dw good day to you. i'm kristen welker coming to you from new york. the gop nominee using rude language talking about groping and kissing women. around three dozen republicans now distancing themselves from the top of their ticket. now the first resmons from trump the wife melania calling her husband's worse unacceptable. the latest crisis in trump's campaign and he's vowing to stay in the race. trump saying there's zero chance he's stepping down. this tweet just out "the media and establishment want me out of the race so badly. i will never drop out of the race. will never let my supporters down." that last part is all in caps. this after audio was leaked about offensive comments made back in 2009 happened on a hot mike i "access hollywood," parent economy of nbc news and msnbc. trump's wife melania weighed in,

"the words my husband used are enacceptable to me." trump did apologize for his remarks last night in a video releases on his facebook page. take a look. >> i've never said i'm a perfect person. nor pretended to be someone that i'm not. i've said and done things i regret and the words released today on this more than a decade-old video are one of them. anyone who knows me knows these words don't reflect who i am. i said it. i was wrong, and i apologize. >> now trump was supposed to be in wisconsin today joining paul ryan at an event, but ryan disinvited him, and that is where we find nbc's jacob rascon at the fall fest. you've been talking to trump is a poresupporters and always have guest conversations with them. what are they saying? >> reporter: a lot of them

probably didn't show up because they found out trump was coming anyway, when we told hem pence wasn't coming, very disappointed. they're not bothered by the tape. they think hillary clinton's mistakes are worse than his and this is about the debt, trillions in debt and isis and other issues more important to them. behind me on the stage, governor scott walker, where trump and paul ryan were supposed to be together for the first time and instead what we have, trump supporters here shouting, "trump, trump" during some of the speeches. incredible. all the speakers that have taken the stage from the young republicans, the lieutenant governor, congressman and now the governor, are avoiding any mention of trump. no mention of trump by name. some of them mentioned top of the ticket, but that's it, and the trump supporters are noticing. several very vocal throwing up their hands saying, say his name! trump! trump! but still, no mention of trump.

we know that paul ryan is expected to take the stage next, and he is expected to address the comments made by trump briefly and focus most of his talk about republicans. really what this event has become about, at least right now. kristen? >> all right. nbc's jacob rascon. thank you for that. we'll continue to check back in throughout the hour. now i want to bring in the "washington post," msnbc contributor robert costa with new reporting about meeting going on right now at trump tower. robert what can you tell us? >> reporter: you have new jersey governor chris christie, former new york mayor rudy giuliani, campaign manager kellyanne conway, campaign chairman steve bannon, and they're plotting a path forward. trump remains defiant and trying to think through this debate on sunday. what's his message? is he going to be able to focus on any policy? or issue? that's the question in their mind. >> you have been covering this

campaign from the beginning, robert. what do you think the conversations are like right now inside trump tower in terms of what they're strategy might be? donald trump signaling he might get personal with bill clinton. do you think that someone like a kellyanne conway is going to try to back him off of that course? >> reporter: i think that there's -- there's a divide of sorts in trump's circle. people like steve bannon, used to right breitbart news. david bossy, deputy campaign manager, a longtime clinton investigators and activist. they want to take a hard line against secretary clinton and the former president tomorrow, and others, sources tell me, like ivanka trump, his daughter, kellyanne conway, urging trump to deflect from those kind of issues, incendiary moral issues. issues about his offensive remarks and try to talk about populism and the economy, if he can. >> robert, you had this extraordinary conversation with donald trump earlier today in

which he was defiant and adamant he's not getting out of this race. what specifically did he say to you, and what was his mood like at this very moment? >> reporter: his mood was defiant. again. it was also a little wistful. he talked about life. that was, to me, the most fascinating part of the exchange, with trump saying, i've been through these things in my life before. meaning major public controversies. questions about his ethics, his morals, and he said he's weathered them before and brought up the incident with john mccain. the arizona senator last year, disparaged the senator, who was a vietnam war hero and said i survived that, and i kept pressing him whether he would stay in the race. >> robert, i late to interrupt you, but paul ryan is speaking right now in wisconsin. >> gotcha. >> taking paul ryan live. -- we talk about our ideas. we talk about our solutions. we talk about our conservative principles, and we promote our candidates right here in wisconsin that are fighting for

us, candidates like our senator ron johnson. you know, what matters in elections is, are we giving people real choices? seven people out of ten people in america seven out of ten people in america, they don't think this country's on the right track. do they? seven out of ten people. they think that their kids are going to be worse off in this country. we have never done that before in this country. we have never given the next generation a darker future. we have always stepped up and fixed the problems in front of us in our generation so that our children and our grandchildren can be better off. and you know what? you know what we're doing about it in the house? what we're doing about it as conservatives, we are offering people a better way. we are offering solutions. i tell you what, last january we got together, we said, we need

to take an agenda to the country, we need to show men and women in america those seven out of ten people, that's not just republicans. that's not just independents. that's democrats also. they need to have solutions, and we're offering them. let me tell you a few things. number one, six plans. go to bet.gop. six things. we have got to get people out of welfare and back into the workforce. our welfare system isn't working. our welfare system tells people stay out of work. we need to get beam back into work to get on the ladder of work to reach their dreams. showing you exactly what welf e welfarwelfare reform looks like. second thing. we are not safe. you know this. you see the terrorist attacks in this country. you see what's going on overseas. we have a president, president obama, that is phoning it in on national security. we have a president that has been hallowing out our military.

we are showing you exactly what it takes to rebuild our military, to secure our border, to go on offense against isis and to keep america safe. this is important. i tell you what, and if you want to get jobs in this economy, get the federal government out of the business of micromanaging every little aspect of our lives, of our communities, of our society, of our small businesses. we are losing self-governing in this country. we've got this new fourth branch of government, unelected bureaucrats writing our laws. look at this. we got a case magnum made in racine. and you've got waters of the usa regulation coming from the epa. it is telling farmers how, where, when and what they've got to do if they want to farm and these things don't go through congress. so here's what we're saying. all of these rules and always of these regulations that come from these unelected bure ross cra e

don't know our people, communities, businesses, all has to go through congress. congress for a final vote approval amendment before it goes into effect. it's a simple principle. the principle is one of our founding principles. we govern ourselves as americans. we believe in self-government. the laws that we live under in this country need to be written by us through our elected representatives. not by these unelected bureaucracies and that is exactly what we're offering. that is exactly what we're running on nap is exactly what we're giving people. let me tell you what. how many of you think obama care is working? i don't think he thinks obama care's working either. obama care is failing. biggest health insurance company in the world, in the country, united, they pulled out. aetna pulled out. this thing is in a death spiral.

premiums are going up double every year. deductibles so high you might at well not have health insurance. showing you, first time in six years, republicans van alternative. it's repeal and replace obama care with patient-centered health care to choose what we want for our families. more choice, more competition, lower prices. and i've got to tell you, you are not going to fix this economy. you are not going to grow jobs. you are not going to get economic growth and job creation if you do not scrap this tax code and start over and reform the irs and our tax code. you need to go to better.gop and see what we're talking about. you need to go to better.gop and see our solutions. you see, we need to go from being seen as an opposition party to being a proposition party and that's exactly what we're doing. we are showing you our fellow

citizens that we as -- >> you're listening to house speaker paul ryan addressing the crowd in alcorn, wisconsin. this was supposed to be a unity event. donald trump was supposed to be there. but speaker ryan disinvited him in the wake of this audio that surfaced yesterday at the top of his remarks, ryan did address what he referred to as the elephant in the room. let's hear a little of that. >> -- a little bit of an elephant in the room. and it is a troubling situation. i'm serious. it is. i put out a statement about this last night. i meant what i said and it's still how i feel. but that is not what we are here to talk about today. you know what we do here in fallfest? we talk about our ideas. we talk about our solutions. e were talk about our conservative principles. >> and last night speaker ryan released a statement that said i am sickened by what i heard today. women are to be championed and revered not opt phied. i hope mr. trump treats the

situation with the seriousness it deserves and works to demonstrate to the country that he has greater respect for women than this clip suggests. in the meantime, he is no longer attending tomorrow's event in wisconsin. of course, referring to today's event. joining me now to break all of this down, my fellow road warrior, nbc's katy tur follows the trump campaign. nbc campaign embed ali vitaly outside trump tower and nbc political editor mark murray joins us from st. louis, site of tomorrow night's big debate. thanks to all of you for being here. katy, start with you. your reaction to paul ryan. seemed to be making a defense for why people should vote for republican candidates in down ballot races. there is no doubt he is possibly in the toughest position of all here. >> absolutely. with the republican party fears right now, not necessarily donald trump losing. what they fear, losing the senate, potentially losing the house. the house will be a difficult hurdle for the democrats to overcome, but the senate is definitely plausible, if donald

trump loses. and the reason why you haven't seen the republicans totally back away from trump, refuse to endorse him as a candidate en masse. like paul ryan, mitch mcconnell. they believe that he loses, starts losing by ten points in these key states, they're going to lose these key seats. people like kelly ayotte in new hampshire. rob portman in ohio. even though rob portman has done a pretty expert job so far of threading the needle and maintaining his lead in new hampshire, but there's also pat toomey in pennsylvania. these are seats that they do not want to lose. they're seats they're worried about losing, and that's why paul ryan can't come out and say, i don't agree with donald trump, and go farther than that and say, i refuse to vote for him. >> quickly, before i go out to ally and mark, you know this candidate better than anyone. he's saying adamantly he's not going anywhere.

more than 20 republicans saying, step add sigh or they don't vote for him. >> nobody expected donald trump to bow out of the race. that's not in his nature. you push him, he digs in further. you saw with this tweet that just camous, no way i'm leaving the establishment. the media wants me to go and establishment. before that happens i expect donald trump to lash out at not only the press as he's done but the republican party. he's indicated in the past, said repeatedly, if the republican party is not with me then they're against me and they are fair game. and his base of support is with them on that. the republican party is worried about that. what happens to that chunk of people if they decide to cut ties with donald trump? what does the that mean for them going forward? how do they recover? what does their party look like? and does their party even survive this? >> casting a real fight against the establishment. out to you, ally. talking about donald trump digging in. we know there are meetings going right now.

inside trump tower. you have been watching all of the comings and goings. what have you seen and what do you think's happening inside trump tower right now? >> reporter: i can tell you definitely what's happening outside trump tower where we are now. some find of spontaneous pro-trump gathering. lots of people with make america great again flags, hats, all cheering in favor of trurch. meanwhile, inside we've seen advisors and senior members of the campaign coming and going. people like robert costa, mentioned, rudy giuliani, chris christie. of course, kellyanne conway and, of course, i want to go back to something robert said. really interesting to me and something we've seen play out time and time again throughout this campaign as we go through each new iteration of controversy. it's that there's people inside the orbit really pushing trump to do what he did during the primary. stay tough, stay ready to say anything and willing to kind of get in the dirt with his rivals, something a lot of us are expecting to see especially in light of these new comments from

2005 unearthed. expecting him to get in the dirt a little about bill clinton when he debates hillary clinton and the other side, kellyanne conway, evauivanka trump. pull back. that's what would eventually come out in this race presidential personified candidate the republican party more wanted him to run as in the general election. of course, these people here i'm looking at and talking to have been energized by trump continuing to do what he did throughout the primary. be brash. be willing to say anything and i think that those tweets seen from him today further evidence this is the kind of trump we're going to see out on the trail and on sunday especially. kristen? >> what a great point. i'm going let mark murray pick up on that point. mark, what are you expecting to see at tomorrow night's debate? you heard ali talk about what trump supporters hope they see. what does he need to do to

recover from this? >> yeah, kristin. i would be shocked if it wasn't the first or second question tomorrow night, at the debate here in st. louis. center a big news convenient and knowing how debates are conducted, sometimes the newsy stuff gets asked at the very top. so this is going to be something that donald trump's going to have to answer, and we've seen how the campaign is responding so far. they've apologized. katy tur noted a first for the candidate. ended up saying that apology should be good enough are and everyone should move on and the statement donald trump ended up releasing late last night on facebook saying he actual lly wants to litigate bill clinton. i wouldn't be surprised if that's where we go even if the intention is stay away from that because hillary clinton wants to go toe to toe with donald trump on this news. sets up for really big stakes. to me, biggest, down ballot republicans. how tomorrow night goes, what donald trump says, how hillary

clinton lit gaits thigates this the way republicans take it on the chin a month from now or really getting knocked out, where not only are we talking about republicans losing the senate but also maybe the house of representatives, and that is maybe what's at stake tomorrow night. >> just stunning. incredible analysis. mark, ali and katy, thank you so much. before we head to break i want to read a statement we just got from nancy o'dell, the subject of some of the lewd comments made on that 2005 tape. she writes, politics aside i'm saddened that these comments still exist in our society at all. when i heard the comments yesterday it was disappointing to hear such objectification of women. the conversation needs to change because no female, no person should be the subject of such crass comments whether or not cameras are rolling. and, of course, nancy o'dell of "entertainment tonight." next, back to politics. team clinton responding to the latest trump controversy as well now revealing some of its strategy for tomorrow night's

face-off. we break all of that down, coming up after a quick break. stay with us.

the clinton campaign did not waste any time hitting trump hard for this past comments on women. >> pregnancy is a wonderful thing for the husband, certainly an inconvenience for a business. >> look obviously matters. like you wouldn't have your job if you weren't beautiful. >> move and her like a [ bleep ]. couldn't get there. and she was married. >> totally changed her look. >> mr. trump, women are going to be the reason you're not elected to be president. >> kasie hunt, fellow road warrior join us. kasie, we understand secretary clinton is not going to respond until tomorrow night. what is her strategy going to be and is she bracing for what might be some very personal attacks against her and former president bill clinton? >> reporter: i think they are, kristin. as she spent the last four days

in debate prep, that's something that has loomed large, especially after the events of the last 24 hours or so. of course, donald trump mentioning bill clinton in that statement that he initially put out last night, that printed statement. sort of potentially foreshadowing what he may talk about or be willing to talk about this time around on the debate stage. even though he has, of course, pledged no the to go there when it comes to bill clinton. so figuring out how to handle those attacks and also to pivot back to policy, a critical part of clinton's debate preparations. you know their strategy is likely to focus on trying to get back to those policy issues she's been doing a lot of in-depth preparation over the past couple of days. but i will say, i think that the clinton campaign right now is trying to restrain its glee over this, these comments that donald trump has made. i mean, this is in many ways, they could not have asked for something that would help her potentially win this election in a way that this set of comments

has the chance to do. so i think they are really trying to step out of donald trump's way. for the most part, let him and other republicans, who, of course, started to jump ship today do the talking instead of hillary clinton. >> that's a strategy we typically see from the clinton campaign when one of these controversies pops up. they tend to sort of let the news cycle play itself out. reading reaction we're just getting from vice president biden. words demaining, such behavior is an abuse of power. it's not lewd. it's sexual assault. so more strong words coming from the democrats. kasie, put it in broader perspective, though. if it's weren't for the controversy we'd likely be talking somebody the clinton campaign is dealing with. leaked transcripts, appear to be transcripts, are speeches that she gave to wall street and there are some comments in there which could be problematic for her. bring us up to date and the what's the campaign saying about that? >> reporter: right.

well, these are potentially part of john podestas -- they are part of what wikileak's says are leaked campaigns from john podesta. the campaign has not authenticated, confirmed authenticity, neither have we. some of the documents, keep in mind, are altered, but appear to be a list of what looks like essentially self-opposition research. they read through the transcripts of these speeches they gave to wall street banks and other private groups and i highlighted most problematic consults. one in particular talking about how you have to be, or have to have, excuse me, a public position and a private position on issues so you can negotiate privately while at the same time not putting a foot wrong publicly. the problem there, of course, that it underscores this perception that clinton is a politician who says one thing in public and another thing behind closed doors. she also talked about in one of these speeches having open trade and open borders in the american

hemisphere with latin-american countries, and that, of course, runs counter to what she has claimed in the primary, on trade, and, of course, potentially problematic with swing voters very focused on border security in this general election. kristen? >> all right. msnbc's kasie hunt. joining you in a matter of hours. kasie, thank you. >> we are ready for you here. see you soon. and here's an inside look at the setup for tomorrow's town hall-style debate at washington university in st. louis, missouri. hillary clinton and donald trump face off for the second time tomorrow as the trump campaign remains in crisis mode. joining me now, adolfo franco, former adviser to john mccain's '08 presidential campaign. victoria difrancesco and msnbc contributor and reuters political correspondent luciano lopez. thanks to all of you for being here. appreciate it. abofl odolfo i want to start wi. you know what it feel it's like to be inside a campaign. how do they deal with this moment what feels like a moment

of crisis, and these calls for him to remove himself. not that realistic. right? we're past the filing deadline? >> well, it isn't realistic in terms of the campaign, this is beyond crisis. this is really a meltdown situation. there really is no way out for donald trump. now with these comments, a number of republican, i'm not supporting donald trump but a republican, the notion that north carolina, florida, new hampshire, nevada, colorado, these states would be possible for donald trump, unquestionably, they're no longer in play. i think he could lose yutah, texas, georgia. it's a meltdown situation. the only strategy, try to attract former president clinton, he's not on the ballot. that's a mistake. what i was struck by earlier, though, quickly, is the speaker who i greatly admire. he said, the elephant in the room. symbol of the elephant, the

symbol of the republican party. it's now a question of salvaging the republican brand. that will really now look beyond 2016, when we lost this election and say donald trump should not be the party nominee and invoke rule nine of party rules and have him removed. it's too late on the ballot but he's going to lose anyway. we can salvage the republican brand if there's the courage to do it. a number of senators not up for re-election, senator fisher of nebraska, senator thoune called for this. seriously entertained if the republican party survives beyon point. more than 20 republicans condemned him, including congressman joe heck and mitt romney. play a little of that and get your reaction. >> totally shocked that they would use this to -- denounce donald trump. he's a man. he's an american man.

he did something wrong with a female. he awol jppalologized and holdio high. they're not god. >> that was actually a trump supporter from nevada. so trump supporters aren't going anywhere. but that's not his challenge. right? i mean, he's got to bring in more people into the fold. can he survive this? >> you hit the nail on the head there. the people who were hard-core with him through the primaries, they're ride or die. there through november 8th. what he needs to do, because this isn't the primaries now. this is the general. he he needs to expand the base, especially with women for whom these comments are really pretty toxic. if you look at twitter today, it's just a range of women just denouncing this, and a lot of women talking about how they, themselves, have been sexually assaulted and how for some of them these words recall very painful episodes for them. >> backlash stunning. no doubt about that. let me go out to you, vicki,

that second crucial debate is tomorrow night. sort of already being cast as do or die. what do you anticipate secretary clinton is going to do if donald trump gets personal? which he's indicating that is very likely what he's going to do. >> i like luciano's comment, ride or die. donald trump is going guns ablazing. at this point, kristen what does he have to lose? he is going to go personal and i think the hillary clinton campaign knows as much and is preparing for that. the question is, how is he going to deal with the format? it's not just a moderator and the two candidates. it's people. it's going to be a woman who gets up and said, you know what? i was sexually assaulted. those comments you made affect me. so how he talks to the audience. i mean, he's going to attack clinton. i have no doubt about that, but how he talks to that audience is going to be really key in seeing if he completely sinks tomorrow night or is kind of able to

tread water. >> adolfo, i know you want to jump in and talk about the fact melania commented today. they're trying to neutralize this ahead of tomorrow. >> sure. i have a lot of respect for my friend vicky but this is beyond trump. yes, what trump will do. he's already said he's not going to quit. i want to emphasize as a republican, i am concerned about my party in the future. it's now beyond donald trump and there are mechanisms to deal with this. we are going to lose this election in 2016. before this incident it was uphill. now it's a forgone conclusion. why you see republican officeholders denouncing him and distances themselves from him very, very quickly. it's taking more than that. far more if we salvages house and senate in this cycle and in the future. that's donald trump's strategy but a question whether the republican party will acquiesce or say, no. unguarded dhaumt mirrors the soul. this isn't an incident, a clip

with a woman. not about an incident. this is not monica lewinsky, as deplobable as that was, in is has to do with his perception of women and being predatory nap is offending not just women but men and women. everybody has a mother, everybody, many people have a sister, and a wife, or a spouse, and that's what's troubling about this. that's how the republican party la to step up and do something about it. if not, we will pay a price for decades, back to luciano on that point. take a look at a recent quinnipiac poll. gender gap already yawning in this race. right now secretary clinton leads him among women 53-37%. you talked about the fax he needs more women. what could happen to these numbers? what do you anticipate in the coming days and does melania's statement neutralize it at all? can she be the voice here who says, forgive my husband. i have. >> there's been some evidence that the undecided voters pool,

the people who could swing this election one way or another are, in fact, women, and a lot of them are the kind of suburban female voters who typically would vote for the conservative, for the republican candidate, but who have some issues with trump. and this is the kind of thing that's only going to make their concerns and their nervousness even more palpable and even harder to get past. i think just melania trump coming out saying i have forgiven my husband doesn't necessarily speak to the deeper concerns that a lot of these women have. >> all right. great conversation. adolfo, franco, victoria and luciana. thank you for being here. a growing number of republicans continue to take a step back from trump. some calling for him to get out of the race altogether. as we've been discussing all day long, could that actually happen, and if so, how? the republican party as a whole, does it move forward? we discuss that, after a quick break. i believe our only option

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this is a decision that only donald trump can make, and i don't -- this is unprecedented, and i don't know what the process would be for replacing him. that was senator susan collins, a staunch anti-trump republican, openly speculating about the process's replacing trump in the unlikely event he steps away from the presidential race. joining me now is ben ginsburg, msnbc political analyst and former general counsel for the republican national committee, ben, thanks so much for being here. really appreciate it. >> my pleasure. nice to you with you. >> no one knows the rule better than you do. former rnc chair, michael steele said today, earlier today, that

rule nine of the party's operating rules, which deals with a vacancy apartment the top of the ticket, could allow for some maneuvering here. how do you see this? is there any possible way that trump could step aside? >> to be honest, i think the rule is written for the case of a nominee who can't continue in the role. it's not meant for a coup, and there's one word in the rule, the word "otherwise" that people are trying to hang the coup on. and i think that would not stand amongst the majority of the current rnc members. as a viable option. so the real alternative, the only alternative, is that trump resign. >> so, okay. walk me through that, then. if trump were to resign, which he says he's absolutely not going to do under any circumstances, what, then, happens? >> well, life gets interesting.

the republican national committee convenes. each state would have the number of delegates it had at the convention. so each delegate, if each of the three from the state would have a third of vote. new york, 99 delegates. each delegates gets 33. you would have to have a cumulative total of 1,237 to become the nominee. prior to the rnc meeting, its rules committee would have to decide on the nomination's process, what are the qualifications for somebody to be nominated. the rnc could then vote and have a nominee. the challenge then is twofold. one is, getting that name on the ballots of every state. that would require state-by-state litigation, to impact the ballot rules in each state. and, number two, the other challenge or rules in each state, that describe the job

that an elector must fulfill. in the state. in other words who can they vote for, do they have to follow the will of the people? can they vote for the nominee of the party? and that various from state to state as well. >> all right. ben ginsburg. thank you for breaking that down and helping us understand something that is very unprecedented and complicated. really appreciate it. >> certainly. thanks. now, i want to bring in msnbc and msnbc political analyst elise jordan to rand paul's campaign, former, and republican strategist susan del percio. thanks, ladies, for being here. let's just talk about what your both hearing. susan, start with you. they're meeting right now inside trump tower. we don't know what's happening. do you get the sense that this is a campaign in crisis? does anyone know what happens next? >> it is a campaign in crisis, and no one knows what happens next. no one -- if there is, rumors of an interview later today that may come out with donald trump but even looking towards

tomorrow's debate. no one knows including the top trump people what donald trump will show up tomorrow night. what will he ultimately end up doing. i can tell you having folks like rudy giuliani, chris christie and roger ailes, very aggressive in crises, whispering in his ear will definitely probably enhance the odds of him being very aggressive, however, hopefully some more season's strategists and his children, which i hear are definitely, are among those who hope that he kind of gives, a toned down response and more of an appaology tomorrow night, but we don't know which one will happen. >> the most challenging moments you've had in political campaigns, this has to top them all. can you imagine what the conversations might be like? how they are tracking a path forward? this is a campaign that is good at hunkering down and saying, this is a fight against the establishment. >> the worst part about what the trump campaign's job is right now for everyone working on that

campaign is that they are dealing with an utterly irrat n irrational and unpredictable candidate. no one knows what version of donald trump will show up tomorrow night. now, this week he did traditional debate prep. he finally did conventional sit down, be drilled working with advisers, in a way he didn't for the first debate and he needed to. is that donald trump going to suddenly surface sunday night after a week or two of prep, after this blowup last night? >> ladies, do you think he even shows up tomorrow night? >> i think there are -- >> really, i'm doubting it. i really i think at the last minute he could say this is rigged. you see it. the media is up against me and pulls out. quite frankly, i don't see how he helps himself tomorrow night. >> he probably can't. do give you that answer i need my magic eight ball. about the best guess one can make. >> look at recent polls before i let you go with women. secretary clinton opened up a sizable lead, i discussed earlier. leads 53-33%.

he leads her way men, but in the same poll she leads among independents, 46-32%. independents and women. those are the two groups that trump needs more of. susan, how damaging is this moment with those critical groups? >> it's critical, because with the independents, that was the thing that donald trump had the best chance of getting, honestly. there were women who were just never going to turn back to him, but he had a shot at least of having some of them. and now that -- excuse me. the independents are with hillary clinton, how does he get -- he can't get them back. that's the biggest problem. math is against his side. donald trump needs to expand his base. even if what's happened in the last 24 hours, he keeps his base. he only keeps 75% of republicans. that doesn't come close to getting him elected. >> all right. we are out of time. really appreciate you being here. susan and elise, grace conversation. coming up next, revelations about russia. new evidence this hour that russia's hack on the dnc was

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a new nbc news investigation reveals russian hacking started over a year ago and more extensive than reported so far. officials tell nbc news the work is considered strategic to the putin regime and targets democrats and republicans. joining me now to talk about it from stanford university, ambassador michael mccall, former ambassador to russia and msnbc news contributor. thank you for joining me. >> yeah. thanks for having me. >> if you would, talk a little about why you think the u.s. government is so certain this is the work of russia. >> well, let's start with first principles. the russians are one of the few countries in the world that have this kind of capability. like the chinese and like we have it. right?

second, our ability to track this kind of hacking has increased. it's gotten better. and as mr. clapper said yesterday, there's no doubt anymore what happened to the dnc was the work of entities closely tied to russian intelligence services. but the third thing is most important. the spies spy on everybody all the time. that's the -- that's what the cia and kgb or fsb as it's called what they're supposed to do. different about this is using that data to influence our internal democratic processes as they did when they gave this data to wikileaks and then influenced what happened, you know, ultimately removing from power the head of the dnc. >> secretary clinton has talked about this. president obama has as well. what are the implications of trying to influence a u.s. election if that is, in fact, what is happening. >> well, i just want to underscore how unprecedented

this is. we've never had a situation like this in my memory, most certainly not from the russians, and the fact, know -- this is very serious that a foreign government would try to change our electoral processes. i think the first step is what the obama administration did yesterday. to attribute this to russia. that's important as a deterrent and the second is to educate the american people about possible other things that may happen between now and november, including two things that worry me the most -- one, e-mails that are released that are then doctored and changed so they look like they are originally e-mails but are not that might affect one of the two candidates. and in this case, that would be against secretary clinton. it's clear to me that they are targeting her, and then second, what they might do on election day. not to steal the election, which i don't believe they have the capacity to do, but to disrupt it and to delegitimate mate tth

process. we need to be ready for that and educate people about that right now wharnlg now. >> ambassador what do you make of donald trump praising vladimir putin and he's not willing to go far as to blame russia with the united states certainty russia is behind this? >> it's clear as day to me that the russians and president putin supports trump, because trump supporting policies that the russians advocate. it's just obvious. that they have gone to this length to help him is -- is unprecedented, but that they have the same policies is unprecedented. now that this is out, i do think, i hope, mr. trump will be asked about this to clarify his position, and i just want to point out something else. on any other news day, the fact that a foreign government would be trying to influence our democratic politics would be a giant national security debate in this country. the fact that it's not, i think,

shows another problem with mr. trump. that we should be talking about this, and because of these other things, we're not talking about national security. that troubles me as somebody concerned about our security. >> well, we appreciate your joining us to talk about this. it is such an important issue, ambassador mcfaulcfaul. coming up next, the woman ant-of-at the center of the controversy speaks out. what the entertainment host, nancy o'dell, is saying, on the other side of this break. remember here at ally, nothing ops us from doing right by our cusmers. o's withe? i'm in. i'm in. 'm in. i'm in. ♪ ♪ one, two, - wait, wait. wait - wher's na? ing the hand thing? yep! we are all in for our customers. ally. do it right.

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widespread reaction still coming in at this hour to the latest trump controversy, this time over that 2005 audio released of his lewd comments about women. in the video that surfaced last night trump could be heard talking about his attempt to sleep with former "access hollywood" host nancy o'dell who released this statement. "politics aside i'm saddened that these comments still exist

in our society at all. when i heard the comments yesterday it was disappointing to hear such objectification of women. the conversation needs to change, because no female, no person, should be the person of such crass comments, whether or not cameras are rolling." everyone deserves respect. no matter the setting or gender as a woman who has worked very hard to establish her career and as a mom, i feel i must speak out with the hope that as a society, we will always strive to be better." that statement from nancy o'dell just the latest in what has been a long list of responses to the latest trump controversy. we will keep an eye on all of it for you, but for now, i'm kristen welker, live in new york. my colleague ari melber picks up coverage after a quick break. stay with us.

good evening to you. msnbc world headquarters here in new york continuing to follow two major stories now. more fallout for donald trump following lewd inappropriate comments caught on tape.

31 days until the election the republican nominee saying hours ago he'll never withdraw from the race even as members from his own party calling increasingly for him to do that. also, south carolina feeling the effects of hurricane matthew. residents along the coast of florida and georgia beginning to assess damage. also updates on the storm and its aftermath throughout the hour, but we begin with donald trump's campaign in what is clearly its worst crisis ever. donald trump himself defiant, vowing on twitter he will stay in the race but calls going all over the place from top republicans saying he should step aside. this is essentially unprecedented territory. the audio, of course, leaked. you probably heard by now, of deeply offensive comments trump made about women and potential assault back in 2005, on a hot mike during a recording for "access hollywood." a show we show note owned by nbc universal, the parent company of msnbc.