tomorrow, well, that's the unofficial beginning of the end of the election, and you can imagine that. and as both campaigns hit the road full bore now, immigration is the hot topic of the week. the focus, if donald trump and his camp can say if all of the more than 11 million undocumented immigrants will be deported or not. vice presidential nominee mike pence unable to specifically answer nbc's chuck todd on today's "meet the press" on that topic. >> donald trump's made it very, very clear that in his ten-point plan, we're going to build a wall, we're going to enforce the laws of this country, end catch-and-release. we're going to do all of the things that politicians in both political parties have been talking about for more than a generation. he's also said there will be no amnesty and path to legalization. if people want to get legalized or want to get right under the color of the law, they need to leave the country, but he also said -- >> nobody becomes legal in this country without leaving the country? >> chuck, he also said -- >> this is where we get

confused. >> he also said it's not going to be under the existing caps and existing program, but rather, it's going to be under a new and reformed immigration program. >> is it fair to say that you're not going to answer this question about the 11 million? not just you, but the campaign? you're going to leave this as an open question throughout the rest of the campaign? >> i think donald trump's been completely consistent and i think he did answer the question. >> well, trump surrogate rudy giuliani also muddle ad the deportation plan for noncriminals today. >> after we secure the border and after we remove the criminal illegal immigrants to a large extent -- you're never going to get to 100% -- then and only then can we look at this in a very rational way in which we can look at all the options and be open to all of the options. >> and he doesn't want to separate families, as you say? >> well, i would say that would be one of the things that would be pretty clear. there are other options, too. i mean, it's going to depend on the person. i mean, some of these people could have been on welfare for the last 30 years or taking

benefits or cheating, and maybe some of them have to be thrown out. but not necessarily all of them. >> and that's where it stands. nbc's hallie jackson following the trump campaign for us, with us here today. i guess they're doubling down on a double immigration message so far. >> i don't even know what words to use sometimes to describe it, anyway. immigration in the spotlight again today. you saw that from donald trump surrogates on the sunday shows who had to answer on where he stood on the issue of the undocumented immigrants who have not committed other crimes. that's been the question mark. the campaign says privately, listen, let's secure the border, let's do these things that we know we're going to do, that we can try to get broad consensus on, and then after we emphasize those who have been here who have committed other crimes, violent criminals and such, then we can deal with the undocumented. that is what you heard chris christie say. listen to a little bit of that from this morning. >> once we remove those 2 to 3 million from the country, return them to their countries of origin, because of their criminal conduct, then i think what donald trump wants to do is

take a deep breath and look at where we are in the country then and find a humane way to deal with those who remain. and so, i think what he's talking about is a pause after the 2 to 3 million get put out of the country because they're committing crimes, hurting americans, selling drugs, doing things that are illegal. once those people are dealt with first -- and i think everyone agrees on that issue -- then we can deal with the remaining 8 million people. >> so, this is what you're hearing from team trump out today. let me tell you what you're hearing now from team clinton within the last couple of hours, out with a statement, seizing on this immigration, which you, richard, called a muddled message. "what we saw today is mike pence," on "meet the press," by the way, with chuck todd, "and trump's top campaign officials attempt to mislead voters about their mass deportation policy by using soft words to describe harsh tactics -- one of the oldest tricks in the book," says hillary clinton's campaign manager, adding that "trump's message to immigrant families is clear, everyone must go." the clinton came pain sees an

opening and an opportunity, given where the general election electorate is, as opposed to the republican base during the primaries p. primaries. the question is what will trump do over the coming weeks to clarify this or to put another issue on the front burner, like national security, where he seems to be on more comfortable ground. >> since you're talking about the next couple weeks, there are opportunities for donald trump and surrogates to make clarifications here? >> sure. and interesting to know, chris christie, we haven't seen him out as a surrogate in such a high-profile way in a while, so interesting that he's back in the mix. as for where donald trump is, what i find interesting is he is turning to more traditional swing states. remember, we saw him in places like, gosh, georgia, connecticut, at one point i think he was in mississippi, places that you wouldn't think a republican candidate would be going. >> no. >> where is he this week? north carolina. he's heading to florida. we know that. >> early voting state. >> well, exactly! and the thing, is his campaign has been saying for a while, after labor day we will really kick it into gear and he is now

competing in some of the more traditional states. new york city, you may go, huh? remember, that's our commander in chief forum wednesday night. >> there you go, with matt lauer. thank you so much, hallie jackson. great to have you. >> you, too. >> joining us now is democratic congressman loretta sanchez, a clinton supporter and member of the caucus. thank you for being with us this sunday. let's start with this, secretary clinton not necessarily polling drastically better than previous democratic nominees with latino americans, especially when we're talking about the issue of immigration. what's your thought here? why has she not been able to capitalize on what appears to be a topsy-turvy trump immigration message? >> well, first of all, i think that latinos have taken a look at what has happened over the last eight years of obama and have probably said, you know, are we going to vote? and i keep telling them, of course we're going to vote! and if you take a look at some of the policies, some of the last immigration pieces that were passed with respect to the congress, where they passed as

actual laws, for tps and other issues that bill clinton helped to push through the congress. so i think we're going to see an ally in hillary clinton. i think it's just taking a little bit of time to see that. >> you know, there's something you're very familiar with, and that's spanish-language ads, something we've not seen a lot from the clinton campaign so far, this has we've seen some of the support that the recent "washington post"/abc poll, showing that latino american support has dropped by 16 percentage points. do you think it's because of the lack of spanish-language ads so far? >> well, i think a lot of -- there is a lot of on-the-ground work being done, especially by the clinton campaign. i haven't seen it by the trump campaign, but certainly, in key places where secretary clinton wants to pick up the vote, like nevada, for example. we know, and i've seen it -- i've gone in and i've campaigned for harry reid before, where we've seen 400 and 600-vote

differences, and that was because latinos came out and gave him a victory. so i think that she's investing in the ground game along with senate campaigns, congressional campaigns and local elections so that we can get that vote out. and that's really how you bring the latino vote out. you have to go door to door and you have to talk to them. >> door to door. and this is something you're doing, running for senate in california at the moment, something you know very, very well. how does she reach english-speaking latino-american millennials? you know that group that, the tip of the spear of the millennial vote that is out there today, and they're up for play right now. >> well, actually, you reach them the way you reach any millennials. it's by texting, it's by social media. we know that many of the millennials don't have a tv or they don't watch tv. they get all of their information off that handheld device. i see with my 16 and 17-year-old nieces. they talk to each other even when they're sitting across the

table, they're talking to each other and they're texting. so that is the median in which you can reach the millennial. and i know because the millennials in the polls are with me in this u.s. senate race. >> there you go. well done at getting that messaging out there, representative. i want to get your response from some of the critics of secretary clinton and her unfavorability so far, at least in the polling we've seen so far. take a listen to what was said today. >> hillary clinton is having a hard time being accepted as a truthful and honest candidate. >> the essence of hillary clinton is she's a political insider who over and over again has not told the truth to the american people and who thinks there's a different set of rules that apply to her than everybody else. >> hillary clinton is the most dishonest candidate for president of the united states since richard nixon. >> and when we look at another number here, the "washington post"/abc news poll, 56% see her unfavorably. how does she turn this around? this is not the first cycle that we've heard this criticism.

but the fbi release on friday certainly added more kindling to this argument. >> well, certainly, first of all, think about this. there has been a lot of money spent over years, almost decades now, against the clintons. and you know, money and ads and disinformation are very -- you know, they start to stick if you say it loud enough and long enough. so how does she get past that? i think people have to see her in her natural settings. she is so good in smaller groups, and they can see the sincerity of her. that's how i know her. and i hope that she will get out. i know she's a good campaigner. when she was first lady, quite honestly, she kept a lot of democrats in their seats because she would go around and campaign for them, and people could see that sincerity in a more closed situation. >> right. >> so, i think that that's really what she needs to do is get out on the campaign trail and not be afraid.

>> and she hasn't. it's been over 270 days since we've seen a news briefing with her. that's an opportunity, certainly, that you're underlining, but she's done quite well on the fund-raising side, as you were intimating here, over $140 million is the number we've got in july -- >> clearly -- >> but let me get to this because i know you're running for senate in california, as i mentioned everly arlier, and am your supporters, republican congressman darrell issa. the two of you appeared together in his district this past week. i just want to share a little bit about what isa has said about hillary clinton to breitbart news back in july and get your response. >> we are in a crisis because hillary clinton, if the voters do not stop her, will be the next president of the united states. she will, in fact, on day one say, pardon me -- and she'll mean it. she will have pardoned herself." >> so, representative, do you agree with congressman issa? and how do you reconcile his

support for you and what he's saying about the candidate you're supporting? >> well, first let me say that i was in his district on official business. it was a bipartisan delegation of five people, three democrats and two republicans. and we were doing the work of the military committee, which is where i am a top person. i'm in the top wrung of the military committee. it happened to be that the bases were in representative issa's district. and so, as is custom, he also was there with the military members. so, the fact that he would say loretta has worked with us in a bipartisan manner, she gets defense. of course i do. i've got 22 years experience. and what he was acknowledging was that my opponent has none of that. you know, she doesn't know our generals and our admirals. she's never worked on national security issues. she hasn't met with the foreign leaders. and so, he was just saying, look, i've looked at these two

candidates, and i know who i'm going to be voting for. clearly, loretta is the better choice. i like her on national security. i like her on international relations. oh, and the other thing he said was, by the way, i don't agree on a lot of issues with her. >> from the great state of california, my home state, congresswoman loretta sanchez. always good to see you. appreciate the time. >> thank you so much. we're also watching this breaking story over the weekend. it is hermine, the slow-moving storm. it has straen strengthened, bringing the risk of coastal flooding from atlantic city to coastal delaware tonight and tomorrow. new jersey governor chris christie telling residents, despite the nice weather on the jersey shore today, do not venture into the water. >> urge people to be careful, listen to your lifeguards and municipal officials about being in the ocean or not, because rip currents are going to get fairly aggressive, even before you see any other type of outward manifestations of the storm. >> there in new jersey for us,

nbc's tammy leitner at seaside heights, new jersey. and tammy, so, when we were talking yesterday, the weather was fairly moderate. it looks fairly moderate today, but it could be fooling or not fully telling of what might happen in the future. >> reporter: yeah, that's right. you know, the wind has been kicking up and down, the current is everywhere, the ocean is just swirling out there, but one thing that they've done to make sure that things don't get too bad is they've piled up these sand berms here about 10 to 12 feet high. now, the main goal here is to make sure that it does not get up to the boardwalk. on the boardwalk just on the other side, there is row after row after row of business, and we want to keep the water out of those. that's their goal. as you can see, a lot of people are still out here today enjoying the day, taking their chances, they say, on the weather. we've talked to a few people. let's listen to what they had to say. >> you have to prepare because you never know. like, it's not as bad right now as they say, but in a quick second, it can change. i mean, we've all lived through that. so i mean, it's not as bad as

sandy, but it's still, you know, a concern. yeah, it's actually a gorgeous day out. you know, it's not that busy here. people really didn't, you know, think it was going to be this nice. but as you can see, it's definitely not a day to go swimming. >> reporter: the swells have been 6 to 8 feet out here, and the water has been coming up. one thing they are concerned about is high tide tonight. it is at about 10:00, so they will definitely be monitoring this area. richard? >> all right, tammy leitner at seaside heights, new jersey, for us, on the coast watching what is happening with hermine. now we go to msnbc meteorologist bonnie schneider. i was just saying here to tammy, look out. >> it's really coastal flooding and beach erosion that's our biggest concern with hermine, because the storm did take more of an easterly path, at least in the computer models, which is a good thing that we're getting the sunshine, but we still have some danger to contend with. right now the storm is 300 miles to the south-southeast of the tip of long island, around montauk. and the winds are at 70 and the storm has slowed down as we

thought it would. that's really the problem with the storm slowing down, unfortunately, but it is leaving a lot of rain well offshore, so that's why the jersey shore is dry right now, but the clouds coming up to chincoteague, not quite yet in the south shore of long island. but notice the track for hermine. the storm eventually makes a northerly turn, and eventually, a turn to the northwest. so that takes it a little closer to the jersey shore, to the south shore of long island, to the south coast of massachusetts. and all of that being will kick up the risk for coastal flooding. how much and how bad will it be? depends where you are. if you're in the carolinas, out to chincoteague, you're looking at 1 to 3 feet, above normal, above high tide times. this is where it's going to get tricky, right here, in south jersey. if you're south of atlantic city, like in cape may to delaware bay, delaware coast, and even into areas all the way in coastal virginia, 3 to 5 feet. and that's what we're looking at in terms of more danger for coastal flooding. this will likely occur on monday at the time of high tide, also a

risk further north along the jersey coast. and finally, a risk toward long island but less of a risk there. monday morning high tide, richard, that's where we're watching really all of these places for the threat for coastal flooding. >> keeping an eye on that for us, hermine. thank you so much, bonnie schneider, meteorologist for msnbc. up next, donald trump steps up his outreach to african-american voters in a detroit black church, reading judiciously from prepared remarks and a prayer shawl. the reaction so far? let's feed him to the sharks! squuuuack, let's feed him to the sharks! yay! and take all of his gold! and take all of his gold! ya! and hide it from the crew! ya...? squuuuack, they're all morons anyway! i never said that. they all smell bad too. no! you all smell wonderful! i smell bad! if you're a parrot, you repeat things. it's what you do. if you want to save fifteen percent or more on car insurance, you switch to geico. it's what you do. squuuuack, it's what you do.

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communicates to others about us, at us, but never with us. >> pastor lawrence glass of detroit not buying donald trump's outreach to black voters, as you heard there. trump visited a black church for the first time on saturday, part of his effort to try to get minority voter support. some observers say that the whole event was awkward. yet, many gave him credit for the effort. is it enough, though, to chip away at the lead that his opponent has among african-american voters? and for more on this, we want to bring in richaud robinson with color of change and also missouri state senator maria chapel nadal. both of you, great seeing you again. it's been a while since we've spoken. i'll go to you first, marie, if you can for us. when we look at the messaging that is coming from donald trump, and you saw the reaction there in detroit, one of those major, rich african-american communities over the decades, and he's coming forward and

saying the words ignorance and condescending, would you agree with his statements about donald trump's effort to reach out to the african-american community there? >> you know, much of what donald trump is doing is patronizing a community that has been disenfranchised in many different ways. and one of the things that i would like to urge donald trump in doing is talking to people who have lived the reality of day-to-day life. he has not done the adequate job that he should have been doing quite a long time, and so, that is why it's quite essential for him to understand. and until he really understands what people are going through in the african-american community, the patronage that he is offering us is not going to do much at all. >> right. as you and i spoke about this very topic, that the time that it takes to understand the dynamics, when you and i were in ferguson, and also when you and i were in ferguson as well,

richaud, talking about the topic and the african-american and where it's at, there is a history of what donald trump has said in the past, that the african-american community is listening to you. and i just want to go back to some of his comments that he made about president obama and where he was born. >> if everybody apologized for all the things they said in politics -- >> okay, it's rudy giuliani, excuse me, making a comment about that very topic. let's listen to rudy giuliani. >> if everybody apologized for all the things they said in politics, all we'd be doing on television shows is apologizing. maybe a lot of the democrats should apologize for calling donald trump a racist and calling him all kinds of terrible names. it gets a little silly. let's get down to the basic issue here. for years, people say republicans don't reach out to the african-american community. well, he reached out to the african-american community. >> so, he was asked there about

whether trump should apologize for his birther campaign quote/unquote earlier on. should he? >> look, there was a moment to do it, do it inside of a church where you're seeking redemption, where you're ieng up for your mistakes, where you're seeking to reach out to a community and build a new path forward. that would have been the perfect opportunity. but let's be clear, donald trump is a 70-plus-year-old man with no meaningful relationships in the black community. he has people introducing him at events that he doesn't even know. we find out, you know, days later that these people have, you know, falsified statements about themselves. these are his black surrogates, that he has no real relationship with. he has less than 70 days now to try to attempt to make a new statement about himself, to introduce himself new. and it's simply not working because at the end of the day, donald trump is not trying to get the black vote. he's trying to have a conversation with white moderates who see the racist things that he's been saying, who feel uncomfortable with it. and what i have to say to white folks who are watching, who may

feel some affinity for what donald trump is saying, that donald trump is starting with black and latinos now, but he's going to continue to go to community after community. he's going to go to poor folks, because he -- poor white folks, because he doesn't have an agenda for them, either. for all of us, we've got to be in this together because donald trump is attacking many communities. >> state senator in one of the communities that he reached out was to detroit, but many are saying he should reach out to more african-american communities. and as he does that, state senator, he was saying that the democrats have done no better, so why not give me a chance? you have nothing to lose. and he's alluding, potentially here, for instance in detroit, to a poverty rate for african-americans that's four out of ten. >> well, you know, let's just admit it, just about a week ago, donald trump also talked about the fact that we have plenty of immigrant gang members in ferguson, which is untrue. we have to recognize that we are dealing with a faux candidate

that we honestly have to take seriously. and he's not only an embarrassment to this electoral process, but he is also an embarrassment to the entire world. if we have a donald trump president, we are inevitably going to be in a situation where there is a russia or a china that is a superpower instead of the united states. and i urge every single american, regardless of what party we belong to, to understand that this is a faux candidate that is reckless in what he says and what he does, and he is completely inconsistent with everything that we stand for as americans. >> rashad, one of the points that donald trump likes to make is that hillary clinton once used the term superpredators and gangs of kids being that, and that specifically was alluding to african-american youth. when we look at 2016, we're

seeing some of those being brought up on both sides as points about understanding the african-american community. how do we need to be talking about race today, especially after 2014 and 2015 when we saw all across our country real existential questions? >> well, the question for black voters in this election cycle -- because we have worked to push hillary clinton and hold her accountable. folks have protested her. and we will continue to hold all candidates accountable. but the question is, who do we have leverage with? who's going to be concerned and interested about our needs? and who is going to be worried about disappointing us? and we recognize that, you know, for better or for worse, we don't have as many choices as we want, but we do have a candidate in hillary clinton who at the very least will come into our community, have real conversation, and that we have real leverage over. and we have a candidate in donald trump that will throw fire grenades into the community, put out facts that are not true. you know, over the last couple

of weeks, he continues to put out this number of 54% of black youth are unemployed, and he says this over and over again. he's counting high school kids in that number. >> well, by the same measure, the "washington post" says also young white youth are close to that number, 50% is their calculation, so -- >> so, it's this idea. he talked about detroit and going down the street on the weekend and people are sitting out on the street corners. people are on their weekend. and so, donald trump has this idea of black folks and who we are and what our potential is that we simply cannot afford to have him in the white house. >> my friends, rashad robinson, thank you so much for stopping by. state senator maria chappelle-nadal, good seeing you as well. have a good holiday. >> thank you. hermine still a threat to bring serious flooding to the atlantic coast. a live update. mastery is a journey of continuous improvement. come triumph, or trial,

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the hour for you. we want to get you up to date on the stories we're watching here on msnbc. and of course, hermine continuing to gain strength, even as it moves further away from the east coast. that storm's winds now up to 70 miles an hour, churning up dangerous waves and currents along the east coast. we're watching that along with the weather channel's scott newell, who joins us from cape may, new jersey. and scott, how do the surges look and what should we be looking out for in the coming days? >> reporter: well, as you might be able to see, it's actually a pretty nice day here because the storm is so far offshore, not impacting this area right now. in fact, it's sunny, the air is dry. we've got a north-northeast winds at about 20 miles an hour, so it's kind of pleasant. but the big thing here, the big story is beach erosion. ideally, you would like to see that point between those rocks back there and me to be almost a straight line, but you can see the shore is scalloped out. so hermine has had an effect on beach erosion.

it's been significant here. they sent up a drone here last week to measure where the shore was, and they're going to send up a drone next week and compare the two things. and then in november, they will replenish the sand. so, it has had a significant impact. and what they're going to do also is watch for high tide tomorrow. depending on where the storm goes, if the high tide coincides with a storm surge, there could be more beach erosion here, but dangers of it getting into the buildings here pretty low at this point. it has impacted a lot of people who have come out here for a holiday vacation. scott fisher from eastern p.a. is here with me. what were your original plans here and how did you alter them or not alter them? >> original plans, we came down thursday night. actually, our entire family came down for a long labor day weekend and had intentions of staying throughout the weekend. little by little, a few people left, but we hung in there. and thankfully, we did, because it's been a beautiful day today. a little windy but very nice. i think the forecast for tomorrow is good. so, we're glad we hung in there. >> reporter: must have been a tough decision. you have been here many years.

>> many years. >> reporter: and you've looked at this beach and you've seen the erosion, right? tell me how it is this year compared to last years. >> okay, this spot here, for the last 25 years, we've sat right here. this is our spot on this beach. it's a beautiful beach. but we've never quite seen what's happened here, the sand coming in and filling in the brick water and leveling it out across there. so it's quite a sight. erosion is not uncommon here, and they do a great job of reclamation and straightening it out every year, but it's kind of a strange look for cape may beach. >> reporter: all right, scott. thank you so much. glad you got a chance to enjoy your vacation. hopefully tomorrow things will be good. >> all right. thank you so much. >> reporter: all right. so, that's the situation here, richard. really a lot of people who stuck it out here, they really got a bit of a reward with a nice day today and hopefully tomorrow things will be okay as well, but we still have to see what mother nature is going to hand us. back to you, richard. >> yep. it's a nice day. and as they say in california, some good holas out there. appreciate that, weather

channel's scott newly in cape may, new jersey, with the waves behind him. it was a joyful celebration at the vatican, thousands gathering to witness the canonization of mother teresa. we will go there live for you. and hillary clinton heading back on the campaign trail and taking some big names with her. (vo) stank face. a universal expression of disgust, often caused by inadequate cat litter. if you or your a loved one suffers from stank face, the cure is tidy cats. it's new and improved with guaranteed tidylock protection that locks away odors. so you don't have to face one more stank face. tidy cats. every home, every cat. there's a tidy cats for that.

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opportunities don't wait around, so you have to be ready for them. find out how american express cards and services can help prepare you for growth at open.com. and welcome back. it's just 65 days until election day, and hillary clinton is leading the real clear politics average by just under four percentage points. recent polls showing trump getting closer. the trump campaign is revving up the ad machine, meanwhile, buying time on the airwaves in five swing states this weekend -- nevada, colorado, iowa, virginia and new hampshire. clinton, meanwhile, raising a staggering amount of money in the month of august, $143 million, most going to the democratic party. now, the lead-up to the super bowl of politics, election day, there's going to be a series of one-on-one debates. the first one in three weeks. joining me now is daniel

strouse, politics reporter at politico. we also have jameel smith, senior national correspondent for mtv news and nan hayworth, former republican congresswoman from new york. nan, let's look at this. as we look at the closing poll numbers, as expected -- and all of you will probably agree with this -- we're at half the gap that we were before the conventions, but where most of that has closed is not necessarily donald trump gaining, but hillary clinton, secretary clinton losing and johnson and stein getting a little bit of a bump. why is this happening this way? >> well, i think people have had a chance to look at both candidates, both major party candidates, i should say. there's been a tremendous amount of bad news for hillary clinton concerning her competence, her reliability, her ability to do this job. meanwhile, she's hold up with successive bunches of wealthy people instead of being out among the public she's supposed

to serve. it's not really an attractive picture, and i think that's why a lot of people are looking at hillary clinton, saying you know what, if i'm interested in the social libertarian argument, i'll go with gary johnson. >> i want to go with the mtv guy, our young expert for a second. let's talk about young voters, and that might be part of it here. because i was looking at a number from politico, heading out to you, my friend, daniel. and that is at 24% of the young voters are going to johnson and stein right now. is that a problem going forward? >> well, i don't necessarily see it as a problem. i think first of all, she's going it be a lot more visible in the coming weeks. i think a lot of people are starting to tune into the election and they're going to see her at the labor day parade in cleveland, they're going to see her, you know, holding rallies going forward. so i think that that's a minor thing -- >> still avoiding the press. >> well, but that's -- no one's making their voting decision based on her not having a press conference. i think what we're -- but the point is that with young voters, i really think that johnson and stein may have kind of capped

down on them because they don't have the money to reach them. they don't have money to, say like in daniel's report, do more than radio ads. you're not going to reach the young voter with radio ads. >> daniel, i want to go to this on you. your colleague reporting today on the clinton team and their debate prep as we move into the topic of what's going forward, right, because as we move into monday, this is when they're all gearing up and they're practicing is what we're hearing. they've got their plans together. he writes, "clinton friends say she is leaving open the possibility that trump only agrees to one debate." they also expect him to threatening pulling out of the debate in the weeks leading up to it as a way to heighten the drama along the way and to agitate for the inclusion of libertarian candidate gary johnson." so, that may fit in here with th that, that gary johnson might be the clinton spoiler. what are you hearing in terms of his potential withdrawal of these debates? >> listen, we hear that it's entirely possible, and we've seen this before in the primaries, right?

donald trump skipped one of the gop primary debates, and that made it more of a spectacle. the real question, though, in this, is does gary johnson even get enough leverage to get into one of these debates? he's really a few points short of the 15-point threshold to get in there. and maybe he is getting 24% of the support of young voters, but he's still outside the range he needs to be in to get into these debates and really cause a problem. so, until he gets into that range, it's going to be a lot of smoke from trump. >> yeah, yeah. i want to go to this quickly, because as we talk about these very close races and the essential part that these debates hold in trying to swing the numbers here, there's a new cbs battleground polls out today that show clinton is leading in north carolina by four, pennsylvania by eight. kellyanne conway, the trump campaign manager, this morning discusses their chances in pennsylvania. take a listen. >> can you win without pennsylvania? >> yes, we can. absolutely. we have several different paths to victory.

we're just making amends this week with absentee ballot outreach, with ads in about 10, 11, 12 states. pennsylvania's one of them. >> so, trump is headed to the home state of two of our analysts, our guests today, and that's both jameel and nan, and that's ohio. so, let's do talk about that, because when you do look at ohio, where the race is considerably tighter than pennsylvania at the moment, without pennsylvania, ohio is a necessity. your thoughts here, jameel? >> well, my thought is that he's got to make sure he secures the support of the republican party in ohio. frankly, you have a lot of people turned off there, pro-kasich people. frankly, i'd like to see how he appeals strictly to those people who voted for kasich, voted for cruz, who didn't let him win that state. >> and nan, a part of this is as we look at ohio, early voting state, north carolina, we look at where trump is going in the coming weeks, they're going to these early voting states. is that what is in the crosshairs right now, so essential in his outreach? >> of course. and i think jamil's exactly

right, donald trump does have to follow certain rules of conventional politics and one of them is shoring up your base. and speaking as a republican, it's very clear that republicans have to vote strategically if we want to recognize -- >> strategically meaning vote for somebody who you might not support? >> right, vote for donald trump even if you're not 100% with every position of his. i'm not either, necessarily. but if we want to get the kind of economic jump that we truly need, that young people need, that african-american communities need, that everybody needs, the only way to do it is with a program that donald trump is offering. >> so, daniel, as we look at these early voting states, we also have that first debate that's coming up, very essential here to get these early voters, and it may or may not favor donald trump based on these polling numbers. >> well, look, i mean, he's definitely coming into the first debate as the underdog here, right? and he thrives in debates. that's where he was able to really vanquish his foes in the primary. so if there's any point where donald trump can turn this

around, it's in one of these debates. >> so, there's nothing to watch, basically, for us coming up in that first debate? there are no factors related to any of this. >> i think -- >> daniel strauss, thank you so much, jamil smith, nan hayworth, i appreciate you being here on a sunday. it is three days until hillary clinton and donald trump's first joint event of the general election season. the issue are service members and veterans. we will preview nbc's commander in chief forum. if you have a typical airline credit card, you only earn double miles when you buy stuff from that airline. wait...is this where you typically shop? you should be getting double miles on every purchase! switch...to the capital one venture card. with venture, you earn unlimited double miles on every purchase, everywhere, every day. not just ...(dismissively) airline purchases. seriously... double miles... everywhere. what's in your wallet?

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the atmosphere here was, how can i say, somber and festive at the same time, but it bore a huge significance for the more than 120 thuz who came here to st. peter's square from all over the world, many of them, of course, from the u.s., because to them, even though pope francis elev e elevaelevat elevated mother teresa to sainthood only today, for them, she's been a saint all along for decades, even before she died 19 years ago almost to the day. because of her lifelong dedication to the poor and the homeless, the poorest among the poor, as she calls them, richard. >> nbc's claudio lavanga, thank you so much. mother teresa now being a saint. 785 women named as saints. tomorrow, of course, is labor day. for millions, it is one day to enenjoy the summer. but the true meaning of the holiday is to show respect to the working men and working women.

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well, this wednesday night, an historic first will take place in presidential campaigns. both candidates will take part in the first ever commander in chief forum right here on msnbc and nbc news. for one hour, they will be answering questions on military affairs and veterans issues from host matt lauer and an audience of veterans and military members. and there's a lot of issues the next president will be faced with, starting with the fixing certain issues. right now, over 500,000 veterans have been waiting a month or longer for a doctor's appointment, according to the latest va numbers. suicide among veterans is an epidemic at over 20 people a day. and earlier this year, congress was considering massive cuts to the post-9/11 gi bill.

for more, i'm joined by retired army captain emily jaslo. captain, thanks for being with us. let's just dive straight into the topics that are so essential to this community and the one that we brought up just a second ago, 20 veterans committing suicide a day. and that's something that certainly you want addressed during this forum. >> absolutely. i mean, not only is it touching so many american families, but as a veteran myself, i have a number of friends who either struggle with mental illness or who have committed suicide themselves. it's something that we should address as a country. we've made a little bit of progress, but everyone should be disappointed with the fact that it's still over 20 vets a day that are dying. >> and there's also the issue of homelessness in this community that is so dear to us. >> yes. you know, it's something that the obama administration made a priority, but i'd say that there are a lot of statistics that were pushed out. but there's still a lot of work to do on that issue as well.

you know, it's something, again, you don't want to see veterans having such a high suicide rate and veterans who are homeless on the street is something that i don't think our nation should tolerate. >> what's the one question you would ask? >> you know, i think that we're going to have an incredible experience this week. you know, all too often, candidates and even elected officials figure out a way to have veterans and service members on the stage with them, but all too often, they neglect to actually engage them in a dialogue. so for the first time ever, on a national stage, these two candidates are going to be interviewed directly from the folks who they're going to have to be a commander in chief to. >> and captain, you were saying you're just so jazzed, if i may use this, about this first ever. and you will get to hear the voices of folks like yourself and other veterans and veterans' families. what's the energy like that you're seeing from the veteran community that their voices will be heard one on one? >> well, i mean, like i said,

it's an unparalleled experience and opportunity. and these are two candidates who don't know how it was to walk in my shoes, and they honestly don't know how it was to be my mom worried about me when i was deployed twice to iraq. so it's really important for them to make the case to that audience this week that they are the person who can be commander in chief, who gets their experience, and who also is going to take serious what it means to send them off to war. >> that's an essential responsibility of being commander in chief. and so, when you think about that, what is it that you hope that yourself as a veteran, as a captain, and others want to hear in response to that question? >> i think more than anything else, one, not only is it really understanding and feeling person to person, that they understand what that means, but they also need to be able to articulate not just foreign policy but also how they stand on a number of very important veterans issues. you know, we have an

all-volunteer army these days. less than 1% served in the most recent wars. and how you take care of veterans is a readiness issue. and if you want people to still step up and to serve and to make sure that this country stays as great as it is, you need to make the case that when they come home, they're not going to go back to a crumbled va, that the benefits that they fought for, that they thought they were going to get when they got home, that they're going to be protected, they earned them, they deserve them, and they need to see two people on stage this week who get that. >> they will not be easy questions. they'll be tough questions about our military family, that is all of our american family, certainly, on this labor day and as we go forward to this commander in chief forum. thank you so much, captain, for your service and for putting this together. very important. >> absolutely. thank you for hosting it with us. >> you bet. allison jaslow there, former captain in the army. thank you so much. nbc's matt lauer will moderate the nbc news and msnbc commander in chief forum wednesday from new york's intrepid sea, air and space museum. it is quite a vehicle, shall i

say? the one-hour event will simulcast live wednesday at 8:00 p.m. eastern on nbc and msnbc. there will also be a live stream on nbcnews.com. that's all for this hour of "msnbc live." i'm richard lui. more the latest, go to msnbc.com. 73% of americans try... ...to cook healthy meals. yet up to 90% fall short in getting key nutrients from food alone. let's do more... ...add one a day men's 50+. complete with key nutrients we may need. plus it helps support healthy blood pressure with vitamin d and magnesium.

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