good day, everyone, i'm alex

witt at msnbc world headquarters, it is high noon in the east, 9:00 a.m. out west. we begin with pictures from new york city where protesters have gathered for another straight day to protest the historic election of donald trump. these are live pictures down in union square area. nbc is learning this past hour that the president elect called mitt romney one of his chief rifles at some point after the election results became clear. and now new details of president-elect donald trump appearing to scale back his plans to gut obamacare upon taking office. this new insight is part of his first sit down interview and it will air tomorrow night on "60 minutes." >> let me ask you about obamacare. which you say you're going to repeal and replace. when you replace it, are you going to make sure that people with preconditions are still covered? >> yes, because it happens to be one of the strongest assets. >> you're going to keep that. >> also with the children living with their parents for an

extended period. >> you're going to keep is that. >> we're going to very much try to keep that. add costs but it's something we're very much going to try to keep. >> and there's going to be a period if you repeal it before you replace it when millions of people could lose -- >> we're going to do it simultaneously it will be just fine. it's what i do. i do a good job. i know how to do this stuff. we're going to repeal it and replace t we are not going to have a two-day period and we're not going to have a two-year period where there's nothing. it will be repealed and replaced and we will know and it will be great healthcare for much less money. >> after taking a short break since giving her concession speech hillary clinton was back in brooklyn last night to thank her campaign volunteers and staff. former president bill clinton, their daughter chelsea and campaign officials huma abedin, john podesta and robby mook were there for a party at the campaign headquarters. >> we left it all on the field,

every single one of you. this is a tough time for our country. i think we've seen how people have been reacting to the events of this election and i know that we've got to be reaching out to each other to keep it clear in our own minds that what we did was so important, it looks like we are, you know, on the path to winning the popular vote and that says -- that says volumes about the importance of your work and the lasting -- the lasting impact that it will have. >> meanwhile more fallout over senator harry reid's harsh words and a statement about the anti-trump protests during which he told trump a sexual predator who lost the popular vote. democratic senator joe manchin called his comments an absolute

embarrassment to the senate as an institution, our democratic party and the nation. senator reed's words feed the divisiveness that are tearing this country apart. senator manchin will be up for reelection in 2018. morgan radford is at union square in new york city. that is where the anti-trump protest is just about to kick off. what's happening there right now? >> reporter: well, it's a sorry start in fact you can see hundreds of people behind me here in union square. i want to show you some of the signs and posters they are holding up here. you can see one says knowledge trump hate protect our public schools, teachers against trump. you see people that are really saying that this is the time for them to come together, they are trying to say they're being more inclusive. that's because thousands of people are feeling marginalized by president-elect donald trump's comments. they say this is about a love rally and letting people know they are excluded. we expect to see 10,000 up to 13,000 people.

there's barely standing room here. they're going to head north up to trump tower, that's where they will end their rally. this comes on the end of three nights of protest and at least ten major cities across the country. last night we know one protester was shot in portland, 11 people were arrested here in new york city but for the most part things have been peaceful and that's what they expect and hope will continue today. >> morgan, can you tell who is organized this rally? it has been suggested that so many of the protests across this country have been impromptu rallies, it's been supported by a very diverse array of constituents. is there someone in charge here? >> reporter: right now this is a lots of different groups of people who have come together with no necessarily official leader. that's been some of the criticism. people have said what's the point, you have all these disparate groups coming together but what they're saying is the point is they know they can't change the results of the election because that is in the can but what they say is they want to come together and show america that love really does win.

>> all right. morgan radford in union square in new york city. let's bring in kelly o'donnell, she is at our washington bureau. what are you hearing about this call donald trump made to mitt romney and when? >> well, donald trump has been spending a considerable amount of time on the phone since his victory, receiving calls and making calls from foreign leaders to prominent people in this country including the former republican nominee for president and one of the most vocal opponents of donald trump, mitt romney. you may remember months ago it was romney who staged a full speech to make a case against the nomination of donald trump, urging his party to move away from him, and up until the election really strongly taking issue with a lot of the words, the on duct, the positions of donald trump. after the election results mitt romney did what many have done and that is to congratulate and use the phrase duly elected president and to offer his

prayers, support and hopes for his success as president. we now know that there has been a phone call between donald trump and mitt romney and that would be part tradition, perhaps part fence mending and it might be the result of some of the other kinds of conversations that donald trump has been having from his more than an hour long meeting with president obama, going much further in time than people had expected, the president giving donald trump a lot of personal interaction well beyond what was planned and then time with speaker ryan and majority leader mitch mcconnell. all of these sorts of conversations in addition to a flurry of phone calls with foreign leaders are all a part of donald trump trying to reach out, trying to fortify his place as the next president, trying to secure support from those who although they might have opposed him in the election would be inclined to want to say the country has spoken, he will be president and to look for thard at least encouragement if not outright support.

so because of the nature of this call, not a lot of details about what was said or what the tone of it was but we can say that that contact has been made and i wouldn't be surprised if there aren't other calls of this nature in the days ahead. >> okay. kelly, we will have you back next hour, i want to get the latest on the transition where things stand because there are 4,000 appointments to be made, many of which have to be approved by congress. thank you for that. joining me now caitlin huey-burns and jeremy peters reporter for "the new york times" and msnbc contributor. big welcome to you both on this saturday. jeremy, i will begin with you here. it encapsulates the night donald trump's victory met with shock across a wide political divide and in it you write about the clash between excitement and dread. so here we are a couple days later. does it still hold or is it beginning to sink in? >> i think what has not changed, alex, is the fact that donald trump will enter the white house with the lowest approval ratings, the lowest trustworthy

ratings and the largest percentage of voters who say they are scared of the thought of him becoming president. and that is a tremendous thing to overcome and i think it's part of your' seeing donald trump try to mute some of his impulses, his erratic tweeting, his kind of off the cuff remarks coming out and saying on election night i will be a president for all people. whether or not he's able to do that of course will be the defining question i think of his first 100 days. >> well, there have been a few tweets that would challenge that, let's say. >> there have. >> caitlin, let's take a listen to a bit more of donald trump from 60 minutes. here it is. >> hillary called and it was a lovely call and it was a tough call for her. i mean, i can imagine. tougher for her than it would have been for me and for me it would have been very, very difficult. she couldn't have been nicer and she just said congratulations, donald, well done, and i said i

want to thank you very much. you were a great competitor. she's very strong and very smart. >> what about bill clinton, did you talk to him? >> he did. he called the next day. >> really? what did he say? >> he actually called last night. >> what did he say? >> and he couldn't have been more gracious, he said it was an amazing run, one of the most amazing he has ever seen. >> he said that. >> he was very, very -- really very nice. >> so caitlin i know that you covered the speech that hillary clinton gave, it is something i have categorized as being a speech that only a mother could have given in terms of its tone and delivery there, but how difficult do you think that call was for her to make? how much did the clinton camp believe that he would never be in a position to make that call? >> well, the clinton campaign thought, you you know, up until later that evening that they were going to win this election. remember in the final days they had had this ceremony of sorts of passing the political baton from president obama to hillary

clinton, you talked to a lot of her supporters as i did and lots of them were sure she was going to win, in fact, even in her stops to places like michigan in the final hours and areas of pennsylvania like pittsburgh, people did not necessarily doubt that she would win and focused on turning out the vote. and so it was a very heart breaking moment for her supporters gatheringed there at the ga jijavits center, but the that she struck was crica in ensuring that peaceful transfer of power that is so critical to our democracy. and i think she recognized at that point that she had to set that tone in order to allow people to move forward, but that doesn't disguise a lot of the really raw feelings that are going on right now. this week has been peaceful in terms of obama inviting trump to the white house, you know, both sides saying that they will let

this president elect lead, but we can't forget how many feelings were hurt during this process and that makes it very difficult when it comes to governing in 2017. >> jeremy, you co-wrote that article just before the election that went inside the trump camp, it portrayed a rather gloomy picture, shall we say. how long did that picture last? how surprised were they when it all changed and when was that point? >> on election night in the early hours around 7:00 p.m. there were inside -- there was inside the trump campaign a fear that they were going to lose. i think that trump himself believed he could win, i think the people around him were less sure in these campaigns you always need to psych yourself up and tell yourself you're going to win as a psychological coping mechanism, it's really the only way you can endure these really tough races and i think that's what was going on. i think there were few people in the country as surprised as the people around donald trump that they pulled this off.

now, that doesn't mean that they thought it was impossible, but they knew it was going to be, you know -- they had to run as they would say or were saying in the final days of the campaign an inside straight. it was a tough, tough thing to do and they pulled it off. now, i think looking forward a bit, alex, one of the things that i would really look for is how donald trump is able to reconcile with republican leaders who walked away from his candidacy. in the saker of the house he has somebody he does not trust for all of the ceremonial pomp and circumstance of trump coming to the capitol and shaking hands with paul ryan and this show of good will that they will work together, i think that is going to be one of the most precarious relationships donald trump is going to have and we just don't know how that's going to turn out. >> before i ask caitlin one last question can i just ask you i had a conversation and i will just repeat it somewhat

anecdotally with michael steele the morning after the election in the hallway behind me and he said that he believes the trump camp knew things were going to go their way the moment florida was called. will that concur with your reporting and what you've heard? >> oh, i'm sorry. >> that st that's how, jeremy. >> i apologize, alex. i think so. i think that, you know, it was all across in news rooms all across the country we were looking at florida and watching those returns come in from the rural areas and when they were much higher than we expected even though we knew that there was a large swell of hispanic turnout in south florida, the numbers coming in from the rural parts were overcoming that and making it almost impossible for her to make that up. now, of course, she could afford to lose florida, north carolina, ohio, new hampshire and still win the presidency, but what nobody expected was for her to lose michigan and wisconsin and

she barely lost there. so, you know, it shows you how especially in the detroit area where black turnout was lower that, you know, she just did not motivate that obama coalition. >> caitlin, there is a "new york times" report which suggests that bill clinton wanted the campaign to reach out to white working class voters much earlier on, but it fell on deaf ears. why do you think they didn't listen? >> well, the clinton campaign saw a changing electorate, right, a more diverse electorate and they watched as donald trump went through the republican primary, jeb bush and other republicans played, you know, kind of a similar playbook as clinton did, focusing on policy, focusing on kind of the traditional mechanics and fundamentals of campaigns and historical precedent without kind of -- and then fact torg in, though, that the electorate would be more diverse and she really banked on the obama coalition not necessarily turning out in the numbers they did in 2008 either in 2012 but

at least having that and then building upon that coalition, they were hoping to draw support from suburban women, for example, and we saw in the exit polling that a lot of those that they were trying to court went -- ended up going to donald trump and also surging latino support as well. and so she wasn't able to capitalize -- to fully get the numbers that obama did of course, but also there was a thought process of you're not going to be able to really cut into donald trump's numbers among the white working class so if you can rev up the numbers on the other side that could help make up the difference and we saw that of course that wasn't enough. >> yeah. caitlin, we will squeeze in one which can question to you here. the remarks that hillary clinton made to the campaign staff in brooklyn she noted the country has reacted strongly to the results, analogy knowledging the protests out there, reiterating that, hey, i won a popular te. that a way to console the

troops, console herself and are you surprised she said that? >> i think she was speaking especially to members of her staff who of course these are people who invest years of their life to the campaign and donors who have invested and people across the country who felt they have voted for her and seeing that popular vote number but not in the electoral college, however, i also think that this will have an impact on democrats when they approach the senate and congress in 2017. remember, they are going to be the minority in washington and they haven't been in that position for a really long time. and so they have to figure out as a party how they are going to move forward with that. do they act as an opposition party solely and focus specifically on rebuilding and being opposing to the other side in that way, or do they try to find areas of common ground and areas or issues or policy initiatives that they can work together with donald trump on and claim some successes for themselves? that remains to be seen.

>> caitlin huey-burns, jeremy pete he issers, thanks, guys. political advice, we're hearing more from senator bernie sanders on what the democratic party should do post election.

i came to my decision because i don't trust hillary. >> he just called everybody american and that's what i believe. >> the president elect is riding into office on the strength of critical blocks of voters including white women. it is clear now hillary clinton's campaign did not do enough in swing states to win the presidency and joining me from cleveland former ohio state senator and political analyst nina turner. >> thanks, alex. >> let's talk about the numbers because that's really the stats we can look at here.

the obama coalition did not show up for hillary clinton. why not? >> well, alex, to the extent that there is a coalition, i mean, we are assuming that there is. i mean, the joining together of people we understand what coalition means, but the joining together those people in 2008 they came together because they were inspired by president obama on hope and change. but that coalition, if you will, was not cultivated for the entire eight years that the president was in office. meaning on a regular basis to keep that group strong, to keep that group together and to remind that group that the way that we got president obama elected is also the way that we have to run this country and that means electing people to state houses and governors mansions of which you know democrats are very far behind our republican colleagues to that extent. >> sure are. >> while they were paying attention to those things we were not. >> talking about the type of person that cast a vote for trump, filmmaker michael moore disputing the notion that they're racist. let's take a listen to that.

>> you have to accept that millions of people who voted for barack obama some of them once, some of them twice changed their minds this time. >> uh-huh. >> they are not racists. they twice voted for a man whose middle name is hussein. that's the america you live in. >> nina, what do you think hillary clinton could have done to keep those voters on her side? >> it's not just about what the secretary could have done but it's democrats in general. you remember, alex, when the republicans did an autopsy report after 2012 it is time for the democratic party to do an autopsy report. this is not just something that's based in 2016, it happened in 2014, it happened in 2010. the handwriting has been on the wall for the democratic party for such a long time and if the democratic party does not heed the cries of the people today, we will find ourselves in the same situation and it really is, alex, about speaking to people's hearts. it wasn't about resumes, it wasn't about the best platform it really was about people, whether they were black or white

although we know that the majority of white women did vote in that way, it's not people of color, she got 90% of the black woman vote, 80% of the black man vote, the majority of the votes from our hispanics sisters and brothers but it really is about knowing and recognizing that people were suffering in this country and mr. trump like it or not, spoke to that hurt in a way that got him to be now president elect. >> you are exactly reflecting the sentiments of your candidate, the one that you supported, bernie sanders, who has written a new op-ed in the "new york times" with advice for the future of the democratic party. he writes i believe strongly that the party must break loose from its corporate establishment ties and once again become a grassroots party of working people, the elderly and the poor. do you think the party will now take his advice given what happened on tuesday? >> well, if we ever want to come back from this, alex, the democratic party is as low as it can go, we can't go any lower, there is nowhere to go but up,

but if they do heed that and a the thoughts and the ideas of the people, we have to listen more, we can get back there, but we cannot fool ourselves into thinking it's not just one thing that got us here, it is a plethora of things that got us here, if we have the courage, strength and determination to heed the cries of suffering people across the electoral spectrum we can and we will go get back there. >> mr. trump he won your home state of ohio by more than 8 points. >> he did. >> ohio deciding the correct nominee for president. what did hillary clinton miss after visiting there so many times and she had the ground game to boot? >> 14 times, alex, is my understanding that ohio has picked the winner of the presidency. again, it wasn't about concerts, it wasn't about entertaining people, you know, it wasn't necessarily about who had the better ground game as we know right now but it really was about heeding the feelings and cries of the people who were saying that they were suffering. i mean, in my state 70% -- mr. trump won 70% of 30 counties in

the state of ohio. the secretary certainly won the big counties like cuyahoga and franklin, but he won the smaller counties. >> all the rural, yes. >> all the rural counties. so we cannot move forward without acknowledging the pain of our rural sisters and brothers who are suffering under the weight of poverty in some of the same ways that our sisters and brothers in urban areas are. and you may remember that the reverend jesse jackson that was fundamental to his run and also after that, his whole notion of the bringing together of the suffering of people across the ethnic spectrum that we cannot win by separating each other and my party failed to recognize that. so the smaller counties in the state of ohio and by extension across this country they bound together. >> all right. nina turner, we always appreciate your sage insights which means we will see you again. >> thank you. outrage in the streets of america after the election, i'm going to ask a presidential historian just how unprecedented this vote was and now the

reaction as we give you a live look at a bunch of people marching from union square to trump tower in the heart of new york city. stay with us. ♪ ♪ ♪ is it a force of nature? or a sales event? the season of audi sales event is here. audi will cover your first month's lease payment on select models during the season of audi sales event. (bing)

small business saturday is our day to get out and shop small. a day to support our community and show some love for the people we love. and the places we love. the stuff we can't get anywhere else and food that tastes like home. because the money we spend here can help keep our town growing.

on small business saturday, let's shop small for our neighborhood, our town, our home. on november 26th, get up, (all) get together and shop small. welcome back, everyone. i'm alex witt at msnbc headquarters in new york. here is what we're monitoring for you. another story, hundreds ve gathered for protests over this historic election of donald trump and in the next hour or so they will begin marching towards trump tower, we will bring you a live report from that demonstration at the top of the hour. join me right now, nbc news presidential historian michael besrloss, always great to see. >> you thank you. >> is there any precedent for protests of this magnitude against our country's election results before the winner has even assumed office? i mean, this soon after the election? >> i think the timing is unusual, usually it waits a

while. the thing i'm thinking of is 1969 the day that richard nixon was inaugurated we sometimes forget, you know, the car went down pennsylvania avenue, there were beer cans thrown, there were sticks, there were beer bottles, there was a demonstration and of course during the next year or so -- next two years there were big demonstrations against nixon and his war in vietnam that were not just peaceful but actually grew violent. the thing that nixon tried to use that for political reasons, nixon tried to say i'm for law and order and he almost gined up these administrations and in the midterms of 1970 just before that election nixon gave a talk on tv saying i'm the one who is standing for law and order, the others, the side of violence, it really did not work and republican leaders said please do not do this. >> when wung about the late '60s we think about all the unrest and demonstrations there. >> it went on for years.

>> these protests what do you think they say about the president elect's future as a leader. does it dee lijt miez an ability to reach out to the public and inspire healing and unit each among the different races many of which he called out countless times during the campaign? president obama was called to respond to these types of things on so many points. >> sure. >> can donald trump do that? >> well, this is a big message to him that if he's not thinking about doing it, it's a very good idea for him to do so. this is a time for any new president to heal and unite. even john kennedy in 1960 came in without the kind of campaign that we've seen the last couple of months and kennedy said i know that the election was close and i know that part of my job is to unite this country even among people who disagree. even richard nixon in 1968 he said this is almost a verbatim quote, the great objective of this administration will be to bring the american people

together. he didn't do it. but at least we heard him say that right after the election. that's a tradition that i think donald trump should listen to very carefully. >> michael, as you recall when reagan took office in 1981 his critics questioned his intelligence, questioned his plit dal intelligence, they feared war and yet that was a man who had served as the governor of the great state of california which was a huge prospect of that kind of work, but is there a comparison to be made here or none at all because of ronald reagan's service in california? >> well, i think the general comparison is that for those who were doubtful or very worried about donald trump, there is a tradition among some american presidents where presidents did much better than people expected at the beginning and the end turned out to be very difficult from what people were expecting at the start. i am not comparing donald trump to harry truman in any way except for the fact that when truman came in people thought that this was someone who could

not measure up, especially because we were still in world war ii to the leg's of franklin roosevelt, did much better. so i think if we have a president who makes a huge effort to say, give me a chance, as hillary clinton was saying the other day, you know, give him a chance to lead and makes this effort to heal the country and unite it, i think people might see a surprise. >> you know, one of the president elect's campaign promises was to, quote, train the swamp in washington. when was the last time an anti-establishment candidate took office and how much change were they successful in implementing? >> that's a thread that's run all the way through american history. andrew jackson promised to do the same thing and did throw a lot of people out of office, jimmy carter came in as an outsider in 1976. usually it doesn't happen quite that way because people need partners with whom to govern and usually what we've seen in the past is those people tend to involve a lot of people with a lot of political experience who were part of what donald trump

would call the swamp. >> what about the popular vote versus the electoral college? hillary clinton won the popular vote, lost the electoral college. it's caused some to ask whether or not the electoral college should be abolished. that argument has changed over the years. or is it a better more legitimate way of electing a president? >> you can argue about one round or flat and it really was argued after 2000 because not only as you know and you were saying earlier did you have a president who -- president bush who was elected by the electoral college whereas al gore had the popular vote but that was decided in one of the most controversial decisions the supreme court has ever made. and what surprised me at the time was that there was a movement maybe we shouldn't, you know -- maybe we should elect presidents by the popular vote -- yeah, by the popular vote, not by the electoral college and what amazed me was how quickly that petered out. if you go by the precedent of 2001 when bush was inaugurated

my guess is that this discussion is not going to last very long. >> when it comes to needing to rewrite the handbook, talk about the pollsters out of this election, my heavens, and what do you think in terms of this being a reflection of trump's unique appeal or whether this is outdated polling technology. have pollsters have ever this far off the mark so far? >> they have been this far 1936 the literally digest said that landen would defeat franklin roosevelt who went on to win 46 states out of 48 and the biggest landslide for some time. in 1948 of course truman and due would he when the pollsters stop polling weeks before the election because they figured dewy was so far ahead that truman who in every catch up. polling is always an enact science. i think the real problem was before this election there was a tendency to think that, you know, polls were something that should be treated as the word of

god with these things, you know, hillary clinton has some huge percentage chance of winning. i think in the future we who use polls have got to say they are interesting, they give us some information, but you've got to understand especially based on, you know, the lesson of 2016 that public opinion can move very fluidly and i think what we saw in the lasten days of this campaign was voters moving in a way that was very fast and sometimes too fast to be captured by pollsters and some of these crucial states. >> nbc news presidential historian michael beshloss always great to talk to you. thank you. it may be the first challenge for the president elect what supporters of donald trump want to see after the unusual spike in hate crimes and intimidation. the pursuit of healthier. it begins from the second we're born. because, healthier doesn't happen all by itself. it needs to be earned every day. using wellness to keep away illness. and believing a single life can be made better by

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potential hate crimes have been reported across this country. sara dallof has more with that. who is being targeted and can these instances be definitively linked to the election? >> reporter: those are both great questions, alex. the southern poverty law center says they have seen increases like this in recent history when president obama was elected and when south carolina made the decision to remove the confederate flag from its state house grounds, they say this is so much more than political passions and strong emotion, they say it is threats and intimidati intimidation. this morning officials across the nation are looking into a rash of alleged hate crimes, incidents of hate speech and bullying in the wake of the presidential election. graffiti and threats are surfacing across the country, directed at political, racial, ethnic and religious groups. >> we are very worrisome about what the next four years is going to hold for us. >> reporter: this federal

building in los angeles vandalized and in virginia this statue of robert e. lee tagged with spray paint. in new york pennsylvania three students were suspended after chant gs white power. in another school in royal oak, michigan, kids caught on camera chanting build the wall. online expressions of fear with one woman tweeting my eight-year-old sister just told me she's scared to be muslim. that broke my heart. >> it's really quite ugly out there. >> reporter: the southern poverty law center has tracked an unusual spike. more than 200 reports of hate crimes and cases of intimidation since the election. >> people walk around with fear in their hearts, they look at their neighbors not as their friends but with suspicion when things like this happen. it's not good for us. >> reporter: many are speaking out about this alarming trend. >> it's just an act against human decency it doesn't matter which side of the political spectrum you're on or what

candidate you supported. >> reporter: some are calling for direct action from the president elect who this week pledged to be a leader for all americans. >> i would like to see him come forward in the next 24 to 48 hours without a doubt and put people at ease. >> reporter: and the fbi also tracks statistics for incidents like these, interestingly, alex, their latest statistics are due out on monday. back to you. >> all right. we will look for those. thank you for that. what the pollsters and the pundits missed coming up one of my guests tells me what she discovered when she met with 32 focus groups. coming your way in the next hour con greg's woman debbie dingell on how democrats can win back white working class voters. ou s? that airline credit card you have... it could be better. it's time to shake things up. with the capital one venture card, you get double miles on everything you buy, not just airline purchases.

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than a dozen at the nato air base in kabul. hans nichols is joining from from the whau. >> reporter: it was at the bagram u.s. base, two were u.s. personal, two other were contractors. there were 16 american wounded one additional polish soldier who is there part of the nato contingent so a total of four dead on this veterans day weekend. the attack happened at 5:30 in the morning, it appears as they were gathering for a post veterans day fun run. ash carter has put out a statement, he said for those who carried out this attack my mess a.m. is simple, we will not be deterred in our mission to protect our homeland and help afghanistan secure its own future. you know, havingly this attack happened inside the air base. i've visited that base, it's heavily fortified, they think that the bomber tried and picked his spot to cause the maximum amount of damage. remember just a couple days ago

earlier in this month in the north of afghanistan two american service members, 30 civilians were killed. this all in the context of a transition to power here in washington. president barack obama wanted to draw downforces in afghanistan to about 5500. in july he changed, he said the number of u.s. troops there will be 8,400. that's the change he made. right now there are about 10,000. the next president is going to have a decision to make. >> hans nichols on this terrible news from afghanistan. thank you. the mood among democrats after the election, perspective from inside the clinton camp next.

the mood among democrats generally is horrible, the worst i have seen in 30 years in politics. >> wow. >> i've been through three previous presidential general election losses going back to dukakis and it's never felt anything like this. >> why so hard? >> i think there's two things, one is there's crushing disappoint that we don't have a

hillary clinton presidency, but even more the shock and dismay that we've just elected donald trump to be president and democrats do truly believe the man is not fit to be president. >> and that is matt bennett former deputy assistant to bill clinton talking about the fallout from hillary clinton's loss on tuesday. let's bring in elise jordan and morris reed democratic strategist and partner at mercury. awfully good to see you both. >> good morning. >> morris, i will reach out to you first here. i know that you mow matt bennett. i want to get your reaction to what you heard him say there. do you agree that this loss feels worse for democrats and why? >> i think it feels worse only because it was hillary clinton, there was an opportunity to make history and it slipped away. as you know my mentor ron brown has always taught me you are never as good as you think you are and never as bad.

i think there's lots of things to be excited about with the democratic party right now. this was a tough loss, they need to recover, regrut group and focus on the feel. >> if they don't want to be as bad as it feels what do the democrats take away from this election? does the party need to he can to us its focus or priorities? >> number one, politics is about story telling and message. this was as you know i've always said this was the achilles' heel for mrs. clinton. what was the message? it was always in the first person. you remember the greatest messages in america, hope, even donald trump had a good message. you have to come with a core message. we also need to stop segmenting the population, when you have a good message it should resonate with every american and stop thinking about the demographics and slicing and dicing things. when we need to focus on touchers voters where they live. one of the things i was troubled with, the fact that mrs. clinton was in arizona trying to expand a map when she needed to stay focused in ohio, michigan,

indiana -- i'm sorry, wisconsin, those places that ultimately were the dee -- decided the election, the rust belt. >> were they looking too much at demographics, focusing on that, saying let's get to the college kids and the like? >> i think so. i think they should have focused on where the pockets of hurt were. it was very clear in the primaries where we thought that she was going to have a tough time. the fact that bernie beat her in michigan was from my guesstimation one of the places they should have doubled down. ohio i'm from ohio as you know you always go heavy there if you want to win it always picks a winner. i thought they were going a little too far afield, focused too much on history instead of focusing on winning the race. >> elise, you write about working with all the who will sters in the battle ground states, you admit that you were shocked by trump's victory. what did we all miss? why are were the polls so wrong? what did you hear from these 32 different polling groups that you had and talking with people,

how did we get it so wrong? >> i put my reliance on the data and i would visit these states and i would have a gut feeling that trump really seems like he has a chance in wisconsin but then i would look toe polling and say, oh, well, it's never historical trends, someone who is this behind, you know, it just can't be. >> you weren't trusting your gut. >> i wasn't trusting my gut and i think that that was a lot of our problem and i think that this just shows how elite political opinion and the media and, youknow, as i was a part of that, we became so fixated on seeing one outcome that we didn't imagine the possibility of another. and i think that one huge predictor that i pointed to that was an outlier was the enthusiasm gap. you would meet people who said that they were voting for hillary clinton and they just weren't that enthusiastic, but trump supporters were really passionate. you look at the end of the day those hillary supporters just didn't turn out the way that they did for barack obama in 2008 and 2012. >> do you think that pollsters, though -- i mean, not giving

them a pass but you can say here is part of what you didn't get and it's hard to get the group of disenfranchised voters who haven't voted in three, four elections and all of a sudden they see someone that is heralding what they believe and want to see, make america great again and they come from nowhere seemingly. >> pollsters either oversampled hillary voters and understamped trump voters or trump voters were forthright about their intention to vote for trump. whatever that might be i think that it really comes down to, you know, at the end of the day donald trump was not coronated by the republican party. he won despite not being the establishment favorite. bernie sanders look at what happened to him and then hillary clinton essentially was coronated by the establishment and she was a weak candidate. voters wanted change and hillary clinton was not the change that they wanted. they is it not like her experience at the end of the day. >> you know, it's really

interesting. elections are always about the future, right, and she was always looking back to her past, looking at herself. when you have a message people -- the electorate had as to see themselves in that vision. that's what america was, people saw it, hope. but let me talk about pollsters. i always tell me candidates we don't focus on the polls, it's a snapshot in time. we spend too much time looking at data and not following our gut. the one thing i always say about elections is you've got to have parks and enthusiasm. parks and enthusiasm always trumps a turnout and that's what happened in this election. >> so, morris, everything has gone the republican way, they've got everything they need to pass bills and to get things going. where does that leave the democrats? do they spend the next couple years obstructing, filibustering all the republican legislation as the gop has done to president obama? will the 150th congress still be

like we are still not getting anything done. >> barack obama came in a big way, he had both chambers of congress and he didn't get a lot of things done because he was fighting with his party. frankly what the democrats need to do is find their own vision. they need to find an offensive position and run a play. they need to show the american people that even in the opposition they are worthy of coming back to be the majority party. if they only find a way to be obstructionists they won't come back because donald trump whether we like it or not was a unique transformative figure in american politics so what the democrats have to do is find that next barack obama or that donald trump who is going to propel them back to the white house. >> i've got to go, as nick would tell me we are heavier than a christmas hen right now. it's good to he so you both. we will talk about where all those never trumpers go. take a look at this, everyone, a live look at the protests going on right now here in new york city. this over the results of the presidential election. they are loud, pretty fierce, we

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