaign is insisting his immigration plan has not changed, despite conflicting comments about whether there will be a deportation force. here's what trump's campaign manager said this morning. >> he has to deal with those agencies and those individuals already responsible for this who aren't doing their jobs. nobody enforces the law the way he wants to enforce the law. you look at his plan and you look at the no amnesty and the building a wall and the enforcing the law and the making sure that there's no legalization. he's also said that. it's exactly what he's been talking about all together. >> meanwhile, ben carson, one of trump's advisers, has this message to critics who feel the candidate's outreach to african-american voters needs to be reworked. >> you're going to hear coming from the republicans, which i admit, they have been late to the game. we have should have been into this a long time ago, because the policies that have been espoused are good policies, but they've not been expressed in a

way that people are going to understand them or even listen to them. and donald trump is starting that. and of course, that's why he's being attacked. but i've got news for them, a lot of people in the black community are very, very intelligent, and they're going to be listening very carefully to what's being said by both sides, and they're going to be making intelligent decisions. >> the campaign says trump will start visiting minority communities soon. the candidates are off the campaign trail, but later this week, trump and clinton will address veterans at the american legion conference in cincinnati, ohio. but right now let's go to des moines, iowa, where jacob rascon has the latest from the trump campaign. another good day to you, jacob. how is trump handling these new criticisms being lobbied his way, specifically the ones about race and immigration? >> reporter: yeah, there are a lot of them, and really because -- let's remind everyone, this was his signature issue. this is how he started his campaign and what propelled him to the nomination, which is his hardline stance on immigration. deport everybody. build the wall. the wall is still there, but

there is clearly a change of mind on the deportation force and whether he wants to get all 11 million undocumented or so out of the country. asked that specific question repeatedly this morning, his campaign manager, his vice president and others, vice president nominee, and other surrogates asked the same question. they all said he has been consistent, consistent on no amnesty, no legalization, but they could not specifically answer what he would do with those noncriminals who are here in this country. they also said that he will be speaking about this very issue in the coming weeks. so we expect a clarification. meanwhile, the trump campaign has put out a new web ad focused on hillary clinton, as usual. here's part of that. >> we know a dirty pay-per-play scheme when we see it, but not hillary's spokesman, who arrogantly tells voters who question the clinton foundation's ethics -- >> if any american voter is

troubled by the idea that the clintons want to continue working solving the aids crisis on the side while hillary clinton is president, then don't vote for her. then don't vote for her. then don't vote for her. >> we won't. >> reporter: they really like that line, of course, from the campaign manager on the clinton side. so, they always, in all of these scripted speeches over the last week and a half, have spent a lot of time going after hillary clinton. they want to stay focused on that issue, even though everyone now talking about immigration and race. on the topic of race, you heard ben carson defending and saying that trump will get a good listen from the african-americans who are open-minded about whether to vote for trump or not. you also heard the campaign manager again promising that in the future that he will visit more urban areas. of course, we're still looking for that. alex? >> all right, jacob rascon in des moines. thank you very much for that. joining me now is rosie gray, political reporter for buzzfeed news and olivia nutsie with the "daily beast."

rosie, you first here. i want to start with the trump campaign and also to say today the trump immigration policy has never changed. at least that's the word there. so, that means no path to legalization, no path to citizenship unless they leave the country. how much of an impact will his meeting with hispanic leaders have on any upcoming policy proposals? >> well, i'm not sure about that because the situation still seems pretty fluid in terms of where they're going to end up deciding to go on this issue of deportations, which is the thing that's really still up in the air and we're not really sure whether he is still going to stick to his initial campaign promise, which was to deport all 11 million people who are in the country illegally. so i think we're still -- i mean, we're hearing mixed messages from the campaign, and it's still sort of up in the air how this is going to end up. >> okay. you want to correct that, olivia? where do you think it's going to go? >> i think what we're seeing right now is someone learning about this issue in realtime, which is shocking that we're this far along in the election and early voting starts in a few weeks in some states, and he still has not worked out the details of what is a central

policy for this campaign. >> okay. let's talk with you about mike pence. let's take a listen to what he has had to say about this racially charged exchange between the two campaigns. here's that, everyone. >> kaine's comments, hillary clinton's comments on thursday night sound desperate to me. i mean, to be honest with you. i don't talk a lot about the polls, but i know the polls are all closing up. and the fact that you see democrats and hillary clinton and her running mate rolling out the same old playbook of racial divisiveness sounds a little bit to me like an act of desperation. >> who do you think stands more to lose when throwing around phrases like bigot and kkk values? >> well, i think it's more -- it seems more serious whenever hillary clinton says anything, because we hold her to a different standard than we hold donald trump. for whatever reason, there is a different set of rules for donald trump. we expect less of him when it comes to the quality of his rhetoric or the outrageousness

of his rhetoric. so i think the campaign did not -- the clinton campaign did not do that lightly when they made that so-called alt-right speech. but donald trump is doing sort of a classic political tactic here by accusing his opponent of the very thing that he's been accused of for a very long time and trying to deflect from his own faults by doing that. but i think mike pence, i mean, it sounds like he is living in his over universe when he says things like that. she is up in the polls consistently. she has a national lead. she has a lead even in places like georgia. things are not going well for the trump campaign right now, and i don't know that accusing hillary clinton of something that she has never been accused of, frankly, on such a broad scale, is really going to work for them in the end. and he's polling as low as 0% with the african-american community right now. he is not going to change any hearts and minds by taking this line against hillary clinton. >> rosie, the "washington post" was reporting on all the debate preps, citing some recent gatherings, for example, trump's new jersey golf course. clinton's campaign press

secretary tweeted "for all his lack of substance, trump's showmanship as ex-tv star makes him formidable debate foe. he thrashed rivals in gop debates." this is gamesmanship? >> obviously, the two candidates will have very different approaches to these debates. i think hillary clinton is approaching debate prep from a soferlt traditional way that, you know, the way that it's usually done with a lot of poring through policy papers and, you know, mock debates, et cetera. and it seems like trump, who is, you know, a natural showman, is, you know, sort of going with his gut and is likely to try to really sort of give everybody a show. so i think we're, you know, these are going to be really huge events, and it's going to be unpredictable. >> do you get a sense, though, rosie, that he does that because he thinks that's what his audience wants, that is what propelled him to where he is now? or do you think he does it because he's not particularly honed in yet on policy details?

>> well, i think it's become clear by this point that donald trump does not have a huge interest in policy and in learning often what his own policy proposals are. i think that, you know, like you were just saying, there is something to him that's very focused on, you know, giving the people what they want, putting on a show. and i think that it's possible that he is sort of -- he might be viewing the debates like that. >> what do you think, olivia? because the "washington post" report talks about the different approaches from each camp to preparing for the debates. what's your sense of that? >> well, it's interesting. if you remember, he never really thrived in the debates during the republican primary. there were a few where he would have a moment or two, like when he talked about new york values, where he really broke through. but, and in fairness, there were a lot of candidates on the stage for much of this, and that could explain why. but he doesn't seem to do particularly well when he has to answer tough questions in realtime when there is someone else sharing the spotlight with him. so i don't even know if that,

you know, his showmanship, his qualities as a showman are really going to help him so much, because he's going to have to answer serious questions in detail. >> when you talk about debate prep, it's probably not the same scenario for hillary clinton as it is here with this setting. reading what's on the screen here, part of "the washington post" report, he signs his formal band of counselors to a new jersey golf course over chats and hot dogs and coca-cola. they test out zingers and chew over ways to refine his pitch. >> i'm sure the trump debate prep is a lot more fun than the hillary clinton prep in brooklyn. >> or at least the setting, golf course, beautiful day, yeah. >> but obviously, they're going to take different paths when they're preparing for something as big as these debates, which are going to be, you know, the super bowl of politics. i'm sure she's, as rosie just said, looking over policy notes, really honing in on the details of what she believes, what she is offering to the american people. trump, meanwhile, is you know, talking about how he's going to burn her over burgers on his golf course.

>> oh, it's going to be so exciting. i can't wait for september 26th. it is highlighted on my calendar, that first debate. thank you, olivia nuzzi and rosie gray. appreciate that. reaction from a news conference in a chicago shooting of dwyane wade's cousin. and the lives lost to gun violence every day. i'll ask ben jealous, former president of the naacp, about that and more. at the all-new carfax.com that might help. show me the carfax? now the car you want and the history you ed . are easy to find. show me used minivans with no reported accidents. boom. love it. [struggles] show me the carfax. start your used car search and get free carfax reports at the all-new carfax.com. burning of diabetic nerve pain, these feet learned the horn from my dad and played gigs from new york to miami. but i couldn't bear

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female teacher:anyone else? through internet essentials, comcast is on track to connect 3 million people in need to low cost, high speed internet at home, helping to make sure that every hand in the classroom goes up. male teacher: okay, veronica. amphibian. male teacher: excellent. welcome to a brighter future. welcome to it all. comcast. now news from chicago, where police just wrapped up a news conference after two men were arrested in the shooting death of dwyane wade's cousin. nbc's morgan radford has more on this story for us. morgan, what do we know so far from this news conference? >> reporter: alex, lots of developments today. authorities expressed deep frustration in the wave of this gun violence that's already taken hundreds of lives in

chicago. now today, superintendent of police eddie johnson began by saying enough is enough. and here's part of what he said. >> i'm so sick of every weekend talking about the murders that happen in the streets. and the frustrating part is to me, i've told you all countless times, we have 1,400 individuals that drive this gun violence in this city. this isn't a mystery. we've got very good at predicting who will be the perpetrators or victims of gun violence. you know, these guys choose that lifestyle, but they continue it because we continuously show them there's no consequence. they're going to keep doing it until we show them we're serious. i don't need to preach about the incentive for other leaders to do something about this problem. the answer is out there. we just have to get it done. and we should not -- listen, i

feel bad for the wade family. i feel bad for the aldridge family, but i feel bad for all of the families in chicago that have lost somebody unnecessarily because of this silly gun violence that we experience. these gang members on that ssl list, they make a conscious decision that's the direction i want my life to go in. they do. they make that conscious decision. the rest of us -- these streets belong to the rest of chicago, not to them. but until we get serious about holding them accountable -- >> alex, you can hear the frustration in his voice and you can see the pain on his face. for a lot of people in chicago, this is personal. and the people we spoke to yesterday said, look, this is sad, but why does it take a superstar to bring attention to an issue that is happening repeatedly, that is hurting our communities and that is hurting the kids in chicago? over half the people who are shot in these incts just beginning this year,hey've

been children. brothers 26-year-old darwin sorrells jr. and 22-year-old derren sorrells jr. they're the two men there, charged with first-degree murder and both have criminal records and they're suspected of a shooting that happened on friday when nykea aldridge was just pushing her babeny a stroller. she had a baby in a stroller walking down chicago's south side. now, this, alex, was after she was registering her other kids at school, and she was caught in the cross fire right in broad daylight, shot once in the head, one in the arm. pastor jolinda wade, dwyane wade's mother, spoke about how this happened to the family and how this was a stray bullet that caught her niece's head. and to give you a sense of how big this is, there have been reports of 20 injured and 3 killed by gun violence just this weekend. in the meantime, there are two prayer vigils being held today all in honor of nykea aldridge. alex? >> that's in less than 48 hours. i mean, it's just unbelievable

these statistics, thank you for that update to include what the chicago pd had to say about this. let's bring in ben jealous, former president of the naacp, to have a look at what he has to say about this. what is your reaction to all this frustration that's expressed by the police chief in chicago, as i do say welcome to you, my friend. thanks for being here. >> oh, thank you. it's great to be here. look, you know, i feel for him and i get it. my family has lost someone to gun violence. and when you live in a city and you work in a city where people are killed day after day, week after week, whether it's baltimore or chicago, your heart gets heavy and you get kind of sick and tired of having a heavy heart. you're feeling sad, and quite frankly, you know, being worried each day when you wake up about cousins, about family members, about friends. >> you know, morgan radford, the reporter there, she made the point that it's unfortunate that it takes an nba star, dwyane wade, his cousin being shot to bring this again to the forefront, when you look at the stats of all those that are being shot. i want to also ask you about the

controversy over san francisco quarterback colin kaepernick and his decision. as you know, he did not rise for the national anthem at the start of saturday's preseason game. here's what he said in a statement. and this is to nfl media, a quote -- "i am not going to stand up to show pride in a flag for a country that oppresses black people and people of color. to me, this is bigger than football, and it would be selfish on my part to look the other way. there are bodies in the street and people getting paid leave and getting away with murder." i think that last part is specifically relevant to officers on paid leave after the officer-involved shootings. that said, what's your reaction to his actions? >> well, i mean, his actions are frankly part of a tradition of protest by black patriots going back to frederick douglass and his fourth of july speech. he, of course, would go on to be the first black federal marshal after being born a slave. and in sports, i think for a lot of people, it reminds them of the spirit of jim brown or of the two black --

>> 1968 olympic athletes, yeah. >> yeah, up there with their fis fists. but frankly, it also should remind us of jack kemp, who was a quarterback, who became, you know, who became a republican candidate but still was very proudly involved in the naacp. and he was asked once, they said, well, you know, how can you be a republican running for president and you know, be such a supporter of civil rights? and he said, you know, i've never had trouble fighting for the rights of men i used to shower with every day. and so, for colin, i mean, he has tapped into, you know, the kind of broader concern in the black community, but he's also, frankly, dealing with, you know, he leads a team with a lot of black players who are worried about how they're treated when they're off the field and the danger that they're in when they're off the field. and frankly, a lot of white players who are worried for them, too. >> yeah, absolutely. and we should say, it's not been

without some pushback. he has certainly received a lot of angry tweets and people saying that, you know, what is afforded to you via this flag? your ability to make millions of dollars as an nfl athlete, should not be ignored here. but the nfl for its part has issued a statement, saying "players are encouraged but not required to stand during the playing of the national anthem." you know, your thoughts on that. >> yeah, look, you know, we are the home of the brave and the land of the free. and the reality is that that's part of our freedom, that we don't you know, this is not h korea. we don't say you must stand and put your hand over the heart this way, you know, when the flag goes up. you know, we as a country think that that's something that should be earned, and that when someone puts their hand over the heart and says the pledge or stands for the national anthem that they're doing that of their free will. so, this is him and his free will. it is his right. and frankly, there's a long tradition of folks who have had similar concerns for, frankly,

for very good reasons across the years. >> yep, and they use their platform to make these things social issues as pell wp let's switch from there to politics, ben, and donald trump's effort to woo minority voters. this survey monkey tracking poll found hillary clinton would win 87% of the african-american vote. trump would muster perhaps 8% of black voters. interpret these numbers for me. what do you make of them? >> look, you know, for roughly nine out of ten black voters, their decision's made up, it's been made up. in some states like pennsylvania, frankly, he could get 0% of the black vote. this is not a fight over the black vote. frankly, he's talking about black people, he's talking about brown people, trying to woo back white voters. he's trying to show that he's concerned while at the same time holding on to his kind of edge with far right, unlikely voters who will only turn out if they see him as extreme as ann coulter wants him to be. so, he's doing this weird dance. but i think we're pretty clear -- you know, maybe ben carson's confused, but the rest

of us are pretty clear that he's not trying to earn our vote. he's simply trying to act like he's concerned and get more of the white vote. >> let's take a listen to what he said when he spoke out yesterday afternoon. let's roll that tape. >> republicans are the party of abraham lincoln. pretty good president, right? pretty good. i said i'm going to be the most presidential president you've ever had, and then i thought about abraham lincoln, and i thought, i don't know, he's pretty tough to beat, right? nothing means more to me than working to make our party the home of the african-american vote once again. used to be. >> so, what's your reaction to those remarks, ben? and do you hear anything from donald trump or the gop that could directly benefit african-american voters? >> you know, the republican party historically was a very different party. it was the party of civil rights. they made a decision about a half century ago to switch from being the party of civil rights,

the party of love, if you will, to being the party of hate and to let the old dixiecrats flood in, starting with barry goldwater, you know, all way through reagan and now trump. trump is, frankly, the logical conclusion of that bad road that that party with a great history but a dismal present has been on for a long time. and him, frankly, bringing up lincoln only contrasts himself to somebody who was qualified to be president, somebody who believed in civil rights, somebody who had courage to stand up for people not like them. he is the opposite of all of that, and i wish he could just see that. i think somewhere in his heart he wants to be a better person, but he has proven incapable of, frankly, being anything but sort of resistantly racist in his remarks, in his perspective. i wish it would get tiring to him. i think it's getting tiring to the rest of the country pretty quickly. >> well, it's interesting. i spoke with a gentleman yesterday who wrote a book about him, spent 20 hours in interviews with him. and he said it is remarkable the

difference between the private donald trump and the public donald trump, bunt fortunately, it seems that the public donald trump would be the one to get into the white house, perhaps the most public place on the planet. so you have that. quickly, is there at all a risk with secretary clinton polling so well among african-americans right now that she and democrats could take their votes for granted? >> look, that's always a concern. it's always a concern. but i think quite frankly, the bigger risk right now is that she's only, you know, some polls show err hup by 10, some show her tied. they seem to average around six, two points outside of the margin in those polls. and if she wants to inch that up, you know, she's going to have to really give folks a real reason to fight forward. it's clear, if you will, that she is for civil rights and she has a good heart on those issues. folks, when you talk to them, and i've traveled all over this country talking to activists in our party, are concerned that they don't see her out there really fighting for working people with, you know, in the

way that they need right now. and it's going to be herhe tpp,g hard for the $15 minimum wage, issues like that that will get folks to see, frankly, their real self-interests. i have no doubt that black folks who turn out to vote will vote for her, that many whites who turn out to vote will vote for her. my concern is will they work for her? will they turn out unlikely voters? donald trump's extreme rhetoric will turn out unlikely voters who share his hate. we need to see, you know, we need our candidate to really come out there and give people a reason to turn out voters to get out there and volunteer. and so far, that's what really concerns me. and i'm really worried, you know, that we're only at max six points outside the margin, and we've still got months to go. >> we sure do. okay. former naacp president ben jealous. thank you, ben. republicans using donald trump's own words against him. what's behind the new tv ad appearing in battleground

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well, i feel better. it's been five minutes. talk about progrs. [ chuckles ] okay. welcome back, everyone. i'm alex witt here at msnbc world headquarters in new york at the half hour. here's what we're monitoring. demolition crews in italy today are tearing down structures rendered unsafe by wednesday's deadly earthquake. no strong aftershocks were reported overnight for the first time, in fact, since that quake. we're ao keeping an eye that tropical disturbance in the caribbean. it is bringing rain to south florida, and it could still become a tropical storm. and in the battle against zika, miami beach is threatening to impose big fines of at least $1,000 against property owners with standing water on their property, which can allow mosquitos to breed. so, to politics, and breaking news information about a debate prep meeting in about an hour from now for donald trump. nbc's kelly o'donnell is joining

me from our washington bureau on that. kelly, good day to you. >> alex, sundays are often the day that donald trump gets together his top advisers and his team in order to hash out things that are happening in the campaign. i've learned that today at about 3:00, he will bring together some key conservative voices -- roger ailes, who's been going through a challenging team leaving his job at fox news, but a longtime confidante of donald trump. in addition, laura ingraham, who's the radio host but also a very prominent figure in republican politics that can give some voice to the debate process. also i can tell you that at this meeting, son-in-law jared kushner, who has strong influence in the campaign, he will be there with daughter ivanka, and we expect that rudy giuliani, who has now taken over being the negotiator with the presidential debate commission, because paul manafort has left the job, resigning recently.

so, they're going to get together about 3:00 today. and how is this different, alex? it's not the typical kind of presidential debate where you find there would be lecterns set up, a time clock, there would be a series of questions going back and forth to rehearse. that is not the donald trump way, i'm told from sources. instead, he likes to have everybody around a table, kind of free form, hashing things out tap talking about approaches to, in this case, attack hillary clinton or talk about different ideas. much less formal. and it is his way, relying heavily on his gut instincts, heavily on his sense that he performs well on television. and perhaps more than anything else, alex, his unpredictability. and we know on the other side, the brooklyn headquarters has a number of people preparing for the debate sessions for hillary clinton, and it is team clinton trying to sort of turn down expectations about how well she would perform. she's been through this before with one-on-one debates. trump has never done a one-on-one debate, even though he had many appearances during

the crowded field during the gop primary. alex? >> he sure did. you know, it's very good, that "washington post" article that talked about the binders full of information. it's as if hillary clinton is studying the entire time over these next 3 1/2, 4 weeks or so. but i'm curious specifically, kelly, about the latest in the clinton campaign push to try to turn red states purple. >> this is something that is a high priority inside clinton world because they see that the polling number supports that she can be much more comfortably confident in some of the places that would typically be battleground states. and so, they can try to expand the map a bit. now, trump's team is trying to shore up some traditional republican places, not really a good sign this late in the campaign. so, one of the best surrogates on this is her running mate, tim kaine, who has been governor of virginia. he is currently senator from virginia and formerly was the head of the dnc. he's been talking about how the clinton team wants to expand the

map. >> a couple of the states that were really close have actually moved into pretty safe, safer territory. virginia's one, colorado's one. but what that means is the states that are real close, okay, now we can really spend a lot of time here. and florida's one of those states. not only massive on the electoral vote side, but also because it is so close, it's a place where we're going to spend a lot of time. >> and of course, we talk about the big expectations for the september 26th debate between clinton and trump. of course, senator kaine and governor pence will have their own debate as well, and it will be interesting to see how they pair up. they have both been members of congress. both have a more mild-mannered approach on the campaign trail. but the high stakes come on september 26th, that first time that trump and clinton are at the same venue, one on one. alex? >> okay. thank you so much, kelly o'donnell. we're going to talk about the new ads being run against

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let's go to a new storm developing in the tropics, also some stormy weather expected in florida. nbc meteorologist rafaarea oraf miranda's here with all of that. >> hey, a busy time right now, tracking multiple storms and threats, the gulf coast and the atlantic seaboard both on the lookout over the next couple days for tropical weather and significant impacts. now, we've been tracking this storm very closely. i am noticing convection starting to wrap around that center of circulation. that tells me that this storm is beginning to get better organized and it's moving into an area that's more favorable for development. so we've been tracking 99l. it could become a depression or a tropical storm over the next day or so. computer model spread still takes the storm anywhere from texas to louisiana, back towards the florida panhandle over the next several days, so that's going to be a lot of uncertainty day by day, so the untire gulf coast on the lookout for what happens there. here's our other storm. this is now tropical depression eight.

this one has been better organized, maybe become a tropical storm over the next day or so, and this should be a close call with the outer banks of the carolinas. cape hatteras as early as monday night could see impacts from tropical storm, that could be tropical storm hermine. a lot to watch, alex. >> thank you for doing so, raphael miranda. let's go back to politics and anti-trump republicans making a last-ditch effort to get trump to drop out of the race for the presidency. political groups report that they will launch a tv ad in some swing state suburbs. let's take a look. >> and if i was dropping in the polls where i saw that i wasn't going to win, why would i continue? i believe in polls. you know, how many elections do you see where the polls were wrong? not that many. >> let's bring in msnbc contributor katie packer. katie also is deputy campaign manager for mitt romney's 2012 presidential campaign. katie, with a welcome back to the broadcast, i know you describe yourself as a republican but not the trump kind. so, what do you think of this

latest effort? and is there any reason why it would work this time around? because we know the efforts failed leading into the gop convention. >> well, i don't think that these efforts are very likely to succeed in getting donald trump to hear reason and withdraw. i do think that republicans would do better with any republican that had a pulse than they're currently doing with trump, but i don't think that he's likely to see eye to eye with them and withdraw and hear their pleas. so no, i don't think it's going to be successful. >> these are ads. i mean, it costs money. people have to spend money to put them out there. what would the goal then be, as most people would assume your position is correct, he's not likely to drop out? >> yeah, i'm not sure what this group has in mind. i think maybe they're thinking that if they start pushing that some donors might join the effort and rally around them. i just don't think that's likely to happen. i think that the best course really at this point is for republicans to focus their effort on down-balloterations.

we have a lot of senators that are in vulnerable seats that are running well ahead of trump, senators like pat toomey, marco rubio, rob portman, kelly ayotte, others that need republicans' help, and that should be where we're focusing our efforts right now. >> as for the trump campaign, they've certainly dismissed these efertst. politico quotes jason miller as saying "the never trump movement died at the republican convention after it was revealed that they were nothing more than press releases and facebook posts." was that really all the never trump movement was? >> well, i think that the never trump movement, so to speak, is a lot of conscientious conservatives and republicans that have said all along that this was not a conservative, he's not a republican, he's not somebody that stands for the kind of values that we signed up for as republicans. and so, whether or not, you know, it's a widespread movement, there are still plenty of individuals, as seen by the polls, that say that, you know, that trump's only getting about 78% of the republican vote, that there is a huge number of republicans compared to the 93%

that mitt romney got in 2012, that aren't embracing trump's candidacy. that is the never trump legacy. >> well, in terms of that 73%, though, who are at this point, hillary clinton's certainly being critical of the trump campaign's appeal to the so-called alt-right. let's listen to what she said on friday about that. >> disturbing that he is taking hate groups that lived in the dark regions of the internet, making them mainstream, helping a radical fringe take over the republican party. >> what do you get a sense of from the average republican of trump's apparent embrace of the alt-right? >> the average republican is very concerned. i'm very concerned that this is coming to define the republican party in a way that's going to be very, very difficult for us to climb out from under. my hope is that after donald trump loses in november that those folks that came out of the woodwork just because of donald trump and just because of the kind of rhetoric that he

embraces, that maybe they'll just retreat back to their basements and we won't hear from them again, because i don't think that they speak for the republican party as a whole. >> all right. msnbc contributor katie packer. thank you, katie. >> thanks. coming up, the "newsweek" story about how poverty changes the brain in disturbingly frightening ways. and at the top of the hour, chuck todd speaks with rnc chair reince priebus about donald trump's campaign pivoting, the so-called trump 3.0. ♪ ♪

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neuroscience at the university of southern california. with a welcome to you, mary helen, i want to get right to it, because you tracked the development of more than 50 low-income teens over five years. what did you learn about the way they live and how that influenced their development? >> well, first of all, what i'd like to say is that across many labs in the country right now, we're finding that exposure to poverty and the circumstances that surround it, so the kinds of unsafe neighborhoods or bad relationships or bad supports and experiences that people have are shaping the way their brain and biological development are coming over time. and what we're finding with teenagers is that many things can buffer against these bad effects. so high-quality schools, relationships with teachers who are teaching kids how to feel about the world, how to make meaning of their own lives, how to be purposeful and hard-working, and also high-quality relationships in families, the way in which families are holding together and supporting one another and teaching their children how to be resilient and how to change the world for the better and to feel compassion for people.

these kinds of values really support and help people over time to be resilient. >> yeah, you know, look, we've heard all about nutrition and how that affects things. that makes pretty plain and simple sense. but when you talk about being exposed to violence and how that affects the brain, relative to the gray matter. talk about that. >> well, what we're finding is that people who are exposed to a lot of violence, in particular in the community, and in their families, it's almost as if they're teaching their brain to expect the world to be a dangerous or threatening place, and then they go forward acting as if it is. so they are readier to fight, they are more threatened. and those kinds of mind-sets are undermining a persos ability to be productive, to be happy, to be healthy and to learn while in school, in the case of children. >> so, how do the results of these studies, yours and the others across the country, how can they be used to create strategies for early intervention that will eventually mitigate the affects of poverty? >> absolutely. that's the critical thing.

and what these studies are telling us is that we really need to focus on supporting children and families in living in safe and healthy circumstances, having things like parks and community supports and high-quality schools, teachers who are trained to be able to deal with the affects of poverty and to help children and families buffer against it, that the kinds of community supports and societal supports that we can provide for people are changing not just their sort of ability to learn in a direct sense but really their biological and physical health and their brain development going forward. >> all right. well, usc's mary helen immordino-yang, keep up the good work. thank you so much. less than a month away, new information on what donald trump is doing to prepare for the presidential debates and the team he's meeting with today. ♪

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less than one month from the first presidential debate and both candidates are hard at work

preparlg. trump campaign manager kellyanne conway offers a peek into the republican nominee's process. >> he's an unconventional candidate and he's not going to prepare the way hillary does which is, you know, lock her in a room and cram her head with all of these binders. donald trump, the authentic donald trump who's been taking the case to the voters is the one you will see on stage with hillary clinton. and i think they are nervous in the hillary clinton camp. he is the unpredictable x factor. she's the status quo hillary clinton that needs to memorize lines. >> let's bring in former deputy campaign manager for carly fiorina and the former communications director for the rnc. picking up on what she said, if hillary clinton comes in with just memorized lines, given the unpredictability factor of donald trump, how is that going to work? don't you think that is actually an unfair saysment of what hillary clinton is doing?

>> i think what we saw from both candidates in the primaries is neither one are particularly comfortable in the setting. this is an enormously important debate for hillary clinton if she wants to hold the lead she has. has to look like she can go toe to toe with donald trump who will be unpredictable. i assume they are well aware and running debate prep less with scripted lines and more with how to go with the flow, something hillary clinton's had a lot of problems with, especially because she hasn't had a press conference now in 260 plus days. so if she is unwilling to take questions from the press in the sort of royaling press conference format, that's great prep for debate asks her unbeingness to do that doesn't speeg to her confidence. >> nbc just report donald trump has this debate prep meeting in new jersey about on hour from now. there is also a report from the

post describing in more detail. he summance his band of counselors to his new jersey golf course for sunday chatds. they test out zingers and chew over ways to refine his pitch. just by the description it seems so unprecedented this casual approach. do you think trump is taking these debates seriously enough? >> well candidates like, you know, foclks with kids. every candidate learns differently. it is unprecedented in the sense that i don't think that is what a lot of campaigns say they do but absolutely debate prep varies from candidate to candidate. what makes them most comfortable, where they learn the most. and i think for donald trump it is not at all surprising that the have someone play hillary clinton over here, have donald trump stand there, isn't going to be his style. >> that willing said we'll see how they do over the course of the next month. they are probably still very much in the brainstorming stage and may look to put him in the hot seat more as you get closer.

>> and let's talk about the report that said that radio host laura ingram was going to be playing hillary clinton as she stood behind some sort of a podium and would do a mock debate with donald trump. is that the case? >> i hear that is not true. that laurie will not play hillary clinton. i think it would be a really poor fit for laurie ingram. she's more like donald trump. more unpredictable. more feisty. i think kelly ann conway has a much better demeanor to play hillary clinton. background as the pollster. citying in focus groups with liberal women will prepare more to speak the language that clinton speaks and solidify her support. >> i've got about a three second answer to expect from you. which is who stands more to lose? >> oh, hillary clinton has a lot

to lose in this debate. i think she's going and trying to lower expectations and that is going to be tough against donald trump. >> thank you so much for that. and that is a wrap of the hour. i'm alex witt. thanks for watching. up next on "meet the press," chuck todd. ♪ don't just eat. ♪ mangia! bertolli. proof of less joint pain.

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this sunday, trump this sunday, trump3.0. is he now against deporting undocumented immigrants? >> there certainly could be a softening. because we're not looking to hurt people. >> there no path to legal zagsz unless people leave the country. >> plus the clinton foundation under fire in a pay for play accusation. if hillary clinton wins will the foundation need to be shout down? finally the toxic state of this campaign. >> through it all he has continued pushing discredited ns